High Needs Baby Support Group (thread IV)

(961 Posts)

Yoohooo! Over here!


The last thread was filling up so I've started us a sparkling new one.

The original thread was to support those of us with babies fitting the following criteria:

1. Feeds frequently daytime
2. Feeds frequently nighttime
3. Needs to be constantly held
4. Wont sleep alone
5. Hates the car seat/pram
6. Short naps

Some of our babies have grown out of some of those now, but we're still here to support each other through the sleepless nights and noisy car journeys and to offer hugs, chocolate and wine to anyone who's struggling.

So if that list sounds familiar then come and join us as we delight in our active, inquisitive, curious and restless babies or toddlers!

Thanks for the shiny new thread Truth! Wow, the letters actually appear in the box as I type them instead of 20 seconds later... grin

It sounds like you've got everything sorted apart from the house then, how exciting!

Yeah, apparently there was supposed to be a Jubilee convert with fireworks earlier in the summer but it was rained off so it was tonight instead. hmm Poor DS jumped every time the loud ones went off!

Convert? blush Concert!

SpannerPants Mon 27-Aug-12 17:02:54

Hi everyone!

After a few reasonably good weeks, we went to to my cousins wedding yesterday and DS went for 9 hours without a nap - he was a delight during the wedding and loved meeting all the new people, but slept abysmally sad he's started having nightmares where he starts screaming his heart out and it takes us ages to wake him up and comfort him - I don't know what we can do about that.

Hope you're all enjoying the bank holiday weekend!

tickleme63 Mon 27-Aug-12 18:22:21

Hello everyone, just checking in. New thread, wooooo!

Just looking at that original list makes me realise and appreciate just how far my little fella has come in the space of a few months. He's still not a huge fan of the car but will tolerate it, ditto buggy. Everything else seems to either be resolved or resolving itself <touches wood; keeps everything crossed; prays to myriad deities>

Great night with him last night - bed at about 7.30pm, one wake-up at about 1.50am, quick feed and back to sleep till 7.20am.

Joyful Poor DS, fireworks are the work of the devil. I used to love them, but now they make me very growly - how dare they wake up our babies!!! grin

Spanner Sorry to hear your little one is having some nightmares sad Hope that they pass lady, must be horrible to hear.

Truth Lake District = beautiful smile

We're hopefully going to look at a place this week under the Homebuy scheme. We so crave our own space...

Bathtime for DS, hope you all have a lovely night!

What a fab night tickle! Good luck with the househunting. smile

Spanner nightmares are terrible when they're small, they just don't understand. At least when DD has them four or five nights a week we can tell her that they're just bad dreams. Much sympathy.

Well, after 6 months of teething DS finally cut his first tooth today! And spent most of every feed clamping down, then launching himself backwards. Horrid child. sad When DD did it putting her on the floor stopped it, but she was a bit older. I'm not sure DS understands cause and effect yet.

LittleWaveyLines Mon 27-Aug-12 21:58:16


Just checking in - haven't been on MN much recently as everytime DD sees my laptop out she wants a go and starts bashing - so any posts tend to be urgent and to the point!

Thought I'd see how far we've come since we started this support group ... DD is now 14 months!

1. Feeds frequently daytime - yup if I'm there, has even upped the frequency recently (but I'm told this is common for this age and should calm back down soon, and she copes without OK when I'm at work)

2. Feeds frequently nighttime -Not anymore smile ! I think she feeds maybe 8/9pm (her bedtime), 11/12pm, 4am, 6am, 7am and up at 7.30 - so I now get more than a 2 hour stretch of sleep maximum at night! I reckon most nights I know get a 4 or 5 hour stretch, and it feels FANTASTIC! grin)

3. Needs to be constantly held - well frequently still the case but it is now just a good excuse for getting a bigger stash of slings, so I enjoy it grin
(For the sling nerds I now have a Bara barn, girasol size2, caribe 5, ER 6, Light rainbow DW 7, a wompat, an indio ring sling and a babyhawk grin)

4. Wont sleep alone - Well she's up in bed on her own right now, but sometimes this one still holds... TBH I would feel weird putting her in a cot now, I've got so used to sharing the bed.

5. Hates the car seat/pram. We've got a fab new rear facing car seat that she mostly just falls asleep in! shock I think it was the bucket shape of the infant seat that was the problem. I don't use a pram now (exclusively sling) so not sure about that bit

6. Short naps . Well you can't win them all. She now does about one 30minute nap a day - not really long enough to sleep myself or get anything done, but I'm reconciled to this one now..

I've probably jinxed the sleep thing now, but it really makes such a difference to get more than 2 hours in a row. We had a rocky patch a couple of weeks back where she didn't even give me the 2 hours, and I felt just awful..

Anyway - how is everyone else? grin

There's some positive stories here. Well done BabyTickle and BabyWavey (although two hour stretches still don't sound like much fun LWL!)

Keep trying with the putting him on the floor when he bites you Joyful. It took DS a few days to get it but he has 9 teeth now and hasn't bitten me since those first agonising few came through. Bloody painful until they work it out though eh? Oh, I think I used to give him a teether as I put him on the floor so that he realised the link.

I think DS is cutting another one actually, he's had a couple of very awake wake ups recently (usually wakes, screams, feeds, sleeps, but has been really unsettled and squirmy on wake ups recently) This is causing friction with DH, who thinks that at 13mo DS should be doing much better than this. Has anyone had any success with convincing their OH's that their HN babies are normal and it's not because of anything we do? If so, what did you do?

Yes, after the controlled crying debacle DH was fully accepting that DD was the way she was and nothing was going to change it. Maybe give him the Dr Sears link to read? And I used to have a wonderful link about how babies are biologically programmed to wake frequently, I'll see if I can find it. 13 months is so awfully little still.

Here it is, the Infant Sleep Information Source.

Generally, though, babies do not sleep all night-every night until they are close to a year old. One study investigating infant sleep duration found that 27% of babies had not regularly slept from 10pm to 6am by the age of 1 year. 13% of babies had not regularly slept through for 5 hours or more by the age of 1 year. Popular beliefs about when babies should be 'sleeping through the night' are based on studies conducted in the 1950s and 1960s on groups of formula-fed babies. However it is normal for babies - especially breastfed babies - to wake and feed at night throughout at least the first year. Encouraging babies to 'sleep through' before they are ready to do so makes it difficult to keep on breastfeeding, and may encourage babies to develop mature sleep patterns out of sequence with their other circadian patterns such as those controlling the regulation of temperature, hormone production, and the genes that control our biological rhythms.

From this page of the above site.

I thought this was worth posting near the top of the thread for any newbies who happen upon our haggard happy band. grin

Dr Sears' 12 features of a high needs baby

<Puts on fresh pot of brew and lays out tray of biscuit and matchsticks>

I may be talking to myself here a lot tonight - it took 3.5 hours and 2 bouts of vomiting before DS settled to sleep tonight. sad

How's everyone else? Anyone else excited about the Paralympics?

LittleWaveyLines Tue 28-Aug-12 22:14:32

Oh Puddle your poor DS.... what happened?

Well DD didn't sleep until 9.30 tonight - but then she actually had a decent nap today so I'm not surprised! Normally it's just 30mins 11 or 12 ish - but today she did 2 hours shock from 1 to 3.... shock

I actually didn't know what to do with myself grin

Mind you she normally doesn't sleep until 8.30 so it was that different a bedtime....

<wails> I don't know! His first tooth cut yesterday and his second is cutting atm but I have no idea why he was sick. He finally settled in bed at about twenty past nine then woke screaming at ten. sad I gave him a dose of nurofen before bedtime but then he threw up - I daren't give him any more in case of overdose!

Wow, great napping baby Wavey! Fingers crossed it means you have a good night too. smile

LittleWaveyLines Tue 28-Aug-12 22:46:58

<sending soothing vibes to babyPuddle> Hope he gets better soon./// now I must go to sleep!

DS was so bad last night I only managed half an hour out of the bedroom the entire evening. I didn't get to sleep till after 0100 then was woken every so often as he was in bed with me. He woke up at 0430 and I spent 2 hours trying to get him back to sleep. I had almost succeeded when DD came bursting inat 0640 (she knows she's not allowed in my room when he's in bed) and woke him up again. I am so wound up right now I feel like I'm going to explode.

How was your night?

tickleme63 Wed 29-Aug-12 08:14:28

Joyful sad Poor DS and poor you! sad I'm sorry you've had such a shitty night and morning. Big breaths lady. I hope your little man feels better today. Teeth are bloody evil. <offers frozen muslin for DS to chew and strong coffee and dairy/soya-free chocci cake for mum>

We've got a molar here... it's now poking through on the top left. And another bottom tooth as well. Our poor bubs...

Office day today, sigh...Can't complain really as I only go in one day a week, but I hate leaving DS all day long. Hope you all have a good day.

<Offers matchsticks, coffee and some Kendal mint cake from recent trip to the Lakes>

How is everyone?

DS well and truly rebuffed the HN tag last night. We drove back from the Lakes and he chatted away to himself for the first half an hour, dropped off to sleep for the rest of the way, woke up when we pulled up outside the house, gave a cute little nod as if to say 'ah, home' and then let DH put him straight in his cot with no fuss or feeding. Yay him!

He did then wake up every two hours and demand food, then end up in bed with us because I couldn't persuade him to go back in his cot after 4am

Mitsouko Thu 30-Aug-12 12:33:26

Hi ladies, nice to see the new thread and hope everyone is managing ok.

I've been offline since last week due to migraine...again. Came down with a stomach bug last Thursday. The fever got quite bad and seemed to set the migraine off. Tried to tough it out but caved after two days and took my sumatriptan prescription (regular painkillers don't have any effect). That meant that DD had to be bottle fed for 8 hours. I tried to express, but couldn't pump much and ended up getting really painfully engorged. All in all, a really rubbish weekend. But DH was great, as always. Did all the high need baby care and the bottle feeding while I was ill.

I feel like the chronic sleep deprivation, and lack of support is really taking it's toll on my health. I'm getting severe migraine episodes every 3 weeks or so, and have had multiple bugs and fevers this summer...which I never used to get!

On a more positive note, DD is being super giggly and showing so much excitement and enthusiasm right now. She's almost able to sit unsupported and seems to be developing a lot of strength in her neck and torso. She's really thriving, despite reflux and patchy sleep, and her little personality is emerging. She's a very social baby and loves people and faces. I need to get out more!

And I just found out my best friend in my home country is expecting and will be due next March the week before DD's 1st birthday. Really really thrilled we will have babies so close together in age. And as DH and I are hoping to get out of London and move back to my corner of the world next year, they might even get a chance to grow up together.

How are all of you keeping today?

LittleWaveyLines Thu 30-Aug-12 14:14:56

Sleep deprivation is a killer - but strangely I am only just getting migraines (again) now it's improving!

... and last night DD went to sleep at 9.30 - and didn't wake till 6am! shock shock

Shame I still woke at midnight and 4am! grin

Prior to that the best we've had is the last couple of weeks she has dropped the 2am feed and gone from 12 till 4am. So here's fingers crossed that it's the start of better sleep, just in time for me being back at school teaching with a proper timetable....

(DD is 14 months now, before anyone starts worrying why their 6 week old isn't doing this. It's only the last month that she has ever slept more than 2 hours in a row. So I know about sleep deprivation!)

<picks self up off floor>

She did WHAT LWL??!? That's amazing. Had you or she done anything differently during the day or was it just random? I'm also starting to worry about back to school next week. I went back at Easter and was fine, but it was a much easier timetable than I'm about to start. I've just started lesson planning this afternoon and cannot believe it is time to go back already! What do you teach?

We're supposed to be trying night weaning in time for the new term but DH slept through all but one of DS's wake ups last night (despite much pushing & prodding by me!) so I'm not sure how succesful it will be.

Sorry to hear about the migraines Mitsouku. Mine are usually stress/tiredness related so I'm surprised not to have had any with DS. I do dread them though so I'm full of sympathy that you're having to go through them.

It's good that your DD is developing so well though. I'm sure most of us on the thread would agree that once our LOs starting doing stuff the sleep deprivation came a little more bearable and the oh wow, you're so cute moments a little more frequent! For my DS, being able to do more for himself and communicate a little (by which I mean pointing at what he wants and screaming about what he doesn't) also helped him calm down a lot. It's really just sleep we're struggling with now, but honestly, that gets more bearable as the other stuff calms down.

<hands round Kendal mint cake from recent trip to the Lakes and trots off upstairs to begin The Great Sleep Debacle>

LittleWaveyLines Thu 30-Aug-12 20:39:31

It was just random... absolutely nothing different so I'm not holding out too much for a repeat - but 4 hours in a row would be nice smile

I'm secondary science and still in denial about term starting really! Done NO lesson planning blush I also had an easy timetable last half term so I'm a bit apprehensive..... you'll have to let me know how you do!

<scoffs Kendal mint cake and brews more brew>

That's great news LWL! Fingers crossed for another good night. smile

Truth how's the househunting going? And the lesson plans? Your DS sounds so cute recognising when you were home!

Mitsouko the others are right, sleep deprivation is easier to deal with as your baby gets older and you get more back from them. It's tough though, and must be hard with migraines. Could you pump when you're well and freeze it for when you're not? That way you wouldn't have to worry about it when you're in pain.

Well DS has calmed down a little but now DD is being a stroppy little madam. I think it's to do with her starting preschool next week - she's looking forward to it and asks every morning if she can go yet, but it's a big change. I have to say I'm dreading it, I hate the idea of her being away from me every day - what if she gets hurt or upset and I'm not there? (I know I sound crazy and need to get over this! I have a lot of anxiety issues around this kind of stuff though).

The househunting is going well thanks Joyful, although I made the stupid mistake of doing all the first viewings myself, then taking DH to see 'the shortlist'. Because he didn't see all the crap places that I discounted he's being a bit 'meh' about the good ones. Sigh. I also stupidly took him to see the best one first, so now he just compares them all to that one. Double sigh. I shouldn't complain. He loves it so much that he's willing to increase the budget and it really is a lovely house grin The biggest challenge is selling our house now. The signs are up and the place is spotless. Going back to work is probably a blessing as it will give DS and I less chance to mess it up!

Anyone want to buy a house?

The lesson plans are done. They didn't take long actually. I've just done two 'intro' or 'getting to know you' lessons that I am using for every class for the first week and hopefully every class for the first week of my new job in January too so the real planning mission will start next weekend after I've met them all.

Does DD go to nursery or anything at the moment Joyful? It sounds like she's very excited about preschool and hopefully it will give you a chance to catch up on some rest, but I agree that the 'what if' questions are worrying. If it helps even a teeny bit, I was terrified before DS started nursery, but he absolutely loves it.

Oh, Mitsouku, just a thought, what pump do you have? I used to use a Tommee Tippee and could never get very much, then a friend lent me a Medela and it was a revelation. If you can beg, borrow or steal one it might be worth a try.

No nursery, so this is the first proper separation for us. Which is why I'm a bit wobbly about it, although I'm trying very hard not to let on in front of DD. She's so excited about it and I'm excited for her but I'll miss her terribly. And it's only for 3 hours a day! hmm

Have you made an offer on your lovely house then? Or are you waiting until you have a buyer?

Sounds like good planning btw! smile My sister's planned her first couple of weeks of term but she's primary. And really needs to learn how to say no - she's head of maths, music and head of year (a SATS year at that). She nearly crumbled under the load last year. confused

Raspberrysorbet Thu 30-Aug-12 22:28:13

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

<waves back>

<passes Raspberry some Kendal mint cake, brew and matchsticks>

Raspberrysorbet Fri 31-Aug-12 07:50:48

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

I could take him to the zoo with us if you like? I'm considering feeding DD to a tiger and leaving DS with the monkeys so I'll have an opening for the role of pesky child... wink

DS was up every hour during the evening until I caved around midnight and brought him into bed. He still woke fairly frequently after that but I didn't have to wake properly, just shove a nipple in his mouth and go back to sleep. This happens pretty much every night!

How old is your DS Raspberry? Is he your first or do you have other children?

LittleWaveyLines Fri 31-Aug-12 09:35:19

9pm til 3.30am

That's not my baby - she sleeps too much! grin

However after 3.30 she was incredibly unsettled so not sure I got more sleep last night - but it's progress!

tickleme63 Fri 31-Aug-12 09:39:55

<waves at Raspberry> Cake is always an acceptable food, no matter the meal or ungodly time of day!

Hope you enjoy the zoo Joyful smile I know what you mean about being worried about being away from DC. I hate when I'm on office days. Some days it hits me that yes, he will be going to school one day and will be away from us for six or seven hours at a time - yikes! Bet we'll be glad of it by that point grin

Truth Hope you get a buyer really soon! I can't wait to move. One day, tickle... one day...

DH is taking DS swimming this morning, I think. It's so tricky for him to go to groups and that with DS as his naps clash with nearly every single one of them, apart from one on Wednesdays... sort of leaves DH at a bit of a loss some days as to what to do. Any suggestions for activities for a 13-month-old?

Good night with DS again - bed at 7.15, fed at 11.45pm, up again at 2.30am - DH went in and it had got so cold in his room! Poor little mite was chilly (and is teething a bit again) so DH layered him up, gave him a dose of Calpol and he was out like a light until 7.30am. Poor thing, I feel so crap that he was all cold sad

tickleme63 Fri 31-Aug-12 09:40:34

LWL Gasp! Good stuff lady! Well done BabyWavey grin

Raspberrysorbet Fri 31-Aug-12 10:03:09

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Whoop whoop. Go BabyWavey grin

Don't worry too much about the high needs tag Raspberry. You're welcome to share the Kendal Mint Cake and matchsticks regardless of what your baby is like - especially as he sounds so sweet trying to latch onto your ankle smile

Awww, Joyful, I'm sorry it's stressing you out. As I said, I was terrified before DS started nursery, but he loves it and I quickly came to trust his key worker (still get a bit stressy when someone else meets us in the morning, but they all seem lovely to be honest). I've ended up putting him in for extra sessions over the summer to allow myself a rest. Hopefully you'll find the same [gentle smile and head stroke] We haven't offered on Dream House. We're waiting to see what happens here first. I'm getting impatient already though. I can just picture our furniture there and DS playing in the garden.

Night Two in the Night Weaning house was as unsuccessful as night one. Sigh. DH just doesn't wake up. If I try to wake him up he reacts so badly to it that it's easier just to go to DS myself, and if I go, well, we all know what he wants from me! To be fair, DH did get up at 5am with BabyTruth and does a good line in 'you should have woken me'. BabyTruth has also been ridiculously sweet this morning so he is forgiven for waking me so often last night, although I did lie awake for about an hour in the early hours stressing about how exhausted I will be when I go back to work next week. Oh the irony.

You "can't wait to move" Tickle? Well, I know this great house... wink

Hm, activities for a 13mo? Sounds like a good idea for a thread. I'd certainly have benefited from some tips over the hols. Here's some that work for me: take a ball to a park (lesson learnt when I didn't take a ball and he just tried to steal everyone else's); library for a flick through the books (DS does a very cute attempt at 'reading'); soft play (where I confess to pretending DS is only 11mo so we get in for £1); washing up (seriously, DS loves washing up, we just put a chair in front of the sink so he can reach & keep all knives out of the way); going on a bus or train; feeding the ducks. Um, er. That's it. I'm out. Sorry.

Raspberrysorbet Fri 31-Aug-12 11:05:45

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Yeah, it's the sugary stuff. It's minging grin but very good for boosting energy.

Loving the pasta idea!

JemJar Fri 31-Aug-12 13:25:51

Hi, hope you don't mind if I pull up a chair?

My PFB 19 week old lad is asleep in a sling, I am perched on the edge of a chair as he wakes if I sit back, patting his bum and I have the white noise machine blaring.
He is 4 weeks into the 4 month sleep regression and it is getting worse not better. I got 4 hours sleep total last night and only because hubby slept on the sofa and took him from 5:30-7:30.

Every nap is a wrestle unless I walk around slinging him but am too knackered to do it 3 x per day. He is even worse if he goes more than 2/2.5 hours without a sleep. Plus now he will only sleep for me.

He can be a smiley giggling gorgeous poppet in the day but is also very needy and wants to be held a lot.

My NCT friends babies are all a dream in comparison and any trip to the park or anywhere is them all chatting with babies sleeping/chilling and me rocking/swinging/walking and feeling like the crapiest mum to not have a content baby. I have not gone to the last 3 meets as it is more stressful than enjoyable.

Away with family this weekend, in a bloody caravan, dreading the 'no where to hide' bit of the night wakings and constant 'you need to wean him, give him a formula bottle before bed, stop co sleeping, let him cry it out he has to learn, you are spoiling him and making a rod for your own back' etc.....

Feel so tearful and short tempered. He is awake now and screaming and crying again

tickleme63 Fri 31-Aug-12 13:54:21

Got to get back to work shortly but just wanted to send quick <hugs> to you Jemjar. Ignore, ignore, ignore those telling you to let him cry/you are spoiling him. You honestly can't spoil him, and (I believe) letting him cry it out will only make him 'learn' that no one actually cares or is listening.

Honestly, it is nothing about you, or your mothering, that has made your little one this way. It's just how they are, for a while at least, Doesn't make it any less frustrating/hard/depressing/earth-shatteringly tiring. But I don't believe in the rods for backs thing after my high-needs PFB - whatever works, works.

It honestly won't last forever. My DS was the same. Wouldn't be put down, held/fed to sleep. But he steadily improved and now at 13 months, he's sooo much better. Still has night feeds - I'd be terrified of weaning, as the boob is the one thing guaranteed to get him back off to sleep! grin

Back later - big breaths, this too shall pass smile

Raspberrysorbet Fri 31-Aug-12 14:08:19

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Recycling babies - is that an option? shock Why did no-one tell me?

We had a lovely day at the zoo but we're all very tired now and my back is blindingly painful - something to do with having an 8mo in the sling for most of the day (on top of all the usual issues of DDD of course). It was worth it though, and DS even sat in a stroller for a little while! DD was very taken with the giraffe but the funniest bit of the day was when we were looking at meerkats:

DD: Look, a mummy and 3 babies!
Me: How do you know that's the mummy meerkat?
DD: Because she's telling all the other ones "Do that, do that, do that!".
Me: confused

Jem you sound so stressed! It really honestly is nothing to do with your mothering, some babies are just HN. There's no reason. There are a couple of posters on here who have 4 children each - the first 3 were sleepy contented babies and then the fourth was HN. Some babies are just born that way.

I get so stabby when I hear the phrase 'rod for your own back'. I heard it so often when DD (also a HN baby) was small and I used to get so worried about it. Now she's 3 and she doesn't feed to sleep, doesn't need to be cuddled to sleep, doesn't like slings or buggies and is the most fiercely independent child I have ever met.

Do what you need to do so that you and your baby get reasonable amounts of sleep. If it stops working a bit further down the line or you need to make changes, do it then. Worry about it then. For now just do what works. smile

Oh dear, that was a bit epic! Sorry. blush

Lychees Fri 31-Aug-12 21:38:04

Hi ladies, can I join in, please? I could use with the support some days. I have a naturally conceived DS aged 4 1/2 who was high needs and is now a very bright, energetic, chatty little boy who is generally well behaved. However, we struggled to conceive a sibling for him and had ICSI which resulted in my beautiful DD who is now nine weeks old.

I honestly thought that lightning couldn't possibly strike twice. And that our struggles with secondary infertility would mean that we would have this perfect and chilled-out baby. I thought I'd be "given a break", "cut some slack" by higher powers. How wrong was I?!?

DD is a crier ... she wouldn't go down in her crib in hospital from day one and went from perfectly ok to screaming in five seconds flat. She's still the same now although I get some respite at night because that's generally when she's sleeps well .... ish. But she has wind problems [we're trying everything but as nothing seems to improve it significantly, we are just hoping that she grows out of it soon] so all day long, she cries unless of course, she's in my arms asleep or feeding [although sometimes she cries then, too].

I've tried two different slings ... she hates them; bought a cradle swing, hates that. Have DS's bouncer; hates that. Hates going in the car seat [in the car or on the pushchair]. We have a white noise machine which makes no difference whatsoever. I've talked to my GP, DD went from nothing to screaming the place down in seconds, he rushed me out of there saying that she's fine and she'd grow out of it. And I know, it's a matter of time but I feel a bit alone as everyone I know has easy babies and being around them makes me feel worse. I don't have family close by either, so mostly I sit at home holding her and when DS isn't in nursery, he sits with us playing on his own and has to fend for himself to some extent. Occasionally, I've been out with both of them [somewhere noisy when no one will really pay much attention to the crying baby] but our trip is always cut short by an inconsolable crying spell and me rushing us all back home.

DH is great ... when he's here but he's a contractor so works full-time rarely taking a day off. Right now DD is very tired but as usual, unable to fall into a deep sleep so DH is comforting her.

Oh Lychees you poor love! I too thought that lightning couldn't strike twice. confused

This may sound like a random question but what are your baby's poos like? Your GP sounds rubbish, could you go back and see a different one?

Lychees Fri 31-Aug-12 22:18:35

Hi Joyful, she doesn't poo for days on end but I don't think she's constipated as they are soft poos. She cries excessively all the time; building up to poo day, on poo day, after poo day so I don't think poo is a specific issue.

I do wonder if she has silent reflux as she has hiccups a lot, arches her back and fusses whilst feeding. When I mentioned this to my Dr though, he said that she's putting on weight fine so doesn't think she has this [as he ushered me out of the door with her screaming in her carseat]. I think I should persist and go back to my GP and hope I get to see a different Dr. Unfortunately, if I want to see a particular one, I have to make an appointment at least three weeks in advance so it's kind of potluck with who I get.

Yes, my GP surgery's like that. sad I asked about the poo because I was wondering about reflux, wind, possible letdown issues if you're breastfeeding etc. If the poo's an unusual colour or foamy it can be an indicator of certain conditions (I'm sure you already know that though!).

How's your DS coping with his new sister?

Raspberrysorbet Sat 01-Sep-12 20:27:45

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Oh he sounds adorable! DS gets the giggles when DD tells him he has chubby little cheeks, for some reason that's the funniest thing in the world!

Have you started him on solids recently? It could be wind or an uncomfortable tummy as he starts digesting food. Or it could be the start of separation anxiety - if he's waking in the dark and can't see you it may be upsetting you. You'd think he'd be able to feel/hear/smell you though.

Sorry, that wasn't as helpful as I thought! Have a brew and we'll wait for someone else to come along. grin

Upsetting him, obviously. blush

Teeth? DS has always woken up crying, but definitely gets worse when there's a tooth coming through. Not found a solution though, sorry!

Raspberrysorbet Sat 01-Sep-12 20:52:06

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Raspberrysorbet Sat 01-Sep-12 20:54:40

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Ooh yes, could be teeth! It's definitely teeth here atm, I should have thought of that! I doubt it's the beer but if you really think it might be try cutting it out for a couple of nights and see if it makes a difference. smile

DS is gorgeous, sometimes I think that's the only reason that he survives! grin He and DD are both awesome, I just wish they slept better...

You could try winding him I suppose? As for teeth (if it is that) he'll settle down once it cuts through the gum. Until the next one starts. confused

<considers evading question, decides honesty is the only policy>

Um, BabyTruth got his first tooth at three months, he's now (13mo) got 10 and a bit. So it's been on and off for 10 months, with no sign of letting up!

No, that's not fair. We probably get two or three nights of full on screaming each time one comes through, the rest of the time we just get a lot of dribble! Bickiepegs are the only thing that seems to work for DS, although they're only really good for daytime. He just wants to nurse all night when there's a tooth coming.

Raspberrysorbet Sat 01-Sep-12 21:08:57

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Raspberrysorbet Sat 01-Sep-12 21:09:55

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<Offers cake. Always makes things better>

Raspberryandorangesorbet Sat 01-Sep-12 21:24:58

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LittleWaveyLines Sat 01-Sep-12 21:37:32

Rasberrysorbet - we had about a month of even more unsettled sleeping when we started solids.... It tends to correspond with yet another sleep regression as well I think....

If it helps, DD has all her teeth now... [hopeful]

Raspberryandorangesorbet Sat 01-Sep-12 21:40:51

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Raspberryandorangesorbet Sat 01-Sep-12 21:42:02

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If it's his digestion it should settle down fairly soon, and the same for teeth. smile Is he trying to roll or is he fairly static in bed?

LittleWaveyLines Sat 01-Sep-12 22:09:02

Sitting sobbing and ranting on here - oh and not giving her green veg at dinner... just lunch. Dunno if it helped grin

Raspberryandorangesorbet Sat 01-Sep-12 23:02:27

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Raspberryandorangesorbet Sat 01-Sep-12 23:03:32

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Lychees Sat 01-Sep-12 23:35:28

Is anyone still awake? I'm downstairs sitting with a crying DD. She just won't sleep unless she's in mine/DH's arms. And now my arms ache and I've sent DH to bed as he was up until 3am with her today and DS was up and loud as usual by 7am. Anyway, I've put her down on her cushion for a bit to see if she'll cry herself to sleep. I confess I tried a soother today ... I'm not that keen on them as I hear/read they can become a hinderance in the long term but she spat it out anyway so I don't know why I spent so long umming and ahhing about whether to try one.

Raspberryandorangesorbet Sat 01-Sep-12 23:43:14

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Lychees Sat 01-Sep-12 23:55:47

No, unfortunately, I've tried a Close Ring Sling, a Baby Bjorn and a Infantino. She hates them all. I've picked her back up and calmed her down several times now but every time I put her back down to give my throbbing arms a rest, she immediately starts crying again. I'm planning on carrying this on until her next feed in an hour or so, then hopefully, she'll be so tired, she'll fall asleep on the bottle.

Raspberryandorangesorbet Sun 02-Sep-12 00:01:52

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Raspberryandorangesorbet Sun 02-Sep-12 00:03:26

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Lychees Sun 02-Sep-12 00:12:55

I have to stand up and do half-squats. She likes the up and down movement. It burns the old thighs but I get to do some pelvic floor exercises and butt clenches whilst doing them ... it's always a good idea to find some positives to keep you going, right? grin. I have two other ways to sway her; going from one foot to the other (works the outer thighs); then twisting from the waist (helping to get rid of the mummy tummy faster?). I've been doing these so much, I thought I should glean some benefit from it too.

She might actually be falling to sleep now on her own .........

Hope your lo is a bit more comfy tonight.

Lychees Sun 02-Sep-12 00:15:27

Thanks for chatting. I don't feel so alone. When you do tagteam-parenting, it often gets lonely.

Lychees Sun 02-Sep-12 00:20:03

Spoke too soon. She's cryingsad. Nevermind ... here we go again.

zambooloo Sun 02-Sep-12 06:02:14

Hi everyone, I feel I need to apologise for my absence and ask if I can re-join? I am seriously crumbling here sad

Dd now 8 months and still waking every hour from 11 onwards AND wakes for the day at 4.30 or 5 if we are lucky. She sleeps perfectly from 6.45-11 so why oh why can't she carry on through the rest of the night?

Back to teaching ft on Monday - I think I might actually die from lack of sleep!

How is everyone? Sorry haven't read thread yet.

zambooloo Sun 02-Sep-12 06:03:02

Sorry that was very me me me wasn't it?!? Feeling sorry for myself sad

Hi zambo, welcome back! Sorry to hear DD's still not sleeping well. Will you be able to catch up on sleep at weekends?

Lychees I hope DD settled in the end and you got some sleep? I know what you mean about tagteam parenting, we do that too. Especially at night as I'm stuck feeding AMD co-sleeping with DS, DH gets up to DD. I hate hearing her crying (she has a lot of nightmares) and not being able to go to her. sad

How was DS last night Raspberry? Still wriggly?

We had another dreadful night and are off to am airshow this morning, so will ne walking around all day. Again. I may not be able to move by this evening! confused

LittleWaveyLines Sun 02-Sep-12 09:04:38

Lychees - have you tried bouncing on an exercise ball? I find it's a bit easier - also Madame here hated most slings at the beginning except our stretchy wrap - but she loved them all by 6 months. Could you get to a sling meet or sling library to try some others?

DD - 12 till 6,30 am last night! shock Seriously, this is not my baby! So there is hope for all those with hourly waking babies - just wait it out until they're 14 months or so... grin

LittleWaveyLines Sun 02-Sep-12 09:06:43

Zambooloo - could you change her hours so she goes to bed later (at the same time as you) and so then sleeps in later? I got DD to sleep from 9.30pm till 7.30 so we got the best bit of the night (a whole 2 or sometimes 3 hour stretch! grin) when I could sleep if I wanted....

Raspberryandorangesorbet Sun 02-Sep-12 09:20:34

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Just another three weeks to wait with DS then? Thanks for the hope LWL... grin

Zambo - you'll cope smile I actually found I had more energy when I returned to work and have been shattered over the holidays. For some inexplicable reason, I find classes full of teenagers less exhausting than DS! Just make life as easy as possible for yourself (double up lesson plans where you can, befriend peer assessment...)

Lychee - [hugs] Sorry, no advice, just hugs.

daisylulu Sun 02-Sep-12 11:03:58

Hi ladies

Can I join please? I had joined the early wakers thread but our issues actually go WAY beyond that. In fact I'd love early waking to be our only issue!

DD is 16 months and I really thought things would be a whole lot easier by now....

Our background is - colicy as newborn, reflux, dairy/soya intolerance, extremely sensitive to teething/colds, will absolutely not self-settle, wants to be held to sleep, when does sleep ok is a very early riser, won't sit still, into everything, won't sleep in car, hates car seat/pushchair and is a climber BUT she is clever, funny, willfull, cuddly and loving.

I feel like I'm at the brink of losing the plot right now. sad DD is teething all four molars and sleep is absolutely hideous. Most nights she ends up in bed with me, with DH in spare room. I had always told myself I'd never co-sleep but there feels like no other choice. I hate to think of all the rods Im making.

I feel like passing ships with DH and I'm snapping all the time. We used to be so happy. I know sleep deprivation is used as a form of torture but is there ever a point it starts to feel like depression?

Sorry for the self-indulged post.blush I feel better for letting it out and am hoping, particularly when these teeth have popped through, I can offer some support to you guys on this thread too.

Thanks for reading!

LittleWaveyLines Sun 02-Sep-12 11:15:34

daisylulu Welcome. Oh yes sleep deprivation merges with depression - and you end up crying lots... I really recommend chocolate and just lying on the floor with your eyes closed as they play safely nearby or on top of you..... I also think besharing is not making rods, but survival. People who haven't been there don't know! I have on many occasions in the past year actually hallucinated with lack of sleep so you have my sympathies...

Truth - it has been such a sea change! I haven't done anything differently - she's just all of a sudden stopped waking every hour or 2 for most of the night! If someone had told me this would happen a few short weeks ago I wouldn't have believed them... we are actually now talking about re-assembling the bedframe, thinking about DP coming back in the bed for the first time since paternity leave ended, and actually using the cot as a cot rather than for laundry storage! shock



I've run out of Kendal Mint Cake now, but I did bake some berry flapjacks yesterday. Want some? Here, have a brew to go with it.

So sorry you're struggling, but you've come to the right place. Self-indulge away. We'll listen. We also love rods grin

I don't know much about depression, but if it feels like it to you, then I would say see your GP sooner rather than later.

If you don't mind me asking, are you at home with DD fulltime or are you working?



<Picks self up off floor for long enough to high five LWL>

That's flipping amazing. I hope you get to wake up next to DP soon grin

<Goes back to 'work'>

Ugh, any of the rest of you wasting the last day of your hols working? (Sorry for minor hijack, but I know there's at least two other teachers on here)

LittleWaveyLines Sun 02-Sep-12 11:33:59

I'm still in denial re work and have done NO planning since the last few days of last term.,.... That's what tomorrow's INSET is for isn't it? grin

I know, would you believe our school has the audacity to actually run training tomorrow?! Pah. I've got my planning done, it's all the stuff I do for my TLR that I've neglected, and part of the INSET is about that so I kind of need to do it. I've just replied again to your other thread too by the way smile

daisylulu Sun 02-Sep-12 13:50:56

Thanks for the warm welcome everyone smile

I work 3 days a week and DH works 4 days - work honestly feels like I rest and I do appreciate how lucky I am with our set up. DH is fab with DD but in the night DD only wants me and gets into a god almighty rage if DH tries to settle her <sigh>

My employer provides an 'employee assistance program' which gives access to free counselling. I think I'm going to arrange some sessions. I think I'm exhausted rather than depressed but I think it might help to have a chat with someone who's paid to listen to me moan (I have had counselling in past when we lost our DS when I was 5 months pg. sad It really helped me out of the big pit of despair I was in at the time. On a side I wonder if that's in some ways why I'm struggling a bit now- I always thought that when I finally had a healthy baby I would never moan about sleep deprivation because I would appreciate every second with that baby - but I suppose life isn't like that and I need to accept being a parent is bloody hard work!!!)

It's reassuring to hear of the positive stories on here. I flit between thinking I ought to be 'making' DD sleep better to thinking there's nothing I can do until she's ready. We are going through the final wonder weeks so I think that's probably got a lot to answer for.

For anyone that doesn't know about the 'wonder weeks' there's a great app that tells you when your DC is going through a wonder week- I've found it often explains DD's seemingly random behaviour and fussiness.

Do you think these HN babies turn into exceptionally brilliant children/adults?! I do hope so....

LittleWaveyLines Sun 02-Sep-12 15:01:42

"Do you think these HN babies turn into exceptionally brilliant children/adults?!" - of course they do! I was told I was one grin

SpannerPants Sun 02-Sep-12 15:56:07

I was a HN baby too grin my mum says she's getting her revenge for me not sleeping until I was 3!

We've gone from DS not sleeping too badly to everything going wrong for the last week. Last night he woke every 30 mins and needed me to shh and pat to resettle him (until 3am when I caved and took him into the spare room), the night before he was awake for 3hrs in the middle of the night screaming with no obvious cause - tried everything I could think and in the end he just cried himself to sleep in my arms sad

DP wants us to try CC this week as we're on holiday - I really don't want to but we've been doing no-cry sleep solution since January and even before the latest set back he was still waking at least 3 times a night.

Welcome daisy - lack of sleep and depression are linked, in fact insomnia is a symptom of depression but I always find everything seems worse with sleep deprivation. I feel like crying all day after a bad night! It sounds like the counseling would be worth a go though?

LWL DS is 14 months next week, I'm hoping for a sudden improvement in sleep!

Do you think these HN babies turn into exceptionally brilliant children/adults?! I do hope so.... Well DD was as HN as they come and she walked and talked early (walking by 9 months and first words at 10 months). At her 2 year check we were told she had the vocabulary and comprehension of a 4 year old. She is currently reading most 3 and 4 letter words and some longer ones too. She's 3.2. She starts preschool on Wednesday [sob] I don't think they know what they're letting themselves in for! grin

We had a great time at the airshow although the whole morning programme was rained off and we ended up having our picnic in the car! DD was very impressed with the wing walkers. I'm paying for a day spent on my feet though - as expected my mobility is pretty much nil right now. sad Worth it though!

daisy so sorry for your loss. But you're right that sleep deprivation and depression ate often 2 sides of the same coin, and I think you're wise to look into counselling. DS is dairy and soya intolerant too, it's a real pain!

LWL stop hogging the sleep fairy and send her over to my house please!

<hands out candy floss>

Raspberryandorangesorbet Sun 02-Sep-12 19:17:25

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Raspberryandorangesorbet Sun 02-Sep-12 19:18:16

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Wet! grin It was good fun though and the kids looked really cute in their ear defenders. The aerobatic displays were amazing and the Battle of Britain recreation was also very good, complete with explosive charges that made the ground shake!

I get easily distracted by candy floss too, you're forgiven! wink

Raspberryandorangesorbet Sun 02-Sep-12 19:24:43

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daisylulu Sun 02-Sep-12 19:39:30

Thanks joyful and everyone else for your kind words.

Hmmmm candyfloss. Thanks ! grin

Wishing everyone a peaceful night tonight.

LittleWaveyLines Sun 02-Sep-12 19:50:42

<hunts under the sofa cushions for the sleep fairy>

I'll send him along when I've found him! grin

Raspberryandorangesorbet Sun 02-Sep-12 19:55:39

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Ooh I like that Raspberry!

daisylulu Sun 02-Sep-12 20:29:08

Awwwwwwww thanks raspberry - I've actually got tears rolling down my eyes at your kind words, and I don't normally cry easily! <emotional sleep deprived> But in a nice way iyswim.

Ha ha I'm actually only 5'2 grin

Yes I like that! Very mythical but true. smile

daisylulu Sun 02-Sep-12 20:29:56

Mystical not mythical....

Raspberryandorangesorbet Sun 02-Sep-12 20:42:14

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zambooloo Sun 02-Sep-12 20:45:45

Night everyone - promise will try to catch up soon but I'm so bloody tired that I'm actually going to bed at... 8.40 - what a loser!

Back to work tomorrow - lets all sob together fellow teachers... Are you all secondary?

zambooloo Sun 02-Sep-12 20:46:19

Meant to say I hope you all have peaceful, sleep filled nights!!

Raspberryandorangesorbet Sun 02-Sep-12 20:49:00

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LittleWaveyLines Sun 02-Sep-12 20:59:09

Secondary here - but INSET tomorrow so it's not sooo bad.

I'm in bed next to sleeping baby which is a bit of a surprise - normally she wont go to sleep until 9.30ish so maybe she knows it's an early start in the morning!

I agree re rods v tools. And the people who say you are making a rod are the tools grin


I'm loving your soapbox Raspberry and the 'tools' LWL

I'm not going to moan tonight. Instead I'm going to tell you about my amazing new Ergo sling and how much I love cuddling DS in it (oh how I wish I'd bought one earlier) and how cute he looked cuddled up to his dad in it. I'm also going to tell you that DS is the bestest 'peepo' player ever, and that when he wraps himself in a curtain to play I just melt. Oh, and that apparently doors are the best toys ever (did you know they open and close over and over again?)

I may have had a glass or two of vino tonight to take my mind off going back to work tomorrow

Big glasses were they? wink

I love the way DS giggles in his sleep, and the huge grin he gets whenever I walk into the room. I love the way DD plays with her little brother and sometimes lets him play with her precious Octonauts, even though she knows they'll get dribbled on and chewed. My kids are awesome. smile

LittleWaveyLines Sun 02-Sep-12 22:11:36

I love the way DD angrily flaps her arms when caught about to eat stones. Again.
I love the way that she throws herself sideways and grins at me over my shoulder when in a back carry, they does the same over the other shoulder. Repeat ad nauseum.
Doors are indeed awesome toys to open and close. As are babygates.. - and I thought they were supposed to be babyproof? hmm


I like wine. And our babies. Our babies rock.

Raspberryandorangesorbet Sun 02-Sep-12 22:41:21

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He sounds gorgeous Raspberry!

daisylulu Mon 03-Sep-12 18:47:18

Hope everyone who went back to school had a good day?!

I LOVE wine and my dearest HN toddler too grin

Had a really lovely day with DD today which has done wonders for the spirits. Spent it with some of my loveliest friends - one who has 3 under 4 yrs (the middle one who is also very HNs) and its really perked me up. I've also got the ball rolling for some counselling sessions and I feel like a bit of a weights been lifted. And all that on only 3 hours sleep! Am hoping for a better night tonight as have work tomorrow.

How's everyone else today?

daisylulu Mon 03-Sep-12 18:50:52

forgot to say - Truth we have an ergo too and absolutely love it. At 16 months DD still likes it even though she no longer likes her pushchair. they're pricey but with every penny IMHO.

I'm glad you're feeling better daisy! Sounds like a good day. smile

We had a fairly quiet day as my mobility is still pretty rubbish. But while at the supermarket I discovered that they had reduced punnets of raspberries to 50p each so I bought loads and made jam. I now have about a dozen jars cooling in the kitchen. grin

DD is ridiculously excited about starting preschool on Wednesday, she's so looking forward to it. Which is great but I still feel a little sad. I'm trying to look on the bright side though, it means DS will have some time to crawl around the floor in peace and I might actually get on top of the housework for once...

How's everyone else? How are all you teachery types?

Raspberryandorangesorbet Mon 03-Sep-12 19:17:04

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JemJar Mon 03-Sep-12 19:37:45

Thank you so much to tickleme63,raspberrysorbet and thejoyfulpuddlejumper for your lovely replies. I read them on friday before we went away for the weekend but he woke before I could reply. I was feeling very low and was very grateful for advice and support from people who actually know what I am experiencing and not from people with rose tinted specs who had babies 35 years ago (I am looking in your direction mum) or those that think they have had a bad night if baby wakes once!

I have the book wonder weeks book raspberrysorbet and am so glad of it, like you say, helps so much to understand why. I use that phrase too and I wondered whether I knew you in real life when you said it. small worlds not that small though hey!

Off to the Paralympic athletics tomorrow so hoping for more than 4 hours sleep tonight, fingers crossed. Wishing you all a peaceful night x

It's my wedding anniversary today. DH has cooked a lovely dinner and we were planning to cuddle up on the sofa and watch a film. But DS refuses to be put to bed. sad He's fast asleep, but as soon as I try to put him down he wakes up. I know he's teething but he had a dose of nurofen at bedtime. It's so frustrating.

How exciting Jemjar! We've been watching loads of the Paralympic events on tv and fielding awkward questions from DD . How was your weekend away in the end?

Raspberryandorangesorbet Mon 03-Sep-12 20:25:09

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Happy anniversary Joyful. What has DH made you?

* News Flash * BabyTruth is walking. Uhoh. Now the fun begins!

Raspberryandorangesorbet Mon 03-Sep-12 20:56:22

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Lychees Mon 03-Sep-12 20:58:44

Argh ... wish I had something positive to say about my day, too but I'm struggling. DD has been mostly crying since 8.30am (over-tired as she can only catnap unless I hold her constantly) and when I thought she was finally going to fall asleep for a decent amount of time at 8pm, she's up crying again but DH has her. On top of this, DS started complaining he was hungry an hour before dinner so I made him wait as he'd not long had an afternoon snack and when he saw what dinner was (roasted veg couscous which he normally eats) he flatly refused it and after some cross words we sent him to bed. So my nerves are frazzled.

Happy annivesary, Joyful! Happy sixth month day to lo, Raspberry!

Raspberryandorangesorbet Mon 03-Sep-12 21:04:29

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daisylulu Mon 03-Sep-12 21:11:59

Sorry to hear that lychee I too second cranial osteopathy. DD had a traumatic delivery. We had a couple of amazing sleeps for a few days and less crying when she was about 3 months old. However <caveats> I did take her back when she was 9 months old for teething issues and it did jack shite. So I think it depends on age and issues.

LittleWaveyLines Mon 03-Sep-12 21:30:11

Phew! DD finally asleep! And I'm knackered....

Well this teachery type has brain overload - I just cannot take in all the information that gets thrown at you on the first day back INSET while worrying if DD is OK at the childminder - then it turns out I hadn't read an email (or accidently deleted it) from last term, which made me look a bit stupid, and all the while I was thinking that poor DD was separated from me and I that I have her in childcare for too many hours, and that I should hand in my notice as soon as possible.... confused

LittleWaveyLines Mon 03-Sep-12 21:34:26

2 days a week she will be with a childminder for about 5.5 hours, one day a week she will be with the childminder for about 7 hours, and one day a week she will be with her grandparents for about 6 hours - so a total of 24 hours in a week.... and I know I started a thread about this is AIBU but I'm really not happy leaving her sad

The childminder said she was happy today but when I picked her up I could tell she was stressed - not crying/upset but stressed sad

Oh LWL you sound so stressed! I haven't seen your other thread but I can understand how difficult it must be to leave DD. 24 hours in a week sounds like a lot but it could be a lot more, and one day with her grandparents sounds nice. I'm sorry I don't have any practical advice (MH issues prevented me going back to work) but I have lots of hugs and sympathy.

DH cooked a lovely chicken with roasted Mediterranean style vegetables. It's one of my favourite meals and we haven't had it for ages. DS eventually settled in bed around half eight and I'm back in with him atm. But that's nearly 2 hours -that's the longest he's slept in months! So it's not all bad.

tickleme63 Tue 04-Sep-12 08:29:59

Well done on your walking BabyTruth! smile

LWL <relaxing shoulder massage> Lots of hugs lady.

In fact, <relaxing shoulder massages> for all!

Lychees - we also took DS to cranial osteopathy. I can't say we had any huge changes as a result, but it felt sort of nice to satisfy ourselves that his birth hadn't caused any stresses/discomfort. It is a bit woo (Raspberry - that's my new favourite phrase!) but maybe worth a shot?

So DS slept from 7.30pm to 7.30am... shock We heard him mumbling a couple of times, but he quickly went back to sleep. Had boobs of steel this morning...! It's divine while it lasts...

Hope you all have a fab day!

tickleme63 Tue 04-Sep-12 08:45:33

The sleep, I mean, rather than the boobs of steel!

Raspberryandorangesorbet Tue 04-Sep-12 10:34:15

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Oh tickle you should! grin

DD's being a cowboy and is galloping round on her hobby horse shouting yeehah - wearing nothing but a pair of bright green wellies and wraparound shades! grin

And DS has been eating his first proper food! After week of smooth purée then textured purée and lumpy purée his gag reflex has finally subsided enough for him to eat some chunky roasted vegetables. I'm so pleased! He enjoyed it too, especially the sweet potato. smile

How's everyone else's day going? LWL how are you feeling now?

<leaves out tray of chocolate brownies, warm from the oven>

Raspberryandorangesorbet Tue 04-Sep-12 18:17:53

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LittleWaveyLines Tue 04-Sep-12 19:55:54

Wow! Babytickle grin
LittleWavey did 9.30pm to 4.30am so also not bad going smile

Down side was that I had to peel her off me crying to give to the childminder this morning. The CM said she calmed down within minutes, and sent me a text to say she was now smiling very quickly - but I'm still not happy about it. DD was VERY glad to see me this pm sad

I'm sorry I'm being pathetic about this, but all my instincts are yelling at me not to leave her....

LittleWaveyLines Tue 04-Sep-12 19:56:57

Puddle - Glad your DS is doing better smile

Raspberyysorbet sad - sounds just like DD used to be (note the USED TO)

Bloody DS and my bloody back and bloody lack of sleep. angry

We built the crib today - DS is finally too big and too mobile for the basket. It took ages to get DS to sleep, then it turned out that the crib sides are too high to put him in - I usually sit on the bed feeding him, with his bed next to me. My back isn't strong enough to lift him over the sides. So I slid off the bed and tried to put him in from standing - but it's too painful to bend over. At this point he woke up.

I have now been sat here trying to settle him and get him into bed for 2 hours. And he's wide awake again and I can't stop crying. sad!

Sorry. blush

LWL would you be happier with a different sort of childcare? Or is it the leaving her bit that's the problem, regardless of where you're leaving her?

Raspberryandorangesorbet Tue 04-Sep-12 20:02:54

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Raspberryandorangesorbet Tue 04-Sep-12 20:03:51

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Yes it is. And now I've cried so much I've given myself a headache - just fucking marvellous. sad

He's still awake.

LittleWaveyLines Tue 04-Sep-12 20:36:35

Oh Puddle, I really feel for you. We had the same problem with DD - even transferring her to the fucking expensive cosleeper cot woke her up - so I'm sorry I have no helpful suggestions, just commiserations sad

DD is still wide awake as usual - there is absolutely NO WAY I am able to do any planning or marking in the evening unless she suddenly decides that DP is acceptable in the evening - and he actually steps up and does some evening parenting. Although TBF tonight he has been trying to fix the car - there is always something though....

It's not the childminder - although I'm not 100% happy with her - it's mainly just that I'm leaving DD... and if I want to quit I can't leave anyway until Christmas (general teaching contract rules). I'm not sure if I would feel the same about a nanny mamybe?

LittleWaveyLines Tue 04-Sep-12 20:47:52

Oh and the things that I'm not happy about with the childminder are being bloody picky anyway - things like she is very mainstream with plastic toys/some TV (limited though)/says "No" - while I'm a bit more "woo" grin with my parenting and tend to do a hippy "validating feelings" type of discipline, and carry her a lot. Basically she's just not me or my clone grin. She's pretty nice, her kids are nice, and she seems to care which is the main thing.

Raspberryandorangesorbet Tue 04-Sep-12 20:53:32

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LittleWaveyLines Tue 04-Sep-12 21:10:56

Fab going BabyRaspberry smile

Yeah I suppose you are right, but I will scream if someone else (well-meaning) tells me that it is for the best /good for us to be separated as SHE IS TOO WELL ATTACHED ,,, grrrr.

ticklemyboobsofsteel Tue 04-Sep-12 21:39:57

I aim to please wink grin

Joyful Sorry lady sad I hope he drifts off soon so you can have a nice cuppa and a chill out. Sending hugs.

LWL Gah, I hate when people say that too! Really grates my cheese (to put it politely). DH currently looks after DS and I work mainly from home, but DH wants to get back to work at some point soon and we'll have the same dilemma. We won't go the nursery route again though, that's for sure. Would love to be able to afford a nanny. DH and DF keep on about hiring a live-in Swedish au pair to wind me up hmm

Babyraspberry Good lad! smile

Hope you all have good nights.

Raspberryandorangesorbet Tue 04-Sep-12 22:28:16

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Raspberryandorangesorbet Tue 04-Sep-12 22:29:17

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LittleWaveyLines Tue 04-Sep-12 22:32:29


tickle there's something different about you today, I can't quite put my finger on it... grin

Well after an epically bad night with DS I can barely walk this morning, so the crutches are back out. And it's DD's first day at preschool! She's sat here eating breakfast and is very excited. I'm excited for her too but am still feeling a bit wobbly.

Raspberryandorangesorbet Wed 05-Sep-12 07:57:21

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Raspberryandorangesorbet Wed 05-Sep-12 07:57:47

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Raspberryandorangesorbet Wed 05-Sep-12 10:01:46

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DD went in and headed straight for the water tray, looked very happy and was too engrossed to say goodbye! shock smile She had a great time and is looking forward to tomorrow. However, having insisted on wearing a skirt she's come home with scraped legs after falling off the slide in the playground! Jeans tomorrow methinks...

How's everyone else today?

ticklemyboobsofsteel Wed 05-Sep-12 13:29:37

Glad she had fun Joyful smile

Sooo. I've just come back from a check-up at the dentist. Fair enough, it's been a while. But there's a reason they get you to lay down in there... <feels very faint at cost of getting teeth up to scratch> sad

DH and DS came along though, and after a bit of persuasion, the dentist let them come in to watch as I don't want DS as terrified as dentists as I was/am, and it also meant I had to be brave as DS was there with me smile I thought that would be a fairly normal request... but it seems not...

Thanks for the reminder tickle, I must see the dentist before my maternity exemption expires at Christmas. How was it? I'm terrified of dentists too but took DD in last time and I was very brave. grin

Raspberryandorangesorbet Wed 05-Sep-12 19:00:33

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ticklemyboobsofsteel Wed 05-Sep-12 19:01:46

It was fine - mainly because it was only a check up... The evil that is injections/fillings/etc begins on Monday... sad Still don't like that pointy metal thing they poke you teeth with.

To be honest, most of mine, bar the fillings, is for cosmetic reasons, which my maternity exemption wouldn't have covered. Miffed that I left it too late anyway, but I really don't like going at all sad

Raspberryandorangesorbet Wed 05-Sep-12 19:09:33

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daisylulu Wed 05-Sep-12 19:56:59

Evening all- just popping in quickly to say hi.

Not had chance to catch up properly as busy at work but hope to on when have day off.

I hate dentist too. Had to have inlay back in May just before mat exemption ran out. Actually wasn't too bad. I think pregnancy screws your teeth up- or maybe it was just me...

I'm shuddering at all this talk of dentists and drills! <sticks fingers in ears and sings la la la>

DS is finally asleep and in bed. I have been trying to settle him since six o'clock. sad

I feel so weary tonight. Mentally as well as physically. It probably hasn't helped that I got far too personally involved in a thread about child poverty and ended up being told that I am lazy, I should try harder to find a job, that I am using my MH and mobility problems as an excuse not to work and that I was irresponsible to have DS when I couldn't afford another child (despite the fact that he was unplanned).

The thing is, I know that what's been said is true to a degree. I could have aborted DS - life would have been simpler, I would have been able to work now that DD is in preschool. We did discuss it but neither of us felt that it was an option. Then I had AND through the pregnancy anyway. I'm now in the same position, mentally, that I was when DD was small - the thought of leaving DS to go to work increases my anxiety and brings on panic attacks. I have fought depression long and hard this time but our current situation (DH unemployed, my back getting worse and worse etc) means that I have finally succumbed. Today I seriously wondered whether DH and the kids would be better off without me. And when it took so long to get DS to sleep I ended up sobbing uncontrollably.

I don't know why I'm telling you all this, I don't want to bring you down and I don't want anyone to worry about me - I'm not suicidal this time, just sad. I know I should get to the doctor for some happy pills but I don't like the idea of taking them while breastfeeding (the BF-friendly ones dis bugger all last time), and I will not stop feeding DS. Especially with his CMPI and soya intolerance.

Sorry for rambling. I hope everyone else is having a better/good night.

Raspberryandorangesorbet Wed 05-Sep-12 22:17:30

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Raspberryandorangesorbet Wed 05-Sep-12 22:27:12

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ticklemyboobsofsteel Wed 05-Sep-12 22:27:15

Joyful I havent seen that thread. But You are such a strong, kind, funny, caring person. Don't let anonymous fuckers on a message board make you feel anything other than the above. There are some horrible bastards on MN at the moment who don't realise the hurt their words can cause. Ignore, ignore, ignore.

Your DH and beautiful babies love you, as do all of your friends, both RL and online.

Speak to your GP lady. See if there's anything they can suggest. For both your sadness and your back. You shouldn't have to be in so much pain. And be kinder to yourself. You work so hard for your little ones, who obviously adore you. Anyone would be struggling with the things you are going through at the moment. If I can do anything, please let me know.

I wish I could come and give you a hug and a hair stroke.

Lychees Wed 05-Sep-12 22:59:25

Joyful, for the short time I've been posting on this thread [I haven't gone back and read any posts from before I joined], you have been caring and supportive. Like all the ladies on this thread. So be kind to yourself and try not to dwell on comments made by people who don't count/matter to you.

Following a good day [for DD ... good naps; for DS ... getting out and about instead of being holed up at home; for me ... retail therapy] yesterday spent out shopping. We have had another day of inconsolable crying today [DD and maybe also me a little bit]. We were out with a new friend and people were staring as no matter what I did I could not settle my baby. DH has now managed to get her to sleep in her cot and my parenting confidence levels are at an all-time low. I have purchased a Fisher Price Cruise and Soothe from Amazon to see if that helps. So far three slings, one vibrating bouncer three soothers and one US Fisher Price Cradle n Swing have failed. My house is stuffed full of these gadgets ...

With DS, he went through this inconsolable crying period, then weaning was a nightmare, then came the terrible two's ... I really hope that DD is not the same.

Raspberryandorangesorbet Thu 06-Sep-12 09:53:46

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Mitsouko Thu 06-Sep-12 10:40:06

Joyful...big hugs to you. Sorry to hear that you're struggling, please feel free to let it out here. In the short time I've been posting on this thread you have indeed come across as so kind, thoughtful and supportive. And such a brilliant mum. You're doing wonderfully in a very challenging and stressful situation. Don't for a moment think that your babies would be better off without you - your are their mummy and no one on earth can love them the way that you do. Being in pain makes everything so much harder. I hope that you can get some relief.

Oops, DD just woken from her 20 minute catnap so got to go - take care Joyful.

Sorry for the minor breakdown last night, I'm feeling quite embarrassed about it now. blush I was just overwhelmed by everything and in desperate need of sleep. I'll be ok.

DD had her second morning at preschool today and is still loving it! She seems very happy there. smile

DS has had a second tooth cutting through the gum today, so he now has both lower incisors. Hopefully he'll settle down a bit now that's through.

How's everyone else?

Raspberryandorangesorbet Thu 06-Sep-12 20:09:52

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unhappyhildebrand Fri 07-Sep-12 13:51:37

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<puts fresh brew on, opens box of chocolates>

Hi hildebrand! How was the holiday? Good that DS slept well - any idea why? How are things with the H? I hope that you were able to relax a little while you were away. Have the big 3 settled back into school? And how's DD2? (I sound like a crazed stalker... hmm)

Raspberry I don't have much advice about integration apart from take your time if possible - I'm sure the others will have more useful suggestions! grin

DS had a bit of a bump today. I went for coffee with a friend after dropping DD off at preschool, and DS managed to launch himself off my lap onto the edge of a solid wooden table. It came up in a big purple lump and he was screaming, poor little mite. The staff were lovely and brought me some ice so I fed him and put a muslin full of ice on the lump. He recovered quite quickly and was chatting and smiling away, but I felt awful. The lump's still there bit it's just a bit red now. Bad Mummy. blush

unhappyhildebrand Fri 07-Sep-12 19:24:28

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I know what you mean about the NSPCC advert. So far this week my two's injuries are:

Lump on head (as explained)
Cuts on fingers (due to forgetting he has 2 teeth now)
Purple bruising across torso (not actually bruising, stains from smearing himself in blackberries at teatime)

Scrapes on her knees and one ankle (fell off slide at preschool)
Bruise on right hip (fell off the sofa)
Scrape on right shoulderblade (jumped off sofa)
Bruised forehead (walked into a doorframe. No really, she did!).

I may just buy some padding for the walls or wrap them both in bubble wrap...

Sorry to hear H is still being difficult but I guess that's no surprise really. I hope you're able to resolve things soon lovely.

Oh and well done DD2! smile

SpannerPants Fri 07-Sep-12 21:17:33

Hi everyone, I've been on holiday this week - haven't been away but thought I'd have a break from the Internet and do the other things which have been piling up - the house is very clean for once and I've even had the sewing machine out, I could get used to being a lady of leisure!

DS has moved into the next room at his nursery and I'm not happy with it - he's been assigned a new keyworker randomly and it just happens to be someone he doesn't like. She used to cover his previous room on a Friday and everytime we handed him over to her he cried hysterically. He still cries when she's around which is horrible for us to see - she wasn't in yesterday and he didn't cry at all. They have also been lying to us about what he's eating, how much he's sleeping and he keeps coming home in other nappies and without his clothes. I've been to look at another nursery already, I'm not sure if it's a knee jerk reaction but I feel like the trust has gone with the current one sad

Hope you're feeling ok Joyful - there are a few antidepressants which are safe to use when breastfeeding (sertraline, citalopram, fluoxetine off the top of my head) - there's always the breastfeeding network helpline to discuss medications? They've been v helpful when I've called them before.

Hildebrand glad your DD has been eating better, that must be a relief. Your DH sounds like he needs a big kick up the arse!

raspberry well done on picking a CM, I found my anxieties about going to work almost disappeared once I'd picked a nursery. They settle in much better than you think they're going to!

tickle love the new name, hope baby tickle is still sleeping well smile

daisy my teeth seemed to crumble when I was pregnant too, I had to go to the dentist at least once a month for my entire pregnancy and until my maternity exemption ran out - ended up with a root canal and about 8 replacement fillings as they just kept dropping out!

LittleWaveyLines Fri 07-Sep-12 22:16:46

Joyful Hope you're feeling better.

Spanner Hello! smile and hope you find a nursery you are happier with.

My grumble - having had my day off this week, I am so so torn. I'm a bit lost at home without adult company - but DD has been so pathetically limpet like, and exhausted that I am totally convinced that childcare is not for her. But I cannot leave until Christmas sad

Oh LWL poor you and poor DD. Do you think things might improve once she gets used to the new routine? Perhaps it's just the change that's the problem <desperately trying to find something helpful to say>

Thanks for the tips about ADs Spanner. I took sertraline when I had PND after DD but it didn't work, and I have had bad reactions to fluoxetine in the past. But citalopram is worth a try I guess. smile

Mitsouko Sat 08-Sep-12 13:51:31

Glad to hear that you are felling a little better Joyful - I can really sympathize! It sounds like you are struggling with chronic pain, sleep deprivation and hard economic circumstances - none of which are good for mental health. I think that even the impact of one of those things would be a major stress - never mind all three.

I have a depression / anxiety history as well but have never been able to find relief through medication. Tried many times, but was either ineffective, had terrible side effects, and in a few frightening cases made things worse. My usual remedies are meditation, gentle exercise, getting out to socialize, doing creative stuff and gardening when the weather is nice. All well and good but a bit tricky with high need DD as it's near impossible to get the me time necessary to really work on it. Trying to adapt with walks, singing while DD is in sling, seeing people when I can, and doing a quick 20 minutes of meditation during one of DD's catnaps.

I'm doing a bit better with the co-sleeping anxiety. When we first started trying it around 12 weeks I couldn't relax at all and would have terrible, terrible nightmares about waking up to the unthinkable - and I would be so tired I wouldn't realize it was just a dream. It was dreadful. But now I'm doing a bit better. It's just murder on my back. I've tried 5 pillows for support as Dr Sears recommends, but wake up after an hour with a crick in my neck and shooting pains in my sacroiliac joint.

DD will be 6 months next week...can hardly believe it!

Yes, I think part of my recent increase in pain is due to co-sleeping. But there's no way around it, DS wakes so often that I either have to haul myself up to a sitting position while trying not to scream (every 90 minutes or so) or just bring him into bed with me the first time he wakes after I go to bed. Do you share the bed with your partner as well? I find that sometimes it's a little less painful if DH isn't there and I can stretch out s little more.

I haven't had any luck with meditation in the past but going out for a gentle walk helps sometimes. Unfortunately I often end up comfort-eating, which is a dreadful idea when I can't exercise. hmm

After the death of my fiancé when I was 19 I took venlafaxine and that helped me a lot (as opposed to the fluoxetine which led to my first suicide attempt). When I had severe PND after DD was born I was prescribed sertraline but it had no discernible effect and the GP was loathe to prescribe anything else while I was still BF. The obvious answer would have been to wean but I set such importance in BFing that stopping would actually have worsened the depression. I feel much the same this time. I can identify with your nightmares though, except my anxiety tends to manifest as intrusive visions of DH or one of the DCs dying (crossing a road earlier for example, I had a vision of DD being struck by a car and flung into the air). It's vile being in my head sometimes. sad

I've had fantastic support on the MH boards here though, they're a great bunch and it's such a relief to find others who understand how you feel. smile

That wasn't meant to be such a me post, sorry! It's weird, I rarely talk to anyone in RL about these things but I can talk to you ladies. I trust you and it feels natural to be open about this stuff.


What have you all been up to today? It's glorious weather here!

confused I killed the thread...

<scatters jelly babies to tempt quiche members back>

LittleWaveyLines Sat 08-Sep-12 23:22:48

<Runs in to munch jelly babies before going to bed>

I had massive anxiety issues as well as previous depression problems. I wonder if there's a link between high needs babies and depression-prone mothers?

Going back to DD and the childminder - DP is convinced she just needs to get used to it and is fine and happy there. And she is happy enough I suppose - but I can see that she's stressed when I pick her up so...?

Mitsouko Sat 08-Sep-12 23:29:20

No, no...still here! Just impossible to post on crappy Android phone while feeding DD. You let it out Joyful, it's therapeutic! Glad to know you can feel like this is a safe place to voice these things, especially with little RL support.

Preparing for the long night ahead...

ticklemyboobsofsteel Sun 09-Sep-12 08:38:55

<looks around excitedly for any remaining jelly beans>

Count me in with the anxiety and depression... Under control mostly now though. Joyful I know I do this a lot, but sending big <hugs> You've certainly been through some stuff haven't you. You're so strong.

Well I've just looked ay myself in the mirror this morning after yesterday's scorcher. We took DS to a fun day at a children's centre. He was creamed up, hat on, under a parasol. Me? Oh no, I forgot me... cue major lobsterage...! It's calmed right down now, thankfully...

Spanner I'm sorry about your nursery shenanigans! sad That doesn't sound very good at all. I hope you find somewhere lovely, I wouldn't be happy either. The staff at DS's old nursery got a bit of a bollocking from their managers when we decided to take him out. He was the youngest by far in there - they said they would follow our routine for him, but all the other kids in there were just having one nap a day, and he to this day still needs two - but he was kind of having to keep up with the older children sad So I don't think they cared for him as well as they promised they would when we chose them to look after him. The managers were so cross with the room staff! He was so tired and irritable and came down with bug after bug. So glad he's out of there. I think we'll go the childminder route next time...

It's D-Day tomorrow. And by 'D' I mean, yes, the dreaded dentist <shudders>

daisylulu Sun 09-Sep-12 14:37:43

I'm still here too! You definitely haven't scared me away Joyful. For the limited time I've been on here i can gather you are a brilliant mum and very caring.

I haven't been about much as found out my nan only has days/weeks left to live- she's had terminal cancer for 3 years and it's finally spreading everywhere sad we are meant to be going to Cornwall tomorrow- not sure what we are going to do but I'm probably not going to be posting much over the next week or so.

I hope to catch up with everyone properly when life less maniac. Am typing on phone so can't namecheck properly...

Hope you're all enjoying your weekends. Right DD woken from nap so got to go...

Oh daisy I'm so sorry. Look after yourself. (((hug)))

tickle how's the sunburn? Still lobstery? grin

LWL what do you mean when you say she's stressed? Could she just be overtired?

I was chatting to my mum today about the kids' poor sleeping and she told me that I was just the same as a baby. Apparently they used to have to leave me in the cot to scream myself to sleep. hmm

Raspberryandorangesorbet Sun 09-Sep-12 18:36:03

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I can well understand not being enthusiastic about DIY, even without the sleep deprivation! Poor you, that sounds awful. Do you think PeskyRaspberry might be teething? DS's sleep became even worse when he started teething properly.

Raspberryandorangesorbet Sun 09-Sep-12 19:44:09

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

It does sound like DS's teething habits, especially the frequent wakings and gallons of saliva! Is he pulling his ears or rubbing them? Does he chew on toys/fingers/high chair trays etc?

I'm ok, I think. Having a bit of a mope today but no major meltdowns yet . Both children are in bed and asleep and DH is cooking curry so the evening is looking good atm. Unfortunately DS is waking roughly every 30-45 minutes in the evenings atm so it may not last... Hoping to watch the Paralympic closing ceremony though. smile

Raspberryandorangesorbet Sun 09-Sep-12 20:08:09

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Balti I think.

Yep, sounds like poor little Pesky has some teeth coming! Vaseline is good for chapped skin on babies. I can also recommend refrigerated carrot sticks or sticks of cold cucumber for chewing on, the cold soothes the gums (obviously at his age you'll need to keep a close eye on him when chewing it) or bickiepegs are ok.

Oh and a dose of paracetamol/nurofen at bedtime sometimes helps. As does chocolate (for you).

Raspberryandorangesorbet Sun 09-Sep-12 20:39:36

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No closing ceremony for me. sad No curry yet either. sad I've been in with DS since my last post and the little sod darling won't settle back in his bed, he has to be held. Arse.

Raspberryandorangesorbet Sun 09-Sep-12 22:22:45

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It took an hour to get DS back into bed. He stayed there just long enough for me to eat dinner then woke up again. I'm still in with him now.

DD is also very restless tonight, she seems to be going down with a cold or something as she's suddenly very snotty.

Give me cake strength...

LittleWaveyLines Sun 09-Sep-12 22:50:40

Moan alert:

DREADFUL night last night. If I said she woke 20 times I'd be underestimating... then on to today and I'm fucking reeling and she doesn't nap.

Has a few quiet moments, but no nap.

Until 6pm! Wakes at 7pm ready to party,

She has JUST gone to sleep and I have to be up at 6.30.... grr shock

Raspberryandorangesorbet Sun 09-Sep-12 22:51:04

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Raspberryandorangesorbet Sun 09-Sep-12 22:52:05

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I actually have brownies! DD and I made them this morning. smile They're vegan ones (DS is dairy and soya intolerant so I can't eat them either) but they're lush.

Oh Wavey you poor poor soul... I hope she sleeps better for the rest of the night. <sprinkles sleepy dust on all the babies>

Raspberryandorangesorbet Sun 09-Sep-12 23:14:28

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<brews extra strong brew>

<puts out tray of matchsticks>

Urgh... That was a baaaaaaad night. How's everyone else?

unhappyhildebrand Mon 10-Sep-12 09:24:21

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Because that's no fun! I swear sometimes they have a better night just to lull you into a false sense of security... "Haha, I let Mummy sleep last night. She looks ever so optimistic, but tonight I'm going to wake up every 20 minutes and shriek until she feeds me!" <rubs tiny hands gleefully>

Mitsouko Mon 10-Sep-12 13:34:05

Sounds like most everyone had a rough night...us too! DD was on 2 hourly wake ups, and taking about an hour to settle back down with each one. Even co-sleeping failed to settle - she tossed and thrashed about the bed all night long. No clue why. I actually had high hopes for last night as DD was quite cheerful yesterday with good naps, and chilled in her push chair when out and about. Had a nice bath and bed at 8pm. All and all a great day, but then a terrible night! I have kept a sleep long, and really try to find a pattern but it just seems so random.

Feeling pretty low, mostly at the thought that DD will probably be an only child as I really don't think I could manage another high need baby and high need toddler at the same time.

I really hoped that by 6 months it would be a little easier. I don't think I have unrealistic expectations. I see threads from mums here who are complaining about one night waking, or starting the day early after the baby's slept for 10 hours. I'd be happy with just a 5-6 hour stretch, a feed, another 2-3 hours another feed, then an hour and up for the day. There have been a few rare occasions when this has happened, but only a few.

Ok, moan finished. Wishing you all more peaceful sleep tonight!

I felt just the same when DD was that age, I couldn't imagine ever having more children. Then when she was 21 months we discovered that I was 5 weeks pregnant with DS which kind of took the decision away from me. confused

Fwiw, DD sleeps well now (apart from nightmares and when she's ill) and isn't HN at all. She's very independent and confident and will play quite happily on her own. You will look back on this in the future and wonder what you were worrying about, I promise you.

Mitsouko Mon 10-Sep-12 14:53:13

Thank you Joyful - you are always so supportive and that gives me hope! I really, really don't know how mums with high need babies / toddlers cope. How on earth do you manage running after toddler with un-put-downable baby all day? And all on just a few hours sleep a night? I don't know where I'd find the strength. Hats off to you who do - you deserve medals.

Mitsouko Mon 10-Sep-12 18:00:32

Oops. Meant to say sleep log, not sleep long. Wishful thinking, Freudian slip there. Been following The No Sleep Cry Solution, you see.

<polishes medal> grin

How do I manage? I have a sling and an unemployed husband. confused It's mums like hildebrand who deserve the medals - she's got a HN DS and 3 older children! And yet she's still standing just about . She's my idol. grin

How's the No Cry thingy working out so far?

LittleWaveyLines Mon 10-Sep-12 18:46:17

Well we had a better night last night - two wake ups between her going to bed at 10.30pm, and me getting up at 6.30am.... the second one was about 5,30am and I have no idea what time the first one was but it felt like I'd barely got to sleep!

Hope everyone gets a good night tonight... smile

DS is going to be put on eBay if he's not careful. angry 2 hours ago he was crying, yawning, rubbing his eyes etc. He still hasn't gone to sleep. DD had an early night and has been asleep since six, I had foolish hopes of actually getting some time away from DS this evening and relaxing. How stupid of me.

Raspberryandorangesorbet Mon 10-Sep-12 19:36:28

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Raspberryandorangesorbet Mon 10-Sep-12 19:36:44

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I think I need help.

DS still hasn't fallen asleep and I feel like I have just completely shut down emotionally. DH could leave him outside in the dustbin and I doubt I could make myself care right now.

When things are going well or ok I'm fine, I feel in a good mood and I feel happy and content. I love the children. But when things are going badly or I'm really stressed it's like a black cloud descending, I lose myself. Right this moment I do not love DS. I do not want him in my life. And that scares me. Especially as I was telling DH this afternoon how much I would love another child.. The thing is though, with my physical limitations and mental health problems I don't think I will be able to have any more. And that kills me. And yet right this moment I feel absolutely nothing for this baby in my arms.

It's almost like being bipolar, but instead of having cycles that last days or weeks mine only last a few hours at most. It can't be good for the children to have such an unstable mother - if I could convince myself that they would be happier without me I wonder if I would be happier?

I am going to phone the GP surgery in the morning and make an appointment to discuss antidepressants. And maybe counselling, although that's never done much in the past.

I am going to withdraw from this thread for a while too. It's not fair to you for me be having meltdowns and breakdowns all over the place. You have enough stress in your lives as it is! I may lurk though and when things are a bit calmer in my head I shall resume posting.

I wish you all luck and peace and sleeping babies - and I shall see you again soon. Take care.

Hey there. Sorry I haven't been around for a while - back to work and then a weekend away.

Joyful - I'm sorry that things are so bad. Do you have people you can talk to in rl? Please do make the appointment with your GP, even consider calling Samaritans or similar now if you need a friendly, non-judgmental ear. Please don't withdraw from the thread. Meltdowns are surely what we're here for? We'll just worry if you disappear.

Oh, on a purely practical note, Joyful - if you need a few minutes of not holding your baby while he's refusing to sleep, have you tried putting a radio in his room and leaving him (just for a few mins)? I did it tonight when I couldn't cope with DS crying at me and planned to just take a breather outside his room. Actually, it calmed him down and he fell asleep. Gasp. I've left it playing in case it keeps him that way for a bit longer than normal! (Disclaimer: this is the only time I have tried this; it is not scientifically proven)

Raspberryandorangesorbet Mon 10-Sep-12 21:05:02

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

LittleWaveyLines Mon 10-Sep-12 21:48:36

joyful hope you're OK.

Raspberry Don't be daft (said affectionately) don't you be going anywhere! smile

Well DD is asleep already! shock so I plan an early night.... here's fingers crossed for us all....

<sits on Raspberry to stop her going anywhere>

Thank you all for being so kind. I just don't want to end up hogging the thread till it turns into the Crazy Joyful thread instead of the lovely supportive thread it is atm. I'm frightened that there is something seriously wrong with me and I don't want my stuff to take over the thread. You all have stressful lives and stressful babies too.

DS is finally asleep and in bed. I'm going to follow his example, if he lets me. Thank you again for being so lovely.

ticklemyboobsofsteel Mon 10-Sep-12 22:07:43

Joyful As Truth says, don't withdraw. That's what we are here for. To support each other. If it is of any help or solace to you, please keep posting. We are listening. I might be heading your way this weekend - flying visit to take DS to see my mum - if you need anything, just say, my dear.

Raspberry You are, like anyone else who needs a place of support, more than welcome to be here. Don't even think of backing off!

Dentist today. Was shitting it all morning, and then my appointment was half hour late, not good for the ol' nerves. But I've had stage one of the work done, in a week or so I go and get it finished off. It wasn't pleasant but as always, once the injections were over, it was pain free and ok - well, as okay as a vast amount of drilling can be...<shudder> Was numbed up so much that I had a 'trout pout' for most of the afternoon. grin DS kept looking at me like hmm So achy now though, paracetamol isn't quite cutting it. Why did I choose to do this to myself again?

Wishing you all a peaceful, sleep-filled night.

Raspberryandorangesorbet Mon 10-Sep-12 22:24:57

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

** news flash **

DS slept from10pm until 5.30am. Flipping hell!

How are you Joyful?

unhappyhildebrand Tue 11-Sep-12 07:36:11

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Mitsouko Tue 11-Sep-12 12:13:01

Oh Joyful, please don't feel you have to go away because you're struggling! You should definitely have a safe place to offload and get support right now, which such a difficult time as you're having. Really glad you're going to the Dr, I really hope that you can get some help. I'm sure that you're just beyond exhausted and anyone's mental health would suffer under such circumstances.

I wish I could come up with some magic, baby-settling ideas so that you could at the very least, get a bit more rest. No Cry Sleep Solution is pretty good, though we just started a few weeks ago and half the time I don't keep up with sleep logs as I am so tired.

Hope everyone else is doing well, sounds like it was a slightly more restful night for some, that's great!

Mitsouko Wed 12-Sep-12 14:52:21

Oh hell, today I feel like even a worse mum than usual! DD is 6 months today, so I introduced solids - baby rice with aptamil formula (DD is bf but I am shit at expressing even when I get the time, which is never) and apple puree. She had had the most horrid allergic reaction to something, broken out in rash all over her face and neck. Breathing fine though. GP says not to worry.

I have suspected she has CMA as her reflux always got so much worse after the odd bottle (have to give them sometimes when I have migraine and have to take sumatriptan). But I was never able to see a change in DD when dairy was eliminated from my diet for a month or two, or gradually reintroduced, so wasn't sure.

Just posted in allergies so hopefully will get some advice there. sad

Raspberryandorangesorbet Wed 12-Sep-12 20:38:38

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Raspberryandorangesorbet Wed 12-Sep-12 20:39:29

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ticklemyboobsofsteel Wed 12-Sep-12 21:29:09

Mitsouko oooh you poor love, I hope BabyMit is doing okay now. Really scary when that happens sad Hope you get some advice lady.

Raspberry These babies do like to surprise us!

DS slept beautifully last night. Bed at 7.30pm, up at 7am. Not a squeak in between. I am so proud of him. And sooo grateful for the sleep. But, I miss him in the nights now! Gawd. Never satisfied, am I...

Sooo, we're watching Ghost. What the hell is with the part where Carl "accidentally" drops coffee down his shirt at Molly's apartment?! It never occurred to me before how bizarre it is... an excuse to get his bod out and 'entice' the grieving woman...? And it just ends up being all weird and awkward. Hmm. I may have had wine...

Hope you all have good nights tonight! <waves at Joyful if she's reading smile>

<peeks around door>

<sneaks in and lays out tray of chocolate cake and brew>

I saw a lovely student doctor this morning (and then had to explain everything again to the rather sceptical looking GP when she came in) and came away with a prescription for 50mg sertraline and a counselling referral. So hopefully things will start to improve soon. In other news, I finally heard from the physiotherapy team on Tuesday and they've agreed that there's no point seeing me so are referring me straight on to the Spinal Triage team. smile

Mitsouko how's DD? I found your thread in Allergies, I hope you're both feeling better today.

Raspberry you sound like me! grin Has the hysteria subsided yet?

tickle I haven't watched Ghost in absolutely forever! I must dig it out sometime. Although I could never take the pottery wheel scene seriously because I kept remembering that it was meant to be Whoopi Goldberg's body... confused

hildebrand how are you doing?

Thanks to everyone who sent me supportive messages both on thread and via PM. You're all lovely and I'm so glad you're here. smile

Raspberryandorangesorbet Thu 13-Sep-12 20:26:55

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<strokes Raspberry's hair>

I love the crate idea! Does it have a lid? wink

I know it's hard atm, you're doing really well. I can't remember whether you co-sleep - if not would you consider it?

LittleWaveyLines Thu 13-Sep-12 21:13:45

My brain is mush. I cannot teach/work on this little sleep - the last few nights have been hell.

I wonder if you can get signed off by the doctor for suffering from "High Needs Baby Syndrome"?

I find that if you collapse on a doctor weeping hysterically you can get pretty much anything, especially if it's a male doctor! grin

How are things with the childminder?

LittleWaveyLines Thu 13-Sep-12 21:58:41

grin I might try it!

Childminder - not so good. Every day this week I have picked up a blotchy tearful girl.... the childminder said she'd been crying on and off for 2 hours before pick up on Tuesday, and 1 hour today. sad

Oh no, poor DD. And poor you! (((hugs)))

Raspberryandorangesorbet Thu 13-Sep-12 22:14:17

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LittleWaveyLines Thu 13-Sep-12 22:18:39

The childminder has said she might want milk/is tired/don't know... she wont take milk of any form off the childminder, and is not good at drinking water when there either - waits to have a massive BF when I pick her up - which was 8 hours on Tuesday.....

The CM says she is otherwise happy/cheerful - it's just as it gets later.... I think DD can just not cope more than 5 hours without me sad

Raspberryandorangesorbet Thu 13-Sep-12 22:45:39

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How about milkshake? DD has always hated cows milk but if I blend it with some banana she can't get enough of it.

Could you introduce a cup or bottle at home that she then takes to the CMs, so it has an element of Mummy there? Or would that make it worse?

<brews brew>

Morning all...

Raspberry that was a fun thread last night! hmm

Raspberryandorangesorbet Fri 14-Sep-12 12:18:44

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Mitsouko Fri 14-Sep-12 15:48:34

Raspberry, Tickle, Joyful - thank you all for your kind words and support. Babysuko doing much better, but goodness it was frightening! We've been to the GP who prescribed an antihistamine in case of another episode. I'm going to try and get her next appointment with the Paed moved forward so we can talk about referral to allergist and dietician.

Carrying on with the weaning. Just made the baby rice with cooled, boiled water and mixed with the apple puree. So far, so good. Tomorrow, we try banana!

Hope all mums and babies are keeping well. Wish you all a restful weekend filled with lovely, lovely sleep.

LittleWaveyLines Fri 14-Sep-12 20:01:04

She has milk off me no problem - has never taken a bottle but sippy cups and open cups are fine - just not for the childminder!

Will suggest milkshake - thank you smile

Raspberryandorangesorbet Fri 14-Sep-12 20:18:34

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LittleWaveyLines Fri 14-Sep-12 21:40:15

Not too bad thanks. Just going round and round in circles wondering what to do for the best. Almost had a row with DP about it tonight as he was "being devils advocate" and countering everything I said!

The bottom line is that I don't know why she gets upset at the childminders. I don't know what's wrong. There is no guarantee to say she would be better, or even worse, if we swapped childcare, and it would definitely be bad to just keep swapping. I don't really want to give up work and can't realistically change my hours know until next September.

I just know that if she does more than a morning there I am picking up a teary blotchy upset or stressed little girl.

And she's been going to this childminder since June - so it's not "settling in". sad

Sorry to be "me, me" but I really can't see through this. And my anxiety is starting to some back big time - getting irrational panics again....

Oh sweetheart (((hugs)))

It's ok to be stressed. And it's completely understandable that this is making you anxious. I don't have any advice I'm afraid - I fell at the first hurdle when it came to going back to work. But someone will and you just have to remember that you are a great mum.

LittleWaveyLines Fri 14-Sep-12 22:52:03

Thank you Joyful.

I have spent the last hour emailing childminders (had to venture onto netmums shock )and putting adverts on free sites for nanny shares...

I think that's all I can do for one night!

How are you and DD today Wavey?

I've not been around for a while again (bloody work. Tut. How dare they take up so much time?!) How is everyone?

Glad you've seen the doc Joyful - How are you feeling?

LWL - Sorry you're in this predicament. The start of term is tough enough without worrying about DD too. Do you mind me asking how she is with other children? Would you consider a nursery? I've probably been really lucky with the one DS goes to, but I really would recommend it to anyone. The other children really seem to distract him from missing me or getting upset and the staff are amazing. It might be worth visiting a couple to see what you think.

Raspberryandorangesorbet Sat 15-Sep-12 20:19:21

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Raspberryandorangesorbet Sat 15-Sep-12 20:39:01

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Surely not Raspberry? grin

I'm feeling ok thanks Truth, no massive side effects yet. DS is being a pain in the bum tonight though, I have only spent 20 minutes outside the bedroom so far! Bah.

LittleWaveyLines Sat 15-Sep-12 22:00:41

Thanks for the replies smile

We had a really rough night (well I did - she didn't seem at all tired today) but we've had a lovely day today so I'm feeling a lot calmer. Thank you for letting me vent...

Re nurseries - we looked round the 2 closest to us be we had to cut the tours short as she found them too loud/busy! She like being with small numbers of other children for small amounts of time - after a bit she just wants me, and to be slinged...

I think the not drinking milk is part of the problem. But I don't think it's the whole thing. Today she has just wanted to be on/near me and ventured away to do things for short periods - but always come back to be picked up quite quickly. I think she just wants me! I think she'll accept DP and his parents as she knows them so well, but even they have to work quite hard for the last few hours...

I mighgt ask the childminder if I can observe - she did offer to video her a while back as I think I looked sceptical when she said DD was actually happy for most of the day and it was only the last hour she got upset! I think I'll take her up on her offer!

Hm... this is perhaps extreme, but how far is the childminder from school? Could you go cuddle her for half an hour on your lunch break? Or would that make the afternoons worse for both of you?

On another tack, have you had a good look at your department timetable? Is there any possibility at all of you doing any swaps so that you only work mornings? Or smiliar? Alternatively, would you consider taking parental leave? I had never heard of it before seeing it on another thread (and still don't quite understand) but it looks like you could take up to 13 weeks unpaid leave, which may buy you enough time for DD to grow up a bit and become a bit more independent.

I need to be self-indulgent for a moment, just skip over this bit if you like. smile I'm feeling sad today. A friend had her 5th baby this morning, a lovely healthy little girl. I'm so pleased for her and her husband but it's made me face up to the realisation that I may not be able to have any more children. DS may be my last.

DH and I always wanted a fairly big family, 3 or 4 kids perhaps. But my back is so bad now that I struggle to lift DS and he's only 8 months old (19lb mind you! He's a chunky lad grin). I struggle to get down on the floor and play with DD. Add in my mental health problems and our financial situation and the possibility of having more children becomes very slender. I love my children dearly but I never thought I'd only have 2. I have quite a lot of friends with big families (3 or 4 mostly) and several other friends who are pregnant. And while I'm happy for them I'm sad for me. I know this isn't set in stone and it might still happen but right now it seems awfully unlikely. sad

Right, moment over. How's everyone else's weekend been? Lots of sleeping babies I hope?


I empathise. I only have the one, but DH is determined that he will be the last. It breaks my heart. Still, never say never eh?

Sleeping babies though? I think you've got the wrong thread... grin

Sorry to hear that Truth, that's sad. But you're right, never say never. smile Does he have a reason for not wanting more?

LittleWaveyLines Sun 16-Sep-12 21:10:58


I also empathise. I always always wanted a big family. XH couldn't have kids (and never told me that he knew this), and I think I've met DP too late to have any more now.

Never say never though.....

Sleep! Hah!
DD has been HOURLY waking up the last few nights.... this afternoon I had to go for a nap as I was starting to see things out of the corners of my eyes again.... needless to say DD didn't nap hmm

Does he have a reason for not wanting more?

DS sad

I think DH has found parenthood much harder and much more exhausting than he expected. He's adamant that this is it. I'm adamant I want more. We're at an impass. Part of the reason I applied for this new job is to give me something else to focus on.

Oh Truth how awful for you. I know you know this but one HN baby doesn't mean they'll all be like that. I just got lucky hmm Maybe once DS is a little older and you're settled and comfortable in your new life he'll reconsider.

Wavey I don't know how old you are (in my head you're all about my age!) but you never know. My MIL didn't have her youngest until she was 42 and one of her friends had her son at 45.

Hourly wakings and work can't be a fun combination, you poor thing. Is co-sleeping an option? I know I always suggest it but it's honestly the only reason I am able to function!

LittleWaveyLines Sun 16-Sep-12 21:36:42

I'm very nearly 40 and yes we cosleep! I really would not be functioning on any level without it.... grin

Still waiting for DD to get tired. Have tried to put her to bed twice now but she just starts crawling around and burbling happily....

That's the plan joyful grin

Oh, lwl, I thought nights had got easier for you sad What happens when DP tries tp settle her?

Raspberryandorangesorbet Mon 17-Sep-12 15:32:35

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Yep, it's developmental. It'll all be over soon and he'll sleep through the night, no problem. smile

Maybe. wink

I've just been looking at my friend's birth photographs. They're absolutely beautiful, she had a wonderfully peaceful and gentle birth (despite having her other 4 children in the house, 2 midwives, a photographer and a film crew!). I feel such pangs looking at them though.

How's everyone else today?

Raspberryandorangesorbet Mon 17-Sep-12 19:09:01

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That's what I'm trying to focus on. It wouldn't be fair to these two to have any more when I'm struggling already.

They really are stunning photos though - she had a home water birth and guided the baby out herself. The midwives basically got to sit and watch (along with everyone else!).

Raspberryandorangesorbet Mon 17-Sep-12 20:57:30

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Oh you should, I love a good birth story! Mine were very different from each other but having DS was amazing. smile

Could you flip Pesky once he's settled into a deeper sleep (raspberry turnover? grin) so that he doesn't wake on his front? What's his preferred position usually - back, side?

Raspberryandorangesorbet Mon 17-Sep-12 21:30:21

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LittleWaveyLines Mon 17-Sep-12 21:40:52

*Just answering Truth before I go back to toddler wrangling - we don't even try DP resettling her anymore - I go to bed when she does, we share a king sized mattress on the floor. DP is in the spare room in his old double bed....

LittleWaveyLines Mon 17-Sep-12 21:44:35

I'm so bloody stressed I might have to buy yet another sling. I'm thinking of Azure ring sling.... I';ve only got the one ring sling! grin

So I dropped her off today at 9am - tears from both of us. I had to stay at school for a meeting so couldn't pick her up til 5.30ish so DP went in early and picked her up at 4pm. She was very upset and now understands what I was on about. She hasn't been right all evening now... sad

He's talking about getting me pregant ASAP so I can go on maternity leave - kind of ignoring the fact that
A: I'm too bloody tired to DTD with her hourly wakings and
B: I haven't got my cycles back yet (15 months) so there would be no hope....


That's marvellous! grin Sounds like a fantastic birth!

DD - 41+1. Contractions started mid-afternoon Tuesday, went into hospital early hours Wednesday. Only 3cm. In loads of pain so end up on a diamorphine drip (epidural not an option due to my back). At 1003 I tell the midwife I want to push - DD was born at 1006 on the second push. I had a very bad second degree tear so they started to stitch me up straight away (before the local anaesthetic arrived!). It took an hour. I found out afterwards from DH that they'd wanted to take me to theatre but were worried I would bleed out on the way. confused

DS - 41+2. Woke up at 0130 Christmas bloody Day with contractions. Determined to see DD open her presents so lay quietly in bed and read and MNed until 0630 when I woke DH. Saw DD open her presents. Get to hospital, go onto triage ward. Midwife says I'm 6cm and goes to fetch a wheelchair to take me to a delivery suite. I say I need to push. She tells me that I can't need to push yet. DH points out that DS is crowning.. Poor midwife panics as they're not set up for births on the triage ward, DS is delivered on the first push. grin (I had a second degree tear this time too but much more minor. Apparently my babies just come out too fast!).

Wavey you don't have to be having periods to be ovulating - my friend who's just had her fifth hasn't had a period in years, she's either been pregnant or breastfeeding or both since 2004!

Sorry to hear that DD still isn't getting on. At least DP understands now, that's got to help right?

Raspberryandorangesorbet Mon 17-Sep-12 22:00:10

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LittleWaveyLines Mon 17-Sep-12 22:07:51

Sorry for the "poor me"s smile

Lovely to hear nice birth stories as well smile

Yes now DP understands it is a bit easier and I think he will make more of an effort - he had 1.5 hours of her being clingy before I got home - the first time she's ever been like that with him - so I think he "gets" a lot of stuff better now! grin

Just to add another straw to the back, our arsey neighbours have their TV bass up loud again. I can tell they are iplaying Strictly.....

I can't work out if that's better or worse than watching films loudly... hmm

Don't apologise, goodness knows I've written enough me posts lately! It's about time someone else had a turn. wink I hope you manage to resolve things soon but we're all here for you.

Mitsouko Tue 18-Sep-12 09:42:12

Little Wavey Lines so sorry to hear of your childcare stress and hope you can find a way forward with things. This has probably been suggested before, but is your cm any good with a sling? It sounds like you have an enviable collection! Would cm be amenable to slinging DD when she gets fussy? The body contact might be nice and soothing and help her settle.

I need to learn back carries soon as Babysuko is now 7.5 kilos!

DD: Mummy, have you got a baby in your tummy?
Me: No sweetheart.
DD: Yes you have!
Me: Why do you think there's a baby in my tummy?
DD: Because it's big and round and fat!

Ouch. confused

LittleWaveyLines Tue 18-Sep-12 20:35:49


LittleWaveyLines Tue 18-Sep-12 20:38:43

Mitsouko - we did get a buckle carrier just for the CM to use when DD first went to her 3 months ago - and she did use it and found it useful, but then said DD was too big for her to even back carry (CM is very petite) and it wasn't being helpful anymore, so I've currently leant it out to a sling library. I might talk to the CM again though and let her try out the wompat buckle carrier that the Grandparents use....

I did think of it then just dismissed it but I should talk to the CM to see what she thinks. The wompat is a lot more comfortable than the beco butterfly we had previously given her to use....

That's a really good suggestion Mitsouko. smile

I've been trying out back carries too but DS is just too wriggly and too keen to play with my hair! He's 19lb now though (I think that's about 8.5kg?) and is getting quite big.

JemJar Tue 18-Sep-12 20:55:19


Sorry I have not been back here since first posting. Been on holiday to Dorset for a week which was lovely and before that was struggling lots with DS and not able to get time online.

Joyful, sorry things have been so difficult, it sounds exhausting. I hope the anti depressants work for you and the counselling waiting list is not too long. I pay for private counselling as GP list was too long as I have issues about DS's traumatic birth and week on SCBU and I really find it helpful, hope you do too.

Little wavey lines That sounds really distressing for you and DD. I hope you find a way of it working for you both very soon, not nice at all.

truth the impass sounds very tough for you guys to work through. Hope he changes his mind when sleep comes more easily and the fog clears. 10pm until 5.30am must have felt amazing :-)

unhappyhildebrand that sounds like a lovely sleep, hope he didn't make you pay for it the next night in the end.

Mitsouko That reaction sounds scary. hope it is something she grows out of very soon.

Tickle The text book 7-7 dream! Hope he has kept that up!

We are 6 weeks in to our hellish sleep time and DS is 5 months on thursday. Thinking it is not just a sleep regression/leap as he cannot settle himself ever bless him. Naps are only sling or car. If in the sling and walking outside then he sleeps fine and within a couple of minutes of putting the hood up, if at home then it is walking to get him off, then rocking on the glider with bum pats and white noise.

Going to sleep is generally fine now and he usually feeds to sleep at 6/6:30pm and sleeps until 10/10:30 occasionally 11 and then it is downhill from there. Last night he was awake and sobbing every hour from 6, gave him nurofen as think he was teething and he did really well and managed a 3 hour, then a 45 min monster feed pull off, jolt awake root etc... then a 2 hour then every half hour until Daddy came (sleep on the sofa during the week now) and took him at 5:45 until 7:45 thank goodness.

Some nights it is 30 mins-40 mins - 55 mins all night long :-( doesn't feed just dummy and pats most of the time. he makes the saddest face and cries until you pick him up and then he sinks in relief in your arms and is asleep within seconds.............until next time he wakes and can't settle........

Not showing signs of increasing hunger to make me want to wean early or think it would help really.

CC Is really not for us. Have read the 'no cry sleep solution' on holiday (oh the days when holiday reading was trash!) and am starting logs tomorrow.

Hope we all have good nights tonight x

JemJar Wed 19-Sep-12 09:20:23

Horrendous night here and just wrestled to nap with sling/white noise/rocking/dummy after 4 hours awake instead of his usual 2/2.5.

He learned to roll yesterday after doing it accidentally a few times before. practised in the night and this morning and couldn't switch off.

Very cute but even my teeth feel tired today sad

Had plans to see my NCT friends that I am not sure I will make now. Suggested lunch then sling walk round Epping forest (declined Westfield meet and pub lunch earlier in the week as too stressful with master mardy) but not sure I am safe to drive.

If one more friend suggests 'sleeping when he naps' I will scream. If he would be put down to nap do they think I would need telling??! and breathe x

Oh Jem you sound at the end of your tether, you poor love. I agree, 'sleep when he sleeps' is no use at all in this situation!

Now that he's got the hang of rolling he may settle a little better, I found that when DD was on the cusp of a physical development her sleep went even more haywire. Fingers crossed lovely.

Mitsouko Wed 19-Sep-12 13:45:33

Hi JemJar - sympathies and brew

Your nights sound very much like my own right now. DD was 6 months last week and we've been having hourly wake-ups for quite some time. Nothing too new round here really though as sleep has been troubled since birth. First colic and reflux as a newborn until 3 months, then the 4 month sleep regression, now teething and who knows what else. It's hard. I only manage by co-sleeping half the night and having a very supportive husband.

I really need to stop peeking into other sleep threads because if I read another one where the OP is complaining about an angelic self-settler that sleeps through but wakes at 5am, or sleeps naps 3 hours in the day and sleeps 7-7 but wakes once in the night and takes a WHOLE HALF HOUR to settle I am going to lose it. I know it's relative, but just really, really envy.

Sorry, am feeling a bit grrrrr today.

So I carted DS off to bed at half past five as he was yawning and rubbing his eyes. He refused to sleep, was a little sick and has spent the last hour bouncing around the living room. hmm

Is there a development spurt at this sort of age (he'll be 9 months next week)? I can't remember. He's suddenly chattering a lot more though and is much more interested in people and objects.

Mitsouko I am sorely tempted to hide the entire sleep topic atm! So far this week I haven't spent more than 20 minutes at a time out of the bedroom in the evening. sad

Raspberryandorangesorbet Wed 19-Sep-12 20:38:05

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How was last night? Everyone? Anyone?

<peers around hopefully>

I spent my morning having cuddles with a 4 day old girl... So lovely. And so tiny. I forget how small they are when they're born!

Raspberryandorangesorbet Thu 20-Sep-12 19:03:46

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Oh dear. <pours wine> Any idea what's up?

Mitsouko Thu 20-Sep-12 19:53:52

Joyful...4 days old, how sweet! Yes, you do forget how small they are. I've been organising today and boxed up some of DD's newborn babygrows...so tiny!

Raspberry...I forget how old Pesky is...please remind me? Babysuko is 6 months and also been pretty screechy and fussy today. Thinking teeth as her first one had just cut.

Wishing you all a restful night!

Grr... Bloody DS

Oops, didn't mean to post!

But anyway, grr. For the last 3 weeks I have spent most of my evening (I would say about 90%) feeding or holding him. If I do manage to get him settled in his crib he lasts a maximum of 20 minutes before waking up and screeching. I have barely spent any time with DH, I am behind on my knitting (I started a little knitted hats business on Facebook) and I am pissed off with DS. I have no idea what the problem is but I have had enough.

MerseyMama Thu 20-Sep-12 20:03:39


Ooh hello! smile

<crawls in, waves weakly, falls asleep in corner>

<tucks a blanket around Truth, puts out a plate of biscuit for when she wakes>

Raspberryandorangesorbet Thu 20-Sep-12 20:21:16

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Raspberryandorangesorbet Thu 20-Sep-12 20:24:00

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I do co-sleep now but it's very painful for me. Better than a night without sleep though. smile If I take him out of the bedroom he wakes up, he's very sensitive to his surroundings (even though we use white noise).

DS smacks the highchair tray if he gets impatient too! DD used to do it as well. It's cute the first few times... grin

Raspberryandorangesorbet Thu 20-Sep-12 20:38:37

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

That sounds like an Excellent Plan, it's sure to work! [encouraging]

He lasts about the same amount of time in my bed unless I'm actually there. Awkward little blighter. hmm Even DD was never this bad!

Raspberryandorangesorbet Thu 20-Sep-12 21:03:22

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Mmmm, pie... What kind? I've been trying to watch this week's Bake-Off and am now craving meringue.

Raspberryandorangesorbet Thu 20-Sep-12 22:28:05

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<wriggles out from under the blanket, thanks joyful, scoffs biscuits, goes back to sleep>

I wish!

After keeping us awake for most of last night, DS has now developed a sickness bug, so our 'early night' has been rudely changed into a sheet washing, sick-baby-holding, sheet-washing, bedding-changing, DS-soothing marathon. Poor little thing. Poor us.

Oh dear Truth! I hope you managed to get some sleep - is DS any better this morning?

Raspberry that pie sounds amazing! envy

Mitsouko Fri 21-Sep-12 08:38:53

Oh dear Truth how awful, hope baby feels better soon and you can get some rest.

We had a rough night too as my back has gone out on me. All locked up and spasmodic now, ouch. I've been in low level pain with it for awhile but something popped while putting DD down in cot last night. DH will have to stay home today as I can't lift her. Won't go down well with his work. Bugger.

Oh Mitsouko that's rubbish! I hope you recover quickly.

A friend has roped me in to do a webchat with her A-level students this morning. confused I used to be a forensic scientist and she wants me to talk to them about the forensic extraction of data from digital devices, and just how much of your deleted data a device can retain. That's going to be interesting... Is it too early for gin? grin

Well, that was an interesting night!

I think we've had eight bursts of sickness (and all ensuing bed changes), four washing machine loads, two calls to the out of hours doctor, one argument about whether we can send him to nursery or not (I won, he's tucked up in bed upstairs), three more baths than usual...

And it doesn't seem to be over yet. DH is now complaining of feeling ill and I've just extracted myself from underneath DS after finally getting him to sleep (so that I can go tackle the HUGE pile of washing that now needs sorting)

We were supposed to be having our first child free day/night out tomorrow. That's looking unlikely. I doubt SIL&MIL will want DS in this state! sad

Anyway, enough about me. Have you managed to get to a doc Mitsouko? I hope you get some super dooper painkillers and some relief soon.

How did the chat go Joyful? That sound suspiciously similar to what my DH used to do. I've never come across anyone else who'd even heard of digital forensics before!

Raspberryandorangesorbet Fri 21-Sep-12 11:43:33

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Well the webchat went well! They had loads of questions and now have to write an essay on it or something... Truth I was a digital forensic scientist for the FSS at Chepstow, where did your DH work?

Get the washing to a laundrette and put your feet up for a while!

ticklemyboobsofsteel Fri 21-Sep-12 12:13:30

I wrote a big message earlier, but the site died and ate my post on its way down! <sigh>

Hope all the poorly babies and mums are feeling better.

I'm feeling a bit sad today. The time is coming when DH will go back to work. Money is getting tight and we need to get back to the house deposit saving too. But that means DS into almost full-time childcare again. I'm so going to miss these days where we can all be at home together (I'm working, yes, but at least I can feed him, and play with him on breaks and stuff). I don't know that I'm ready to let them go yet. A lottery win would be very handy right about now...!

DH is toying with the idea of becoming a male nanny while he is doing his OU degree grin He'd be amazing at it. He wants to be a teacher eventually.

I had another dentist visit on Wednesday to have permanent crowns put on. Oh my god, the pain was second only to childbirth. It was awful. Much better now though, and they look so much better.

Little man has another molar on the way, poor fella sad

Wishing you all a good day!

Raaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!! angry DS is still awake.

Truth how are you and DS, is he any better?

tickle I hope you get that lottery win soon lovely so you can pass some of it my way

Mitsouko how's your back?

Jemjar how are you doing?

Raspberry where's my pie, hmm?

Raspberryandorangesorbet Sat 22-Sep-12 20:14:10

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Naughty BabyJumper - get thee to sleep! <Flashes teacher stare in his direction>

DS is still poorly sad DH has gone down south to the wedding without me sad so I'm home alone sad with chocolate, wine and apple pie grin

To be fair, DS is being bliming amazing. He can't keep anything down, so the cycle goes: feed, throw up, sleep, wake up super happy, play, get hungry, feed, throw up, sleep, wake up super happy... you get the picture. Apart from the bits where he is actually being sick (when he looks at me in total despair and confusion) he's just being amazing. Bless him.

Did I tell you about his latest skill though? He's learnt how to kiss, which is gorgeous (he only kisses me grin) but he will only kiss on the lips... and he's sick... and he keeps wanting to kiss me... and I really want him too, because it's just super cute, but oh-my-god, he's sick. Boak.

Raspberryandorangesorbet Sat 22-Sep-12 20:33:34

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He's asleep! The teacher glares/eyebrows worked! Thank you ladies. smile

Truth oh bless him... DD had a bug like that when she was about 27 months, she couldn't keep anything down for over a week. It was after she'd weaned as well so I couldn't even feed her. sad I hope he feel better soon - the kisses sound lovely!

Raspberryandorangesorbet Sat 22-Sep-12 20:56:37

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Sick for over a week? Don't say that! Our washing machine is already looking at me as if to say 'more? really? I can't cope!' (no really, it is, I'm not in a sleep deprived haze, no really...) and I really can't take more time off work.

Glad BabyJumper is asleep. Now stay that way little man, or I'll have to put you in a detention.

Sleep with Mr Raspberry! Sleep with Mr Raspberry! Much as I adore DS, I love the very rare mornings where I wake up next to DH grin

Raspberryandorangesorbet Sat 22-Sep-12 21:05:15

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See how long it is between wakings. When you get to the point where you can't bear the thought of getting up yet again, that's when you stay with Pesky.

I vote for cuddles with MrRaspberry too. smile

When you get to the point where you can't bear the thought of getting up yet again, that's when you stay with Pesky.

If I was writing a book, that ^^ would probably be the title. Pretty much sums up the last year or so!

(Sorry if this has been asked before, but can you not sleep with both? DS ends up tucked up between us most nights)

Raspberryandorangesorbet Sat 22-Sep-12 21:18:13

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Yep, same here Truth! grin

More of Joyful's words of HN wisdom:

It is not your fault, or your baby's fault. It is just one of those things.
Doing what gets you both the most sleep is A Good Thing (with safety disclaimers, obviously).
Anyone who tells you otherwise is an idiot.
Ignore anyone who uses the phrase 'rod for your own back'.
Cake is good.
This will pass. smile

<falls even more in love with Joyful than she already was grin>

Have you seen the other thread? We are 'Baby Led Sleeping' dontcha know? We is like sooo cool.

(Such a refreshing change to see that thread. I was told the other day that I had to ignore my DS at night. Er no, I don't, he's my son and I love him and if he cries I will go to him)

Oh Truth, this is so sudden! blush grin

I'm loving that thread. Weirdly DH and I were saying something similar this morning!

Raspberryandorangesorbet Sun 23-Sep-12 10:33:06

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Hmm.... With pesky?

Under the dining table, rocking, with your fingers in your ears.

Raspberryandorangesorbet Sun 23-Sep-12 11:29:44

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I had my suspicions, yes, but I also had my fingers crossed for you! Was it awful? <pours Raspberry a soothing brew>

But of course I speak the truth. A username never lies smile

I wish I was wrong and you'd got man-size cuddles instead of baby-sized ones though.

DH is back from the wedding so I left DS with him and took the afternoon to myself. A whole three hours in town with the credit card. Bliss. Except I couldn't find a Single Thing I wanted to buy. Tch.

Raspberryandorangesorbet Sun 23-Sep-12 18:48:35

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DS is being a pain in the arse again tonight. Fell asleep feeding, slept for ages, still feeding, then woke up wanting to play. I've been trying to get him back to sleep for over half an hour but he refuses

I am so angry with him. It's bad enough having no time to myself during the day but for the last few weeks I haven't had any time in the evenings either. I know it's partly the depression talking but right now I really feel like I hate him. angry

Can you hand him over to DH for half an hour Joyful? Sounds like you've done your shift and are in need of a break. Either you, or him and DH, could go for a walk to give you some fresh air and a bit of space.

Raspberryandorangesorbet Sun 23-Sep-12 19:30:28

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I have now, thanks. DH has him while I have dinner and calm down a bit. It's just so frustrating, it takes at least an hour to get him to sleep and into bed, so even if he decides he's sleepy again soon I probably won't be done with him till about nine.

Where can I buy chloroform? grin

Raspberry I live in nursing tops, much easier to whip them out when wearing the sling! That's on my list of 'reasons why it's a good thing we can't have more children' - when DS means I can start wearing nice bras again! Assuming I can afford them, I usually end up buying from Bravissimo as I'm an awkward size.

No idea about chloroform, but Ashtons and Parsons appears to be back on the market. I've been trying to buy it since DS was first born and SIL recommended it. I've literally got my first box this week, but now he's refusing to take it. Apparently (and I can't confirm this as I can't get any into him!) it really, really works to calm stressy babies.

I hate to tell you this but it never had any effect on either of my two. I have friends who swear by it though, so hopefully it will work for you! smile

It's not going to work for us either - he won't open his bloody mouth!

No, the irony is that we finally managed to buy some in the week that he started sleeping better so I'm not too worried about not being able to get it into him. I've been deliberately not mentioning it as you're all obviously still struggling, but DS is sleeping much better (despite being ill) and settling him at the start of the night is zillions times better than ever before. Sorry!

Raspberryandorangesorbet Sun 23-Sep-12 19:52:15

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That's great news Truth! How fantastic! Well done that boy. smile Is he recovering from his bug yet?

Raspberry there's no easy way to say this but - yes, yes you are. confused

Raspberryandorangesorbet Sun 23-Sep-12 20:23:14

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Of course! Says the crazy, medicated woman... wink

Raspberryandorangesorbet Sun 23-Sep-12 20:37:30

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I've lived in the vest and baggy top combo for the last year Raspberry, now that I've got DS onto formula for daytimes, I want clothes that fit. The problem is that my 'fit' is totally different to how it used to be (hello saggy boobs and 'still pregnant?' tummy!) and my budget is somewhat depleted (hello nursery fees!)

Two babies? Why?! No seriously, it'll be fine. Who's baby? Why will you suddenly have two? (Sorry if I've missed this) Do you want a third from time to time?

DS is doing well, he's stopped being sick, but his nappies are, um, interesting. I'm going to attempt to take him to nursery tomorrow, but DH is on standby to pick him up if he's poorly.

Ashtons and Parsons is a teething powder that lots of friends swear by, but it's been off the market for the last year (typical!) Not sure if it's magical or not though - he won't take it. DS's sleep has been getting better for the last month or so. He settles really quickly for DH so we'd managed to get him down to one feed between 7pm and 7am (the stuff that dreams are made of grin) until he got sick, when I've just had him in with me and let him feed as and when he likes. We've put him back in his own cot tonight, so fingers crossed...

X posts.

Um, a bit mental, but it sounds like you're up for the challenge.

How is she repaying you for this amazingness? I hope there's plenty of spa days, champagne and flowers on your horizon