Anything I could do?

[Focusfocus]

Will keep this vague, if possible.

Friend got a puppy 1 year ago from an online advert. The seller (a) refused with various excuses to have them come and see and friend paid for seller to come by with four pups to show. (B) seller brought four pups from three different litters, each few weeks apart. Friend doesn't accept this is a puppy farm, but that it's just a regular family living in a nice farm.

Okay. Friend seems very keen to have a skinny dog. The way to do this they concluded at the outset is to not feed the puppy (8 weeks) more than 2 meals a day, a fistful of kibble each meal. Eventually after a few months the vet remarked at a pre neutering check up that puppy looks underfed. Feeding continued as normal.

Fast forward one year. The dog is now 1 year old. Weighs 7.5 lbs. it is NOT. Toy breed. I repeat, we aren't talking chihuahuas. Every bone is visible. Friend recounts to me how the dog is disciplined by hitting. Sometimes hitting hard enough to hurt their hand. It's all said jokingly, and swiftly.

Dog has come to stay with us. The perpetual posture is a crouched cower, low tail wag and walking along the sides of the room, following the walls, ears back, skeleton crouched and tail in a low wag. Every bone is visible.

Friend has left food for the dog. Fistful of pedigree and fistful baker morning and evening. I have been asked not to worry with letting dog out too often. Dog is often left at 8:20 till 6 and has never soiled indoors. Dog is 1 currently.

Can someone please tell me that I am wrong in feeling sad and angry.

[Buttholelane]

I think, that I would video it then report to the rspca personally....

Probably then move house incase they got violent, they sound like those sort of people!

[Buttholelane]

Or,

Video it then fled go a different area with the dog and if tracked down present the video as evidence of abuse

[Buttholelane]

** flee

[KoalaDownUnder]

Are you serious?

Feed the dog up, for starters, and report the owner to the RSPCA. It's abuse!!

[KoalaDownUnder]

...and why the hell are you friends with this person?!

[MsAdorabelleDearheartVonLipwig]

Take it to your vet and report them for animal cruelty. Is there any way the vets could take it to a rescue, one that your friend couldn't get it back from?

I am furious on your behalf.

[DishwasherDogs]

Take it to a vet and tell them?
Poor dog doesn't sound well at all.

[KoalaDownUnder]

Whatever you do, don't just give the dog back to her. Please.

[Focusfocus]

The issue is I have no evidence of this punishment by hitting. It's mockingly told laughingly recounted tales.

As far as having a skinny dog, well, there again, the dog has a vet, it seems they are unconcerned apart from a general comment in skinniness.

What is specifically disturbing to me is that I am observing an animal in a perpetual cower, believe me, a 24/7 cower. And also - that I am serving up one bowl of grain free high quality kibble in one room to my dog, and a other bowl of very colourful, green, red, blue chunks of Bakers in the kitchen. I have categorically been asked to not serve anything more or different. Last time the dog stayed with us, it ran out of food and I served up some of mine as I saw fit, it returned 2 lbs heavier. It didn't go down well.

They live in a different city, so not sure how the recoding would work. And not friends by choice. Perhaps aquaintances is a better word.

Last time I posted on this forum about it some folk said obesity is more of a problem than skinniness, and maybe my eyes are deceiving me. This is half a year later. I don't think my eyes are deceiving me. More importantly, I am perplexed as to how a fistful of coloured Bakers kibble is appropriate nutrition for a - shall we say - definitely.not.toy.dog.

[tabulahrasa]

I'd rehome the dog, not divulge who to and not particularly care about losing a friend who treated a dog like that...

However, if you value the friendship - report them to the RSPCA, they won't say who reported it.

[CuddlesAndShit]

Fucking hell, what absolute bastards.

I don't know what to suggest, but please please don't give the poor thing back to your friend. I'm hoping someone will come along with a foolproof plan for you.

God, that has pissed me right off

[Focusfocus]

Cannot just rehome it. The friend is best described as - one of us two in a two member bridge-building team, or say - joint partners in 2 partner organisation. Sorry for being vague, but I have my hands tied. And the hitting can be very easily denied. Frankly, I've got nothing to go on except it's clearly a mentally broken animal and the fucking Bakers fistful and pedigree is driving me bat shit crazy.

[DishwasherDogs]

Could you give a rough idea of size? Labrador, springer, what would compare to it?

The thing is, if it is as skinny and ill looking as you describe, I would suspect that they are not taking it to a vet at all, as no decent vet would be unconcerned about this.

Take it to a vet (tell your friend the dog was ill and you had no option), and talk this over with someone who can see the dog in person and evaluate its health and then take it from there.

[Focusfocus]

Look I am going to post a partial picture but then going to ask MNHQ to remove it, I cannot be identified. Wait for the part picture. I am earnestly hoping this is normal

[DishwasherDogs]

Hitting can easily be denied, but if every bone is visible this is very difficult abuse to deny, as presumably it's visible to anyone who sees the dog.

[ItsAllGoingToBeFine]

Take it to vet, and contact RSPCA. They may not be able to do anything, but you at least have to try. I'd also have an "accident" with his kibble, and be sadly forced to feed him other food in the quantities suggested on the bag.

[SunshineAndShadows]

You need to report your concerns to her vet and to the RSPCA. The information may not result in direct action but it will be logged at least.
Why do they keep this dog?
What do you say when they recount their jolly tales of animal abuse?

[SunshineAndShadows]

You can also report to police as a breach of the Animal Welfare Act

[Focusfocus]

Sorry am not being able to click anything half decent as it's cowering away under furniture and upstairs.

Conversation could be like

Me: so is your dog all housetrained then?
Friend: oh dog wouldn't dare to soil indoors. Would be beaten hard! Hehhehe.
Me: what?! You'd beat the dog?
Friend: yes yes everyone needs discipline. Come on let's go and do X or Y on this task now.

I've honestly never figured out if it's real or not. Also there are significant language barriers and sometimes I give them benefit of the doubt with English words.

I could try changing the food. But last time it went back from mine they strove hard to get rid of the slight weight gain and not sure if that's fair. Secondly, last time it had my dogs food it got diarrhea owing to sudden change.

Oh, by the way, last time it got diarrhea, we did consult the vet in our city who did say that dog looks underweight. Friend brushed it off saying it's not a problem, they are avoiding arthritis.

[BagelwithButter]

Can't you just say it got out by accident and ran away ....

Hide in (proper) friend's house in the meantime ... mad, I know, but HELL, poor dog.

[tabulahrasa]

The type of food is irrelevant really... Yes in an ideal world everyone would feed a quality dog food, but, they are dog foods and plenty of dogs do well on them.

The dog's weight is the food issue. 7.5 lb for anything bigger than a toy breed is pretty small, to put it into perspective that is the same weight as my very small cat.

But, how underweight depends on whether we're talking whippet, spaniel or lab sized dog.

[DishwasherDogs]

Is this a very large breed? I have heard from one large breed owner that she keeps her dogs on the slim side (but not starved) until they are fully grown to allow bones to develop healthily.
(Disclaimer: I have no idea if this is bollocks or not, just wondering if these people are acting under some misguided notion)

I still think you need to take the dog to a vet and tell them the full story, and they will be in a better position to judge than we are. If the dog is indeed being treated badly, then it either a) mustn't go back to the owners or b) should go back under some sort of supervision and monitoring (don't know if the RSPCA does this, so may not be an option).

[KoalaDownUnder]

Take it to a vet (not 'her' vet, your own vet). Get an official diagnosis that it's malnourished and anxious. Then report her to the RSPCA.

[basildonbond]

What breed is the dog? That can make a huge difference as to body type and carriage - my dog is about springer spaniel size and doesn't eat much more than a couple of handfuls of kibble plus half a sachet of wet food a day (def not bakers or pedigree chum though) and lots of people say he's too skinny but acc to my vet he's perfect. He needs to be thin as he has a dodgy hip and id be really pissed off if some well-meaning person fed him up in the mistaken belief they were doing him some good

[DishwasherDogs]

Oh, just seen 7.5lbs, so not a large breed.
Being underweight will surely contribute to worse conditions than arthritis?