My feed
Premium

Please
or
to access all these features

Here are some suggested organisations that offer expert advice on special needs.

SN children

Think ds has greater problems that I envisaged.

16 replies

macwoozy · 14/11/2007 11:25

I'm worried that ds has far greater learning difficulties that I anticipated. He has HFA, but it's only since he's been at his new school(MS - statemented) that it's really apparent that the difference between himself and peers with regards to schoolwork is really escalating. He can only participate with very few lessons, he's just not on the same wavelength, in fact, his teachers allow him to draw pictures a good deal of the time. The homework that he's given is way beyond him, I can't even get him to understand the concept of most of the work. His LSA is wonderful and spends a lot of time with him, but I doubt he's actually learning much at all. They don't force him to do any work because he's a highly anxious and angry child and will scream and shout if made to do anything he doesn't want to do. In his last school(he's now in yr3) he did actually produce so much more work, but he was forced and he became very stressed with very low self esteem. I'm relieved that his teacher understands his emotional difficulties but I'm also concerned that they are not pushing him at all, because they fear a meltdown. He has big behavioural problems too,(they've spoken to me many times about him hitting other children) and it looks like they are just trying to keep him calm without any outbursts, the schoolwork seems to be taking second place IYKWIM. He's a real enigma, he's so behind with regards to schoolwork and yet if he's watching me play a computer game, he comes out with some really great ideas. Oh I don't quite know what I'm asking really, just wondering if this sounds familiar to anyone else?

OP posts:
Report
Tiggiwinkle · 14/11/2007 11:39

My DS is 8 and has AS. He also seems to not participate in quite a few lessons. In some subjects, such as Maths, he is way ahead so it is a case of his getting separate work. But in other subjects, he simply is not engaged or interested and refuses to do the work. His teacher is trying all kind of incentive schemes; some weeks they work, others he does not co-operate. He is certainly not achieving his potential. School have just applied for assessment for a statement and turned down by the LEA.

Report
mccreadymum · 14/11/2007 11:42

Macwoozy my boy is only 4 but I do sympathise entirely with what you are saying. Things seem not to go into his brain and stay, but pop in and out. If he really likes computers, have you tried those fun/educational computer games? My boy loves DVDs so I got these babybumblebee counting and letter DVDs and he learned to count in 3 months, because he liked the way of learning. We also do ABA, which has really helped with his behaviours - eg when he used to hit, we would wash his hair (he hates it) as an aversive therapy. Is there anything like that you could do on the hitting? I am probably in the wrong boat as I guess the issues are different at different ages, but he sounds like he has some really good skills, it's just a question of accessing them?

Report
macwoozy · 14/11/2007 11:57

Tiggiwinkle, did you know that you can actually appeal on behalf of the school, I can't rememeber who told me that now, I think it was IPSEA.

mccreadymum, yes he used to play 'jump ahead', an educational game, but he is now so obsessed with a virtual reality game on the computer, that I literally can not get him to do anything else without a huge screaming fit. I have tried different techniques with regards to his hitting, but the problem with ds is that he is so impulsive, that absolutely nothing will deter him from hitting out, he seems incapable of thinking of any consequences when he's about to suddenly attack, he gets into such a rage. The school have tried allsorts, and sadly it's got to the stage where they have to constantly watch out for him at playtime, if and when he's allowed to do outside play.

OP posts:
Report
Tiggiwinkle · 14/11/2007 12:09

I did not realise that macwoozy-I thought you could only appeal if you had made the application yourself. I will definitely look into doing so-he really does need additional support as the teacher just cannot give him the time he needs. Unlike with your DS there are no serious behavioural issues other than just sitting doing nothing (although he does occasionally disrupt the class in various ways), but the net result is the same in that he is not learning much.

Report
mccreadymum · 14/11/2007 12:27

Macwoozy I really feel for you. I am sure you have tried absolutely everything and I hate it when people give me advice without knowing the actual situation, but at risk of stepping out of line have you tried absolutely holding him tight till the tantrum is over and keeping on until he realises he is not going to win, and the tantrums will not get him out of at least trying something (if only for a few seconds at first). My ABA therapists are always telling me that if I let my DS get away with something because of his tantrumming, he will learn that this behaviour is a good technique and it will escalate. It is sometimes a battle of wills, but it's a battle I must win as one day I will not physically be able to control him (he is predicted to be 6ft 4 when grown up) so I have to establish a sort of who's boss thing now. When he tantrums , I either put on a really angry face and shout "don't you dare have a tantrum" or I leave the room, or I hold him tight and then come back to whatever it was that he was trying to avoid. It is very stressful and very hard, and the tantrums got worse before they get better but it has worked reasonably well for my DS. But you have probably tried this, and so have the school. Big hug to you!

Report
Peachy · 14/11/2007 12:33

Macwoozy I can truly empathise, its very much a case of when you compare them with their peers isn't it? Wih ds1 there's only 13 months between him and ds2 which always highlighted gaps, but with ds3 its when he's with his cusins (3 and 6 months younger) that we see it.

He sounds so like my sam tbh- he has really good capabilities sometimes, yet I was stunned the other day that i simply could not get him to understand the concept that when ds2 and ds3 spent 79p of their £1 from Grandad they received change, whereas DS1 didn't as he spent the full amount (sam is 8 in a few weeks and has completed the money awareness part of KS1). Concepts are a big issue in ASD though- and finding a way to explain them often a big hurdle ime!

BIBIC told us to do the holding tight during meltdowns as well (an issue if they start up atm obv- do you ahev input from BIBIC? can't remember if you do- if so give them a call as they are good at breaking deadlocks with concepts etc!

Report
macwoozy · 14/11/2007 14:52

Tiggiwinkle, I know it has to be within a certain time after the refusal. TBH I was really surprised when she told me this, as I've not heard or read about that anywhere, and I sure did plenty of reading about statementing at the time. Without trying to make you feel even more despondent than you must already feel, I'm pretty sure that ds wouldn't have got a statement if he wasn't such a pain for the teachers in the classroom, I'm sure many of the 'quieter' ones suffer in silence.

Peachy, I haven't used BIBIC, but the school are contacting CAMHS, in the hope that they might help out...... but I've been to CAMHS before, and it wasn't a succesful meeting to say the least. Like yourself, I'm shocked at times, on how little my ds can understand particular concepts, and it's all becoming so much more evident now. It's really sad and confusing

Mccreadymum, You've got me thinking now. I haven't tried holding him during a meltdown for years. He hates to be physically restrained and I'm scared to make it even worse, and he's so strong already. (Of course I do though, if it looks like he's about to go for someone )His teacher asked me what strategies I used to calm him, and all I could say was that I spoke to him in a really calm voice, as he doesn't like raised voices I feel such a loon.

OP posts:
Report
AttilaTheMeerkat · 14/11/2007 16:21

Hi Tiggiwinkle,

When was the refusal made?.

I think an appeal has to be within six weeks of the refusal being made. Put in an appeal asap. TBH you as the parent are in a far better position re applying for a statement than school would ever be. I would seriously consider therefore applying for the statement yourself.

Report
AttilaTheMeerkat · 14/11/2007 16:25

Hi macwoozy

Are the school aware that you've had previous dealings with CAMHS?. TBH they'd be better off talking to the NAS or your son's developmental paediatrician if he is under the care of such a person at a CDC. CAMHS certainly have their place but from my readings of them ASD is not always within their understanding.

Report
sarah573 · 14/11/2007 16:27

Macwoozy, my DS is 9 with AS. I have found with him he either loves something (often to the point of obsession) and pursues it avidly, or is completely indifferent to it's existance. For example he loves maths, science, IT - but couldn't care less about literacy. Motivating him to do something that he is not interested in is really hard work. This applies to other things in his life as well - not just school work.

I also feel like the school are stepping on egg shells around him sometimes. Trying to prevent meltdowns and hence letting him have his only way (have to admit to a little of it at home too - so I know where they are coming from!!).

Fortunately he has a very strong teacher this year (and a great 1:1), and is doing pretty well.

Report
macwoozy · 14/11/2007 19:00

I have to agree with you there Attila. The meeting with CAMHS was beyond a joke. His new school knows I've had dealings with them before, but I'm prepared to give it another go. They did say another professional was coming in to give advice, but I didn't catch who the person was.

Exactly the same here Sarah. It's incredibly hard work to get ds to do anything that he's not interested in, and that's quite alot nowadays. Homework is a battleground, it's such hard work, it's like I'm trying to force him to do work that he can't even understand, and that's just ridiculous. Ds must be so exhausting for his teachers, as I'm almost pulling my hair out with frustration after I TRY and encourage ds to do any work at all.

OP posts:
Report
Peachy · 14/11/2007 19:53

if the work is stressing him and temper is an issue (meltdowns rather than temper tbh), then seriosusly consider whether you want him to do work at home- personally I'd pull it for a few weeks and then see how it goes. Confrontation won't get you anywhere.

HAs anywhere ever taught you how to do a proper restraint? The one that works best with ds1 is putting my arrms through under his armpits and then crossing over in the front and holding his shoulders (whilst sitting on my lap)- another excellent one that BIBIC taught us is to wrap him in a duvet, no potential of hurting him then.

Consider BIBIC_ they can assist with funding adn have beena round 30 years so not a fly by night, their web address is www.bibic.org.uk.

Report
macwoozy · 14/11/2007 23:52

Peachy, I saw his teacher, whilst in yr 1 doing that restraint. I had picked him up early from playtime for a doctors appt and came across it, and as soon as she saw me she looked rather startled.

Problem is, I'm so worried to use that kind of restraint for fear of making him worse. I feel I'm in a really bad predicament. He has a 50% chance of developing a heart condition. His next check-up is in Jan, and already I'm treating him as if he's developed it. I'm scared to push him for fear of his heart not being able to cope with the strain. I'm worried to an extreme, and yet he could well be perfectly healthy. This stops me from using any physical restraint but I know using a softish approach{I do shout when annoyed!!) will not help anyone, least of all him.

I will give the BIBIC website a good look, thanks

OP posts:
Report
Peachy · 15/11/2007 09:42

What might help then- after Sam's BIBIC routine he has to have a 'sausage roll', which means he is wrapped in a duvet tightly for 5 minutes (a bit like Temple grandins squeeze machine I guess?), when he comes out we pull the edge and he rolls out- and he loves it. Its very calming and a good 'wind down now' routine signal. We sometimes whip out that duvet if he seems to be going off as well (he's a bit like an alrm- when he goes off, he goes!)- and it seems to give him both the caming sensations and sensory stimulus he needs.

Report
flyingmum · 15/11/2007 18:24

Macwoozy, your child sounds so similar to mine who could scream the school down if necessary. I remember thinking 'if only the tantrums would stop then...' and (whispers becaus of gremlins) they have really. A bit of shouting at his brother and he can still go into one at school, but better. In a way I think your son's school are doing what they can because the more anxious he gets then the more shouty and hitty he seems to get so they must be thinking along the lines of reducing the anxiety levels. And it is a very fine line balancing pushing them and keeping the anxiety in managable forms for him and the rest of the class. It is early days yet - we are only in the Christmas term and our children are a bit like very sensitive, finely made engines with very intricate parts - it all takes time to calibrate and tune them and this is as much a learning curve for his teachers and LSAs as for him. To be honest my chap did very little in year 3 but things improved after that. Does he get one to one support?
Another thing it is linked to as well is speech and language. My son received no SALT therapy when in mainstream and now gets SALT once a week and I think has improved because of it.

Good luck.

Report
macwoozy · 15/11/2007 22:50

Peachy, I'm going to try that. Sometimes I can sense when he's about to kick off and that would also be a great distraction as well. He actually loves being wrapped inside his sleeping bag. Thanks for your help

Yes flyingmum, he does get 1:1 and I can't help but admire her, she has a hard job there trying to encourage him to do things that he's constantly refusing to do. I agree with you completely. The school are keeping his anxiety levels down, and I appreciate that by pushing him to do work will only get him stressed. I do agree with their approach, but I do worry about how so little he seems capable of doing. You're right, it is early days, and even though I sound like I'm moaning I'm actually relieved that they're not stressing him out as much as his previous school, just sad that if he carries on like this, the difference between himself and peers will be huge.

OP posts:
Report
Please create an account

To comment on this thread you need to create a Mumsnet account.