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How to get out of TAC meetings without damaging future relationships?

(38 Posts)
babiki Fri 12-Apr-13 11:33:15

Just had a call about TAC meeting in May, whom to invite etc. I realised I don't actually want to do them at all, the first (and only one so far) was a lot of hot air in any case, totally useless. I was uncomfortable the whole time, as I complained about the Physio and OT, who are both waste of space.

Did you get out of yours? Was it seen as uncooperative?
They used the minutes from our one at the Tribunal, I know now the therapists are all buddies wit the Education and there mjust a lot of talk about us...

We lost Tribunal over refusal to asess but have applied to Upper Tribunal and the case is being reviewed now as well (by the same judge). One of the contested issues is independent OT report and her recommendations...

What could I say to stop the TAC meetings without damaging future cooperation - DS is only 3 and a half so will have to see all the muppets anyway at some point again.
The only one that is helpful is SAlt, maybe I could have a TAC meeting just with her grin

wasuup3000 Fri 12-Apr-13 11:39:27

Useful to have someone with you at these meetings such as parent partnership (google them if you are not in touch). They can keep meetings on topic and make sure important points are made.

babiki Fri 12-Apr-13 11:41:09

Wassuup, unfortunately our Parent Partnership are totally biased, I was warn several times (on recent Ipsea training as well).

wasuup3000 Fri 12-Apr-13 12:16:18

I am not sure that the bias matters in a meeting where it is just their job to ensure you get your points across and that the meeting stays on track.

2006hildy Fri 12-Apr-13 12:18:52

babiki we are virtually in the same situation so would also love to know. sorry can't help as have not got there yet.

I was going to ask for reports instead so that they can't lie. (I lose my grip on reality when they lie and not written in meeting minutes)

I got the impression you just got separate meetings with all the so called professionals instead. That potentially gives you more time to sort things out anyway. You can always cancel the TAC meetings but still give the professionals permission to share information about your case.

Agree with your view on Parent Partnership as they work for the Council. What hacks me off is I do all the work and they get the credit. So I am only having them there if they actually doing something for us.

I am sick of being treated like a mushroom. Kept in the dark and fed a load of s**t. I will only agree to the next TAC meeting if they have results to enlighten me with, not just the how long is a piece of string word "progress" b******s.

How do you get onto the IPSEA course? I have tried by phoning/emailing but they say it's on the website but maybe I am missing something still have not got on.

Good Luck. Will be watching this thread with interest.

Yes. I got out of all of mine by turning up to what became the last one, declared myself ds' key worker' who would assume all responsibility of calling the future meetings and subsequently - didn't.

TBH, one way of stopping TACs is to ask them what they are FOR, and what SPECIFICALLY will be discussed.

Ask for that information and say it is to enable you to make an informed decision as to whether it would be more efficient to meet or whether the issues raised can be resolved in a most cost-effective way.

You can also send a letter/email to all those involved, saying you've been asked who you want to invite to the next TAC so please could they answer one question: 'How long has ds been on your caseload? What outcomes have there been for him as a direct result of this?'

They won't answer. That non-answer is useful for tribunal.

babiki Fri 12-Apr-13 12:28:28

Hildy so how are you going to approach it? Would you request the reports in writing?
I'm getting paranoid so thinking maybe it's better in writing..than at least they can't lie what I said etc.

What's the bloody point of them anyway? Can't tell them the truth what I really think about them anyway..

Star that's really cool smile Maybe I could write stating I'm the key worker hahaha, that made me laugh.

babiki Fri 12-Apr-13 12:30:35

Oh yes and the training it was via local autism charity, they didn't mind ds doesn't have asd..which was lovely smile
Lots of local charities book them for training..but I was asking for a next one (more in-depth) and they don't plan them anymore because of the coming changes...
Are you in Essex btw?

babiki Fri 12-Apr-13 12:36:14

Excellent Starlight, I will do that I think smile

Another thing you could do is to say that you were so confused after the event and the minutes didn't reflect what you thought had been discussed, so for your peace of mind and to avoid additional stress to you or confusion you are seeking permission to record the meeting and will make the transcript and recording available within 14 days after the event.

They won't agree to that either, but you might be able to compromise by agreeing to write the minutes as you go along. So after each 'decision' or discussion it is written down preferably on an interactive white board or projected from a computer. During the meeting when people say things you disagree with or find a bit odd (or illegal), you can simply say 'please can you put that in the minutes' and they will revise immediately.

A copy is printed before you leave and everyone signs it. If people leave half-way through then they can sign where you go up to.

I did that once too.

wasuup3000 Fri 12-Apr-13 12:38:54

I found the latest TAC meeting useful as it made all the professionals see my childs class teacher and senco for what they are....too polite to put that into words. Anyhow my PP couldn't attend and although obviously working for the council and biased to their employer in my experience they are good at keeping matters to the point and on track. Meetings and appointments do get tiresome I know, first week back and I have 3 written in on the calender already including an annual review.

Always take someone with you.
Always write your own minutes.
Beware of the broken record technique - where people will go on and on at you until you agree.
Never agree to anything in the meeting - always say you will think about it and get back to them.
If given any surprise reports on the day just say that you can't comment on this new information as it wasn't given to you in time to digest it prior to the meeting so you couldn't possible comment on the content in this meeting.
Write the meeting agenda yourself and hand it out at the start of the meeting - so you are in control and have all the evidence you need to make the points you want.
Anything you don't understand - say so.
If things get heated - take a break, just say I need a couple of minutes and leave the room. The phrase "moving on/forward" might be useful.
Set a date for the next meeting to conclude.

babiki Fri 12-Apr-13 12:41:52

Starlight no energy for that now - but can imagine doing that in future.

It's a stupid position to be in; I don't really want to see them etc, but on the other hand if the council ever agress to assess, it will be the same bunch of people...

As stated at the tribunal: 'the excellent holistic cooperation between the NHS and Education in Essex' smile

babiki Fri 12-Apr-13 12:49:13

Wassup thank you, that's good advice but I think for later.

Cause I don't have any issues atm I need to sort out with them..ds is happy at preschool, in love with his 1-1, they work very hard with ds without any help from NHS people (of course looks like lots of help on the paper) by following private programme we do at home..

I don't trust them, they are bad at their job, so I just don't see the point. And the things I would like them to do (such as diagnose DCD which was suggested by private OT) they won't do, cause ds is too young and so far everything has been hidden under the GDD label.

Icedcakeandflower Fri 12-Apr-13 12:53:06

You can also send a letter/email to all those involved, saying you've been asked who you want to invite to the next TAC so please could they answer one question: 'How long has ds been on your caseload? What outcomes have there been for him as a direct result of this?'

grin I really really want to send something like this to my OT grin

So send it. Otherwise what is the point of your making the effort to attend that appointment?

babiki Fri 12-Apr-13 12:55:52

Icedcakeandflowe- all of us saddled with useless therapists should send it on the same day smile

wasuup3000 Fri 12-Apr-13 12:57:07

If a private OT has suggested dyspraxia (DCD) then surely that is what he has a diagnosis of - Is it a paediatrician that won't formalise the OT opinion or is it or CAMHs or others. If so you can ask for a 2nd opinion either ask your GP to refer you to GOSH or the Maudsley or tell your NHS professionals that you want a 2nd opinion for your son.

Icedcakeandflower Fri 12-Apr-13 13:03:22

I'm going to do it, and copy to the HT at school!

babiki Fri 12-Apr-13 13:13:36

Wasuup, I was told by everybody (GP, peadetrician, Nhs OT) that beacuse he is globally delayed they won't diagnose him. The problem is that if a learning disability is present, this is the way they do it in UK.

wasuup3000 Fri 12-Apr-13 13:15:52

Do you think he is globally delayed or that there is osmething else going on? If you feel there is something else going on ask for a 2nd opinion is what I would advise.

You can be polite about it btw. But your time is important as is your child's.

If the OT isn't making a difference there are two options 1)Carry on wasting the OT's time and your childs. 2)Release the OT to help children that he/she CAN help and make time avaible to your child to something else that DOES do something/a different OT with a different skillset.

If you were a private client, would you carry on paying and visiting someone who you thought was ineffective?

It's a reasonable question.

babiki Fri 12-Apr-13 13:28:43

Starlight, we haven't seen the OT in months anyway, so hopefully she is helping other children somewhere smile.

Wassup, he is globally delayed but the CDC atm is his weakest area, apart from self-care. I think it's a bit of a chicken-egg situation, nobody can say if the DCD causes ds to be delayed or if the delay causes the CDC..

2006hildy Fri 12-Apr-13 14:07:36

Herts but IPSEA tribunal line says they are all as bad as each other.

I was going to approach it by telling the Family Support Worker who is lead professional in our case.

(I get on with her even though her minutes have been economical with the truth. They must go through a tribunal proof process before they reach me as they take soo long as well)

That I will only turn up if there is an agenda and that everyone has seen ds otherwise no TAC meeting and wait for everyone to contact me by letter instead. I don’t request anything anymore I just let them do their jobs or not as case may be.

babiki Fri 12-Apr-13 14:13:07

Ouch yes Herts is infamous too.

I will probably combine your approach with Star's - our key worker is OK as well, I realised I don't have all of their email adresses so just will send them generic email through her.

Let me know once you do it what's the reaction..and good luck.

wasuup3000 Fri 12-Apr-13 14:24:34


babiki Fri 12-Apr-13 14:49:02

I meant DCD of course, sorry
maybe CDC also means something smile

wasuup3000 Fri 12-Apr-13 15:24:02

OK smile

2006hildy Fri 12-Apr-13 16:26:14

ok will do

CouthySaysEatChoccyEggs Fri 12-Apr-13 18:36:24

I have a TAC meeting for DS3 'soon'.

I however, have the DDA and the equality act to be behind my request to record the meeting, as I have memory issues caused by my disability.

Everybody hates it, but then I can type up the transcript and send them a copy.

I'm hoping that this means that nobody can wriggle out of things!

(I'm in Essex...)

CouthySaysEatChoccyEggs Fri 12-Apr-13 18:51:47

Parent partnership might have someone now - we've been 4 years without one in our part of North Essex. They're in the LA's pocket, but at least it will be somebody there with us.

My Ex is even going to take the time off work...

My goal from the TAC meeting is for them to see that due to DS3's issues, MS Nursery isn't the correct placement for him, I have found a perfectly good SN Nursery, the Specialist Pre-School Education Assessor agreed with me, and I'm just waiting for an answer from the pre-school assessment board to finalise this placement.

I want some proper SALT help - even if it is just a Makaton course.

I want a referral to OT to assess and tell me if there is any equipment to help him with his hypermobile joints - I get DLA, am happy to buy most equipment myself from that, just want advice.

I want Physio to actually SEE him, rather than just 'keep him on their books', as I don't want to run the risk of him developing kyphosis like DS2.

I want a referral to the allergist at the Evelina in London, rather than the local one, as the local one didn't listen to me properly, filled his report with inaccuracies, though did dx DS3 with anaphylaxis to dairy, tree bits and peanuts, and also with an allergy to soy.

I want them all to accept that I am not 'over exaggerating' his health issues and disabilities, but that I just want what is best for him right now, and that I feel that Early Intervention is far more cost effective, with better outcomes, than a 'watchful wait', having been here twice before.

I would like to go on a course directed at parents of toddlers with Autism / ADHD for support. (Though he hasn't got a firm dx of ADHD due to age, he does have a dx of hyperactivity 'with a high probability of ADHD'). His ADOS is in May, so I'm hoping that the TAC meeting us postponed until after that.

The Specialist Pre-School assessor is recommending sensory integration therapy - so at the very least it has been recognised that DS3 has some sensory processing issues.

Along with his severely delayed speech, I don't feel that MS Nursery, especially with the drop in ratios from 1:3 to 1:4 in September, is going to be an appropriate placement for him - and neither do the local pre-schools!

Blimey Couthy. I know it isn't supposed to work like this, but if it wasn't for you know, all your kinds and stuff grin you could probably make quite a bit as an independent advocate.

babiki Fri 12-Apr-13 19:38:58

Wow Couthy, I can see the point of TAC for you!
Agree with Star, once you got the kids sorted in the best possible way you can have a great career ahead of you smile

But getting Physio to SEE a child in Essex will be difficult! Our one is very good at 'observing' and writing hilarious reports but never actually touched ds smile I don't know why they just don't call themselves 'assesors' instead of therapists.

Last year, while still being very naive I have asked about hydrotherapy and she almost kneeled over laughing...so funny, isn't it, that something widely available in so-called Eastern European countries (hands on physio and hydrotherapy) is seen as a luxury in one of the richest countries in the world!!

If they get rid of all the air hot bullshit meetings and Early Support huge bibles etc maybe they could actually do stuff that works...

CouthySaysEatChoccyEggs Fri 12-Apr-13 23:20:15

Would it pain you to know that my DS2 is actually getting hydrotherapy? blush

It's taken until he is 9yo, has developed kyphosis from lack of Physio input, and is in severe pain though...

CouthySaysEatChoccyEggs Fri 12-Apr-13 23:22:55

Believe me, 15 years ago, when I first had DD, I was bloody clueless!

I thought, naively, that these therapists etc actually DID stuff...

Little did I know!

I only know how to work the system to my advantage because I've spent a decade and a half attempting to navigate it...

And even now, there's plenty that I don't know!!

CouthySaysEatChoccyEggs Fri 12-Apr-13 23:22:56

Believe me, 15 years ago, when I first had DD, I was bloody clueless!

I thought, naively, that these therapists etc actually DID stuff...

Little did I know!

I only know how to work the system to my advantage because I've spent a decade and a half attempting to navigate it...

And even now, there's plenty that I don't know!!

CouthySaysEatChoccyEggs Fri 12-Apr-13 23:23:18

Sorry for double post.

babiki Fri 12-Apr-13 23:51:07

Couthy that's wonderful that ds2 is getting it! And so he should!

I have spent every summer in a rehabilitation centre (we call it spa) having various types of physio and hydrotherapy etc..because of my arthritis. It was not that bad (diagnosed when I was 6) but it was preventetive - and it probably worked, as I am very lucky and it has not deteriorated much at all.

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