I can't cope with my dog anymore :( be gentle please.

[TheTempest]

I have a 7 yo Patterdale who we got from a friend of a friends dad. Bad idea I know now.

We've had her for a year now and I really thought I was getting somewhere with her. We have been doing PAT with her as she was too snappy and barky at other dogs.

She slipped her harness today got her muzzle off and attacked another dog. Bit it in 4 places, the dog has had to stay in the vets overnight and it's coating us nearly 400 pounds.

I'm at the end of my tether, she had been so much better. She laid down and looked at me afterwards.

I absolutely adore her but I can't cope with this anymore

Where do I go from here? She's had a vet check and nothing wrong, seen a behaviourist who said she wasn't aggressive. I'm a horrible d

[ClaimedByMe]

I have a dog aggressive dog and after nearly a year we are having one bad day a week instead of one good day a week, I can sympathise with the amount of work you are putting in, the relapses are heartbreaking.

We a SBT and were told not to use a harness on her as her pulling against it while walking empowers her or dog behaviourist advised a rope lead and there has been a great improvement I think that's because I feel more confident using it.

I would find another behaviourist and do you have insurance that covers her attacking other dogs, ours does.

I am not familiar with PAT, what is that?

[curlew]

I await my flaming- but if you are getting no pleasure from this dog, and if the dog can have no freedom because it is dog aggressive, and if you have spent a year trying to put it right, and if it has seriously hurt another dog, then it should be PTS.

[Scuttlebutter]

Hi OP, do you mean BAT?

[TheTempest]

Sorry that should have been BAT. Curlew that's what my DP, DParents, DPIL etc have said. I don't want to though I love her and she finally has a nice life with me

Thank you, it's nice to be able to offload.

[TheTempest]

Sorry ClaimedByMe, I couldn't see what your post said as on my phone.

Insurance doesn't cover it, I checked I'm going to have to try another behaviourist. It feels so hopeless though, I have been in tears ever since. The other dog didn't even fight back

[TheTempest]

Oh and I should add I get a lot of pleasure from her at home. Not so much out I agree.

She knocked DD ( nearly 4) over while she was going for the dog, this has translated to everyone as she was being aggressive to her

[ClaimedByMe]

It doesn't sound like she was being aggressive to your dd, I can imagine my dog knocking over anything or anyone that is in her way of getting to where she wants to go.

I also get lots of pleasure from my dog in house but going out can be a bit of a nightmare.

[ChickensHaveNoEyebrows]

My utmost sympathies. My dog has never actually attacked another dog , but is dog aggressive. He will jump, lunge, snarl and make some horrendous, murderous noises. I understand the stress, strain and anxiety managing such a dog involves. Now, I'm far from an expert, but someone on this very board once gave me some great advice: When it's all too much, take a day off. No walks that day. Throw a ball, do some training, whatever. But stay at home and give yourself and your dog a break. Then think of a new way of tackling the problem. It might be that your dog is never going to be trustworthy around other dogs. In which case, you can try a different harness/muzzle combo, you can only walk her early and late, or you can try another behaviourist who specialises in socialising dogs with issues. You must feel rotten right now, understandably, so take a step back and reassess in a few days.

[Floralnomad]

I have a Patterdale x rescue and he doesn't like other dogs but fortunately on the whole just ignores them .obviously the first thing is to make sure your dog is secure on a harness ,we use a Doxlock one and its the only one that I don't feel my boy can get out of ( we've tried loads) . Have you thought of walking in a canny collar , they are much more secure than most of the other types of headcollar and give loads of control . It may be worth you looking at the Patterdale rescue site as they have lots of good advice . I'm quite lucky with mine as he has a good recall and is in general an absolute sweety .

[Floralnomad]

Forgot to say my boys weakness is cats and he would knock a herd of cows over if he thought he was going to get at one so I don't think knocking your daughter over is an issue ( apart from for your daughter ) . You are very brave to have taken on a Patterdale they are far from easy ,especially when you get them second hand .

[TheTempest]

Thanks Chickens, I am having tomorrow off. I have sorted it out with the other owner and they were very kind so I am slightly less upset.

Flora, thanks very much. I had a look on the website it was like reading about my girl. I'll up the training at home we do quite a lot already but I did find she is calmer out when I have knackered her mentally.

I'm willing to give anything a go. She has Baskerville muzzle and a properly fitted harness and anti shock training lead etc. I honestly try so hard with her.

Thanks for being so kind, it's so hard to balance my love for her and lack of progress to thinking about whether I can keep her and other dogs safe

I'm not worried about her and DD, they are always supervised and she has never even slightly responded to her aggressively. Other than the occasional growl if someone leans over her or DD as she wants to protect her.

[Floralnomad]

At least the it doesn't seem like the other owner is going to report you . Have you not got third party insurance which would cover the bill ? If not you really should get some just in case she causes an accident and someone sues you .

[curlew]

You must feel absolutely awful. But it's no life for you, the dog or your dd. Honestly. You will never be able to relax and trust her with other dogs. Do you really want this for another 6/7 years? When you could have a dog that your dd could play with in the park, that you could relax and enjoy?

[Floralnomad]

I'm sorry curlew but you don't get rid of pets just because they have the odd issue you live with them ,because they are part of your family and deal with them as best you can . This dog is not aggressive with people so the OP and her daughter are in no danger ( from info given) . Lots of people have dogs that have to stay on lead for a variety of reasons its not a reason to get rid of them . I feel very sorry for any animal you have ,god help them if they are less than perfect .

[Scuttlebutter]

BAT is a proven technique that helps reactive dogs, when used appropriately. Progress is possible. Our reactive dog has improved so much I will be taking him to training classes in the autumn, something I'd have thought impossible this time last year.

OP, i think it's worth looking at a number of issues. Firstly, as a matter of urgency, rethink the fitting of your harness and muzzle - it shouldn't be possible for your dog to get out of both while you are out and about. Secondly, ahve a look on the APDT website for a positive behaviourist near you who can help you through this, and work on a training programme for you both. Thirdly, take the pressure off yourself and find a safe off lead play area for regular use. Many of us greyhound owners use them - your local greyhound charity might be able to advise, dog training club, or even an indoor riding school. We found that having this option, even once a fortnight, really helped us - we could simply enjoy watching the hounds zoom about without worrying about passing cats, squirrels etc. - Having that time when you don't have to worry etc. is enormously helpful and keeps your spirits up.

Good luck and best wishes - so pleased you are wanting to do the right thing by this dog.

[curlew]

The OP has spent a year trying to fix this problem, and the dog has badly hurt somebody else's pet. She will never be able to relax and be happy with this dog, and he may hurt other dogs in the future. This is not just a little blip, it's a serious problem which will make everyone unhappy.

[Floralnomad]

The OP has said that she loves the dog and it gives her a lot of pleasure .No one is saying its not serious but its not something that most people would consider getting rid of their pet over , most people would do what the OP is doing and get advice on how to move forward safely .

[curlew]

Anybody who wouldn't consider getting rid of this dog as one possible option would be a fool. How can an owner ever be absolutely sure that something like what happened today would never happen again?

[Viviennemary]

The OP has given this her best efforts and the dog is causing a lot of stress and upset. I don't think she should feel ridden with guilt if she decides she can no longer cope with a dog and try and find a new owner. It does sound an agressive dog that has attacked another dog. What if this keeps happening.

[Scuttlebutter]

Sadly, Curlew, nobody can guarantee that any dog will behave perfectly during its entire lifetime, no matter how well trained.

Injury, illness and different situations can all make dogs react in ways that are not typical.

To help the OP, which is the reason for posting, a number of us have come up with constructive, positive, tested approaches that will allow the OP to maintain her relationship with her dog without either killing it or dumping it on someone else.

[curlew]

"Sadly, Curlew, nobody can guarantee that any dog will behave perfectly during its entire lifetime, no matter how well trained.

Injury, illness and different situations can all make dogs react in ways that are not typical.

To help the OP, which is the reason for posting, a number of us have come up with constructive, positive, tested approaches that will allow the OP to maintain her relationship with her dog without either killing it or dumping it on someone else."

We can't guarantee that any dog will behave perfectly, no. But the OP can pretty much guarantee that if this dog ever gets off his lead,, he will hurt another dog. Rather different.

And I don't think anyone has suggested anything that the OP has not tried over the past year. The OP needs to be reassured that sometimes it's all right to be defeated by an intractable problem. Incredibly sad, but true.

[TheTempest]

Thank you everyone. It has givens some good for thought.

It is an option I have considered, but I can't put her down/ shift the problem. She's my little girl and it was my fault yesterday happened.

Thanks Scuttle, I have been doing Bat to the letter with her, and she has been so much better until yesterday

I have had a look on t'internet but there isn't anything like your field around here :( thanks for all your input, felt that I might have had a flaming. I 'm feeling a bit delicate and so sad for my lovely girl. Life could be so much nicer for her

[Scuttlebutter]

Tempest, quite a lot of secure "play" areas aren't advertised, or only via networks, IYSWIM. Try your closest greyhound charity - they will almost certainly either have one themselves or know of one.

Hope you are feeling better this morning.

[Floralnomad]

This is the quote that rules my Patterdale owning life ,it comes from the Patterdale rescue uk website
'Terriers will be terriers and need management as much as training. Their safety is in your hands. We naturally take the blame and never place it on the terrier.'
I'm not flaming the OP for letting her dog escape her harness and muzzle but it ultimately was an accident that shouldn't have happened .Well done OP for wanting to deal with your dog rather than just PTS or pass the problem on . If this attitude makes me a 'fool' then I'm happy with that .