need some CC hand holding.

(58 Posts)
BeebiesQueen Fri 25-Jan-13 17:46:17

I've had a thread in chat earlier incase any of this seems familiar to anyone!

dd2 is 12 months in 2 weeks. She cant fall asleep by herself. So I'm having to get tough, and its hard! I've decided after trying diffrent things that cc is the way to go, i'm not after a fight or a debate on teh rights and wrongs, I just need support from anyone who can offer.

So her first nap of the day she cried (its not sad, distressed crying its angry cry iykwim) for 2.5 hours before it was time for her bottle so I got her up, gave her bottle, gave lunch, had a little play then it was time for her afternoon nap. She cried for 2 hours 15 minutes until it was time for her afternoon bottle and if she had fallen asleep at that point she would have missed dinner and not been tired at bed time which would mess up dd1's routine.

now here we are, she was so tired at dinner, I decided to put her to bed at 5.30, getting her ready for bed she kept closing her eyes and trying to fall asleep.

I put her in her cot and here we are again big angry screams and lots of 'urgh, urgh, urgh' (up, up, up) I'm goin gin every 10-15 minutes depending on how much shes shouting. each time I lie her down, she settles, closes her eyes, I walk away and she screams again. (ive tried staying by herside and patting her, it was taking over an hour some nights to get her to sleep, which isnt practical with dd1 (who is only 15 months older) around

That was a long explanation blush if any one around is doing the same tonight or can hold my hand to get through this, please join me.

thankfully dh will be home at 6.30 to take over so I can go out and have a break (in other words go and do the weekly shop!) so I just have to survive another 45 minutes, then however long it takes to settle, but I really do think we are in for the long hall tonight sad

BeebiesQueen Fri 25-Jan-13 18:03:13


knottyhair Sat 26-Jan-13 08:01:00

Hi Beebies. Didn't want you to go unanswered. Hope you got through the night OK. Just to say we had to do this with DS 8 years ago, and it's bloody hard! It worked though, I think it took around 4 nights to show an improvement, and I remember sitting on the stairs crying whilst DP held my hand! As I say, it did work though, keep going. DS slept like a dream after about a week or ten days (improved after about 4 though) and still does. Now I have DD currently 6 weeks old, and am hoping I won't have to do it with her when the time comes, but I will if I have to! Good luck xx

BeebiesQueen Sat 26-Jan-13 08:08:21

We had the best nights sleep we've ever had last night. It took a while to get her to sleep, but by 8.30 she was fast asleep.

I will keep going, shes quite clingy and tired today I just need to push through!

Its for her own good and my sanity

knottyhair Sat 26-Jan-13 12:29:38

Great news smile! Keep at it, it's worth it in the end.

AnyaKnowIt Sat 26-Jan-13 12:33:03

Great news, the first night is the hardest

Will be able to hand hold if you need it again

BeebiesQueen Sat 26-Jan-13 15:56:49

she just will not give in today! I am shocked by her stubbornness!

She can barely keep her eyes open she is so tired, she closed her eyes on the sofa, closed her eyes when I cuddled her, yet I put her in her cot and she stood and shouted for another 2 hours.

I've had to put her back to bed as she is that tired and yet again she is standing and shouting.

Time to get her up and get her ready for bed, with out letting her fall asleep. I will win! I will not break first!

AnyaKnowIt Sat 26-Jan-13 18:24:48

Oh dear, my dd use to scratch her face and poke her eyes to keep herself awake hmm

Good luck!

BeebiesQueen Sun 27-Jan-13 09:47:39

last night it took 1.5 hours fort her to fall asleep! but when I went up to check on her she had pood. So had to change her and it took another 1.5 hours, so again 3 in total.

We are perservering today, and I will noit give up. Just need her to give in and sleep during the day!

You will get there, you will. Don't give up now!

BeebiesQueen Sun 27-Jan-13 11:16:25

Ist nap of the day is almost over and she hasnt slept! I'm counting down till 11.30 so I can get her up and not have to listen to her shouting any more!

Then at 1pm we will start again. I'm hopefull that thisafternoon will be the day she falls asleep!

But after 2 days I am not giving up! I will not back down. She does fall asleep at night, so I know she can do it!

knottyhair Sun 27-Jan-13 17:56:13

Keep going, it's bloody hard, but it will work if you're persistent & consistent!

timidviper Sun 27-Jan-13 18:00:45

Keep going OP. We did this with DS when he was 15 months old and had never slept through a night (he is now 25 so it is quite a while ago). It took a while but suddenly clicked and he has been able to sleep on a washing line ever since!

AnyaKnowIt Sun 27-Jan-13 19:12:57

Another one here to say keep going

BeebiesQueen Sun 27-Jan-13 19:22:44

well she stopped crying in 1.5 hours today! however I just checked on her and unbelievably she is still awake! she is just sat in her cot, awake, staring into space!

It wouldnt be such a problem if she didnt share with dd1. So I've just sone somne quick bed movement and now dd1's bed is in the little room (currently over flowing wiht boxes due to house move in a couple of weeks, but it will do for now!)

So in 10 minutes as she has gone quiet again, I will put dd1 to bed and that will mean dd2 can fall asleep at some point and I can stop clock watching and worrying about getting dd1 to bed!

I am not giving up, 3 days of feeling like a crap parent and having an exausted baby all day will not be in vain! I will win this one, she will sleep!

breadandhoney Sun 27-Jan-13 19:35:42

Admiring your perseverance! Keep going! I've been there. We did it with dd1 at 6 months as nights had become horrendous. Hoping not to have to do it with dd2 who is now 7 weeks but as a pp said we will if we had to as it completely changed our lives! Cheering for you and hoping you get it cracked very soon.

BeebiesQueen Mon 28-Jan-13 10:57:34

day 4 and she is accepting that she needs to sleep in the day! her shouts are getting much longer and in the 2 hours I have been up just twice. I'm meant to be getting her up at 11 for her bottle, but as I think she is almost asleep I'll leave her till 11.30, if not asleep it will be bottle, lunch a little play and nap time at 1!

I am going to stick this one out, I am not getting 4 days into it to give up. 7 days and if nothing has changed I may think about changing tactics. I can do this!

BeebiesQueen Mon 28-Jan-13 21:37:04

After 2.5 hours this evening she finally led down and went to sleep grin she fell asleep by herself! I'm elated. Hopefully tomorrow she will go to sleep quicker!

Iggly Mon 28-Jan-13 21:40:33

Blimey you're hardcore. I know you didn't want a debate but you let your baby cry for hours and hours and hours.

Well done you.

Iggly Mon 28-Jan-13 21:41:18

I will add I have a 13 month old and 3.4 year old who weren't great at sleeping but got there without cc.

Iggly Mon 28-Jan-13 21:43:00

Although you're not doing CC you're doing CIO which is horrid.

Erm, no, OP has been going in every 10-15 minutes. That's not the same thing at all.

You could try shorter periods of time - rather than 10-15 mins as I think the resettling and reassuring is more important than the period of crying and getting worked up. We only did night time, not nap time and started with 2 min and worked up by 1 min each time.

2.5 hours on the 4th night sounds like a really long time - most people who have success with CC seem to have it quicker than that and it is resolved within a week.

If you add the 2 hours earlier to the 2.5 hours at night time, you are leaving her to shout for 4.5 hours which is a really long time. You can't seriously believe that many people will "hold your hand" while you leave your DD to cry for that many hours in a day?

Yes possibly about shorter periods of time, but if the OP stops CC altogether now it will have been wasted, pointless crying, and her DD will just have learned to keep crying. Crueller in the long run if you ask me.

breadandhoney Tue 29-Jan-13 02:38:21

I agree with IHeartkingthistle. Can't give up now or the past 4 days have been for nothing. I'm shocked at the stubbornness of this little girl but would hope it will all click suddenly into place.

Question though OP. you sound surprised that your dd fell asleep by herself tonight. Isn't that what has been happening every night, eventually? Or hZve you given in? If you are inconsistent and giving mixed messages I agree it's cruel.

knottyhair Tue 29-Jan-13 06:23:57

Ignore all these OP! You are not cruel, you are trying to teach your child how to settle herself which is an important skill. Keep at it my love x

BeebiesQueen Tue 29-Jan-13 09:23:16

I'm not doing cry it out, nor am I leaving her to cry for hours and hours!
I'm going in every 15 minutes so calm her down and lie her down again.

She is also not crying for hours and hours. she is not upset and not distressed. she is angry and shouting, but most of the time she is just sitting quietly in her cot.

Let me reiterate she is not crying, her shouts are just 'up, up, up' which means she wants to get up. she is not upset or distressed. If she was I couldn't and wouldn't be doing this.

I haven't been giving in each night breadandhoney, she fell asleep lying down which is a first. she actually led down and fell asleep, up until now she has been falling asleep sitting up and even when I lie her down in an asleep state she has instantly been sitting up again.

For all of those who suggest this is a cruel method what do you suggest? she is stubborn and determined, this is showing results, maybe not as quick as others have had results but still we are getting results. I have tried every thing else. Letting her fall asleep in her 0 stage car seat is not practical, she has almost grown out of it and she cant sleep in it all night, its not safe. Sitting next to her patting her and shushing was getting the same results, her crying for hours and hours, only worse because I was there and she wanted to get out.

Come on then if you are all such amazing parents why don't you come here and do it. You can come and tell me where I am going wrong and why she wont sleep EVER. This way dh, dd (who is only 2) and I have all had 6 hours sleep in a row, we haven't had that since she was born. she always woke up after 1.5-2 hours meaning we are always shattered, my 2 year old is always grumpy and tired. In the past few days I have seen my little girl turn into the child she was before she sister was born. I have also seen my baby improve as she is getting more sleep this way and is much happier for it. she is becoming more independent rather than clingy. she comes to me for a cuddle then goes off and plays rather than being constantly attached to my side all day long.

You may think is cruel but you are not here I am, you are living this life I am, you are not seeing what I am, just what I type here. Do not for a second think you have the full picture because I can assure you, you haven't.

I don't care how crap sleepers your children were, every child is different, every person feels things differently and every family make up is different. You don't have a clue what I am going through here. Don't pretend you do.

BeebiesQueen Tue 29-Jan-13 09:25:48

Also I have had some lovely people holding my hand on this thread, and on my first thread which was in chat. I moved here as it was a more appropriate place.

To thoes that have been supportive and kind. Thank you.

teacher123 Tue 29-Jan-13 09:37:26

I don't think anyone goes into sleep training lightly, I am sure that beebiesqueen has thought long and hard about this. Everyone's approach to parenting is different, and there is a huge difference between just leaving a child in a room sobbing their heart out whilst parents are downstairs watching telly/getting wasted/neglecting them and parents who are desperate, whose children are unhappy, trying to help them.

Sleep deprivation is just horrendous, and for some people co sleeping is the answer. For others (like us) cosleeping just doesn't work and never did. Therefore you are stuck. In our case DS would cry whether we were there or not, but would settle much quicker when I wasn't in the room (ie 5 minutes of shouting/grizzling as opposed to 45 minutes). Should I stay with him so he's upset for longer? That would be ridiculous.

BeebiesQueen Tue 29-Jan-13 09:46:30

Thanks teacher. We also have tried co-sleeping, but she just wont fall asleep and gets more and more upset.

Good for you beebies. Lovely to hear it's having an impact during the day as well.

breadandhoney Tue 29-Jan-13 14:42:46

Beebies. Glad to hear things are coming along and that your eldest is benefitting from what you've been doing the past few days. I hope you didn't take my pp as a criticism. I was simply curious about how your dd had been falling asleep before. Admiring your determination. As the mother of a very stubborn 2.6yo who we sleep trained at 6 months I only mean to be here to support you.

Shut out the negative voices. You know this is the right way forward for you and your family. CC is not a way of life. Soon this will be a thing of the past and your family will benefit.

This is pretty much the least eloquent thing I've ever written. Basically...still hand holding smile

MNPin2013 Tue 29-Jan-13 17:30:44

Sounds like your both getting on with it as best as you can and it is for the positive.

BeebiesQueen Tue 29-Jan-13 18:28:19

I put her to bed 5minutes and after the initial protests she hasn't made a noise since. She also didn't get up the second I put her down. After a crap day i could cry! Hopefully she's falling asleep up there rather than sitting staring.

teacher123 Tue 29-Jan-13 21:58:45

Did she go off to sleep ok? Hope you managed to get a bit of an evening! X

breadandhoney Wed 30-Jan-13 02:40:19

Hope she was asleep soon after you posted.

BeebiesQueen Wed 30-Jan-13 09:58:14

she woke up soon after I posted and was shouting till 9pm, but she fell asleep again in her cot by herself. I'm clinging on to any improvement!

and this morning there was hardly any fuss, less than a minute in fact and she is sleeping soundly. day 6 and I think we cracked it!

teacher123 Wed 30-Jan-13 22:06:19

How's it gone for the rest of today and for bedtime tonight?

pacific407 Thu 31-Jan-13 12:44:59

I haven't read all the posts so may be repeating, but have you considered her sleeping environment and anything that could change? I'm just wondering if there's a reassurance/comfort element to you being there and, if so, whether you could replicate that with a soft toy (I read on another thread about a microwaveable bean bag toy which I love the sound of), music, lighting etc?

BeebiesQueen Thu 31-Jan-13 17:14:27

I put her to bed last night, she grumbled for around 2 minutes, she then fell asleep for 45 minutes, she woke up, cried for 2 minutes (I wanted her to know i was still there) re settled her she grumbled for another 5 and slept for 45 minutes cried for 2 i resettled her the she grumbled for 5 minutes. She cried out at midnight by the time i went on she was fast asleep again! She woke up at 4.45 for a bottle then slept till 6.

Today we had to go out this morning and she fell asleep in her car seat. This afternoon she slept for around 30 minutes and she's currently having dinner and then it will be bed time.

I'm also going to do something quite scary, I'm going to put both children to bed at the same time. Up until now dd1 has been waiting till dd2 was asleep before going to bed, and before that we would put 1 to bed before the other too. Quite nervous as its another big step, but a necessity and when its a solid routine I'll be glad I did it!

teacher123 Thu 31-Jan-13 17:30:38

Wow! Sounds like progress is definitely being made, when they both go to bed, make sure you have a very large glass of wine and a big bar of chocolate smile

BeebiesQueen Thu 31-Jan-13 17:52:55

I put them to bed at 5.45 (figured they are both very tired and it will take a while for them to settle) and they are both quiet! no idea if actually asleep, but as there is no noise coming from their bedroom there is no way in hell anyone is going anywhere near those stairs! grin

chocolate sounds good, a big bar of choc. On day 7 both sleeping in the same room at the same time. HUGE progress

knottyhair Thu 31-Jan-13 18:06:56

Just wanted to say well done, it's tough but real progress today by the sounds of it smile.

teacher123 Thu 31-Jan-13 18:07:19

Hahaha! Our stairs are dead creaky-when MIL or DM look after DS I have to tell them NOT to go and peep at him, as it wakes him up! I really hope you get at least some of an evening smile

BeebiesQueen Thu 31-Jan-13 19:09:22

I'm not sure what happened. They were both fast asleep and happy then suddenly dd2 dtarts screaming hysterically, I ran upstairs and she is wild eyed and very upset. I picked her up and she held on tight and wouldnt let go. thankfully dd1 is still asleep but dd2 is not downstairs with me hmm not sure I did the right thing, but I've never heard her make a noise like that before and she really was scared. we'll cuddle for a bit then back to bed I think.

BeebiesQueen Thu 31-Jan-13 19:09:59

now not not!

breadandhoney Thu 31-Jan-13 19:43:50

Fantastic progress! Hope dd2 settles for you shortly. You trusted your instincts on that one. Maybe a bad dream or a tummy pain?

BeebiesQueen Thu 31-Jan-13 20:07:24

I really dont know what happened. dh got home from work and she happily went to him and tried to snuggle down, so he took her back to bed. I can still hear her every now and then, but shes trying to sleep. It must have been a bad dream sad

teacher123 Fri 01-Feb-13 07:26:35

Did she manage to settle back off? When they cry like that then you know that it's out of the ordinary and you have to cuddle them, don't you? Glad that she had a nice cuddle with DH when he got home.

BeebiesQueen Fri 01-Feb-13 12:27:46

she went back off in about 10 minutes. she didnt cry, just shouting for me again.

I just put her down now as she missed this morning nap (I didnt notice the time) and shes up there shouting again. shes tired but has decided that today she just doesnt want to sleep!

breadandhoney Tue 05-Feb-13 17:22:55

How have the last few days been?

BeebiesQueen Tue 05-Feb-13 19:21:38

We now have 5 minutes of crying and a she sleeps till 4.30ish in her own cot.
She's been teething for the last couple of days and she's even been good during that!
So pleased I did it.

Seriously, you rock.

breadandhoney Wed 06-Feb-13 00:19:35

Yay! Well done you and your dd smile

knottyhair Wed 06-Feb-13 06:16:35

Great news! smile

BeebiesQueen Thu 07-Feb-13 11:06:49

thanks :O
our new routine is walk in to her bedroom, she starts complaining. I lie her down she shakes her head at me and sits up and complains louder. I say its nap time, or night night (depending on the time of day) she complains until I close the door and she lies down and goes to sleep.
To be honest I'm still in slight shock! I cant believe my child who never sleeps now has 2 naps in her cot during the day, goes to bed at a reasonable hour and sleeps in her cot for most of the night. She also sleeps longer in the morning rather than being up at 5 am she sleeps till closer to 7 sometimes even 8!
Shes a happier more independent baby. she will play with her sister or by herself meaning I can get stuff done around the house. for the 1st time in a year I have an empty laundry basket and an empty ironing basket at the same time!!

It may seem like a harsh way of doing things to some, and I guess it is. I've tried controlled crying in the past with her and she never responded well (she just got hysterical) so it really does depend on your baby, but I think dd2 was ready for a change, I think she wanted to be able to sleep just as much as I needed her to sleep. The difference in her is just incredible, she really is a different child

teacher123 Thu 07-Feb-13 11:41:20

Amazing!!! So glad things have improved, sleep makes everyone happier!

breadandhoney Tue 12-Feb-13 18:54:38

I remember that feeling well. Congratulations! Enjoy smile

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