I can't cope

(82 Posts)
Shagmundfreud Tue 23-Apr-13 09:08:09

It all seems to have reached a head for me today. Mentally. I can't stop crying and feel completely hopeless about dd.

She does what she wants and nothing I say makes any difference. She is abusive towards me - physically and emotionally.

This morning I have found that I'm unable to parent my other two children. I feel used up and want to go to bed, pull the duvet over my head and stay there all day.

I just needed to say that.

Shagmundfreud Tue 23-Apr-13 14:10:06

Apparently the next time we call them they will take her down the station.

At some point in the next 2 or 3 years she will be looking for work experience, probably in child care or in social care of some sort. I wonder if they will CRB her and if so will this show up (as it would be an enhanced CRB maybe?).

Tortington Tue 23-Apr-13 14:15:18

that's for her to consider - you shouldn't be assaulted AND consider her future,

TheRealFellatio Tue 23-Apr-13 14:15:35

Yes ok, sorry - I missed that right at the bottom of the post ans I didn't realise there were repeated physical attacks, I thought you were just talking about the 'threats' and 'bullying' you mentioned.

Is it just you she is like this with or does she do it at school and out in public as well?

Tortington Tue 23-Apr-13 14:16:21

"Dd if you assault me again, I will call the police and they will press charges.

This may affect a DBS check in the future - this is for you to consider before assaulting me, because I will not be assaulted"

fair warning

Badvoc Tue 23-Apr-13 14:16:33

Shagmund.
At some point she has to take responsibility for her actions.
You have a right to feel safe in your own home.
If is was a man physically assaulting someone, what would you advise?
I don't know about the enhanced crb I'm afraid.
14 is old enough to know right from wrong.

Badvoc Tue 23-Apr-13 14:18:48

If her behaviour is bad at school and she refuses to work how will she get the grades needed and/or good reports?
She will need those to follow her career choice too, surely?

Shagmundfreud Tue 23-Apr-13 14:43:42

"14 is old enough to know right from wrong."

This is what I keep coming back to. sad

"If her behaviour is bad at school and she refuses to work how will she get the grades needed"

You only need 5 gcse's to get onto a childcare course.

She is very bright and will probably scrape a handful of c's at GCSE if she simply turns up for the exams. At the moment she is going to school most days she does some work in some lessons. If she feels like it. She does no homework to speak of.

Badvoc Tue 23-Apr-13 14:54:21

I do feel for you.
Really.
But that is what I would keep coming back to too.
Also, and please dont take this the wrong way as childcare is one of the most important jobs in the world, but is she going for childcare because she can do very little work at school, get the min GCSE passes and still get a - perhaps as she sees it - easy job? Or has it always been her dream?
I could be way off the mark here of course but childcare does seem to attract very young school leavers who haven't got great exam passes sad
The turnover is also very high ime.

Maryz Tue 23-Apr-13 17:27:57

custardo is absolutely right about the violence.

No-one should put up with being attacked in their own home. There are a fair few of us here atm who have reported our children to the police (yes even at 13/14 - in fact the younger the better as they are likely to get a fright, but avoid a record).

Few of us have had to do it more than once. Often just knowing we will do it is enough.

Shag, you can't carry on like this - it's exhausting. Believe me, I know I have been exactly where you are and still am at times.

You need to separate what you can deal with from what you can't. And stop desperately trying to control things you can't control. You might as well get up every morning and bash your head against a brick wall for they day.

You need to take a step back, detach from her behaviour, and be nice to yourself. Rebuild yourself as a person (counselling helped me), and rebuild your relationship with your other children.

If while you are doing that you need to let her go a bit, then do. If that means her staying with your mum, let her. If that means "giving up", well you might just have to. For the greater good of the whole family in the long run.

It is easy for people who haven't been there to say "apply the rules, be rigid, make her do whatever". In practice sometimes you just can't.

Maryz Tue 23-Apr-13 17:31:53

Oh, another thing: in the greater scheme of things her education is not the most important thing. Let the school deal with her schoolwork, with disciplining her if she doesn't do homework or is late. Keep your battles only for things that happen at home, and things that you are actually physically able to deal with.

Cut out as much as you possibly can in the way of "petty" rules and stick to a few: No Violence; Go to School (or at least leave the house) every day; No Touching the younger children.

Don't argue with her or discuss things; she can't argue if you refuse to respond.

And go and talk to your gp - family counselling helped me a lot, even though ds refused to go. And I ended up on anti-depressants which I really, really didn't want to do but which have helped a lot.

Shagmundfreud Tue 23-Apr-13 18:17:31

I don't want to go back on antidepressants but after today I may have to.

I have very, very few rules.

The ones she is supposed to adhere to at the moment are these:

no violence
go to school
be on time for school
do your homework
tell us where you are if you are not at home or at school.
hand over your phone at 10pm on a school night and go to bed.

Don't think those are unreasonable. I don't check her homework or try and make her sit down at home and work. That is long gone. There are no sanctions for not doing school work other than those the school are prepared to implement. We are so beyond that.

Badvoc Tue 23-Apr-13 18:24:11

I think they are all perfectly reasonable - apart from the homework one.
As Mary says, let school deal with that.
I am more concerned for your younger dd sad

Maryz Tue 23-Apr-13 18:36:09

No, they aren't unreasonable (but give up on the homework for the moment), but you can't enforce them all so you have to accept that.

You can enforce the violence one. And you can refuse to return her phone (or pay credit) if she breaks the handover at 10 pm one, but only if you don't mind her not having a phone. I gave up on the phone one at one stage, simply because I reckoned it would be useful way to find him if he disappeared completely.

You can just state the rules and walk away, refuse to discuss. Repeatedly and unemotionally.

I know for a fact that ds used to try to make me get cross, because if he could get me to lose my temper he could take the high ground (he would simply repeat "stop shouting at me" even when I was talking quietly so that eventually I would have to shout, and then he had won). Having made me lose my temper he could then justify walking out/not doing what he was told etc.

Minimise the damage she can do at home, too. Lock your bedroom door and lock away money and valuables - it is a great relief to know for sure that things are safe.

At one stage we had three rules. No violence. Send a text if you are going to stay out overnight. Go to school. We could only enforce one of them.

Ledkr Tue 23-Apr-13 18:36:43

Oh goodness I remember this with ds1 I have seriously never been through anything so awful. He didn't attack me but stole practically everything I own to sell for weed. I had dubious people turn up at my house for money,threats to petrol bomb my house on Xmas eve and a cheque taken out of my book and cashed for two hundred pounds.
The younger children couldn't even have birthday money without it going missing.
I kicked him out at 16 I just couldn't do it anymore. We helped from a distance and he's been back from time to time.
He's 27 now can't keep a job and I live in fear of him coming home again if he loses his flat.
I work with troubled teens but don't have the answers I mostly give the parents a sounding board and try to get the kids to see sense.
Is she using any drugs?
Are her periods out if the ordinary?
What have camhs done already?
Was there any birth or post birth trauma or any binding problems?
I hope you don't mind the questions but I want to ask a couple of colleagues where you go from here?
Pm me if you like and ill have a think.
I actually do sometimes suggest the police for violence but dh is police and disagrees.

where does she want to be? i have been there done that with my dd, turning point for me was when she turned 16 andi just told her to leave if she did not want to be here, i started locking door if she was not home by 9pm during week, she soon found out she did want to be here and thank god has been a changed teenager the last year. Cahms were no help for me but school were v supportive and she has a mentor there. the police arrested my dd when she was 14 after she punched me and knocked out my tooth, i actually slapped her back for the first time and then social servicers got invloved they were really good.if she cant behave do not give her any money, clothes ect, that worked for my dd and taking away hr laptop and phone made her behave for a bit...its hard i feel for you x

oh and forget the homework rule thats not your problem that is up to her and the school, if you are dealing with issues at home, school work is the last thing you want to argue about , she will get detention at at school for not doing.

You poor thing - what a horrible time you are having.

I want to add my voice to those who are saying that you can call the police. I spent a long time avoiding that road because I didn't want my DS to have a criminal record but, actually it turned out to be absolutely the right thing to do. The police were great and it showed him how serious we were.

mindfulmum Tue 23-Apr-13 20:12:16

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Sommink Tue 23-Apr-13 20:46:00

Shagmund

I was a horrible dd to my mum. I was never violent but I was mean and I was nasty. She has never said so but I know she was on anti-depressants for a while and that was probably due to the way I treated her. I was good at school, always did what I was told and tried very hard but not with her.

I just wanted you to know that I now have a fantastic relationship with her. She is my rock (much more then my dad and I was still am a daddy's girl) she never let me down, she yelled at me, went to school about me, tried to get me counselling (which I refused) and has always wanted what's best for me.

I realised and have spoken to her about my behaviour as I have grown up. The conclusion I reached was I was struggling with lots of issues at the time (being tested for genetic diseases, watching family member die of said disease, bullying to name a few) non of this is an excuse but I think I used my mum to vent. I knew she would yell and shout but that gave me the opportunity to yell and shout and scream and get rid of all the feelings I was hiding inside.

I am not saying this is what is happening to you, and in no way should your dd be violent towards you, just wanted you to know that you may still have the relationship you want with your daughter and I hope things get better for you all

Maryz Wed 24-Apr-13 10:53:29

How are things this morning Shag?

Shagmundfreud Wed 24-Apr-13 10:54:23

Quick update:

DH arrived home with flowers, chocolate, champagne and a takeaway for our anniversary, which cheered me up no end, and by the time I went to bed I was feeling better.

DD went out to a friend's house after school - she did phone and tell me for once, because she had been told to by DH. She got back at 6pm and immediately said that she wanted to go out again to buy ice-lollies. I didn't say no as I knew it would cause a row and I wasn't up to it (this was before DH had got home), so off she went again, and didn't get back until after 7. She had been to a friend's house before going to Sainsbury's. She came back with two boxes of ice lollies - I have no idea where she got the money from to buy them as I haven't been giving her any.

So on a school night, with homework to do, she was out from school finishing at 3.20, until 7pm. She will do it again tonight.

The bottom line is - she either lies to get her own way, or becomes verbally abusive and behaves in an intimidating way to try and force the issue if she has been told 'no'.

I have done with standing up to her - I'm not willing to say 'no' to her any more if it results in bullying and personal abuse.

So I have a 13 year old in my house who has no sense of personal responsibility, who is lazy, dishonest and bullying, who is basically going to do what she wants, when she wants. And who will trample over any one who gets in her way.

I feel completely grim about it and am having to discipline myself not to think about it, otherwise I just want to cry.

Maryz Wed 24-Apr-13 11:02:56

You can't change her attitude, you can only change how you react to it.

I remember coming home one night at about midnight when I was 18, and finding my 16 year old brother sitting on the wall in the bitter cold in a t-shirt. When I asked he what he was doing he said "they said I had to be in by 11 so I'm damn well not going in until at least midnight". It became a fight that he was determined to win. I used to remind myself of that when ds1 was like your dd.

Rules, regulations, threats, consequences aren't working. And they are killing you. Sometimes you have to accept that for everyone's sake you have to step away, so why not just take a step back. Let your dh deal with her for a bit. Just detach, detach, detach and try to get yourself back on an even keel.

Come and join us all on the horrible teenagers thread - there is some fantastic support there even if it is a bit depressing at times. And Flow has put some great posts on the first thread here

PeterParkerSays Wed 24-Apr-13 11:16:05

Shagmund how does she behave at your mum's? You asked upthread whether your daughter ca help acting as she does - if she changes her behaviour because her dad asks, or at your mum's, then she can help it, she's just reacting to you.

MoaneyMcmoanmoan Wed 24-Apr-13 11:35:00

You have got some great advice here. Here. You deserve these: flowers

Maryz advice of detaching is excellent, and tbh it is the only way I manage to get through with DD. I too have a challenging 13-year-old and to detach when it all starts to get too much, I ignore her.
Not deliberately and obviously ignoring that she would notice, but if I see her I try to fool myself that she is not there, if you know what I mean.
If I 'see' her, I straight away start thinking of all the issues we are having.
Of course, if she asks me a question or speaks to me, I respond, but otherwise, I try not to engage her in conversation when I know it will end in a fight.
Other times when she is being very challenging, I blush blush pretend I am on some documentary about parenting teenagers. It helps me be careful in what I say. That's what I do when we're in the car and she starts having a go at me. This happens a lot. I don't know what it is about car journeys and arguments.
Anyway, the pretendy documentary thing is a tad humiliating to admit, but it works for me.

MoaneyMcmoanmoan Wed 24-Apr-13 11:37:04

Wanted to add, I only 'ignore' her when she is being particularly argumentative, to avoid the fights.

Ignore is bad word to use for it as it smacks of abuse. I think 'disengage' is better.

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