Four month sleep regression...

(43 Posts)
Runswithsquirrels Thu 24-Oct-13 11:53:28's almost four weeks now since she entered this phase early... Four weeks of not sleeping longer than two hours and frequently less...
Someone please tell me this will end soon. Please!

MrsDavies Thu 24-Oct-13 20:29:38

can't tell you it will end as mine hasnt! hmm

my DS is 5 months old and went from bed at 7, dream feed at 10, wake at 4am for a feed then up about 7 for the day, to waking every 2-2.5 hours through the night! I'm shattered as ebf too. can't wait until he's 18 and hungover and I can get my own back! ha grin

jojie79 Fri 25-Oct-13 02:23:47

This exact same thing has happened to us - 5 months old now and she woke up at 9pm, midnight, 2.30am (didn't go back to sleep until 3.30am), 5.30am, 6am and then we woke her at 7. Its been getting worse for about 3 or 4 weeks. Once in a while she will manage 2 wake ups again which gives us hope. I think its sleep regression plus teething (a tooth has just cut through her bottom gum) and a cold. Anything to reassure myself that things will go back to normal one day and this isn't permanent....

Lets hope someone comes along soon and tells us about coming through the other side.....!

Runswithsquirrels Fri 25-Oct-13 09:27:32

We got a slightly better night last night and the only difference was I took her out of her gro bag and went back to blankets.

BloodysocksAndGore Fri 25-Oct-13 09:29:44

Mine only got better when we moved her into her own room at just over 6 months.She went from waking every two hours to sleeping through 8/10 times!

bionic77 Fri 25-Oct-13 12:05:58

Watching with interest as my 5 month old is doing exact same thing. We've gone from going down at 7.30pm, waking at 4.30am for a feed and then back to sleep until 9am.

Now he is waking every 1.5hrs and doing anything to avoid sleep. He won't be BF to sleep, hates to be rocked but also doesn't want to be left on his own. Argh.

He won't nap during the day either. He has cut one tooth, so I'm guessing more are on the way. He's mastering new skills everyday so I'm sure it's that too.

Just wish he could self soothe. I'm thinking of putting him in his own room to see if that helps.

Any advice very gratefully received!!

Beesneeze82 Fri 25-Oct-13 18:05:30

Watching with interest too, feeling like I've got a newborn again

purrtrillpadpadpad Fri 25-Oct-13 18:12:45

Also with 5 month old with same routine (or lack thereof). As an aside, what does an emerging tooth look like? There's a bit on her bottom gums where the gum skin/fleshy bit is standing up, like a ridge. Is this a sign there's a tooth underneath pushing up? I don't want to prod it :/

cupcake78 Fri 25-Oct-13 18:15:43

I'm also going through this dd 17 weeks. Read up on it today apparently it can last for 6+ weekshmmhmmhmmhmm

Beesneeze82 Fri 25-Oct-13 18:19:22

Purr, I'm wondering about that too. My DS has two such ridges on bottom gum. They do look like they could be the beginnings of teeth, just not sure how long they've been there...

purrtrillpadpadpad Fri 25-Oct-13 18:21:20

Do you think we should prod them a bit? :/ If my DD gets her gums on my hand she starts slurping away, it's possibly the most disquieting experience I've had. yuck.

Mrsdonalddraper Fri 25-Oct-13 18:26:12

Just joining in to say my 5 month has gone from sleeping 9pm-9am to waking every 1.5-2hrs. I can see her teeth clearly through her gums (large white lumps) at the top, but they're not that close to the gum line. I was also depressed to read that the bottom ones usually come in first and I can't see anything there. Ironically she slept better than this as a newborn...

She did just roll all the way over for the first time yesterday...

purrtrillpadpadpad Fri 25-Oct-13 18:35:23

Ooh congratulations draper!

Mrsdonalddraper Fri 25-Oct-13 19:06:22

Thanks! Though she's not a fan of being on her stomach, so she's yet to feel much of a sense of achievement grin

Beesneeze82 Fri 25-Oct-13 20:04:55

I have had a little feel when he's been chomping on my fingers actually and it does feel like teeny teeth could be under there. Don't look white at all though.

Liveinthepresent Sun 27-Oct-13 16:40:01

I am in this gang too and so fed up!
I have only 8 more weeks of mat leave and can't believe it will have flown by in such a tired blur. No idea how I would work and survive on this sort of sleep pattern.
No teeth but lots of new skills like rolling over and grabbing feet - so at least there,is something to show for it.

Littlebagoflaughter Sun 27-Oct-13 19:19:22

feeling everyone's pain, ds was only waking once for a feed and then at 17wks it literally changed overnight. He's 26wks today and overall things have improved over the past few weeks(though not back to pre-17wks bliss), though just as his nights have gotten better his evenings have become more disrupted, argh! Putting him in his own room has definitely helped as he was waking up to feed within an hour of whenever I went to bed as he knew I was there. I've also been following suggestions from the no-cry sleep solution. Stay strong everyone!

Quinandthem Tue 29-Oct-13 05:29:34

We've just hit this wall

Every 2 f-ing hours

Used to bf to sleep but even this is loosing its effectiveness as she's not that hungry. She'll fall asleep bf but wake when I transfer her.

Side note - she's currently swaddled, is it possible for them to self soothe in a swaddle?

Stay strong everyone

bigwellyfucker Tue 29-Oct-13 09:46:50

We're also in this hell.

DD2 - beautiful sleeper right from newborn, and from five weeks she slept 11-13hours rarely waking for a feed. Napped beautifully. Fed ok ish.

Now 20weeks. Has got worse and worse and worse. Not just thr refusal to go down in her cot. But the waking 8 - 10 - 12 times a night. And the being awake for long stretches crying or cooing. And the vomiting ferss because she is too full because she doesn't actually want milk but in my eagerness to sleep I try feeding her. Naptimes have also become battlegrounds and last a mere fifteen minutes.

She (and we) is exhausted. Completely and utterly exhausted. She has huge bags under her eyes and cries pretty much all day long, doesn't want to be held. Doesn't want to be put down. I've almost lost it with her I don't know how many times - 4am this morning I was sobbing in the spare room after baby had been awake two fucking hours solid after only an hours sleep, DH took her downstairs for an hour to let me sleep.

I have a tenuous grip on reality as it due to PTSD and depression, my DD1 is bearing the brunt of my bad temper too. She was a truly diabolical sleeper - up every 45minutes and awake for hours in the night so I know what babies are like. But then she was a cuddly baby, always recognised that we were there and in the main didn't cry at night was just awake. Dd2 on the other hand is downright miserable at night - screaming and shrieking. I genuinely think she wants to be asleep and is upset that she isn't.

So - averaging 3 hours sleep for me a night, this has been going on three weeks, I'm also on the verge of quitting breastfeeding as I hate it this time round.

cake for all

Littlebagoflaughter Tue 29-Oct-13 10:10:13

Oh bigwelly that sounds absolutely awful, really feel for you, it is absolutely heartbreaking when a good sleeper becomes a terrible one. Have you taken her to the doctor? Just wondered if there might be an underlying issue if she's so miserable in the day too. I'm really glad that I've breastfed but I definitely resent it at times, especially when I'm feeding him every hour in the evening because that's the only way he'll stop crying! I feel quite bitter about all the 'sleep experts' as I never fed him to sleep and he pretty much self settles at bedtime but still insists on beng fed almost every time he wakes up, I'm at a bit of a loss as to what to do.

I would say wine for all but because I never know when he'll want feeding next that comfort is out the window sad cake and ice cream will have to do instead.

jojie79 Wed 30-Oct-13 12:56:02

My sleep deprivation is such that I completely forgot that I had commented on this thread and never checked back....

Its heartening to hear that so many of us are dealing with this and that is it normal, even if no one has the answers.

On the teeth - you can see the white of the teeth coming through the gum and it feels sharp when they chew on your hand or finger. The teeth don't come out of the top of the gum ridge, they actually come out behind it - so not where you would think they would come through.

Hope things get better for everyone.

RigglinJigglinBones Wed 30-Oct-13 19:45:06

Our house is the same, she's 24w and its been going on for 8 weeks. We are sleep walking through life at the moment. A good night is 3 wake ups, but two nights ago she was up 7 times in 4 hours.

I have no advice, I'm just eating cake to get me through.

cake and brew for all!

emeraldgirl1 Thu 31-Oct-13 12:29:22

Sorry to report we have never recovered from 4 month regression and DD is 7.5m now... Tbf she wasn't a fabulous sleeper before 17w but she was going from 7.30 til 2am ish before waking persistently til 5am... These days we are lucky if she gets to midnight before waking to feed and her persistent waking is dreadful. Teething (I hope!!!) is the issue...

Bigwelly, hope you are ok, I thought we had it bad but you sound properly at the end of your tether, big hug xx

Good luck OP and everyone else!!! Xx

Runswithsquirrels Thu 21-Nov-13 19:13:58

Argh! Still facing the same.

I live in hope every night...

Kelly1814 Thu 21-Nov-13 19:18:42

Lord. I have a 9 weeker whochardly sleeps, I am clinging to the premise that this gets better.

This thread has scared the bejesus out of me.

BusyCee Thu 21-Nov-13 19:23:52

Me too. The Incredible Sleeping Baby hit 16wks and it's been downhill from there. Now 19wks and last night woke at 10; 130; 4; 530. Won't nap during the day and feeds constantly. I do not remember this from DS1.

I'd share more of my pain with you but I'm too fucking tired to type...hmm

cantthinkofagoodone Thu 21-Nov-13 19:26:20

Hi ladies. Would you like advice? Or is this more of a support thread?

LittleMilla Thu 21-Nov-13 20:20:11

Advice, please.

In comparison we're doing ok. But I need my sleep more than most (seriously, in my group of friends it's always been a longstanding joke) and I am slowly regaining all the weight I've lost thru cake/caffeine/sugar intake.

My ds2 also has a chest infection.

Depressed to read in a psych book that you shouldn't attempt sleep training between 4-5.5 months. I cannot wait. Ds2 is 19 weeks I think, lost count if his age after he hit 16 weeks!!

BusyCee Thu 21-Nov-13 20:21:22

Advice pls. My last post was putting him down for the night....and now I'm back upstairs feeding him after he's woken. I'm on my knees; DS1 isn't taking any prisoners either and between the two of them I honestly feel like I haven't had a decent relaxing break for too long...

BusyCee Thu 21-Nov-13 20:46:54

Where are you, Can'tthink? Bestow upon me your wisdom...

Now I'm in bed and my eyeballs itch with tiredness and I'm wondering WTAF is up with this weird relationship between sleep deprivation and over-eating; I've just cleaned my teeth and all I can think about is a) sleep b) Percy Pigs c) those M&S chocolate salted pretzel lump things. I just think tired and thin might be easier than tired and fat, but I can't stop eating crap, honestly I can't...

LittleMilla Thu 21-Nov-13 21:03:48

Busy, I'm with you! I can't stop eating. Or craving booze. I just want tobe drunk, feel warm and fuzzy and SLEEP. Urgh

Ds2 awake and dh up trying to shhhh pat him. I know I'm going to have to schlep up in a sec as he wants boobs.


TarkaTheOtter Thu 21-Nov-13 21:10:59

My daughter was sleeping 7-7 before the 4 month sleep regression. Sadly for us it was a permeanent change in sleep patterns. It did get better, but never went back to how she slept as a newborn. They are more alert and find it much harder to settle. With dd we sleep trained eventually and now she will sleep through till 5/6 when she's not teething/ill etc. But... and here is the depressing part... she is 22months.
I'm expecting dc2 and this time I'll make sure I remember that the first 4 months don't really count.

Sammie101 Thu 21-Nov-13 21:17:39

Can I join the suffering please?

DD is 15 weeks and has never been a good sleeper, on an average night she can sleep 3-4 hours but now it's every 1.5 to 2 hours! Normally she sleeps well from 7pm to 10pm but tonight she woke up at 8 and wouldn't settle with her dummy like she usually would. Instead I had to feed her and I'm utterly sick hmm

I just want one night where I don't end up a sobbing mess because she just constantly wants to feed!

LittleMilla Thu 21-Nov-13 21:20:42

Tarik's, this is also my second and having had a dopey time with ds1 I was sort of expecting it. But forgot how brutal it can be. Esp when you aren't able to have the catch up naps in the day grin.

Also, ds2 was much better early on and so I'd stupidly hoped it would be better.

He's literally just had three sucks of boob and he's back to sleep. Annoying thing us that he can self settle beautifully and so I cannot fathom what's so fantastic about my saggy boobs?!?

cantthinkofagoodone Thu 21-Nov-13 21:28:51

Here's the science bit. At 4 months sleep changes and becomes more adult like with noticeable light and deep phases of sleep. If your baby cannot self sooth and has an association such as feeding to sleep, motion (rocking, pram) this will become apparent in the light phases.

At 4 months more extreme sleep training can't be understood by most babies as they don't know that if they can't see you, you're not there. You can however encourage self soothing by using shh-pat or pick up put down.

In addition to using shh-pat or pupd, you can also work to prevent overtiredness by encouraging naps after 90-105 minutes awake. Cat naps are very common so 4-5 naps per day is normal.

BusyCee Fri 22-Nov-13 01:18:55

Ok, so can you talk to me about shh--pat? As he's been such a good sleeper to date, he's always suckled to sleep. What's the best way to teach him shh-pat? Is this going to be a variation on 'put-him-in-the-cot-partially-awake'? Is the goal that he'll be able to self soothe as a result so ill need to go in less frequently? Or do you end up shh-patting as frequently as just feeding (in which case why not just stick a boob in?).

Yes folks, I'm up feeding again. Ill check in again at the next wake when I may be considerably less chirpy and significantly more sweary

BusyCee Fri 22-Nov-13 01:28:38

Sorry, this slightly off-topic, but while I'm here...just come back to bed to find OH asleep IN THE MIDDLE OF THE BED. AGAIN. I get that he doesn't have to wake when I do, but his OSTENTATIOUS enjoyment of sleep is getting on my fucking nerves.

Oh look. I'm fucking sweary again

cantthinkofagoodone Fri 22-Nov-13 09:02:50

SHhh-pat is a gradual process that will result in putting them into their cot wide awake, them rolling over and going to sleep.

You have to start by not feeding or rocking to sleep any more. With the fed to sleep babies you should move it earlier on in the bedtime routine so bath if you do that (we didn't every night due to dry skin), pjs, milk, sleeping bag (if used), quick book and then start to settle.

To begin with we just held him, patted his bum and made the shhing sound. It is meant to replicate how a heartbeat sounds inside of you. Just persevere with this and they should go to sleep eventually. Make sure you start the bedtime routine early enough so that they are not overtired when you try and soothe them to sleep.

When this becomes easy, you progress to putting them down in their cot and shh patting them there. The time it takes to shh-pat them in their cot should reduce and reduce until they're so used to the routine of it that they eventually just go to sleep. It should take about 2 weeks.

With regards to feeding at night, its best to set a time limit of say 5 hours from bedtime. Its realistic for a baby at 4 months to still want to feed twice at night. If they wake before 5 hours, or however long you think they should be going between night feeds then settle them via shh-pat instead.

If you choose to feed to sleep and it becomes a negative sleep association then your baby will want to be fed back to sleep everytime they wake up. This will pass on its own but I always felt better doing something to tackle it rather than just accepting it (I NEED sleep!)

I hope this helps if it is something you're interested in.

LittleMilla Fri 22-Nov-13 14:01:29

My ds can self settle, which makes this all even more illogical.

He actually smiles at me when I put him down at 7.30pm and goes off without a peep. And he's put down awake again in the night too.

We've just got in to a pattern of him expecting boob every time he wakes up.

Tonight we're getting tough. Boob at 7, dream feed at 10 if he's not woken before then and then no more milk until 4am. I neeeeed to get him back to just one feed. If he wants to wake more then fine, but DH ha said he'll look after it all.

Wish us luck! Not expecting a miracle but we'll see if anything changes over the next week or so

cantthinkofagoodone Fri 22-Nov-13 15:53:45

There is a huge growth spurt at 17 weeks that people often confuse with the need for food. It should pass within a couple of weeks though.

Good luck little

BusyCee Fri 22-Nov-13 18:57:48

Thanks Can't. Last Boob to sleep tonight (as feel indeed to plan ahead a bit) and then tomorrow we'll be away.

I really don't remember this with DS1, and this ones been a dream so far, so I'm a bit unprepared!

BusyCee Fri 22-Nov-13 18:58:17

Meant to say; good luck everyone!

LittleMilla Sun 24-Nov-13 16:48:28

I am blatently going to curse this...but things seem to be on the up!

New regime is working and last night DS went to bed at 7.30, dreamfeed at 10 and then didn't wake up until 6am shock.

Night before was also pretty good.

One constant on both nights was some baby rice (first time on friday) at 5pm along with a few oz of formula. Wasn't planning to wean him early, but think i'm going to stick with this rice business for as long as it works.

I am flabbergasted TBH and know that it'll prob go to shit again now I've dared to write this!

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