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Tips for pending Tribunal

(66 Posts)
santaclaw1 Sat 29-Dec-12 17:40:40

Have refusal to assess tribunal very, very soon.

I have the bundle here.

Where did you start?

What did you focus on?

and any other tips?

Naelith Sat 29-Dec-12 19:17:53

Hi I have done a couple of these recently for my kids and my nephew, we went through the bundle and picked out all the areas the kids were not making progress on. I had a seperate piece of paper with the bundle page number and a quick reference comment about what that page held. It came in handy as I was able to say to the panel on page such and such of the bundle the ed psych states such and such.
I concentrated on the fact that the school had done masses to help my dd ( they hadn't done much but it showed I wasn't upset with school just wanted help for dd) but the progress was slower than that of her peers and for my dd her emotional state had actually deteriorated as she is now a school refuser.
I also found it helpful to have a pad and paper with me on the day. I made sure I didn't interrupt when someone else was talking but if there was something I wanted to say or I disagreed with someone I wrote it on my pad and brought it up when it was my turn to speak.
Good luck.

StarOfLightMcKings3 Sat 29-Dec-12 19:33:16

Dress like a mum, not a business woman. Have 5 key points to get across to include in summing up. Be prepared to have the role of onlooker as you are largely ignored for the majority. Take lunch as venues can be expensive. Put your deflection shield up and don't argue back when LA witnesses attempt to rile you.

StarOfLightMcKings3 Sat 29-Dec-12 19:34:33

And take the very best wishes of us all, with you!

TheTimeTravellersWife Sat 29-Dec-12 20:51:37

Definitely take some refreshments - you don't want to find yourself queuing up at the coffee machine with the opposition!
Bach rescue remedy (or whatever works for you) for nerves.
Smart clothes, that you feel comfortable in, but agree with Star, not the place for power dressing.
Mark up the bundle with post it notes, highlighter pen important parts.
Write notes as you go along.
Don't do what I did and shout at one of the LA's witnesses! blush
You'll be fine - you have the power of MNSN behind you!

santaclaw1 Sat 29-Dec-12 21:06:03

Thanks, i was planning on

1. My main reasons ie bullet points of failed to make progress. Giving examples and referring to bundle/experts.

2. LA main points of dispute ie they are saying they can meet needs from within resources. ie The level of support ds needs is more than a school can provide own resources and he has too many areas of needs and too complex. Giving examples etc.

3. The evidence i need to give relating to how his difficulties impact on him/us at home.

Whether i am asked about 1 and 3, i dont know. Last time all i was asked about was about 3.

I really cant see this going all the way. The LA's evidence is basically 'can provide from own resources and is making progress'

They have provided unevaluated IEP's or handwriting comments in evaluation, with silly comments like achieves when he is in the mood.

The levels of attainment they provided are all over the place.

and that is all their evidence, some IEP's.

wasuup3000 Sun 30-Dec-12 00:24:51

Have all lack of progress evidence to hand to include in one of your main points. The Judge can simply take the schools word that he is making progress if he feels like it - so this is one of the main areas you need to have clear evidence on.

santaclaw1 Sun 30-Dec-12 11:02:00

Thanks Wassup, that is exactly what happened last time.

mariammama Sun 30-Dec-12 11:19:50

Make sure you stick to 'failure to make adequate progress'. I know it's just shorthand here that you're saying 'failed to make progress' but the LEA will have you by the short and curlies if you make that slip in tribunal, they're bound to have some evidence of a tiny bit of apparent progress in one or two areas. Even if it's a blatent lie, 'well, last term the head watched an assembly and thinks she came on marvellously, she didn't run out crying until almost the end'

mariammama Sun 30-Dec-12 11:21:54

I found using the terms 'inadequate progress', 'minimal progress', 'no progress' and 'loss of skills' stopped me falling into that bear trap.

AgnesDiPesto Sun 30-Dec-12 21:28:58

Or given the circumstances you could use phrases like 'regression', 'skill loss', 'gone backwards', 'loss of confidence' 'heightened anxiety, which when it went recognised by school, developed into self harm, significant mental health problems and possible school phobia', 'unmet needs' or even 'negative progress'!

Emphasise you have tried everything, you have been patient, you have given all the various 'plans' 'NILs' etc time to work but now enough time has been lost. Tribunals are quite sensitive to the idea of lost education and making up for lost time. I don't just mean when he has been out of school, I mean lost education since the last tribunal.

AgnesDiPesto Sun 30-Dec-12 21:29:19

unrecognised!

santaclaw1 Mon 31-Dec-12 18:21:40

Thanks Guys, im writing it now, just a break for coffee.

The problem im having is more unmet needs, so progress cannot be recorded and i dont want it to look like school could do more, instead of statement.

For example LA are saying needs can be met by resources from school and external agencies (such as SALT and ASD Advisory etc)

The problem is school have NEVER called upon these resources. So im having to go for the resources ds needs could NEVER be provided without a statement.

Also i wanted to ask can a SA tribunal decide what is the best education for ds to receive NOW, while SA is taking place??

At the moment i am having to work on the 'plan' to send ds back to this school, when i dont want him to go back there.

1. Relationship has broken down.
2. How can i work on any plan, when school are witnesses for LA and are opposing my request to have ds's needs assessed.
3. They are bloody dangerous. They cannot understand his needs and have reported me to CP for bringing his needs to their attention.

Can an SA rule that the LA has to find another form of education for ds?

(i am assuming tribunal will agree SA of course)

wasuup3000 Mon 31-Dec-12 18:34:57

One step at a time - the first step is to convince the tribunal judge to order the LA to assess? That is the only matter that the tribunal will deal with at this time.
The LA's angle is over anxious parent, likes attention of professionals, said ds is actually OK in school because school say so, parent is making situation worse.
Your angle son has significant difficulties, is regressing when at school and self harming and not making adequate progress. Son not presently able to access education at all due to school and LA failures to address his needs, hence they need reassessing to ensure needs are met.

StarOfLightMcKings3 Mon 31-Dec-12 18:58:54

Claw, if you have to appeal an NIL or statement contents then there will be plenty to present at that time plus you will have additional evidence in the time that it takes.

At the moment you have to show that he 'probably' needs a statement and that the LA do not yet possess the information they need to be certain he does not, or that they do possess enough information to suggest that he 'probably' needs a statement but are not doing their duty of assessing.

When you and your parenting is brought up, be sure to remind the panel that this is about the child and his rights. Children of unreasonable parents can still need statements after all.

santaclaw1 Mon 31-Dec-12 19:14:37

Thanks Wassup, thats true i need to focus on SA. But they keep throwing in meetings with SW and school inbetween.

I have to attend a meeting with school and SW etc the day before Tribunal, to report on how the 'plan' is going to get ds into school. I think it is totally unreasonable to expect me to work with a school, who despite being told the day before Tribunal that ds's anxiety is school related and he now requires therapy from CAMHS to 'reduce his self harming' and 'work on getting him back to education' and address 'school related anxieties' and being told by CAMHS his worries are very big and very real and relate to school and ds has told them he never wants to go back there.

Will turn up at Tribunal next day and report 'ds is happy in school and is making pleasing progress'

StarOfLightMcKings3 Mon 31-Dec-12 19:20:51

Write to the SW and request that this meeting of the day before, is postponed until after the tribunal as with tribunal pending you won't be able to give the matter your full attention.

Regardless of whether they agree, Take a copy of this letter with you to tribunal and refer to it/read from it at some point. I think it is important that the tribunal panel are aware that they have done this.

santaclaw1 Mon 31-Dec-12 19:38:48

Star, SW will not postpone and will just conclude im 'disengaging' and being 'obstructive'.

The meeting is totally pointless, CAMHS have already told them its a gradual process and will require tiny steps to get him back to school. So new term starts on the 7th, we have a meeting on the 10th to see how 'plan' is going after 3 days!

Sw is recommending that school need to start gathering evidence for a statement to met ds's needs. Yet school are opposing my request to do exactly that.

Sw doesnt know what the hell she is doing, she hasnt got a clue.

StarOfLightMcKings3 Mon 31-Dec-12 19:46:11

It doesn't matter if she doesn't postpone, the point is that you have evidence of her unreasonableness.

Tbh, I would be inclined to cancel on the day and let the LA tell the tribunal that you didn't attend said stupid and stressful meeting the day before. I imagine it will raise eyebrows, especially if you have letter requesting a 2 day postponement in your clutches. You can simply say that you need to put your chikd's needs before their policy and you are therefore prioritising getting rested and prepared for the tribunal.

mariammama Mon 31-Dec-12 19:53:25

SW is recommending school crack on with getting DS a statement, and recommending you 'work with' school to get him back into education. Well, they're going to fail completely to do the first bit, whilst any attempt you make to 'work with' them ticks your box. Methinks the HT and LEA might soon rue the day they tried to involve SS in this charade, even if it feels bad now.

To 'work with' the school you need 1. to be satisfied with their risk assessment 2. to have a mutually agreed set of baby-steps towards reattendance and 3. For them to demonstrate enough trustworthiness for you to take the risk of your DS deteriorating. You can ask SW to help you draw up a plan (SMaRT etc) towards these aims. Eventually the penny will drop that you're right fully engaged and school are lying mistaken.

StarOfLightMcKings3 Mon 31-Dec-12 19:55:57

Have you this SWs recommendation of a statement in writing?

mariammama Mon 31-Dec-12 20:00:37

You can ask SW to meet with you first to go through your pre-agenda. If you do end up missing or rearranging the meeting, but it goes ahead anyway, you've met her half-way.

SW might end up at school alone with the HT, but well enough informed to be DS's advocate, which is part of her job.

santaclaw1 Mon 31-Dec-12 20:11:02

Yep Star in writing, part of her core assessment, she slags me off totally in the report about 'disengaging' and 'not following professional advice', which isnt true, but anyhow her 'suggested plan'

Category of need "ds to be back in full time education. Difficulties id high levels of anxiety about school and how he copes with the work and his peers. What needs to happen - assessment from CAMHS and school to gather evidence for statement in order for support in school to be put in place"

santaclaw1 Mon 31-Dec-12 20:14:43

BUT her idea of how this should be done, which she has stated verbally is that ds MUST attend school in order for school to gather evidence!

I have told her this isnt how school gather evidence to GET a statement, they complete an SA. But as i said she doesnt have a clue, what she is talking about.

StarOfLightMcKings3 Mon 31-Dec-12 20:17:21

Oh. Blimey.

Just hang in there.

Does your prep point to SW rec for statement?

StarOfLightMcKings3 Mon 31-Dec-12 20:30:12

Do you think she is/ever could be persuaded to be on your side?

Or is she just a muppet?

santaclaw1 Mon 31-Dec-12 20:31:29

I have a social worker who is totally out of her depth and doesnt understand professional advice and doesnt have a clue about education or special needs or the processes involved.

For example CAMHS and EWO told me if ds was not fit to attend, take him to GP. I take him to GP, GP signs ds off, a few days later SW is arranging meetings for ds to return to school and putting plans in place, when he has a medical certificate stating he is not fit to attend.

Then writes in report i am 'incapable' of following professional advice!

She is recommending that school need to gather evidence for a statement to put support in place in school. While school are opposing my request to do exactly that and going to tribunal to oppose it!

Ive tried explaining it to her verbally, but she is obviously not understanding.

Maybe i need to put it in writing briefly with my request to postpone the meeting?

StarOfLightMcKings3 Mon 31-Dec-12 20:33:36

Yes I would. Be nice though. It is your last chance to show how utterly utterly sensible you are in a crazy world.

santaclaw1 Mon 31-Dec-12 20:47:27

Star even after CAMHS explained it would have to be a gradual, tiny step approach, with ds doing school work at home being step one and ds actually attending school being the goal. Me explaining, i have started the process already ie trying to do school work and sorting out sleeping etc, etc.

She insisted on a 'start' date, of the first day of term. A 'start' to what exactly! A start on me trying to get ds into school.

In one ear and out the other. Admittedly she has been thrown into a complex case and is trying to get her head around it. But she is just full steam ahead with HER plan, disregarding everything else.

She is the one who told me to go and pick ds up from school immediately and take him to A&E after she interviewed him in school.

Yet a few weeks later she is making plans for him to return to school and when it doesnt work, turning up at my house, not happy and threatening ds to the point he locked himself in a bedroom to get away from her.

She is out of her depth and really doesnt have a clue what she is doing or how to handle it.

She has calmed down a bit, now CAMHS are involved, but even then ignores what they say and ahead with her plan.

StarOfLightMcKings3 Mon 31-Dec-12 20:49:18
santaclaw1 Mon 31-Dec-12 21:00:33

No not at all Star, its brilliant, i am up to my eyes in it and any help and advice is much appreciated. Will have a read. thanks smile

AgnesDiPesto Mon 31-Dec-12 23:31:11

I would refuse the meeting tbh. Write and say that your priority is to succeed in getting SA and getting right support in place is integral to success of plan to return DS to education. You can tell sw (in writing) that while she clearly agrees SA is necessary the school and SEN Manager do not agree and are proceeding with tribunal against the sw advice. Therefore the tribunal has to be your priority and you will not be able to meet her to discuss plan to return DS to school until after tribunal, which is after all only a few days away. You will be spending the day before tribunal preparing for what will no doubt be a stressful experience for you and your family and you are sure she will understand you have to give this your full attention. Then give a list of several dates in the following 2 weeks when you can meet. Then take the letter with you to tribunal.

This is just a cheap trick to keep you occupied and stop you having time to deal with tribunal. If the meeting had any bearing on tribunal then there is a risk the tribunal may be critical of you not attending - but here it has no bearing at all and you can point out the last meeting to discuss the exact same issues took place on x date if the LA raise it - and I doubt they will as it will make them look like bullies.

I would not answer the phone or the door that week unless you are sure it is not sw. Take the battery out of the doorbell if necessary so you can blame that if she comes and you do not answer.

The tribunal cannot tie any future tribunal about what should be in a statement but they can make critical comments and give a firm 'steer' about what they might have expected to see, or about time lost. They can also make factual findings so could for eg find that your DS school anxiety etc is real and not fabricated by you or at the very least deserves to be properly investigated by CAMHS.

It may take a few weeks to get tribunal decision so you will need to be prepared for the 'plan' to enforced in the weeks between the hearing and the decision.

And for the last time in 2012.....Wot Agnes said.

santaclaw1 Mon 31-Dec-12 23:59:15

Thanks guys, i will scribble it down and

Happy new year xx

Happy New year to you too Claw. Hope things start to get better. You will come out of this, blinking in the sunshine, and you'll get on with life as if it never happened eventually, and once you have slept.

There are probably more challenges ahead in the near future but those hurdles are put there because you are getting close.

Keep going, steady.

sazale Tue 01-Jan-13 00:45:35

Wishing you all the best claw x

AgnesDiPesto Tue 01-Jan-13 10:28:37

Happy New Year Claw, if anyone deserves a good one its you.

mariammama Tue 01-Jan-13 13:37:48

Claw, the best defence against 'failure to engage' is appropriate engagement. Fire off a few very brief emails summarising the main points, and asking for urgent meetings straight after tribunal. You have engaged, many of the professionals haven't. This needs to be paper-trailed.

Send the emails to: SW, SW's boss, ed psych, HT, CAMHS, EWO, statementing officer at LEA. Copy in your local councillor, the head of children's services, and (if you're feeling really narked) the chair of the multiprofessional child protection committee (local safeguarding children board).

Book a GP appointment to keep her updated, just beg the practice manager if you have trouble getting a slot. And school nurses are always worth keeping on board, you can get their office number off the old health visitor.

mariammama Tue 01-Jan-13 13:38:50

Having done that (and brief means 1 paragraph max) put your feet up and have a happy 2013 x

santaclaw1 Tue 01-Jan-13 15:23:08

Maria, i have fully 'engaged'. Sw has accused me of lots in her report, i think because she simply doesnt understand, but she is trying to make it look likes its me!

For example 'i am incapable of understanding professional advice'. I followed professional advice, i have everything in writing, its her who cannot understand the advice or how it works!

She is referring to my GP signing ds off from school. My GP signed ds off from school until further CAMHS assessment and plan in place, as he was an emotional wreck. My GP left the date blank as we didnt know exactly how long this would take, but we anticipated a few weeks.

I told her exactly this in writing and gave her a copy of medical certificate. My GP told her exactly this.

She has then written in her report that i am incapable of understanding professional advice!

She then arranged a meeting and put a plan for returning ds to school in place, despite him having a medical certificate stating he was not fit to attend.

Her plan didnt work, as ds was an emotional wreck and not sleeping of a night, which is why my GP signed him off in the first place!

She then accuses me of 'not engaging' with the plan.

and so on and on

wasuup3000 Tue 01-Jan-13 15:45:59

I had the same kind of thing with my daughter a few years ago - a vindictive head teacher who had some problems of his own and an equally awful SW. What changed it was an excellent Ed Psych who backed me up fully and the fact that some people in the LA knew that the said head teacher was an absolute nutter with control issues.

They try and blame it on the parents/mother aka having somekind of obsession with enjoying the attention from professionals and enjoying disagreeing with them and enjoying their child having SEN/difficulties.
You are damned if you do try and get the right education for your child and your child is damned if you don't.

Have you got a voice recorder or a dictaphone for anything verbal? Also keep everything in writing. Could you ask for a change of SW?

KeepOnKeepingOn1 Tue 01-Jan-13 16:20:23

claw I really hope that all goes well for you and DS at tribunal. atm you have to focus on tribunal. This means presenting the 'right' image - which means dispassionate, putting your emotions to one side and discussing the 'case' 'rationally'.

This other issue is not going to go away - regardless of the outcome of tribunal. I don't mean to be critical but your posts demonstrate a desire to tell your account of the facts as you see them over and over again. There is a practical danger in doing this as the account is unwittenly edited through repetition. Your 'not engaging' does not mean not communicating but relates to an idea of separate spinning cogs that fail to 'engage'. Every time you repeat your pov it reinforces the view that you are not able to see things from the pov of the professionals. There is also the possibility that you may be misinterpreting why things are happening as they are - it may be the case that the CIN was called to conform with statutory obigations following core assessment and not because you reported the SW to her manager.

Professionals will also interpret failure to engage (in terns of refusal of help/support) as indication that you do not have DS's best interests at heart. For example, at an ealier stage much was made of the need for CAMHS to complete assessment prior to any attempt at reintegration but when CAMHS did complete assessment and make recommendations they were discounted. This raises the question of whose advice you trust and will follow.

The other side can prove their appropriate engagement - how they have conformed to statutory advice and guidelines and have a paper-trail going back many months.

Please do not have false hope in the ability of tribunal to fix everything.

Sorry to be the voice of doom and gloom - again.

To be fair, if most of us agreed with and then followed professional advice there would be no tribunal system. If professional advice always led to our children's needs being met, there woukd be no parental wins at SENDIST.

inappropriatelyemployed Tue 01-Jan-13 18:24:25

Keepon - my advice would be just as gloomy. If two years of fighting things has taught me anything it is the paucity of commitment on the part of those who are employed to know/do better, to even do their job.

We have just had a request for a case management directions hearing refused despite the fact that the LA hasn't even set out its case in relation to one of the two small, but very specific, issues we are going to Tribunal on. The Order which came back was mumbo jumbo and our solicitor had done a very thorough job in her application.

When we had signed contract for new address and submitted, but still lived at old, (but submitted end of contract there document) new LA requested a Telephone conference to 'establish where we are living because they were confused'.

My solicitor booked barrister and herself for this. I wrote directly to tribunal and told them not to be silly and if new LA were confused about anything they could call me as my number had been supplied with documents. Tribunal then agreed and inwas spared £2.5k. hmm

santaclaw1 Tue 01-Jan-13 19:40:03

Keep, maybe that is how i do come across on here, maybe a bad habit of not being believed in RL for years and a desire to be believed or me trying to make sense myself of the conflicting advice i have been given, i dont know. I will take that onboard smile

I havent given my POV in real life or to professionals. It has just been a case of me following the advice that is given.

I might have a moan about professionals on here, however i would never do that in a meeting etc. I dont turn up for meetings and say i dont agree with that, its more a case of 'ok, il give it a try' kinda thing.

Regardless of why the CIN was called, i have taken on board there is nothing i can do about it and i have to work with it. That is what i have been doing.

However on here, i am saying it just appeared to me to be the case. SW had previously put in writing that she would be involved for 2 weeks, then close the case.

Her '2 week plan' before she closed the case, was for ds to return to school for one hour. It didnt work, because ds wasnt able to sleep of a night (i have now got Melatonin from CAMHS to try and remedy this, but i had to wait for this appointment)

She insisted during this time i attempt the plan regardless of ds not being able to sleep until early hours of the morning. I did attempt to wake him to get him to school and he went berserk.

She then turned up at my house and attempted to get ds to agree to return to school herself, it went wrong and i made a complaint about her.

I was then called to her office 2 days later, I was handed a core assessment and where i was told verbally by her that it was being raised to CIN because i did not get ds to school during those 2 weeks. If i did get ds to school, she would have closed the case.

Sorry if that is repeating again, but i am feeling misunderstood!

CAMHS have stated the plan needs to be flexible at the meeting SW attended too, step one is me completing school work at home, talking about school etc, etc.

SW then waited for CAMHS to leave the meeting and told me the core assessment was not finalised (i had told her the chronology was all wrong, with all wrong dates etc and asked for some time to get back to her) in the core assessment it states there is a time limit for ds to be returned to school and if he isnt then CP proceedings.

I expressed my concerns to CAMHS and asked what the time limit was etc, they had no idea what i was talking about and said we had agreed a flexible plan, with tiny steps.

I also told them, i felt like i was on my own again and was hoping for a comprehensive written plan from them, which everyone was agreed on.

The emphasis is again being placed on me to decide on a daily basis, if ds can attend school and if i make the wrong decision, then CP proceedings.

So now neither SW or CAMHS have produced a plan and all i have to go on was what was said at that meeting, which was conflicting!

CAMHS flexible gradual, tiny steps. SW start date of 7th Jan and time limit.

inappropriatelyemployed Tue 01-Jan-13 19:53:30

Star, it would be ridiculous to have a directions hearing on something so small and resolvable as where you live. I think what not responding to the appeal itself is, however, different so I have no idea why that has been rejected as it would clearly save everyone time and money.

So, I'm sorry but I have no faith in these bodies at all and I would certainty not hold my breath for them to resolve my child's fate or mental health. I think it is different if you need a specific type of provision like ABA or a specialist school. But even then, you need overwhelming evidence to support your case and these bastards will use anything and everything against you.

Presumably your solicitor will be dealing with the bundle anyway.

mariammama Tue 01-Jan-13 20:01:48

Claw, I know you have not only engaged, but that you have bent over backwards to try to work with staff whose attitudes, actions and behaviour were totally unprofessional. Outside of this board (and including at tribunal) a social worker will usually be believed above a parent. It's worth a bit of work now to demonstrate your commitment to engagement is far greater than school /LEA/ SW have stated.

A bunch of emails setting out why DS came out of school, and asking for meetings a few days after tribunal is your insurance policy against the LEA requesting extra time / new witnesses / additional reports based on non-existent social care concerns.

You can do this extremely clearly and succinctly (think short comment followed by politician soundbite, or advert ending with slogan) shows that, on this point, the SW was mistaken, or misled by school giving poor information.

The school claiming your ds's issues are exacerbated by your 'failure to engage' has rubbed off on the SW, despite it being untrue. The problem with this is that, if tribunal does order SA, the social work 'advice' (and if you get the statement, thus parts 2, 3 and maybe 4) will be totally polluted by the same rubbish.

mariammama Tue 01-Jan-13 20:23:02

I spent 20 years working in/ with various branches of health, social care and education before having a dc with SEN. Incompetent colleagues, saving face, professional in-fighting, poor systems, lack of training, overwork, essential paperwork getting lost... all very familiar ad something that drives you insane but can usually be got around.

Staff sometimes get badly harassed, though the unions usually step in. But persecuting a client is something I had never encountered till entering the SEN parent world, and it was a real shock. If someone back then had told me that they were threatened with CP for trying to help their child, I'd have assumed either 'no smoke without fire' or a dreadful misunderstanding.

mariammama Tue 01-Jan-13 20:37:52

The reason for that essay, is because the non-evil staff dealing with your DS will mostly be as naive as I was, and that's why I keep harping on about you demonstrating that the school's allegations are wrong. Otherwise SW, CAMHS, EWO, maybe even GP could be taken in. The allegations may stem from lazy, incompetent, groupthink, or there may be a power-crazed psychopath like the poster above's HT mistaken individual who is over-skilled at convincing others of their views.

santaclaw1 Tue 01-Jan-13 20:41:15

Maria, i have been following everything up in writing for example i told SW my GP plan in writing and gave a copy of medical certificate. She has now changed this suit herself, but i have it in writing exactly what i told her at the time, as i sent her an email setting it out.

I do tend to spend more time on here stating what SW hasnt done, rather than making it clear what i am doing. I guess i just take it for granted that everyone will know what i am doing, despite my moaning!

Star taught me long ago, in fact drummed it into me smile to put everything into writing and i do.

I think im just a bit gobsmacked and finding it hard to believe that despite putting everything into writing, i am still being accused of doing the opposite and i suppose angry that someone can be allowed to get away with it.

mariammama Tue 01-Jan-13 21:22:21

'Everything in writing' does help in tribunal. And if the CP threats ever got turned into really serious action. Otherwise, big files very rarely get read properly, and on those few occasions, inaccurate guesses, errors and hearsay are seldom recognised.

Even with a thin file, you're lucky if someone reads more than the last few pages, and so an inaccurate verbal summary by the lead professional trumps the facts in the file for most practical day-to-day purposes.

mariammama Tue 01-Jan-13 21:37:25

I was advised ages ago to transform my anger from a hot, uncontrolled fireburst into a cold, hard, strategic weapon. Rage at injustice, how do they get away with it, etc is a wasted resource. My rage was (probably) deliberately provoked to try and set me up to 'lose' in various meetings... and it very nearly worked.

Happily, tribunal paperwork, whilst nearly killing me, was a very good reminder that this is chess, not Fight Club.

Inaflap Tue 01-Jan-13 22:26:41

Is it worth including something from your DS. Could you ask someone he trusts but isn't a direct family member to either video him speaking directly to the tribunal or writing his own thoughts about how he feels about school. I know that tribunals are really keen that the focus is the child and in a case like your where he is showing real anti feelings about school at home but is covering this up more at school, it might help the tribunal to'hear' his voice in whatever mecium you decide on.

My lea also provided no evidence. Obviously blenched when they saw what I submitted and caved in before I got to tribunal. The senco is in for a nasty shock if all they have provided is a few ieps. There should be data which indicates progress. If there isn't rub your hands with joy. Key terms to use are

X forms a significant barrier to learning
Ds is unable to access the curriculum fullt and on a par with his peers because ...
Ds is not showing the expected level of progress in despte being given x, y and s intervention.

santaclaw1 Tue 01-Jan-13 23:00:25

Mariam, i usually switch my emotions off, i have done for years, but i think with this and the ultimate threat of we can take your child from you, i am finding it hard not to get angry in private or on here and have a moan.

I had been treating it as a business arrangement, they have something i want and i will go about it in a business like way to get it ie support for ds.

But seeing what all this has done to ds, when i was looking at a shell of my former child, who was covered in injuries and then be threatened with taking him from me. I cant help but to get angry, i cant continue to remain emotionless 24/7 otherwise i would explode, i think.

It will pass, i will get on with business as usual, but given those circumstances i was upset, i was angry.

santaclaw1 Wed 02-Jan-13 14:45:57

I saw SW 2 weeks ago, she now wants to come here tomorrow, as well as the meeting next week.

I have sent her copies of my diary and ds's daily routine. I am preparing for solicitors meeting with pending tribunal and the tribunal itself. I just want a break during the school holidays!

Oh ffs. Send her a polite note telling her that she is welcome after the tribunal, and give dates. Tell her that you are keeping a diary on all that you are doing with DS in the meantime and on date after tribunal would appreciate her thoughts on it.

santaclaw1 Wed 02-Jan-13 15:25:35

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

santaclaw1 Wed 02-Jan-13 15:39:24

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

santaclaw1 Wed 02-Jan-13 15:50:19

and you know what this SW will be on side, by the time ive finished. I will be walking on egg shells as she will be waiting for me to put a foot wrong, but she will have no choice!

School might smile sweetly and say all the things she wants to hear, but their actions say different, she will get the picture, its just taking a bit of time! smile

mariammama Wed 02-Jan-13 20:19:14

you know you're doing great, claw. That's why the thumbscrews are being tightened. The eggshells thing really isn't fair, but soon (fingers crossed) that stupid school will be gone from your life forever and then the other professionals will stop being dragged into their delusions. Wouldn't it be great if we lived in that universe, there'd be no need for MNSN, all the dc with SEN could magically have instantly and vastly improved outcomes, if only their unreasonable parents would just stop being so anxious hmm

mariammama Wed 02-Jan-13 20:20:56

I'm also sure you'll get SW on side. If it's soon, she'll write a great report for ds's statutory advice wink

mariammama Wed 02-Jan-13 20:24:41

and I keep only challenging you on here because when people have challenged me (the very best was an off-the-record chat with very competent and nice generic NHS SLT, who knew nothing about HFA and simply couldn't/ didn't understand why I was so worried about a child who could talk well), it's meant I'm not thrown off-balance and have my response ready for when the school/ LA then tries it on.

santaclaw1 Wed 02-Jan-13 20:38:57

Maria, i appreciate it, as it does help to me think about things smile

I agree about the challenge. I had some very rough times on here wrt being challenged and it hurt, confused and frustrated me, but in hindsight I am so grateful for those people (some of whom were kind and others less so) who made me justify my actions, get my story together, consider other sides and give me practice before facing the cruel RL critics. I woukd NEVER have got through had I had a herd of posters agreeing with me all the time and patting me on the back.

santaclaw1 Thu 03-Jan-13 02:06:53

Exactly Star,

It is difficult sometimes to see it from other points of views when you are living and breathing it day in and day out and the pressure is constant, never ending. You do get defensive at times, when professionals are constantly telling you cant do right, for doing wrong. Constantly critising everything you do, but offering no constructive critism.

It requires constant rethinking and readjusting, add to that lack of sleep, stress and having to do the everyday things like cook and clean and look after a child with SN's who has just suffered massive regression which needs your attention and planning, sometimes it is hard to focus on what you should be focussing on.

Sometimes a slap in the face is needed, rather than a sympathetic hug smile

and yes i cant sleep, hence 2am posting and early meeting in the morning!

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