Managing workload

(32 Posts)
samlovesdilys Sat 22-Oct-16 15:10:39

Hi, I read in an article about teachers in Nottingham who have pledged to only do 2 hours of work outside contract hours...anyone managing to do this? What isn't getting done? Do you think it is possible?? Interested in peoples views...

Euphemia Sat 22-Oct-16 15:55:53

What are the contracted hours? Do they mean beyond the 7 hours a day you're paid for?

Haggisfish Sat 22-Oct-16 16:06:19

Yes they do. Good idea but would mean I couldn't reach the standards expected in terms of planning and marking in my school.

Euphemia Sat 22-Oct-16 17:56:38

Shouldn't they be supporting staff to only work their contracted hours?

Working for free is madness - I know we all do it, but our employers, unions and the government need to help us stop.

PotteringAlong Sat 22-Oct-16 17:58:53

2 hours a day? Not got a hope of me being able to do that and do my job to the standard required.

SaltyRock Sat 22-Oct-16 18:06:23

If I didn't have to mark I might be able to manage that, as long as I had no responsibilities beyond teaching.

goingmadinthecountry Sat 22-Oct-16 19:22:43

I prefer not to add my hours! I try to use dead time - marking in the rugby club house, emails while picking up from the station, even planned for next term while waiting with ds in A and E this morning (ds is 19, wasn't ignoring him!!). I rarely resent my extra time because dh (not in teaching) has always done way over his contracted hours. Equally, my parents both had professional jobs that required work at home.

My primary hours (admittedly only 4 days) are hugely better than when I was a secondary head of music dept with all the extra curricular stuff plus A level marking and planning as well as teaching 27 different classes for one lesson a week. Couldn't return to that now with family commitments.

noblegiraffe Sat 22-Oct-16 19:36:50

The only way the job could be done within contracted hours is if contact time was significantly reduced.

However, given directed time is about 6.5 hours per day, we'd end up working less than a normal working week. An extra two hours would give a 42.5 hour working week which seems reasonable, but also like a totally unattainable dream. I work just under that and I'm 0.65ish.

MsMermaid Sat 22-Oct-16 19:56:45

I would say that I manage to do my job well with 2 hours or less per day after school. My school have always encouraged a good work life balance, they don't require written lesson plans for anything other than observed lessons, and are happy with fairly brief plans for them compared to a lot of other schools.

My biggest time taker is marking. When I was first starting out planning took ages, but now I've got quite a few years experience so planning has got much quicker.

MsMermaid Sat 22-Oct-16 19:59:21

I should probably mention that in other schools I would quite possibly work much longer hours, due to extra paperwork being required, I just don't think it would necessarily improve results.

goingmadinthecountry Sun 23-Oct-16 01:45:55

Just been reading the other similar thread. If people are in school 8 - 5 then doing 3 hours' work a night they are not doing it right. At risk of being flamed, sometimes we teachers make it hard on ourselves.

CannotEvenDeal Sun 23-Oct-16 01:50:08

I agree goingmad.

I would not do this job if I had to take that much work home tbh.

I obviously understand that each school and role is different though trying to dodge a flaming

noblegiraffe Sun 23-Oct-16 09:02:47

All very well saying teachers aren't doing it right if they have to do that much work, but the expectations of SLT (who usually have a limited timetable) in some schools are absolutely insane. Triple marking, extensive lesson plans that have to be handed in on a Monday morning, what I've read some teachers on here being expected to do - it's outrageous.

Haggisfish Sun 23-Oct-16 09:14:56

I am doing it right. It takes about two hours to mark a set of 25 books. I have ten sets. I need to mark them at least once a half term.

MsMermaid Sun 23-Oct-16 10:35:01

I do think it depends on your subject/age range/school.

I mark 7 sets of books each week, some of which take about 20 mins to mark (very small classes of pupils with sen), others take 2 hours (32 kids doing higher GCSE/ sixth form). That feels like a manageable amount to me, I probably spend 8 hours a week on marking on average. Then that leaves me with 6 hours of planning to still be within the "2 hours extra per day" that started this thread. That does go to pot when there are reports to be written, but those weeks I get some classes to mark their own homework to lighten the load.

If I was expected to write particular comments as part of my marking, or submit full written lesson plans for each lesson, or differentiate 5 ways for each lesson, then obviously I would have to spend more time planning/marking, and it wouldn't be that i was doing it wrong, it would be unreasonable expectations from smt.

noblegiraffe Sun 23-Oct-16 10:40:33

My marking workload last year was insane, all my KS3 classes were over 30 (including low sets) and my A-level class was 22. They were also so needy I did way more marking with them than I usually would. This year I've got a small group in Y9 and my Y12s are really bright so marking isn't as much.
Not looking forward to mocks marking now we have 3 papers, and two lots of mocks.

TheJiminyConjecture Sun 23-Oct-16 10:54:33

We have to thoroughly mark (against sc, pick up all spellings/secretarial errors and do a next step or response task individualised to the child) every piece of work that the children do for reading, writing and maths. That's 90 books per morning. Plus all the foundation subjects in the afternoon.

We have to have full lesson plans for each subject, for each lesson (they're monitored)
and our reflections on each lesson need to be recorded and are also monitored.

Each week we have approx 3 hours of compulsory meetings.

The latest thing slt are obssessed with are displays so we're expected to update displays daily/weekly. As well as having exciting 3d or interactive displays on every available surface, including the doors.

2 hours a day? Bahahaha

noblegiraffe Sun 23-Oct-16 11:41:47

That's where the unions need to step in. That school is totally and utterly taking the piss.

MsMermaid Sun 23-Oct-16 13:17:22

I agree, that school has ridiculous expectations and the unions should be stepping in to challenge them. There is absolutely no way I would continue to teach in a school like that (I do realise that not everyone has the option to change career/school), it's a recipe for burnt out teachers.

I've had years with massive marking loads too noble, but luckily my current hod thinks about the marking/planning loads when allocating classes so everyone has at least one class that should be quicker to mark. That's been the case for the past 5 years, so I'd be devastated if we got someone new who was less fair in class allocation.

TheJiminyConjecture Sun 23-Oct-16 20:38:00

I know! Sadly no-one wants to rock the boat. Standard response is to be targeted for drop ins, extra scrutiny and the chance of pay progression is nil. Morale is at an all time low. Unsurprisingly.

DorothyL Sun 23-Oct-16 22:25:25

The marking thing is the single most ridiculous part of teaching in this country. Most other countries only mark tests/formal assessments, not class or homework. Do they have worse outcomes? I don't think so

Scorbus Sun 23-Oct-16 22:29:09

It's the next step marking for children who can't read that gets my goat. Who is it for then if not the children?!

goingmadinthecountry Mon 24-Oct-16 00:33:57

I appreciate that I have a totally reasonable HT. Thejiminy, what would happen if people just didn't do all that ridiculous amount of marking? Ofsted don't require it, it is obviously mad.

My latest take on displays (have always enjoyed doing them in the past but have a very different class this year) is that they can over stimulate children and prevent concentration. It's written in my classroom guide so that when our SIP comes in, he realises why nothing dangles or jumps out at you. Of course, displays are up to date with lots of the children's independent work on display rather than daft shite downloaded from *kl.

Scorbus, totally agree about next step marking for children who can't read so I don't do it. Waste of my time and theirs. My time is better spent helping them learn to read.

I really feel for those of you in such a mad situation. It doesn't help anyone.

CalleighDoodle Mon 24-Oct-16 00:43:51

We mark every book every three weeks max. I have 9 classes. Im also pt. Most in a class is 32. Marking one set takes about four hours as they are taught three times a week. Www and ebi comments needed.

Other subjects in the same school have a max of 21 students in a class. And their marking is much simpler. One told me last year he marks every book of svery child he teaches every week and the lot takes him five hours. Most can be self assessed or peer marked . Im still very bitter about that.

So different schools obviously have different expectations and workloads, but different departments in the same school can do too.

CalleighDoodle Mon 24-Oct-16 00:44:28

I meant every book every three weeks as a minimum.

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