Am I being negative of realistic

(101 Posts)
tallulahturtle Wed 03-Jul-13 00:30:54

I help a friend look after her horse, she wants to buy a second one . She is a first time owner (was going to loan but suddenly decided she would buy one this spring) and currently has a teenage horse who is very well behaved and a real confidence giver, is not spooky and has very good manners.

She's now decided her second one has to be a tb (as when she was young she always dreamed of owning one) and she likes the idea of owning a tb.
I've not owned before but I have loaned so I know the commitment involved and how hard it can be (eg winter).

She currently has the one horse on a routine of exercise twice a day which I am doing 50 percent of and I'm finding it exhausting as I work 10 hours a day with a 30 min commute, in a physical job.

Anyway the second horse, well we found one I rode him, perfect , responsive very non spooky, I was ready to buy him there and then.

She tries the horse and nearly falls off because when asking the horse to do a faster trot she did a pony club kick (the way she was taught as a child -she learnt briefly as a child then didnt ride until very recently), the horse broke into canter and she wasn't expecting it and ended up round his neck.

She decides the horse is not right for her as he is "too advanced" so we start looking again. I trying to steer her towards IDs and ISH , cobs etc and with a bit of age on them as she is not a brilliant or confident rider and also the horse would need to live out 24/7, so im thinking sturdiness rather then a thoroughbred who needs rugging up to the max. As she can't afford livery and wants the "simplicity of living out". She just wants a tb and no older than 12, I feel she wants an older confidence giving horse but every horse I tell her about she dismisses saying "too old".

She has said that she intends to exercise both twice a day, I'm highly dubious as I find it a struggle to do the one horse at the moment with light mornings and evenings and decent summer ground . I keep emphasising how hard winter will be and how impossible it will be to keep to a schedule of exercise twice daily, what if the ground is hard, what if it snows? What if we don't have the time, we do both have jobs.

Anyway she has now decided she wants to retrain an ex racehorse. As they are a breed she likes , cheap and if she does it," she will feel a huge sense of achievement"

We have no school,just a field the horses will graze in too.

Sorry for the rant but she is just so naive and I'm trying to help her into horse ownership . One moment she is saying, don't worry I'll do all the retraining if you don't want to , the next minute she asks me to jump her existing horse as she has never jumped and doesn't feel confident enough. I've said TBs can be spooky and flighty. She is fine with that as she says her existing horse is like that - she's not in the slightest , I've never ridden a more laid back horse. I feel the existing horse has been so easy to look after and ride that she thinks all horses are that easy.

I just feel she should stick at one horse.

Am I being negative? Or realistic? Is her next horse going to be like Pie from national velvet and just by some miracle easy to train by a complete novice and end up being a diamond of a horse. Did I mention she will not pay more than about 600 for her next horse.

Opinions please.....

You are being realistic. And she is potentially going to end up with a horse that is dangerous for her. What an idiot.

tallulahturtle Wed 03-Jul-13 00:45:19

Thank you!!!!! have been getting so frustrated with this.i know not all tbs are crazy, and dont want to stereotype but I just don't think this girl has anywhere near enough the experience. I'm so much more experienced than her with looking after horses and riding them and I would never buy a tb as one of my first horses - I know this is her second horse but she has only owned her first horse for two months.

My plan when I eventually own is to buy an older chilled out horse and keep it at a DIY yard with lots of other owners to give me support through those first few years ,then maybe win the lottery and buy a house when I can keep it at home :-) not go it alone in a rented field with one chilled out horse and a potentially crazy ex racehorse.

ChippingInWiredOnCoffee Wed 03-Jul-13 00:51:37

How about you stop helping her with this horse - tell her to look after it for a year herself before she even thinks about another horse.

She is being a complete idiot - but other than letting her find that out for herself I don't know what else you can do or say that you haven't already.

daisy5569 Wed 03-Jul-13 06:36:58

tallulahturtle you are being totally realistic, now you just need to convince your friend that her plans are not!
If she has only owned her horse for 2 months she will have no idea how much hard work winter will be let alone trying to retrain an ex-racehorse which in my opinion should be left to experts not novice horse owners.
Hope you manage to convince her otherwise, maybe as ChippingInWiredOnCoffee has said it would be good for her to have some time doing all the work herself with the existing horse so she realises how much work it will be looking after two

TobyLerone Wed 03-Jul-13 06:43:04

She wants a TB for £600 and wants it to live out?

She has no idea what she's doing.

xigris Wed 03-Jul-13 06:59:54

I had an ex racehorse for many years and while she was
lovely, a novice ride she most definitely was not! Your friend is being extremely unrealistic. And as for living out, really?!

tallulahturtle Wed 03-Jul-13 08:14:04

Well im off on holiday for two weeks soon so have a perfect oppprtunity to let her go it alone :-)

Butkin Wed 03-Jul-13 09:12:10

You are spot on with your thoughts and she is a loon. I work with TBs and have ridden out my own Pointers and they are hardly ever novice rides. Not only are they flighty as a breed they are also taught different aids in racing yards. Even just shortening up the reins will encourage them to go faster...

I agree with the suggestions above that she needs to look after her current one for a year without your constant help. Winters are very different and I'd council against leaving a TB that is in work (and therefore probably clipped) out during the Winter.

A £600 TB will be a flat yard cast off and will come with all the issues that implies. In the right hands they can be great (a friend is doing high level eventing on cheap TBs) but not in the hands of a complete novice.

Also why does she want to exercise her horses twice daily. That is nuts. I've never heard of anybody doing that. Even in racing yards horses which are prime athletes are only ridden 6 mornings a week.

What is she planning to achieve with them - does she compete and if so at what? Her idea of retraining a racehorse - does she have any clue what she wants to retrain it for and how she will go about it?

snorris Wed 03-Jul-13 09:33:35

Two horses is a big commitment anyway without taking into consideration that TBs tend to be more needy wink . I struggled with two native ponies, they lived out 24/7 and it didn't matter if they weren't ridden every day. I'm by no means an expert but having owned horses for a number of years I think it sounds like she will be taking on too much and it is unfair to expect you to take it on too.

Littlebigbum Wed 03-Jul-13 09:39:15

Is she just pipe dreaming? Because she can go look, thing £600 is just a little over meat price. [pls correct if wrong]

This is one of my RI's regular complaints - people who buy ex racehorses because they're cheap but don't have the skills to bring them on and it ends up dangerous all round. And who in their right mind would chose a TB if they need the horse to live out 24/7? I'm no horse wonder-woman, I don't even know my own horse, but thank god I have RI who has seen fit to teach me horse care & bits about choosing horses etc.

Your friend doesn't really sound like she has a clue. Can you take a month off and leave her to do everything? People who don't realise they have no idea are sooooo dangerous!

jemstipp Wed 03-Jul-13 11:48:11

I have owned a few thoroughbreds and have one right now. They are not all idiots, in the right hands. What is your friend thinking and more importantly, what are you thinking when it you who is doing a lot of the work now. She has absolutely no need of getting another horse when she doesn't do everything with the one she has. She will end up hurting herself or this new horse.

Noooo, stop her! I have one TB who came to me retrained and reschooled, I work p/time, my children are almost adult and I find it hard to do as much as I should with him. At best he gets hacked out 3/4 times a week and lunged once or twice, and I still feel it's not enough. The only time I have had two at the same time was when I bought the current horse before having to have my old one pts - he wasn't being ridden at all, but the sheer logistics of feeding, grooming, poo picking and just give attention to two was tricky to say the least.

My TB's have both lived out 24/7, and are happier for it, but you do need to feed them more, have more expensive rugs and look out for the dreaded mud fever at all times - likewise shoeing can be much more expensive as their feet are generally not as hard as a native's.

Retraining a racehorse is a massive commitment, and not for the faint hearted, those short of experience or with little time. In the meantime the existing horse would suffer. Ex racehorses are cheap as chips for a reason and whilst there are some potentially lovely riding horses out there are also some which are just not suited and your friend really doesn't sound experienced enough to deal with one at all.

She will end up ruining No1 horse, probably ruining No2 horse and being miserable and broke as well.....

Just thought - how about totting up all the costs for her - double absolutely everything and then if she's really considering a TB add another third on top of it. Perhaps that would put her off!

SaggyOldClothCatPuss Wed 03-Jul-13 15:14:34

Who the fuck exercises their horse twice a day? <<faints>>
she is bonkers!

Pixel Wed 03-Jul-13 16:28:56

Your friend is deluded and I agree with everyone here, except we have wintered out a TB that we had on loan and his owner thanked us for returning him in such good condition, so it can be done, though I doubt someone who hasn't even gone through one winter with an 'easy' horse yet will have the know-how to manage it.

If she is serious about this I'm afraid I can't see a good outcome. Do you think she is just getting carried away with new horse ownership (especially as it's summer and everything is still a novelty) and fantasising a bit rather than meaning it as something for the very near future? I mean we've all done it, before coming down to Earth with a big bump usually! I think you need to help with the bringing down to Earth by stopping doing things like jumping her horse for her. It's the only way she'll realise she still has a lot to learn.

lovebeansontoast Wed 03-Jul-13 18:30:04

Yes, she is deluded, and I think it's your duty to "go on holiday" for a week and show her just how deluded she is....

As a matter of interest why does she think her current horse needs excericisng twic a day if it's living out? Mine would be gobsmacked if I tried that malarkey?

Tb living out?!?!?!?! HA! She can't afford livery.... what will she do when flighty tb breaks itself & she has a whopping vet bill - plus the amount of feed for the tb. They're pansys & not to be taken in lightly, rarely novice rides & complex to look after. Perhaps you should showyour friend this thread? She's going to end up either hurt of buggering up a horse

SaggyOldClothCatPuss Wed 03-Jul-13 21:07:58

Tbh, I've seen more than one TB winter out. You need to start roughing them off before the autumn moult starts.
But personally, I wouldn't touch a TB with a barge pole. They are gorgeous, beautiful and lovely, but always seem such hard work. I suppose its the difference between driving a Mondeo and a Ferarri. Everything about them is just so much more expensive!
Natives are just so much harder to break!

I think someone with the right skills and experience could buy a TB ex racehorse, retrain and have them live out. But she doesn't have the skills or experience!

tallulahturtle Wed 03-Jul-13 22:30:30

Thanks for all your support and opinions With the current horse the farrier today told her exercise twice a day was too much (she listened to him thank god) doesnt listen to me. I will be going away for two weeks soon so will see hpw she is when i get back. She is off to view yet another tb tomorrow, ive told her shes crazy and biting off more than she can chew but she doesnt listen. She has a childhood dream,and she is sticking by it. I cant walk away now as i care about the existing horse and dont want my friend getting into a dangerous situation . She said earlier that she doesnt want a non tb as she will "get bored of it" and sell it on but a tb she wont get bored with apparently. I despair!!!

jemstipp Thu 04-Jul-13 12:05:28

Stop helping her!!!!! You are facilitating her idiocy. I know you love horses too and if I had a few friends like you I'd be in my element, unpaid workers, Hell Yes!!! Come on Mrs, you are more than that and she doesn't heed your advice, so let her stand alone. I'm sure she may be a lot of things but her current neddy won't suffer.

SlowlorisIncognito Thu 04-Jul-13 14:28:18

Depending on where you are in the UK I would say you are not going to find a safe, sensible horse for £600, even a TB, which are often cheaper. I think they are nice enough as a breed, but not especially hardy, so if the horse is to live out, it will need rugging and feeding over winter (at the very least), which will be more expensive in the long run.

TBs do also have a reputation for injuring themselves, obviously this is a stereotype and you will get some that are fine, but what is she going to do if it needs box rest or she gets a big vet bill?

On the other hand, if her current horse is living alone, that's not fair on it either, as horses are herd animals, and really do need the company of other equines.

I think she is being unrealistic and silly, but obviously you can't stop her, and in some ways it is better to stay friendly with her incase it becomes a welfare issue. You could suggest one of the ex-racehorse charities, as at least these horses have been professionally retrained, so they may be able to match her up with something more suitable.

Butkin Thu 04-Jul-13 15:45:26

That is a good suggestion Slowloris - get her to talk to one of the many ex-racehorse charities as they will be able to assess her and find her something suitable. They will probably have done the hard initial work as well. If you start with www.ror.org.uk/ they will point you in the right direction for your location.

As mentioned if she is going to leave it out all winter it will need it's full coat (and New Zealand) so no work as this would mean clipping...

Booboostoo Thu 04-Jul-13 18:05:57

Why is she exercising her horse twice a day? I have never heard that one before!

As for a total novice retraining a racehorse that's total lunacy. She'll get herself killed.

SaggyOldClothCatPuss Thu 04-Jul-13 18:53:11

You will find a safe sensible horse, it just won't be aged between 5 and 25!

Butkin Thu 04-Jul-13 22:06:51

Ask her the question we all want to know - why does she exercise her horse twice daily, every day? Then report back to us!

SaggyOldClothCatPuss Thu 04-Jul-13 22:09:20

Maybe she only ever owned a dog before? hmm

Smartieaddict Fri 05-Jul-13 17:27:42

I hope you can persuade your friend not to get another horse. I made a similar mistake, and took on a TB that was too much for me having over estimated my abilities. I went from a confident, reasonably competent rider, to being a nervous wreck and ready to give up, within a few months!

I now have a 17 year old schoolmaster, who I would have dismissed as boring a year ago, and its bloody brilliant. I am having a great time, doing things I haven't done since my early 20's. I was lucky, I escaped serious injury, and I had the horse on loan, so was able to send him back.

tallulahturtle Wed 10-Jul-13 08:27:18

The reason i an helping is because i like her existing horse and also by helping her with some of the care i get to ride again, something that i havent been able to do for years. Although saying that ive recently started riding another friends horse- one i used to ride as a teenager- so ive gone from not riding for 10 years or so to being able to ride as often as i like .
Ok, update on the situation. Well she has gone and bought a tb, he did race but only once (must have been rubbish) and was turned away as a 2 year old and retrained fully as a riding horse. I have seen videos of him jumping , however she bought him from the field and no vetting (sigh) so i can only hope he isnt a complete maniac as he hasnt been ridden since winter. He has already got several cuts from being too familiar with the one section of the field with barbed wire.
I think the exercise twice a day may have gone out the window as ever since the farrier came she hasnt been obsessed with the twice day workout, also in this heat when ive ridden or lunged its been minimal so hopefully the mare is having a rest.
Currently the tb is following her round the field like a lost puppy and there is a lot of squealing and kicking out from her.
She is planning on lunging him friday as his first exercise , so will give an update then. Also she declared the other day that she wants to buy a lab so it can "walk out on rides with us" she is such a dreamer. Im thinking that people generally buy dogs for other reasons and then the dog just happens to want to follow its owner out on rides rather than people buying a dog for this specific purpose.

Right better get ready for work!

Oh god, I hope it works out for her, but can see so many pitfalls. Just be careful that you don't end up picking up all the pieces.......

JulyKit Wed 10-Jul-13 12:21:11

Did you read last week's Horse & Hound? Get your hands on a copy and show it to your friend if possible... There's a good article on why adults are increasingly going for ponies!
Taking on TBs/rehabilitating racehorses is starting to look so last season, don'tcha know? grin
Seriously, though, it's a good article. smile

Butkin Wed 10-Jul-13 19:27:11

Do you know it's racing name? If so I can tell you all about it...

Mirage Wed 10-Jul-13 21:29:01

shock.

The dog idea is just as bad as the ex racehorse idea tbh.Trying to control 2 unpredictable animals whilst out riding sounds an accident waiting to happen.I know people do ride out with their dogs,but they are well trained and both horse and dog familiar with each other.

Good luck with your friend.

tallulahturtle Thu 11-Jul-13 21:57:08

His racing name was Rowan Sun, the horse that she turned down was called Ardent Prince .

Butkin Fri 12-Jul-13 00:23:17

Rowan Sun is a 4yo chestnut gelding by Haafhd out of Rowan Flower. He was bought as a yearling by Fulke Johnson Houghton for 5,000gns. He was put into trainer with his daughter, Eve, and owned by James Burley. As you know he was a failure as a racehorse. He only ran the once, as a 2yo, finishing 10th of 11 in a maiden at Chepstow, ridden by Cathy Gannon. He was beaten 25 lengths and there is no further record of him.

Ardent Prince was far more successful. He is a 10 year old gelding by Polar Prince and owned since a young horse (possibly even bred by) Barry Fletcher. He was always owned by Barry but trained by 3 different trainers, Heather Dalton, Alan McCabe and Andrew Haynes. He ran a total of 42 times and won twice - both on the all weather for Alan in early 2009. His form went downhill in 2010 and his last run was in May of that year. He won a total of £8,971 which was pretty decent and I'd say he gave his owner some fun although he always ran at a very low level.

tallulahturtle Fri 12-Jul-13 11:57:58

Wow thats very informative!! Just trying to remember the name of another ex racehorse she nearly bought now.

tallulahturtle Fri 12-Jul-13 12:02:48

http://www.sourceanexracehorse.co.uk/index.php?page=tilapia

This was another she really liked but the lady sold him to a friend

I think she visualises you riding shotgun on the steady sensible horse while she gadds about on the more showy TB.

There was a girl at the stables a few years back (where I used to go)
She was a novice rider not riding very long.
So her (rather indulgent and probably clueless ) parents bought her a lovely, 2yo unbroken part TB.

A very few weeks later the novelty wore off. She got fed up with all the work for little reward.Her friends going off on hacks while she was trying to walk her horse out, like a dog.
Her little colt got some very nasty manners to boot.(Bitey,kicking, barging)
Her parents got fed up and the horse 'went' to be replaced by an older, more staid horse.
OK she's got her horse now but it was at the expense of the little colt. And this was keeping him in a stableyard where there were people to help and advice her.
She just didn't take it.

tallulahturtle Fri 12-Jul-13 20:49:23

Yes I think she is visualising that . She was planning on starting to lunge him this weekend -he arrived Tuesday. But he has been so lively and he existing mare is getting very lively too so they are being left a few days more to let hem settle.

I've never experienced a horse introduction, so don't know what is normal. The mare had been in a field on her own since the end of May and is very relaxed and chilled , then the gelding arrived and they don't like being separated now. Lots of squealing as I had expected and a bit of kicking.

Is this just a settling in thing or is the mare who was happy to hack alone, going to turn into a hacking in company only horse?

Booboostoo Sat 13-Jul-13 08:56:58

Horses generally like being in herds. Some can support being on their own but often pair bond as soon as a second horse is introduced. Sounds like this is what happened to this mare. Your friend will have to take time to get them used to being alone again. It's a long and trying process though.

To be honest if I were you I would find a different horse to ride, all this sounds like an accident waiting to happen.

Having seen the consequences of several so-called 'horse-lovers' over-horsing themselves (consequences generally paid by the horse), your friend needs to get someone experienced with young horses to help her out now, before he gets into bad habit.

However nice a nature the 4yo has, he's still a baby, with lots of learning, and some growing, to do. At the very least, whatever about being exercised, he shouldn't be doing a lot of heavy 'thinking' work, and certainly not every day. He will also need a couple of months off if he's been in work from the start of the year to now, along with a whole heap of other things.

You say she won't listen to you, but is there any chance if you bought her a few books on the subject she might take them to heart?

Pixel Sat 13-Jul-13 22:11:56

Good idea about the books, you could pretend you saw one in a shop or something and thought of her (hard to get offended over a pressie if she is likely to be a bit funny). Just looked at Amazon briefly and was surprised how many there are some here.

Butkin Sat 13-Jul-13 22:14:03

Tilapia won 5 races from 25 starts from 2006 to 2010 but obviously wasn't the soundest of horses as had some big gaps in his CV and was reportedly lame after some races.

Gay Kelleway paid a lot of money (38,000 pounds in 2008) for him as a 4yo out of Sir Mark Prescott's yard but he was useless as a racehorse for her. Then, having moved to Stef Higgins, he amazingly won an apprentice race (at 50/1) in June 2010 before running two more of his usual stinkers and being retired.

He is now a 9yo gelding and he liked 12 furlongs best.

tallulahturtle Wed 17-Jul-13 15:47:02

Hey everyone.
Im pretty sure he has a sarcoid on his leg and also ringworm :-/ - need to post a photo really to show you . I wish she had got him vetted as the poor boy he looks so uncomfortable and even if she didnt mind sarcoids and ringworm, at least we could have treated them asap. When i mentioned the marks -as he is generally very scarred too, she said "hes a typical clumsy 4 year old tb" . Im guessing thats what the lady who sold him said. If anyone has experience of getting rid of ringworm and treating sarcoids (as i know they are impossible to cure) please let me know.

Vet - vet - and vet. You will need to treat both horeses for ring worm I believe (don't qoute me on that) & wash everything that comes into contact with the horses. The sarcoid needs ti be treated by the vet, but sarcoid x supplement stuff has been really good for my mare & a few others too.

cq Wed 17-Jul-13 19:38:53

Yep, and don't ride your other friend's horse in any of the same clothes/boots/gloves that you've ridden either of these in. Ringworm is highly contagious.

A friend was helping me exercise my Sec D when I was working FT, her horse had ringworm, she was very diligent and changed all her clothes, boots, washed hands etc before riding mine. But forgot about the CHAPS - he came down with a very nice rash just behind the girth.

Sounds like your friend has bitten off far more than she can chew. Can't believe people still buy horses without vetting.

tallulahturtle Thu 18-Jul-13 09:00:05

Thanks for the advice, am trying to avoid contamination through brushes and my clothes etc but as they are both out 24/7 at grass livery i feel that the mare will catch it too. I am desperate to avoid giving it to another mare i ride sometimes at a different yard , so as im only a week away from my holiday, ill probably not ride her until i get back :-/
Yes she bought both horses not vetted. She bought the first one then the farrier said that she may have navicular and she then vowed to get the next one vetted, but seemed to decide against it "as the lady he came from seemed so nice".
When i eventually am in the position to buy my own i will be getting the horse vetted for sure!

SaggyOldClothCatPuss Thu 18-Jul-13 13:08:35

Are you on a livery yard? Ringworm can have serious repercussions. If it gets about, your friend could be liable for treating everybody! It is also transferrable to humans. If you get itchy, you need treatment asap, it is murder! Id either steer clear of these horses or the other mare you ride until it is treated. Ringworm is a shit to get rid of, and can live in wood and building fabric for years!

SaggyOldClothCatPuss Thu 18-Jul-13 13:10:44

Personally, I wouldn't vet a horse that I hadn't paid more than about £1200 for, but I would isolate, worm, treat for lice as routine and check out the general health before putting it with my others.

Pixel Thu 18-Jul-13 22:05:09

We've never had a horse vetted blush. Always do quarantine though.

lovebeansontoast Fri 26-Jul-13 14:01:16

I would always have a horse vetted whatever the cost. To me it's about what they might cost me in vet's fees not what they cost to buy. I know a vetting doesn't pick up everything, but it's about peace of mind for me. I should add I had one fail the vetting once with a cataract. That's something I would definitely have wanted to know about.

tallulahturtle Wed 07-Aug-13 08:41:35

Im currently on holiday and she is finding it hard work. Also the tb has thrown a shoe and is currently lame and the other has gone lame on both fronts :-/ im very worried about navicular. Apparently the vet has said that this horse is not insured for either front legs due to past tendon problems. Quite upset as this mare is really the sweetest and most uncomplicated ride you could wish for. Would a vetting have picked up navicular i wonder? And if this isnt tendon problems , why isnt it covered under insurance? Why are both whole legs not covered Pretty worried about how much this is going to cost her. Will know more when i get back to UK on Sat. Also does anyone know about Atopy as ive had time to do some reading on holiday and i think the tb has it as he flares up with hives and has all the scars that horses online in photos seem to have.

Navicular has some fairly standard symptoms.. . Its more likely to be concusive laminitus if she's over working her, or something tendon related. Has she been lame before, is she worse down hill, how old is she, is she worse in a circle, on hard grouns, when her feet are too long, is it intermittant?

Navicular isn't actually that expensive to manage if they respond well to treatment.

My mare with navicular has corrective shoes (£80) and bute £80 for 100 bute. She's sound at the moment but if she goes lame will probably have steriod inhections which are £200

The diagnosis was £139 for nerve block, vets time, flexion tests, lunging etc etc (and 30 bute)
Then £220 + vat for the x rays.

Insurance companies will void a whole leg if they have any issues, as one thing often leads to another iyswim.

PeriodFeatures Sun 11-Aug-13 13:37:59

She thinks she's going to get a bargain?! TB's cost a fortune in feed, rugging and often vets bills. She would need to consider the cost of physio therapy, dentistry etc too. Ex Racers often come off the track with all sorts of issues, tendons, back problems, dodgy teeth etc..issues and if they are not sorted can quickly get worse. They also go best when they have a water tight routine, sensitive and disciplined rider. 'kicking like a pony club rider' will not end well!!

Yes, TB's can live out. Contrary to popular opinion it is possible. But she will spend a fortune on feed and haylage during the winter is the horse is going to maintain a healthy weight and will have to manage things extremely well to avoid mud fever etc. TBs are in short, very very hard work. They take experience to manage and if you haven't got that experience as a first time owner, you need to be able to enlist other people. I e a good supportive livery yard, instructors, professional reschooling etc. If she has the time, money and motivation, then go for it. They can be really rewarding horses, beautiful, willing and capable. It is a massive commitment though.

bonzo77 Sun 11-Aug-13 13:59:44

Your friend is deluded, this will end badly, particularly for the horses.

OTOH I a TB (and also a TB X Arab bred for arab racing, and a TBXArab bred for horseball) at the moment. They're out 24/7 with decent rugs over winter. Fed 2x a day all year round and ridden 3-4 x a week, including international horseball. All ex racers in their early teens. They are a bit spooky etc, but the owner is very old experienced and pragmatic about them. TB / x racers can make lovely "normal" horses but its a long road getting there.

bonzo77 Sun 11-Aug-13 14:01:08

Oh, and the pure TB with papers and who has raced is much nicer than the other 2!

tallulahturtle Tue 13-Aug-13 15:23:15

Oh dear. The tb was ridden for the first time when i was away and it walks backwards, then lies down then runs off :-/ . Pain or naughtyness im wondering? No update on the mare as regards when shes going for x rays, she said the vets are currently pricing it all up.

mrslaughan Tue 13-Aug-13 19:12:55

Holy Molly - actually lies down.......not something I would want to be anywhere near.....

Hmmm doesn't sound ideal... maybe the poor tb just has no idea what its being asked to do?

TheFroglet Mon 26-Aug-13 22:22:05

Just tell her to give £600 straight to the vets, and cut out the middle man as it were - as all her money will go straight there anyway!!

tallulahturtle Mon 02-Sep-13 10:11:40

Ok, update. With the lame mare she has buried her head in the sand as while the vet has not contacted her with a price, she hasnt got in contact either. Im really thinking its navicular and im convinced the old owner had this diagnosed and kept quite about it. So ive told her to contact her vet and ask them to contact the previous vet, that way if there was somethinf diagnosed, we can start treating it a lot sooner and not waste money diagnosing somthing that has already been diagnosed. She still has not done this so im getting quite frustrated.
The TB, has been coming along ok with lunging but when sat on he literally will not move, i had a go on him in his field and he planted himself and would only move when the mare was led in front of him (if anyone has any ideas to wean him off this please let me know!!). Ive just had laser eye surgery so im not allowed to ride for a bit so yesterday I and my other half went down to offer moral support as she wanted to have another go on him.
We discovered that while he wont move in the field, he will walk out the field gate and along the quiet country lane with wide grass verges, so my husband walked with her on a lead rein, they walked away from the field fine but on the way back the mare neighed and it set him off into a reverse in the hedge head in the sky nap type thing. My friend then got off and said that she didnt want him anymore.
She is now looking to find someone who will loan him (i am very doubtful she will find someone, especially someone who will actually pay). She doesnt want to sell him as she likes him, he is a sweetie on the ground so i understand but i feel if she is going to give up on him we need to find someone who wants a project and sell him cheaply or give him away.
I take no joy in thinking "i knew this would happen" as now we have a very confused young horse in the middle of this mess . My friend wont ride him and i dont think shes going to lunge him anymore as shes given me all his tack. Id love to step up and magically transform him but ive never re backed horses or done any basic training of them, also if i was going to attempt to do this id only do it if i had access to a school of some description somewhere safe and without any distractions . All i have is his own field which has a barbed wire on some sides and his companion in who he constantly naps towards , and hacking. She said yesterday that she would contact the vet to try find out more info from previous vet on the mare (i think she is realising she has no horse to ride so needs to sort out the mare).

Why couldnt she just have stuck with one or got a nice chilled out older horse, she poo pood anything above the age of 12 as it was too old. My way of thinking is its better to have an older horse that you can enjoy straight away than a young horse who needs training and shatters your confidence.

This experience has reinforced my belief that if i ever am lucky enough to get my own i will get an older horse and will pay a decent amount for it and will keep it at a yard with good facilities and other liveries as the support of more experienced owners is invaluable.

She has prepared an advert for him, im torn between feeling that he needs to go to a better home as she should never bought a 4 year old TB from the field and feeling that she shouldnt give up this easily . But i feel if she keeps trying it could just get bloody dangerous for all of us .

What a mess :-( and if anyone would like a 4 year old TB who is very chilled out on the ground and on the lunge (you have to get very worked up to get him to canter! - more exercise for the lunger than for him!!) but nappy to ride, but does move beautifully when you do get him moving. Please let me know.

.........And breathe

Butkin Mon 02-Sep-13 11:21:41

Thanks for the update. A most interesting and salutary thread. It would be very hard to sell him in his current state. I would suggest a give-away (as sorry as this sounds) or offer him to a thoroughbred rehabilitation operation (there are a few around now). Don't forget that whilst the weather is nice now it will soon start turning cold which means a lot more effort on her part required..

DumbestBlonde Mon 02-Sep-13 14:42:16

Crazy idea and I feel for you, having to be the voice of reason; particularly if she is turning a deaf idea to your quite reasonable objections and suggetions.

I had a TB (ex-PTP), came to me as a 15yo but he had been a family horse for quite some time. The first winter when the yard wanted all horses kept in (hunting yard), he couldn't handle it and became a firecracker, nose on chest, hocks underneath himself, grew another hand or two. Scary. Yet he was the kindest, most genuine gent I could have wished for. A two-year-old kid could turn him out (if he was going out dily, that is), my then 10-year-old daughter rode him around the village and he taught my husband to jump, after a fashion, as in, the horse knew what he was doing and took charge. He cost £800 in 1997.

But he had health issues - not too sure he didn't come to me with Navicular, which meant careful riding, shoeing and a day-long session at the vet for diagnosis. He in the end had a heart murmur and a couple of melanomas (grey - a prettier version of Desert Orchid) and had daily sachets of Danilon. But this was as he reached his 30's, so he lasted a long time - and did have an easy life; trust me, one time to a show was enough!

If you only have the two, beware of how attached they may become. As we ended up with only two (the third, another TB, died suddenly after moving to this small private yard, away from my friend's family farm, where there had been as many as 30 family/livery horses), they became almost joined at the hip and as mine was retired, the other one has become rather out of condition and also a bit of a handful. The quarter Shire in this one makes him a bit of a tank; I know that I wouldn't be able to ride him. He is now living alone and I am feeling really quite guilty but am not sure if I could take on another....

As a new owner, she really does need a reality check - and this period of sole care may give her just that. Here's hoping.

My old man was pts on 1 July this year after a sudden neurological deterioration; TBs can - under the rirght conditions - go on for years. But she really needs to take all the advice she is offered - and act pragmatically, not let her heart overrule her head - or you.

Booboostoo Mon 02-Sep-13 22:42:24

I am sorry to be rude but your friend is an utter moron! Of course the horse won't move or leave its companion, it's only 4 years old and by the sounds of it, it doesn't really know much. Unfortunately the poor horse needs an experienced home with someone who has the time to bring him on properly but I suspect your friend will struggle to find him a good home even if she gives him away. The poor horse is in for a life of being messed up and passed around.

So sorry for the horses, but, unfortunately not surprised, to hear how it's turned out. Frankly, at this point, I'd be looking out videos of what happens to animals who end up in the TB's situation (basically passed from pillar to post as Booboo mentions) and sending them to her - it's really, really unpleasant.

Also, the mare may not have navicular. A friend bought a TB - six yo, tricky, head-shy and jumpy (and seriously underweight) - not from badness but from being poorly used and then sold to an inexperienced/unsuitable rider, who then sold on when he couldn't control her, despite using starvation as a method.
Ultimately, despite much TLC and re-training she had to be PTS as was continuously going lame in both fronts, like your friend's mare, and, on scanning, it turned out that tendons were badly damaged in both legs (friend had only done a general, not detailed, vetting on purchase and horse was sound on the day). The previous owner had essentially ensured the damage was ultimately irreparable by riding when she was sore as the mare didn't feel 'unbalanced'.

Sorry for rant, but stories like this make me very, very angry - your friend should not be allowed to own a horse - they are not toys to be thrown out when broken.

CountryCob Tue 10-Sep-13 23:11:41

The simplicity of living out is something I would want too - if I didn't have a tbxwb which drops all weight and shivers if wet or too cold, he would look like a rescue case in weeks if i tried to get him to live out, he is out in a medium weight with hood tonight! as you know winter is tough, two horses is tough and very expensive in hard feed, forage and rugs for the finer types - even if it goes well which is unlikely riding twice a day will be barely possible in the mud and dark and wind and rain and they will get too fit if you could for most types of work, as you know this is a barmy plan sorry

CountryCob Tue 10-Sep-13 23:19:46

Sorry had not read the whole friend that is so sad the poor horse did not stand a chance

CairngormsClydesdale Wed 11-Sep-13 08:24:39

Your last update is just bonkers. I am always more than a "little surprised" when people want me to PAY to take on their problem horse - I'm genuinely looking for a "problem" and people are asking sometimes 4-5k. <much mirth> But, there are people out there like me who have a genuine knowledge, experience and patience to make a horse good, but I'm not paying YOU to train your horse for you!

As for living outside, I kept a WB in sub-alpine (lots of snow + very cold obv.) - no problems with the cold but couldn't cope with the wet and weight would fall off when soggy.

Tell her to nip over to the Kelly Marks forum and get an RA out to have a look.

Hehe cairn what kind of problem are you looking for? [Grin]

CairngormsClydesdale Sun 15-Sep-13 11:13:22

hi chocolate

I like ex-point to pointers everyone else calls "dangerous"! grin

fwiw, just looked at your photo re: navicular. Can you get an EP (equine podiatrist - barefoot specialist) to look at her feet? Reason I say is that her toes are way too long, feet splayed, heels collapsed - all of those things exacerbate navicular. If caught early enough and corrected via a sympathetic trim, navicular can be all but cured. Remedial shoes simply mask the pain on a temporary basis but never actually help the horse.

tallulahturtle Mon 16-Sep-13 10:01:50

Ok she has just gone on holiday for 2 weeks so I'm in sole charge its going to be hard work as when I was away she had a girl helping her but she's now gone back to college so its just me, and occasionally my very understanding other half. She has given me her boyfriends number but I don't like him (they have been on/off all summer) and I took an instant dislike to him when she told me that when they first met he said he could only commit to seeing her once a week , they have been on and off for three years and some occasions he can't even see her once a week so as I know he is not an oil rig worker or has some other awkward job,I'm thinking he has other girls he sees during the week , has a completely separate life, or basically doesn't want to be in a relationship and she should find a decent bloke -anyway that's another story, I just don't want his help !

Anyway this will anger all of you , she told me the other day that she has put a deposit down on an ex polo pony and it is arriving on the 2nd Oct. I am thinking that three in the field may be better than two for things like separation anxiety but I am worried about the long term financial commitment and the sustainability of it all.
That was last week she told me , anyway last night when we met up so she could give me their food and things I may need for them while she is away , she said that a fourth may be arriving , another ex polo pony . It didnt sink in until later that night when hauling two wet rugs from the field , into the car , into my garage to dry off. How the fuck are we going to manage with four of them?
I can't work out if she just is A-frustrated that her current two are unrideable as one needs re training and the other one is being treated for navicular and she just wants a horse she can ride, B-she likes collecting things , C-she has a boyfriend that she barely sees even once a week and she allows him to be in the relationship purely under his terms so she is basically trying to fill her life up with horses (she told me ages ago that she doesnt really watch tv or read , she is used to being very busy when not working as she gets lonely when she's not working) or D she is fucking insane.

We said to her last night, that we thought she was insane to take on two more horses before winter especially and that if the shit hits the fan financially we can't help , all we can offer is time.

I know people would say to walk away but I enjoy being around horses, I enjoy caring for them. I know that by helping look after them I am enabling her and making it too easy a ride for her so she feels she can take more on. But I can't just walk away.

fait Mon 16-Sep-13 13:38:41

What a nightmare scenario. I don't know how you will do it, but she must be made to understand that even if she has a field, she can't expect a whole host of horses to winter out in it - particularly if they have never wintered out before. As I said on another thread, our HOYS horses all winter out for three months, but they are fed extra haylege and checked properly every day - and if they are looking miserable we can always make the decision to cut their holiday short and they can come back in. Sounds like that is not an option for her.

Best of luck with this!

mrslaughan Mon 16-Sep-13 18:03:40

is she paying you? in anyway....ie not just financially........

Mirage Mon 16-Sep-13 18:49:48

I'd say option D,she is fucking insane.How can she afford all these horses? I hope that she has a well paying job,I'd hate the feed bills she is going to get this winter.shock

Poor horses too.

tallulahturtle Mon 16-Sep-13 19:35:47

Yeah it is very worrying , and I really worry if one of them can't handle living out or if any of the need box rest etc. I know that many horses live out but for one person to have four , the shit could really hit the fan if one needs to move somewhere with a stable and she is still paying for three at grass livery at 40 per month per horse.

She's not paying me in anyway , when I first started helping her I was riding the mare 50 percent of the time so that was my payment along with the fact I'm happy to have my hand in again as I've really missed being involved with horses ever since I ended a loan when the horse moved away when I was 16- I'm now 28. She got the tb and then the Hanoverian went lame with suspected navicular so I didn't want to just bugger off as I wasn't getting to ride anymore, I enjoy being around them and I'm lucky to have a job (albeit badly paid) where I can easily do the horses before work as I don't start until 10 but after work is going to be torch based (I finish at 7 or 8 and its half an hour from the field) although I live 5 mins away.

She is insane but she hasn't listened to me so far :-/

AnnaBanana101 Mon 16-Sep-13 19:54:12

My goodness. Is this a wind up?!

Sounds like your friend is not considering the welfare of the horses or your safety or hers.

What happens if one (or more) horse(s) get sick or injured and need to be stabled? Could she afford it? Does she have insurance? With horses you need to think of the worst case scenario and ask if you would have the time and money to deal with it.

Four horses require a huge time commitment - especially in winter. Does she work full time? If so how will she find the time? Also doesn't sound like you have floodlit facilities and it is very soon going to be dark at 4pm ..........

I hope it all works out for the best without someone (human or horse) getting hurt. This is not a situation I would want to be involved in myself.

tallulahturtle Mon 16-Sep-13 21:18:38

She has insurance. She doesn't think of the worst that could happen , that's the problem. I would have thought that with the lameness and vets bills for other things for the existing two so far she would have had a bit of a financial scare . Also I think that she thinks that four is not much more time consuming than two, but i know it will be ,anyone would realise that double the horses would mean double the time and then probably a bit more time for general fannying about as well as four lots of rugs to drag about this winter as we have no storage facilities up there , as well as four to feed and hay.
She works full time with odd hours (police) with the only benefit for the horses meaning that she can often be around in the middle of the day for vets , farrier etc, but it does mean that on days she does the horses there is no set routine time wise as she will often do the morning check after a night shift (6/7am) but then the next day she may have worked different hours so the morning check could be as late as 11/12, but then she may be starting work again at 6 so the evening check would be late afternoon. I work full time too but set hours 10-7/8 so when I do them its in more of a routine, I work 9-8 come December (bloody retail) so I already know I'm going to find it very hard with two let alone four.

We have no lights it will be torchs although the farmer mentioned getting a solar light which he said should give us enough light to check them and do rugs etc in the evenings.
Yes I really hope it works out ok too, watch this space.

theimposter Wed 23-Oct-13 13:09:23

So is there any update on this? I have a little ex flat racer who was 4 when we bought her (now 5) and she did live out for a year whilst with my friend who retrained her and was fine out (decent grass) but she does prefer being in. Having said that she looks worse now (stabled & stuffed) than she did living out 24/7 as our grass is poor. She is a one in a million as a very quiet girl generally but I'm sure like them all she would take the pee out of a total novice (does with my OH sometimes if in season!). We even got caught in lightning yesterday and she was good as gold; maybe I'm lucky she is just not a silly/nasty character?!

Is the original mare sound now? Perhaps your friend could ride her and lead the TB so they can go out together (maybe with someone on foot to be on hand to help just in case) and the TB can gain confidence from the mare without anyone having to be on top? That way they could get in a routine before progressing with solo rides.

If the polo ponies have materialised I'd imagine they will winter out perfectly well as they usually get roughed off over winter anyway and especially if they are Argentine types should be good doers/hardy.

Your friend does sound slightly bizarre and one of those horse collectors. I struggle to afford one so can never understand people who keep adding when they may not have the funds for unforeseen bills! Especially if they are not experienced (would never have got my 4yo had I not known I'd be keeping her at a livery with experienced help on hand) but well done for sticking with it for the horse's sake!

She's still bonkers then....oh dear.

tallulahturtle Sun 29-Dec-13 12:25:27

Hello all.

Sorry no update for a while, i work in retail and november and december are rather tiring months to say the least!!

The Hanoverian mare
Ok the mare had bar shoes fitted and is now sound.
She rode her at the start of november and she was fresh as she hadn't been ridden since July and proceeded to buck my friend off then got her off again by apparently rearing , i was at the field at the time but didnt see either of the falls so suspect the rear wasnt a big one and she fell off as she has a very inexperienced seat (she once fell off as she wasnt expecting a horse to go into canter). The mare hasnt been ridden since (she will be , but ill get to why in a moment)

The TB
The TB was advertised and sold in October he went the same day they came to view him so it happened very quickly , he has gone to an owner of a competition yard who plan on training him for eventing, i was annoyed at my friend for her lack of tenacity and commitment with him but for his sake it was for the best.

Polo pony 1
A few days before the tb was sold an ex polo pony arrived. The old owner said she can be hard to catch sometimes. We were unable to catch her for ages, she would turn her arse to us and threaten to kick , she was ver distrustful. Now i can walk up to her to stroke her and can catch her but still need food most of the time as a bit of an incentive ,( think it may not be fear now but just general naughtyness). Once we managed to catch her we built up trust and eventually got her to allow us to tack her up. Then one day i got on and she was brilliant, just did walk and trot and she had very good brakes , i then took her out on a hack and she was fine in traffic .
She then decides she is going to keep ride her as often as possible and the Hanoverian, she is going to hire a school down the road and ride in there a few times before hacking her , to get the beans out of her.
Anyway she rides the polo pony out and is having a great time , then one day i text and ask how its going and she says. Well i was out galloping again (i think she knew she had good brakes so was testing them to the max ) and getting the mare very excited by galloping bloody everywhere. So she was galloping and then trying to get her to stop, she wouldnt so she apparently used an overhanging tree to drag herself off :-0. She comes off and breaks multiple ribs. The pony runs home and is thankfully found by the gate unharmed.

And then...
That same day another ex polo pony arrives. She told me literally the day before that she had bought another . She said that she is bad with her feet but. "Dont worry ill do all the handling at the start " So the pony is delivered and the old owner helps put a rug on the new one and then my friend pays her and then gets herself off to a&e.

This was in the middle of november so i now find myself having to again do all the care (She cant move without intense pain) , of three horses one of which is hard to catch and the other is easy to catch but tries to kick when you pick
her feet out. This added to working 66 hours a week because my hours and days are increased because im in retail and its christmas.

Now
After a very tough month and a bit its improving as
Now she can move again but my latest battle with her is regarding the new polo pony who is 20 years old and a tb so not as good a doer as the first polo pony who was an argentine type and very sturdy built.
She wants to hay them every other day , they have little grass and they do get hard feed but its not loads. She is convinced they will put weight on if they have plenty of hay .

How often do you all hay and how much roughly?

Hope that update wasnt too long! But essentially there are now three horses and none are currently ridden- she is getting a person to fit saddles in the new year as she has recently learnt that saddles need to be fitted and not just bought off ebay and slapped on (ive been telling her this ever since she bought the first horse).

Once saddles are fitted and my work calms down- January should be dead smile i will start riding them and hopefully she will also ride and will not throw herself off again- who does that?! No idea what the new one is like as she hasnt been ridden yet but hoping she is fairly uncomplicated apart from her feet picking out fight.

Im just hoping that no more horses arrive and we can just get proper tack fitted and get the feed balance right and then get on with riding them .

Littlebigbum Sun 29-Dec-13 18:13:01

Tb a wad twice a day, and 1 scope of nuts... still got grass

Pixel Sun 29-Dec-13 18:22:49

Blimey, sounds like a nightmare!

Ours are currently getting a section of hay each twice a day, but they also get grass each day as we are still strip-grazing, plus one feed of balancer, chaff and beet. They are good-doers though (cobs and a sheltie) not tbs and they have rugs and shelters. Only the old welshie gets a 'proper' feed of beet, the others just get a little taste to make their chaff more intesting as they don't really need it.

Mirage Sun 29-Dec-13 18:43:44

Oh dear,you really couldn't make it up,could you? You have more patience than I have!
We still have a little grass,but am feeding 3 big slices of hay every other day,plus a couple of handfuls of pony mix at tea time.They are both rugged and live out,a 23 year old welshie and a 18 year old connemara.

Booboostoo Sun 29-Dec-13 18:55:51

Your friend is clearly bonkers, but to be honest you are a glutton for punishment! Why are you doing all this work for very infrequent rides on unreliable horses? Why not find another share with someone sane and sensible who has a horse to match?!

tallulahturtle Sun 29-Dec-13 19:58:36

I think its because i worry what would happen if i wasnt there. It terrifies me that there are so many people out there who just buy a horse( or three) and have so little knowledge and riding experience/ability. There is a group on Facebook and its full of horse owners asking such elementary questions or photos of their horses wearing brushing boots etc with the straps on the inside, i know that we all have to learn and you never stop learning when you own a horse but it just gets to me. I was a pony helper for years before i got a loan pony as a child whereas now it seems for some people a child starts riding lessons and then bam! Next christmas theres a pony under the tree. Also im trying to save for a house so cant really pay to share a horse or get one on loan , but i can afford the time and ( just about) energy. It is not an ideal situation but id rather be involved in horses than not.

Also it may amuse/scare you lot that she has also bought a dog , to accompany her on hacks . That dog is ........a pug!
I think they are cute but the poor thing is out of breath just walking from her car to the field so i doubt it will be running alongside once she is riding again.

Ive told her that they are to have hay twice daily along with their food (hi fi lite , pony nuts and fast fibre- not to mention milk thistle, tumeric, pepper, garlic, seaweed and linseed oil!) and will keep a very close eye on all their conditions, especially the 20 year old tb.

Booboostoo Sun 29-Dec-13 20:53:23

I appreciate what you are saying but what will happen if you get injured by one of these unsuitable animals? Can you afford the time off work?

Not all shares ask for money. I've had 3 sharers didn't ask for money from any of them, just ride and look after the horse I did not have time for and keep me company on hacks. If you have transport and can try different yards I am sure you can find a better arrangement.

The other thing is that without you she may be forced to keep the horse buying more under control.

Mirage Mon 30-Dec-13 13:29:46

Oh God! I remember you saying she wanted a dog to exercise alongside the horses.A pug!shock.It'd be funny if it wasn't so dangerous.

It sounds like she is a bit of an animal collector.I have a friend a bit like this,but she did know what she was doing care wise.Your friend must have plenty of money to buy and keep all these animals.

I'm going to channel my childhood riding instructor now:

"Young Lady, this will end in tears".

It is applicable to so many situations; bareback jumping the night before my 11 plus, trying to mount or indeed ride Fat Horse whilst wearing a black hooded robe and holding a plastic scythe (fancy dress...), "let's swim the horses in the river" (near the Swan's nest) but it is most entirely applicable to everything you have described above .

This woman is a loony. A dangerous, deluded, half witted lunatic and you are enabling her. No good will come of this for you, for her and particularly for those poor horses.

She's one of those people who learn to sit to canter and start believing they are advanced. hmm The only advice I have is to remove yourself from the situation, but I appreciate the difficulty because you know the horses now and are concerned for them.

What a big hairy mess OP! Good luck with it.

tallulahturtle Wed 19-Feb-14 10:08:48

Ok, I have an update. Maybe make a cup of tea , hell make a flask!

Well just as the new year was dawning I asked her what her aims were for the coming year, was thinking she'd say "sponsored rides, long hacks" the sort of thing she was planning on last summer. Anyway it was then she admitted she had not realised how difficult and above all time consuming horses are so her plan was to loan out two of them and concentrate on one as she felt she was being stretched too much financially with no reserve if shit hits the fan and also she was starting to resent having to go down and tend to them as three of them takes a lot of her time.

So then she manages to loan out the older ex polo pony to a lovely chap who is going to use her for occasional polo, all she has even done is polo and the only reason she stopped was as the old owner was giving up polo whereas she was still happy playing.

When the pony is collected my friend tells the farmer (who she rents the field off) that she is planning on loaning out another one and will just have one. He is not happy as he has been getting £50 per month per horse plus £50 for use of a field shelter (we're not using it as it's in the other field) and a storage container (which we are using) . He then says that if she goes to one he will be charging her more than £100 a month and will charge her for almost what she would pay for two horses. I'm not entirely sure what has been said but I'm guessing he is reliant on the income now and hasn't got any one else on the look out for grazing at this time of year as in the summer he was more than happy for her to have just one horse in the field.

Anyway I keep out of the financial discussions and she says maybe we should keep an eye out for somewhere else. So I did some online searching and everywhere was full or pricey , mentioned it to my friend who owns a section d I ride in exchange for poo picking and wine (that I have to thrust upon her as she is happy the horse is being ridden in the first place, but I feel guilty so feel I have to slightly pay my way somehow!). She then said "oh there is a space next door"- and sure enough the yard next to ours has a space .

This yard has a school and access to off road hacking ( that I know very well as it's literally 100 metres from a yard and horse that I've ridden for years). The yard does have space for two to move there but in the long term I think the yard owner prefers to have a bit of breathing space so we have been told we can keep two there for a few months but need to go down to one eventually.

So we are still looking to loan one of them out , the Hanoverian to a happy hacking home as she is sound with the correct shoes on and is very easy going, whereas the polo pony we are keeping takes a while to trust people so she decided it was fairer to loan out the Hanoverian as she settled in with us very quickly compared to the polo pony who we couldn't catch for two weeks !

So overall the plan is to move at the end of the month and to actually start riding them again, and to find the Hanoverian a loan home. I feel it will be easier to find her a home once she is in regular work and they can also try her out whereas the other pony was loaned from the field.

I am also delighted that we will have access to a school, something which I've never had, it's always been schooling in sloped slightly dubious fields so to have a school will be amazing and will mean we can bring them back to work in a safe environment. Also they will both have a stable and will be coming in at night , so the mudfever which we are currently battling will be more manageable . And to top it off, there will be running water and lights!!!

I am beyond excited and glad that she has finally realised she is collecting horses only to not actually ride them , so we are moving in the right direction.

The next stage is to move and then establish the correct bit for the ex polo pony so that on hacks my friend can stop and not have to pull herself off using a tree again :-/. The chap who has loaned the other polo pony said without a doubt she needs a cheltenham gag as that is all she will respond to as that's what they use for polo.

I've done some research and seen that you need to ride with two sets of reins as you ride with the normal bit action then if you aren't getting response you can use the emergency rein to get a gag action. One question I have is are there different strength levels of the bit as my friend has bought one with a rubberised straight bar , whereas I would have thought a French link mouthpiece would have been the mildest to start her off with. Also how the hell do you get the roundings in the bit the hole just doesn't look big enough?!

Hope I haven't bored you all senseless but thought it was time for an update , cannot wait to get moved in and settled and bring them back to work so we can actually start enjoying them. I am glad that she is finally seeing sense although I did nearly slap her when she said "winter is so much less fun than summer , you do more work and spend more money with even less riding" - I had been warning her of this all summer while she set about collecting a herd of horses. I am not one to labour the point of I told you so, much better to move ahead and get on with it.

I am hoping that my next update will tell of hacking and maybe even a sponsored ride smile.

Right better get up to the field to start the gradual moving of things and to give them breakfast.

Littlebigbum Wed 19-Feb-14 12:44:02

So glad and well done for sticking with it.

Pixel Wed 19-Feb-14 17:55:05

Wow! lots been happening and the new yard sounds great. As for the Cheltenham gag, do they have roundings? I've never used one but I thought they had more of a cord or thong type thing, sort of like this or this.

tallulahturtle Wed 19-Feb-14 18:25:34

Yeah that what i mean what they have in the photos, sorry must be getting confused smile i shall call them do dahs from now on. Also just read that you should use a slip head in case one of the do dahs breaks. Not entirely sure what a slip head is, guessing its like a head piece/cheek piece combo that you attach incase your do dahs snap :-/ .
Sorry for my bitting uselessness but i have only every ridden in eggbutt snaffle type bits rather than bits with accessories smile .
Yeah i am glad i stuck with it, just getting impatient for the move !!

That sounds better - although your friend still sounds insane!

tallulahturtle Sat 22-Feb-14 07:30:49

Oh yeah she is deffo still insane !!

tallulahturtle Fri 20-Jun-14 11:47:38

Ok, is everyone ready for an update?

We had a good spring, both were being ridden frequently . I got the ex polo pony jumping and took her on a sponsored ride , she was such a good girl nothing fazed her.
After doing the sponsored ride her owner signed up to do one in July on her.

Meanwhile the hanoverian gets kicked in the field, leg blows up. Vet comes and treats, two days later all her legs blow up cellulitis is diagnosed . He treats again (injections) and advises frequent light exercise three times daily. The vet then comes again to check up and while trotting up ,my friends loose dog ( who is always under everyone's feet) runs under the horses belly and gets squished under the mares back legs.

So I have to finish up with the vet while my friend rushes the dog to the vet with a suspected broken foot.

Later on she comes back the dog has broken toes and needs to stay in a dog cage for 5 weeks, feel sorry for het but I honestly feel it was an accident waiting to happen.

Anyway we get on with giving the hanoverian regular exercise and she is now sound and all better , she also found a sharer to ride the hanoverian three times a week .

So the hanoverian is getting regular exercise and I'm keeping the polo pony fit as well as my friend riding them when she gets the time.

Then, last Friday on the drive to work a lady ploughs into me from the left on a roundabout , all liability is admitted by her and her insurer agrees and is paying for everything , although my car is written off (I will be repairing it privately with the settlement ) so I've been a bit stressed recently.
Then on Sunday I'm driving the hire car back from the stables when a chap pulls out from a junction into the other side of me , he apparently looked left and right but not straight ahead, again he admitted liability and his insurance is sorting everything out .

The whole weekend left me very stressed out, emotional and with my head all over the place to be honest.

So on Monday I get this text..........

"Hi, I know this is a bit out of the blue but would you like to full loan her. As I don't really have the time for horses anymore, and don't like spending the money when I don't have time to ride. Thought I'd see if you wanted to loan as if not I am seriously thinking of selling them both."

I then say look you have time to ride , you just need to make time, I work full time too but I get up earlier and ride before work or after work, it is summer so after work riding is possible. It's summer so we are just poo picking not mucking out so make the most of it , this is the time of year we reap the rewards of horses after getting through winter. You have me to help with them both and you now have a sharer for the other one so right now is the easiest it has been.

She then replies with this, have copied this from my phone.....

"These are the reasons I don't want to keep horses anymore: I don't have time for them, I can't be bothered to go there sometimes, id rather just sleep, as I never have time for myself, for instance a manicure! I can't face another winter covered in mud, horse shit, straw and freezing cold. I'm fed up with vets bills coming out everywhere. I'm fed up with my dogs getting hurt every time I go there. Yes I love riding, but I can ride other ways! They drain all my money. I feel like their a chore sometimes instead of a hobby. I never even have time to poo pick, which I know pisses all the others off at the yard, but I just don't have time, I don't even have time to walk my dogs. That's all the reasons I don't want to keep horses anymore. Yes I love them and I know it's going to be hard and I'll regret it! I'd prefer you to loan pan, then I know your happy and she's safe, I don't mind helping when I can. Then sell or loan Millie. Or two sharers for Millie. I just don't want the cost or the time.
What do you think? Do you think there's a better way? Xx""

For the record she the had horses before she had dogs , the dog only got injured as she let it run under the horses belly .
Basically when I met her she had a boyfriend who wouldn't commit to seeing her more than once a week (odd I know and rang alarm bells with me) . She said to me she doesn't watch tv or read, she just works and then gets bored so wanted horses to give her something to do.

So she buys one horse, then a second and spends every free moment down there with them. Then buys a third horse and then "rescues" a pug and a chihuahua . She then ends it with the boyfriend and is single for a bit. And that was December when she was injured after falling off.
She then gets a new boyfriend who seems like a decent bloke and he wants to spend time with her , so she doesn't feel the need to fill every waking minute with horses , dogs etc .

Basically the horses have served their purpose and now she has lost all interest , she hasn't poo picked for two weeks (shared field with five other owners who do it daily so suffice to say they are pissed off) I have now done the poo picking.

Anyway I am seriously considering taking the ex polo pony on but have a hell of a lot to think about .
I am currently looking after both horses full time (she doesn't know this and I think just presumes its fine to just leave them in the field unchecked) I am activity trying to avoid her as I'm angry with her although no one has seen her down the yard since last week so I think the chances of bumping into her are slim. I just don't want to see her until I have thought it through and know what I would do if she was wanting rid of them .

Sorry this is so long but didn't want to drip feed.

Initially I thought there was no way I could have my own horse, but then my husband , my parents and my parents in law (our nieces - their grandchildren ride this horse and have lessons on her ) , have all said based on the monthly cost that it is perfectly do able and they would help financially as they can see how happy this horse makes me and my nieces . All the others at the yard and the other yards down the track have said they can support me and can advise me on things I have not had to think about yet like the cheapest way to buy bedding etc

I am over whelmed by the support my family and friends are giving me when I thought everyone's advice would be to walk away. I can't take on both horses but am starting to think that I can take on the polo pony. Help my "friend"/ find somewhere for the hanoverian who can lightly hack out , and then get on with the new and exciting/scary world of horse ownership.

Have a lot of thinking to do......

Blimey she's been a nightmare. Actually I think your life will be a whole lot easier once you've made your decision. The polo pony sounds worth your investment, just make sure that you've got everything down on paper and signed so she doesn't try and swan back in and nab it from you.

Sorry to hear about the two car accidents, that really doesn't help, but hopefully it will be sorted ok and you can get down to the serious business of actually enjoying horse ownership. As you know there are lots of people hear who are happy to help - just pick out the information that's relevant to you, and I can recommend the Pony Club Manual of Horsemanship for a workmanlike and easily readable guide - I use mine still and it's a good 30 years old, but it's my go to book when I'm doubting myself. Good luck - look forward to hearing a positive update!

tallulahturtle Fri 20-Jun-14 19:52:17

Been working out rough costs and bit confused about levels of insurance cover , basically we wont be competing just hacking and the odd sponsered ride. I dont think i need public liability as i have BHS Gold membership all i want is decent cover for vets fees and where possible not a big excess. I really dont know what a normal excess is to be honest!!
Have a few books , has anyone done the " horse owners certificate" , was thinking of either doing it or getting the very knowledgable lady at the yard to go through it with me, just things like emergencies and what to do if they cut them selves that im unsure on .

tallulahturtle Fri 20-Jun-14 19:54:36

That is her in the photo by the way. Her name is Pantera (Panther in Spanish) she was imported from Argentina for polo and she is a crillo/tb.

She's lovely, fabulous name too. I insure with SEIB but tbh can't really remember the excess (head in sand....), I suggest you ring around a few and see what comes up. I was with NFU who were great but quoted a ridiculous price when I bought my new horse so went with SEIB. They've had to pay out a fair amount on him and the premium has ratcheted up a bit so I'm not sure if I want to, or will be able to afford to insure next year. There's a long back story so it's not as mad as it sounds.

My first horse had basic insurance, I didn't bother with vet fees and it worked out fine with him.

I haven't done the horse owner certificate, but I think others here have and will be able to give you advice. If you've got someone on hand whose happy to help you'll probably learn more from them than anywhere. One word of warning, every person has their way of doing things and it can be a bit confusing - I was helping a new horse owner last year, and every time she said "how do I do.....?" I'd say "I do it this way, it works for me" as a sort of caveat that it may not be the exact textbook way of doing it!

A lot of it really is common sense - horse ownership isn't such a dark art, even though it looks like it from the outside! If you've had children you apply the same rules really - get to know what's normal for them and you'll soon work out if they're not right. Basic first aid is all you need - anything major that's what the vet is for. My vet is great at phone advice, and will also look at photos which I email - eg dhorse had lumps on his neck which I wasn't sure about, vet said it was an extension of the mud fever (which she'd already been treating) - one visit saved!

Phew, that's a bit of an essay - what I basically trying to get across that whilst it seems a huge thing, it doesn't have to be, and the fact that you've already been dealing with the horse and know her gives you a head start.

Join the discussion

Join the discussion

Registering is free, easy, and means you can join in the discussion, get discounts, win prizes and lots more.

Register now