16 year old ds determined to screw up educationally - school won't let it go

[mizzscarlett]

.. and I'm dreading the next year.

He's determinedly underperformed the whole way through secondary - not doing homework, arguing with teachers, and then last year not bothering to turn up for some of his mocks.

He's just started in year 11 and the letters/texts have started to come from school, again.

Clearly the school (a decent comp) are determined not to let him fail without a fight on their part, but he's determined to self-sabotage for no reason known to us, them, and probably him.

I'm thinking about the year ahead and almost wishing the school would write him off, as I suspect the end result will be the same. If he won't work he won't work, and he'll fail. He's choosing to fail, while everyone around him busts their chops to try to stop it happening.

I feel guilty that our clever but determined to fail child is taking up so much of his teachers' time and energy and so, so resentful. The more we all try, and the more he metaphorically sticks two fingers up at us, the more I dislike him.

Has anyone else been through a GCSE year with a child like this, someone who can give me some tips for coping emotionally while watching helplessly as their child screws up?

Oh gosh, and we're supposed to be looking for colleges for him.... what sort of educational establishment wants to offer a place to a child who's got such a poor school record and doesn't seem inclined to change?

[constantlyconfused]

I'm not in GCSE year yet but i feel your pain completely DD 14 is the same. I am getting seriously sick of hearing from her school (every bloody day) since last December and yes that is EVERY day. Then i have to speak to DD about whatever the issue is then we argue as you can't converse with her unless she screams and rants. I have had enough . She will leave school with nothing already been told . She doesn't even attempt work and doesn't seem to give a crap if she is sanctioned she doesn't care for rewards either. Impossible.

[SilverStars]

Hi, sounds a frustrating situation. Would taking him around colleges and looking at courses he may be interested in, help him at all? If he knows he needs certain grades to do a course he would rather do, instead of the onky ones which will accept him? as a school with 6th form, including his own if it has one, is unlikely to accept him.

Am sure you have tried all sanctions - no allowance/money ( as good grades can equal good jobs and good money, no grades can mean no spare money to spend), no mobile phone, no Internet - as responsibility for school work can be rewarded etc.

[Bunbaker]

When SIL was a teenager and wanted to leave school before O levels MIL arranged for her to get a waitressing job so that she could experience what type of job she could get with no qualifications.

It worked.

[threepiecesuite]

Could you write a slightly altered version of your first post, to him? It really struck a chord with me.
It sounds like a difficult situation. I teach many kids like this who scrape into 6th form and then suddenly grow up and thrive and turn it around so have hope, and kudos to the school for throwing everything at it.

[Heyho111]

Some kids hate studying, hate the regime of school, just hate school life full stop.
Could he access councelling to help him understand his thoughts.
You could possibly be right. Step back and let him be.
Colleges offer BTEC's. These can take you to uni. They are a different way of learning. It's more In tune with jobs. No exams. Some kids much prefer to learn that way.
Perhaps encourage a weekend job to make him feel valued.
The more you and school fight him the worse he could get. It's a shame school can't just have a chat with him and say ' you ok?'

[ancientbuchanan]

I support the counselling step. Do you know why he hates it so much? Is he being bullied? Quite possible even at this age. Is there a teacher who has made his life a misery? Is he into drugs or alcohol?

Or as others have said, does he prefer a vocational style? Could he do 3 days at school, 2 at college? Take up an apprenticeship now? He can always pick up academic qualifications later, esp if he is bright.

Yours is the third such story I have heard, the other two in RL. In both cases the young man has been transformed by leaving school and following something of his, not his parents', choice.

In both cases the parents are great, it's not s criticism of them.

[mizzscarlett]

Not being bullied (we have dug and dug on this one, talked to teachers, friends etc - no hint of bullying).

Doesn't even specially dislike school - has lots of friends. Just won't do the work. Won't do homework. Won't revise for exams. At all.

School have been very supportive and up until this year tried as much as possible to reduce/remove sanctions for not working so as to stop things escalating.

But he has GCSE's at the end of this year - there is no escape. He's already been moved into foundation sets for several core subjects. I'm gutted - teachers have described him as A* material for maths and English (based on small amount of work done in class, and now the most he'll be able to get is a C.

Apprenticeships and BTECH's are the way to go, but I feel quite sad about it. I'm not sure it's what he wants, and I can't imagine any good college particularly wanting him, given the sheer volume of work involved in doing a BTECH, and his shit record on completing coursework, and getting to school on time.

[Heyho111]

I would try councelling. Try to avoid councelling through school as he will associate it with his issue. Most areas have youth councellors you can access out of school in a youth community centre. Or pay private if that's feasible.
Sometimes the penny drops with boys close to the exams. My lad only started to study in the summer term. Cross fingers that will happen with you.

[headlesslambrini]

Dont right off the colleges. All the open evenings are starting around October. Take him he might just see something which he wants to do.

If he already knows what career he wants then arrange some work experience for him. Look up job adverts for the career and show him what employers are asking for - qualification wise. Share with him how much money your household income is so he can get a baseline for how much he needs to earn in order to keep his current lifestyle.

[Cheeky76890]

What interests and inspires him?

[Cheeky76890]

Has he said why he doesn't want to work

[Northernsoul58]

Step back and trust the school, they sound brilliant and they know what they are doing, it's their job and he's not the first...
Agree with bunbaker. If there's a way to demonstrate to him what an unskilled job is really like, that may shake him up a bit. Is it possible for you to change your script and instead of talking about college, talk about what mundane jobs he could do for the rest of his life, and offer to apply for jobs for him. I don't mean you would actually end up doing this, it's just that if your expectations suddenly reflect his own lack of ambition, it might just jolt him out of the defensive anger he's built around himself.

[McGlashan]

If there's a way to demonstrate to him what an unskilled job is really like, that may shake him up a bit. Is it possible for you to change your script and instead of talking about college, talk about what mundane jobs he could do for the rest of his life

Couldn't agree more with this. My cousin was like your son- very bright but lazy and determined he wasn't going to do any work. Took a sort of pride in it. So he left grammar school at 16 and went to do an apprenticeship. Still the big man. His brother went to university and he saw what a ball he was having. Then his friends started leaving university and getting interesting reasonably well paid jobs.
He by this point was doing a boring minimum wage job and being left behind by his peers. He realised he'd cocked up and went back to college and then on to University and although he still hated doing the work but he could actually see the point to it. He graduated and got a fantastic job.
Your son needs to see the lifelong consequences of fucking up his GCSE's.

[CatCushion]

Not my own child, but another close family friend has been through/going through something similar.

Getting turned off academic work can be for a number of reasons.

Teenagers can look at the way a school is run and be turned off academic work because they lose respect for teachers when they see their peers are badly treated. If they see the system is flawed, they lose interest in wanting to help the system work. Even if it hurts them personally. Teens like an opportunity to be a hero and for some, doing badly at school work gives them a feeling that they are doing somwone else a favour. Within this, there is a seed of low self esteem and self harm which needs looking at, as well as other outlets for ways to take risks or help people. Voluntary work, non competative team sports, community projects and part time work can really help. You'd think that taking up their free time would be disastrous, but it can be what saves them. Getting them involved in something like a town sports club or family business, something with a functioning all age community outside of school, can help them put school into the right context for the rest of their lives.

There have been some studies showing that thinking about sex affects grades. As a parent, this makes me squirm a bit but we have to face up to the fact that they have feelings that they don't want to talk to us about and they need to find a way to keep their minds on their work. Co-ed comprehensives are not generally great at awknowledging this and it can be very hard for some teenagers to deal with it. Do the lads and lasses sit separately in your son's GCSE classes, or are they mixed up? Does he have a girlfriend?

Today's teenagers have more MH problems than in previous years, and the NHS cannot cope with them all. Getting help can be very hard. There is a lot a parent can do to help. Just reading up on how to help and be a supportive listener without being judgemental is a great start. (Hard when it is your own child, I know.)

[YeGodsAndLittleFishes]

DD did her work experience at a place where they offer apprenticeships. She nearly died of boredom. She has a couple of friends who underperformed and are now working very long hours, on poor pay, doing apprenticeships. They are making it work for them, they lost faith in schools as a route to learning.

[Abilly72]

Almost impossible to deal with..how about a totally new approach?
Tell him you just do not care about school,exams,college,future jobs because you and your family will not be affected by him totally messing up his education..whatever may happen tell him you and the rest of the familywill be ok and will continue to live a normal life.Whatever the outcome of the situation tell him it will be his life that will be forever affected/ruined as you and family will not forever give him the necessities of life and/or money.Really emphasise that you will not stand in his way...and whilst you will always love him and care for him even after he is eighteen and responsible for himself..it is his life and future he is throwing away.Yes you will be disappointed but it is his life and if that is what he really want then so be it.
If you continue to deal with it as thought it is your life that is the centre of things he will not change..make sure he knows and understands that it will be his future ruined not yours.

[soddinghormones]

We have a very bright but spectacularly lazy ds1 who did manage to salvage his GCSEs by working his so is off after Easter but it was touch and go

He swore blind he'd learned his lesson and started sixth form with high hopes all round but within weeks had slipped back into not completing homework, skipping the odd lesson and generally being an arse

His teachers are bending over backwards to get him through his IB with a semblance of the grade of which he's capable but he seems determined to be mediocre

Nothing seems to get through to him - I think the reality of his situation will only hit home when all his friends start moving on and he's left behind (he's refusing to apply for uni courses and I actually think he's right as if he started he'd just drop out without a major change in attitude/work ethic)

So no advice here, just sympathy

[noblegiraffe]

Is there a male role-model not in the immediate family that could talk to him?

Has he got a half-arsed idea about what he'll do when he messes up his exams and can't get into sixth form? I agree that it's time to start properly researching those options. Hopefully he'll realise that he doesn't want to resit maths and English at Mediocre College halfway across town and pull his finger out, or come up with some sort of reasonable plan. But he does need to be made to think seriously about his future and plan for it. End of Y11 isn't that far away.

[Northernsoul58]

Catcushion, really well explained. Thanks. I agree with Abilly72, but perhaps not so much of the 'you have ruined your life' and more 'that's an interesting life choice your'e making, let us know how it turns out for you'. Be as neutral as possible about his behaviour choices but remain totally engaged with him on an emotional level.

[Oneeyedbloke]

I genuinely can't see how all this 'ruining your life' stuff is going to help. Teenagers get a lot of that kind of stuff at school already. Every test or mock is super-serious; I'm not sure I wouldn't have rebelled myself if I'd got all that pressure when I was at school. His life will not be 'ruined' by not getting good qualifications at 16, and I think it's rather unkind, not to mention counterproductive, to tell him that. It will be made very different, and in some respects more difficult but not everyone is suited to - or likes - academic work. So I would say the emphasis has to be on making sure he understands the route he's taking, even if he's taking it haphazardly.

My ds2 was like this after GCSEs. Always been quite lazy but had taken enough on board to get reasonable grades without any revision. Then afterwards, downhill big time, skipping lessons, a forest of letters home, meetings with teachers. Almost complete failure of A-levels.

The reasons, apart from natural indolence? Well, all kids are different but mainly:
â?¢ Disillusionment with the school (the head really was awful, the teachers were hacked off & the kids picked up on that - result, lack of respect).
â?¢ Too much video gaming.
â?¢ Poor sleeping patterns: staying up too late. You can send 'em to bed but you can't make 'em sleep.
â?¢ Concentrating almost exclusively on the one subject he liked: art. And not schoolwork, either, his own stuff.
â?¢ Self-consciousness: overweight.

Answers/strategies? I would say, find out, as calmly as you can manage, what he wants to do - if anything. If there is something, help him towards it. If it involves academic qualifications, point out the obvious; if it doesn't, don't freak. You want him to be happy, right? Exam passes really are not the only route to happiness, or even to success.

If there's nothing, explain that he'll be expected to get a job. Don't make it sound like a punishment; just the normal consequence of not being in full-time education and still living under his parents' roof.

Take it easy, though, OP. I've been there & you have my every sympathy, it's no fun getting the letters & dealing with the fallout. And I totally get how disappointed this is making you feel. But, I'm sorry, you do sound as if you believe academic exams represent the one & only route to success in life. They don't. Maybe he senses how important it is to you and that might explain some of his attitude? Teenagers are brilliant at working out what you want & then doing the exact opposite.

For the record, after his A-levels fiasco my ds2 did a year's art foundation course & it motivated him to apply to uni (lucky for him they go mostly on quality of portfolio). I think most kids go through an I-don't-give-a-damn phase with education, some have it early on, some later on. I had it at uni, totally flunked it. I'm now a happy audio engineer - a trade not a profession (don't think the word vocation is accurate). And who makes the best audio engineer - a graduate or someone who's had practical experience & a hands-on BTEC-type course? Don't despair; please don't dislike your own DS because he's not following the route you hoped. Behind the moodiness, almost certainly, is a kid who's lost his way.

[Liara]

He obviously feels trapped by the path that has been drawn out for him - he needs to figure out what he wants to do.

I was like that at that age - then I decided that I wanted to go to Oxbridge, put all that angry energy into doing what I needed to get there and did.

But that was my choice, and that's what it worked. No one else wanted me to go there, if they had I would probably have rebelled against that too!

[YeGodsAndLittleFishes]

I think there might be more to teenage rebellion. Rather than doing the opposite of what parents want, I think it could be an urge to improve on the previous generation, and to do that they sometimes have to look at parents' flaws and misconceptions and prove them wrong, or at least improve on what has gone before.