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Feminism: Sex & gender discussions

5 Love Languages - problematic?

19 replies

BertieBotts · 14/04/2012 10:51

Inspired by a thread in Relationships - didn't want to post there as it looked like more of a light-hearted thread. But what do others think of this?

Link if you haven't heard of it before:
www.5lovelanguages.com/learn-the-languages/the-five-love-languages/

My feelings are that the "acts of service" one is particularly problematic from a feminist point of view, because these acts of service are so universally accepted as women's work that only the absence of them would be particularly noted, and for a man to do it is often seen as a "help" or a conscious act rather than the everyday thing that it is.

The "touch" one is just a (masquerading as less-gendered) version of the argument that "men need sex to feel loved", surely. And the gifts thing is problematic too, when some men use gifts as a way to "justify" awful or plain neglectful treatment of their partners. This is just providing a ready made excuse for that, IMO.

What say you?

OP posts:

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youngermother1 · 14/04/2012 16:21

Is it not more a discussion on which 'language' you speak, rather than all being relevant.
I mean if you want compliments, but OH buys gifts, you are speaking different languages and not communicating.
I think it is about learning which type your partner speaks and using the same language

BertieBotts · 14/04/2012 22:16

Yes, that is the premise of the book. But I feel this is problematic in itself, because of the connotations attached to all the different "languages".

Sorry, I'm probably not explaining very well. It just doesn't sit quite right with me.

OP posts:

solidgoldbrass · 15/04/2012 00:15

It sounds like a similar load of old willy to John Gray and the Venus'n'Mars books (known round here as 'And you're talking out of Uranus'). Just because someone's written it down in a book doesn't stop it being complete rubbish.

JellyMould · 15/04/2012 00:21

But the point is that you need to think about the value you and your partner place on each of the languages, not the value society places on them. Eg if you think acts of service show love but your H doesn't notice them, then you shouldn't bother (or explain to him why you're doing it).

NiceHamione · 15/04/2012 00:35

I was recommended this book by a friend when dp and I were going through some problems . As a feminist I have never read anything untoward in the book .

My dp shows his love through acts of service and to be honest I never really got that . I am a touch person and dp and I were getting our wires crossed and. It really understanding that we were expressing love to each other. I know now that when dp cooks me a special meal, or helps me our at work he is showing me love. I also try and show him love in his language. He also understands my need for physical touch and again tries to me much more tactile with me.

I have also found it useful in understanding my children.

KRITIQ · 15/04/2012 00:42

Sounds like too much like game playing and I agree with the op's and jelly's points.

I could see how someone could use this system in an attempt to control the other either sulking when the other doesn't pick up on the 'language' they are using, or rationalising away inconsiderate behaviour or actions the other person doesn't like, insisting, 'that's just the way I communicate (so your problem if you don't get it or don't like it.)

It's complicating, not simplifying relationships and giving avenues for avoidance, denial and blaming I think. But if some ar taken in, the guy will make a few bucks.

solidgoldbrass · 15/04/2012 00:50

None of this sort of crap has any basis in actual facts you know. It's just some anecdotes and vague observations that someone has thought of a good name for.

LRDtheFeministDragon · 15/04/2012 00:51

I think in the context of MN, which is female-majority, it's a concern to talk about 'learning which type your partner speaks and using the same language'. IMO women do too much of that sort of adaptation already.

And the flipside I'm not keen on either - if you're saying to men 'here, learn to speak to your wife in her language', you're reinforcing the idea that men are 'naturally' less good at the communicative side of things.

NiceHamione · 15/04/2012 00:54

I think that if a person is a bully they could use this, however I have a very healthy and respectful relationship , but there was some miscommunication. I don't see it as complicating our relationship, I found reading the book to be a seeing the light moment. So much became clear, both about myself and those whom I love.

Importantly we make an effort to use each other's languages as well as our own.

NiceHamione · 15/04/2012 01:08

Of course no one should be coerced into anything . However I think it is useful to know how people show and recieve love .

By showing my partner acts of service I am not acting as his slave or being submissive. However I know that he will really appreciate me taking time out of my day for him, because I love and respect him that is no hardship. I want him to feel loved. For example this morning I knew that dp was feeling overwhelmed by work . So I got up early and made a special breakfast for him. I know he did not expect it but I know he appreciated it.

In a similar manner when we are say together of an evening, rather than sit on separate sofas reading, dp will sit on the sofa with me. Or when we are out together , dp will brush my hand or something similar. Again dp is not doing anything that makes him uncomfortable , but he understands that something that that is a very simple act is actually very meaningful to me.

It is a fact that dp and I do show love in different ways , it is also a fact that we have a stronger relationship since reading this book together . Although to be honest, the fact that we read the book together shows that we already have a very strong relationship. Perhaps a little like therapy it is the talking about the relationship that makes a difference rather than the exact nature of The discussion , theory or insight.

Quodlibet · 15/04/2012 01:25

I looked at this earlier and did the online quiz out of curiosity, and I have to say I find it troubling from a feminist POV too. I don't have a problem with the idea that people may express their love in different ways, or that it's worthwhile thinking about this in the context of a partnership. However, it's something about the categories - 'acts of service' etc, as well as the assumption on the website that it is all couched in the context of a heterosexual marriage ('I love it when my husband buys me thoughtful gifts' for example). There are statements in the quiz I couldn't find any agreement with to do with acts of service because my feminist brain was going 'but tidying up is not an act of love, that's just a human responsibility!'. I also noticed that the male questions and female questions are phrased differently with household chores very clearly gendered - the male ones say 'I feel loved when my wife does my laundry' and 'When my wife helps me with the yard work I feel appreciated', and that sets big old clanging bells off for me. Because of this, I feel you're spot on Bertie, with the 'connotations' of the languages thing - although there needn't be those connotations if it was all angled differently or phrased differently.

As SGB said, it's not based on facts, and the number 5 seems plucked out of the air. Surely there are other means of expressing love - making each other laugh, for example? Being patient of the other person's shortcomings?

Quodlibet · 15/04/2012 01:30

It also seems like a very convenient way of 'equalising' unequatable things. Wouldn't it be easy to say 'Well, yes, you are expressing your love through acts of service, thanks for cleaning the house. However, I like to express my love through physical touch, so can we have sex now?'

NiceHamione · 15/04/2012 01:52

I have not looked at the website but we have certainly not looked at this in terms of gender stereotype . For starters my dp is the one who naturally shows love through acts of service . This does not mean doing the hoovering or running the home , although he does do more around the house than me. But he is the kind of person who likes to help out and is always running around after our children and myself. For example he loves to help our daughter out with her horse or he enjoys fixing up the boat for our son. When he senses I am tired he shows me love by running me a bath , setting out candles and music etc. In the past I found this odd and used to think , why is he running me a bath, I can do that myself, now I understand that is how he is showing me love.

I think this can be useful in an equal, healthy relationship. I think discussing as a couple how you show and recieve love , can only be a good thing.

BertieBotts · 15/04/2012 09:44

I didn't look at the questions for "husbands", just "wives" - but Quod that is just - I got annoyed enough at having to choose between something or other and "I love it when my husband helps with the laundry" - grrrr.

I can see that the theory would be interpreted very differently in households where there is an unequal relationship compared to one where there is an equal one.

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NiceHamione · 15/04/2012 09:51

If someone suggested to me that my dp "helps" me with the chores , I would be pissed off. We are equals running our own home. Helping with the laundry is certainly not what I meant by "acts of service" No one is doing anyone a favour. I guess you take different things from the book, according to your relationship.

BertieBotts · 15/04/2012 09:51

I think my other problem with it is just - well, aren't all these things pretty standard in a normal, loving relationship anyway? Surely there is something lacking if your husband/wife never compliments you, or doesn't do their share of the housework/practical things, or never wants to touch you/have sex, or is mean with gifts, or doesn't give you his/her time and undivided attention? Just one of these things lacking would be ringing alarm bells for me.

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NiceHamione · 15/04/2012 10:32

If there is one language I don't speak it is the language of gifts . When I first met dp he fell into the trap of buying me gifts which I always said thanks for, but to be honest they meant very little . If I want something I will buy it myself . We now don't buy each other birthday off Christmas gifts. I would much rather have time with someone than recieve a gift .

MooncupGoddess · 15/04/2012 11:54

That website sounds bloody awful, but I have found the basic idea useful in terms of friendships. Personally I couldn't care less whether my friends remember my birthday, but I get really cross and hurt if they (say) cancel meet-ups for pathetic reasons. The love languages thing made me realise that some people are the other way round, and that just because they don't behave exactly as I would doesn't mean they don't care about me.

NiceHamione · 15/04/2012 12:28

I think that is where I am at as well mooncup

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