I've really stuffed it up haven't I? :(

(36 Posts)
AllIWant85 Fri 12-Jul-13 22:17:09

DS is nearly 12 months and has never fallen asleep on his own and never slept in his cot.

Until 10 months he fed to sleep every night, now he feeds, rolls over and goes to sleep but still in our bed. If I get out of the bed he wakes within 5 minutes.

Every evening I go to bed when he does and I get up when he does. Nap times during the day are 20 minutes if I get up and leave him or 1 - 1.5 hours if I lie next to him.

I've never managed to transfer him from bed to cot or even from buggy to carseat if he is sleeping. If I lift him he wakes.

I just feel like I've really messed it up and now I have a nearly 1 year old that can't self settle, wakes multiple times a night and is generally exhausting me!

I tried him in his cot the othe night and I laid on the floor next to the cot. It took 2.5 hours for him to go to sleep and then he slept for 40 minutes.

I don't know what to do. I'm so tired. sad

RandallPinkFloyd Fri 12-Jul-13 22:27:18

Hello there stranger smile

I'm sorry you're having such a rough time. I wish I had some sage advice I could proffer but in all honesty my DS is 2 next month and I'm still winging it.

I got very lucky and have never had any issues with night time sleeping but daytime naps were an absolute fricking nightmare until about 3 months ago. Then all of a sudden, out of nowhere it all changed so keep the faith, it won't be forever.

Sorry I can't be any help but just thought I'd say hi and keep you company until someone useful arrives!

Nicknamefail Fri 12-Jul-13 22:35:40

You poor thing.

I have also stuffed things up. My dd woke multiple times and co-slept. I am now taking steps to address this and am doing a slow gradual retreat. Millpond gave us a month long program and we are on night 5. The change so far is she doesn't feed to sleep and stays in her cot, but waking lots at the moment, and still cuddled to sleep, but hopefully we will get there.
The main thing to realise is that you can't change things overnight. You need a plan, whether cio, gradual retreat or whatever works for you, but then stick to it and accept that the first few nights are going to be hell.
If you lie by the cot one night, have a crap night then go back to your usual you only have that really crap night to come again. When you start you need the freezer stocked with food so you don't need to cook and a variety if friends to cone in and play with dc for an hour while you sleep.
Btw, our naps are crap to, must be rocked/walked in pram continuously. I am still doing this ad I decided to couldn't face a day and night battle, and am going to tackle dd napping in cot when I have won at night.
Decide on your plan then set the date and go for it.
Good luck.

Nicknamefail Fri 12-Jul-13 22:38:49

And I meant to put 'stuffed it up' in quotation marks. Some of us have crap sleepers and we do what we have to to survive. Until a week ago I was breast feeding a 9 month old 5 times overnight. People with babies who sleep well thought I was crazy but that is the only way I could get her to sleep for ages, so that it was I did. It's not your fault your baby wants to sleep by your side!

AllIWant85 Fri 12-Jul-13 22:39:58

Thank you for keeping me company smile

I feel like I've failed. All the parents I know have wonderful sleeping children and I don't understand where I went wrong.

I've asked them how they did their first night home with the baby and they just say they put them down and they slept. Then when they woke they fed them and put them back down again.

That never worked for us. The first night we paced the landing until 3am with a screaming baby until he gave in. If we put him down he woke straight away and screamed again.

AllIWant85 Fri 12-Jul-13 22:44:05

What is Millpond?

Also how do you do it when you are so tired you could just curl up and cry yourself to sleep? I am a rubbish sleeper, it takes me about 2 hours to go to sleep, always has. I can't sleep during the day and I can't sleep in other people's beds so there is no chance of daytime naps for me.

Nicknamefail Fri 12-Jul-13 22:49:54

I am in the same position. Except for one, all my baby friends have great sleepers. But a quick look through this sleep section shows you how many parents are struggling. We can't all be failing! I firmly believe there are just bad sleepers. How can those who had babies who just slept when and where they were supposed to have succeeded as opposed to our failures? They didn't do anything! They were just lucky. My dd never wanted to be put down and would sleep well in arms but screamed if you put her down, it is just one of those things.
It's exhausting isn't it. One day we will sleep through and it will be the most amazing feeling ever! It WILL happen.

RandallPinkFloyd Fri 12-Jul-13 22:51:29

Just have a read of your last post and take a look at the irony. It's not the baby's fault at all, you passed on all your faulty sleep genes!

I feel so sorry for you I really do, if I remember rightly I think Millpond is a poster who is a bit of an expert on sleep training. She sounds like just the person you're after.

Nicknamefail Fri 12-Jul-13 22:53:54

I am lucky in that I can nap I the daytime and have started my dd's sleep training on a week that do has off so we can take it in turns.
Millpond are a sleep clinic who give advice on sleep training for children. They are very expensive and haven't told us anything ground breaking, but I felt more comfortable talking though things with an expert. We emailed a sleep diary and a questionnaire to them, had a long chat and they explained the program we were going to follow and I can email her for support, and we have 2 more phone calls for review with her.
I know a friend who devised their own programme using a book which I will go and check the title of and cone back and post on a minute.

AllIWant85 Fri 12-Jul-13 22:54:20

I'm not blaming the baby sad

Maybe it is because I'm a bad sleeper.

ILovePonyo Fri 12-Jul-13 22:54:29

Hope it gets better for OP.

This may be crappy/useless advice, but have you tried putting your ds to sleep on his tummy when you pick him up from pram to move him?
My dd was the exact same, she woke as soon as I put her down unless I put her on her tum. Fwiw she is 2.5 now and can settle herself, she just refuses to stay in bed grin

ILovePonyo Fri 12-Jul-13 22:55:15

Oh and I'm a great sleeper but dd wasn't wink how dare she! Don't think you can pass it on smile

Nicknamefail Fri 12-Jul-13 22:57:58

Book is 'teach yourself baby sleep' by Andrea grace.

RandallPinkFloyd Fri 12-Jul-13 22:59:15

I was only joking!

Of course it's not your fault. It's just shitty luck, and also it could possibly hereditary but that's still just shitty luck.

None of us have any mythical sleep producing secrets, despite what some smug knob heads might think. We all just muddle through the best we can. If my great night time sleeper was all my doing how do you explain the fact that every single daytime nap for the first 19 months was fought with the strength of a tiger?

RandallPinkFloyd Fri 12-Jul-13 23:01:36

X-post about Millpond. I'm sure there is a poster who has helped people with sleeping though. I'm sure she gave them some sort of plan to follow. Maybe I've made that up blush

CalamityJ Fri 12-Jul-13 23:05:06

Baby Whisperer. Some great advice and surely never too late to teach a young 'dog' new tricks grin

Flibbedyjibbet Fri 12-Jul-13 23:05:32

Mill pond is a sleep clinic

nestee Fri 12-Jul-13 23:06:47

I did exactly the same with my first. Finally when she was one I did the controlled crying method that I read about in Christopher Greens book 'Toddler Taming'. It worked like a bloody dream, within 3 days she was settling herself and sleeping through. Saved my life.

AllIWant85 Fri 12-Jul-13 23:10:38

Sorry Randall I am a little sensitive and weepy at the moment, it's been a rough few days. I just feel so down about it.

Thanks for the book title Nickname I shall look it up. Sadly if Millpond is expensive then it won't be something I can look into too far.

Front sleeping, back sleeping, side sleeping makes no difference to DS unless I'm laying next to him!

UnicornsPooGlitter Fri 12-Jul-13 23:12:00

Andrea Grace is fab - we used her for DS when he was 7ish months old and DH and I were unable to think straight any more. It was all phone / email based, and she really went above and beyond what she needed to.

Good luck everyone smile.

AllIWant85 Fri 12-Jul-13 23:13:27

Sorry, what is Baby Whisperer? Is it a book?

With the controlled crying, I don't think I'm mentally strong enough to do that at the moment, it would probably break me!

ILovePonyo Fri 12-Jul-13 23:13:58

Aw sorry OP, you've obviously tried the different sleeping positions! It was the only thing that worked for us. And it didn't work all the time!

I think at your sons age it could still be worth trying sleep 'training' we never did. Wish we had though wink good luck with everything.

Flibbedyjibbet Fri 12-Jul-13 23:14:30

I do think you get a sleeper or you don't, ff or bf babies either sleep or not. DD1 woke every 90 mins, sometimes she stretched to 2 hours till she was 18 months and even then it wasn't like a full nights sleep. Now at the age of 3 ( we do have to stay with her till she falls asleep or she'll be out of the bed till midnight) she sleeps 8 - 6 and occasionally till 6.30, bliss.

Dd2 now 8 months old lulled us in to a false sense of security and could be put down at first and did 5 or 6 hour stretches and even some 8 hour stretches. However she had terrible terrible wind for the first 3 months and so fed or nursed for comfort pretty much continually. She has always been a daytime sleep resister despite me saying I wouldn't be able to stand another child that I had to walk in pram or pushchair/drive or nurse to nap here I am again.

The big difference this time round is that I know that it will end, I have been through it once before and so will you and I promise you as tough as it is now you do forget the pain of it.

Although I have had the rage tonight as DD2 didn't go down till 10.20 angry

UnicornsPooGlitter Fri 12-Jul-13 23:20:30

For those that don't want to use controlled crying, gradual withdrawal worked really well for us. It takes a bit longer, but you (hopefully!) get there in the end. Andrea Grace's book had a description of it, and some sample sleep plans IIRC.

Nicknamefail Fri 12-Jul-13 23:25:57

Another risk of x post but the baby whisperer is Tracy Hogg. She has a book. Maybe books.

LauraPashley Fri 12-Jul-13 23:26:04

I'm on my 2nd "bad sleeper" here - massive difference between this one and the 1st one is my chance of attitude - I am chilled out, resigned, too tired to care, whatever you want to call it! But I am not as angry, upset, stressed etc as I was 1st time round. I just have the mindset of I am knackered, I will be knackered for some time now (dd slept through at almost 3!), but it will pass. And rightly or wrongly I have devoted NO time at all to trying to "fix" dd2's sleep, as I don't have the energy and it didn't work with dd1 anyway! So we cosleep cos I am too lazy to get up in the night, she stopped daytime naps around 16mths as I couldn't be bothered to "fight" with her about it. She occasionally drops off in the afternoon when I'm feeding her. I am no less tired than I was with dd1, but I'm not worrying about it AT ALL! Does that make sense?!
With dd1 I lay on the wooden floor next to her cot and tried to calm her down cos I thought she should learn to sleep in there - now I think what the actual fuck was I doing?! When we could all have been asleep?!!
Maybe controlled crying or similar would have "sorted" them sooner but I don't agree with it, so for now it is the path of least resistance!!
Agree also with those who have said, you either get a sleeper or you don't! Not much you can do either way imo!

Nicknamefail Fri 12-Jul-13 23:27:57

Just to make you feel better dh and I were watching a to programme and it has been on pause for over an hr as he tries to settle dd. wish she would hurry up and sleep, I need to know whodunit!
(And also, until one week ago, I thought dd would never go to sleep for anyone but me.)

LauraPashley Fri 12-Jul-13 23:28:38

Sorry change of attitude! And fwiw dd2 is currently snoring blissfully next to me- at this point with dd1 I'd have been stressed out, angry, exhausted, trying to get her to sleep in the cot! Waste of time!

RandallPinkFloyd Fri 12-Jul-13 23:28:50

Don't apologise, have a good cry if you need to. You sound utterly exhausted and understandably so.

I'll leave you in the capable hands of all these much more helpful people! Good luck, hope you find something that works thanks

JoInScotland Fri 12-Jul-13 23:37:51

I love "Healthy Sleep Habits: Happy Children". My son was in his cot shoved up beside our bed until 10 months old (his room was not ready until then) and breastfed to sleep every evening as well. The transition was really painful for both of us. I bought this book because I didn't want to just leave him to cry it out. I love the advice in this book and would buy it for all my pregnant friends if I thought they wanted my advice shoved in their face. Erm, but when they ask, I highly recommend it! It helped us transition my son to his own cot, in his own room, and helped when he had various developmental leaps that interfered with his sleep patterns (learning to walk, weaning, etc). Hope this helps!

AllIWant85 Sat 13-Jul-13 10:46:38

Thank you for all your advice and book suggestions. I will try to get a couple and see which method may work for us.

I'm sorry for all of you also struggling with non sleeping children! Here's hoping we all get good nights sleep very soon!

UnicornsPooGlitter Sat 13-Jul-13 13:17:27

I found Healthy Sleep Habits very pro controlled crying (actually, pro extinction, which means never going into the child), and less pro gradual withdrawal IIRC. It's good for stats though, e.g. how long children of different ages sleep for, how many naps they have etc.

DeputyDeputyChiefOfStaff Sat 13-Jul-13 13:26:37

I don't know if you're interested in another book suggestion, but the No Cry Sleep Solution by Elizabeth Pantley is another and, as its name suggests, is very gentle. It has all sorts of different suggestions that you use to create your own plan.

I've struggled with non-sleepers too, especially my first who bf every 2 hours overnight until she was past 12 months and who needed to co sleep or be held for all sleeps. She did grow out of it, slowly but surely, and with a bit of No Cry help. It's so exhausting though, and disheartening when everyone else's baby sleeps well. It's hard not to blame yourself but it's NOT your fault.

jojane Sat 13-Jul-13 13:42:26

I have 3 children.
Ds1 used to co sleep and bf to sleep until aboutn8 months. We then did a little of halfhearted controlled crying and he soon started going to sleep by himself, had a bit of trouble around 18 months when we put him into a bed due to climbing out but a stair gate on the door soon sorted that. Other than that he prefers to sleep by himself and goes to sleep after a story by himself (he's now 6)
Dd was a nightmare she's 4 and even now likes to creep into our bed but until she was about 2.5 you had to cuddle or sit by her bed until she was fast asleep other wise she would scream and scream for hours solidly, controlled crying did not work even when dh did it who is a lot harder than me! But she now goes to sleep by herself after story and cuddle and a song.
Ds2 always slept well at night sleeping through a lot sooner than the others but did have a period of wanting to be cuddled to sleep he's 2.5 and will now generally have a cuddle and some stories then play with his singing bear until he falls asleep. He sleeps through.

What I'm trying to say that even children in the same family with the same way of doing things can result in children with different sleeping habits

JoInScotland Sun 14-Jul-13 22:00:17

We liked the statistics on naps and things in Healthy Sleep Habits, but weren't as hard-hearted with the controlled crying as he suggests. I just couldn't do it. However, being on anti-depressants, partially through sleep deprivation, will make you try things you would never have countenanced before. (!) I don't remember the author saying never go into the child. We did have to let him cry for a bit, but we never just shut the door and walked away. I can't remember all the details, but we saw an improvement within a week, and our life was changed within 2 or 3 weeks. I was a shattered wreck before.

Fast forward, and even within 8 weeks we had a child who would go to sleep after a feed and a cuddle.

He's 3 1/2 and sings when he goes to sleep, sings when he wakes up, and reads books if he wakes a little bit too early. He's happy and doesn't feel abandoned when it's bedtime. We worked out a bedtime routine when he went into his room of stories and songs, teeth brushing and cuddles, and I think this (as much as any method or book!) gave him a routine to guide him to sleep. We have stuck to it whether on holiday, or whether I've gone into hospital when I'm unwell, etc. Probably that is what helped him learn to sleep through, not anything we read ....

toomuchpink Sun 14-Jul-13 22:08:14

You have not stuffed it up, honestly. Co-sleeping is totally normal in some cultures and it has helped you cope. Now, clearly, you have had enough of it and you no longer feel it is good for your son. It is never going to be easy and you should pick a time when you are feeling a bit stronger mentally - maybe when you're partner has a week off for example and you can do it together - and then decide to tackle one thing, putting him alone to sleep in the evening for example. Follow one of the guides in the book's suggested and the chances are you will get there. It might be a really tough week, but at least there will be another side. Good luck.

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