Would you return puppy to breeder?

(100 Posts)
NorthernAnnie Wed 06-Mar-13 21:45:31

We bought a cross breed puppy. He is now 10 months old and has numerous allergies including grass and certain foods. He is now on an expensive diet, can't walk on grass, our vet's bills are huge and not likely to get any less and he sheds heavily which aggravates DS's asthma. We love him but in hindsight we should have been more careful about where we bought him from. I have realised the breeder was a BYB, she hadn't had her dog (or the stud) health tested although she was a much loved family pet. Would it be awful to return him to her?

Bakingtins Sat 09-Mar-13 19:48:40

I think any vet who did not recommend ruling out fleas/parasites as step 1 in treating any skin condition should be ashamed of themselves.
If your dog is not itchy ( includes rubbing, nibbling, licking as well as scratching) then is v unlikely to be atopic.
The black greasy patches which tend to affect skin folds like the groin, round the tail, armpits, ears in particular sounds like a yeast infection called malassezia. This can be identified v quickly by looking at tape strips pressed on the areas under the microscope to identify the yeast, then treated with Malaseb. You can either buy it from the vet or ask for a written prescription. The yeast infection can be the primary problem but also can be secondary to another underlying problem. Either way, controlling it will likely improve things.
The other thing which is likely to be useful is skin biopsies, which can be done under sedation/local anaesthetic. You need a proper diagnosis and a plan for treatment going forward.
I agree that the EPO and omega 3 may be helpful.

idirdog Sat 09-Mar-13 18:19:58

Malaseb has to be given by the vet as a prescription is required but you can get the prescription and then buy online. You do need advice from the vet to check this is the right thing for your dog

pigsDOfly Sat 09-Mar-13 18:12:48

No advice really to offer except to reiterate what others have said about getting a referral to a specialist.

My girl had a problem with her eyes. Went to my vet who said he had no idea what it was as he'd never seen it before. Immediately referred me to an eye specialist who recognized it immediately, explained to me exactly what it was and started treatment. It's possibly an ongoing problem, but now we know how to handle it, and my vet has learned some new information.

I have a great deal more respect for my vet for admitting he's not some god like figure who knows everything, than if he'd just kept trying things that he thought might work.

My vet gave me malaseb when Jas had a yeast skin infection. It is very effective and provided instant relief to my dog. I think it costs around £6. I use the vet practice which operates out of Just For Pets, so I assume that they stock it.

Floralnomad Sat 09-Mar-13 16:43:38

You need a referral to a specialist to get to the root of the problem . TBH it doesn't sound like today's vet was any better than the other one . If you don't know what you're treating how can a special diet treat it ?

So do I. You dog is certainly flummoxing the medical profession it has to be said. smile

Fair play for trying somewhere else too.

Turniphead1 Sat 09-Mar-13 15:46:46

Northernannie - did you ask this vet about a referral to a dermatologist? Could this vet not advise you where to get malaseb?

NorthernAnnie Sat 09-Mar-13 15:36:50

needastrongone - thanks, I really hope it can be sorted though and we won't have to resort to rehoming him.

NorthernAnnie Sat 09-Mar-13 15:35:18

I took him to another vet this morning as suggested just to see if our vet had missed something. She gave him some spot on advocate just in case it was fox mange. She said the causes these things are notoriously hard to pinpoint and treat and that we should just keep up with his special diet. I have been to a few places to try and find malaseb but no luck so far.

smile

Annie - Do you mind if I say something honestly? I say this with good intention and not to have a go at you. I really think that, having read your posts, that you have made your decision to rehome (whether you realise this or not at this stage). Many have given extremely good advice regarding his condition and what you might expect the vet to do etc etc, but really, you are focusing on the rescue aspect.

That's fine, your decision and I am not making comment about the rights and wrongs of it. This dog has to add to your family and I don't think that you think it is or can see a time when he even will.

But you really can't expect to see him again. The rescue will ensure he goes to the best possible home. You need to leave it there and move on. Good luck.

Freakin' doodle and other 'oodle' breeders have a lot to answer for, wankers.

AmandaLF Sat 09-Mar-13 10:44:38

No advice regarding the allergies but if you do decide to put them to a rescue could you keep him till they found him a home? My parents have 2 rescues, and both taken from a kennel. Neither of them got on well but the second you could literally count every bone in his body. He was days from death as he stopped eating. He was about 17kg and was fully grown. Skip forward 2 years and he's now over double that size but is not underweight which just goes to show how skinny he was.

It would also help the rescue place out immensely.

SuckingDiesel Sat 09-Mar-13 10:34:33

I see evening primrose recommended above. I would also supplement with Ester-C (a natural anti inflammatory - will help joints too if you suspect HD might be an issue) and fish body oils (omega 3 - NOT cod liver oil). Relatively cheap and promotes skin health. I have used them with great effect for my dig's skin complaint and managed to keep her off antibiotics/steroids for several years now.

idirdog Sat 09-Mar-13 08:56:28

No rescue will let you know where he is being rehomed. Rehoming means that you are giving up ALL responsibility for the dog that is the whole point.........

You can't have it both ways visit the dog but hand the baggage and expense to other people.

You seem to be bogged down by this issue and obviously need to get better informed. Some of the reasons you have said or been told about are just ridiculous.

Get a second opinion and be prepared for a short while to get things back on track and an accurate diagnosis. In a months time things will look very different. Once you get on top of the skin problem, know the cause and triggers etc it will be easy to manage and control.

Malaseb will also help with your DC,s issues to as it will help with the dander But you are going to have to spend some money

NorthernAnnie Sat 09-Mar-13 08:32:06

Does anyone know how we would go about rehoming him if this doesn't work out? I'm really upset that the labradoodle trust would not let us know where he was going and that we would never be able to see him again... I would want to know that he would have a better life than the one we could offer him.

NorthernAnnie Fri 08-Mar-13 21:24:18

ThePlatypusAlwaysTriumphs - Thank you so much, will buy some malaseb

NorthernAnnie Fri 08-Mar-13 21:21:36

The skin on his inner ear flaps is also black, strangely.

Also rather dubious that they have so very different air in Scotland!!

Platypus gives super advice it would seem, good luck.

DOoin. Giggled at your dogs performing in anticipation of chicken. Our puppy does this when he sees the clicker coming out!!

Seriously Annie, recently our puppy sustained a serious eye injury. Our vet was awesome, the specialist remarked that the initial treatment could not have been more appropriate or thorough. And, when our vet was unsure about the exact treatment to give as the injury was so rare, he wasn't afraid to seek expert help. That doesn't sound like your vet.

Please get a second opinion. Please. Hope you are ok.

ThePlatypusAlwaysTriumphs Fri 08-Mar-13 19:51:21

Rehome to Scotland??? I'm in Scotland and every 4th dog that walks through my consulting room door is atopic and suffering!! We do still have pollen here, you know!!

I would agree with others that most atopy is pruritic (itchy), so I'm not sure I'd go down the atopica route just yet. (Have to admit, I've not had great results with it, many of my atopic dogs don't respond, and it is comparatively expensive)

Couple of questions: has your vet given steroids in the past, and if so has it improved things or made it worse? Most atopic conditions will initially improve dramatically with steroid injections, then relapse as they wear off. In my experience food and contact allergies are less responsive to steroids, so it can be a useful experiment. Mange etc will worsen with steroids.

One of the things I would recommend (which you may already have been recommended to do) is give evening primrose oil capsules daily- this can really help the lipid barrier in the skin, and although not usually curative of atopy it can help, and it's fairly cheap and harmless, even if it has no effect. You need to use it for about 6 weeks to get an idea if it is helping. I'd second malaseb, which is really good for yeast and superficial infections. it's not particularly cheap, but you can make it last.

It may well be worth referral to a dermatologist- the initial outlay could be worth it.

I'd get a different vet. You shouldn't have to suggest a diagnosis to your vet, they should be telling you what's wrong. It must be worth getting a second opinion?

NorthernAnnie Fri 08-Mar-13 19:11:23

The labradoodle trust said it was their policy that the rehomers weren't allowed to know where he came from and we weren't allowed to know where he had gone confused sad

Floralnomad Fri 08-Mar-13 17:19:28

You need to stop messing about with the vet and get referred to a dermatologist . I agree with ruledbyheart and if you do rehome why would you think you would be able to keep in touch or know where he had gone ?

ruledbyheart Fri 08-Mar-13 17:15:27

If it's atopic dermatitis the medication will not cost £60 a month forever it is about £30 for 15 capsules however once under control the medication can be reduced to every other day and in some instances every 3-4 days.

You should have researched the breed before getting it and then finding out that they can be high shedders but thats too late now but you took on the dog and you should accept your responsibility towards it, if your child needed medication that you had to pay for would you rehome him too?
Not trying to be harsh but the dog is your responsibility and to palm him off because he needs medical care is atrocious.

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