Here some suggested organisations that offer expert advice on SN.

omg im so upset...what do you think they were suggesting?

(50 Posts)
crazygal Thu 07-Feb-13 18:19:13

hi..
My ds is 8 with adhd and aspergers..
Ive been having a lady from 'point 1' come round to help me with anger and anxiety management and over all abit of support...
She has been with us 5/6 times,
and today she said she has some concerns!
She said she has an alarm bell in her head....because last week he told her he didn't like his bed room cause ghosts where in there,and he didn't like the kitchen cause aliens are in there and someone might kill him...he wont go to the loo in case something pops out of it to get him!
and in school he wont use the loo,and he said he dosen't like the doors when there half open in case someone gets him...she was told all of these anxieties last week....
Today she said she was really concerned...she asked was there any trauma in his life? I said no? why? why are you that concerned?
She said its just a little alarm bell going off,that he's too scared! that something has happened for him to feel such anxeities....
That children with anxieties that high have normally had a trauma!
I'm feeling quite upset at the moment....am I reading to deep?
I asked her have we caused it?as we do get angry and frustrated with him...we have spoke about stranger danger to him and wandering off!
he has seen me get upset...i told her he's like a woodpecker going at our heads at times...he's knows we are fed up....
But at the same time we do loads with him....we praise him,take him out,play With him etc....Maybe we are not doing enough??!!
maybe we should never get angry...do I let him away with what he wants?we are strict with our discipline,eat at the table,no sweets only on sundays,he earns pudding etc etc....
what do we do?
Dh asked if i was reading to deep into it?he wasn't with me at the meeting..

porridgeLover Thu 07-Feb-13 18:45:22

I don't know what 'point 1' is. Does it mean she is familiar and experienced with ASD?

I do know that DS (ASD) goes through phases of expressing his general anxiety by being afraid of going upstairs alone at night. Or being scared after over-identifying with a programme (the Richard III thing on C4 has had him scared for the last 2 nights). Or scared of a black hole sucking us all in.

Does that sound more like what is going on for your DS?

crazygal Thu 07-Feb-13 18:47:55

yes porridge thats similar to ds....if theres a story at school he will over think it and make himself scared!
Or the discovery channel...he will see spiders or whales and next thing you know there coming for him!

crazygal Thu 07-Feb-13 18:50:17

she told me she has worked with asd before...but really i think she is the first one they put you touch with before CAMHS

Awomansworth Thu 07-Feb-13 18:51:09

Unless she is a trained professional, she isn't qualified to suggest that your ds's anxiety is caused by anything. Even if she were I doubt she would be coming to those conclusions after spending so little time with him.

Can you eplain what point 1 is please.

Ineedmorepatience Thu 07-Feb-13 18:53:11

Hi crazy, the first thing that popped into my head was how he is explaining his anxiety, my Dd3 has difficultly in explaining how she is feeling so she appears that she is either happy, sad or cross and not much else. She is completely unable to explain a level of fear so she is either terrified of something or not at all bothered by it.

She is the same with pain, she is either rolling around in agony or fine. This could be for a tiny scratch or a major bump.

I am probably not explaining myself very well but this could be more about the way he explains the fears rather than the actual level of anxiety.

crazygal Thu 07-Feb-13 18:56:18

Thank you Awoman!
There a point 1..then 2 then 3, 3 been the highest...3 been camhs...
she, the point 1 offer support to families who need it,they run parenting courses aswell..
they can come into the home or school and give guidance.

crazygal Thu 07-Feb-13 18:58:40

Ineedmore...she asked me to try and get his fears out in to the open...so over a few days i noted down everything he said he was scared of...and i rang her with them...i wish i hadnt!

sickofsocalledexperts Thu 07-Feb-13 19:02:46

Oh how ridiculous of this silly "amateur psychologist" woman. Anxiety goes hand in hand with AS , and indeed many other normally functioning kids with over-active imaginations.

My perfectly NF, grammar school clever Dd, age 12', still asks me to check under the bath for "a tiny vampire" just before she gets in. She also watched Jaws and is now scared of our local swimming pool (someone might be keeping a shark in a tank next door to the pool, and open a door into the deep-end, apparently).

Tell this ignoramus that AS is often co-morbid with anxiety, OCD etc

Childhood trauma, my arse!

Awomansworth Thu 07-Feb-13 19:05:46

Well from your explanation it doesn't sound like she is in any position to be making these assumptions. I would be speaking to her superior.

As Ineed suggest sometimes with ASD the individuals response is sometimes out of kilter with the situation not saying this is the case for your ds though.

My ds had an accident yesterday at school, quite a nasty cut to his knee, yet I only discovered it at bath time, he hadn't complained at school nor to me, it apparently didn't hurt! On the flip side, we can we walking along the pavement and he is visable scared of cars going by often saying that they are going to come onto the pavement and he will be dead!

crazygal Thu 07-Feb-13 19:08:20

sickofsocalledexperts! love the name by the way!
Thank you...this has really upset me this evening...ive been judging myself since she left and milling over every year of his life...and asking dh what have we done?we are guilty of shouting...and ive tapped his hand twice about a yr ago..he has everything he wants
hes quite spoilt..and maybe some of that is an issue
but i have been told before that high anxiety goes hand in hand...he has the ocd to and sensory...
you have made me feel a whole lot better!!!! xxx

coff33pot Thu 07-Feb-13 19:13:20

Tbh I would say thank you now move me to point 2........

did camhs not diagnose him crazygal? I know down here its them that do it or is he still under assessment x because if he is just tell her straight to get the assessment moving to 3 and have done with.

I cant see what she is getting at. DS does this on and off all the time with a TV programme, he wouldnt go upstairs on his own for weeks after dh let him watch chitty chitty bang bang with the child catcher. So I guess you could say yep he watched a film that traumatised him?

Please dont worry too much as tbh our children are quite often so sensitive that anything can build up anxiety and cause them to be scared x

Awomansworth Thu 07-Feb-13 19:13:51

Ha... we are all agreeing, but sickof puts it far more elequently. grin

Ineedmorepatience Thu 07-Feb-13 19:15:44

Oh I see, so you just gave her a list, sorry I thought she asked him.

I think most verbal children with ASD would give a long list of things that frighten them. The world is a scary place when it is noisy, smelly, dark and people say wierd things like "he laughed his head off!!"

Bless him

coff33pot Thu 07-Feb-13 19:19:18

DS is upset today due to him not seeing any rabbits in a field when out. By the time he finished he decided that there were bunny traps in the field and thats why and that the farmer fenced it off (there was a fence) and him and his friend put bunny traps all over the place to catch all the rabbits!

He traumatized himself by his imagination and ideas going over the top see? x

crazygal Thu 07-Feb-13 19:20:27

Yes i loved sickof post!!!
DH has just said she only seen ds 3 times and us twice...1st time for us to meet her,and second time to set up a caf...
coff33pot the pead dx him...and the last time we seen her i got myself in a state of i cant cope any more! so she suggested sending this 'point1' to our house for extra support and help with ds,as the as diagnosis is quite new,and i didnt know alot about it...

crazygal Thu 07-Feb-13 19:21:58

omg thank you all!!!

coff33pot Thu 07-Feb-13 19:23:35

Well crazygal I dont think the "point 1" knows much about it and really isnt in a position to suggest such things and then leave you to worry about it x

Its certainly not a professional way to go about it anyhow.

crazygal Thu 07-Feb-13 19:31:39

Yes true...
I try dam hard with ds...and for someone to come in and say that those anxieties are normally down to a trauma really shocked me! I said to her we went on honeymoon for a week a left him with my mum...she said no....that's not really what I'm talking about. She said its more then that..it's like he scared of life,and the world is scarey,but it's like something has happened to him...I couldn't bring myself to ask what do you mean...I would've cried as I feel guilty about most things,getting him to sit down to eat...read...do teeth...it's all a hard battle,and maybe he can't cope with that? Do I need to lay off him and just let him be?

Arithmeticulous Thu 07-Feb-13 19:33:28

Unless she is a clinical psychologist, I wouldn't start to worry.

My DC1 is just being dx - I thought I was well read but had no idea about anxiety and ASD. I hadn't thought about things being extra scary because of being so literal - thanks for that.

Goodtalkingtoo Thu 07-Feb-13 19:43:51

Hi this sounds exactly like my son and no it's not caused by any trauma he has been through and he's 14, and I too have been in a similar situation.

My son said to his learning support teacher that he saw a boy on the beach that looked like him and was worried it was his evil twin. This caused a great deal of concern, not to me cos I am used to him, but to her.

I am not saying she is wrong I am not familiar with point 1 but in my many years of dealing with my son and the system I have seen many wrong or over exaggerated conclusions being jumped to.

My son builds up unbelievable fears about the end of the world, if he even sees a trailer for a disaster movie then that's it. He takes the idea, builds it in his head till it become a full blown reality. Definately not caused by any trauma but just the way he.

crazygal Thu 07-Feb-13 19:45:02

She also said she wanted to refer me to a "point3"(camhs) as they would be able to deal with his anxieties better.
I'm feeling anxious about it though as she said she is going to pass her notes and thoughts onto them,this lady from point 1 has also told me she has been made redundant from next week...so I won't be seeing her again.

coff33pot Thu 07-Feb-13 19:55:29

Thats great you wont be seeing her again.

At least you have bypassed 2 and gone to hopefully the professionals that have clinical psychs etc to help with anxiety. Dont worry its not your fault and despite what she puts in the reports they have to assess you fully first and make their own decisions on how best to help your DS. BTW I hope she intends to send you a report copy?

Ineedmorepatience Thu 07-Feb-13 19:56:09

Fwiw, I think a referral to camhs could be a good thing. They should be well trained professionals and may be able to help your Ds with his anxieties. Especially if you have concerns over ocd.

Good lucksmile

zzzzz Thu 07-Feb-13 21:07:28

There was a thread a few weeks ago where we discovered just how many of us have children who "are" or have been scared to go to the toilet, upstairs or whatever. I can't imagine why she thinks that is an indication of trauma??

Amateur Psychologists do my head in. Ignore ignore ignore, FFS surely there are enough real issues without inventing subplots.

crazygal Thu 07-Feb-13 21:18:06

My dh wants to ring her tomorrow and give her what for over the phone
causing such worry and stress to an already stressful situation,
he thinks I should show her this thread too...

sickofsocalledexperts Thu 07-Feb-13 21:27:59

I would be careful about shouting the odds to Camhs staff. Always be calm and polite. I also don't think she will give us old mums much credit. Perhaps google up an article or two on AS. If you put Aspergers and anxiety or OCD in google you will find something. But be calm and measured, or I am afraid you look like you are protesting too much. An email might be better, referring to the worry caused

zzzzz Thu 07-Feb-13 21:29:59

Save your strength, blame the parents/past experiences is the default setting of tons of pseudo professionals.

coff33pot Thu 07-Feb-13 21:30:51

Feel free to, it may make her think twice on assumption and she may just learn something about asd and anxiety wink

Personally though I would treat it with the contempt it deserves. That she is unprofessional, not a psych and is a "point 1" which basically sounds like a support "helper" and you get volounteers that do that not necessarily trained ones.

Go to camhs with an open mind and start afresh. If they have "suggestions" go for it keep a diary and note what worked or didnt. Even if it takes going through the motions of the same suggestions over to prove its not that then I would as it eventually will leave them in a corner where they have to admit defeat and stop blaming the parents and start looking at the real issues behind his anxiety as asd based x

sickofsocalledexperts Thu 07-Feb-13 21:31:47

http://www.autism.org.uk/working-with/health/mental-health-and-asperger-syndrome.aspx

Here is a good, reputable article

sickofsocalledexperts Thu 07-Feb-13 21:32:04
troutsprout Thu 07-Feb-13 21:34:40

Omg ! The silly cow! These are normal (lol ) asd anxieties!
Some of ds's more unusual anxieties when he was younger:
The "gonk gonk gonk" - the noise the toilet made when it had finished flushing .
One whole summer he refused to use his left hand ( he's left handed) because he thought he had touched poison with it.
Chocolate would make him have a heart attack and die ( thank you year 1 teacher)
He was frightened his skin would fall off.. He used to press his skin on in an OCD manner.
He was frightened of a corner in his bedroom.

Fwiw... He's now 15 and He cracks up with laughter at some of these now.
Honestly!...The silly woman! Makes me flipping mad!

sickofsocalledexperts Thu 07-Feb-13 21:36:03
ouryve Thu 07-Feb-13 21:40:29

It sounds like it's a good thing that you'll be rid of her ans are being referred straight to CAMHS. If your DS is so anxious, he needs to be seen by a professional rather than someone who sounds like they've read too much wikipedia.

crazygal Thu 07-Feb-13 21:41:09

Yes thank you...i will go in with a fresh start...the link is great!! i think thats a good plan..ill give her them (she said she might be at the caf)
plus after going through some of the notes with info she left me on the 2nd visit theres a piece on AS anxiety at school!
should my dh ring and ask her to elaborate?

crazygal Thu 07-Feb-13 21:42:59

Thanks sickof x

Selks Thu 07-Feb-13 23:01:48

CAMHS clinician here. That woman is completely jumping the gun. Yes your DC sounds anxious, but to suggest that strong anxiety is usually caused by trauma is wrong and misguided. Sometimes it can be, but children get anxious for a variety of reasons, and children on the autistic spectrum can be more anxious than some.
CAMHS might be a good idea though if the anxiety is reaching a problematic level.

cory Thu 07-Feb-13 23:52:01

She sounds like the paediatrician who told us that dd's joint pains must have been caused by trauma because that would be the only explanation for such strong psychosomatic pains.

The week after dd was seen by a rheumatologist who took one look at her ankles and muttered "yes, I can see why that would hurt".

Dd has Ehlers Danlos syndrome. She also has anxiety levels that are absolutely sky high (normal concomitant of EDS). What she's never had is a trauma.

crazygal Fri 08-Feb-13 08:06:53

SELKS nice to hear that from you..thank you! thats very reassuring. and of course all the other stories here on the anxieties!
Do I say something? Or just leave it? I've gone from upset to cross now...that I went to my dr for help and it's ended like this..
I keep looking at ds at wondering if I've done something,something to cause it...the lady yesterday asked me to think of anything!
And I can't...the only things were that we went on honeymoon 6 yrs ago for week without him and that We get cross with him..
But the praise and love we give him way out balances that,but could it be that?
Honestly,as I'm sure you will all understand,he's like a woodpecker most days at our heads,and we do tell him firmly,no! Enough,and we try to distract....
It's at night to...calling us lots...right up till 12/1...or else he will fall asleep straight away and wake at 1.and he doesn't go back to sleep....
He's on two melatonin.
We both work full time.
It is hard and I wonder is he sencing this off us which in turn is causing his anxiety? Or am I reading to deep in to it all now?

sickofsocalledexperts Fri 08-Feb-13 08:22:23

I would probably say something calm. AS kids are very complex, and I would think the thoughts of ghosts and monsters could as easily have come from watching an episode of scooby doo, plus an over active imagination and a lack of ability to separate fiction from fact. With my DD, I try and get her factual brain to take over: there are no such thing as tiny vampires, it is a biological impossibility, so there could not be one under the bath. Has he seen any scary films recently, or read any books that are scary.

sickofsocalledexperts Fri 08-Feb-13 08:25:31

I see that most articles recommend CBT type therapy for AS anxieties, so maybe CAMHS can actually help. Maybe also get his melatonin looked at as perhaps the slow release type would be better.

crazygal Fri 08-Feb-13 08:27:16

He watches cartoons and its later at night he thinks things are in his room...or the other week at school they spoke about space...the Neil Armstrong was suddenly in his room...he looses bear grils but that can end in disaster as bear tells you what "could" happen. And he had fears of the snakes in the loo after bear grils killed one...etc etc. we have stopped him watching that now which is a shame,as we all enjoyed it and its better than sponge on!, so at the moment we are careful about tv...no news,no discovery,etc.

crazygal Fri 08-Feb-13 08:28:37

Sorry watches bear grils! ( ipad)

sickofsocalledexperts Fri 08-Feb-13 08:36:16

See I would tell him there are no poisonous snakes in Britain, except adders which can't survive in water, so no loo fear! Late night fear of monsters is v normal - the whole film Monsters inc is based on that!

sickofsocalledexperts Fri 08-Feb-13 08:37:32

Actually maybe don't mention the adders! I still won't walk in long grass or ferns since someone told me about them as a child.

sickofsocalledexperts Fri 08-Feb-13 08:46:36

Trouble is you can't protect kids from seeing or hearing about scary things, so they have to find or be helped to find methods to control anxiety and put fears in perspective. It's part of growing up for an anxious kid, which I probably was too, like my DD.

sickofsocalledexperts Fri 08-Feb-13 08:48:30

But of course that over active imagination can also be a good thing, eg my daughters writes loads of v imaginative stories

ouryve Fri 08-Feb-13 19:50:52

DS1 displayed a perfect example of the overactive ASD imagination, this afternoon. I made him a veggieburger for lunch and he sat at ate it, but complained that it had too much horse meat in it grin

And anyone who follows me on twitter, may have seen the picture of him hiding under the table because DS2 was eating a big bowl of scary rice pudding.

crappypatty Fri 08-Feb-13 20:09:12

Daft woman, obviously not as experienced or knowledge as she thinks. Ds 8 is exactly the same, it's very common.

crazygal Fri 08-Feb-13 21:57:12

Hi all...
Firstly let me thank you for all your support!
Today this lady rand my dh to confirm the date and time of the caf meeting,
while she was on the phone,dh asked her to elaborate on the comments she made to me?
dh told her she had upset me and caused alot of stress,as my mind was going round and round,he told her I googled lots and everything came up that children on the spectrum had high anxiety....
She said she had a list of questions and that was just one of them!
She sent her sincere apologies to me......She said there was no offence meant,that it was just a question!
She asked dh to ask for me to ring her so she could explain and to say sorry.....

I feel alot better this evening,(the large wine helped)
And feel really proud that dh done this for me smile
We have all had a lovely eve,we went for a meal,ds coloured,and we got to have a good chat about things,x

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