Downton Abbey

(1000 Posts)
harrietthespook Tue 11-Oct-11 22:20:33

Ladies....as we were?

mrszimmerman Tue 11-Oct-11 22:45:19

lawks a mercy - how do you all know what's going to happen next?
(pinched waist emoticon)
(Mary with eyebrows up far too high emoticon)
(sweaty strumpet untimely 'caught' up the duffski by that wicked rumpled cad of a winking Officer)
lawks!
make it stop!
I watched series one on dvd, it was DIVINE, three nights, no ads, lovely.
brew

Phew was panicking there Harriet!

<loosens corsets & makes a brew >

www.itv.com/downtonabbey/episodes/episode-five

For those who missed the trailer....also lots of behind the scenes footage on the DA website. grin

Longtime Tue 11-Oct-11 23:30:57

PastGrace, I pm'd CheerfulYank with the same link! Not that I'd use it of course ;) .

Longtime Tue 11-Oct-11 23:51:58

mrszimmerman, I did too but then the time frame thing is even worse when all nine episodes are watched in such a short time, aren't they? It supposedly spanned two years and four months. In my head it only seemed to span a couple of weeks!

Longtime Tue 11-Oct-11 23:52:28

Can't see the trailer over here sad and can't find it on youtube.

josephinebonaparte Tue 11-Oct-11 23:53:29

Humfph

CheerfulYank Wed 12-Oct-11 01:11:59

I would never use such a thing! <sputters indignantly>

But if I ever did I might, say, refuse to go with DH and DS to visit relatives so that I could, say, start episode 2. HYPOTHETICALLY.

Also hypothetically, if I were to watch season 2 I would think I'd love Bates just as much as I always had and that wife of his did look like a bitch, and he was probably just calling a spade a spade.

Hypothetically.

Phew, found you!

<settles down with a brew>

mrszimmerman Wed 12-Oct-11 07:20:18

I don't understand the loving of Bates. And WHY does his love interest have to be as young as his grand daughter would be? He's kind and silent and strong but also central casting for the creepiest, wrongest kind of bad un' in a crime drama.
And the actor Lord wotsit has eaten all the pies hasn't he?
But if Matthew and Mary have to end up together to satisfy our womantic needs, how will Matthew forgive her harlotry and criminal behaviour?

diddl Wed 12-Oct-11 07:42:17

"you have some interesting guesses on the go there, laydeez.."

But are any correct??

Well, with Mary & the Turkish guy, Ethel & the farer, Sybil & Bransen, I reckon Matthew is better off awayfrom them all before they corrupt him toogrin

Available men of any type being so scarce in the rarified circles of Downton, the gels are easily swayed by a sweet -talking cad wink

Pentagram Wed 12-Oct-11 08:26:07

Has this new thread unexpectedly moved on 3 years too? grin

harrietthespook Wed 12-Oct-11 09:30:37

I have to exert today and probs won't be back on for a bit.

Waiting for AITCH to return and spill it

ThePsychicSatsuma Wed 12-Oct-11 09:31:40

helleau. <pats hat>

<accepts china cup of tea>

Is Aitch a TV reviewer/editor??

<makes kidnap plans-the ransom will be obvious>

ThePsychicSatsuma Wed 12-Oct-11 09:33:55

ooooooooooooooh 4 days to go till ep 5. can't actually wait already.

ripstheirthroatoutliveupstairs Wed 12-Oct-11 09:41:08

I am looking forward to it too. DH is coming to England on Friday evening, that means he must watch all the episodes I've recorded for him so far before Sunday.

Lucky Mr Rips !! Hope he likes period drama?

ripstheirthroatoutliveupstairs Wed 12-Oct-11 09:51:39

To be fair to him, he'll probably be more interested in the Spooks I've also recorded for him.

Summerbird73 Wed 12-Oct-11 10:11:05

<runs into room breathless - so there you are>
<fluffs cushion on new 'thread' seat>
<has a cup of brew and seed cake>

Aitch shock are you Jonafan Woss?

harrietthespook Wed 12-Oct-11 10:47:26

A vair quick update re Season 3. Zoe Boyle, aka Lavinia, was characterised as a 'guest' star of the show and not listed as one of the main cast members for this series...leaving the door open for...?

ripstheirthroatoutliveupstairs Wed 12-Oct-11 10:55:13

Rolf Harris?

Summerbird73 Wed 12-Oct-11 10:57:22

Meee! wink

ThePsychicSatsuma Wed 12-Oct-11 11:02:11

can we discuss Mary's eyebrows further. They seem very long, with a wide gap in the middle?

<sips tea>

AKMD Wed 12-Oct-11 11:04:58

I'll stand in. I'm blonde.

Totally agree with the DVD thing. I can't remember why I bought it after Christmas but DH and I watched it in 3 nights then howled when we found out that series 2 wasn't on until the autumn of this year. I did mention doing myself a kindness and just waiting for the DVd again this time but the temptation was irresistable.

josephinebonaparte Wed 12-Oct-11 11:22:54

<offers round cucumber sandwiches>

limitedperiodonly Wed 12-Oct-11 11:29:10

Would round cucumber sandwiches have been served in grand houses in 1918?

AKMD Wed 12-Oct-11 11:35:49

No, the cucumber would have been replaced by slices of cabbage made to look like cucumber. Or is that the wrong war /me making it up?

I've just been reading Nancy Mitford and on the strength of that I don't think that the portrayal of Maggie Smith's character is wildly inaccurate. I bet there were lots of eccentric/sarcastic/judgeypantsgossips in the WWI/interwar/WWII period aristo set.

Actually the comedy elements owe a lot to Mitford, I bet Julian Fellowes was rather heavily influenced by her.

limitedperiodonly Wed 12-Oct-11 11:58:41

Somewhere like Downton Abbey would have had its own glasshouses so they would have been okay for salad vegetables.

But I'm pretty sure the working classes had to make do with powdered cucumber in the Second World War.

ScatterChasse Wed 12-Oct-11 12:17:24

Well, it's mostly water anyway...

Did you say the first series spanned over two years? And then we've done another two in this one? Mary is well and truly on the shelf then, she must be what, 26?

But Edith and Sybil are catching up I suppose. Why aren't they worried about Edith getting married? Violet's gone all concerned about Sybil, but not Edith.

<sips tea>

I was just wondering if it was necessarily Pamuk the newspaper man was talking about... Admittedly I'm not sure what else it could have been, perhaps he realises she loves Matthew?

GeorginaWorsley Wed 12-Oct-11 12:33:34

Hello Ladies.
Am stockpiling tissues,wine and chocolate for sunday night.
Will self combust if Matthew dies.
I can't stand it!grin

AKMD Wed 12-Oct-11 12:40:06

Nah, definitely Pamuk. He wouldn't care about her fancying Matthew as long as she kept the line.

Someone said on thread mk 1 about making the Georgette Heyer books into a series/film. Yes! Why hasn't it been done already? The Foundling, These Old Shades and Regency Buck would make great TV.

Matthew must not die. He must marry Mary. The end.

apparently (accroding to a long thread a while back) there was a TV movie made of a GH book, which she hated so much that she refused to allow permission for any of her books to be filmed. I'm torn as to whetehr I want them to be filmed, becasue they won't Do It Right and I will Get Cross.

I'm not finding Series 2 of DA as gripping as series 1 though, which is very disappointing. I think it's the disjointedness of it all, and not being able to work out the timescales.

ThePsychicSatsuma Wed 12-Oct-11 12:44:48

gah to 'powdered cucumber'
and bread and dripping.

crepes suzette are ok though, I'd give Patmore a job

ThePsychicSatsuma Wed 12-Oct-11 12:45:47

anyone else think it was a bit tenuous O'Brien hearing the 'special cupboard' comment by patmore then grassing her up to Cora, she didnt even seem to hear the whole conversation

ripstheirthroatoutliveupstairs Wed 12-Oct-11 12:57:08

The whole bloody thing is tenuous. But strangely addictive.
Imagine if it had been a special cuboard in the mould of special meat from the butcher in The League of Gentlemen.

AKMD Wed 12-Oct-11 12:59:16

I thought the whole 'special cupboard' thing was very panto. All Mrs Patmore needed to do was raise her eyebrows and wink at 'special' and 'cupboard'.

I read a biography of GH once and it put me off her books for a while. Such a stuck-up snob! I do like the books though smile

Summerbird73 Wed 12-Oct-11 13:10:18

rips oh yes the first thing i thought of was the League of Gentlemen too! grin Expected whatsisface to skulk in with 'that look' wink

FearfulYank Wed 12-Oct-11 13:16:16

Bates is exactly like and older British DH, except for the yelling at his wife. That's probably why I love him.

And Anna is not old enough to be his granddaughter! <indignant sniff>

diddl Wed 12-Oct-11 13:16:22

I´ve found that the only thing I care about is that M&M don´t marry-although I´m sure they will!

So M´s come back injured, Lavinia can´t cope, Sir R gives Mary the heave-ho, Mary nurses Matthew & they fall in love & she´s "worthy" of him as she accepts him in his wounded state.

Thereby proving that she truly loves him & not just DA?

FearfulYank Wed 12-Oct-11 13:19:42

I want them to marry!

But I the thing I care about most is Bates and Anna getting their little hotel and babies.

I am part of the baser American audience, though wink

ripstheirthroatoutliveupstairs Wed 12-Oct-11 13:23:15

Which brings us all full circle to M+M marrying despite Ms manhood being blown off, which, logically means they must adopt slutmaid and moustache's baby and bring it up as the heir to DA.

Like your thinking rips but what if the baby has ginger hair and a moustache? Dead giveaway.....

ThePsychicSatsuma Wed 12-Oct-11 13:27:25

slutmaid!

ThePsychicSatsuma Wed 12-Oct-11 13:35:30

diddl your way seems the most logical, but howsabout this then...

clearly ep 5 is about 10mths later, judging age of baby

The Vicar comes round as O'Brien gossiped in the village about sins and unwed gels getting knocked up.
as he is there, he gets chatting to Violet and love blossoms.
Matthew totally paralysed due to spinal injury {sob}
william bravely pulled him out, got his foot shot off- he's a hero. But shellshocked too, starts beating Daisy up. Patmore intervenes and tells him the engagement is off. Daisy heartbroken.
Thomas catches flu, dies. Obrien devastated, admits he was her secret son. She moves in with ethel to bring up her son together.
Mary uncovered for Turk-shagging. Family protect her, she becomes reclusive. Nurses Matthew. lavinia gone in horror of sleazy revelations.
Earl G shoots himself.
Cora ails with the flu; but survives. edith cares for her.
Sybil runs off with Branson, nobody notices.
Mary resigns herself to lonely spinster nurse.,..when Matthews right foot twitches.
Huzzah he is recovering. Mary and he have spring wedding. He gets house. Isobel ousts Cora to the attics. Violet moves into the rectory avec the horny old vicar.
Carson retires, Bates is butler, Moleson is Valet.

ThePsychicSatsuma Wed 12-Oct-11 13:42:06

or... ...

Anna get scapegoated with the pamuk scandal, earl g gives her thousands of pounds in compensation, she leaves to open her happy little clean hotel, with masterbates.

diddl Wed 12-Oct-11 13:43:10

"Isobel ousts Cora to the attics."

I like that!

I´ve been giving this far too much thought, as I was pondering when Matthew takes over, shouldn´t Isobel, as his mother, live where Violet does.

Although Cora would be the Dowager Countess(?) & Isobel still Mrs Crawley, but of course Cora isn´t Matthew´s mother.

This is why I feel sorry for Isobel.
(I know she´s been a pain lately), but the servants are such snobs regarding her, but she´s the heir´s mother-& as such could be in Violet´s position-presiding over everyone!

AKMD Wed 12-Oct-11 13:47:19

Ousts her to the dower house surely?

Poor Sybil running off and no one noticing!

harrietthespook Wed 12-Oct-11 13:51:14

That's awesome Satsuma.

I'm really wondering if there won't be resolution to the Matthew Mary saga this series though. If they really think it would acceptable to string it out even further - regardless, I think Christmas is the earliest we'll get any answers. They haven't filmed that episode yet apparently.

I think JF could be waiting to see how the wind blows in terms of what 'the audience' seems to respond to, to decide how to wrap things up. The whole thing feels a bit fly by the seat of one's pants-ish so it wouldn't surprise me.

Agree Sybil is going to go off with Branson and barely be noticed.

I think they need to get at least one of those daughters married off. War or no war, you wouldn't get 3 daughters like that not married would you? I mean I know they can't inherit but wouldn't they have come with a dowry or something? Surely they'd have more suitors sniffing around? As someone pointed out earlier they're be left on the shelf if they get to their late 20s.....

AKMD Wed 12-Oct-11 13:56:05

If there isn't a resolution then I think JF will lose a few million viewers TBH. It's all very well leaving people in suspense but that would be taking it too far and surely Mary et al are getting on a bit in terms of marriagability. I'm surprised none of the sisters are married yet TBH, it seems very unusual even with a war on. Sybil was presented in 1913 if I remember right.

How many episodes are there left of this series?

'they're'? they'll even

diddl Wed 12-Oct-11 13:56:55

"Ousts her to the dower house surely?"

Why?

She´s not Matthew´s mother!

Cross post AKMD but great minds think alike smile

harrietthespook Wed 12-Oct-11 13:59:09

We're on to episode five right? SO 5,6,7 then the XMAS one.

Kind of dismayed to see yet more characters coming in next week - the vicar. Could be panto value, yes, but still.

diddl Wed 12-Oct-11 14:01:25

I don´t think that any of them have any dowries.

That´s why someone like Sir R would be "good" as he could afford to "keep them in the style to which they are accustomed".

Didn´t some of the estates "change hands" after WW1 due to deaths in the war death duties, so no heirs & no money to keep them going?

(Or was that after WW2?blush)

ripstheirthroatoutliveupstairs Wed 12-Oct-11 14:01:35

I'd like to see a threeway fight between Isoble, Cora and Violet. I absolutely loathe Isobel, bossy arriveste.
I think Violet could possibly have her on her own using only the walking stick. Cora is a bit drippy TBH and Isobel has the insiders nursing knowledge of where the most painful bit of a fanjo is when kicked.

harrietthespook Wed 12-Oct-11 14:03:38

They do have dowries. Remember that conversation that Lord G had with the wayward Duke who thought he'd get in there when it looked as if Mary was going to inhert. "You'll find the settlement generous." There is pin money coming their way. It's position they need. (But not of the ilicit Pamuk variety.)

harrietthespook Wed 12-Oct-11 14:04:46

RIPS: "....most painful bit of a fanjo..."

("Favorites" and "Likes")

AKMD Wed 12-Oct-11 14:04:59

When Lord G dies and Matthew inherits, she will be the Dowager Countess and hence have the right to live at the Dower house, which existed on huge old estates like DA for the sole purpose of getting the old Baroness/Viscountess/Countess/Marchioness/Duchess out of the way to make sure she and the new holder of that title weren't fighting it out in the main house. Matthew's mother would definitely not get the dower house but would more than likely stay at Crawley house in the village.

It makes sense really. Who really, truly, wants to live in their MIL's old house with her still there and thinking she's still in charge? Look how quickly the wife and daughters get thrown out in Sense & Sensibility.

AKMD Wed 12-Oct-11 14:06:02

Yes Biscuits, glad someone else thinks it's odd! smile

Pentagram Wed 12-Oct-11 14:09:57

Although there would be a definite lack of suitors - Sybil said in ep 1 something like "I feel like every boy i ever danced with is dead"

Which leaves only ageing dodgy editors and randy car polishers / farmers...

AKMD Wed 12-Oct-11 14:11:41

But they were all 'out' before the war, Mary and Edith for some time. you would have thought they would have met someone. I'm still waiting to see what happens when Evelyn Napier shows up for a bit of R&R though.

diddl Wed 12-Oct-11 14:13:21

"Matthew's mother would definitely not get the dower house"

Wouldn´t that be for Matthew to decide?

harrietthespook Wed 12-Oct-11 14:14:21

My money's on Edith to snare Napier. BUT he found her quite odious, it seemed, that she spread the rumour about Mary. However, she's chhhhaggggeddd for the better. So we'll see.

diddl Wed 12-Oct-11 14:16:32

Thinking, it´s Cora being the widow of Lord Gthat would give her the Dower house, isn´t it, not Isobel being the mother of Matthew?

diddl Wed 12-Oct-11 14:17:53

I thought that Napier wanted to marry Mary, but couldn´t afford to?

Or was that a Duke who had been "seeing" Thomas?

AKMD Wed 12-Oct-11 14:19:02

Exactly Diddl. It would be a massive, huge, huge, huge insult to Cora if Matthew installed Isobel at the Dower house. Everyone would be very, very shocked. You just wouldn't do it.

AKMD Wed 12-Oct-11 14:20:15

Napier is very rich and did want to marry Mary but was put off by her being rude to him while falling over herself to get to Pamuk. It was the Duke who was in it for the money (and the money only, clearly!).

ripstheirthroatoutliveupstairs Wed 12-Oct-11 14:22:33

So there would be a fanjo gouging fight?
I imagine the incumbent of DA's mother lives in the Dower House. That's where Violet lives.
I would prefer the one that Isobel lives in now. In fact I'd like to buy it now and live there where people from unknown numbers can't get me.

harrietthespook Wed 12-Oct-11 14:29:13

Yes, Cora to Dower. But if Violet is still alive it poses another problem it wuld seem.

Isobel bunking in at DA - now wouldn't that be fun. Matthew likes living with her tho.

"what shall we call each other." Violet/Cora to Isobel.

"I is Cinderella and you is the Ugly Sisters."

diddl Wed 12-Oct-11 14:29:20

I guess you also have to hope that everyone conveniently dies in the right order!

Could you imagine if Matthew inherited whilst Violet was still alive-and Isobel didn´t want to be by herself in the village any more!

There could be 2 Countess(?) Granthams plus a MIL all under one roofshockgrin

diddl Wed 12-Oct-11 14:30:36

Great minds Harrietsmile

AKMD Wed 12-Oct-11 14:30:59

I think I'd take the new Countess of Grantham and move into the dower house. No massive pile would be worth that fight!

LeBOF Wed 12-Oct-11 14:31:56

But what about the shoehorn, eh? That might be used by slutmaid to despatch Lord G, unless JF is bound by the super injunction, of course.

AKMD Wed 12-Oct-11 14:34:04

I thought you were going to say something else there BOF! I was all ready to start tutting over the turns from which MNer gets the lovely Matthew, to parallels in classic literature and then back to the mud grin

harrietthespook Wed 12-Oct-11 14:39:28

The shoehorn. I can't believe no one has mentioned it yet.

Deadly props: soap, shoehorn....whatever next?!

mrszimmerman Wed 12-Oct-11 15:23:30

Oh does Capn' Crawley's nob get blown off?

LAWKS A MERCY!!!
Poor Mary where whilt she turn for her deep and baser needs to be met?
I think if Matthew gets her one of these machines then Mary will be fine. Put it in the billiard room behind an Arrass is all, marvellous. Lady Edith will need to use it very often particularly if she has unwarranted Thoughts. Sybil has the dirty filthy basta'd communist chauffer to get all mucky with she won't need it.

ripstheirthroatoutliveupstairs Wed 12-Oct-11 15:46:25

I can feel your enthusiasm through the screen mrZ blimey, you've given it plenty of thought.
I had wondered if the shoe horn (which was long with a nice curly shaft) was going to have some great significance.
What a creepy old stand in valet was.

mrszimmerman Wed 12-Oct-11 16:00:37

has anyone else noticed capn' crawley's voice it's absolutely GORGEOUS.
Lady Mary won't deserve him, nobless or not. Noblesse, that's a word isn't it? grin

ripstheirthroatoutliveupstairs Wed 12-Oct-11 16:06:54

Oooh no, I can't think of anyone with a gorgeous voice in that.

harrietthespook Wed 12-Oct-11 16:08:29

If you think cousin Matthew's voice is gorg you'd better listen to this sometime in the next six hours:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b014x4ht.

Comin' at you from Twitter sources.

LeBOF Wed 12-Oct-11 16:14:59

Nobless Oblige could be the name for the sex machine.

limitedperiodonly Wed 12-Oct-11 17:33:27

psychic I think Slut Maid was an actual post that you worked your way up to from Lady of the House Maid via Scullery Skivvy/Tweenie.

Obviously it was a high-risk strategy but we should salute those early female entrepreneurs.

limitedperiodonly Wed 12-Oct-11 17:36:05

DH has a shoehorn made of actual horn. Reindeer, I think, or possibly elk.

It's very long and could do someone a serious mischief.

limitedperiodonly Wed 12-Oct-11 17:45:13

"Oh does Capn' Crawley's nob get blown off?"

Mary should catch it like a bridal bouquet made of those fleshy flower displays you see in Soho restaurants.

harrietthespook Wed 12-Oct-11 18:08:42

I think everyone should say what they reckon their 'downstairs' job would have been, back in the day.

I'm definitely a Tweenie.

vixsatis Wed 12-Oct-11 18:12:19

leBOF That is v funny!

FearfulYank Wed 12-Oct-11 19:10:27

What's a tweenie?

harrietthespook Wed 12-Oct-11 19:16:56

I first heard the word in Jessica Mitford's book Hons and Rebels. A poster below mentioned it too.

Accd to t'internet: "tweenie" or "in between" maid -bottom rung as far as the household staff went in grand old English homes. I think these poor girls came in and did various things that the older more senior staff found tiresome. Like brushing out fires etc.

Plan to dig out hons and rebs tonight.

harrietthespook Wed 12-Oct-11 19:18:18

Our arrangements. Americans would call the floor on which we lived the second floor, but here in Britain it is called the ‘first’ floor. We shared a common room, although I must say, the peculiar needs of my friend occupied the major part of the room..... Our rent included the services of a tweenie who dusted, cleaned, made the beds and kept the fires clear. These girls seemed to come and go about once a year and tended to be from fourteen to sixteen years of age. I presume they went on to work at grander residences when they left our employ.

harrietthespook Wed 12-Oct-11 19:18:43

that's a quote btw. Think my research is actually done on this point.

FearfulYank Wed 12-Oct-11 19:22:33

Well I have to hope for Slut Maid then. grin I could have an illegitimate child and extort a lot of money from the family, then hop ship for America or similar and say I was a grieving widow.

harrietthespook Wed 12-Oct-11 19:24:33

You'd have to pay it to me anyway. Because I'll have seen your goings on as I'm cleaning out the grates and will threaten to TELL.

limitedperiodonly Wed 12-Oct-11 19:42:47

I would definitely have been Tweenie status but I wouldn't have held the job down for long because I'm not good at getting up early and am a bit lippy.

I'd have been ideal transportation fodder about 150 years before and the Australian sun would have played havoc with my freckles.

Don't know about the 19-teens. I used to be a barmaid in my early 20s but suspect I was a bit too argumentative for them days.

FearfulYank Wed 12-Oct-11 19:53:34

Harriet you'll rue the day! <narrows eyes>

ThePsychicSatsuma Wed 12-Oct-11 20:32:11

I am in turns howling laughing and befuddled by this thread. Having to keep explaining it to Mr Suma

the shoehorn. Intruiging. That was Molecom's wasnt it, 'special' gift for Chubby Earl G to put on his own shoes. Then MasterBates grabbed it.

Slutmaid? the tweenies? confused.

ThePsychicSatsuma Wed 12-Oct-11 20:33:36

...and that film - - - - * words fail me. i adore Sheridan Smith.

Longtime Wed 12-Oct-11 21:25:36

ScatterChasse, from Wikipedia:

Series one

The first series started on 26 September 2010, and explored the lives of the Crawley family and their staff from the day after the sinking of the RMS Titanic in April 1912 to the outbreak of the First World War on 4 August 1914.

So it spans two years 4 months pretty much.

Series two

The series will be composed of eight episodes, running from the Battle of the Somme in 1916 to the Armistice in 1918.

So the second series also spans two years and four months (if you take the start date of the Battle of the Somme). Surely if we've only seen four episode we can only be somewhere in 1917?

For some reason I thought there were 9 episodes in series 1 but there were only 7. As there are 8 in this series and both series cover the same time span, the first series must have gone faster than this one. Doesn't seem like it though.

ScatterChasse Thu 13-Oct-11 00:03:02

So say they started trying to marry Mary off in 1911, it's now 5-6 years later.

There definitely isn't that much in age between the girls, and considering it was all volunteers at the beginning, I'm still surprised they didn't get one married off first.

I'd have liked to have been a lady's maid I think. I'm quite good at arranging hair and flowers and a bit hopeless at dusting.

AKMD Thu 13-Oct-11 08:23:12

I would have been a farmer's wife. 700 years worth of genealogy proves it!

Doesn't sound too bad actually.

I don't know if anyone's noticed but at the end of the opening credits they show the year at the bottom of the screen. It's only up for a second and TBH I'm busier looking at what's going on so only spotted it in the last episode.

We're already in 1918 - it came up on the screen in the Sunday episode.

LeBOF Thu 13-Oct-11 08:35:25

How long has Sir Richard been waiting for an answer to his proposal? It must be more than the generally-considered-polite fortnight.

ripstheirthroatoutliveupstairs Thu 13-Oct-11 08:36:06

Sorry, I don't notice details like that.
Whoever thought they could bribe the family for some money/propery/status for their bastard offspring, my GGGrandma will serve as a salutory tale.
She went 'into service' when she was 14 which would have been around 1895. The young master took a shine to her when she was 15 and, essentially raped her.
She had my GGgrandad and her family supported her which was astonishing. The family in the big house wouldn't accept that their son could possibly have had anything to do with it. Strangely enough, they did send one of their old cruet sets down when the boy was christened.
My GGGrandma was fortunate to meet my GGGrandad who accepted bastard boy, married her and they went on to have another three children.
All this in the frozen wastes of Durham which was clearly a racy foreward thinking county in the late 1800s.

ThePsychicSatsuma Thu 13-Oct-11 09:05:54

scatterchase - ladies maids had more than hair and flowers - can you sew invisible seams? press evening dresses and replace sequins? hand wash gloves and nylons?

I would have to try you for a week, without pay, to see if you're satisfactory

ThePsychicSatsuma Thu 13-Oct-11 09:07:11

wow, riptheirthroatsout she must have had some bottle

ripstheirthroatoutliveupstairs Thu 13-Oct-11 09:11:06

Yes, incredible woman who was raised in a pit village where the women went into service in the big house.
She was anaemic and ate raw liver every Monday and just an all round top woman who died at the age of 95.

Summerbird73 Thu 13-Oct-11 09:32:21

rips i am from slightly north of that neck of the woods (Newcastle) and i can say your GGGGran makes me proud to be northern. What a strong character smile

I often wonder (since watching DA) whether i would have 'gone into service'. I would like to think i would be as senior as Anna but would probably have been a Daisy as i too am a bit gobby... That is of course if i wasnt born into privilege - if that were the case i would like to be Mary. Although i have never shagged a Turkish diplomat hmm

leBoF may i sensitively suggest you are getting a tad obsessed with this shoe horn (i may be proved wrong!)

Summerbird73 Thu 13-Oct-11 09:33:36

Anyway I digress.

'Slut Maid Sex Machine'

Could this be the next group to audition for X Factor 2012? hmm

mrszimmerman Thu 13-Oct-11 09:39:04

That shoe horn needs must be attached to the lady's companionable machinery (see below) to treat those of a nervous disposition.
Whither us all?
To hell amidst a flurry of handcarts!
Ah me!
Get the behind me Dr!
Screens Matron!
SALTS!
HOT WATER TOWELLS!

ThePsychicSatsuma Thu 13-Oct-11 09:51:39

<fans Mrs Z and beckons for Anna>

ripstheirthroatoutliveupstairs Thu 13-Oct-11 09:56:06

I don't think that Daisy is necessarily gobby, just a bit thick and (whisper) more common than Anna.
Once again I will say how astonished I am at the levels of literacy in the house.

harrietthespook Thu 13-Oct-11 10:35:51

Rips. Your story is so interesting. Do you know the name of the family where she was working/person who did it? Are they still around?

ripstheirthroatoutliveupstairs Thu 13-Oct-11 10:42:45

Yes, yes and yes. Sadly my GGGrandma isn't.

harrietthespook Thu 13-Oct-11 10:47:48

Was what happened EVER acknowledged by them?

Must be so hard if there the sort of people YOU COULD bump into or see plastered in local 'society' rags...

DH is from Yorkshire BTW. I'm a very enthusiastic Northerner by proxy.

ripstheirthroatoutliveupstairs Thu 13-Oct-11 10:51:52

Not expllcitly, but they did send a rather nice cruet when she married my GGGrandad. what use a silver vinegar, oil and salt and pepper set would be to a miner and his wife is beyond me.
My mum has it, it's solid silver with their crest on it.

harrietthespook Thu 13-Oct-11 10:52:53

sorry they're

harrietthespook Thu 13-Oct-11 10:59:51

So never subsequently. Interesting.

Summerbird73 Thu 13-Oct-11 11:36:56

rips that is fascinating, so <working this out> your GGrandad is of society blood, therefore - erhem - so are you? Absolutely fascinating.

And does nobody want to join my new band Slut Maid Sex Machine? I dont do vocals but can do the first chords of 'Nothing Else Matters' by Metallica... DS plays a mean pianoforte (he is 2 smile )

ripstheirthroatoutliveupstairs Thu 13-Oct-11 11:56:38

Never thought of it like that, I could inherit the big house one day [doubtful]
I'll play slut sexmaid machine if you want.
I can play a town called malice on the bass guitar and DD informs me she is learning to play the violin at school. Luckily no evidence of this has made it home.

harrietthespook Thu 13-Oct-11 12:09:09

You should pop over to the big house with the cruet and go: "Planning to go on Antiques Roadshow to get this valued. Thought it might be interesting to tell them a bit about the circumstances it came into my family as well. Don't you agree?"

Summerbird73 Thu 13-Oct-11 12:28:15

harriet grin YY rips you must do that!

ripstheirthroatoutliveupstairs Thu 13-Oct-11 12:51:26

grin, I am actually smiling at that idea. I honestly doubt that a bastard child 100 years ago would make them quake in their boots. TBH, from what my GGG told my mum, it wasn't uncommon.
Maybe I should ask her to send a photo, post it here and see if any other cruet owning bastard offspring from the same family come up.

ThePsychicSatsuma Thu 13-Oct-11 12:56:18

<<<at first I thought you had a stutter GGGGrandma and all that>>

grin

there is also a rumour in our family linked to a big house in Yorkshire where my GGGran was an undermaid, the house hosted royalty when they travelled to scotland; anyhoo GGGran got knocked up and instead of being banished in disgrace she was given a small house on the grounds

meaning I am clearly a princess.

Summerbird73 Thu 13-Oct-11 13:07:41

satsuma that is rather sweet, see you hear stories of boys of social standing growing up and 'fishing with the gardeners son' and being BFF. I am now wondering if these are the same boys who are born of knocked up serving maids and thus probably brothers hmm

ripstheirthroatoutliveupstairs Thu 13-Oct-11 13:09:20

My poor old Ggrandad his BC, where the space for Father is is Unknown.

LeBOF Thu 13-Oct-11 13:17:13

I think you should get the family on Jezza with you for a DNA test.

Summerbird73 Thu 13-Oct-11 13:35:31

<coughs> sorry to interrupt but LeBoF you are wanted over here on this thread

care to share before you go? hmm

LeBOF Thu 13-Oct-11 13:38:19

Ahahaaaaaa. Nope, nothing m'lady grin

Summerbird73 Thu 13-Oct-11 13:44:11

Spill BoF otherwise i shall take away your privileges and make you eat downstairs with the oiks!

<purses lips>
<furiously polishes candlestick>

LeBOF Thu 13-Oct-11 13:54:51

All I can say is that it is nowhere near as good as pinkjenny's grin. But I may pm you if it saves me from blackening the range...

ThePsychicSatsuma Thu 13-Oct-11 14:04:49

snogging famous types eh? we'll have none of that on this thread. Our maids are all well-behanved decent young gels.

hmm

LeBOF Thu 13-Oct-11 14:07:04

What can i say? <adopts slutmaid mantle>

Summerbird73 Thu 13-Oct-11 14:31:21

BoF PM me now
<thumbscrews>
wink

josephinebonaparte Thu 13-Oct-11 14:40:07

OK massive spoiler.....







"There’s a great sadness at Downton Abbey this week as a much-loved character passes away.

It’s now 1918 and at the battle of Amiens, Captain Matthew Crawley and his soldier valet, William Mason, charge over the trenches. As those around them fall, the Downton pair are hit by an enemy shell. William dives in front of Matthew as the blast strikes, but both men are left badly injured and unconscious.

The news of Matthew and William’s plight leaves those back at home in despair. Matthew’s former fiancée, Mary, pledges to nurse him at Downton, now converted to a hospital for war-wounded soldiers, and footman William is brought there, too.

As well as battling for their lives, both injured soldiers have matters of the heart to settle. Matthew’s told by doctors that, if he pulls through, he’ll never be able to walk again or have children. He tells his distraught fiancée, Lavinia, that she must find someone else, while Mary realises how strong her own feelings are for Matthew.

Meanwhile, following their recent engagement, William asks housemaid Daisy to marry him now, but she has always been unsure of her feelings for William.

“It’s difficult, because Daisy loves William as a friend and doesn’t want to let him down,” explains Sophie McShera, who plays the scullery maid.

Eventually, Daisy decides to become William’s bride, and an emotional ceremony takes place in front of the staff and the Crawley family.

Unfortunately, one of the men doesn’t survive and Downton is left in shock. Has Daisy already been widowed? Or has Downton lost its only heir, Matthew Crawley?

Valet John Bates has almost finalised his divorce from his estranged wife, Vera. But when she shows up at Downton again, she tells Bates that she still intends to take revenge on him and the Crawley family by going to the newspapers with the story about the night Mary’s Turkish lover died in her bed. When Mary hears of Vera’s plan, will she use her influence with newspaper baron Sir Richard Carlisle to thwart her?"

Pentagram Thu 13-Oct-11 14:45:38

That's quite some spoiler there josephinebonaparte ..... my money is on William croaking

anonacfr Thu 13-Oct-11 14:52:26

No way can Matthew die. William is clearly expendable. He's gone.

harrietthespook Thu 13-Oct-11 14:53:35

Where did that come from?

I am guessing that Matthew stages a miraculous recovery wrt his willy and an heir, if he doesn't cop it. (Probably just in time for Christmas. wink)

If he does - JF is barking mad. Okay, I've had a glass of wine at lunch and am perhaps unduly partial, but I would not continue to watch the show in it's current state w one of the main couples left Mary and that twat, Sir Richard.The guns would fall silent on ITV, as it were.

LeBOF Thu 13-Oct-11 15:09:17

Great spoiler! Love it.

LeBOF Thu 13-Oct-11 15:11:45

Oh, and Summerbird- I did PM you, didn't you get it? <wails at the thought of cock-up and wonders which random MNer has received slutmaid story>

harrietthespook Thu 13-Oct-11 15:13:17

tell slutmaid story here pls

vixsatis Thu 13-Oct-11 15:18:52

Daisy will marry William then he will die. If Matthew dies then we will have to go through the "distant cousin as heir" palavar all over again. Mary will marry him and his knob will miraculously regrow during the Christmas special

LeBOF Thu 13-Oct-11 15:19:01

I couldn't possibly- it would haunt me forever. I can only say that I tuck the best...

ScatterChasse Thu 13-Oct-11 15:28:16

But if Matthew can't walk or have children, perhaps JF thinks he might as well croak?

I hope not, and that Mary does marry him (bit of a shame though, if it means her only experience of under-bedclothes-jollities would be with the one who died half way through...)

LeBOF Thu 13-Oct-11 15:36:30

Love will find a way. Or at least a shoehorn.

Scatter - at least that way if Mary marries Matthew, the bar is set nice and low for Matthew in the bedroom department so he might not feel to bad about his fairly major failings? I mean as long as he can last the night, he's doing OK?

Summerbird73 Thu 13-Oct-11 15:56:59

BoF your slutmaid story is intact <as it were> i had to rush straight into a meeting angry so had to wait to read the PM. Although i could have sold the story to Sir Richard for all you know <nods head>

and a willy wound??? nooooooooooooooooooooo <wails>

No wonder Matthew looks a bit glum in those photos then......

josephinebonaparte Thu 13-Oct-11 16:18:09

Maybe they use the shoehorn as a willy splint?

ThePsychicSatsuma Thu 13-Oct-11 16:59:38

bellowed at vixsatis's regrowing willie
mary would be praying to santa for that one

I believe I was the first dirtypiece on here to insinuate a willy injury, non? <pats self on knee>

ThePsychicSatsuma Thu 13-Oct-11 17:00:38

aaaaah poor willie. rub it better, mary

<cackles>

ThePsychicSatsuma Thu 13-Oct-11 17:02:01

yy, Mary lost her virginity to a corpse and now will have to try and breathe life into Matthew's poor willy.

ThePsychicSatsuma Thu 13-Oct-11 17:03:17

'shoehorn as willy splint' holy guacamole that is awesome. Imagine Violet -

'what good do you think that'll do, Mary? it must be tighter '

<wipes spluttered vino off screen>

Can here the Dowager now..........grin

HEAR

GeorginaWorsley Thu 13-Oct-11 20:47:12

It must be resurrected grin
He is too nice to be impotent.
He will recover his faculties,all right....wink

josephinebonaparte Thu 13-Oct-11 23:48:15

All will be solved by some Christmas magic and a Willy splint

ripstheirthroatoutliveupstairs Fri 14-Oct-11 06:49:14

Not much use having a splint if his cock has been blown off though? It's only recently that genital shields have been introduced to the current services uniform. Imagine a huge metal jockstrap to be worn underneath what was, virtually, everyday trousers.
I think it is possible that Daisy will marry William, fall pregnant and Mary and Gary will nick the baby and claim it as their own.
Mary will have realised Matts failings in the bedroom dept despite the willy splint and have been plotting for months to get an heir. From somewhere. I don't think she is particuarly scrupulous.
The baby will be found not to be theirs when it grows up with a face like a Jersey Royal.

Thank god it wasn't Williams willy that was damaged .....the word games we'd have had with that!!

grin

josephinebonaparte Fri 14-Oct-11 07:25:34

Tbh, I think Matthew will recover without the help of a Willy splint. I'm guessing they will say that he can have kids because of the paralysis rather than any physical damage, and he will recover from the paralysis at Christmas.

ripstheirthroatoutliveupstairs Fri 14-Oct-11 07:32:33

Yep, recover from paralysis like you do.

Longtime Fri 14-Oct-11 08:47:17
ripstheirthroatoutliveupstairs Fri 14-Oct-11 08:53:36

I've had another idea about the procreation. The shoe horn could be used as a prostate tickler to prompt ejaculation. Luckily, Matthew is paralysed so won't feel it being slid up his back passage. Obviously he'll see the cup which Carson will be holding to collect his jizz.

MortBlack Fri 14-Oct-11 09:00:14

this came on tv last night ....is it Lavinia? Had a quick google but nothing came up....

josephinebonaparte Fri 14-Oct-11 09:18:18

Well yes recovery from paralysis is unlikely but I bet in Downton world it will happen.

AKMD Fri 14-Oct-11 09:40:43

The thing is, in the trailer for the next episode everyone was wearing full mourning. They wouldn't be wearing that for William. Unless it was all the same day and they had attended his funeral?

ThePsychicSatsuma Fri 14-Oct-11 09:52:13

1 paralysed sexy handsome man + 1 shoehorn = very rude ideas on how to create an heir

ThePsychicSatsuma Fri 14-Oct-11 09:53:46

AKMD the way the time flies in downton, probs he dies and has the funeral in the same 4 minutes; plus Lavvie is dispatched, mrs Ex-Oirish Bates threatens and Mary speaks to Sir Richard her press mouthpiece. gosh it's all a disaster waiting to happen, innit

ThePsychicSatsuma Fri 14-Oct-11 09:54:46

arf at 'jersey royal' head

q- How does William's head look so much like a potato?

a - it's in the eyes

ThePsychicSatsuma Fri 14-Oct-11 09:56:06

mortblack - I doubt that is our feeble little Lavvie

ripstheirthroatoutliveupstairs Fri 14-Oct-11 09:58:52

Oh boom boom Psychic.
DH is arriving from Antwerp tonight. I will be revisiting the Pamuk and Mary bedroom scene to assertain whether it was up the bum.
If it was, and I'm not too late, I will wire/telegram JF to advise him that that would get Matt's paralysed memrum virulae back up and ready for action in no time. All that is needed is Mary to describe in detail how the cad abused her.

ThePsychicSatsuma Fri 14-Oct-11 09:59:11

quite like the name 'Almina'

ripstheirthroatoutliveupstairs Fri 14-Oct-11 09:59:24

membrum doh. DH is a classisist and has taught me the latin for private parts.

AKMD Fri 14-Oct-11 09:59:29

The confrontation between Sir R. and Mary isn't mentioned in the spoiler above. Am I allowed to be dubious?

ThePsychicSatsuma Fri 14-Oct-11 10:00:16

Rips!

period drama genteel anal sex with a turk research. only on MN.

ThePsychicSatsuma Fri 14-Oct-11 10:01:11

membrum virulae

is that something to Not Google

ripstheirthroatoutliveupstairs Fri 14-Oct-11 11:15:06

Possibly, I'll ask DH. He'll be back here in approximately nine hours <squee>

harrietthespook Fri 14-Oct-11 11:57:58

I think they might have been in full mourning for William...The actor who plays Matthew is in the Christmas special (as a ghost??? who knows????)

JF is a sadist. Anyway, it's a good thing the British are accustomed to disappointment if he does cop it...how the Yanks will take it is another matter (being an Anglo Yank myself)...

harrietthespook Fri 14-Oct-11 11:58:30

Where's Diddl these days anyway?

harrietthespook Fri 14-Oct-11 12:00:15

AKMD - I agree the spoiler posted here doesn't mention Sir R and it was such a big part of the trailer...but then it's bizarre that the pictures that have come out about Ep 5 have had nothing to do with the trailer theme...or is that typical of this series...

mrsruffallo Fri 14-Oct-11 12:04:14

I have it. It's Carson that dies. Remember the recent dizzy spell?

diddl Fri 14-Oct-11 12:09:45

Hello!

grin

<currently opinionless on shoehornsblush>

ripstheirthroatoutliveupstairs Fri 14-Oct-11 12:19:42

No, it can't be Carson. He is a cheeky Charlie. Carson needs a love interest before the series ends.
Obviously he'll be catching the jizz that Matt produces after having his prostate stimulated, but he needs an ejaculatory means himself
<ponders Downton village brothel and the users of the establishment>

harrietthespook Fri 14-Oct-11 12:25:07

Carson spanking Mrs Hughes with the shoehorn?

Carson getting spanked by Mrs Hughes with the shoehorn?

mrsruffallo Fri 14-Oct-11 12:26:20

He's not in the trailer.

ThePsychicSatsuma Fri 14-Oct-11 12:27:03

RipS!! <fans self>
<ponders future of edith as 'madam' at said brothel. The gal can organise, after all>

ThePsychicSatsuma Fri 14-Oct-11 12:28:09

is he not in the trailer because he's dead!!

rip carson.

then masterbates can be butler; molecreep as valet

ThePsychicSatsuma Fri 14-Oct-11 12:28:59

molecreep and masterbates then can duel over anna....with the shoehorn.

<bows>

ThePsychicSatsuma Fri 14-Oct-11 12:29:59

maybe o'brien dies of internal sourness

mrsruffallo Fri 14-Oct-11 12:30:07

I think the gels need to keep the wounded soldiers' peckers up

mrsruffallo Fri 14-Oct-11 12:31:07

Surely Mary was asleep and Thomas shagged The Turk

ThePsychicSatsuma Fri 14-Oct-11 12:31:52

hmmmm. ethel did that. bet she regrets it now <shock at childrearing pre in the night garden>

ripstheirthroatoutliveupstairs Fri 14-Oct-11 12:32:02

Which is why my introduction of the brothel is genuis.
Slut maid can be madam and sour O'Brian can be the money taker. It can be sited in Isobels soup kitchen.

ThePsychicSatsuma Fri 14-Oct-11 12:33:08

didnt the turk refuse thomas,.

a 3-way with thomas/ pickle / mary would increase viewer levels, adverts or no

ripstheirthroatoutliveupstairs Fri 14-Oct-11 12:55:58

I think you could be onto something their Psychic, I am imagining a special room (perhaps the special cupboard) in Izzy's house with manacles, mirrors and butt plugs for the more discerning customer.

LeBOOOf Fri 14-Oct-11 12:57:53

No, no, it has to be in Patmore's sitting room, because it has an audio chamber, and they could drill a peephole.

ThePsychicSatsuma Fri 14-Oct-11 13:00:09

an audio chamber ? que?

ThePsychicSatsuma Fri 14-Oct-11 13:02:50

surely both william and carson cannot die?

also Isoble going away which seems random odd and ill-explained at the mo; will turn out to be crucial for the story -

so who will she save/ meet in france?

ripstheirthroatoutliveupstairs Fri 14-Oct-11 13:06:24

Patmore isn't important enough to have a sitting room I don't think. The other one already uses hers for Downton Dykes every Thursday and Sunday afternoon.

ripstheirthroatoutliveupstairs Fri 14-Oct-11 13:07:51

Isobel will meet somebody (possibly a relative of a soup kitchener) who will tell her that her lovely house has been requisitioned as a ministry of affairs brothel.
She will rush home to be in charge of GUM testing.

LeBOOOf Fri 14-Oct-11 13:12:59

Oh bugger, have I got the name wrong? I mean the hread housekeeper who is close to Carson. She has a little vent where she eavesdropped onmasterbayes and his evil wife. That one.

ThePsychicSatsuma Fri 14-Oct-11 13:15:11

patmore is the shortsighted fat cook,, mrs H something is the housekeep, scottish, plainspeaking, decent honourable

LeBOOOf Fri 14-Oct-11 13:19:46

Mrs Hughes, yes.

<slinks away in shame>

At least I don't get Edith and Ethel mixed up.

ripstheirthroatoutliveupstairs Fri 14-Oct-11 13:23:24

I do which is why one is called slutmaid blush
So, what do you think, is my brothel a goer?

LeBOOOf Fri 14-Oct-11 13:24:38

It's more than a goer. I'd go so far as to say that it tucks the best.

ThePsychicSatsuma Fri 14-Oct-11 13:26:24

yes. I'm in. lets make violet the madam though, she is fearsome. and has a few pecadilloes herself, I'll be bound

ripstheirthroatoutliveupstairs Fri 14-Oct-11 13:28:46

oooh, I'd never thought of one of the upstairs people as being involved. Do you think Vi is unshockable? I do.
When one of the villagers comes in and asks for something that would outrage Hugh Borneville, Vi would just think of an appropriate fee.
Will the soup kitcheners get a discount? I think they should. The officers can subsidise them.

ripstheirthroatoutliveupstairs Fri 14-Oct-11 13:46:27

OK, I must off to meet the marvellous flying machine bringing my DH from, appropriately enough, Flanders.
Will be away for around a week. Keep the brothel open and cheeky Charlie alive.

mrszimmerman Fri 14-Oct-11 13:57:38

I think Capn Crawley's exploded Manhood will be found operational once he's seen the light and dropped dreary drippy loathsome Lavinia for bug eyed whoresome bug eyed ladidah Mary who will nurse his nobhood back Active Service for the sake of a woman who can't go hunting without needing to carry on riding all night...

SORRY! SCREENS MATRON!

harrietthespook Fri 14-Oct-11 14:16:23

Psychic: Pecadillos to NO END, that Vi

My favourite quote from Series one is when Violet says to Cora (when she's telling her that Mary feels she needs to tell Matty about Pamuk):

"Everyone goes down the aisle with haaaalllff the story hidden."

Interesting turn this thread has taken. I think you all may be a little obsessed with Matthew's manhood and the shoe horn tbh grin

Poor William - he's had cannon fodder written all over him for months. Got to be him though - Matthew's death just robs JF of any romanctic action and seeing as the plan seems to be for Downton to go on and on that won't do at all.

Not Lavinia I don't think in that ad Mort.

meant to say earlier .... but RL got in the way
I distinctly remember the Cadish Turk telling Mary not to worry
" she'd still be a virgin on her wedding night"
as I had to explain to the DD's about "Eastern practices" shock

<adjusts bosom Les Dawson style>

What are 'eastern practices'?

I'm not sure what i even made of that comment at the time confusedhmm

Anal sex I assumed..........

I'm so innocent - I think I just imagined they wouldn't go 'all the way' - perhaps working on the 'base' system.....

Although I never really knew what 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th base were either blushconfused

So, did Pamuk croak before or after they did this? Poor Mary if that was her first go - I do feel sorry for her now......

diddl Fri 14-Oct-11 17:44:08

" she'd still be a virgin on her wedding night"

Maybe he was lying?

harrietthespook Fri 14-Oct-11 17:58:50

We're going to need a glossary for this discussion.

I already explained 'reverse cowgirl' on the other thread.

We've got #the bases# to cover now as well as #eastern practices#

Longtime Fri 14-Oct-11 19:43:49

I read earlier today (can't remember where now) that JF is stopping after three series. Anyone else hear this?

Longtime Fri 14-Oct-11 19:45:04
HermanMumster Fri 14-Oct-11 22:53:40

... I'm in awe of Kreecher's prostate tickling.

And Carson is in the Christmas Special, just saying.

ScatterChasse Sat 15-Oct-11 00:34:03

Well, it was only a panic attack wasn't it, brought on by the stress of having to have women in the dining room <hard-hearted>

Biscuits, definitely her first go. Perhaps it was 'nudge, nudge, wink, wink' virginality (that isn't a word is it?), as nobody would know but them?

I'm surprised we haven't had a companion/chaperone yet, for Lavvie, if none of the Granthams.

Article on DA in the Mail's Weekend mag today

disclaimer I'm at my Dad's & his new wifelet reads it so naturally I'm avidly reading the showbiz gossip I happened to see.

Box of tissues job apparently they were all in floods at the read-through....I reckon it's a deathbed marriage for Daisy & Mr Potatohead. Who, incidently looks quite sweetly handsome in real life when he smiles properly & not with the pussy's bum mouth!!!

diddl Sat 15-Oct-11 10:29:50

If series three is series is in the 20s, it´ll perhaps include the Wall Street crash?

If there´s a 4th series it would have to be WW2?

Didn´t a lot of big estates not recover from WW2-no heirs & no money?

HermanMumster Sat 15-Oct-11 15:11:53

I reckon Violet is the goner.

Summerbird73 Sat 15-Oct-11 15:13:52

If DA is to become a soap opera then they need another generation otherwise what will happen in the 20s and 30s other than 3 bitter sisters who never married or bore an heir..

then in the 60s they all die and the house goes to rack and ruin - or becomes a hippie commune for those young teenager types!

I mean look at what happened to Heartbeat - the 60s lasted 20 years and little Gina ended up looking like she had a right rough paper round by the end of it.

ThePsychicSatsuma Sat 15-Oct-11 20:02:08

so it becomes more the saga of one house through the millenia.

could be good, as long as it includes..

1) a nun bricked up in the wall
2) a ghost
3) a lunatic who needs a lobotomy at a clinic in somerset
4) a foreign family member reappearing, amidst huge scandal
5) possible a vampire

harrietthespook Sat 15-Oct-11 21:33:36

Yep, actor who plays William currently filming with Kiera Knightley and Jude Law.

mrszimmerman Sat 15-Oct-11 22:42:09

Bossybritches
LOL LOL LOL LOL @ "<adjusts bosom Les Dawson style>"

loving thie thread.

snigger

"Eastern practices" is a term coined by a worldly-wise but maiden aunt / friends of my grandmothers who always hinted she had had an exotic past........

grin

ScatterChasse Sat 15-Oct-11 23:34:08

I loved Heartbeat Summerbird. I like to do the ironing watching it on ITV3 now!

diddl Sun 16-Oct-11 18:46:40

So, Ladies-what´s going to happen tonight?

Does Mary tell Sir R about her secret because she thinks he ought to know before they marry, or is it all about to hit the fan & she´s telling him in the hope that he can stop it all being revealed & thus save the family honour?

And will Sir R still want to marry her?

harrietthespook Sun 16-Oct-11 19:06:36

Diddl
I reckon Mary's gonna have to give some thought to how many bases she's going to have to get to with Sir R in order to save her bacon.

I bet we'll see her googling what they mean at the start of the episode smile

ThePsychicSatsuma Sun 16-Oct-11 20:00:53

exciting.... ep 5 wine chocs whoooo xfactor result first...

No, Sir R is arrogant enough to feel she is "tainted goods"

Anyway she has to run home to look after MAthew & his damaged manhood
Mister Bates handover the shoehorn!! grin

I predict a deathbed marriage between Daisy & William.

diddl Sun 16-Oct-11 20:42:10

I think he´ll still want to marry her because he wants a titled wife.

True.....

fivegomadindorset Sun 16-Oct-11 21:09:58

Odious Doctor, and DH is on his side.

Noooooooooooooo poor William

harrietthespook Sun 16-Oct-11 21:19:10

odious doctor AND branson's talking himself out of sybil. twat faced remark.

harrietthespook Sun 16-Oct-11 21:21:47

lady mary is f'ng ace

ZombiesAteYourCervix Sun 16-Oct-11 21:23:42

he's never going to father an heir.

i predict lavinia won't be interested any more.

Harriet.....agreed!

ZombiesAteYourCervix Sun 16-Oct-11 21:28:12

it's the incontinence that would worry me more than the walking. or sex.

ZombiesAteYourCervix Sun 16-Oct-11 21:29:50

and ethel isn't dead-in-childbirth shock

yep lavinia will head back to London, I reckon!

harrietthespook Sun 16-Oct-11 21:30:15

Mary get your skates on! This is challenge was MADE for her.

LeBOOOf Sun 16-Oct-11 21:30:47

So, nine months of pregnancy, plus six or so. And we are STILL in 1918?

harrietthespook Sun 16-Oct-11 21:32:44

this new chick is the one that causes Lord G to wobble.

ZombiesAteYourCervix Sun 16-Oct-11 21:32:55

he doesn't look well does he.

ZombiesAteYourCervix Sun 16-Oct-11 21:33:20

shock surely not harriet shock

harrietthespook Sun 16-Oct-11 21:34:52

Lady m's eyebrows ARE very very long whoever said that before.

harrietthespook Sun 16-Oct-11 21:41:46

two men who deserved to lose their dicks:

That SHIT who got the maid pregnant

Possibly...Sir Richard. We'll see.

WOOOOOOOOManyBlossoms Sun 16-Oct-11 21:59:09

Poor Daisy sad

ZombiesAteYourCervix Sun 16-Oct-11 22:00:18

she's going to marry william and then he is going to get better.

harrietthespook Sun 16-Oct-11 22:01:16

shit Jane and Lord g. Just look at it.

practicallyimperfect Sun 16-Oct-11 22:05:35

Feel so sorry for Daisy.

WOOOOOOOOManyBlossoms Sun 16-Oct-11 22:07:16

<sob>

ZombiesAteYourCervix Sun 16-Oct-11 22:08:00

Ay have a cold grin

harrietthespook Sun 16-Oct-11 22:13:13

FUCK WHAT A TWIST

MissMunsterMogwi Sun 16-Oct-11 22:13:28

Noooo that was a crappy end for William.
although I'm still sad

harrietthespook Sun 16-Oct-11 22:14:00

HE'S GONE FOR IT. SODDING JF has GONE for IT.

I'm not medical - what did he just die of?

ZombiesAteYourCervix Sun 16-Oct-11 22:14:02

shock i was wrong about william shock

shock it's that chap wot died on the tiatnic shock shock

LeBOOOf Sun 16-Oct-11 22:14:23

Yay- it's the ghost of the Titanic! That's put a spanner in the works.

ZombiesAteYourCervix Sun 16-Oct-11 22:14:32

or is it hmm

maybe its an imposter?

And who is the alternative heir?

AKMD Sun 16-Oct-11 22:15:18

That is a step too far - coming back after six years of no word whatsoever? If he's for real then this really is a soap. Bet he's not though.

ZombiesAteYourCervix Sun 16-Oct-11 22:16:27

definately an imoster. someone who has heard the tale - maybe a disgruntled serf who has had his face blown up and is now looking to make a fastbuck.

LeBOOOf Sun 16-Oct-11 22:16:35

Oh, it will be some chancer- someone will expose him.

So Patrick-the-heir has returned, so Mary & Mathew could marry & live in penury together??

Not over Sir Richards dead body.....

MissMunsterMogwi Sun 16-Oct-11 22:16:54

Adds new Lord G shagging housemaid to Hate List along with Kitty from X Factor

Much better episode than last week I thought.

Has anyone disappeared who is disgruntled?

dapplegrey Sun 16-Oct-11 22:17:57

AKMD yes surely the Titanic person would have been in touch if he had after all survived the shipwreck.
Anyway, JF is good at coming up with unexpected twists.

ZombiesAteYourCervix Sun 16-Oct-11 22:18:34

patricks manservant.

i'd like a manservant. or a valet.

AKMD Sun 16-Oct-11 22:19:08

I don't think Mary's going to care about her rep in the end. Or Sir R dies from a convenient heart attack. However, the one wedding is already spoken for.

I have to say, I thought this episode was good but the trailer made me a bit meh about next week.

...and why is Carson going away??? mrs h sid she'd miss him???

SAID

harrietthespook Sun 16-Oct-11 22:19:49

They killed the tsar and his ministers this episode...but Downton's got it's own Anastasia. (Too well informed on royal histories.)

Don't worry - whether he's an imposter or not will ALL depend on Violet. she's a quality snoop.

AKMD Sun 16-Oct-11 22:21:14

Ooo, valet is a good idea! He'd know everything there is to know about Downton and his employer's life; could easily pass himself off with no face to match.

On consideration, Sir R. gets blown up by the mad Mrs Bates. a heart attack would be too boring.

NoseyNooNoo Sun 16-Oct-11 22:22:47

I think 'Patrick' has been conjured up and coached by Thomas.

AKMD Sun 16-Oct-11 22:24:05

Matthew will get his va-va-boom back if it's a fake.

I thought tonight was very good. Delighted to see no trees left in war torn France grin - very moving opening scenes - much better than last week. Violet sorting everything and everybody out was a joy. Drippy Lavinia got her cards - good. Mary looked v thoughtful. Cora is neglecting that muppet Lord G who will obviously take up with the war widow. Evil Mrs Bates got her guns spiked by somebody even nastier than she is. Edith got no credit at all from anybody for being a good egg - shame - and we saw thankfully little of Branson Pickle.

So - the heir survived the Titanic and just didn't mention it eh? hmm

cyb Sun 16-Oct-11 22:30:34

I wish they didnt sign post whats going to happen so obviously

Would be soooo much more fun if Lady Cory stumbled across his Lordship taking that new housemaid up the back stairs

Well subtlety is hardly JF's strong suit so being obvious is inevitable I'm afraid. I don't know how Hugh B will manage to play an adulterer - really tough challenge for him.

harrietthespook Sun 16-Oct-11 22:39:53

(blows Northern a kiss.) Nice one.

I was right about the deathed marriage though! <preens>

and totally fecking wrong about the rest slightly off on the other predictions!

ScatterChasse Sun 16-Oct-11 22:46:01

I know things have been a bit fraught with the war, but six years. He'd have been struck off my Christmas card list!

Although I suppose it does mean we wouldn't have to hunt for another heir. I will sit back, and hope it's a good twist smile

Nosey's theory about the "heir" being coached by Thomas would be about right....he's had the manner of someone waiting in the wings for something to happen since he got there. I never see him doing much apart from smoking & giving poor Daisy hell.

So Lord G will have a choice between an heir with no air or heirs OR an heir with no face....tough one.

bottlebank Sun 16-Oct-11 23:38:28

no face but, presumably, a working penis.

It MUST be an imposter - in fact I am sure I read a (Roald Dahl? Saki?) story along these very lines once upon a time. Someone will have heard about Matthew's unfortunate condition and decided to cash in.

Will Lord G try to marry poor Edith to Mr Crispy though?

ScatterChasse Sun 16-Oct-11 23:43:57

I think Sybil should be swept off her feet by Sir Richard, leaving Mary to marry Matthew.

Lord Grantham can live until he's 104 and they manage to break the entail, leaving Downton to Edith and the nice sensible person she's married, to be passed down in their family.

And with JF's speed of writing, that should give us a good 3 or 4 more series grin

josephinebonaparte Mon 17-Oct-11 01:25:30

Just watched on itvplayer. So sad...

diddl Mon 17-Oct-11 08:10:51

It´s a bit Martin Guerre, isn´t it?

Last night's episode was July 1918 and we know the series runs till November 1918 so thats only 4 months to go - which is just about the right time for Matthew's back to recover and for Lady Mary to plan her wedding - so I reckon he will regain the use of his legs and hasten off to find drippy Lavinia for a bonkfest whilst Mary bites her lip over whether to actually marry the press baron.
Do we think Edith might actually meet a nice unattached man at some point?

HermanMumster Mon 17-Oct-11 08:37:46

Tichbourne claimant!

Maybe Mary will admit to Edith's elderly peer that she made up the bit about edith laughing at him.

diddl Mon 17-Oct-11 09:02:33

Well I think the girls are about 22, 24 & 26-so Mary must be approaching Anne Elliott status!

MarthasHarbour Mon 17-Oct-11 09:12:00

(it is summerbird here under a new guise - how do you like my new name <twirls> )

leBoF i thought the same thing about Ethel's marvellous gestational period. I also wonder would the baby not have been taken from her by 'the authorities' or would she not have been taken to an institution for unmarried mothers. I know sadly this still happened back then.

I am so thick - i hadnt realised that William died at the end of the episode, will dash off to watch it again tonight (i thought he was just sleeping hmm )

WheresTheCat Mon 17-Oct-11 09:14:56

Oh no, it's all getting a bit too OTT. I do hope the new heir is an imposter.

BTW
(whispers. . am I the only one who thinks Thomas is gorgeous?) blush

*hangs head in shame*

MarthasHarbour Mon 17-Oct-11 09:15:39

ooo and scatterchasse dont get me wrong - i love Heartbeat too - and I too watch it whilst ironing on a Friday when DS is napping smile

midnightexpress Mon 17-Oct-11 09:23:14

May I crash in and ask if the first series was much better than this one? I've been watching, but missed all of the first series because Scottish TV decided that we'd all rather watch the 653rd series of Taggart instead hmm. They've got wise this year. Anyhooo, I must say I'm a bit <whispers> underwhelmed. The first series had such rave reviews that I was expecting something really special and it just seems a bit like any other Sunday night Lark Rise/Upstairs Downstairs/Cranford drama. The 'ishoos' all seem terribly clunky.

Or is it just me? Are you all smitten?

WheresTheCat Mon 17-Oct-11 09:26:14

Midnight I do agree with the 'clunkiness!' (Although I am still smitten much to DH's disgust!)
Just seems this series that there is so much happening that we are going through everything at breakneck speed making it difficult to understand - well for me anyway (but then I'm no Einstein!!!smile )

ThePsychicSatsuma Mon 17-Oct-11 09:35:17

oooh it had me in tears about 4 times; poor old william.

dh said the explosion dragged all the air out of his lungs and ripped all the vessels - it was a common injury

thomas and obrien were horrid talking about the wedding/deathbed werent they?

Daisy looked like an old fashioned picture, beautiful.

vicar was a horrid old sod wasnt he, loved violet blackmailing him

LeBOOOf Mon 17-Oct-11 09:56:18

He was quite perky and talkative though, wasn't he? I found it a bit hard to believe.

Midnight- the first series was about 734 times better than this.

ThePsychicSatsuma Mon 17-Oct-11 09:58:25

was he whistling a bit as he breathed, or was that dh?

SugarSkyHigh Mon 17-Oct-11 09:59:52

satsuma I agree about Daisy - looked very beautiful in an oldy-fashionedy sort of way!
In the trailer for next week the gorgeous Matthew had perfect creamy delicious skin again, so looks like some of the injuries at least are superficial.... He played a gay man in The Line of Beauty some time back - that's when I fell in love

MarthasHarbour Mon 17-Oct-11 10:01:22

BoF i really thought he wouldnt be able to talk at all - my nana has more trouble talking than he did hmm yep satsuma i thought he was whistling too which was rather more realistic.

I agree - the first series was much more gripping

ThePsychicSatsuma Mon 17-Oct-11 10:01:38

pickle nearly scored a kiss off Sybil, didnt he.

Lord G is def going to boff that maid. and she'll get ideas above her station and Obrien will have apoplexy at the sheer front of her

cora will be the furious woman scorned, may have a fling of her own...with scottish dour doctor army guy

loved isobel's chic hat and return complimenting mary on her nursing skills

ThePsychicSatsuma Mon 17-Oct-11 10:02:42

also interesting o'brien still feels v protective of cora, regrets summoning crazy mrs bates; think there'll be a mrs bates vs o brien showdown

<excited>

ThePsychicSatsuma Mon 17-Oct-11 10:04:10

this thread is maximising my enjoyment 10-fold.
agree 1st series was awesome, loved mary and edith bitching each other off

ThePsychicSatsuma Mon 17-Oct-11 10:05:45

also thought violet and edith quite coldly discussing best way to break the news to his father/ how to move him etc spoke about the strength of wartime women, and again the gulf betwixt upstairs and down

ThePsychicSatsuma Mon 17-Oct-11 10:07:06

and thomas is a one isnt he - Im a working class boy just like him, we always get stuffed
next breath - make me a brew serving wench and make it hot etc

he's a great character.
very vampiric though

right off to lidl

MarthasHarbour Mon 17-Oct-11 10:16:22

psychicsatsuma i too was sooo proud when Isobel complimented Mary's nursing skills 'it is the complete opposite of nothing' or something <wipes eye>

Sooooo Lord G is gonna have it away with Samantha Morton, she bears a boy heir and so the lineage is safe, no? Pah Cora will get over it (although if she was on a mumsnet 'fred she would be told to 'leave the fucker') wink

LeBOOOf Mon 17-Oct-11 10:35:52

I dint think illegitimate children could inherit, but maybe Lord and Lady G will pass the baby off as theirs? Or even Matthew and Mary's?

diddl Mon 17-Oct-11 10:43:01

No, they couldn´t-also adopted couldn´t.

Presumably as they weren´t "blood" related?

In which case, would the Grantham´s want to pass off a maid´s baby as theirs or Matthew´s?

diddl Mon 17-Oct-11 10:43:58

Sorry, was thinking of Ethel´s baby, not Lord G with the new maid.

MarthasHarbour Mon 17-Oct-11 10:45:28

hmm <scratches chin> maybe, so they lock Cora away for a few months and she myseriously appears with said bambino (as long as its a boy..)

That actor who plays William's dad crops up in everything, he is quite a good actor though. Not surprised they have shoehorned him into this one <arf>

josephinebonaparte Mon 17-Oct-11 11:04:42

Violet was BRILLIANT! I love Maggie Smith!

harrietthespook Mon 17-Oct-11 11:13:23

Violet was absolutely fantastic. There should be a spin off show, with all the dialogue her trying to speak on the telephone.

I am desperate to be her when I grow up. Complete with savage walking stick.

I just can't wait to find out how she smokes out that imposter. I reckon former valet is just about right.

Lord G might get a snog in but I don't think they'll go all the way - he'll be ridden with guilt and blubbing...Cora Cora.

harrietthespook Mon 17-Oct-11 11:17:55

Re this series generally.

The first two episodes got it off to a bad start. The last few episodes I've enjoyed and I think are up to last season's standard generally. With JF there is always going to be some bizarre thread that isn't followed up/properly explored or some angle where you're like: "huh?" But I think maybe people are forgetting how many of those there were last season.

MarthasHarbour Mon 17-Oct-11 11:20:57

I adore Violet - she is just like my nana, i am so making notes as to how to behave in 50 years time! Note how the 3 sisters interact with her - they think she is fab too - i love it!

AKMD Mon 17-Oct-11 11:49:44

I want to know what happened to Evelyn Napier. He was supposed to be coming to Downton to recuperate so where is he?!

diddl Mon 17-Oct-11 11:53:25

Yes, I thought that Napier´s return might finally get one of the gels married off!

harrietthespook Mon 17-Oct-11 12:05:51

Diddl I think Mary is going to be sorely tested - let's see which way her character goes.

matthew is going to become avail again, might even be able to shag, and then the pretender is showing up...restarting the will her or won't he inherit debate.

diddl Mon 17-Oct-11 12:12:57

I guess she´ll decide that she wants to marry him anyway & thus be "worthy"

<vomit>

And then the heirs an imposter so everyone gets the ending they want-M&M &DA!

harrietthespook Mon 17-Oct-11 12:20:22

I'm not so sure. I think Lavinia may well stage a comeback: when Mary realises she's never going to love Matthew 'enough' she let's him go....! (dont' think it will be the end of the story though, my money's on JF dragging it out into Series 3 one way or another.)

Also: michelle D said there's a sex scene, a wedding, and a funeral this series. We've now had all of the above...

diddl Mon 17-Oct-11 12:23:28

Perhaps the guy will be the heir & he´s already married to someone totally unsuitablegrin

harrietthespook Mon 17-Oct-11 12:25:47

Or Edith will marry him?

Then they find out he was a footman.

AKMD Mon 17-Oct-11 12:27:45

No funeral yet.

HermanMumster Mon 17-Oct-11 12:53:41

Edith was keen on Patrick (Titanic victim heir), wasn't she? So maybe she'll feel protective of the imposter.

diddl Mon 17-Oct-11 13:08:57

i think that it was hinted that she was.

Or maybe she just thought she was?

ScreamingHeebieCJs Mon 17-Oct-11 13:30:52

Ok, last night's episode has finally got me to de-lurk and out myself on this thread grin. Best one yet.

I have to confess I was ironing whilst watching hmm so I might have missed a few significant looks. BUT BUT BUT - have I totally missed the clues re Lord G and the maid? Why is this something everyone's assuming is going to happen?

Am pathetically hoping that Matthew will recover. I am a total sucker for a happy ending. I actually like Mary now, dammit. Really like the way her character has grown and changed throughout the two series.

Oh, I could witter on all day now I've started ...

AKMD Mon 17-Oct-11 13:33:05

She said she would have had him if Mary had given her the chance.

I missed the maid bit too. I really hope that doesn't happen. Affairs are so cringe-worthy.

MarthasHarbour Mon 17-Oct-11 13:36:09

YY i now remember Edith being all smitten with Titanic blokey.

I saw the glances between the new maid and Lord G but had forgotten the Daily Mirror leak re Lord G's indiscretion - although didnt it say that she just 'turns his head'? hmm

josephinebonaparte Mon 17-Oct-11 13:38:21

Hugh bonneville would have found it really hard to act that, seeing as he's such a family man.

diddl Mon 17-Oct-11 13:43:16

Yes, but I wonder if she really loved him, or thought she did because she knew Mary didn´t.

Or just the rivalry between them?

What I didn´t really like was Mary´s assumption that she should be there-with no thought of Lavinia!

I think that Mary loves him, but can´t decide about Matthew.

For example asks about Lavinia & his mother first.

ScreamingHeebieCJs Mon 17-Oct-11 13:51:10

Ah - a Daily Mirror leak? <goes off to google>

Georgimama Mon 17-Oct-11 13:52:34

Last night's ep was fabulous but I have a huge issue - has Julian Fellowes actually forgotten that there was a flu epidemic which killed more people than the war? I mean, there has been no reference to it whatsoever. This is a bit of a cock up if so.

Georgimama Mon 17-Oct-11 13:53:22

Hmm, just googled, it started in June 1918 so I suppose there is time.

AKMD Mon 17-Oct-11 13:53:33

Didn't it start after the war, when all the soldiers came home?

diddl Mon 17-Oct-11 13:57:07

Also, if Matthew now won´t "subject" Lavinia to being married to him-doesn´t that also apply to Mary-unless he only sees her as a friend?

ScreamingHeebieCJs Mon 17-Oct-11 14:01:38

Mirror article here in case it isn't just me who missed it grin

Am also intrigued by the Christmas special - so presumably it won't all be wrapped up next week?

AKMD Mon 17-Oct-11 14:06:10

The Mirror reckon it's a BBC drama though grin

AKMD Mon 17-Oct-11 14:06:37

If Mary tells Matthew that she's had her bit of fun then maybe he won't feel the same scruples!

diddl Mon 17-Oct-11 14:12:39

grin

Georgimama Mon 17-Oct-11 14:13:41

I still think Lavinia is going to have to conveniently die of flu or turn out to be a caaaaaaw in some way (preferably connected with the dastardly Sir Richard - bastard is clearly going to hold Mary's past over her) so she can be packed off and forgotten about.

ScreamingHeebieCJs Mon 17-Oct-11 14:16:05

Maybe Mrs Bates will go ape and take a shotgun to Dastardly Sir Richard?

Georgimama Mon 17-Oct-11 14:17:41

ooooh, hope so. I think either Anna or masterbates are more likely to be in her firing line though. One of them is so going to end up deaded.

ScreamingHeebieCJs Mon 17-Oct-11 14:23:40

I'm not feeling the Bates/Anna love so much recently. Which is sad because they were genuinely moving at the end of the last series, and when he came back at the beginning of this one. Perhaps it's been decreed that we can only cope with one will they/won't they/lots of meaningful looks romance per series.

Would hate one of them to be offed, though.

MarthasHarbour Mon 17-Oct-11 14:23:41

oh no is next week the last one? i thought there were 8 episodes <wails>

AKMD Mon 17-Oct-11 14:25:41

I thought we just had episode 5 and there are 7 episodes + Christmas special?

ScreamingHeebieCJs Mon 17-Oct-11 14:30:33

Sorry - my confusion. For some reason I thought next week was the last one.

Just checked - there are eight episodes, plus the Christmas special. So plenty of time for 'flu to cause havoc grin

LeBOOOf Mon 17-Oct-11 14:32:38

The Romanovs were shot in July of 1918, to give us an idea of where we are meant to be up to. The flu started in June, but was ordinary enough, I think, but with a much deadlier strain developing in the autumn.

harrietthespook Mon 17-Oct-11 14:55:22

My great grandfather died in it in 1918, in the US.

argghh Mon 17-Oct-11 15:20:05

Another one who loves Violet, need a soundbite of all her best sayings to use. I think I need to cultivate a very cut glass accent

Stokey38 Mon 17-Oct-11 15:30:24

See, I find the whole Bates / Anna thing really unbelievable. I'm not really an Anna fan TBH, she is a bit drippy for my liking!

AKMD Mon 17-Oct-11 15:37:46

I quite like Anna but Bates is such a drip. Why does his overly-developed sense of ego honour always include making the woman he supposedly loves unhappy? "Oh, look at me, I'm such a decent chap and look how I suffer for you all." He's the kind of mug whose infuriated wife posts on AIBU about him spending his weekends putting up other people's kitchens for free and running their home like a guesthouse for dodgy relatives.

I was quite amused yesterday to see Mary asking the filthy-rich Sir R to tell her how much it would cost to buy Mrs Bates off, then getting home and shrugging when Bates (and/or Anna?) told her he's given them all his money.

AKMD Mon 17-Oct-11 15:37:57

given *her

harrietthespook Mon 17-Oct-11 15:51:23

BUT- she must believe that Sir Richard's ability to solve an ongoing problem for him has some sort of 'value'. Maybe at least he and Anna will get a second hand silver cruet with the family crest on it as well...

harrietthespook Mon 17-Oct-11 15:58:48

Or she could be thinking: he paid for his bit, she offered to 'pay' for hers and then remember Sir Richard goes: Wives are indebeted to their husbands. Which I kind of read at the time as: you'll be working your debt off to me in the sack/dining room/wherever I say.

Or am I just blinded by Mary's charms?

Avantia Mon 17-Oct-11 16:10:00

I think the new maid looks like a younger version of Cora - sorry of that has been said already - can't keep up with the thread !

Cora I think has been neglecting Lord G of late - last night she cancelled a dinner invite and Lord G was slightly pissed off in an Edwardian way grin

Poor Mary selling her soul to the devil in disguise - Sir R.

The imposter moment - not sure about someone coming back fropm the 'dead' had Dallas shower scene all over it - talking of Dallas that will be back on soon grin

diddl Mon 17-Oct-11 16:56:26

The class boundaries are getting very blurred, aren´t they?

Also, has DA been requisitioned?

Just thinking of the difference when the Granthams wanted Evelyn Napier to stay & it was ultimately their decision, but then Violet had to sort things herself re William.

Georgimama Mon 17-Oct-11 16:57:55

I think the thing with William is that he isn't an officer, and it is a rest home for officers only. That's why he was upstairs in a guest bedroom with Enid caring for him rather than downstairs in the official bit with "proper" nurses.

dapplegrey Mon 17-Oct-11 17:33:53

Maybe the badly burned officer is Evelyn Napier? Every other prediction I've made has been wrong so I'm unlikely to be right on this one.

diddl Mon 17-Oct-11 17:34:51

Yes, but Lady Violet wanted him there-and I´ve no doubt that that would previously have been enough.

I think that Edith was great again.

GeorginaWorsley Mon 17-Oct-11 17:36:52

I think Cora may succumb to flu leaving Robert distraught,to be comforted by new maid's widowly charms.
And new maid already has proved her childbearing ability,so in the post war class breakdown could become the next Countess?grin
Would love to see Violet's face!
O'Brien will refuse to serve the new Lady of course and will plot and plot....
The 'who's the heir' question will be resolved by new baby of Robert and maid-come-new-countess.smile

diddl Mon 17-Oct-11 18:01:16

"Maybe the badly burned officer is Evelyn Napier?"

Well I would have thought that he´d already done his convalesing-or at least started it!

Actually killing off Cora would be brilliant for dramatic tension - is Lord G going to marry again? A new heir? V pissed off daughters and his mother scrutinising all candidates....oooh yes!

I thought the CHristmas episode was going to be all flu ridden? I'm hoping Lavinia gets the flu. Also maybe Pickle could come down with it and be nursed back to health by Lady Sybil? That might stop him being such a tosser.

Another vote for the Dowager here...I've always been a fan of hers.

Loved her as Prof McGonagoll in the HP series, she had some fab one- liners

in those as well!

ThePsychicSatsuma Mon 17-Oct-11 20:30:52

they cant ditch cora - old mcgovern is a ratings winner

SeveredHeadsDragonTheFloor Mon 17-Oct-11 21:42:23

Just caught up with Sundays episode. I couldn't watch the opening sequence at the front.

how blubworthy was Daisy and William's wedding?

ScatterChasse Mon 17-Oct-11 22:10:50

See, I found the singing last week more tear-jerking.

But it did have to wipe my eyes when Mary was looking after Matthew, gently lifting him and everything.

i didn't find the wedding too heart rending but the going over the top and the teacup had me gripped.

SeveredHeadsDragonTheFloor Mon 17-Oct-11 22:22:13

I think, for me, it's not so much the TV story but realising that it happened to real people. The number of young lives and loves lost or destroyed is heartbreaking. The end of Blackadder Goes Forth does me in too.

DrCoconut Mon 17-Oct-11 22:54:24

SeveredHeads, I watched the dramatisation of Anne Frank's diary a couple of years or so ago. It was heartbreaking to see them all being taken away at the end knowing that although what we were actually seeing was just a film it did really happen and most of them died. And I'm not massively sentimental about TV either. So I completely see what you're saying about the realisation that these events were real.

AKMD Tue 18-Oct-11 08:47:49

I was teary at the opening sequence too sad I just thought it was such a massive waste. And for what? The Kaiser/King/ArchDuke etc. were all related, couldn't they have sorted it out without sending off millions of men to die?

dapplegrey Tue 18-Oct-11 08:52:46

I couldn't watch the scenes at the Front either - anything to do with that war is so harrowing.
"The war to end all wars" is what they said. But then 21 years later another one started.

I keep hoping Matthew will recover, but if he did I suppose JF would get so much stick for implausibility.

MarthasHarbour Tue 18-Oct-11 09:26:06

i found the opening scenes 'goosebumpy' and very well portrayed sad the end of Blackadder gets me too severedheads

i actually thought the teacup thing with Mary and Daisy was a little over contrived - one of them yes but both? hmm

the one part that did have me wiping my eyes was when Isobel came in to see Matthew - his face lit up when he saw her. It is a mother and child thing i think (being the mother of a DS) I also struggled with the fact that William is my sons name, the whole thing when his mum died and this week when his dad was sat with him when he was dying sad My DS is an only child too. <reaches for the kleenex!>

The Isobel/Mathew reunion was wonderfully understated wasn't it?

I got the feeling he really wanted to shriek "mummmeeeeeee it hurts" & bawl like a 4 year old & she would have been quite happy just to cuddle him...but being stiff upper lip land it was all conveyed in one word ....."mother" sad

Marvellous stuff!

diddl Tue 18-Oct-11 10:28:08

I thought that the beginning & the Isobel/Matthew bit was great as well.

The "shivers" from Daisy & the tea cup from Mary-too contrived.

The wedding didn´t really get me either because Daisy didn´t love him-but I thought that Carson´s expression was great.

Also thought that the girl playing Daisy acted it really well.

Georgimama Tue 18-Oct-11 10:28:55

I loved Isobel's little line to Mary as well, when she said something like "it was nothing" and Isobel said "it was the very opposite of nothing" or similar. DH and I spent the entire epsiode shrieking "marry her/him you idiot" at Matthew and Mary.

AKMD Tue 18-Oct-11 10:32:37

I was hoping to see a tear in Thomas's eye at the wedding. None forthcoming but I like to believe he wasn't only there to make William feel like a muppet on his deathbed.

Georgimama DH is silent on pain of death. I might miss something! We're allowed to shout during the adverts though.

MarthasHarbour Tue 18-Oct-11 10:33:37

bossybritches YY if that was me with DS i would have run in shouting 'my little boooyyyy i love you soooo much my likkle picklieness mwah mwah' <cue tight scrunchy cuddles - ouch> i am glad it isnt just me wink

diddl i too didnt weep at the wedding and i also think it was because Daisy didnt love him, but wasnt William wonderful - he wanted to make sure Daisy would get her War Widows pension and be looked after forever. And when she said it was dishonest he didnt understand what she really meant - but that was ok because he thought she didnt want to defraud the benefit system. It was all so well acted by both of them.

MarthasHarbour Tue 18-Oct-11 10:35:01

georgiemama that line from Isobel summed up everything i thought - another clever line well said!

OK so this series is slow but JF does know how to convey the moment in just one or two words

Georgimama Tue 18-Oct-11 10:35:46

I don't know - I think William had an inkling she had been railroaded a bit, he wanted to see her right though God bless him.

harrietthespook Tue 18-Oct-11 10:52:10

Re Matty's willy: JF has always gotten away with implausibility before. I just hope it's not too terribly cringeworthy.

The actors were FAB in this episode. Love Thomas/Daisy, Mary and Edith both, Matthew, Isobel, Violet- honestly all. Any other actor spilling her teacup would have been ridiculous, so hard to carry off.

I really don't see the point of bringing that dead/undead heir back. There are enough interesting story lines to pursue w/o it.

AKMD Tue 18-Oct-11 10:58:04

I really fail to see why William ever thought Daisy was in love with him in the first place. A massive example of self-delusion really!

I think they left the door open for the spinal diagnosis to be wrong didn't they? Which could result in a recovery? Think the moustached doctor said it might have severed the spine, and if he was right then it was a no recovery situation?

Presumably there could be other recoverable spinal damage with the same symptoms even if the spinal chord wasn't severed?

AKMD Tue 18-Oct-11 10:59:41

The key word is 'might'. Wide open!

MarthasHarbour Tue 18-Oct-11 11:05:46

Biscuitsandtea hooraaahhh you have made my day, kept my hope alive that Matthews winky may be saved... grin

Well, it's something I've given a lot of though wink

Thought, not though...

diddl Tue 18-Oct-11 11:19:13

Is it possible to bruise your spine badly enough to lose feeling in your legs?

But if so-how long would that last?

VerityBrulee Tue 18-Oct-11 11:37:41

DD is at home sick today, so I am re-watching the last couple of episodes. I LOVE the concert scene, brings a tear to my eye every time. How restrained of Mary to resist the implulse to run to Matthew when he appeared at the back of the room. He looks so handsome in his uniform, I was a bit non-plussed by him in the last series, but I'm rather more keen this series!

I am absolutely not countenancing the idea that Matthew will not recover and he and Mary will not live happily ever after, altough I presume she will suffer at the hands of the dasterdly Sir Richard in the meantime.

I find the war scenes very harrowing. My granddad fought in the Somme, he had shrapnel in his shoulder until he died aged 89. He rarely spoke about the experience as he found it so disstressing, but I remember him describing being in the trenches up to his knees in muddy water floating with dead rats. He was only 16 when he joined up (lied about his age). I have a 13 year old boy. It makes me well up to think about it sad When I see war scenes I always picture my grandad there, so I try to aviod them!

I love Violet, but cannot understand why Sybil is not being plagued by the recovering officers, she is so stunning surely Branston is not the only one to be smitten.

MarthasHarbour Tue 18-Oct-11 12:04:09

verity my great uncle and his twin brother lied about their ages too and they signed up at 15. It is astonishing when you think how young they were sad

<pulls on ex Orthpaedic Sisters unflattering hat & uniform>

As far as I remember some spinal injuries are very difficult to predict, even these days with posh whizzy scanners an' all. Bruising can take MONTHS to disperse & then feelings/function come back, damaged nerves can regrow but only something like 1mm per month so the will he/won't he recover storyline could go on for months...could be the big news in the Christmas special.

Po-faced Scottish doc is hardly a nerological expert, so a bit of prodding down Mathews back hardly makes a conclusive examination!

<sniffs a la Violet & hitches ample bosom>

Just saying....grin

"my ickle pickle" Martha....??? Love it!

LeBOOOf Tue 18-Oct-11 12:09:46

Excellent point about Sybil. She should be beating them off with a shoehorn stick.

AKMD Tue 18-Oct-11 12:14:48

I'd be surprised if Edith didn't get an offer or two after all her good work.

AKMD Tue 18-Oct-11 12:15:44

Did anyone else think that a Matthew who was concious would have had something to say about being washed by his ex-fiancee/cousin? That bit made me sqiurm!

Bet she didn't do below the waist....nothing wrong with his arms I don't think?!

LeBOOOf Tue 18-Oct-11 12:21:33

I'm wondering (in quite an unseemly fashion) what he is doing about his poos and wees. Would he not have noticed a problem with them before he idly got round to mentioning he hadn't moved his legs for a while?

AKMD Tue 18-Oct-11 12:24:09

I think she would have done the lot. I doubt anyone would have been keeping up with her down-below hygiene TBH. Once he was at the hospital the nurses would have been keeping that bit in order while he was on morphine so he wouldn't necessarily have been 'with it' enough to notice.

LeBOOOf Tue 18-Oct-11 12:30:06

Her down-below hygiene could be positively lethal, for all we know. After all, Pamuk died of something...

AKMD Tue 18-Oct-11 12:32:20

His, his, his. Let's not even start on hers. Please grin

I agree there is plenty of scope for spinal recovery. If JF really wanted to keep him knackered he would have blown the lovely legs etc right off!

I expect Isobel will be up with all the latest spinal developments and then be bested by Violet applying a bracing poultice.

Looking at the preview on the ITC website - the war finishes on Sunday.

diddl Tue 18-Oct-11 12:40:07

So, what´s the point of the "heir"-for Mary to realise that she does love Matthew-even without DA?

Alas too late as she is now entangled with Sir R!

Matthew recovers, marries Lavinia-she dies having a son.

Mary marries Richard who commits suicide over something.

So M&M eventually marry & discover he is the heir-& there´s a spare!

But does the spare die in WW2?

But that´s OK as M&M have son(s).

ThePsychicSatsuma Tue 18-Oct-11 12:46:03

yy someone will cure matthew by dropping him or something, violet ordering him moved upstairs to marys room; carson drops him, isobel furious but then he says
worry not, mother, my legs are working and little matthew is standing right to attention

ThePsychicSatsuma Tue 18-Oct-11 12:47:29

good. am sick of the war. bring on the flu! lets see some women die too

<munches popcorn>

MarthasHarbour Tue 18-Oct-11 12:54:28

her down below hygiene - yuk thank god i finished my egg sarnie

<stamps foot>

look i just want M&M to marry, have babies and live happily ever after ok??

LeBOOOf Tue 18-Oct-11 12:56:40

No- Lavinia shuffles off, dies of a mixture of flu and a broken heart. Mary continues to nurse Matthew, and during a routine bed bath, tries a little shuffle and gets an unexpected twitch in response. With a few weeks more careful nursing, Matthew's manhood is restored to its previous morning glory, and proposes to Mary on Christmas Eve. Edith, meanwhile, was smugly set to inherit Downton after taking up with the creepy Patrick imposter, but his deception is uncovered when O'Brien intercepts a letter from Bates's evil wife and realises that he is actually her bitter old lover whom Bates had bludgeoned into disfigurement with a shoehorn. In a fit of rage, Edith fulfills her driving vocation and runs him over with a farm threshing machine. Nobody can tell the difference, and the family assume that he too has succumbed to Spanish Flu. Matthew and Mary inherit the estate, and argue about whose mother gets the Dower House. The End.

AKMD Tue 18-Oct-11 12:57:19

Yes, me too. Sir R can marry Lavinia, Bates' wife will nlast him with a shotgun and then fall into a canal and then everyone will be happy. Except Anna. She can marry... Thomas?

MarthasHarbour Tue 18-Oct-11 13:09:20

<claps hands> all sorted then lebof nice one.

ThePsychicSatsuma Tue 18-Oct-11 13:56:11

no no no.

Sybil invites emmeline pankhurst to dinner and chains herself in her pantaloons to emmsy, with Pickle joining in. The recuperating soldiers clap them on and whistle.

Lord G develops gout and needs morning massage by the new maid

Mary thinks this is marvellous and massages matthew every day, this progresses to a daily handjob at 9am sharp after breakfast, with Isobel nodding and smiling in the back of the room

one day thomas walks in and decides to be straight as he didnt realise women were so...'useful' on the downstroke;
he proposes to Anna and they leave to open a sauna in Rippon

Masterbates is devastated and buries his head in Mrs Patmore's bosom; she decides there is life in the old woman yet and proposes to him, he smacks her on the rump with his walking stick and agrees

O'brien picks up the unwanted shoehorn and shoehorns the titanic survivor to death 'No-one will tek this howse off mi lady' gritting her teeth

Cora, bored with Lord G and his gout, asks Molecom the creepy valet to dress her each morning; he turns out to be full of vim and vigour when it comes to lacing corsets

AKMD Tue 18-Oct-11 13:58:51

shock

HermanMumster Tue 18-Oct-11 14:15:48

I think Sir Anthony Strallon will turn up wounded and succumb to Edith all over again.

anonacfr Tue 18-Oct-11 14:16:59

First off- POOR DAISY!!!! Mrs Hughes was so harsh with her.

Now onto to Pickle- he's eeeeevil! How rude was he to his supposed undying love when she asked him to drive her to the hospital to help look after Matthew- she can go if she wants!!!

And I hate the whole emotional manipulation he does with her. As I said last week if we're meant to swoon at a forbidden love storyline the whole thing's a massive fail.
Not to mention there's so much contrivance to get a scene between the two of them. I mean why would the lady of the house go to the garage when they staff for that?

Speaking of contrivance how convenient that Lavinia was sobbing in bed half undressed with her door wide open just as Mary was walking by? And telling Mary that she and Matthew could never be lovers- don't you mean man and wife?

This is too ridiculous. I hate Anna and Bates as well. I'm only watching for Mary/Matthew Edith and Violet right now.
And talk about character assassination with Lord G. He used to be so nice and now he sulks when hbis wife can't attend a social function because she is RUNNING A MILITARY HOSPITAL AFTER FOUR YEARS OF WAR???? Tosser.

MarthasHarbour Tue 18-Oct-11 14:20:20

<wafts fan at anon>
<applauds psychicsatsuma>

Stokey38 Tue 18-Oct-11 14:25:23

anonacfr - I agree, all lord Smug Fat has done is walk about in his uniform for the last 4 years and get more and more annoying. Anna and Bates are too dull and mismatched for words. Lady Mary is really boring this season, much better when she was ballsy and bitchy IMO. The Edith / farmer story line was pointless and she doesn't seem to have much of a role. Thomas could be put to much better use and even he seems to be getting a bit nicer (or maybe I am imagining that) Can't see where the Ethel / baby storyline is going - maybe he will be left at the nativity scene at Christmas. All this said, I will of course keep watching and still do enjoy!

diddl Tue 18-Oct-11 14:30:34

"she is RUNNING A MILITARY HOSPITAL AFTER FOUR YEARS OF WAR???? "

She´s not though, is she?

I´m sure she doesn´t have to be so involved-she wasn´t at first-until O´Brien told her that Isobel was getting above herself.

bottlebank Tue 18-Oct-11 14:34:02

I'm worried that Branston is going to rape Sybil. If he does and it gets handled like the Pamuk thing (when Mary basically went along with it), I will be really cross.

I think CORA is going to die of flu.

You lot are pricelss!! grin

diddl yes why is Lady Cora running around being Head Girl of the hospital-I thought that was Thomas' job?

Sybil counts sheets & moves bandages around, Edith does the Lady Almoner job beautifully & Mrs Padmore & Daisy have the kitchen under control ...

WTF is she doing other than Neglecting Lord G which can only Lead To Trouble??

<does pussy bum mouth impression a la Dowager with knowing nod>

anonacfr Tue 18-Oct-11 15:54:11

Actually despite Branson's condescension I think it was established that Sybil does a bit more than just serve tea to randy officers.

Diddl it does seem that Cora has kind of taken over Isabel's position and as such is supervising the staff etc at DA- which is kind of a big job.

Bottlebank I don't think there will be any rape. Remember this is supposed to a love story. She might resist him initially but will soon surrender to his Irish charm, give up her career and identity and bear him a dozen children.

mrszimmerman Tue 18-Oct-11 16:42:29

haven't read whole thread yet.
in a rush.
But will Matthew's nob be miraculously Mended before the end of series 2? Will Mary resurrect it with her love?
thank god he's dumped lumpen lavinia she's a bore.
boring dying footman storyline, dull.
Too many plotlines.
Cartoon villainy is ridiculous, too implausible.
When's Lord Grantham going to go off his dull piste and do something other than get Fatter?
My mother thought he was twinkling at that new maid (who's clearly a liar)

I was hoping Branson Pickle would go off to London to start a career as a radical journalist or MP then Lady S could elope with him. Rather dull to elope down to the chauffeurs cottage tbh.

harrietthespook Tue 18-Oct-11 16:55:08

Psychic and Le BOOOF you are ON FORM.

bottlebank Tue 18-Oct-11 17:02:06

anon I think Pamuk was supposed to be a love/lust story too but I thought it was fairly dodgily presented. Would hate to see Lady S painted into a corner!

I hope Branston actually does something which makes him worth her, then, rather than just being snide until she capitulates.

anonacfr Tue 18-Oct-11 17:49:17

I can see how Pamuk worked as alust story. Initially there was a lot of flirting/lingering looks going on.
The creepy thing with Pickle is the bullying- he keeps telling her what to feel/think while at the same time being dismissive of her ambitions. You just know that if they ever eloped Sybil would have to turn into the little wife.

Also half the time she seems quite scared of him.

Anyway I think I'm reading too much into this. I need to step away from this tread.... Slowly...

mateysmum Tue 18-Oct-11 18:04:35

Love your plot summary Le Booof, pretty close to the unlikely "truth" I reckon.

I love DA, but I do wish they'd just slow it all down a bit and let the characters and the story lines develop a bit. It's like a revolving door farce sometimes. Evil ladies maid writes evil letter to evil ex wife of wonderful valet who loves wonderful house maid. Handsome soldier goes to trenches, comes back from trenches wounded, is nursed by beautiful aristocratic girl who still loves him. Evil chauffeur tries it on with beautiful aristocratic girl 2. Evil Captain gets silly housemaid up the duff, saintly housekeeper tries to save her. Oh and that was all in one episode. Soon it will be 1960 and we'll be watching M&M's grandchildren trying to prop up the crumbling Abbey.

I think all those ad breaks are just there so that the plot can move on a few months - a sort of time warp effect.

I haven't lost faith yet, but I think that in series 3 they just need to let us all take a breather and have a lovely wallow in nostalgia rather than be sped headlong through the years.

limitedperiodonly Tue 18-Oct-11 18:21:09

I kept shouting: 'I told you he'd live,' at Daisy right up until William fell into his final slumber. Blame it on Emo Phillips. How much was a private's widow's pension in 1918 anyway?

How has the Impostor become horribly burned? The Titanic sank in 1,000 feet of freezing cold water. Was he clinging to one of the boilers?

Ethel's is the biggest baby I've seen since that Battleship Potemkin homage in the Untouchables.

Cora will die of flu. Then Elizabeth McGovern will be free to get Botox again.

LeBOOOf Tue 18-Oct-11 18:26:43

grin@ limitedperiod

And yes, the dole for a Private of five minutes standing wouldn't have been much, I don't think.

LeBOOOf Tue 18-Oct-11 18:28:43

And Ethel got knocked up, had a pregnancy and grew the bairn to practically school-age, all in the space of a few months in 1918.

LeBOOOf Tue 18-Oct-11 18:45:56

I LOVE THAT! grin

diddl Tue 18-Oct-11 19:09:44

That was really funnygrin

limitedperiodonly Tue 18-Oct-11 19:09:55

And yes, the dole for a Private of five minutes standing wouldn't have been much, I don't think.

The working classes used to be nobly modest. <<shakes head sadly>> Thank heavens the current Cabinet is trying to restore Britain to her traditional values.

Northern I thought of you when I saw those blasted trees in the opening scene.

I was very pleased limited - obviously they'd been back and reshot after our comments last week grin

oo-er.....

limitedperiodonly Tue 18-Oct-11 19:19:10

The dawn of a new era is one thing but how beastly if poor Lady Mary is forced to assemble flat pack furniture after a hellish Sunday afternoon with Sir Richard at Ikea.

Does the end of the war mean Earl G will get to wear a different outfit?

diddl Tue 18-Oct-11 19:29:29

Yes, do they all go back to as they were?

What about Thomas?

He´s no longer staff ar DA is he?

HermanMumster Tue 18-Oct-11 20:32:27

I reckon the new maid is the Imposter's spy on the inside, feeding him info so he can keep up the pretence of being The Heir. Boffing Lord G is her fall-back position (ie, fall back onto a big aristocratic bed).

maizieD Tue 18-Oct-11 20:35:23

I've been lurking on this thread for weeks now and love it almost more than DA.

I have to confess to a moment of utter confusion in the last episode when I was thinking it was getting all very Lady Chatterlyish and wondering when the virile young gamekeeper was going to make an appearance, and what a pity it was that Sean Bean is too old and fat for the job now, when up pops Sharpe's deadly enemy, Sir Henry Simmerson, disguised as the vicar, but still just as nasty. (yes, I know he is nice Oliver in The Archers but you can't see him in that). Thank heaven he got his comeuppance.

Now, will JF and the DA casting director please stop getting an elderly lady completely bemused... blush

anonacfr Tue 18-Oct-11 20:53:03

That reminds me- did anyone else see William's father and thought EGG'S DAD!!!!

I knew I recognised him! Just couldn't place him!

diddl Tue 18-Oct-11 21:32:18

Wasn´t he also in THe Lakes as John Simms father?

The chap playing Mosely was also in that, wasn´t he?

MarthasHarbour Tue 18-Oct-11 21:42:57

Y Y anon I too shouted 'eggs dad' loved that programme. I think creepy mosely was in the lakes too

ScreamingHeebieCJs Tue 18-Oct-11 21:43:10

EGG'S DAD!

I DID!!

He's always Egg's Dad in our house grin

The vicar reminded me of the one from "Curse of the Were-Rabbit" grin

ScreamingHeebieCJs Tue 18-Oct-11 22:02:56

I always think that actor (Egg's Dad grin) must get bored of being typecast as the salt-of-the-earth, earnest, slightly down on his luck bloke. I bet he's still thrilled that he got one job where he got to take Es and shag a 25-year-old.

MarthasHarbour Tue 18-Oct-11 22:12:07

hehe yep - i was just going to say that i remembered he went clubbing with Anna then shagged her (that is Anna of This Life and not Anna on DA - now that would be a storyline!!)

harrietthespook Tue 18-Oct-11 22:55:53

http://tinyurl.com/66ebbyu

Mary and Pamuk's love child that never was visits Highclere.

Doesn't object to the white feather either - kids today, hey?

Seriously - can we please run a sweepstakes on how Matty's willy is going to recover? How will they pull this off?

LeBOOOf Tue 18-Oct-11 23:34:16

During a bed bath, is my best guess.

josephinebonaparte Wed 19-Oct-11 07:38:33

Christmas episode for Willy recovery, deffo.

HermanMumster Wed 19-Oct-11 08:31:42

He will roll his wheelchair into the lake, meaning to drown himself, and the shock of the cold water will revive his extremeties*. He will swim back to land (recovering Bates' leg brace en route, in case it comes in handy), and make a beeline for Mary. Leg brace probably a leetle on the large side for a willy brace, though.

* always worked for Rupert Brooke, apparently.

I expect Bates will try and be supportive - war wounded too as he is. Of course Matthew will then lash out at him as both his legs and willy work - albeit limpingly. grin

LeBOOOf Wed 19-Oct-11 08:45:24

William- 'Inside The Minds Of Angry And Controlling Men', by Lundy Bancroft.

SoupDragon Wed 19-Oct-11 09:10:12

To be honest, I don't think will be any difficulties with Matthew's willy and pulling it off.

[snurk]

Diagnostic medicine being what it was, they have no way of knowing what spinal damage there has been and whether it is permanent or not. No, people don't recover from broken spinal cords very often, especially if they've been transported as they would have been in WW1, but spinal injuries are not always permanent ones.

SoupDragon Wed 19-Oct-11 09:15:59

"The wedding didn´t really get me either because Daisy didn´t love him"

Maybe not, but he loved her and died married to the girl he loved. I really liked that Daisy said she would stay with him in case he needed her, a change from when she couldn't wait to get away from him.

MarthasHarbour Wed 19-Oct-11 09:30:41

soupdragon i was just about to <snurk> at 'pulling off matthews willy'

fnarr fnarr

limitedperiodonly Wed 19-Oct-11 09:58:02

Bates wouldn't be much use as support. He'd fall over.

Who was the horrid vicar? He's been loads of things.

Georgimama Wed 19-Oct-11 10:39:39

So the burned one is Canadian - Patrick wasn't Canadian was he?

Note to Julian Fellowes - stop ripping off plots from Nancy Mitford/Evelyn Waugh and get some of your own. Richard Carlisle is clearly modelled on the bloke whose name escapes me that Julia Flyte married, and now we have a Canadian heir like in Love in a Cold Climate. Naughty naughty JF thinking we Sunday evening lower orders won't have read this stuff.

Georgimama Wed 19-Oct-11 10:40:29

Horrid vicar is from the BBC/ITV shared Character Actors Department - like Bates he has Been In Everything but no one knows his name.

ThePsychicSatsuma Wed 19-Oct-11 11:15:19

still laughing at 'snow white in reverse...the princess kisses the prince and then he dies'

that's made my day that has.

yes I too thought of this thread when all the trees were gone.

good show ladies.

So who the feck is the canadian - and why is it weird for him to speak posh, and why doesnt edith know who he is???

limitedperiodonly Wed 19-Oct-11 11:47:17

It's not just the BBC/ITV that has a Shared Character Actors Department.

Years ago I read about people who make really decent livings in Hollywood without ever headlining a film.

Ed Harris was one of them. That article is the only reason I recognise him now. I can't remember who the others were or what they're up to. Probably counting their money away from the paparazzi.

ThePsychicSatsuma Wed 19-Oct-11 12:29:20

yes. they do not have to court publicity to make a buck.

HermanMumster Wed 19-Oct-11 12:39:32

Many of the Titanic dead were buried in Newfoundland / Nova Scotia, weren't they? That's Canada I think. So some context.

AKMD Wed 19-Oct-11 12:43:24

Bates was the rabid trade unionist in North & South. Another <swoon> for the Darcy-alike in that!

dapplegrey Wed 19-Oct-11 17:42:15

How do we know the burned officer is Canadian? Have I missed something?

diddl Wed 19-Oct-11 17:56:24

"The war finally ends but Mary is under pressure to save her family from scandal and a Canadian visitor claims to have links with the Granthams."

That´s the blurb from the website for next weeks episode.

dapplegrey Wed 19-Oct-11 18:13:38

Thank you diddl. I must pay more attention in future!!!!!

maizieD Wed 19-Oct-11 19:13:28

limitedperiodonly, the evil vicar was the arch-villian in the 1990s 'Sharpe' series. A series which had half the nation's ladies getting progressively more excited as the hero's (Sean Bean) uniform trousers got progressively tighter with each episode..Said hero had already caused a flutter or three doing interesting things with Lady Chatterly (husband paralysed from waist down in WW1, thus the connection with DA); the entry of evil vicar was disconcerting...

Not trying to hi-jack this lovely thread - please continue with the plot speculation which is highly entertaininggrin

ThePsychicSatsuma Wed 19-Oct-11 19:48:04

I used to love a bit of sean bean., liked him in that bond film too. bit of rough.

I expect evil vicar will have a thing or two to say when Bates and Anna set up in sin together (that divorce is SO not happening).

Apparently the Duke and Duchess of Cambridge are fans. Now I'm thinking that maybe Kate might be thinking vaguely about babies at some point - she could be here now lurking - or posting? <<shines torches in face of all on thread>>

josephinebonaparte Wed 19-Oct-11 19:50:23

Bean is a bit grubby, and not in a good way.

ThePsychicSatsuma Wed 19-Oct-11 19:53:46

I am far too witty to be Kate.


<or is that a double bluff?>

AKMD Wed 19-Oct-11 20:04:31

Not slim enough, sorry.

I will winkle her out!

(as Major Git no doubt said as he eyed up sluthousemaid)

Ok - everybody tell me what you were doing on April 29th.............

ThePsychicSatsuma Wed 19-Oct-11 20:07:12

[gasps] you cheeky cow !

ThePsychicSatsuma Wed 19-Oct-11 20:08:02

I am jealous of my sister's bum...

anonacfr Wed 19-Oct-11 22:04:10

Don't be. She doesn't have one.

Driftwood999 Wed 19-Oct-11 22:45:36

I've only managed to watch a few episodes. My only prediction so far is:

M&M marry, DTA is saved.
Mary meets Mellors, but that's another story.

Driftwood999 Wed 19-Oct-11 23:27:19

Also, that Daisy will rise, although poor, small and uneducated, she is tough, principled and will develop. Go girl.

limitedperiodonly Wed 19-Oct-11 23:35:18

I was watching it on the telly on the 29th and then I walked my mum up to Westminster Abbey and put her on the tube at Westminster station.

I told her it would be far too common and crowded to wave from the crowd. Plus I was in my dressing gown until the afternoon - much like Lady Violet.

Pippa does have a nice bum but Kate has a nicer face. They are both too heavy-handed with the dark membrane pencil, though.

Thank you maizied. I knew I'd seen that face before.

psychic I used to like Sean but he's gone to seed. Did you see his moobs under stretch lycra in Red Riding?

HermanMumster Thu 20-Oct-11 08:21:07

Preggers already, I reckon. She isn't joining Wills on his next tour 'till a bit later on'.

Georgimama Thu 20-Oct-11 08:41:16

Am hoping for a Christmas baby announcement - I reckon she's upduffed too.

Dragging the thread reluctantly back to DA - I understand for purposes of plot why not, but really, why aren't Matthew and Lavinia married already? They've been engaged for 2 years and he has had at least 3 period of leave in that time. Has any actual explanation for protracted engagement been given? It just seems a bit daft - it's not as if he lacks money or prospects after all.

diddl Thu 20-Oct-11 08:48:52

I agree with that.

Was the point of Lavinia- to make Mary realise she does love Matthew?

Because she´d had two years thinking of nothing else from what it would seem-so why didn´t she just bloody tell him before?

And why would he have to become engaged for her to realise?

AKMD Thu 20-Oct-11 08:50:53

Aww, I hope so. I know it's terribly common to be a fan of the royals but... Not a huge fan of the Yorks though if that saves me? grin

Ok. DA.

Yes, the protracted engagements are very odd. Why isn't Mary married to Sir R yet? It's not like he went off to war. Matthew and Lavinia should indeed have been married by now. "Waiting until after the war" is a bit too convenient plot-wise. How do they know when it's going to be over? It could drag on for a few more years for all the know. I thought everyone was racing off to get married, eloping left, right and centre because of the war, not stringing it out.

I think it was the unspoken agreement that they'd "wait till all this is over" type of thing , then if he gets bumped orf she can find another.....

Also they weren't together at the time of the garden party when war was declared were they? So actually they've not been together, as in developing the relationship, that long, just over a period of years.

Oh dear I think I'm over-analysing it all again!!! blush

AKMD Thu 20-Oct-11 08:53:05

It wasn't until the episode just gone that I thought Matthew really loved Lavinia. When she turned up at the hospital and was greeted with 'my darling' I was wincing, thinking that he was going to follow that up with 'Mary' but NO shock It's also the first episode where Lavinia has worn nice clothes instead of the poorly-fitted odd outfits she normally has.

AKMD

Another common royalist here too....have to agree about the Yorks though. grin

AKMD Thu 20-Oct-11 08:53:42

They were together at the beginning of 1916 though. 2 years is a super-long engagement.

diddl Thu 20-Oct-11 08:57:58

"It wasn't until the episode just gone that I thought Matthew really loved Lavinia."

I thought that also.

Then it all went tits up & she was portrayed as immature & a bit hysterical I think.

To make Mary seem all calm & mature...

No, still don´t like her!

Yes but how many times in 2 years were they actually together alone?

He used to pass through on one of his cannon-fodder-gathering trips but they rarely had time time to themselves. (hark at me mother)

That said impulsive marriages were firing off all over the shop as you say, maybe the heir apparent to DA has to have a big society "do" not rush off to tie the knot, in case they all think they had to!

AKMD Thu 20-Oct-11 09:05:37

I would have thought that the heir apparent of DA would have found it imperative to get married and the future countess 'in the family way' just in case he died. Or lost his important bits... as happened. I'm sure plenty of poeple would have chugged up to York Minster if they had wanted to get married on a jaunt home. Previously unknown heir to a fabulously wealthy estate - oh yes, lots of people wanting to schmooze in there.

Georgimama Thu 20-Oct-11 09:25:20

From my detailed research Nancy Mitford the upper upper classes thought big society weddings pretty vulgar, they could have just married at local parish church in five minutes flat. And given precarious nature of succession he would indeed have wanted to get Lavinia upduffed asap. No the whole long Matthew/Lavinia engagement thing stretches credibility.i If they were married and she was sprogged and then he had died in the war the Crawley/Downton machine would have cared for her for the rest of her life.

Lavinia must die. It's the only solution.

grin I'd have bought a hat!!

MarthasHarbour Thu 20-Oct-11 09:30:15

YY my nanna and grandad had a hasty marriage in WW2 when he was home on leave, he then had to go back the next day sad they were married for a whopping 50 years though smile

is anyone else really unnerved by Sir Richards forehead? It really creeps me out, and the way he stands - like he has the biggest balls in the whole wide world hmm

AKMD Thu 20-Oct-11 09:39:39

Maybe he does.

I quite like Sir R. He and Mary would make a fanastic couple if she wasn't clearly in love with Matthew.

Georgimama Thu 20-Oct-11 09:50:52

I do find Sir R oddly hot I must confess. I thought it was actually quite funny (in a very wrong, controlling way obviously) that he put their engagement announcement in the paper the day after Mary threw herself on his mercy about Mrs Bates.

AKMD Thu 20-Oct-11 09:54:25

I thought Lord G's reaction was hilarious. I'm surprised the newspaper wasn't sprayed with tea and toast crumbs (or do they vacuum the toast downstairs to remove crumbs before it's served? [confused). He is really annoying this series.

MarthasHarbour Thu 20-Oct-11 10:17:33

haha - Lord G was rather a spitting buffoon at the breakfast table wasnt he?! er and yes georgiemama i am trying hard 'not' to fancy Sir Richard.....but he does have that look about him.

AKMD Thu 20-Oct-11 10:24:08

I'd marry Sir R if he was, um, real.

harrietthespook Thu 20-Oct-11 10:24:13

yep, thought Matthew loved her too this last episode. I really don't think Lavinia's gone for good. They were saying int he run up to the show: The audience will warm to her. But we haven't seen enough of her or them together to say. She just seems drippy to me and far too much like his mum. Gag. Yes, v strange they're not engaged. No credible explanation for that in terms of historic context. That was the only way they could really bonk as well. I think Matthew's a fan of bonking, mary's clearly a fan of bonking, Lavinia...well maybe she could do without the 'bedroom unpleasantness'. (queue theme of Series 3 - M & M furtive hall creeping shagging bonking away from the eyes of Sir R and L ...)

SIR R's NOT HOT by the way. Just saying.

I haven't been following Kate's latest. Check the name threads, I tell you.

AKMD Thu 20-Oct-11 10:27:07

He is though. Smart too.

Lavinia is poorly dressed can't talk, drippy and boring.

harrietthespook Thu 20-Oct-11 10:32:43

Yes smart.

ThePsychicSatsuma Thu 20-Oct-11 10:43:30

ok, my thinking on the long engagements was because the 'intendeds' were well aware they didnt really love each other, and wanted time for feelings to grow/ mature.

Matthew got engaged all of a sudden to Lav didnt he? Violet was most concerned about the unseemly hurried rush, and they all had nurtured secret hope of Mary...
if Lav moved in would lord g et al have to vamoose someplace else?

ThePsychicSatsuma Thu 20-Oct-11 10:44:05

vamoose. new word du jour.

ThePsychicSatsuma Thu 20-Oct-11 10:46:22

I thought Matthew was very tender with Lav in previous episodes; but she is definately a delicate flower who cannot be expected to deal with harsh reality except the bit where she was a spy bringing down scandal upon politicians...hobknobbing with all manner of dangerous men

she doesnt make sense as a character
on one hand hysterical and weak, the other, gritty and assertive?

I have confused myself*

*Not hard

harrietthespook Thu 20-Oct-11 10:52:41

no, your spot on. I don't buy it either.

harrietthespook Thu 20-Oct-11 10:53:24

but I can't see her as a convincing liar either - and that it's really all about shagging or summat the SIr R business.

She's a virgin.

AKMD Thu 20-Oct-11 10:57:30

Lavinia wouldn't move in until Lord G had popped his clogs so there would be no need to for him to vamoose! grin If the girls were still unmarried they would either move into the dower house with Cora or, if she had died, stay at DA at Matthew's expense.

I thought the look he gave Mary when she had come to tell him she was still madly in love with him, then bottled it, spoke volumes about what he felt about Lavinia. I think Lavinia is either extremely wet or a manipulative little madam who plays off her 'delicacy' to keep Mary in her place.

harrietthespook Thu 20-Oct-11 11:08:14

wait - you thought he gave her a lurve you look or not???

Georgimama Thu 20-Oct-11 11:08:43

Perhaps she will dump him next episode when the Canadian confusion makes it look (again!) like Matthew is not heir anymore - added to no funtimes she will be off. This could be what prompted the Mary/Matthew "I don't have to marry him you know" conversation in next week's trailer.....

AKMD Thu 20-Oct-11 11:26:49

He gave her a look like 'eh?' and then thought about it like 'OH! shock'. After that was when he started making a big point of talking about Lavinia and how kind everyone had been etc etc yuck. If I were him, I would hav been doing it to see how Mary reacted. IMO she's been a star; very discreet.

Georgimama Thu 20-Oct-11 11:37:35

Arf am re watching on itvplayer and Violet is on form isn't she: "when you give these little people a bit of power it goes to their heads like strong drink".

SoupDragon Thu 20-Oct-11 12:58:38

Sir Richard is a slimy little toad. I got the impression he didn't bail Mary out over the whole Pamuk/MrsBates thing out of love, he did it out of what hold it gave him over her.

AKMD Thu 20-Oct-11 13:27:53

He's always made it very clear that their marriage is in the style of a business transaction though. Mary knows exactly what she's getting herself into.

josephinebonaparte Thu 20-Oct-11 14:19:20

Sir R looks like he would be filthy in the sack

Georgimama Thu 20-Oct-11 14:23:28

Yes there is that I think.

harrietthespook Thu 20-Oct-11 14:30:27

Filthy literally: "get back out of bed and brush your teeth." sort of filthy.

Risk is: summons the valet to help, returns, and mistress has fallen into a slumber.

Gives me the heebies, I so wouldn't.

Fragrant Matthew on the other hand. Is tehre anyone who doesn't think he's lovely out there?

AKMD Thu 20-Oct-11 14:34:48

No, he's very well groomed.

'Fragrant' Matthew grin I do wonder if he's going to end up bitter and twisted a' la guy in the Secret Garden. If so, run, Mary, run!

harrietthespook Thu 20-Oct-11 14:39:20

Let's hope not. Again: would JF really risk all the 'Cougars' out there switching off? grin

limitedperiodonly Thu 20-Oct-11 14:40:33

Me harriet, me. I keep saying that Matthew has unnervingly goaty eyes.

He would be acceptable however, if he was blinded by mustard gas like that poor chap who killed himself and wore a blindfold.

That would be a more acceptable war wound to someone who didn't have to work for a living and had a driver, albeit a chippy one, than having your willy rendered unresponsive.

Besides, many couples find blindfolds and other utensils an exciting part of lovemaking.

Not me, though. With me and MrLtd it's strictly lights off, nightie up, knickers down.

harrietthespook Thu 20-Oct-11 14:45:05

What are 'goaty' eyes.

limitedperiodonly Thu 20-Oct-11 14:47:31
josephinebonaparte Thu 20-Oct-11 14:51:22

Sir Richard looks very well groomed blush

harrietthespook Thu 20-Oct-11 15:19:19

I SEE Limited.

(Imagines what it would be like to be that gorgeous and it's still not enough for some people.)

wink

AKMD Thu 20-Oct-11 15:20:01

limited that was waaaay more than I wanted to know love envysmile

How long do yo think it would take Branson to decide the only way to make a headline would be to drive the blind Matthew into a river?

Orlando Thu 20-Oct-11 16:20:54

I find Matthew slightly too weak of chin. Picky I know, and not kind in view of what's happened to him. I also suspect he may have been subconsciously drawn to William because of he was so overly-endowed in the chin department. Just my theory.

limitedperiodonly Thu 20-Oct-11 17:21:46

That's an interesting theory orlando.

Dan Stevens should breed with Jennifer Aniston or Reese Witherspoon and then they would stand a chance of producing offspring with relatively normal chins rather than weak or the kind you could dig graves with.

I think it was for the best that Brad and Jen split up when they did otherwise they'd have founded a Habsburg-type dynasty that ultimately would have starved without the use of specialised tools to eat.

Georgimama Thu 20-Oct-11 17:32:25

Yes I did giggle when Matthew and William lying in the ditch faded to the moon over Downton - Matthew's head was the moon for a moment. Wrong head.

limitedperiodonly Thu 20-Oct-11 17:38:29

The evil chauffeur driving his helpless boss into a raging river is a silent movie staple AKMD right up there with tying people to railway lines.

It's 1918. Branson and Matthew could move to Hollywood, team up with Max Sennett and make a fortune.

Obviously to preserve the pretence Matthew would have to dress up as Mary Pickford at all times, which might be a bit of a drag. Thomas would probably like it though.

ThePsychicSatsuma Thu 20-Oct-11 22:00:34

<shaking laughing at digging graves with chinbones>

Aniston.You have a lumberjack's chin.

Orlando Thu 20-Oct-11 22:03:59

Oh yes limitedperiod, absolutely with you on the selective breeding. You see, it's interesting. In the early 1900s they were preoccupied with finding an advantageous social match, whereas we are more on top of putting people of complementary bone structure together. That's progress for you.

This thread is infamous! grin

Mentioned twice in MN newsletter dispatches

& Limited you win quote of the week.....huzzah!!

Georgimama Fri 21-Oct-11 07:37:36

Getting back to my ishooos with JF's snatching of plots - he's even doing it with dialogue. "at moments of crisis I never seem to have a hankerchief" - that's what Rhett Butler said about Scarlett O'Hara. I'm so onto you JF.

Georgimamma grin you are a pedant after my own heart!!

AKMD Fri 21-Oct-11 08:38:48

Quite apart from plagiarism, that line was spectacularly clunky.

ThePsychicSatsuma Fri 21-Oct-11 09:36:26

quite. a twatty little flibbertygibbet like lav would have a hanky in every crevice.

ThePsychicSatsuma Fri 21-Oct-11 09:37:32

<applauds> georgimama at quote recognition.
you have the skillz that thrillz mi'lady

mrszimmerman Fri 21-Oct-11 09:40:50

what was Limited's quote of the week? I missed that.

How many episodes left?

Did you see they're filming a blardy Xmas Special?
Do you think Lady Mary will open a Xmas present on Matthew's lap and inside it will have his trouser snake erectus covered in tinsel and he can say: "surprise! It works once a year at the Yule Tide! Merry Christmas My Darling!"

Sorry....
blush
brew

Longtime Fri 21-Oct-11 10:03:35

It's a shame there's no "like" button on mumsnet mrsz smile

mrszimmerman Fri 21-Oct-11 10:13:24

love you longtime! grin thanks

Longtime Fri 21-Oct-11 10:16:55

Awww, thanks mrsz, that's the first time anyone's ever said that to me on mumsnet grin !

mrszimmerman Fri 21-Oct-11 11:28:38

And it's the truth!!

Longtime Fri 21-Oct-11 11:45:37

grin grin grin

alemci Fri 21-Oct-11 11:57:52

My dh made me laugh. He came in and I said Matthew has been wounded. "Oh has his willy fallen off".

It seemed to be a week of impotence after seeing 'Broken glass' Arthur Miller in London the same week

limitedperiodonly Fri 21-Oct-11 12:05:15

It's taken me ages to post because I kept checking in the hope that someone would repost my excellent comment so I didn't look vain.

But sod modesty. I must know and I must know now.

LadyHarrietDeSpook Fri 21-Oct-11 14:24:43

so where is the quote then?

HermanMumster Fri 21-Oct-11 14:53:59

yy, where? I shot to the Round-up but no go.

We should be 99% of the Round-up really.

MarthasHarbour Fri 21-Oct-11 15:56:07

Was it the 'lights out nightie up knickers down' one? Made me snurk wink

spongefingeranyone Fri 21-Oct-11 15:57:07

Tis this: limitedperiodonly frets about the direction Downton Abbey's plot is taking: "The dawn of a new era is one thing but how beastly if poor Lady Mary is forced to assemble flatpack furniture after a hellish Sunday afternoon with Sir Richard at Ikea."

Addictive thread, much like DA. Roll on Sunday!

Saltire Fri 21-Oct-11 17:15:04

limitedperiodonlyThu 20-Oct-11 14:40:33

Besides, many couples find blindfolds and other utensils an exciting part of lovemaking.

It's this comment of Limitedperiodonly that made me giggle - the mind boggles at the use of utensils - like a wooden spoon or a spatula, or one of those oldhand whisks wink

limitedperiodonly Fri 21-Oct-11 17:26:57

Oh thanks. I've gone all shy now blush

ThePsychicSatsuma Fri 21-Oct-11 21:09:29

<brandishes shoehorn>

<dh runs away into the night>