Mumsnetters aren't necessarily qualified to help if your child has special needs. If you have any serious concerns, we would urge you to consult your GP or other suggested organisations that offer expert advice on SN

Mumsnet/KIDS support session on special needs and education: THIS THURSDAY, 9pm

(111 Posts)
RowanMumsnet (MNHQ) Wed 23-May-12 09:45:54

Hello there,

We're pleased to announce that the second support session with members of KIDS staff will be held this Thursday evening between 9pm amd 10pm (in the hope that this will avoid most kids' bed-times!). The topic for Thursday's session will be education and related issues. (You can see the first session here.)

KIDS is a national charity working with disabled children, young people and their families across England. The KIDS staff at the session will be Sue Cawkwell (KIDS Regional Director for Yorkshire and Lincolnshire), and SEN specialists Rosemary Foster and Dave Lison.

The idea of these support sessions is to complement the advice and support that Special Needs posters already give each other with the insight and experience of people working for an organisation in the field. We hope that the session will pull together perspectives and advice from MNers and from KIDS staff, and that the thread will serve as a reference point for posters looking for advice about SEN.

It would be great to have as many of you as possible join us 'live' on Thursday evening, but if you can't make it, please also post up any advance questions for here.

We'd really appreciate your feedback on these sessions, so if you can find the time to fill in a survey after the session, that would be great - it's open to lurkers as well as posters - to everyone who has seen the thread.

Thanks,
MNHQ

r3dh3d Thu 24-May-12 11:41:24

Not sure if I can make this or not, so pre-posting a question:

Am having issues with the law and guidance around medical absence.

Briefly, DD1 is at a SLD/PMLD school and has medical needs. They are intermittent and varying. There is a new school nurse who from what I can see isn't used to the degree of need in the school and increasingly DD1 is being sent home in the middle of the day as "too ill" to attend. My view is that she is not "ill" as such, this is part of her disability and if we don't educate her when her condition is affecting her like this then we don't educate her at all.

School are usually pretty good and I think we can thrash this out together if we can put the decision of whether she should be in school or not on a more objective footing. But I can find virtually no DfE or legal guidance about the school's right to take a decision about her fitness for school, or what form that process should take. Is there precedent?

UnCharteredromaeosaur Thu 24-May-12 11:42:18

how timely...can i have the session all to myself please angry

obvs i know this isn't possible so...

what should a parent do if it's becoming more obvious that the SENCO has very little understanding of your child's diagnosed condition?

lisad123 Thu 24-May-12 11:42:46

Sotheby's government know they are failing children with SN in early life by forcing them into mainstream schools and their funding cuts for transport. Why is it so hard to get a statement and who is the best source of support when applying?

Vagaceratops Thu 24-May-12 12:15:56

Marking my place for this evening.

Marking spot.

Marking my place too.

Me too. Not sure if I can make it but the reason isn't daily logistics or anything.

lionheart Thu 24-May-12 14:28:03

Will try. smile

insanityscratching Thu 24-May-12 14:34:46

will try to be here x

HotheadPaisan Thu 24-May-12 14:38:56

I'm in - there is a test case imminent on whether Academies can refuse entry to children with SEN, this is a hugely important issue as many more schools will become Academies - www.ipsea.org.uk/news/hot-topics/can-academies-refuse-statemented-children.aspx.aspx

Rowan, please can you sticky or link this is SN: Children too please.

HotheadPaisan Thu 24-May-12 14:40:45

It would be good to discuss the new SEN Green paper too.

coff33pot Thu 24-May-12 16:37:52

Marking my spot

SueCawkwell Thu 24-May-12 18:55:05

Test

DaveLison Thu 24-May-12 18:56:03

Test

ohmeohmy Thu 24-May-12 19:00:40

I am concerned over the Green Paper too.

Other issues in Herts, there is a push from the County to send any child who achieves level 1 back to mainstream. Apparently this hasn't been trumpeted as official policy but is what the heads are being told. I see this as punishing SN kids for their achievement and would expect a rapid decline in many cases. It will be left to individuals to appeal with all that entails. I think it is criminal they are prepared to experiment with our children's lives in this way. How can parents put pressure on them to rescind this when they won't even admit it is policy?

This area is generally secretive about what the procedures are, apparently parents will not be offered SN schooling, they must ask for it before it is even discussed. They are not being told the options available to them.

RosemaryFoster Thu 24-May-12 19:01:56

Test

RowanMumsnet (MNHQ) Thu 24-May-12 19:18:16

HotheadPaisan

Rowan, please can you sticky or link this is SN: Children too please.

Thanks for this Hothead - will do it now.

UnCharteredromaeosaur Thu 24-May-12 19:21:42

i've just logged in to check times and realised it's an hour later than the last one, thanks for changing this - much more user friendly thanks

RowanMumsnet (MNHQ) Thu 24-May-12 19:25:31

Thanks Unchartered, we aim to please grin

SueCawkwell Thu 24-May-12 19:29:07

test

Yes, but it's pretty much accepted that Herts are evil, - isn't it?

ohmeohmy Thu 24-May-12 20:07:44

Probably starlight but how do they get away with it?

Not sure if I can make as bed time here is between midnight and 3am. Looking forward to reading about the green paper, from what I can gather this will suit us perfectly.

DS has always been special school from 2yo. He has always been reluctant for issues the profs refuse to acknowledge or accept. The bigger and stronger he has got the harder it is to get him there, hence him being at home 24/7 for the last 2 year.

He has a home tutor for up to an hour, 4 days per week, however all services (OT etc) are in turn letting him down, due to his low arousal level, passive but aggressive nature and his lack of motivation. In your words he lacks accountability!! Should this mean he is overlooked?!!

Another situation we are in is as he is still registered at his local authority special school he remains under the care of the pead there. They have rotated and the new one won't take DS on as he is not accessing school and the old one has discharged him. So now have none.

RowanMumsnet (MNHQ) Thu 24-May-12 20:46:50

Hello again,

Sue, Dave and Rosemary are in position ready to start at 9pm; we're just going to post up some pre-prepared answers over the next ten minutes or so.

SueCawkwell Thu 24-May-12 20:53:55

Hello mumsnetters

It's great to be invited back. There are three of us this evening but probably
just me typing (Sue) to avoid any confusion.

I'm Sue Cawkwell, regional director of KIDS and also a parent of three
children - two of my children have been through the statutory assessment
process. I've also worked during my career as a portage visitor and
a parent partnership coordinator.

Joining me this evening are Rosemary Foster and Dave Lison. Rosemary
and Dave both work for KIDS as parent partnership coordinators and have
had many years experience supporting families. Both Dave and Rosemary
have supported families' right through all stages of SEN processes including
SEND tribunals.

SueCawkwell Thu 24-May-12 20:56:58

Hi r3dh3d

Possibly the best solution is to wait for the next annual review, or if too far
away ask for an Interim Annual Review. Next ask the medical consultant to
give guidance to the school in writing as to your DD1's medicals needs and
what would constitute "being too ill for school"; this would then clarify for the
school and nurse your DD1's medical implication of attending the school, or
being sent home. A medical care plan should be in place to assist the school
to make medical decisions.

SueCawkwell Thu 24-May-12 20:59:10

Hello UnCharteredromaeosaur,

Arrange a meeting with the SENCo and the Head teacher, request the
presence at the meeting of the Ed Psych for the school, plus other professionals
that have given the diagnosis or who have given advice re the diagnosis; the
IEP could then be updated accurately. You might also want to provide the
SENCO with any information or reports you already have.

SueCawkwell Thu 24-May-12 21:00:21

Hello lisad123,

The process of obtaining a Statement of SEN can seem lengthy, but is clearly
laid out in the SEN Code of Practice. The local PPS team can help; you can
get a copy of the SEN COP free by telephoning 0845 60 222 60. The Local
Authority may have an area SENCo team who will have lots of information;
you can contact IPSEA national charity for information re any SEN, and legal
advice. Their advice line number 0800 018 4016.

SueCawkwell Thu 24-May-12 21:02:05

Hello everyone

Hi

SueCawkwell Thu 24-May-12 21:03:04

devientenigma

Not sure if I can make as bed time here is between midnight and 3am. Looking forward to reading about the green paper, from what I can gather this will suit us perfectly.

DS has always been special school from 2yo. He has always been reluctant for issues the profs refuse to acknowledge or accept. The bigger and stronger he has got the harder it is to get him there, hence him being at home 24/7 for the last 2 year.

He has a home tutor for up to an hour, 4 days per week, however all services (OT etc) are in turn letting him down, due to his low arousal level, passive but aggressive nature and his lack of motivation. In your words he lacks accountability!! Should this mean he is overlooked?!!

Another situation we are in is as he is still registered at his local authority special school he remains under the care of the pead there. They have rotated and the new one won't take DS on as he is not accessing school and the old one has discharged him. So now have none.

Hi Devientenigma

Pressumably your son has a statement of SEN? If so the LA still has a duty to ensure that all provision outlined within the statement is met. Have you had an annual review since this situation occurred? There is still a duty to hold annual reviews. At the annual review parents have a legal right to ask for amendments to the statement (Children and Families Act Sept 2010). This could included provision to meet the child's educational need through other services should this be necessary to promote access and progress.

PissyDust Thu 24-May-12 21:03:49

I'm very new to all of this, the school have asked for my DD to be referred as she is having real problems with making friends, being nice and general every day behaviour.

Our GP has made a referral and today I spoke with the school nurse who has said she will also make a referral.

Can anyone tell me what this actually means and what I should expect to happen in the next few months?

I'm scared and also relieved that DD might start getting some help from the school instead of constant detentions for behaviour that I think she really can't help.

SueCawkwell Thu 24-May-12 21:03:57

Hello HotheadPaisan,

Academies have to be regarded, in general, as independent schools. A recent
judgment at a tribunal said that if a parent requests an academy to be named
on their child's statement of SEN, they first have to get a letter from the
Academy to agree that they have a place and that they could meet the child's
needs. If the LA named the academy then the parent would have the right to
appeal to a tribunal if the academy didn't agree to the place. If a child does
not have a statement but has SEN, then parents need to get hold of a copy of
the Funding Agreement for the Academy from the DofE and look up what it
says re SEN at that particular Academy. Academies have to comply with DDA
legislation.

IPSEA, have looked at his statment have said it's useless and it's now on hold.

SueCawkwell Thu 24-May-12 21:05:04

PissyDust

I'm very new to all of this, the school have asked for my DD to be referred as she is having real problems with making friends, being nice and general every day behaviour.

Our GP has made a referral and today I spoke with the school nurse who has said she will also make a referral.

Can anyone tell me what this actually means and what I should expect to happen in the next few months?

I'm scared and also relieved that DD might start getting some help from the school instead of constant detentions for behaviour that I think she really can't help.

Hello Pissydust

Did they say who they were making a referral too?

SueCawkwell Thu 24-May-12 21:06:09

Hi Hothead

Have you seen the new publication by the CDC? CDC have just
published a special edition of their Bulletin which covers the proposed SEN
and Disability reforms, including:

A message from Sarah Teather, Minister for Children and Families, on
the reforms;

An answer from the Minister to the questions proposed to her by the
sector;

Information on the Queen's Speech;

An overview of Support and Aspiration: Next Steps and
Progress document; and

Information on the Children and Families Bill.

moosemama Thu 24-May-12 21:06:20

Hi,

On the Academies thing. If every single school in your area is an Academy, where does that leave you if all the schools refuse to take your child?

SueCawkwell Thu 24-May-12 21:06:53

devientenigma

IPSEA, have looked at his statment have said it's useless and it's now on hold.

I'm not sure what they mean by 'on hold'? It should be a current document and if it's out of date/no longer appropriate you definitely do need an annual review and potentially ask for a re assessment of your childs needs

SueCawkwell Thu 24-May-12 21:07:58

Hello ohmeohmy,

LAs have to publish all policies relating to SEN; it would be a good idea to ask
the LA for a copy of their SEN policy. Also if you're concerned, you might
want to ask for an Interim Annual Review, and seek relevant advice from
professionals to present to the review. LAs must have regard to many issues re. a child's progress, not just gaining attainment; a good counter-argument
would be "has the child made progress because of the help and care they've
received in a special school." They also need to take account of whether
the child would make better progress by moving placements, and the detrimental effect of losing friendships, resettling etc.

SueCawkwell Thu 24-May-12 21:10:37

moosemama

Hi,

On the Academies thing. If every single school in your area is an Academy, where does that leave you if all the schools refuse to take your child?

Hi Moosemama

Academies have a legal duty to accept children who fall within their published funding agreement. All academy funding agreements are available on the DofE website and all academies are legally bound to accept a wide range of children who have SEN needs. The disability discrimination act also would apply if academies were saying they wouldnt accept a child.

If a statemented child and all the schools are academies the LA would need to name on in part iv - if the academy refused admission you would have the right to appeal to tribunal

HotheadPaisan Thu 24-May-12 21:13:01

Thanks, why did the LA refuse to name do you know? This is going to restrict choice as more schools convert I think.

PissyDust Thu 24-May-12 21:14:50

Hi Sue I think they are looking at DD as having some form of aspergers.

I haven't really been told much, I just told them what DD is like and I don't know what sort of questions to be asking, DD's teacher asked me to see the nurse and our GP as DD is struggling with making friends and has some odd behavioural traits that are being picked up on (she has always been like this and we manage it well at home on 1:1)

SueCawkwell Thu 24-May-12 21:15:25

HotheadPaisan

Thanks, why did the LA refuse to name do you know? This is going to restrict choice as more schools convert I think.

Hello Hothead

Sorry I'm not aware of the full details. LA's are most likely not to name an academy, if they academy themselves put up a strong argument about not being able to meet the needs of a child

moosemama Thu 24-May-12 21:16:34

Oh, thanks.

Do you have a link to where I can find the funding agreements?

I am still confused though. There has been much in the press this week about certain academies flat out refusing to take children who have SENs and if this is upheld their families will have no right of appeal, because the academies are not answerable to the tribunal even if the LAs are. Is this just the older, first wave of academies with older funding agreements - or will this case open the floodgates for all academies to refuse children with SENs with no right of appeal? confused

HotheadPaisan Thu 24-May-12 21:17:19

Thanks for the CDC link, will be interesting to see how support to 25 pans out. The EHCPs look promising but they will only be any good if you can fund the support at a school of your choice. All local schools here will be Academies soon (secondary already is) and if they just don't want my child, and the LA would rather provide elsewhere, we're stuck.

SueCawkwell Thu 24-May-12 21:18:24

PissyDust

Hi Sue I think they are looking at DD as having some form of aspergers.

I haven't really been told much, I just told them what DD is like and I don't know what sort of questions to be asking, DD's teacher asked me to see the nurse and our GP as DD is struggling with making friends and has some odd behavioural traits that are being picked up on (she has always been like this and we manage it well at home on 1:1)

Hello PissyDust

They may have made a referral for your daughter to see an educational psychologist - or it could be for a muti agency assessment if they are thinking she might be on the autistic spectrum. You could try asking the school and or your GP for further information - who the referral is to, likely waiting times, what to expect etc.

SueCawkwell Thu 24-May-12 21:25:00

moosemama

Oh, thanks.

Do you have a link to where I can find the funding agreements?

I am still confused though. There has been much in the press this week about certain academies flat out refusing to take children who have SENs and if this is upheld their families will have no right of appeal, because the academies are not answerable to the tribunal even if the LAs are. Is this just the older, first wave of academies with older funding agreements - or will this case open the floodgates for all academies to refuse children with SENs with no right of appeal? confused

Sorry lost connection - here is the link

http://www.education.gov.uk/aboutdfe/foi/disclosuresaboutschools/a0065578/funding-agreements-for-academies

SueCawkwell Thu 24-May-12 21:27:49

HotheadPaisan

Thanks for the CDC link, will be interesting to see how support to 25 pans out. The EHCPs look promising but they will only be any good if you can fund the support at a school of your choice. All local schools here will be Academies soon (secondary already is) and if they just don't want my child, and the LA would rather provide elsewhere, we're stuck.

Hello Hothead

All academies have a duty to admit pupils with a range of needs and there is no intention for academies to be able to not admit children with SEN including those with statements. There is a complaints procedure for academies - will just look up the link for you

zzzzz Thu 24-May-12 21:30:49

What services are available to home educated children with sen?

Het42 Thu 24-May-12 21:31:53

I am planning to send our youngest son to the nursery/pre school attached to our local primary. He has speech delay but perfect understanding and good sign language. He also has some motor co-ordination issues. He's being assessed for a statement now and the ed psych says she is recommending a different school in her report. I know it's all supposed to be parental choice but does she have any sway?

thanks Sue will have another look at his current statement. The LA and I are looking into a more individual curriculum/life skills for DS. However obviously without going to tribunal the LA SS would be the named school in his statement. The LA would not openly chose an ind SS for DS. We all can't see DS attending any school for the near future. When I queried cost of sending him to his LA SS, the reply was individuals are not funded, the school is funded for how many places it has regardless of those being used or oversubscribed? A search online discovered a cost of £27000 average for pupil at this school, however the LA seem to think an individual budget cost is £4000 per pupil and £6000 extra if SEN, total of £10000 in comparison to what the school budget is, it's quite low. Would this be right? For what the home tutor is accomplishing with DS, I'd rather take a penny per day to avoid the hassle.

SueCawkwell Thu 24-May-12 21:32:48

Re academies

All academies cannot refuse to admit if this is in contavention to their own funding agreements (as per link in previous response). We are aware there have been problems. There is a complaints procdure via the Education Funding Agency - will post link when find it.

good Q zzzzz

bochead Thu 24-May-12 21:34:47

I agree with moosemama regarding those areas with a high % of academies. When combined with other recent changes such as the removal of the right to a minimum number of hours a week tuition for those children unabe to attend school it & issues surrounding exclusion and SEN we are on the edge of a very dangerous precipice.

It's a back door way of denying some children any right to an education at all.

The coalition has made a fundamental departure from the principle that every child in the UK should recieve an education, yet because things are being introduced in a haphazard, piecemeal way no teaching union, parenting group or national charity seems to have picked up the opposition campaign baton as yet.

-------------------------------

The government keeps making reference to early intervention etc but the evidence on the ground suggests that the route to diagnosis for serious conditions such as ASD is now taking longer than ever before. As the parent of a child who spent 3 years becoming increasingly distressed in the wilderness that comes prior to recognition of SEN this really concerns me. It seems that with the changes to the NHS this government proposes the potential for children to slip through the cracks is dramatically increasing.

It is still not uncommon for children to remain undiagnosed all through their school years, or to obtain final confirmation of diagnosis as adults or at Uni for conditions as diverse as ASD & dyslexia. The removal of thousands of children without diagnosis from the SEN register puts those children at risk of underacheivement, exclusion etc with no redress (esp if they attend an academy!)

Can you recommend any organisations that can help parents push for diagnosis and/or offer support during this pre-diagnostic critical period that despite all the hype can last for years.

SueCawkwell Thu 24-May-12 21:36:19

[quote zzzzz]What services are available to home educated children with sen?[/q

zzzzz

What services are available to home educated children with sen?

HI ZZZZZ
Try putting in Home Education Advisory Service into google their contact number is

01707 371854

MissBetsyTrotwood Thu 24-May-12 21:38:47

Am I allowed two questions?

My son's equipment has to be funded by the school as it is deemed to benefit the whole class, not just him. What can I do if they tell me they are not going to buy it for him? (We have a doctor's letter recommending it.)

He will be 'School Action Plus' (while it exists!) How can I check he is receiving the support he needs, like being taught phonics in a quiet, non echoey room, without coming across as though I don't trust the school?

SueCawkwell Thu 24-May-12 21:38:59

Het42

I am planning to send our youngest son to the nursery/pre school attached to our local primary. He has speech delay but perfect understanding and good sign language. He also has some motor co-ordination issues. He's being assessed for a statement now and the ed psych says she is recommending a different school in her report. I know it's all supposed to be parental choice but does she have any sway?

Hello Het42
An Ed Psych can give professional advice but cannot dictact which school a child goes to. The LA will have a moderating group and they will recommend a school to be named in part IV and should take on all advice including parental representation.

Following that decision you as parents have the right to disagree and would inevitably have the right to appeal is you couldnt negotiate,

SueCawkwell Thu 24-May-12 21:41:27

devientenigma

thanks Sue will have another look at his current statement. The LA and I are looking into a more individual curriculum/life skills for DS. However obviously without going to tribunal the LA SS would be the named school in his statement. The LA would not openly chose an ind SS for DS. We all can't see DS attending any school for the near future. When I queried cost of sending him to his LA SS, the reply was individuals are not funded, the school is funded for how many places it has regardless of those being used or oversubscribed? A search online discovered a cost of £27000 average for pupil at this school, however the LA seem to think an individual budget cost is £4000 per pupil and £6000 extra if SEN, total of £10000 in comparison to what the school budget is, it's quite low. Would this be right? For what the home tutor is accomplishing with DS, I'd rather take a penny per day to avoid the hassle.

#

Hello Devientenigma

Funding for special schools is complex. Some time ago there was caselaw set regarding a tribunal were funding for special schools was determind in the LA's favour and the funding arrangements similar to your description were accepted.

moosemama Thu 24-May-12 21:42:55

Thanks for the link, but can you look up the funding agreements for individual schools and if you do will that make their responsibility for taking children with a range of needs including SENs clear?

My concern stems from this whereby it seems that children with statements could well end up worse off with regards to academy admission than those without.

As a parent who has just fought to obtain a statement for her child partially to ensure his placement at one of two local schools, I am now concerned that, not only can they refuse to take him, but that as academies are now claiming not to fall under the jurisdiction of the SEN Tribunal process, we will be left with nowhere for him to go. As you may have gathered, there are no non-academy secondary schools left in our particular area.

It makes me so angry that we are told that if they refuse to take our children we can take them to tribunal - if indeed that is still the case with academies. So, we have to fight and pay £££s for representation etc just to get our children a place in the local school system, that should be (and indeed would, until recently have been) their right. What are our children supposed to do while they are without a school placement as we are fighting for their basic right to an education?

Academies are still government funded, afaik the UK is still supposed to have a free educational system that is available to all - yet apparently if your child has SNs and a statement and you happen to live in an all academy area that may no longer be the case. angry

When the new wave of academies were first being created, I read that the only recourse parents had was straight to the Minister for Education - I will be interested to see what route the complaints procedure takes.

HotheadPaisan Thu 24-May-12 21:45:50

'The Education Funding Agency1 (EFA) will normally only consider a complaint about an Academy after the Academy’s own complaints procedure has been exhausted. The EFA cannot review or overturn decisions about complaints made by Academies. We can only investigate whether the Academy considered the complaint appropriately. If the EFA finds that an Academy did not consider a complaint appropriately it can request the Academy to re-consider the complaint.'

There is no higher authority from what I've read. We would not accept access to other goods and services being refused on the grounds of disability but we seem to with education, it's a really strange disconnect. Whilst mainstream hasn't always been right for all, to not have the choice locally would be terrible. Our kids are at enough disadvantage as it is.

SueCawkwell Thu 24-May-12 21:46:11

bochead

I agree with moosemama regarding those areas with a high % of academies. When combined with other recent changes such as the removal of the right to a minimum number of hours a week tuition for those children unabe to attend school it & issues surrounding exclusion and SEN we are on the edge of a very dangerous precipice.

It's a back door way of denying some children any right to an education at all.

The coalition has made a fundamental departure from the principle that every child in the UK should recieve an education, yet because things are being introduced in a haphazard, piecemeal way no teaching union, parenting group or national charity seems to have picked up the opposition campaign baton as yet.

-------------------------------

The government keeps making reference to early intervention etc but the evidence on the ground suggests that the route to diagnosis for serious conditions such as ASD is now taking longer than ever before. As the parent of a child who spent 3 years becoming increasingly distressed in the wilderness that comes prior to recognition of SEN this really concerns me. It seems that with the changes to the NHS this government proposes the potential for children to slip through the cracks is dramatically increasing.

It is still not uncommon for children to remain undiagnosed all through their school years, or to obtain final confirmation of diagnosis as adults or at Uni for conditions as diverse as ASD & dyslexia. The removal of thousands of children without diagnosis from the SEN register puts those children at risk of underacheivement, exclusion etc with no redress (esp if they attend an academy!)

Can you recommend any organisations that can help parents push for diagnosis and/or offer support during this pre-diagnostic critical period that despite all the hype can last for years.

Hi Bochead

In terms of pre diagnostic support have you tried the National Autistic society or local support groups? The exsiting legislation regarding SEN is still in force and the emphasis is on meeting children;s sen with or without diagnosis.

SueCawkwell Thu 24-May-12 21:47:46

Re academies

Take a look on the dfe website under The Education Funding Agency re complaints

HotheadPaisan Thu 24-May-12 21:49:18

What moose said, we are all sleepwalking into this, now schools rated as good can apply to be Academies and essentially become independent I am very concerned for the future choices for children with SEN. All the local schools from 5-18 will be Academies soon. I wonder how soon the test case will be heard.

zzzzz Thu 24-May-12 21:50:51

I have googled as you suggested but apart from FAQ which tells me I am allowed to home ed my sn child hmm and the offer to buy a pamphlet that explains what a statement is etc there seems little useful information. HE is a huge part of sn education some by necessity some by choice, how is it it is SO difficult to find out what could be provided in the home?

SueCawkwell Thu 24-May-12 21:52:03

MissBetsyTrotwood

Am I allowed two questions?

My son's equipment has to be funded by the school as it is deemed to benefit the whole class, not just him. What can I do if they tell me they are not going to buy it for him? (We have a doctor's letter recommending it.)

He will be 'School Action Plus' (while it exists!) How can I check he is receiving the support he needs, like being taught phonics in a quiet, non echoey room, without coming across as though I don't trust the school?

Hello Miss Betsy

Ask for a meeting with the senco and also ask to view the IEP (you have been given a copy any way). You dont mention what the equipment is but if a child's progress is determind by the use of specialist equipment then you could ask the school to make a 'reasonable adjustment' under part iv of the DDA Act.

Every child at School action plus should have an IEP and there has to be outside agency involvment (ed psyc, speech and language etc so they could also give advice to back up need for equipment)

HotheadPaisan Thu 24-May-12 21:52:39

I would like more on HE too, it will become even more of an option with the EHCPs.

what about those who have there child at home full time without choice as they don't fit into school, where do you look for support etc?

my DS requires 24/7 supervision, sometimes on a 2:1 ratio, yet I am left to care for him alone.

SueCawkwell Thu 24-May-12 21:55:42

moosemama

Thanks for the link, but can you look up the funding agreements for individual schools and if you do will that make their responsibility for taking children with a range of needs including SENs clear?

My concern stems from this whereby it seems that children with statements could well end up worse off with regards to academy admission than those without.

As a parent who has just fought to obtain a statement for her child partially to ensure his placement at one of two local schools, I am now concerned that, not only can they refuse to take him, but that as academies are now claiming not to fall under the jurisdiction of the SEN Tribunal process, we will be left with nowhere for him to go. As you may have gathered, there are no non-academy secondary schools left in our particular area.

It makes me so angry that we are told that if they refuse to take our children we can take them to tribunal - if indeed that is still the case with academies. So, we have to fight and pay £££s for representation etc just to get our children a place in the local school system, that should be (and indeed would, until recently have been) their right. What are our children supposed to do while they are without a school placement as we are fighting for their basic right to an education?

Academies are still government funded, afaik the UK is still supposed to have a free educational system that is available to all - yet apparently if your child has SNs and a statement and you happen to live in an all academy area that may no longer be the case. angry

When the new wave of academies were first being created, I read that the only recourse parents had was straight to the Minister for Education - I will be interested to see what route the complaints procedure takes.

Hello Moosemamma - yes it should give individual school details. The points you raise are some the reasons the govt has set up the complaints procedure.

You can also as a parent write directly to the secretary of state for education as they will look into the funding agreement of the academy in question on your behalf.

HotheadPaisan Thu 24-May-12 21:56:12

One more thing on Academies and statements - if the Academies and LAs prevail and it is upheld that Academies are outside of the jurisdiction of SEND Tribunals, everything will take a backwards step. You will no longer be able to name provision. That was the one ray of hope in an arduous and fraught process, that you would at least be able to exercise some choice and appeal if necessary. To lose this would be a travesty.

HotheadPaisan Thu 24-May-12 21:58:12

'If the EFA finds that an Academy did not consider a complaint appropriately it can request the Academy to re-consider the complaint.'

That is it, no Tribunal, no Upper Tribunal etc. We will see what happens with the test case but that complaints procedure is utterly useless.

SueCawkwell Thu 24-May-12 21:58:38

zzzzz

I have googled as you suggested but apart from FAQ which tells me I am allowed to home ed my sn child hmm and the offer to buy a pamphlet that explains what a statement is etc there seems little useful information. HE is a huge part of sn education some by necessity some by choice, how is it it is SO difficult to find out what could be provided in the home?

Hi ZZZ

Another site you could try then is Education Otherwise - would be good if you could take a quick look and see what you think - it looks more comprehensive to me.

UnCharteredromaeosaur Thu 24-May-12 22:00:21

sorry i'm late <hands in note from not-going-to-bed-DD>

re;

^Arrange a meeting with the SENCo and the Head teacher, request the
presence at the meeting of the Ed Psych for the school, plus other professionals
that have given the diagnosis or who have given advice re the diagnosis; the
IEP could then be updated accurately. You might also want to provide the
SENCO with any information or reports you already have.^

the SENCO is refusing to arrange an assessment by Ed Psych until she's heard from the Paed Psych - she wants the Paed Psych to 'order' an Ed Psych assessment, which the Paed Psych says he cannot do. Can you advise the best route to stop this ping-pong effect please?

SueCawkwell Thu 24-May-12 22:03:38

HotheadPaisan

One more thing on Academies and statements - if the Academies and LAs prevail and it is upheld that Academies are outside of the jurisdiction of SEND Tribunals, everything will take a backwards step. You will no longer be able to name provision. That was the one ray of hope in an arduous and fraught process, that you would at least be able to exercise some choice and appeal if necessary. To lose this would be a travesty.

Hi Hothead

The case law states that appeals can be made if the LA name the academy in part iv of a statement so anyone living in an area where all schools are acadamies the LA would pressumably have no choice but to name an academy - therefore you would have a right to appeal.

It's vital not to always listen to the point of view of the academies direct but to seek further advice and guidance on the law - your parent partnership service should offer this advice. The funding agreement of the academy is vital

SueCawkwell Thu 24-May-12 22:05:36

UnCharteredromaeosaur

sorry i'm late <hands in note from not-going-to-bed-DD>

re;

^Arrange a meeting with the SENCo and the Head teacher, request the
presence at the meeting of the Ed Psych for the school, plus other professionals
that have given the diagnosis or who have given advice re the diagnosis; the
IEP could then be updated accurately. You might also want to provide the
SENCO with any information or reports you already have.^

the SENCO is refusing to arrange an assessment by Ed Psych until she's heard from the Paed Psych - she wants the Paed Psych to 'order' an Ed Psych assessment, which the Paed Psych says he cannot do. Can you advise the best route to stop this ping-pong effect please?

You could put in a parental request for a statutory assessment

coff33pot Thu 24-May-12 22:05:54

I have a school who will not adhere to a statement. I have a school who illegally excluded for half days from dec onwards. I have a school who like a drop of a hat tells a 6yr old that he cant go on a school trip the day before the trip without a full risk assessment. Basically disability discrimination all round.

This school is an Academy. It wasnt when statement was applied for but was by the time they received the funding for it.

I cannot afford to fight the system its too big and its too expensive which is heartbraking as the system lets me down and so I am letting my son down.

Can you tell me how is this green paper going to stop all this stuff going on? How is allowing the parents to hold the payments (vouchers) going to help if you cannot get the school to accept or abide by anything? What reinforcement is going to be put into place to make sure it is going to be better than what we dont have already. And now there are Academies out there that are not answerable to the LA.

Sorry for a deep question smile

zzzzz Thu 24-May-12 22:06:09

Had a quick look but not particularly promising He-special.org which is linked might have some but it is a board not unlike the one here. Where would you find a list of services available to HE children with sn.

UnCharteredromaeosaur Thu 24-May-12 22:08:14

thanks

thank you

moosemama Thu 24-May-12 22:11:35

Have searched all over the DofE website and can't find any individual school funding agreements. I reckon we would have to do our own FOI request to get hold of it.

Coff33 has said it all really. We are just parents, no power or funds to fight a hopelessly unenforceable system - how is the Green Paper going to change all that - or is it?

HotheadPaisan Thu 24-May-12 22:12:06

Thanks, I know all the answers aren't apparent yet. I just hope it is/was an oversight to not have a right of appeal regarding placements at Academies with the ability to overturn decisions. Also, LAs seem confused about what they should be doing. The from The Guardian today I think:

'A spokesman for the Learning Trust said: "As a matter of policy we do not comment on cases of this nature. Depending on the terms of the funding agreement between an academy and the secretary of state, the academy may not have to admit a child even if the school is named in the child's statement."

The London Oratory case concerns an 11-year-old boy from Croydon. The school declined to be named in his statement, arguing too that it would compromise the "efficient education of other children."

Chris Barnett, lawyer for the family concerned and head of the education and disability law department at Levenes solicitors, said: "If it hadn't been an academy, the authority would have named it [in the statement]. Croydon's position seems to be that it doesn't accept the arguments the school has put forward, but they still won't name it. It seems to me that the LA [local authority] doesn't quite know how to deal with it because it's an academy."'

SueCawkwell Thu 24-May-12 22:13:51

coff33pot

I have a school who will not adhere to a statement. I have a school who illegally excluded for half days from dec onwards. I have a school who like a drop of a hat tells a 6yr old that he cant go on a school trip the day before the trip without a full risk assessment. Basically disability discrimination all round.

This school is an Academy. It wasnt when statement was applied for but was by the time they received the funding for it.

I cannot afford to fight the system its too big and its too expensive which is heartbraking as the system lets me down and so I am letting my son down.

Can you tell me how is this green paper going to stop all this stuff going on? How is allowing the parents to hold the payments (vouchers) going to help if you cannot get the school to accept or abide by anything? What reinforcement is going to be put into place to make sure it is going to be better than what we dont have already. And now there are Academies out there that are not answerable to the LA.

Sorry for a deep question smile

Hi Coff33

If you feel any school, state. academy etc has discriminated against your child you can appeal to a tribunal re disability discrimination ie not allowing your child to go on a school trip, You can at the same time put the case to the tribunal that a reasonable adjustment should have been made in relation to your childs needs. Some parent parent partnership services will help, IPSEA also provide representation, the local legal centre can give advice and some solicitors will take on cases under legal aid.
The childrens legal centre may offer help 0808 802 0008

In terms of the green paper it;s difticult to know at this stage as the pathfinders have only just begun to test out the new single assessment, personal budgets in education etc.

SueCawkwell Thu 24-May-12 22:15:07

moosemama

Have searched all over the DofE website and can't find any individual school funding agreements. I reckon we would have to do our own FOI request to get hold of it.

Coff33 has said it all really. We are just parents, no power or funds to fight a hopelessly unenforceable system - how is the Green Paper going to change all that - or is it?

Hi Moose they are all listed - every one in the country. Dave is just checking for you now

HotheadPaisan Thu 24-May-12 22:15:43

moose, it doesn't matter, EFA do not have the authority SEND Tribunals do.

moosemama Thu 24-May-12 22:16:48

Our LEA is a pathfinder - ds has just been given a statement (well is still at the proposed stage as they are refusing to quantify) and we haven't been told a thing about personal budgets. hmm

SueCawkwell Thu 24-May-12 22:17:24

SueCawkwell

moosemama

Have searched all over the DofE website and can't find any individual school funding agreements. I reckon we would have to do our own FOI request to get hold of it.

Coff33 has said it all really. We are just parents, no power or funds to fight a hopelessly unenforceable system - how is the Green Paper going to change all that - or is it?

Hi Moose they are all listed - every one in the country. Dave is just checking for you now

Hi go to DoE website - in search box top right type in academy funding agreements then a full list of all academies appears

pinkorkid Thu 24-May-12 22:19:14

Similar situation to devientenigma, we have a ds who has a statement and a place at special school but who has refused to attend for the last few months (due to anxiety issues).

Relevant legislation "access to education for children and young people with medical needs" says children who are absent from school due to illness for more than 15 days should have provision made to allow them to access education by alternative means - this could include hospital school, home tuition, in a PRU setting or internet support. It sets the minimum support to be provided at 5 hours tuition per week but emphasises that the only upper limits should be those imposed by the child's illness.

In practice (and in our personal experience) our LA's practice until recently was to provide 5 hours as the standard with perhaps a couple more hours for a child in their GCSE years. The Children, Schools and Families Act 2010 extends that duty and says local authorities should arrange full-time education for all children in alternative provision. As highlighted in the TES article link here www.tes.co.uk/article.aspx?storycode=6116532, many LAs are struggling to meet their obligations because of the additional pressures on their budgets.

We were recently informed that our LA now no longer routinely offer home based individual tuition, instead they will offer a place in a PRU where appropriate (not very in the case of a child too afraid to leave the house) or access to on-line support such as work set on the school's virtual learning environment. I don't personally see that this matches the Children, Schools and Families Act's specification that "The teaching must be of a similar quality to that which the child would receive in school, based on a broad and balanced curriculum."

In your opinion, is there any way we can argue that this policy fails to provide appropriate provision?

My second issue is that the LA insist that access to any alternative educational provision is dependant on a referral letter from a consultant. As waiting lists to be seen by consultants are often several months long, this makes it impossible for a child to access the alternative provison after the 15 missed school days stipulated in the legislation. The legislation does say that "ideally a referral should be obtained from a consultant paediatrician". Do you think this is sufficient legal justification for the LA to make the consultant's referral a pre-requisite for access to education?

Sorry this is so long but it I'd be very glad of any advice.

SueCawkwell Thu 24-May-12 22:19:20

moosemama

Our LEA is a pathfinder - ds has just been given a statement (well is still at the proposed stage as they are refusing to quantify) and we haven't been told a thing about personal budgets. hmm

The current system is still running - even in pathfinders. The are piloting the new single plans and personal budgets with some families but by no means all in order to have a comparison.

Can you point to any definition of what outcomes from the pathfinders woukd signal success o alternatively failure?

moosemama Thu 24-May-12 22:21:25

Ok, now I'm confused again [ridiculously tired emoticon].

I thought the whole problem was that academies such as Mossbourne are refusing to accept that SEND have jursidiction over them and their only higher authority is directly with the Secretary of State via their Funding Agreement? confused

Do we perhaps all need to start overwhelming the SoS with individual concerns, problems and complaints until he decides that that system isn't workable and makes sure the academies are accountable to SEND?

SueCawkwell Thu 24-May-12 22:22:14

pinkorkid

Similar situation to devientenigma, we have a ds who has a statement and a place at special school but who has refused to attend for the last few months (due to anxiety issues).

Relevant legislation "access to education for children and young people with medical needs" says children who are absent from school due to illness for more than 15 days should have provision made to allow them to access education by alternative means - this could include hospital school, home tuition, in a PRU setting or internet support. It sets the minimum support to be provided at 5 hours tuition per week but emphasises that the only upper limits should be those imposed by the child's illness.

In practice (and in our personal experience) our LA's practice until recently was to provide 5 hours as the standard with perhaps a couple more hours for a child in their GCSE years. The Children, Schools and Families Act 2010 extends that duty and says local authorities should arrange full-time education for all children in alternative provision. As highlighted in the TES article link here www.tes.co.uk/article.aspx?storycode=6116532, many LAs are struggling to meet their obligations because of the additional pressures on their budgets.

We were recently informed that our LA now no longer routinely offer home based individual tuition, instead they will offer a place in a PRU where appropriate (not very in the case of a child too afraid to leave the house) or access to on-line support such as work set on the school's virtual learning environment. I don't personally see that this matches the Children, Schools and Families Act's specification that "The teaching must be of a similar quality to that which the child would receive in school, based on a broad and balanced curriculum."

In your opinion, is there any way we can argue that this policy fails to provide appropriate provision?

My second issue is that the LA insist that access to any alternative educational provision is dependant on a referral letter from a consultant. As waiting lists to be seen by consultants are often several months long, this makes it impossible for a child to access the alternative provison after the 15 missed school days stipulated in the legislation. The legislation does say that "ideally a referral should be obtained from a consultant paediatrician". Do you think this is sufficient legal justification for the LA to make the consultant's referral a pre-requisite for access to education?

Sorry this is so long but it I'd be very glad of any advice.

Hi we will print this off and answer this tomorrow if this is ok?

moosemama Thu 24-May-12 22:24:18

Right, thank you Sue.

I was sure I read on here somewhere that the Pathfinders had to offer the choice of personal budgets to every child/family that is issued with a statement. I thought I'd read that they have to at least give details of the trial to everyone? I might have got that wrong though.

RowanMumsnet (MNHQ) Thu 24-May-12 22:24:45

Hi all - thanks so much to Sue, Dave and Rosemary for staying well past 10pm, and to everyone for the questions. Seems like there was quite a lot to cover on this one (and we didn't even get around to the Green Paper, unless I missed it...); we'll see if we can mop up any unanswered points over the next couple of days.

We'll hold another one soon, but in the meantime don't forget to fill in our survey - even if you didn't post - to help us evaluate the session's usefulness.

Thanks,
MNHQ

r3dh3d Thu 24-May-12 22:25:02

Sorry, have been afk.

I think all the funding agreements got "lost" when they were moved on the DfE website, recently. There was a bit of a hoo-har on Twitter about it. They still exist and if you search the right twitter hashtags you can work out where.

There is definitely a change in the new model agreements (we've been looking at going Academy) but each school gets to negotiate their own agreement based on the model. Most won't bother but some sharp ones will. So you have to look at each school individually.

SueCawkwell Thu 24-May-12 22:25:25

moosemama

Right, thank you Sue.

I was sure I read on here somewhere that the Pathfinders had to offer the choice of personal budgets to every child/family that is issued with a statement. I thought I'd read that they have to at least give details of the trial to everyone? I might have got that wrong though.

I'll check with one of the pathfinders Moose and let you know tomorrow

coff33pot Thu 24-May-12 22:25:38

Thanks for replying smile I have also tried your link and put in academy funding agreements but it doesnt come up with a list of schools just starts of with an FOI request for it and then other subjects to click on.

Sorry we are being a pain grin

UnCharteredromaeosaur Thu 24-May-12 22:25:46

thanks to all involved

moosemama Thu 24-May-12 22:26:18

Thank you for taking the time to come on and talk to us. smile

SueCawkwell Thu 24-May-12 22:26:20

r3dh3d

Sorry, have been afk.

I think all the funding agreements got "lost" when they were moved on the DfE website, recently. There was a bit of a hoo-har on Twitter about it. They still exist and if you search the right twitter hashtags you can work out where.

There is definitely a change in the new model agreements (we've been looking at going Academy) but each school gets to negotiate their own agreement based on the model. Most won't bother but some sharp ones will. So you have to look at each school individually.

Hi DfE site down at the moment which may be causing some problems

SueCawkwell Thu 24-May-12 22:27:37

coff33pot

Thanks for replying smile I have also tried your link and put in academy funding agreements but it doesnt come up with a list of schools just starts of with an FOI request for it and then other subjects to click on.

Sorry we are being a pain grin

It came up ten mins ago Coff33 but seems to be down now - you're not being a pain it can be a really frustrating and drawn out process at times

coff33pot Thu 24-May-12 22:28:49

Ah so its not meee! Thank you for spending your time with us it is appreciated.

HotheadPaisan Thu 24-May-12 22:29:07

The potential removal of rights could go right the way through:

'In October 2010 the white paper The Importance of Teaching announced the intention, subject to legislation, to close the Young People's Learning Agency (YPLA) and set up a new Education Funding Agency (EFA) as an executive agency of the Department. The EFA would have responsibility for the direct funding of the growing number of academies and Free Schools and all 16-19 provision. This will include the funding of 16-19 provision in further education colleges, sixth form colleges and independent provision. The EFA will also distribute school funding resources to local authorities for them to pass on, as now, to those schools that are not yet academies.'

How could they have not had a right to name or of appeal for entry to Academies for pupils with SEN? It's almost like they didn't think about the possibility that our kids would be applying to go to these schools in the days when only outstanding schools could apply to convert.

HotheadPaisan Thu 24-May-12 22:30:45

Thanks Sue, loads more to come on all this with the changes mooted I'm sure.

SueCawkwell Thu 24-May-12 22:31:22

We're signing out now - it is quite difficult to provide full answers without having more in depth conversations and gaining all the relevant information as SEN can be quite complex.

We have used the funding agreement to get children into academies. Will check out the website again tomorrow and see whats going on and try to find you all a working link. Will check through to see if we've missed anything and then send outstanding queries through to Rowan

Hope it's been of some use to you all.

Night

pinkorkid Thu 24-May-12 22:34:24

Thank you, Sue, that would be great

Moose there is some information on Pathfinders here:
www.nnpcf.org.uk/home
National Network of Parent Carer Forums are involved in the consultations.

moosemama Thu 24-May-12 22:45:25

Thanks again Sue. smile

Thank you pinkorkid. Will read it tomorrow - am currently in need of matchsticks in order to stay awake!

HotheadPaisan Thu 24-May-12 23:12:20

SEN Pathfinder Pilot Schemes.

There is so much going on atm with Academies and SEN Tribunals and the Green Paper, Pathfinders and EHCPs.

RowanMumsnet (MNHQ) Sat 02-Jun-12 23:58:21

Hi all,

We're going to post up some of KIDS's responses to late questions now; apologies for the delay - my fault!

Thanks
MNHQ

SueCawkwell Sun 03-Jun-12 00:04:53

pinkorkid

Similar situation to devientenigma, we have a ds who has a statement and a place at special school but who has refused to attend for the last few months (due to anxiety issues).

Relevant legislation "access to education for children and young people with medical needs" says children who are absent from school due to illness for more than 15 days should have provision made to allow them to access education by alternative means - this could include hospital school, home tuition, in a PRU setting or internet support. It sets the minimum support to be provided at 5 hours tuition per week but emphasises that the only upper limits should be those imposed by the child's illness.

In practice (and in our personal experience) our LA's practice until recently was to provide 5 hours as the standard with perhaps a couple more hours for a child in their GCSE years. The Children, Schools and Families Act 2010 extends that duty and says local authorities should arrange full-time education for all children in alternative provision. As highlighted in the TES article link here www.tes.co.uk/article.aspx?storycode=6116532, many LAs are struggling to meet their obligations because of the additional pressures on their budgets.

We were recently informed that our LA now no longer routinely offer home based individual tuition, instead they will offer a place in a PRU where appropriate (not very in the case of a child too afraid to leave the house) or access to on-line support such as work set on the school's virtual learning environment. I don't personally see that this matches the Children, Schools and Families Act's specification that "The teaching must be of a similar quality to that which the child would receive in school, based on a broad and balanced curriculum."

In your opinion, is there any way we can argue that this policy fails to provide appropriate provision?

My second issue is that the LA insist that access to any alternative educational provision is dependant on a referral letter from a consultant. As waiting lists to be seen by consultants are often several months long, this makes it impossible for a child to access the alternative provison after the 15 missed school days stipulated in the legislation. The legislation does say that "ideally a referral should be obtained from a consultant paediatrician". Do you think this is sufficient legal justification for the LA to make the consultant's referral a pre-requisite for access to education?

Sorry this is so long but it I'd be very glad of any advice.

Hello pinkorkid

I see you have quoted sections of legislation. Re children's and young families act 2010, it is my understanding that 'Alternative provision' indicates that this does not suggest 'in the home'; it should possibly be read as alternative to a school, ie small educational units, PRUs or possibly other local arrangements made by individual LAs. I would suggest calling an interim Annual Review, get all professionals and an LA officer to attend. If the medical consultant is not able to attend, then in my experience they will write a report for the Annual Review, possibly indicating their support and recommendation for Home Tuition. This would mean you don't have to wait for an appointment. I would also advise that you write to the Consultant with an explanation of the circumstances, along with the request for them to attend the AR (medical professionals are at times not aware of educational procedures). I am not aware of any cases in law re the issue of home tuition that have been brought re the Children & Families Act; you may want to call the National Children's Legal Centre on 0808 802 0008, they can be very helpful - or IPSEA on 0800 018 4016. I would also advise that you obtain a copy of the LA's policy re home tuition, and then possibly request a meeting with the senior officer SEN and the portfolio holder for education on the council. At least this will highlight the difficulties you are experiencing, and bring to the attention of the council any policy anomalies that they may want to address.

SueCawkwell Sun 03-Jun-12 00:09:35

moosemama

Right, thank you Sue.

I was sure I read on here somewhere that the Pathfinders had to offer the choice of personal budgets to every child/family that is issued with a statement. I thought I'd read that they have to at least give details of the trial to everyone? I might have got that wrong though.

SEN pathfinders are all taking a slightly different approach to testing the single plan and personal budgets. Some for example are testing out all new requests for statutory assessments for the under 7s, some are looking at the under 5s and the over 16s, others are testing out 60 assessments covering the whole age range. By 2014 the governments plan is that the single plan assessment will replace the statement and that families will be able to request a personal budget.

Mott McDonald are overseeing the pathfinders. If you are interested you can go to their website and type in SEN Pathfinder in the search box – this will take you to an area where you can look at all the individual pathfinder application forms to see what you local area plans are. Here is the link which should get you straight to the pathfinders applications:

http://www.sendpathfinder.co.uk/pathfinder/

For all those interested in academies

Not sure what happened last night on the site re Funding Agreements – Dave at one point found them (not sure if this was via a saved link) but when we checked again as you say the site was requiring freedom of information requests. Dave has emailed the DfE to see why this information appears no longer to be publicly available. He has on several time used these agreements to challenge academies – resulting in children being admitted, so feels they are really important. Will let Rowan know as soon as we have the response.

pinkorkid Sun 03-Jun-12 11:25:45

Thank you very much for the feedback, Sue - I will follow up as you suggested.

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