A thread for my early waking friends who want a whinge

(408 Posts)
fififrog Tue 13-Mar-12 22:07:16

A few weeks back there were quite a few of us with DCs about a year old, too young for gro clocks etc waking up TOO BLOOMING EARLY. Where are you all at now? DD seems to be getting earlier. Cough not helping but we had 4.55 this morning. I hate to say it but I actually enjoyed her being ill last week as she slept til 6.30 once. Some mornings I think "just a long phase we can live with it" but this morning I was in total despair. Will I ever be able to make it to 10pm without thinking I will regret staying up this late??! I know some of you will say stick with the messing around with morning nap, it will fix it, but to be honest I don't believe it will and I just want to WHINGE to people who will understand!!

vix206 Wed 14-Mar-12 06:33:51

Hi fififrog I wasn't on the original thread but OMG I understand. See the thread about '17 month old waking at 4am' and you'll see I'm in the same boat, and have been for 18 months now. I've tried everything and have come to the conclusion that whether I fight this or submit to it - it will get better. At some point. So I surrender.

I'm in bed by 9 every night and always awake for the day between 4 and 5 although for the past week I've been firm in not going into DS until 6am when his light comes on (it's on a timer).

He's also crying out in his sleep 2 or 3 times per night at the moment so all in all I'm a tired mummy. I have to watch because too much sleep deprivation and I get depressed to the point of not functioning well.

Anyway. Sorry to ramble just I trouncing myself and letting you know you're not alone!!!! grin

vix206 Wed 14-Mar-12 06:34:40

Trouncing myself??! Bloody iPhone. I meant introducing myself! grin

scrivette Wed 14-Mar-12 06:40:36

I wasn't on the original thread but I will have a moan too to keep you company!

8 month old DS kept waking in the night then woke at 5, I am working today so will be exhausted.

mumatron Wed 14-Mar-12 06:49:24

I'm here.

Dd2 is 14mo and usually wakes around 4.30am

She has recently (last few days) started refusing to go to bed, so we aren't getting any sleep until gone 11pm,

<Tears hair out>

Meggymoodle Wed 14-Mar-12 08:21:15

Hello - I wasn't on the original thread either but v. happy to moan along with you all. I have a DD who is 15 months old and up at 0500 - 0530 every morning. I know compared to 0430 that actually seems quite reasonable but it still wears thin! This has been going on since she started sleeping through at about 7ish months....

We went to bed last night at 1015 and I said to DH that we were taking a risk going to bed so late - how ridiculous that 1015 is now considered a late night!

I am trying to get her down to one nap as it did work back along stopping her having a long morning nap but how I keep her to 12 when she's been awake at 0530 I don't know. All deeply frustrating.

My DS is 3 years and sleeping beautifully until nearly 7. I would love it if even she would go to 0600. How my view of a lie-in has changed :-(

Anyway, as misery loves company, nice to know there are others in the same boat!

fififrog Wed 14-Mar-12 19:29:19

Welcome all, didn't really have a previous whinge thread, more a collection of "help me" threads smile

It is funny how you change your perception of what is reasonable, isn't it. Back when, I used to want her to make it to 6.30 (she's always been pretty early), now I'm actually fairly pleased if we make it to 5.30! I keep thinking "some people get up at this time". I imagine you poor 4.30 folk think "at least milkmen get up at this time"!

It is indeed also very frustrating when they can't keep quiet all night - DD is great at self-settling but she still cried out when she wakes and so that's me awake for another 10mins at least, disturbing the sleep pattern etc!

I am currently reminding myself how nice it is that DD is already asleep and that we can have a quiet evening. I guess we are all just shifted to earlier times for everything, seems a cycle that is hard to break - I am also hanging in there to see if one nap might help, butshe's so not ready yet!

Happy evenings and quiet nights to you all! X

fififrog Wed 14-Mar-12 19:31:16

PS OMG mumatron I really hope that situation improves!!

mumatron Wed 14-Mar-12 20:19:18

It's weird, she literally went down for a nap one day last week fine. Woke up an hour later screaming and had a melt down everytime she's been in the cot since.

She currently asleep on the sofa after having another freak out up stairs. She will wake up when I move her soon but hopefully a 5 min cry will be enough. She'll probably wake about 2.30am, self settle then be up again at the crack of dawn around 4.30am.

Until xmas she was sleeping 7-7 sad

<Weeps>

LittleMilla Wed 14-Mar-12 21:00:04

Hello, hello, hello.

Right, I am not as bad as some, but I was on the other thread and can vouch that thus far fucking about with fiddling with DS's naps hasn't worked.

In fact longest sleep so far has come from him sleeping for 1.5 hr kip in the morning and an hour in the afternoon - he then got up at 6:30am next day hmm.

SOOOO want omama's theory to work and will deffo try it again once I am not too tired and craving the morning nap!

Laughing a lot at lie-in expectations. He woke up at 5:45am today but I was with my mum at her parents'...so she got up with him and I got to lie in until 7:45am. Literally, it felt like bliss. Ready for bed now though grin.

Oh, and sorry to burst any bubbles. My DS is crawling, cruising etc and it disn't make the blindest bit of difference. HOWEVER, he's almost walking and so I am finding that if I get him to walk LOADS it does seem to knacker him out. So guess what we've been doing today wink.

MadameJ Wed 14-Mar-12 21:12:23

I thought I would also join this thread as DH has switched off.
DD is finally "sleeping through" at 15 months fingers crossed I havent jinxed it the majority of the time.
However. . . . .our day begins at 4am every bloody day. Obviously given the mad hour she wakes she still has 2 naps and in all honesty it doesnt appear to make any difference what we do, it is always 4am sad
She is walking well and is extremely active so I think this is something I have to learn to live with hmm

ebmummy Wed 14-Mar-12 21:26:21

Yes, I'm here too, struggling with 13 month old DS...

Longest lie-in was 5am this morning-usually up earlier than that.

And funny how DH comes in from work (after I've put DS to bed) and exclaims how he 'misses DS something crazy', yet at 4am in the morning doesn't want to know.. Christ on a stick...

Julezboo Wed 14-Mar-12 21:38:39

Can I drag my tired butt in? 5:48 EVERY morning on the dot, this is after waking at midnight and 3 for milk.

waves to mumatron

I also have a 5 year old that comes in around 2am most nights to tell me he's tired (?) Go back to feckin bed then!!

DH and I do take turns each night, ie, he will do nights I will take him DS3 down in the morning, or I will do nights and he will take him down.

I am an 8am girl. I hate waking up to see the early number 5 on my clock.

The other night DH came down with the gastro bug we have all had at 1am. I took the baby downstairs, he didnt go back to sleep until THREE am and then was up at 5! I tend to go to bed at 9, but he wakes around 11/12, so we generally dont get more than 2/3 hours of unbroken sleep.

I am on my knees!!! HV keeps telling me to do controlled crying. I cant do it, not yet, hes too little (14 months today!) and has hearing/allergy issues still...

suspect you are all in bed, or watching OBEM thinking "just you wait, that tiny cute squishy newborn you are cuddling WILL become a non sleeping 1 year old quicker than you think! grin

(took me ages to write this as my words ended up back to front and wrong because my eyes are so tired.

mumatron Wed 14-Mar-12 21:50:54

julez Stop bragging with your 5.48am! Your positively spoilt! grin

Dd has finally gone to sleep in her cot after the 3rd attempt.

I don't think I can face trying CC. It's too hard. Breaks my heart to see her little sad face sad

I'm hoping she just hurry's up and grows out of this phase.
I should be in bed trying to sleep but I feel like I need to unwind a bit first.

mumatron Thu 15-Mar-12 07:40:05

shock

I put dd to bed finally at 10.30 last night.....and she's still there!

No night wake ups or anything.

I was petrified something was wrong with her when I woke up and it was light.

She will probably make it up to me by being a terror tonight but right now I am happy.

LittleMilla Thu 15-Mar-12 08:31:32

I have tried CC for the early wakings and IT DOES NOT WORK. You just get a very sad & tired baby and pissed off neighbours, in my case! I am a toughie in many ways, but haven't found any humane way to crack this.

5:20am wake up today. Left him chatting until 6:10am though...now I am just couting the minutes until I he can go back to bed!

Going to start short am nap this weekend once DH is about...

fififrog Thu 15-Mar-12 09:27:47

What is it with their mega-precise timing? We get 5.19 exactly most mornings. mumatron sounds like you had a grim evening but WOW what a morning! Hope your DD isn't coming down with something as I can't believe she'll keep that up.

Milla we're now 3 weeks into the short morning nap (with the exception of 3 days last week when she was properly ill) and it's not done anything yet.

We haven't tried CC in the morning (we did try it one night but it just enraged DD that I kept popping in and out) but we have ignored her til 6 for three months now unless she's crying hard, in which case we sit with her. This did work when we had a longish phase of 4.40, but doesn't do anything past 5am. This week have been going in and sitting with a hand on her back as I do if she wakes during a nap, but that's not working either. Ignoring or sitting quietly seem to be the only options. If I bring her into bed she screams blue murder til I let her get up.

Last night was a good one: didn't hear a peep and she woke at 5.40, but I have come down with her evil nursery-lurgy and I didn't sleep at all. Off sick today as feel rough as, my mum has taken her off and I'm back to bed. Realised this is the first time I've had more than 2 hrs to myself for a whole year. Pity all I can do is lie here and groan!

Oh, the amazing thing this week is that she's finally started napping properly at nursery: 45 mins in the morning and well over an hour in the afternoon. This means we might actually be able to do something occasionally at the weekend rather than trying to protect her afternoon naps. Hurrah! it clearly won't last though

Meggymoodle Thu 15-Mar-12 12:47:42

Weeeellll ladies - I tried one nap yesterday. It was hard keeping her up until 1145 from a 5.30am wake up but we managed it. She did 90 mins until 1.15. I put her to bed at 6.15pm as she was hanging and she slept through until 6.15am!!!!!!!!!!!

I've tried it today and she's woken way too early from her nap so she'll be totally zonked by this evening which'll mean early waking from being overtired sad How do you ever win in this game?

Anyway, just to say, we cured ours for a bit with a later shorter morning nap and then we went right back to 5.15 or whatever after about 2 weeks (but my what a blissful 2 weeks they were). My guess is that they are just hard-wired for early mornings sad

And FWIW I've found that CC doesn't work with early mornings - they just cry more and more and more until it's getting up time anyway. I think once they've had 10 hours or however much you've pretty much had your lot.

LittleMilla Thu 15-Mar-12 13:02:39

Meggy my DH was talking to someone last night who said that longer sleeps only really happen once they're on one nap. My DS is only 10 mo though, so worried I am going to have to wait a bit longer!

He was livid about going down this am though, so perhaps he IS ready to start shifting to one? Hmmm, another thing to ponder I guess!

It always feels so wrong to wake him from naps. And I know that early mornings are more wrong grin, but I find it hard to get my head round waking a sleeping baby. Perhaps it's cause I love sleep so much!

vix206 Thu 15-Mar-12 13:23:04

Don't want to pee on anyone's parade but I've a walking, talking almost 19 month old on 1 nap and his sleep was better at 15 months than it is now. Our problem has always been battling overtiredness.

ebmummy Thu 15-Mar-12 13:53:25

Ok, am trying this limiting daytime nap, and haven't really seen any difference. Granted its only been a few days...

DS woke at 5am this morning, but just shut the door and turned the monitor off (and stuck a pillow over my head), and then woke up at 6am. The only time he's EVER slept till 7am is when we all had the gastro bug.

Re CC-I find it works for day naps (have shifted his afternoon nap from 2.30 to 1.30), but DEFINITELY doesn't work in the mornings.

Meggymoodle Thu 15-Mar-12 20:21:50

Yeah vix I'm afraid that I know quite a few people with early waking 3 year olds sad I'm just trying not to depress myself royally by imagining that mine will be one.....

LittleMilla Thu 15-Mar-12 20:38:35

Vix & Meggy I am telling myself that once he's bigger I can use a gro clock and that will be that answer to ALL of my prayers. grin

However, realistically I know that he's my husband's son which means he's full of beans and hates to miss a thing. So something tells me that he's never going to be one to just roll over (hollow laugh).

Let's all tell ourselves that this high-energy/willfull children will grow up to be hugely successful in whatever they choose to be! smile

vix206 Fri 16-Mar-12 05:55:56

LittleMilla I have said clock arriving today smile

LittleMilla Fri 16-Mar-12 08:14:12

Can you say that it's amazing, regardless? Therefore not bursting my fragile bubble that it'll be the magic bullet should this continue wink.

Saying that, DS didn't wake up until 6:10am today. Which is pretty bloody good so I mustn't grumble. Just hate the fact I wake up c.5:30am in 'anticipation'...angry

Meggymoodle Fri 16-Mar-12 13:09:56

LittleMilla - I use a groclock with DS (who is 3 but was somewhere around just over 2 when we started using it). It does work but you will need to give it a couple of days for the concept to sink in. I never really knew how well it worked until I dossed in with DS once when we had people staying over. He didn't know I was in there. I heard him wake at 6am and he chatted really quietly to himself until the sun came up on his clock whereupon he leapt out of bed like a shot. I was amazed.

I fear that DD is too young for that yet at 15 months. That said - she woke up at 6.10 too today having only had one nap yesterday again. I'm trying the same today and praying it's not a fluke having had 2 mornings after 6am. And yes, I'm still waking at 5.30 ready for the day.... yawn......

Good luck with the clock vix

ebmummy good job on the pillow over the head ignoring - I can never manage it.

vix206 Fri 16-Mar-12 18:31:21

If I've nothing good to say about gro clock I promise I'll keep quiet smile

ebmummy Fri 16-Mar-12 18:45:32

ok, well have been trying Omama's method of a short 30 min morning nap at 9.30 am (after a pre-6 wake up), and a longer 1.5 hr afternoon nap at 1.30pm (till 3pm), and he's been better but no cigar as yet. Maybe have to persevere for a few more weeks..

vix206 Sat 17-Mar-12 05:46:32

Good morning. It's been scream city since 5.30 here. Not going in until 6 though angry

fififrog Sat 17-Mar-12 10:51:57

Bonjour. No fab news here I'm afraid though overjoyed to hear of meg's success! DD has nearly been on one nap 2 days in a row because coincidentally she has only had 10-15 min catnaps in th morning but she's still woken early.

I too woke up before her today at 5.10, she woke 5.15 but might have dozed off again for a bit. I certainly did, woke again at 5.50 but DH reckon he heard her thrashing her teddy around at 5.40...

Today is a mess, visiting friends after swimming this pm so giving her a longish one now so she makes it through swimming and hopefully will cope with just a snooze in the car this pm!

Meggymoodle Sat 17-Mar-12 12:03:26

Hi there,

I would be coming in to gloat again - 6.23am following a one-nap day yesterday - except the rest night was total wash out. She cried out periodically between 11am and 2am and then DS - bless him - got up to tell me at 2.55am that his groclock was yellow. WHAT???? Scrap all the positives I've said about it - it was indeed yellow at 2.55am!!! I can only assume that that was woke him up. He was then up, for some inexplicable reason, for 2 HOURS. DD then cried out at 5.30 but went back to sleep for nearly an hour.

I'm knackered and going back to bed as DH has taken DS out of my way so I don't kill him and DD is sleeping. I'm praying she does longer than 45 mins which she sometimes achieves sad

frog from my limited week's experience, it didn't make any difference if she only had 10 mins at 10am, she still woke early. It was only on the days she had nothing around the 10am mark that she went through till later. We had to put her down majorly early though around 6.15pm which made me nervous the first day.

We have to do a cat nap at 10am tomorrow though as we have church and she'll never make it through until 12 without. So, Monday will be up again at 5am and we start again.....YAWN.

Meggymoodle Mon 19-Mar-12 13:18:59

Oh well, that last all of a week then. Back to 0540 this morning regardless of only one nap yesterday. I could weep. sad

fififrog Mon 19-Mar-12 15:29:36

Ah meggy take heart, you know these things are not linear! It's great she managed a whole week! This one seems to have a new cough. Again. And has been refusing afternoon naps. Might try her out on one nap, might wait til clocks change so it's not so long til lunchtime on the first day... Clutches at straws...

Meggymoodle Mon 19-Mar-12 18:38:58

Oooh good idea re. the time change frog - why on earth didn't I think of that! How old is your LO?

My terror DD was back to two naps today as she was up so early, so she'll be up again at 5ish tomorrow am. Boo hoo.

We've had a constant cough here since September - always seems the way..... roll on spring proper!

LittleMilla Mon 19-Mar-12 19:57:08

Just catching up on everyone's woes. We've been away for the weekend and DS has been up and down. He only had one nap yesterday and was up at 5:20am, so clearly massively over-tired - not going to try that again in a hurry! Full of cold today and due to car journey and stupidly early start, a couple of decent kips. Praying for a 6am+ as I am working tomorrow and won't be able to go back to bed with him in the morning!

He's also got a gooey eye (as well as being completely bunged up) so will be staggered if he makes it through the night.

Ahhh, clocks chaging. NEVER did I think I would actually be pleased about losing an hour...if only to make our hellish mornings slightly shorter!

emmyloo2 Tue 20-Mar-12 04:00:51

I am joining this thread! I have a 16 month old who has taken to waking anywhere between 4am and 7am, but more and more it is around 4-5am. This morning was 4.10am. Brutal.

Does anyone find a bottle of milk works? My DS wakes up asking for his bottle and then grabs it out of our hands when we give it to him. He then went back to sleep this morning at 4.45am until 7.30am. Nice for him, but I get up at 5.30am to go for a run before work so no sleep in for me.

I fear the bottle becomes a habit and is encouraging the early waking but otherwise I don't think we would get him back to sleep. And with him, it seems to be the odd morning, and then the next morning he will sleep until 6.30am. I can't figure it out. It seems random.

He has one sleep from about 1pm to 3pm.

CC works for him when he goes to sleep at 7pm at night - we went through that and came out the other side with a much better bedtime situation. It's just the early mornings. CC WILL NOT work in anyway at 4am despite our sleep consultant telling us to try it. I know my son and he just wants company and a chat. He is happy as larry and just sits there and talks and talks. drinks his bottle and then he goes back into his cot and goes back to sleep.

I am hoping it's a phase....and yes I am in bed by 9pm every night. On Saturday night my husband and I were both in bed by 8.45pm!!!! on a Saturday!!!

LexieSinclair Tue 20-Mar-12 06:27:18

Hi there, can I join this thread? I have an 18M DS who is always up by 5-5.30. Not as early as some, I know, but I'm shattered!
I have tried changing nap times, plenty of fresh air and exercise during the day etc but nothing works. The aim is always to get him up as quickly and quietly as possible before he wakes DD who is in reception and needs her sleep! (She has always been a very good sleeper, waking around 7-7.30 so DS has been a shock to the system!)

Can I join? Dd is 17 months and regularly wakes around 5am but ds is fucking 5 years old and usually gets up and makes as much noise as humanly possible and refuses to go downstairs alone cos hes scared about 530am. He has done this almost every bastard day since he was born.

Meggymoodle Tue 20-Mar-12 11:22:52

Hello everyone. So, we did well this morning....not.....0430!!!! What is that all about? Tried to settle her nicely for nearly an hour and a half and then left her to it. She was asleep 10 mins later and slept to 7.15 which means I can start my plan over again of only having one nap. Well...it was a nice week whilst it lasted.

FWIW Lexie - DS who is 3 and also needs his sleep, slept through the entire thing and at points it was v. noisy! He slept a full 12 hours. I can't believe how different my two children are.

vix206 Tue 20-Mar-12 20:08:00

I'm not gloating (it's probably a brief interlude of post 6am wake ups anyway) but since bringing bed time forward by half an hour DS has been waking at 6.30am and napping for 1 hr 40 during the day instead of a pathetic cat nap. This is the best we've had in 19 months so I'm enjoying it but not expecting it to last. He also lives his Gro clock and I do think it is helping, although not as much as the early bed times!

LittleMilla Tue 20-Mar-12 20:26:23

Vix - another line of enquiry opens up for me! DS actually refused bottle and pointed at his cot tonight, poor chap! So perhaps an earlier bedtime could work.

Think I'll wait until cold clears up so that I am have uniform 'test conditions'!

x

LittleMilla Wed 21-Mar-12 07:20:53

SOrry, monopolising this slightly. But, aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaargh!

First peep at 4am (!!!) and after enough squeaks and coughs to stop me getting back to sleep, he started to shout properly at 5:30am.

Birds were in full song by this point, but it was as if DS was up early enough to give them the fecking hymn sheets!!

I am tired, exhausted. Lost of sense of humour today and have a big interview to prepare for on Friday. All I want to do is sleep...

LittleMilla Thu 22-Mar-12 08:18:42

<whispers> 6:30pm-6:30am.

He was tired so I thought I'd try Vix's suggestion. Also full of cold and has a cough, so plenty of snuffling/coughing etc...but I heard him stirring at about 4am. Was obviously still early enough that he put himself back to sleep again.

Not expecting it to be repeated. But guess what time DS will be going down tonight...wink

Meggymoodle Thu 22-Mar-12 10:32:26

Well done guys on the early bed time late up - I'm envious. Mine worked for precisely one week and we are back to one nap, early bed, early up sad

Oh well, we'll keep on trying.

LittleMilla Thu 22-Mar-12 18:41:02

Meggy I am under no illusions that this will last - just foolishly rejoicing, ha!

Meggymoodle Thu 22-Mar-12 19:46:16

Milla - enjoy it while it lasts!! Fingers crossed for tonight.....

fififrog Sat 24-Mar-12 10:23:24

milla we had a near identical Wednesday night! DD is all over the shop at the moment. Monday was fairly nnormal, 1/2 hr in morning and for once i didn't have to wake her, Tuesday (nursery) 3 naps, Wed (nursery) 9.45-11.30 then nothing til early to bed at 6.30, slept til 6.10 - fab!!! But was utterly miserable in the evening so wouldn't want a repeat of that! Thursday was her birthday (can't believe she's one). Normal Thursday 5 mins in car 9.30 then near 2 hours after lunch. Friday quiet til 5.55, then she refused to have a nap, 10mins in pushchair at 11 then DH spent half an hour walking get around and eventually had 50mins at 2.30. This morning 5.37, just trying to decide whether to wake her now after 30mins, we have swimming at 12.30 then a 1 hour car journey.

Hmm who knows what's happening! Going to try one conventional nap from Monday (we have birthday party tomorrow so another messed up day!)

The two 6am days in a row was AMAZING!! Pity it didn't last...

LittleMilla Sat 24-Mar-12 17:56:10

DS been up <6am Friday and today. He's ill, so cannot really make head nor tail of anything. All I know is that it's MY turn to get up tomorrow so DH gets a lie-in, so he better pull out a goody!!

I think DS still needs the two sleeps TBH. But how I get him on to one when he's waking so fecking early is beyond me...he's usually bushed come 9:30am/10am?

One nappers out there - what's the longest you leave yours from wake up to sleepy time?

Meggymoodle Sat 24-Mar-12 21:19:30

Milla - we are trying with one nap at the moment and had a blinding first week and a crap second week. I am trusting that the change in clocks tonight will help us!

I usually leave her max 6 hours between wake up and sleep but I guess it also depends on how your DS is. My DD is nearly 16 months.

But whilst I thought we had triumphed when we put her onto one nap initially now she's back to early waking and still only having one nap. I think she might be getting overtired as well which is not helping things. ARGGGGGHHHH.

Just out of interest everyone- are all your early waking children incredibly active? DD is just the most ludicrously active child I have ever seen - she runs around the entire time and only sits still if forcibly restrained like in a high chair or buggy. DS who has slept brilliantly for most of his 3 years and never had early waking issues, is a lot more chilled out and quite happy to sit and read books or just sit. I get exhausted just watching DD!

fififrog Sat 24-Mar-12 21:46:03

I think it's really hard to know when they're ready to go to one nap. I've been wondering for about 2.5 months already. All I can say is that her daytime sleep behaviour has been getting more and more random, and given we are struggling to get her to have about 50% of her naps now, I think it might be worth trying the move to one. I'd say that contrary to the books, probably more than half the babies I know moved to one nap by 1yr and this is not correlated with presence/absence of disturbed night sleep.

Someone further up the page asked if anyone had tried milk to get back to sleep... Well, yes. We used to have waking anywhere between 4 and 5. I'd feed her and if she was lying next to me I'd usually get her back off for a bit but sleep would be v restless and often I'd feed her again 45-60mins later. It wasn't working reliably,!so I decided nonferding before 6am, as that's what I want to achieve. To be honest I think she is very hungry/thirsty by then but she still won't go back to sleep after a feed.

fififrog Sat 24-Mar-12 21:47:37

Nonferding??! I meant to type "no feeding"!

ledkr Sat 24-Mar-12 21:55:01

Can i join too? My dd is 14 months and seems to vary from 4-6am i so understand the frightened to stay up sentiment.Sky plus is my friend.I watch all my evening veiwing in the morning. I am so tired constantly,would love to take more exercise but am too tired and dd is fairly moany because of her early starts. She is usually in full whinge mode by 7.45 hmm
Dh and i do take it in turns to get up which really helps.

fififrog Sat 24-Mar-12 21:57:37

Ooh meggy must have been posting same time as you! DD is pretty active - she's certainly been pretty early to roll crawl and walk. But funnily enough I was asking my mum if she is like me, and mum said she's a lot calmer than I was and that I never sat still for one second an she could never put me down for a nap (I think they were all in the pushchair or on the sofa). Must be DH's influence. Still I'd rather be up for good at 5.30am than up for an hour at 3.30 or something hideous she says looking on the bright side of the hideous early morning yawnfest

vix206 Sun 25-Mar-12 08:44:58

LittleMilla, the rule I'm using for time between waking from nap to bed time is 5 hours. I am sticking to it religiously because otherwise DS gets overtired and wakes up really early. So no matter what time he wakes from his one nap, he is in bed 4.45 hrs later with the hope he self settles within 15 mins. Almost always works out.

DS is nearly 19 months and tbh it's only the past 2 weeks he's finally settled happily into a one nap schedule. We had 3 months of muddling through and winging it. I feel like he's finally got into a good pattern of sleeping 7-6 then napping 12.30-2. I wake him after 1.5 hrs of napping otherwise he wakes too early next morning.

I don't know how much of the success is down to my tweaks and how much is due to him just 'getting it' (after 19 months of totally NOT getting it!!!!!) grin

Did everyone feel like they got a lie in this morning with the clocks changing? We didn't quite make it to 7am, DS woke a bit early today as I was a bit late with bedtime and it threw him off.

I'm not going to adjust his schedule to the new times I'm just shifting it all ahead by an hour so it'll be 8-7 sleep and 1.30-3 nap. That's the plan anyway we shall see.

ledkr Sun 25-Mar-12 15:52:28

We were up at 5.30 old money (cant take new time seriously the first night) She has been sweet though but its now nearly 4 and i have no energy whatsoevr as i feel its now the evening.
Am hoping 5.30 will become 6.30 tomorrow.

I have tweaked naps to kingdom come but i can conclude it makes no difference to her relentless early wakes. Just have to be greatfull for the full nights sleep i guess.
I went for a pushchair power walk at 8 which was really nice.

LittleMilla Mon 26-Mar-12 08:28:27

What an absolute pleasure to have a child that wakes up c.7am!?!?! I know it's not 'real' but I am certainly going to stick to old timings for as long as poss if this is how it pans out!

xx

fififrog Mon 26-Mar-12 19:28:42

Well DD woke at 4.55 old money this morning (kept her on GMT yesterday as we had a party to go to and it worked better that way). Still she was then pretty quiet for another 45 but I don't know if she slept. Tried her on one nap today, it was ok but I hadn't give her lunch at 11, which was of course 10 by her tum! And it was a struggle to make it to midday. So I think she's not really ready for one nap yet :-( also teething and generally grumpy. Put her to bed on BST she seemed knackered anyway but kicked up an almighty fuss... Sigh.

LittleMilla Mon 26-Mar-12 19:47:27

Meant to add earlier about general ants-in-pants-siness. My Ds is a complete fidget and never been one of those angelic babies that are just happy to sit in their pushchair when stationary. Even on a bus DS wants to be out, wriggling, trying to push the bell, pick off labels etc etc. Never stops. Just taken his first steps (V.PROUD MUMMY!!) and is already trying to run hmm.

Back to sleepy stuff though. I have stuck to normal routine +1 hour. And he's currently battling to go off - frst bedtime tears we've had in a while.

Meggymoodle Wed 28-Mar-12 12:56:29

Hi ladies - how's it all going? Not sure where we are really. We did OK for the first few nights with the clock change but we were back to 5.45 this morning - for both my children!! What's that about? They are now both fast asleep as DS (3) has his first swimming lesson today and I was worried he would sink and drown if he went tired. This may come back and bite me later as I'm giving him an hour, which is a lot for him these days (although he is a total nightmare to wake sad)

DD is still on one nap - but she would merrily fall asleep at 10am if I let her - I guess part of it is just habit. She only slept for just over an hour yesterday which is not enough so we had early bed which may have been the reason for the EW - as she did just over 11 hours so can't really complain. I slept like a bag of pooh though - only managed just over 4 hours and I'm hanging today. Just sat down for 5 mins now and feel like I could go to sleep for ever sad

Anyway, onwards and upwards - off to the pool in a min. Enjoy the sun everyone.

LittleMilla Wed 28-Mar-12 14:25:03

We are creeping earlier too, although today was 6:45am...which by this thread's standards is a lie in!

Prob is that he really just seems to sleep for 11 and bit hours. So last night he was asleep at 7:15pm. Although his post-lunch nap is a bit later today, so I think he'll be up until 7:30pm. I don't mind - happy to put him to bed a touch later if it means he'll sleep in for longer! Just before the clocks changed this was never a sure-bet!

Meggy sorry to hear you're feeling wiped. I am contemplating a second baby (I know, I need my bumps read) and I just don't know how i'll do it if I have another one that isn't that fond of sleeping!

Meggymoodle Wed 28-Mar-12 18:23:23

Milla - you might have a brilliant sleeper. DS was amazing right from the beginning. DD was a nightmare from the beginning - you just can't tell! It's nice having 2 though, even though very tiring - they are incredibly sweet together a lot of the time. I don't suppose it'll last but there we go!

fififrog Wed 28-Mar-12 21:01:26

Milla do our babies communicate by telepathy? We also had a 7.15-6.40 (ok so you got 5 mins more!) I cannot remember the last time she slept that long - well ok I can but she was ill. Incredible to have a lie in. Both yesterday and today she has had 2x40min naps at nursery so let's see if she can manage a repeat performance - though she fell asleep a bit quicker, by 7, today. I really hope so as I've contracted some evil pukey bug and could do without an early start. At least I know she can sleep that long if she is so inclined.

I have decided that I honestly don't think messing with the naps makes any difference. I think it's best she gets what daytime sleep she thinks she needs. It seems to work fine on nursery days and they don't try to "program" her at all. meggy do you still feel moving to one nap helped? I would honestly rather DD had two naps than try to cajole her through to after lunch and eat at weird times just now.

fififrog Thu 29-Mar-12 09:36:38

Ugh 5.30 again, whinged off and on til 6, BF then cries for a solid half hour before passing out again for half an hour. What was that about??!

LittleMilla Thu 29-Mar-12 09:56:58

Fifi grin. DS slept until 6:30am (ish) this morning, went to bed/sleep at 7:30pm last night.

DS needs c.11 hours sleep, the end. I too don't believe that fiddling around with his naps will do munch...they're so close to moving to one nap, it almost feels futile. He's up for a few hours before having another nap anyway and sometimes he'll sleep for 40 mins (yesterday) and other times he'll do 1.5 hours.

My main prob with waking him from am nap is that there's NO guarantee he'll then sleep for 1.5 hours after lunch. I do believe that some babies are born better nappers and in our case, it took him to 6 months old before he'd do longer than 40 mins! So I am loathe to ever wake him TBH!!

Ah, we'll get there.

In the meantime, DS is going to be 1 on 5th May and I am tempted to organise a MN sleepover for him and his naughty fellow early wakers!! wink

Meggymoodle Fri 30-Mar-12 12:03:31

Frog - re. does one nap help - honestly? I have no idea. She did amazingly the night before last - 6.45pm to 6.30am and then last night woke at 4.30am and didn't go back to sleep until 6.15 so who knows? I have to say though since moving to one nap we've had a 6 on the clock more often that we had before so I don't know but I think it's helped a bit.

All I know is that I felt unnatural stirrings of a need to fling the wretched child out of the window at 5 this morning sad

We are going away for a week now staying with friends and then a family gathering (in-laws - what joy) so I'll have to grab her quick if she starts screaming at 5 in the morning which will get her back into her bad ways.

Boooooooo

Hope you're all doing well - sounds like a great idea for the sleep over - bags not do the morning shift!

leebitton Sat 31-Mar-12 07:40:11

hello
This is my first post and i hope you don't mind me posting!
Both mine have been early wakers, with DS1 limiting his morning nap really helped 'cure' it! smile Well, gave us post 6am starts. That was from about 9mo.
DS2 is a different story sad I have limited his mn to 10 mins and allow him as long as he wants around 12.30 - STILL have 5.45 nearly everymorning.... He's 9 months old. Boohoo!
I know it will get better though. DS1 now sleeps till at least 6.3 every morning.
I just hate waking and seeing 5(something) on the clock!!!

fififrog Sat 31-Mar-12 21:08:41

Welcome Lee! It's my turn to feel moderately fraudulent as we've now had 3 post-6am starts this week. I actually think it might be vix's tactic of earlier bedtime, as a result of the clock change. We couldn't really have managed it without the clocks or we would have been getting her to sleep by 6pm only getting home from work at 5pm - just impossible, dinner and BF alone take about 45mins! Her naps are still totally random and uncorrelated with earlier/later mornings. But we are now trying to get her to bed by 6.45 and she is usually sleeping for getting on for 11.5hrs this week. I do have to keep reminding myself this could just be a nice blip!

milla our dc's do sound very similar, we also have only had longer naps after about 9mo - I had spent the previous two months shushing or even rocking her back to sleep after 30mins every single nap even if it took 20mins. She finally just sorted herself out in December, and at 10months then started sleeping through* properly. I think these things just take their own sweet time!

*where sleeping through = making it past 4.30

vix206 Sun 08-Apr-12 13:40:26

How is everyone getting on? DS started going to a childminder last week do his sleep has become a bit disrupted. We had a couple of 5am starts and he's struggling to sleep to 6am even in good mornings.

fififrog Mon 09-Apr-12 21:16:01

Hi Vix been away a few days and TBH she hasn' slept great. We'v had to share a room and she's been waking with a cough. I then try not to breathe in case i keep her awake... DH snoring like a train also for some reason. Not much sleep for me! Mornings have been anywhere between 5 and 6. The esrly nights and long sleeps are a thing of the past sgain. I think body clock adjusting combined with a very tired week for some reason. She is definitely beginning to drop to one nap, if she has the morning one too late or too long she won't do the afternoon one. I am going to take a couple of days off this week and let her find her routine, then we'll see how hard I have to push her to get her to go til after morning activities and lunch!

Hope others are faring better... If people don't come back to whinge does that mean they are now sound asleep til 7?

vix206 Tue 10-Apr-12 19:44:39

Ah 7am starts, the stuff of dreams!

LittleMilla Tue 10-Apr-12 20:14:47

Nope! Reasons for going quiet are: 1. we are getting used to 6am now it's light (WTF!?!?!?!). And 2: putting him to be at 7:30pm to ensure he sleeps until 6 ish.

Supper just coming, will post again later...x

ebmummy Tue 10-Apr-12 20:29:10

Have been following this thread for some time. And unfortunately am in the same boat as a lot of you-DS sleeps 7pm-5.30 (on a really good day), and there is nothing working with the early wakings. He's having 2 naps during the day (9.30-10 and 1/1.30-2.30). I have noticed though, on the days when he only has 1 nap (usually the morning), and won't nap in the afternoon (if we have people over and the house is noisy), he sleeps much better at night. I do want to move towards 1 nap as I'm aware he may be having too much daytime sleep, but he's so whingy and moany at the moment that I actually look forward to naptimes with some anticipation!

fififrog Tue 10-Apr-12 21:32:36

eb ditto. I think we just have to suck it up a few more weeks til they're properly ready to drop to one... And then pray it means they start sleeping in! DD is quite unsettled at the moment, a fair bit of coughing so probably just the next blasted virus. I have found little evidence that the day's naps affect the night's sleep, but am hoping that move to one nap may just coincide with a new phase and that that new phase will be a later waking one.

phdlife Tue 10-Apr-12 22:41:59

Can I join this thread?

My dd is 3 tomorrow and has always woken for early-morning bf. I spent January trying to knock the 3am feed on it's head, after a great deal of shouting/sobbing/fighting got to 4am, February she pushed it back, March I gave in and she slid back to 4, but then also added bfs at 5 and 6.

Now she's waking at 4am and throwing great big strops that wake her fully up (grr frickin terrible 3's!!!!) eg. after waking this morning, feeding, then groping my cleavage (her comfort object) for twenty mins, she suddenly heaved herself upright, looked around, then hurled herself down towards the foot of the bed sobbing, "nobody loves me!" shock angry

Yesterday we got back to sleep at 6am after being awake for 2hrs but not today and not the day before that. It's her temperament that's doing it, not her morning naps, so I'm guessing I'm in for it until she outgrows her shouty default.

fififrog Wed 11-Apr-12 20:59:45

OMG phd you poor thing... 3 years and still not sleeping through you must be shattered. I can't even begin to imagine. I hope she has a lovely birthday though smile

fififrog Thu 12-Apr-12 21:00:48

Yes yes yes 6am two nights ago, 6.10 yesterday! Now if she could manage to avoid the brief wake and cry at 5am we'd be sorted... Assuming of course this continues but it probably won't...

Meggymoodle Tue 17-Apr-12 08:13:09

Hi ladies - how're you doing?

We're still struggling with early mornings and the 1 nap/2 nap connundrum and then last night I had DS (3) up at 1.30 saying he wasn't tired. I gave him exceedingly short shrift and he was back asleep in 5 mins but it took me over 2 hours to get back to sleep - arrrggghhh and then I had DD up at 5.45 as usual....

Soooooooo frustrating.

phd I know it's very easy to say "if it were me" when I'm not in your situation but I think if it were DS doing this I would be withdrawing any privileges (e.g. television) until it stopped or having a treat when he did well. We did it with the groclock that if he got 10 mornings with the yellow sun before getting out of bed we went for a trip to the aquarium. Mind you, I'm guessing I may have to eat my words when DD gets to that age as she's a totally different temperament hmm

oh dear, this thread has depressed me! I have a 8 month old who wakes between 5.15 and 5.45, mostly 5.30. Today he teased me with 6.10 which was amazing but that was after waking me at 4.30 to cry for 5 mins. Guess there are no magic answers which is what I was here looking for! Best start to get ready for bed then sad

LittleMilla Thu 19-Apr-12 20:53:04

After a few weeks off this thread, I am now firmly back on. Got in to a relative groove of 6:15/6:30am which was bearable.

He's now doing a dramatic shout at about 5am hmm and then wakes up properly at about 5:45am. Been like this for the last few days. And lo and behold, having checked the wonder weeks book, he's just starting another fecking one.

A friend joked that with all of these dramatic 'wonder weeks' he was going to be one exceptional little boy!! Ha.

DH reckons he's cold, so he's back in his uber thick sleeping bag tonight. Early waking is also coinciding with him refusing 1 or 2 bottles, which we've never had before.

So back to me being bloody shattered and then over-analysing every stage of the day.

JOYOUS.

fififrog Fri 20-Apr-12 20:54:36

Oh, here and there. Last week was decent, about 50% made it til 6am near enough. Though she is now entering nap-dropping hell so daytime sleep is literally anywhere (from 2 1hr naps to one 20 min nap to an hour at 3.30pm...) She's been shattered but I've struggled with work to get her to bed early enough and she's been a nightmare to settle. Today I timed I spot on it seems, 6.30 to bed on the dot and she was asleep within a minute. However I'm off to bed as between her unsettled night (OT combined with teething I suppose) and DH having a tummy bug (again!!!) I didn't exactly sleep well. For once I went to get her at 5.45 this morn as I Couldn't take any more wailing (she woke for good at 5.15) and she started immediately screaming and signing for milk. Guess she was hungry then...

vix206 Sat 21-Apr-12 05:49:38

I'm back again. We've reverted to 5-5.15 am and on Thursday morning he woke at 3.45 and refused to go back to sleep. Then had 1 measly hour at midday. I know he's overtired so he's had really early nights 6pm since then but it's not working this time. He's also acting out horribly all day so I'm a tired, at-the-end-of-my-tether mummy right now. With child free friends to entertain this weekend sad

Thatisnotitatall Sat 21-Apr-12 06:03:08

Hello everyone! Saw this in active so came over for a chat! All my 3 (age 6, 4, and very nearly 1) are early risers, but they are getting better - after being up with first dd then ds every day from 5am for about 5 years, the older 2 are now relatively well trained now not to come out of their rooms til they hear an adult moving around, and the 6 yo is finally starting to sleep longer (though she gets up the moment she wakes as she hates to miss anything and my 4 yo can usually be heard playing in his room any time from 5am on).

My 1 yo's default wake up appears to be fixed at 5.47am on the dot, which I realise you ladies on here will not think is early - it is at least 45 mins later than his older brother and sister got up at his age - but then again his night time sleep is worse, we were averaging 5 to 7 wake ups a night til I night weaned a couple of weeks ago, last night we achieved the rare miracle of just one wake up (he has never slept through and despite no more milk at night he is still waking 3 or so times most nights).

Anyone else share the red mist reaction when you hear mums whose kids usually sleep til 8am moan that their child woke them at 6am and refer to it as a night waking, and complain that the baby went back to sleep but they couldn't get back off! That's not a night waking that's a lie in! wink

Thatisnotitatall Sat 21-Apr-12 06:07:32

Vix I'm late to the party, how old is your DC? My youngest doesn't nap well either - sleeps in his cot at night but won't in the day, only on me or in the car or occasionally buggy (but more often he cries in the buggy if he's tired and I'm not tough minded enough to push him along howling for half an hour so I get him out and scupper my chances of him sleeping!)

Thatisnotitatall Sat 21-Apr-12 06:09:06

All my kids have been up for an hour, have had breakfast and are currently trashing the living room around me... I knew I shouldn't have made that paddling pool into a ball pool in here, there are balls everywhere! The younger 2 love it though...

vix206 Sat 21-Apr-12 06:48:45

Hi! Ds is almost 20 months. Naps quite well most days but just reverts to bad naps and early starts all the time. Always just as we think we've sussed it!

I have friends who moan about anything before 8. They tell me they wouldn't stand for it. Makes me mad, short of soundproofing my DS's room he gives us no choice in the matter!

woollyjo Sat 21-Apr-12 06:58:39

checking in, just as we managed to bribe convince dd1 to stay in bed before 6am DD3 came along and wakes at 5.01am most mornings (now almost 2) she gave me a sleep in this morning until 5:20 am yay!

It would be nice if she had some (any) volume control as I find it hard to stop her waking the whole household.

Meggymoodle Sat 21-Apr-12 07:16:53

Hi ladies - we're back to 0517 this morning which is a veritable lie-in for some of you, I know. We had got to the heady heights of 0548 for a good few mornings.

Ah well, I'm beginning to think I have to just get used to it.

She took ages to settle last night as well as my parents were here and she thought she was missing something so we're going to have to do 2 naps again today sad and tomorrow because of church. Right bummer. Oh well, there we go. You'd think my parents would've stayed over and given us both a lie-in wouldn't you - selfish people.

fififrog Sat 21-Apr-12 13:50:54

It occurs to me yesterday would have been perfect if shifted by an hour. 1.5hr nap at 11.30, asleep at 18.30, woke at 5.25. Now if it was an hour later I'd have called that spot on! Sigh. I am already dreading the clocks going back!!

Today she fell asleep in the pushchair at 9.30 so a two nap day. Luckily she agreed to the second without any fuss, probably because tired after swimming. Just have to hope she stays asleep a while...

fififrog Sat 21-Apr-12 13:53:58

PS Thatis yes I can't think of anything that p's me off more than the lucky mums who have sleepy babies. What exactly do they expect you to do? Ignore a screaming child for 3 hours??

vix206 Sun 22-Apr-12 08:07:28

Well I've had 2 hours sleep. We have friends over so were daring and went out for dinner. Put DS to bed at 6.45 and my friend babysat. I went to bed at 11, woke at 1 feeling poorly and never went back to sleep. Then DS piped up at 4.15 and it was non stop feeding for 3 HOURS!! At 20 months this is taking the p I think. Feeling very sorry for myself. DH and guests all tucked up asleep and I'm sat here with DS feeling very gloomy indeed envy

Thatisnotitatall Sun 22-Apr-12 11:15:52

Sorry to hear that Vix - are you against night weaning? My DC3 will be 1 on Thursday and I night weaned him starting 2 weeks ago - the first few nights were hard but he doesn't look for milk at night any more (though he still wakes, occasionally just once a night, usually averages 3 wake ups) but at least no mammoth feeding sessions and no longer waking 5-7 times a night!

Any chance of a nap in the day for you?

vix206 Sun 22-Apr-12 17:15:33

DS was night weaned at 7 months. He only feeds twice per day, usually 7am and 6pm. But these past few mornings he's woken so early I haven't been able to hold him off as we've had house guests and he just screams until I feed him. Really hoping for a better morning tmrw. I'm putting him to bed at 6 as he had a measly hour at lunch time nap, and I'm going to bed at 7!

fififrog Sun 22-Apr-12 18:33:00

Ah what I would have given for an hour! I think DD had about 40mins - I went in at 45 and she was playing with her mobile...

fififrog Sun 22-Apr-12 19:12:46

PS Vix didn't mean to sound unsympathetic, your night sounds hellish. Hope you got DS to sleep Ok and have a decent night tonight!

vix206 Sun 22-Apr-12 19:12:57

Yes but an hour after being up at 4.15 was nowhere near enough unfortunately. He's absolutely ot now and I just hope putting him to bed at 6 will help tonight smile

vix206 Sun 22-Apr-12 19:14:23

Lol cross posts! Well I'm in bed already planning to try to sleep at 7.30 so bring on the early morning I say!! Hope everyone has a better morning tmrw!

Meggymoodle Mon 23-Apr-12 12:07:39

Bleurgh, your nights all sound hideous. Our nights so far have been OK - she's woken but gone back to sleep with a pat or two - but still up ludicrously early. I am hanging on by a thread when I go away at the weekend - just me and my friend. HOOOORAHHH I cannot wait.

I have not weaned DD but she's 17 months and she'll just have to cope without boobs at bedtime and in the morning. Does that sound horrendously callous? I can't see any other way round it, she won't take a bottled and she won't drink anything other than milk. My MIL is coming to help DH so I'm sure they'll be fine. And anyway, if they're not, it's only one night. grin

greeneone12 Mon 23-Apr-12 13:15:25

Meggy hello! How are you?! We have been bleary eyes for several months as we have an early waker. Some days she seems to last from 1pm after waking at 5am. Where does she get the energy?!! Hugs to you all smile

Meggymoodle Mon 23-Apr-12 13:34:18

greenone!! hello!! Wondered how everyone from our "6-month not sleeping" or whatever thread it was nearly a year ago (yikes!!) was! Yes, we started getting through the night quite nicely only to be woken exceptionally early in the morning for the last year or so. YAWN!

Good to see you again. Are you joining our early waking moan thread then?

fififrog Mon 23-Apr-12 21:32:06

Hi greenone welcome to morning moans. Incredibly, DD actually slept 6.15-6.00 last night. Pity about the 10min whinge at 04.50 (which then meant I didn't sleep again... DH just snored on through...) Gosh am I sounding like Thatis's smug mummies? Sorry those of you with regular pre-5 wakeups.

DD asleep tonight since 6.20 but had a v decent 1.5th nap this lunchtime so will be "interesting" to see if she wakes earlier tomorrow.

I need to reread from the beginning of the thread... My perception is that things have improved for us in the last few weeks. If she starts regularly making it to six I will be happy (and have to evict myself from my own thread). I may still strangle my colleague who says "yes my daughter still wAkes really early - about 5.30 - but then after some milk goes back to sleep til about 8 or 9"!!!!!!!

sheeplikessleep Tue 24-Apr-12 09:16:12

Can I join?
DS2 is 2 years and 1 month and since 10 months old, wakes up at 5am/5.30am every day. I'm starting to doubt I'll ever wake to a '6' something on the clock again ...

vix206 Tue 24-Apr-12 12:52:26

4.55 for us this morning but I let him whinge in his cot until 6.... Mean mummy! He wasn't crying, just making the odd disgruntled shout!

vix206 Tue 24-Apr-12 12:53:03

Ps welcome sheep!! grin

sheeplikessleep Tue 24-Apr-12 13:25:30

Thanks Vix, it's reassuring to know I'm not alone!

How do other DHs / partners react to the early waking? DH and I are at loggerheads a bit, as I think he feels quite frustrated that we should do something practical to 'solve' it. We are arguing more because we're both tired and I've put on half a stone I'm sure in the last 18 months because of my constant need for sugar! He is great though, and we do get up on alternate days.

DS2 has now worked out that if he shouts out 'MAMA!!!!' at the top of his voice over and over, one of us goes in.

Thatisnotitatall Tue 24-Apr-12 13:38:54

Didn't actually get up for the day til 6.45, but before anyone flames me this is because I had been up more times than I cared to count in the night (don't think I had a full sleep cycle, probably up hourly at least but don't let myself look at the clock on nights like this as I end up wanting to bang my head against a wall) to DC3 (plus once to DC2) and had been up with him from 5am and managed to re-settle him at 5.45am - DC1 is meant to catch the school bus at 7am so I missed it and had to drive her, but luckily everyone got where they needed to be in time.

Sheep my DH has managed to only ever do one night duty with a baby - DC1 when she was 9 months old (she is now 6), somehow I do all night wakings and all get ups before about 6.30am (it started like this because of breast feeding and continued because I am mostly a SAHM...). So one of the weekend mornings each week I just bring DC3 into our room whenever he wakes for the day, where he absolutely does not snuggle down in bed but hares around jumping on us, having to be saved from falling off the bed and rescued from under it etc. til DH is thoroughly awake and takes him and whichever of the older 2 have emerged by then too downstairs, and I go back to sleep.

Thatisnotitatall Tue 24-Apr-12 13:46:09

Meant to say I have also put one weight/ failed to lose the baby weight due to compensating for sleep deprivation with sugar - its a slippery and dangerous slope now I am rationing DC3 to 3 BFs a day and none at night! Its all very well knowing you shouldn't do it, but I defy anyone to cope with long term sleep deprivation of very interrupted nights and early mornings without compensating in some not entirely healthy way!

My DH gets up at 5.45am for work anyway (out the door within half an hour so no actual help) and sleeps though the night waking, so he is only affected by DS3s sleep if I moan about it or one morning a week at the weekend. All my kids are or have been early risers so the weekend alternate lie ins are long established now.

Meggymoodle Tue 24-Apr-12 14:02:00

Yuck - 5.30 again. One nap, two naps, seventeen naps, it makes no difference. Today was the first morning she didn't have a breastfeed, ever in her life...... this could be the beginning of the end. I laid on her floor (we have a couple of duvets in her room for the purpose) at 5.30 to see if she'd go quiet, sometimes she does (not today) but she was having none of it and I totally couldn't be bothered this morning so I put her lamp on and gave her books in her cot. DH came and hauled her out at 6.30 and she never even looked for the boobs.

She's coming up 17 months so I may soon be free. I have no illusions that it will make absolutely no difference to the time she wakes though sad

fififrog Tue 24-Apr-12 22:02:51

Yeah, not evicting myself yet. Don't know how many times she woke last night but at least 3 and one was for about 45 mins. DH slept through that one. Then up for the day 5.19 - her old favourite time. Ignored til 5.58. I suspect she might actually have woken earlier though as despite 2 naps at nursery today she was hysterical this eve, flailing all over the cot. Didn't even bother trying to see if she'd settle herself, but she did end up asleep in five minutes of hysteria when I sat next to her. So asleep at 6.30. Why oh why is she so knackered at the moment?

Sheep my DH's preferred tactic has always been "just ignore her", and he has now trained himself to sleep through her. So I now lie ther awake listening to him sleeping and her whimpering...

kf1979 Wed 25-Apr-12 02:50:43

I think I belong here too. sad

My DS is 10 months old, has just about started occasionally sleeping through (yay!) but is waking around 5 every morning (boo). Prior to this he was sleeping 6.30 - 6.30 with one wake for milk in the night.

He usually goes down for a 1.5 hr nap at about 8.30-9 am, depending on how long I can keep him up, and another similar length kip starting any time between 2-3, although he often really fights this, flailing like a maniac and scooting round the cot.

He's then knackered by 6.30 and I struggle to keep him up beyond 7 at a push. He regularly seems overtired and wakes screaming throughout the early part of the night and needs settling but seems to do a bit better 12-5. I just wish we could push back his wake time a bit.

Writing this down I realise it doesn't seem as bad as some of you lovely ladies are facing, but our home situation is a bit fraught right now (we live overseas, I've been quite depressed, DH's job in a very stressful period) and a decent sleep would make all the world of difference to us all!

This nap limiting idea, is it limit the am nap to an hour then let them sleep what they want in the afternoon? Might give it a bash.

Anyway, helps to vent here as I seem surrounded by smug 'my little darling sleeps 7-7 and has done since 3 days old' types in RL!

Here's wishing us all a lie in very soon, and in the meantime lots of bloody strong brew

Iwantcandy Wed 25-Apr-12 03:33:05

Can I join? D's sleep is beyond a joke! Usually 4 or 5 am wake up. But 3.15!! Ouch!

Tertius Wed 25-Apr-12 06:26:09

Morning all - my 8 month old got up at five am today - after multiple wakeups. Seems she is dropping her night to 11 hours total not 12 so something going on there. Anyway, hoping not to join this thread but just to pop by and say my son, who is now 3, woke at 6 ish til he was one, then 5ish... And the only thing that cracked it was a later nap and bedtime as he never slept more than 10 hours. But hurray there is hope. Once he dropped all naps he added them to his night and if the room is dark and he has had enough exercise he now sleeps 11 hours (8pm to 7am)... Heaven!

And now it all starts again with number 2.... Eeek

Thatisnotitatall Wed 25-Apr-12 06:28:20

Well for only the 3rd time in his life, dc3 (who will be 1 tomorrow) slept for 8 straight hours without a wake up ... but not so fortunately the 8 hours ended at 4am and he has been awake ever since, though I spent a solid hour and a half trying before it got too late for there to be any point.

Iwantcandy Wed 25-Apr-12 08:17:45

Oh. Anyone tried anything that did work? Ds is 7.5 months and the days he sleeps in til 5 are a real blessing

fififrog Wed 25-Apr-12 19:08:10

iwouldwantcandytoo if I had a 3.15 wakeup! From my perspective, which might give some of you hope and fill others with despair, we had some success dealing with unsettled earlymornings when she was waking about 4am by just ignoring her if she wasn't screaming the house down, and going in and sitting in silence if she was. We decides she does not leave the cot before 6am unless ill. That worked over the course if a couple of weeks to get her to 5.15 am reliably (she wakes earlier about once a month) but we have had no success getting beyond 5.15 other than if she chooses to sleep longer.

5.32 this morning. Not too bad. And no hysteria in the bath and settled quietly 15 mins ago, despite just one 50min nap at midday.

kf we did manage to deal with a previous period of 5ams (at about 7.5mo) by not letting her nap before 9am. I was finding everything was getting earlier and earlier. Nowadays though she's less systematic about her bedtimes and waketimes (eg how come she had more energy tonight to make it an extra 15mins and go to bed calmly?). You will find loads of posts on other threads by omama and loveisagirlsomethingorother who suggest the nap cutting should leave you with 30mins at 9.30am, then 2 hours after lunch. I tried this and concluded it made no difference, but it seemed to work for both of them in the end. I notice littlemilla hasn't been back here in a while, I think she was doing that. But then my DD will never sleep 2 hrs in the afternoon anyway...

Peaceful nights and lie ins to all!

woollyjo Wed 25-Apr-12 19:35:54

aaagh! I work 3 days a week and have to be up at 6am to get us all sorted and out of the house by 7:20am. So why did I have 2 sleeping girls at 6:30am this morning? they only do it when I have to go to work! tomorrow we'll be back to 5am

kf1979 Thu 26-Apr-12 01:18:42

Thanks fifi! I'll research a bit more as 5 am starts plus hideous developmental leap behaviour plus teething is shredding my nerves!

Iwantcandy Thu 26-Apr-12 03:41:49

Nooooooooo

I'm afraid I may have to join the club, both my DC are ill.

I haven't been to sleep yet <sob>

not that it's worth it now as I have to be in two hours <double sob>

vix206 Thu 26-Apr-12 05:47:22

I was up at 3.15 yesterday with ds, this morning 5. At 20 months a lot of my friends children are doing 12 hours and sleeping until 7am I know we mustn't compare but aaaaaaargh!!!!

vix206 Thu 26-Apr-12 05:49:57

Iwantcandy for me focussing on early nights helped for 2 weeks but now ds has become resistant to that and basically we are back to the normal standard of waking any time between 3 and 5 and napping 1 hour tops in the day.

Iwantcandy Thu 26-Apr-12 08:00:17

Question-I know some mners think an early morning nap makes early waking worse. What counts as an early nap and what counts as going back to sleep. Eg this morning Ds was up at half three ish. U gave him a bottle, put him back in his cot and sat with him and at 5.30 he went back to sleep til 7

vix206 Thu 26-Apr-12 21:15:09

For me that's not a first nap. That's going back to sleep after a long night waking. Anything before 4 is a night waking for me, although ds doesn't seem to think so....angry

fififrog Fri 27-Apr-12 19:58:25

I'm with Vix on that one, anything before 8 is not a nap for me. Once or twice she's conked out at 7, and I've felt that was still night sleep. Probably because I was still in my PJ's!

Well I cursed myself by saying I felt things had improved. We've now had 4 mornings of 5.20-5.30. Oh well, at least she's not been screaming through her bath an has gone to bed quietly at normalish bedtime!

sheeplikessleep Fri 27-Apr-12 20:05:39

I do worry DS2 is so overtired and that causes early wakings.

The days he does have like a rare mammoth 2 1/2 hours daytime nap (and often later, rather than 12pm), he gets his occasional jump in the air 6am start the next day.

Anyone else have this theory?

vix206 Sun 29-Apr-12 20:06:50

Ugh. DS has a cold/cough so wakes in the night and is wide awake at 5am every day. I've so had enough!!

vix206 Sun 29-Apr-12 20:08:03

Ps yes over tiredness is a MAJOR cause of early wakings. Just wish I could get my son to take longer naps. He's in bed by 6.30 now but can't get past 5am at the moment.

LittleMilla Mon 30-Apr-12 19:36:43

Hello all,

Thought I would pop on and check in. We had a wobble last week (I think?) but he's back to sleeping until 6-6:30am which I am happy with.

Fifi I actually found that limiting naps just made things worse. DS likes to sleep in the morning and any amount of tinkering does nothing. Just makes him REALLY tired for PM nap, which is always the struggle for DS.

We're on a rough schedule of 9:30am morning nap for 1-1.5 hours. Then a c.2pm nap for 40 mins - 1 hour. So he's having up to 2.5 hours of sleep every day - but I am finding that this varies from day to day. TOday he's only had 1 hr int he morning and 40 mins this afternoon. Gone to bed shattered, so I think he'll prob be up early tomorrow.

I think that the best 'cure' for DS is to not let him get overtired and sleep as much as he needs to in the day. And also make sure he has a decent supper - carbs and some banana are good!

I think that early mornings are forever going to be a feature of our life. But for as long as he's going past 6am, I won't darken this thread.

Good luck to everyone xx

lf12002 Mon 30-Apr-12 20:31:27

wow, am i glad i found this thread!!!! I honestly thought i was the only one suffering with daft early mornings. My son is almost 13 months and seems to get by on 9 hours or less a night!! he thinks that 4.30 ish is a reasonable time to wake up! we've tried putting him to bed later, no luck. as for daytime naps, i think he'd rather be playing than sleeping....on a good day he'll have 1 nap of about 2 hours, but that only totals 11 hours sleep in 24 hours. All my other mummy friends seem to have babies that sleep the "normal" 14-15 hours, so thanks again for making me feel less alone at daft o'clock!!

Meggymoodle Fri 04-May-12 12:53:02

Bleurgh - hi ladies - back to touch base. I've been absent from this post for a while - not because we've had any joy with later wakings but just because I'm getting used to the fact that we wake up at 5.30 every morning. tragic....

Ah well, there we go. Nothing is making any difference, one nap or two naps - makes no odds. We had a 4.45 the other day but I went and laid on her floor and finally after some faffing of around an hour she went back to sleep until DS surfaced loudly at 6.20. Who are these mythical children that sleep to 7am?? I want one.

fififrog Fri 04-May-12 21:11:07

Hi folks same here, had 5.30s every time since I last posted give or take 10mins. We had a 5.40 yesterday, felt like a lie in! But she's been sleeping pretty well and the move to one nap has been going OK, even if its length is variable! Sometimes has 15min catnap on the way somewhere in the mornings but doesn't actually seem to need morning sleep at all. I am just trying to be chilled and be grateful that I don't have to get up in the night. I often doze between 5.30 and 6.00 anyway, though a couple of days back I lay there listening to DD roar at her toy lion - it was too cute!

Krustyandthekids Sat 05-May-12 07:18:30

Ah, good morning!! Found this thread at 5.45 this morning then was unable to post as baby was throwing himself at the laptop - he is obsessed grin

I too am suffering with a 1yo early riser. He's my second one too (or 3rd if you count DP). Am I the only one in this house who loves their bed and enjoys sleeping past 7am??!!

WHEN WILL IT END angry

As my mother says, "this too shall pass" - it's just taking BLOODY AGES!!! sad

fififrog Sat 05-May-12 08:46:05

Aarrrrgh I have cursed myself again! Last time I posted I said "ooh things are lookin up" and then she stopped with the 6am and went back to 5-something-small. Last night I tried to be positive and say at least she was sleeping well. Hmph. Had a terrible night's sleep. DP and I barely slept after 4.20, and she was up for good at 5. Managed to leave her til 6 but nearly cracked at 5.40 when she started up with "mamadadamamadadamamadada"!

LittleMilla Mon 07-May-12 10:20:20

After I posed on Monday I had 6 days of c.5am wake ups! Yesterday he was up for good at 5:10am - DH and I had gone out on Sat night to celebrate DS's first birthday - DS did have a family party in the day too! So we got to bed at midnight, then he was up at 5am. Eurgh!

We were reminising over dinner that we'd got up at about 5:45am on the day I was going in for the c-section. I said at the time that "oooh, feels like we're going on holiday being up at this time". Ha, if only we knew!!

fifi love the idea of roaring at lion. Sweet!!

Krusty this is my first and I am offcially a sleeper. So praying that if/when we have another it might sleep more!

Meggy I have found that acceptance is actually half the battle. Lowering expectations and all that.

x

Meggymoodle Mon 07-May-12 20:13:19

Hi ladies - we're mostly all still here then.....ah well, that's not such a good thing but as I always say, misery loves company. That said, my beloved DD woke this morning at 5.10 which is earlier than usual and I said some choice words but we left her for a little while and she went back to sleep until......da da daaaaa 6.30am!

It won't happen tomorrow but it was nice for once. Oh how my standards have fallen, that 6.30am on a bank holiday is good!

Iwantcandy Mon 07-May-12 23:37:11

Fuck fuck fuck. I can't sleep and know I'll be up with Ds in about 5 1/2 hours -if I'm lucky sad

fififrog Wed 09-May-12 20:40:58

Must be something in the air, met my colleague at nursery this morning and he asked if we'd found a tactic to deal with the early mornings as his daughter has started waking at 5.30... These days I'm just hoping for a night when she doesn't cry out in the night. Oh, she just has. Great. That bodes well, not.

buggyRunner Thu 10-May-12 06:05:54

Hi all can I join? I have dd1 who is 2.10 who would sleep until 7 if it wasn't for dd2 who likes 430/530 far too much!

I'm going to try good night milk and have tried leaving her which occasionally works (9 months old)
She goes to bed for 730 - is that too early/ late?
I am back at work and dying!

Iwantcandy Thu 10-May-12 09:12:45

The last few days Ds has managed to sleep til about half six. The main change I can pinpoint is he's eating more protein and he's napping more in the day. Instead of 3 short naps he's doing 2 very long ones. Yesterday he napped 2 1/2 hours in the morning and 3 hours in the afternoon. He slept last night 7pm to 6.30 with a dreamfeed at 10.30 pm

fififrog Sun 13-May-12 19:39:01

Hey candy I can't remember how old your DS is? Sounds like you've had some great nights though, long may they last! What an incredible amount of nappage! I hope I am not subliminally going to burst the bubble but it sounds like one of those weird super-tired phases. DD had one when the clocks changed (12mo) which lasted a good few days.

I am having one last ditch attempt at helping her sleep longer: blackout blinds (which do nothing so far) and gradually moving for a later bedtime. Which would also be helpful as it would mean I didn't keep having to sprint off from work 15 mins early to get her home from nursery in time for dinner and bed... We're on day 2 of "not before 7pm", my aim is to go for 7.15 in about a week's time then maybe 7.30. If that doesn't work it's back to 7.15 and I officially give up the idea of ever staying awake past 10pm!

Meggymoodle Mon 14-May-12 13:35:20

Afternoon ladies. We had the heady heights of 6.20 this morning from DD. I couldn't believe it, but what I really couldn't believe was that DS woke at 2.30 with a bad dream and then got out of bed at 05.55. It's like a tag-team conspiracy to keep me permanently knackered.

buggy - I am reticent to give advice because if I had any idea, I wouldn't have a daughter who has consistently woken before 6 for over a year sad - but that said, I would say 7.30 is too early and is being used as a continuation of night sleep. Try dragging it out by 15 mins every three days until you can get to 9am. Good luck!

candy - good going! Long may it continue.

frog - let us know if the pushing back of bedtime works. It never has for me, and she ends up waking the same time and being over-tired, but that said, I've never been consistent with it. Good luck!

charlmills Tue 15-May-12 14:01:51

Can I join too. My ds has always been a very random sleeper and he is 11 months now. We have been waiting for him to drop a night feed. Which he has now pretty much but now will wake at 5/5.30. He sometimes will have a bottle and eventually go down again and then dd will wake up sad. He will then sleep until 8 ish. However I soooo want him to sleep past 6 as then I can get them in the same room as ay the moment he is still in with us. But he just can't do it and its driving me nuts.
There must be a magic cure out there.... no? Oh well.

fififrog Tue 15-May-12 22:10:20

Isn't buggy saying DD goes to bed at 7.30pm? Rather than naps at 7.30am...?

We had a 5.54am today. Ahhh, a lie in, finally! Lucky us ;-)

fififrog Tue 15-May-12 22:14:57

PS hi char (not sure what to call you , i's and l's look the same on my iPod!) we had that, DD used to sleep til about 6.20 til she dropped her last night feed, had a few weeks where I could resettle her after a quick feed at 5, but that became unreliable so I decided to force her to go til 6. Bit of a double-edged sword - I reckon she now can't sleep past 6 even on the best days because the 6am feed is too much of a habit... Don't think I can break it til I stop BF.

Iwantcandy Wed 16-May-12 06:12:15

Spoke to soon. We re back to 5am wakeups here!

Meggymoodle Wed 16-May-12 12:40:22

buggy apologies - have just read frog's post - of course that is what you're saying - I'm a total numpty.

We had 2 days of post 6 am. Back to 5.35 this morning. YAAAWWWNNN

charlmills Wed 16-May-12 13:54:05

Hi fififrog, its CHARLMILLS. not shouting at you just thought the capitals might help u to read it on your phone.

We had a 6.30 waking this morn which was absolute bliss but just afraid its a one off. He does this from time to time just to tease us. I've given up that hopeful feeling now as I always end up disappointed and I think someone on here said that half the battle is acceptance, so true.

I am trying to think of all the things we did yesterday that could have contributed to such a lie in ;) and all I can think of is that he had a lot of food and half a bottle more than usual. So maybe he was just v v full.
Fingers crossed it continues.

Meggymoodle Wed 23-May-12 10:58:19

Hi ladies - how are we doing? charlmills congrats! Let's hope it continues. I had a - da da daaaaaa - 0645 from both mine yesterday morning. I could not believe it. I was convinced it was the fact that I put DD without the boob for the first time ever (she's done it twice before when I've been away and DH has put her down) and I thought we'd cracked it. However, back to 0540 this morning. Oh well, at least it's nice and sunny in the mornings - it's soooo much more bearable at this time of the year than it is in the winter - 5.30 in the winter is a total nightmare.....

DD has been early waking now for over a year - I'm beginning to think that I just have to get used to it and stop moaning. And frankly EW is way better than night wakings. I just need to get to bed a bit earlier.

Iwantcandy Wed 23-May-12 15:14:25

5am today. However dh works shifts and had a day off so he had to get up grin

I go back to work in 3 weeks. Gulp!

leebitton Thu 24-May-12 07:34:24

4.58 this morning. ffs.
He did resettle though after maybe 10/15 mins and then got woken properly at 5.30 by DS1 (who is ill)
I usually just leave DS2 to grump but i took him on my bed as Ollie was shouting "can you look after Jacob, i'm trying to sleep", i would have laughed if i wasn't so pee'd off!! ALthough i'm chuckling now!!
He's been sleeping till post 6am for 2 weeks now as he's had a horrible viral thing - at least the early starts are made easier by the fact he is an awsome little boy through the day!
I try to remind myself all his good points and all the things he does so well, because i think i dwell on his early waking faaar to much. Although it is bloody rubbish getting up before 6!!

Iwantcandy Thu 24-May-12 22:10:41

Out of interest what is your dc wearing to sleep in in this weather? Ds is just wearing a sleepsuit and feels a bit hot and clammy. I've just opened the window in his room as much ad it can go. He wore the same last night and was very hot when I went to bed but very cold when he woke up at 5

vix206 Sun 27-May-12 19:36:48

Hi everyone, I didn't want to post and jinx myself but.... DS hasn't woken before 6am for around 3 weeks now. A couple of mornings it's been the mythical 7am!! I'm so grateful for it. I honestly never thought he'd do it, he's 21 months old on Tuesday and I've changed absolutely nothing. He naps better in the day now too, and I've not needed to cap naps or interfere with anything the improvement just seemed to happen naturally.

So I'm sorry not to have any magic cure and I hope your DC's follow suit very soon. I have no doubt i will be back on here again soon saying he's up at 4.30 again but for now we are doing well.

Oh and PS Iwantcandy, at the moment DS is just in his nappy and a 1 tog grobag.

Iwantcandy Sun 27-May-12 22:19:07

Joy of joys the last 2 days have had 4.45am wakeups. How I'll cope in 2 weeks when I go back to work I don't knowsad

LittleMilla Mon 28-May-12 09:14:54

Iwantcandy I don't how old your LO is. My DS has just turned 1 and we've had just over a week of c.5am-ers. SOOOO bloody hard.

Then magically yesterday he went to 6:15am again and today was 6am. He's been generally tricky - wanting to be patted to sleep etc and DH is much tougher so said on Sat "enough". He's been a bit better, but last night still didn't go to sleep until 8:30pm, despite being put down at 7:20pm.

I am an avid reader of the book The Wonder Weeks and this phase coincides with one of the fussy weeks, so I am hoping it'll pass soon. Until the next fecking one!

I too work and you somehow find a way to get through it. Sorry sad

Iwantcandy Mon 28-May-12 12:57:39

Thanks for your words littlemilla. My Ds us nearly 9 months. I Had a lie in until 7.30 this morning however Ds was awake between 2.45 and 4am!!! Think the hot weather has made everything worse...

Meggymoodle Mon 28-May-12 13:14:06

Hi ladies - vix am torn between wanting to give you a joyous hug and say "well done" and wanting to scratch your eyes out! Just kidding - well done, that's brilliant. That said, we've not done too badly to be fair. We had 0615 yesterday and this morning it was 6.35 which means that she's doing post 6am as often as she's done pre-6am. It's only 45 mins difference but frankly it makes the world of difference!

Both of ours slept until 6.35this morning which is unbelievable. I took a sleeping tab last night as have been struggling so I was totally out for the count for 7 hours. I feel like a new woman today. Probably back to the old knackered version tomorrow but you never know!

vix206 Mon 28-May-12 15:36:50

Meggy no need to be scratching my eyes out, it sounds like you are doing as well as us! This morning he woke up at 6am, I do think the hot weather will play havoc with them!

fififrog Mon 28-May-12 21:03:10

I have been hiding in misery. Since the blackout curtains have arrived, mornings have got earlier and earlier. She's now waking somewhere around 4 and often not really sleeping again. She hates the heat and was in zombie-like meltdown for most of the weekend. Have to have windows open so sodding birds waking her for good about 4.45. Add a new molar and hayfever (or possibly yet another virus mere minutes after the conjunctivitis cleared up) and you have the picture. Groan. I don't even remember what sleeping til 6 felt like. There is literally nothing we can do. I am just praying that like Vix one day our mornings will improve... Fingers crossed all your successes remain that! candy you will survive because you have to! On the up side, I now get to work 8.15 so leave at 4.45 - I used to only get in about 9.30.... Milla I too read wonderweeks, we're beginning to run out! I think we might be moving towards the next but although I do think it affects her mood and clinginess I can't possibly kid myself it's screwing up her morning sleeping any more. <loses all hope and slinks off to find a packet of biscuits...>

Meggymoodle Thu 31-May-12 19:28:49

frog - my deepest sympathy, it's just not funny is it? It's all very well saying "oh it's fine if you just accept they are early risers" which is what I've been jollying myself along with for the last YEAR but sometimes it all gets too much.

My parents are coming down for the bank holiday weekend and I'm going to lob DD at them every morning as soon as she wakes (hopefully we won't get to 4 as I feel that might be taking the pee-pee somewhat!) and we'll sleep in. They are also staying in our house and looking after both sproglets for us for a whole day and night whilst DH and I go away for a night away - it will be a sleepfest great to spend some time together without the kids. Can't wait! Anyway, hope you all have a lovely long weekend and here's praying for some lie-ins for us all - you know, anything after 06:01!!

fififrog Thu 31-May-12 20:37:58

Thanks, and hope you have a llovely weekend meggy. we've had some night wakings (not done anything and DH slept through) but two 5.55s in a row so I feel much more positive again smile amazing what seems good now. Thank heavens it's cooled down a bit, but I'm not looking forward to Sunday's super-grim weather...

Hello all. I have a 17 month old and I was hoping you lot could sort her out grin. She has always been a terrible sleeper and always woken up early. However, she got a little better when we raised her bedtime to 8pm. Now, though she is still going to bed just after 8pm and consistently getting up before 5.30am (this morning was 5.23am for the precise clockers on here). I am despairing because it has been a struggle to sleep now for 26 months, TWO YEARS. Those of you with maths skills will be able to work out that pregnancy insomnia was also a problem. I have to think that 5.30am is better than the two hourly wakings until she was a year and the 4am wakings when she is sick... But I just want to sleep.

I called someone with a baby the same age as mine the other day at 7.30am and was informed that her and the baby were still asleep <weeps>

thinkfast Sat 02-Jun-12 06:35:54

Tis Iwantcandy. Name changed in honour of the 4+ stone I need to losesad the tiredness isn't helping with that battle

Another 5am start here. Think I could cope with it except for the 10.30pm dreamfeed Ds still needs. By the time I've done that, resettled him etc it's usually 11.30 or 12 by the time I fall asleep cause I'm so overtired.

Anyone having success with blackout blinds?

fififrog Sat 02-Jun-12 09:22:41

candy... Er think, a categorical no on the blinds. Not to say they wouldn't help you. Why not borrow some if you can like I did, then at least you won't waste your money!

Hi Terry! I am weeping in sympathy. 5.25 yesterday, 4.55 today. We were sort of trying later bedtime but can't quite seem to do it. Now 7.00-7.15 and it was about 20mins earlier a couple of weeks back. She's now waking earlier! Don't know if it's because she's now overtired - post-nap is now a nightmare of screaming for up to an hour too - or because it's lighter earlier so the birds are disturbing her. We're thinking of putting bedtime earlier again. My mum reckons we need to go abroad and give her some jetlag! I think we'd need to make her bedtime much later to shake her out of 5.15ish, but I am not sure I can cope!

thinkfast Sun 03-Jun-12 10:30:57

We went to Spain at the end of march and I thought great they're an hour ahead, we ll get an hours extra sleep. Er nope. It was like Ds has an alarm clock in his head. He still woke at 5am Spanish time each day and then 5am english time when we got back hmm

On a positive note he refused his dream feed at 10.30 last night, woke wanting it at 1am then slept through til 6.30 plus Dh got up with him and I had a lie in smile

5.20am today but she came in with us and slept a bit more. Of course, that means DD and DH get more sleep and I don't since she wants to be pressed up against me and then I can't sleep for fear of crushing her in my exhausted state.

Ditto, thinkfast on the jetlag. DD knows what time it is everywhere. I was wondering about earlier bedtime. I just don't want to go back to 4.30am wakings.

Meggymoodle Sun 03-Jun-12 15:01:47

Hi ladies, happy jubilee weekend/Trinity Sunday/whatever anyone else may be celebrating today!

In honour of Her Maj, my beloved daughter slept until.....you are not going to believe this.....0650! That is the latest ever in her whole 18 months. I did not believe it when I checked my phone for the time. DS then slept until 0720 - incredible. We are doing nothing different but we have had as many post-6am wake-ups as pre-6am wake-ups recently so maybe maybe maybe eventually they just grow out of it. She has been waking at 5.20/5.30/5.40 for over a year now so if she was finally getting out of the habit I'd be more than happy. That said, it would be absolutely no surprise at all if she just suddenly went back to 5.15 every morning....

thinkfast Mon 04-Jun-12 06:57:12

Do you think this is wrong? Ds woke up at 5.15 this morning. I left him in his cot and put toys and books in with him and dozed in the bed next to him while he played and fussed til 6.30 when he started screaming the place down. Feel guilty he was basically left on his own but I was just so tired - he woke up at midnight and wouldn't settle for an hour

WifiNappies Mon 04-Jun-12 08:42:13

I've got an 8mo DD who wakes around 5am but its getting earlier by the day, and is then knackered and back in bed by 9am!! How do I get her to go longer? Do I put her to bed later (currently 1930 don't really want her up any later!). Her naps are over the place due to her waking earlier and earlier but it's roughly 9am, noon and 4pm. If we don't let her nap then she's too crabby to do anything with. I just don't know how to get out of this downward spiral!

Am back at work ft in 3 weeks and ideally want her up at 0630 so she's not then a total nightmare for the CM when I drop her off sad

WifiNappies Mon 04-Jun-12 08:44:07

thinkfast I've considered doing that too

thinkfast Mon 04-Jun-12 11:34:23

Wifinappies am in the same boat as you. Ds is nearly 9 months and I go back to work in a week!!!!

fififrog Mon 04-Jun-12 20:32:21

Hey wifi, I wish I had any useful advice! At 8mo my DD was sleeping til 6 or 6.30 but was awake and screaming for an hour at about 3.15... At 7mo she had been through a 5.30 phase which worked it's way out by not letting her nap before 9am, but it sounds like you're doing that already!

thinkfast I do that every morning. I used to bring her in after 4.30 but for the last few months she has to stay in her own cot or she's off rampaging around the house. I ignore her til 6am unless she's clearly upset rather than bored, frustrated and shouting. Yesterday we ignored her from 4.40 until 6.00 so I win by 5 mins!

DD has had 2hr naps the last two days, yesterday I had to wake her at 3.30 and she'd also had 1/2 hr in the car in the morning! clearly she's shattered!

I bought backout curtains thanks to you wonderful ladies and DD slept until 6.30am today. Please, all cross your fingers and hope that this is the trick and she will do this again.

thinkfast Tue 05-Jun-12 07:04:52

Right. Will have to get some blackout blinds. 5.40am sad

Meggymoodle Tue 05-Jun-12 22:18:39

thinkfast - do I think it's wrong to leave your DS in his cot until 6.30am? No I think it's absolutely right. These bloody annoying early waking children have GOT to learn that anything pre-6am is totally unreasonable. I don't how they will ever learn but learn they must!

wifi - it's actually worth trying an earlier bedtime. I know it sounds totally counter-intuitive but sometimes if they are over-tired they will wake earlier. Try 7pm for a few days and see what gives. Of course, if everyone else's children on here are anything to go by, it'll make sod-all difference but you may be the lucky one who actually finds a solution.

Terry so glad the blackout curtains made a difference.

Have just got back from a night away with DH. SOOOOO nice to have a day and night away without the kids and they were both brilliant for my parents which made life easy for all. It was also really nice to be able to wake at 6am and then slide back to sleep until 8am with no hideous child-induced interruptions! DD has slept to post-6am for the last 3 days.....let's see what tomorrow brings......

Good luck for tomorrow morning everyone.

Birnamwood Wed 06-Jun-12 08:14:08

Hello ladies, may I join you?

9mo ds2 seems to think its perfectly acceptable to start the day between 4.30 and 5.45am and I can do bugger all to stop it .

We recently went on holiday torture camp for a week and because of ds's early waking (he's not quiet) by 5.15/30 every morning we were out walking with the pram. The cottage was attached on both sides and as those people were also on holiday it didn't seem fair to wake them too. I've got some lovely pictures of sunrises though!

I had a massive bit of a wobble on Friday night and I think dp realised how worn down I am with this lack of sleep so he did the early wakings over the 4 day BH (and he snuck off for two naps during the day which I have never managed angry) I think he now understands a little of what my life is like atm, (I'm a sahm and he works silly long hours so get very little respite)

Nothing seems to work with ds2, two nights of cc with ds1 cured him of any sleep problems and from about 11mths went from 7.30-7.30+, he's 3.5 now. Cc for ds2 in the morning does. not. work. I've tried short naps, long naps, earlier/later bedtimes, every bloody thing! He still has a feed at about 1ish which he drinks like a rugby player downing a pint so I don't think it's time to knock that on the head yet.

Does anyone know of/have any experience with the 'wake to sleep' method? From what I've heard you set your alarm for 3.30/4 and wake them but put them straight back to sleep, but that's all I know. I'm going to research it a bit more but I'm a bit nervous in case I wake him at 4 and the little bugger thinks that's the start of the day <likely>

Just reading this thread is helping, so thank you, all my friends have babies that sleep wonderfully and I think they don't believe me when I tell them what ds2 does hmm

Hey everyone

Just wanted to poke my head in and say hello - seems we are all in a painfully similar situation, and I am weirdly relived to hear that there seems to be no solution to having spawned a lark!

DS is almost 2, and has always been a sleep fighter. Finally got him going through the night at 16 months (CC, broke my heart, but it was that or leaving him on the church steps). He's been an early waker (between 4am and 5am) on and off since he was born. Boob and a cuddle used to get him back to sleep at that time, but those days are long gone, so now it's just a case of gritting teeth and getting through until the lunch time nap (which always involves a walk or a car ride then transfer to the sofa, it's never simple is it?). He's in bed by 6.30pm too, so hardly a late night.

I have no advice, just my condolences to you all! Maybe we have a team of rocket scientists on our hands?

Those of you about the return to work - yes, it's scary stuff (some days not sure I should be behind the wheel), but work is a break from the agony of a 15 hour day with a small person! Trust me, you'll relish it within a few dya sof being back!

x

thinkfast Wed 06-Jun-12 21:54:30

Ds is definitely waking up hungry - I can hear his tummy rumbling! He still has a dreamfeed about 10.30 but it doesn't seem to be enough to see him through til 7.....

fififrog Wed 06-Jun-12 22:05:03

Hey newbies, it'd be really interesting to compare notes in 10 years time and find out if they ever did sort it out, and indeed what personality traits they share...

Burnham I have not tried wake to sleep though have read about it on here a lot. DD wakes at very variable times in the early morning - though she is often up for the day at 5.19 precisely (curiously she has shunned that minute so far this week!), she often wakes and cries out anywhere between 3 and 4.30 and goes back to sleep. So I am 99% sure that getting myself out of bed to do what she often does anyway is just increasing the agony (talking of which we're on hols soon, really hope our cottage isn't attached...). However, as with the blackout blinds that have done nothing for us, that's not to say it won't work for you! Worth a try...

I should go back and check this thread but my current perception is that the truly awful consistently pre-5.30 behaviour coincided with the dropping of the morning nap. Or maybe it's just warmer/lighter/more active/just a phase... Even if it is the nap, not a fat lot I can do, just have to wait it out til she gets a bit older and less overtired.

Birnamwood Thu 07-Jun-12 01:27:17

fifi I'm going to give it 3 days and see what happens. I'll either be shouting from the treetops about the wonderful inventor of wake to sleep or I'll be hunting him down with a big stick...smile

When you go on holiday, check beforehand that they have good curtains/blackout blinds and if they haven't, take your own <bitter, bitter experience> believe me, you think they don't make a difference until you don't have one. The cottage we stayed in just had venetian blinds and I swear it was lighter in the boys room than outside!

thinkfast Thu 07-Jun-12 06:07:19

Let us know about the wake to sleep. I had 4.30 am today (yawn)

SunshineOutdoors Thu 07-Jun-12 06:32:51

Hi, I've just found you all!

Dd's just started lying in...after weeks of 4.30am she is now waking at 5.30am. I felt happy for a few days but now feel cheated because 5.30 is still fucking early but I've been tricked into thinking I'm getting loads of sleep because 4.30 was so bad.

Going to bed knowing you're really tired feeling scared about what time you're going to have to get up!

Can I join you all in having a moan when I'm up early?

I can't really offer any solutions but trying to get as much evening meal as possible into dd seems to be making her sleep a bit longer.

QueenFuri Thu 07-Jun-12 06:39:14

My DS is 2 and still a early riser but he had been doing well sleeping 7 until 6 the past few weeks up until we made the mistake of putting hi a toddler bed last night we have both been up since 5! He seems to really hate that bed and that's only one night! Hopefully tonight will be better!

QueenFuri Thu 07-Jun-12 06:40:31

Please ignore the atrocious spelling in that post lack of sleep does things to my brain!!!

WifiNappies Thu 07-Jun-12 10:25:15

I feel so bad for you all, you have it way worse than me.
We made it to 5.55 yesterday and a record 6.30 this morning but we are in Europe so technically 4.55 and 5.30 grin it's depressing getting up before BBC Breakfast comes on.

Yesterday she had a long nap at 10am and 45mins at 1430. I also dressed her in a babygro (she has been in just a nappy with or without pj top because it's been hot here) so maybe she felt cosier, I dunno. She has a tendency to work out of her cover and my theory was she was waking up with cold legs. Whatever, it seemed to work.

Tonight I switch the final bf over to ff sad, she normally feeds to near-sleep, so will see what effect that has if any

Yawn, yawn, yawn. 4.30am for us again, too.

DP is now going in with my moble phone alarm set to 5am, to try and get DS into the habit of not getting up until he hears 'the wake up bells'. He seemed quite happy to lie there until 5.15am today, let's see if this a workable trigger.

Hopefully we can then just leave the 'bells' in his room set to 6am (imagine that! 6am!! bliss!) and remain under the duvet...

SunshineOutdoors Fri 08-Jun-12 07:56:48

5.15am today

Meggymoodle Fri 08-Jun-12 13:16:52

Ladies - my sympathies to you all. It is utterly hideous especially on hols. I ended up walking up and down the Tarka Trail at 5.30am last summer on our holiday. I looked particularly special as she was in the underneath bit of the Phil and Ted's so it looked like I was walking with an empty pushchair.....

I hardly dare say this but we have had a week of post-6am wake-ups and thrown into that week for exceptionally good measure, about 3 post 6.30s - this morning was 6.50am. This is after a year of 5.30ish. However, we have had a respite of a week or so before but then she's gone back to early waking so I'm not counting my chickens just yet.....

sharkskinthing how old is your DS? Is it worth trying a gro-clock. We used it with DS from about 2.5 with great success.

Hey gals (yawns, and downs more coffee). Hope you are all well.

Meggy - he's nearly two. And I find your news really heartening" And it's funny you should say that about the gro-clock because...

DS woke at 4.10am. Beginning to get a bit ridiculous you may say? Well, we've been trying somehitng that looks like it may have some success. DP went in on Thurs morn (4.40am) with his mobile, with a gentle alarm set for 5am. He lay with DS and told him he couldn't get up until he head 'the wake up bells'. DS didn;t go back to sleep but he did lie quiely until 5.15.

This morning he woek at (eeek) 4.10am. In goes DP same as before, and what do you know, DS goes back to sleep until 5.45am! The he and DP had abig 'wakie up bells' moment.

DS NEVER goes back to sleep. EVER. So this could be a break through. Maybe tomorrow he'll just wait for the bells. OR DP can go in again and then sneak out. I'll keep you posted...

thinkfast Sat 09-Jun-12 07:00:14

Thought we had a 6.15 am miracle this morning - then panicked when I hadn't heard Ds by 6.30. Turns out my mum had heard him when he woke up at 5 and had taken him downstairs. Lovely lie in smile

Meggymoodle Sat 09-Jun-12 15:21:23

thinkfast that made me laugh grin

shark how'd it go this morning?

My DD is still doing post 6am but am sure it'll break now because DS woke her at 6.10am this morning so I'm sure it'll reset her early waking and she'll be back to 5.30. What is that all about?! He's normally a fantastic sleeper and sleeps until past 7 so I was deeply unimpressed this morning. sad

fififrog Sat 09-Jun-12 20:04:16

Meggy that's fab news! Apart from DS's errant behaviour ;) really hope it sticks! We had visitors today, their son was an early waker too, they said it didn't really sort itself til he was 3.... Sigh. but at least it did. Tales of improvement give me hope!

Birnham have already ordered blind. We are currently borrowing one off friends, it hasn't helped but now I'm paranoid she'd wake even earlier without, and I was already worried about hols given last year's thin gauzy curtains.

I keep wondering whether to buy a groclock. I have one in my amazon basket. At 14.5 months, she's clearly too young, but Part of me thinks should get her used to it asap - the other part optimistically thinks she'll be sleeping longer by next year. Thing is, whatever happens in the early hours, she usually has a good old shout at 6, which is when I go in. So I worry she'll never get past 6 because it is too engrained. I wonder whether I could develop an association with the clock, then move it back by stealth.

fififrog Sat 09-Jun-12 20:07:01

Ps think, LOVE your mum!! last year when we were on hol with my mum she kept offering to take DD so we could have a lie in. Her bedroom was downstairs though. Every time I tried to take her up on the kind offer I'd cart the babe downstairs to find mum so fast asleep she didn't wake when we came in - I hadn't the heart to wake her!

Meggy - thrilled for you, that's great news. Long may it continue!

Fifi - do it. It can't hurt. My DS started the pre-5am last May (when he was 10 months) and a year later, here we are again....

But I think we're winning a little! 4.50am this morn, put himself back to sleep until 5.10am, then 10 mins with DP and 'the wake up bells.' This time last week we were 4am.

Other factor is that he's teething with his last 4 molars and has a horribly sore bum. Perhaps this is what's really bothering him.

Oh look, 9pm, bed time for me! Joy of joys! Good luck tonight everyone. xxx

LaVitaBellissima Sat 09-Jun-12 21:03:00

Just found this thread, I have 19 month old twins, they wake at 4 or 5 am every day! Usually take it in turns on who wakes first but after 10/15 mins of crying I usually make 2 bottles and go in, I always get them give them both a bottle and we sleep till 6ish together, either n bed or on the sofa. Not ideal but I'm not sure how to change it sad

fififrog Sat 09-Jun-12 21:43:24

LaVita I guess it's even more impossible because one wakes the other... At least those of us with one stand a chance that they'll go back to sleep. On the other hand at least your two will go back to sleep, unlike mine.... Nah that's not fair, sometimes she dozes but milk just gears her upfor the day!

LittleMilla Mon 11-Jun-12 14:16:51

My memory of anything past 6am has gone - DS hasn't done much later that 5:15am for too long.

We've just had a week's holiday abroad with mates and come home almost more tired than when we went. DH and I are desperate.

DS now 14 mo and we're going to start putting him on to one nap a day - surely having more sleep in the day will lead to more sleep at night. Esp if c.2 hours (or more) never makes him sleep longer. Worth a try, no?

I despise anyone who has a baby that sleeps until 7am. And I'm questioning my whole parenting philosophy by wondering if Gina Ford was right all along and I should've gone for the strict routine. Although that's not to say DS doesn't have a routine, he just skips the bit that says he should wake up at 7am grin.

thinkfast Mon 11-Jun-12 19:07:31

Argh!!! I go back to work on Wednesday! How will I cope? The earlier we wake up the longer I take to get going in the mornings. Plus I need two breakfasts...

So, I have had a 6.20am this morning. This is extremely late for DD. I think it is a combo of a late snack before bottle and bed, slightly earlier bedtime, blackout curtains, lots of activity in the day and endless hoping on my part.

Or maybe she is testing me. Last week we had 6am (hooray), 5.45am, 5.30am and I could feel my despair rising. If I expect a 5.15am, it is awful but expected. If she messes with her waking time, I can feel myself getting frustrated and upset.

fififrog Mon 11-Jun-12 20:07:48

think I have second breakfast at work at 9.30, I really cannot go any longer without food...

Well this week we had three 5.45+ days, then followed by two 5.10s. Milla hate to disillusion you but she's been napping for Britain this week (well,for her.. Nothing shorter than 1.45) and as you can see wakeups are pretty random still. This after I convinced myself it might be overtiredness meaning she has stopped making it to 6am ever.

Are there any of us who have trouble getting them to bed at night? The more people I talk to the more I realise that if you just have a kid who doesn't need much more than 10hrs a night, you effectively end up "choosing" to have them up til 9pm, or have them waking at 5am. I am trying to look at the positives in our family life - at least DH and I can eat dinner uninterrupted.

Though we had a football recording mishap this pm, which now means I have to stay up and keep DH company while he watches the england match at 10pm.... Surely this is a recipe for waking every hour then up for the day at 4.30!

thinkfast Mon 11-Jun-12 20:32:45

Bedtime doesn't seem to make Amy difference here. Have tried everything from 6pm to 8.30 pm but wakeup is around 5am regardless

thinkfast Tue 12-Jun-12 06:56:12

Why were they digging the road outside my house til past midnight? Why was Ds up at 3am? And why was he up for the day and full of beans at 5 am? (yawn)

My DCs are 10 and 8, and wake between 5.30 and 6am.
I wake around 6-6.30, by which time they've usually made their breakfast and put a DVD on (they worked out how to do it without the remote controls after we took to hiding them).
Whoever asked for "later on" feedback, early wakers stay early wakers, but eventually they can do it without you present.
I'm on another thread arguing (against general opinion) that my DSs early bedtime is reasonable for him. It's good to see that not all DCs sleep 9.30-7.30smile

LittleMilla Tue 12-Jun-12 08:36:33

Fifi we have been struggling a bit here, but last night he went down at 7:30pm without a squeek.

My new tactic is to not have him nap past 3pm. Aiming for one nap a aday but nursery said yesterday that he was shattered by 10:30am, so he had two short naps - but woke up at 2:50pm. Given how well he went down last night and the fact he slept until 5:50am, I am telling myself it's worth a shot grin.

I cannot believe that after so many months we (well, me) are STILL clutching at straws like this!

Just got to take comfort in knowing we are not alone xx

Meggymoodle Tue 12-Jun-12 14:31:14

Hi ladies, just back to give you hope. DD is still doing post-6am smile

Rather tragically from my point of DS - normally amazing - has started doing pre-6am - argggggghhhhh!! What is this? Tag-team sleep deprivation?! That said, this morning I had 6.10 from DD and 6.20 from DS so reasonable all round.

I have NO idea if anything makes any difference or not, but the night we did a later bedtime with DD, she woke up at 5am the next morning - but she did go back to sleep. For us it seems that it has to be 7pm bed. Also she is now consistently doing 2 hours nap at 1230 or thereabouts which is amazing. When she was younger she would literally only do 45 mins....sooooo frustrating.

Anyway, as I said, we've had this sort of respite before so I'm not counting on leaving this forum entirely.

thinkfast Tue 12-Jun-12 23:22:57

Ds go back to sleep!!!!! I have work tomorrow and I know you will have me up at 5!!!

thinkfast Wed 13-Jun-12 00:17:30

Argh!!! Awake again. Looks like I won't be getting any sleep before my first day back angry

thinkfast Wed 13-Jun-12 17:20:04

help help help. now I have wake ups at both ends of the night. so tired today. DS woke up every 30 mins or so between 10 and 1.30 last night til I brought him in bed with me. then up at 5am as per usual. Think the problem was a developmental leap. He suddenly discovered he can sit up from lying on his back and didnt seem to be able to stop practisining it.

any advice? I dont really want to sleep with DS every night - I dont get comfortable or in a really deep sleep and miss sleeping with dh...

LittleMilla Wed 13-Jun-12 19:08:10

Think, I am no expert on the early waking (as you know!) but DH and I got tough re:nighttime wake ups.

At about 8/9 months we decided enough was enough and wnet down the (gentle) CC route. Soooo, although DS DOES wake up fricking early. He doesn't wake up unless really unwell - I can count on one hand the amount of times this has happened in the last 6 months.

Sorry, prob not what you want to hear. But esp when your mornings are so early, you need at least unbroken sleep.

thinkfast Wed 13-Jun-12 19:28:06

Milla am not against cc but don't have the energy for it at the moment. Might start at weekend when dh can help. How long did it take to work for you and did u go in to check every couple of minutes or just leave your dc to it?

LittleMilla Wed 13-Jun-12 19:58:10

Not sure if your BF but I was when we did it (not now) and it meant that I could hand it all over to DH grin.

A few days to see a difference? Way we did it was leave DS for 5 or 10 mins (depends if crying vs shouting!) and then go in, 30 secs of cuddle or sing his bedtime song, then put him back down. Repeat until he goes to sleep. It can take a while (ahem), depends on how determined your LO is feeling!!

If I were you, I'd hand over as much as poss to DH if your LO is happy with them (hope that doesn't sound mean!?). Our DS always responds better to DH than me, and that's not because i'm utterly soft. Honest!

x

I did CC after DD passed the year mark. I was very careful with it though. She never cried for more than three minutes using my made up method. The reason I did it was that I was cuddling/BFing to sleep and she would wake up if I tried to put her down or leave the room. All the patting in the world just used to make her want to be picked up. She was waking up a lot in the night and I felt that if I tried a bit of CC, she would get the idea that I was always there, but she wasn't getting picked up. It actually worked very quickly and well. I did one minute, go in and soothe, put down two minutes, go in and soothe. I stuck at two minutes for a while and only did three minutes if I was very sure that she wasn't too upset. The message I was trying for was, "mummy is always here and will always come but PLEASE GO TO SLEEP".

fififrog Thu 14-Jun-12 08:10:00

think sorry everything has gone to pot just as you least need it. W did gradual withdrawal at 5.5months and as part of this dealt with night wakings as follows:. Basically if DC wakes in night, sit next to them, no talking no eye contact, just a "back to sleep" and wait for them to do just that. An iPod helps. Always allow 10mins before going in to see if they will settle. DD wakes multiple times most nights but I never go in and she goes straight back to sleep 95% of the time.

Meggymoodle Fri 15-Jun-12 12:45:29

think -we did CC with DD too - and DS come to think of it, when he was going through a development stage all those many moons ago - and it worked with both. It's never worked for early waking though and I can't face even trying it as it would wake DS as they generally come into a light sleep at that time in the morning, so then I'd have two knackered children.

I am very sad and despondent - after an absolutely blinding 2 weeks of post 6am wake-ups we're now back to 5.30am. ARRRRGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH. There is no reason for it so I just have to assume that she is an early waker and always will be there and there is nothing I can do about it. That said, she was hanging by nap-time today. sad

thinkfast Fri 15-Jun-12 21:46:50

We had 6am today smile
But please can't they cancel the fucking football? Stupid men downstairs waking up Ds with their cheering. If it happens again I'm taking Ds down for them to deal with angry

LittleMilla Fri 15-Jun-12 21:49:33

We had a 6am-er too. Isn't it bloody mad what you consider to be good nowadays, pfft!?!?

But En=ger-land are winning!

In fairness, I am waiting for DH to get home for a business trip so flat is pretty quiet (upstair must be out).

x

Humania Sun 17-Jun-12 05:47:16

Hello all I'm sorry to hear so many of you are suffering too with this awful affliction! Some of you might have seen my other early waking nightmare thread. Seems to be getting worse... We had 4.45 this morning, I'm really struggling and running out of ideas. Has anyone had any success with putting to bed later? and at 12mo should I really ditch the morning nap? I know I'm clutching at straws really... Hope most of you are still asleep!

tiddleypompom Sun 17-Jun-12 05:59:01

Not asleep either - been lurking here as its one of the only live threads when I get up in the morning! DS is 9 months and wakes between 4.45 and 5.30 sad

Cbeebies needs to start earlier wink

TheToadLessTravelled Sun 17-Jun-12 06:48:51

Morning all, another one with an early waker. Ds usually wakes at 6 on the dot (which is bad enough) but this week has been throwing in the odd 430 and 5am start just to keep me in my toes. To add insult to injury this morning I realised we only have decaf in the house, gonna be a looooooong day sad

ledkr Thu 21-Jun-12 19:31:17

Hello can i bump this thread as I too am up by 5 most mornings with dd2 16 months. Its ok to be cool and share it with dh and tick along coping and watching sky plussed stuff but I AM NOW FED UP. Me and dh look years older than we did,have grey skin and bags under our eyes. I have put on weight (tired snacking) and dh has lost it (too tired for gym)
I literally feel a shadow of my former self am on ad's which I missed a few of the other day and felt terribel (not cured then) no social or sex life and perfect marriage is now bickery and tense.

She is my 5th child,never had this before,the others all slept late if anything.

We have had various sucess with nap jiggling but cant always stick to it if at work or she falls asleep in car or pushchair and im dubious about if it works anyway.

The best we ever had was a few weekend ago when we came bnack form a weekend camping (5am in a camper van aint funny) the night we got back she went to bed about 9 and slept till 10 am shock

Are you coming back or are you all sleeping.

Welcome ledkr. Glad to know you can have this with a 5th child. At least that means it isn't something we are all doing wrong. Now I know why people have 5 children. DH insisted we stop after one, mainly because of lack of sleep.

There may be light at the end of the tunnel for us. 18 month old DD started going to 6 or 6.30am. I was so happy. Then she had her vaccinations and we well me, DH didn't play have had two nights of very little sleep. I am hoping this doesn't reset her back to 5am, or earlier.

Also, does anyone have nay tips on jetlag? I am flying with DD back to the UK from Canada where we live for a couple of weeks. How do I stop DD turning me into a zombie.

nellyjelly Thu 21-Jun-12 19:41:41

Hi can I join you? Ds is 2 and gets up anytime from 5. DH and i take turns to 'lie in' til 7. Dd now 6 and also was an early riser. Now 6 and sleeps til 7.30 so there is hope!

thinkfast Thu 21-Jun-12 20:10:32

Still suffering here. Ds woke up at 3 but went back to sleep then up for the day much later than usual - 5.45am!!!! It's making me so bad tempered and dh and I are trying hard not to bicker but its so hard when you're this tired.

ledkr Thu 21-Jun-12 20:43:13

mrsp Yes she would have been a only child for sure.

As for jet lag I cant help but think can it get any worse??

DD wento bed at about 8 which is very late but we had a busy day and late tea,it wont make any difference though.

I may start to keep a record of her naps and the times she wakes just to compare.

Today she was up at 5 slept in car from about 8.45 till 9.30 then again from 2.10 till 4 which was probably too long but I had so much to do.

I do think her waking gets earlier if she is teething but dont get why they bother her more at 5am than any other time.

nelly We take it in turns to lie in too but find i feel worse when go back to sleep.

The teething makes it worse but so do the lighter mornings and all sorts of other things. I could set off a bomb next to DD at 10pm but 4.45am a mouse would wake her. I think they sleep really lightly in the morning and so teething will wake them.

ledkr Fri 22-Jun-12 06:50:19

Ok. 5.40 which is an improvement,god its still early though isnt it?

dh has work so I got up but we started the day with a bit of light bickering hmm

Hes on earlies all weekend so no lie in's for me and then back to work Monday.It feels relentless.

Does anyne find that the tiredness builds up till you end up in near meltdown?I actually get physically tired and my ageing body aches.

I also live with an almost constant headache.

Ok moan over better start the long day grin

Meggymoodle Fri 22-Jun-12 12:09:21

I'm whispering this in case a. I pee you all off and b. I jinx it, but we are still having more post 6am than pre-6 at the moment. This morning, we got the magic number (7) from DD - I think this is the first time in her life - and a 6.30 from DS which is OK for him, bit early if anything but still. I woke up at 6am and it is the first time for eons I've slept for 7 hours straight, I felt amazing.

I am not saying this to rub it in but just to give you hope for a brief reprieve if nothing else. DD has been early waking (5.00 - 5.45) for nigh-on a year, in fact ever since she learned to sleep through the night. She is now 18 months. Is it possible they just grow out of it? I went to a cranial osteopath back along with her (ages ago) and he said anything after 5am was normal for small babies and anything after 6am was normal for toddlers. It's hideous but maybe there is light at the end of the tunnel. We'll see....I'll probably be back to my old pessimistic self tomorrow smile

thinkfast Fri 22-Jun-12 19:00:17

We had 4am this morning angry then Ds is ready for a nap as I'm heading off to work...

fififrog Fri 22-Jun-12 20:38:40

Hey folks! Just back from holiday. We had actually rather a food week sleep-wise. Mostly 6am (or at least quiet til then) apart from two days of teething. Naps were unsurprisingly here there and everywhere as we were out a lot (despite rain). She managed 6.15 one morning after a day of soft play, feeding farm animals, swim, walk (slept 45 in sling), run around gardens, an hour digging on the beach, picnic tea, bath, bed at 7.15 - maybe we just need to make life more high-octane??! I just don't have the energy! Weirdly, the night we arrived, she slept til 6.35!!! No idea what was going on, she'd spent half the day in the car...

Back to teething now - nothing visible but lots of finger chewing, dribble and food refusal. So am expecting a bad morning!

think how's work going? meggy you do give me hope... As does Vix who has vanished so all must be going well there.

ledkr Sat 23-Jun-12 08:27:26

Well we reached new depths today. 4am shock she also played up going down to sleep last night. I put her in with me but she wouldnt go off despite seeming really tired still. I got up at 5,have a bad headache.

Does anyone notice their dc's sleep is generally quite fragile? DD will only sleep in the day in pram or car and will not transfer from car to buggy even if she has only just gone off.

Today i gave dh a lift to work at 7 and she fell asleep but woke as soon as i moved her despite being up since 4

Feeling a bit despairing today,how do you keep your spirits up when you have no life?

ipswichwitch Sat 23-Jun-12 09:03:20

I've come for a bit whinge....
DS is an early riser and still wakes 2-3 times a night at 8 mo. I've been I'll and at work this week so really been feeling it. So, last night DP went to mates house to watch the UFC (ultimate fighting) that was on in the wee hours as its broadcast live from the USA, because a friend of theirs was competing. Great I thought, a few hours of remote control and bed hogging for me.
Got DS off to sleep about half 7 and because he's been poorly too he slept til 12. I fed him and amazingly he settled straight away. Then I got woke at 2am. By DP. Who was on his way home (bout 10 min away) and his parents were sitting in their car outside our house. They had just got back off holiday and lost their house keys. Could I get up and give them the spare. Not that I begrudge helping them ( they had a nightmare getting home) but MIL said why the hell did DP wake me up when he was almost home? They were happy to wait for him to sort out key and no need to disturb me!!!
The worst part is if he hadn't woke me I would have got 5hrs of uninterrupted blissful much needed sleep as DS didn't stir til 5!!!!!!!
I (grumpily) mentioned this to DP as I got up and he took the hump saying he'll ring his mum and tell her off for waking me.....no you tit, it was YOU who woke me damn it. God knows why you felt the need to when she didn't.
Now he's enjoying his lie in and I have a headache....

Whinge over. Here's hoping we all get some more sleep soon!!!!'

thinkfast Sat 23-Jun-12 23:59:01

Argh I'm getting it at both ends! Ds won't settle properly tonight. Keeps tossing and turning or standing up in cot unless I hold his hand. So tired!

thinkfast Sun 24-Jun-12 08:31:18

It's all change here. 2 post 7 am wakeups but frequent night time waking and won't settle until I eventually bring him in with me. Dh is on nights and I have work tomorrow. Can't handle another night like last night!

LittleMilla Sun 24-Jun-12 10:05:36

We're all over the shop - anywhere between 4:45am and 6am.

We've bought the Richard Ferber book and are getting tough.

He's left in his cot for at least 15 mins (regardless of time he wakes) and then no bottle until 6 or 6:30am.

He's then only put down for nap at c.10am.

Today we're going to let him sleep for as long as he wants as he's beginning to just wnat one nap a day. Then he needs to be asleep by 7am.

Desperate times and we're determined to try and stick to this for the next two weeks to see what happens. Wish me (us) luck.

fififrog Sun 24-Jun-12 13:59:25

Sigh. It is a mess isn't it? We had 5.10 yesterday as predicted, and it was nearly 5.10 again this morning but she seemed to go back to sleep. I heard a thump at 5.30 but then went back to sleep myself til 6.10 - DH was reading, reckons he heard the odd noise and that she was def awake from 5.50, but I don't care as long as I can sleep through it!

led I can't remember how old yours is? Mine has had phases of very fragile sleep, but just now she's doing ok, the othe day I transferred her from pushchair to car, then half an hour later to the cot, and she went happily back to sleep each time. She is currently pretty good when she knows she wants sleep, but of course in the early morning she's well rested and just doesn't want to sleep any more.

It is very annoying how they keep changing their habits - just as you work it out they're onto the next thing. And I feel for you think that sounds like no fun at all. I said at the time (January) that I'd rather take this 5.15 start business over having to get up in the night.

ipswitch Aaaargh! ;-)

LittleMilla Sun 24-Jun-12 19:42:09

The thing is, Fifi I am now kicking myself that we have probably reinforced DS's behaviour over these last few months. Reading the book I can now see that by caving and giving DS a bottle to try and get him back to sleep, he's now expecting it. And actually probably wakes at 5am in anticipation of it.

FFS

We're in the midst of trying to move house and this is probably THE WORST time to try and break him on this. But I figure that by moving he's going to be distrubed anyway, so let's try and get good habits under way!

AAaaaaaaaaaargh.

thinkfast Mon 25-Jun-12 19:22:13

Well today we had 8.15am!!! However that was preceded by Ds being restless and waking up every 20 mins or so til I gave him some calpol at 10pm. He then slept til midnight but then woke up and wouldn't go back to sleep until 2.45 amish when he finally went to sleep in his pushchair. Think he has a cold/teething so being a bit more upright helped him breathe. He us currently screaming while dh tries to put him to sleep. Luckily dh is on night duty tonight as I can't face another restless night followed by work.

I see some of you are getting some sleep tips from a book. Which one?

It's the randomness that sends me loopy. Last three days, after 7am (hooray, I had to check she wasn't dead), 5.40am, then today was 6am. What is that about?

I've got an early riser too. Usually 5am, comes into our bed and fidgets until 7 - just in time for me to have to get him up so that DS1 can get to school, plus 2 feeds in the night. He's 6 months, and I feel like I need to sort out the early wakings. We're BLW, so he probably still needs the night feeds at the moment. Possibly. Maybe.

LittleMilla Sun 01-Jul-12 20:08:08

I am going to jinx any progress, but I think we might be making progress. A week in of being mean and he appears to be sleeping longer. This morning was 6:45am shock but that was probably because he struggled to nod off last night. Saying that, it's meant he's woken earlier in the past, so who knows?

We're being really tough. Leaving him for a looooooooong time before going in, earlier it is, longer he's left (this is scream dependent, obvs).

But the biggest one is witholding milk. He's not having any until 6:30am earliest - just gets water. We have also curbed daytime milk to make sure he's eating more solids, esp at supper.

Having read the ferber book, I think I'd conditioned him to expect milk as soon as he woke up and so by breaking this association we might be making progress.

As alwasy, I don't expect it to last. But he's been teathing horrendously this last week and is being a general sod. So to have the progress we've had I am hoping it's because of tough measures.

fififrog Sun 01-Jul-12 21:33:52

I've been worrying about the milk thing. Whatever time she wakes she hollers for milk at 6am. I was planning to push it back once she was mire reliably sleeping til 6. I wish.... We're back at about 5am at the moment. I fear for tomorrow - she ate no tea at all. Half a fishcake for lunch, half a cup of milk and one biscuit 3pm - I too am cutting down again to see if it makes her eat better in the evenings, though nothing to do with sleep, just have a lot of fights. that's it - not even any pre-bed milk...

milla so glad these things are maybe working for you. Pity they do nothing for me. Maybe i should push back milk til 6.30 but then I'd probably have 1.5 hours of grumbling to deal with... Do you go get him before milk time, incidentally, or leave him til 6.30?

LittleMilla Mon 02-Jul-12 10:00:08

Fifi He doesn't get milk until at least 6:30am. Might be worth building up to it as DS was whining lots to start with, but is now getting more resigned used to it.

We had 5:45am today but that was almost definitely because he had a late second nap yesterday. We've just bought and are trying to do up our new house before moving stuff in on Wed. He was in the way so it was easier to try and get him to sleep blush. So he didn't wake up from kip until 4:15pm.

He didn't have milk until 6:30am and then brekkie at 7:15am.

fififrog Mon 02-Jul-12 12:07:56

See what I mean is, if she wakes at 5am and I don't want her to have milk til 6.30, do I leave her in the cot til 6.30? That seems too long to me... Gut instinct tells me I should still get her at 6.00...

LittleMilla Mon 02-Jul-12 14:43:20

Hi fifi no, no, don't leave her for 1.5hrs! I am leaving him for half an hour max, so long as it's just general "mamamamamama (come and get me up!)" rather than full-on howling.

He then comes in to my bed so that I can continue to chill and snooze whilst he has a cuddle and then goes exploring in my room. He has water here. Will protest a bit at first but once he realises that he's not getting anything more he's fine. I then go and get him milk - 6:30am if it's been early. But on Sunday he didn't have it until 7am, then brekkie at 7:30am.

We don't tend to leave my room until 7am, so no proper toys.

Apparently it's all about setting the boundaries that you want - so we've said that 6:30am is the time that we'd like him to be getting up and so peg everything around that.

Does that make sense?

feeno Tue 03-Jul-12 13:42:53

I hope you ladies don't mind my joining in...really REALLY need to moan about this...I could seriously hug ALL of you...I've been feeling so completely and utterly miserable about my nearly 15 month old son who has been waking early since he was about 7 months old. Felt so alone till now.

Tried blackout blinds, later bedtime, earlier bedtime, fiddling around with limiting naps, two naps, one nap, white noise machine to drown out dawn chorus, more milk, less milk, snack after bath time, solids before milk in the morning, wake to sleep (stirring him an hour before his 'usual' wake time to encourage him into a new sleep cycle), leaving him in cot till after 6am every day then doing 'dramatic wakeup' by throwing open curtains, literally EVERY f-ing thing I could try. I've paid for two 'baby sleep' websites to try and get help and N-O-T-H-I-N-G works.

I had severe post-natal depression which only began improving about 6 months ago but the sleep deprivation is making it resurface-except now it's probably ante-natal depression because I'm also 6 months pregnant-unplanned-stupid, stupid me!

I just want him to sleep past 6am but it's just not happening and wake times are pretty inconsistent in that it can be anywhere between 4.30-5.30 with the odd 5.40am here and there. I lie awake from around 4am waiting for him to wake up now. Shattered, depressed, scared s**tless about new baby and another bout of depression AND the clocks go back in October so will be up all night with new bubba and starting the day at c.4am with the 1st one...sob.

OK, rant over...sorry about this ladies---just HAD to share with women who don't have wonderfully perfect babies that sleep 7-7 or even 8am! Grrrrr...

Oh, feeno how shit. I can't speak to the depression so I hope you have RL support with that.

When the clocks changed last time, DD magically adjusted so that she was still getting up at 5am (even though that would have been 4am to her) within a week. No idea why but maybe it will work the other way for you and your DS will adjust to the clock change.

I know the feeling of 'nothing works'. Nothing worked with DD until she hit about 18 months. Now she is a little better. 6.30am this morning which feels like a lie in until 11am used to grin.

LittleMilla Tue 03-Jul-12 19:12:51

I had a 6:40am again today, and that was after a late nap yesterday (woke up at 4pm!). I am convinced that the Ferber techniques are helping.

HOWEVER, it's worth adding (and I hope that this could give you hope feeno), his walking has really gone up a gear. So he's toddling around everywhere now, so I wonder if this means he's using up more energy? Not sure of your little boy is on the move yet?

Whatever, I am going to stick to this new regime and hope that it leads to one of those magical children that sleeps until 7am. Even Sunday's effort made DH and I more civil towards one another - neither of us was as tired and we all got up together. Unheard of on the weekends.

thinkfast Tue 03-Jul-12 21:34:26

Feeno - welcome aboard but sorry you are here! Ds has had a dreadful cold and croup and I now have the dreaded lurgy. However we had a minor miracle on Saturday night. After no real sleep since Monday he slept upright in his pushchair because of his coughing from 9pm to 8.30am!!!! With me uncomfy on the sofa next to him. Of course now he doesn't want to go back in his cot! That makes a grand total of 4 good nights sleep in nearly 10 months.

Never mind feeling like crap any one else looking like crap? I have new wrinkles, spots, flakey skin, thin hair and I've gained 4 stone. Mo idea how to lose it as I struggle with my weight anyway and have huge sugar cravings with this exhaustion

Its so good to hear from other parents who also have children who dont sleep. All my friends babys seem to be perfect. Or are they lying?

fififrog Thu 05-Jul-12 21:16:46

We have had teething hell for the last few days with shocking sleep one way or another. She's not eating anything. It's very distressing. But v cheerful today apparently and managed to eat a yoghurt, a few biscuits and half an avocado. So 5am two days in a row, coslept last night, DH in spare room.

Milla great news! Annoyingly sounds like you're doing what I'm doing only I have milk ok at 6am. So not sure there's much I can do. Milk at 6 doesn't stop her waking at 5 so I'm not sure 6.30 will help any more.

feeno big hug! Feel very bad for you. I know what you mean about lying there waiting for them to wake. So annoying. Fingers crossed things get better...

think i finally bought myself some new underwear so no longer wearing scummy nursing bra. I feel like I look like a new woman. I am putting on weight now I spend all day sat at a desk. Very depressing.

fififrog Thu 05-Jul-12 21:18:49

Ps Milla final straw of hope to clutch to: what time is your bedtime?

issimma Fri 06-Jul-12 05:58:33

Can I join?
feeno apart from PND, I could have written your post. Dd (16mo) just won't sleep past 6 - that's a good day. Today was 445, even though she's exhausted. It's usually 5-5.30. Feels relentless and am also exhausted as 19wks pg. She is now rolling on my floor trying to fall asleep, but screams if I bring her into bed! Will get coffee soon!

feeno Fri 06-Jul-12 06:32:11

Thanks MrsTP...it's so bloody awful. Maybe a sill question but what's RL stand for? Feel like I'm being completely dumb...I'll probably slap my forehead when you tell me what it is thinking "oh yeaaaah!"

Milla I'm extremely envious. I feel like 5.40 is a lie in these days as since posting, my son has started waking at 4.10 and refusing to go back to sleep-the Ferber regime I guess will be in his book...perhaps I should give it a shot? How old is your little one? As for walking, DS started cruising around 7 months, 1st steps at 9, confident walker since 11 months and doesn't sit still for a second so unfortunately no hope there for me on that score either &#128546;

thinkf I do know how you feel. I've aged about 100 years and put on s**tloads of weight since I'm comfort eating so much. No energy to exercise-just tooooooo tired ALL the time.

Fifi Thank you-we went through the teething fiasco couple of weeks ago-twas a complete nightmare as my little man just refused to eat anything for about 6 days-he lost loads of weight-but I just kept gaining. Can't remember last time I bought any nice underwear-can just about manage wearing one of those awful comfort bras which just makes me look like I've got huge saggy boobs over my disgustingly huge bump which looks about ready to pop even though I'm only 6 months. So depressing when people keep asking " just a few weeks left now?" and I'm like Aaaaaaargh! No! 3 months yet! and they stare at my bump confusedly saying "gosh, you're big for 6 months aren't you?" Yeah-thanks!

isimma hugs to you and all of you in fact. It's so so so horrible-I'm at the end of my tether cuz its getting earlier and earlier every day-how do we cope eh? Although I don't think I really am.

fififrog Fri 06-Jul-12 07:59:12

4.40 this morning. Aaargh. She is basically starving. fee glad to know Someone else had had a similar teething nightmare recently. Somehow makes it more bearable. Luckily she managed a bit of porridge this morning. At least she was 91st centile so not exactly wasting away! By the way I think RL = real life smile

LittleMilla Fri 06-Jul-12 15:23:28

Ds how to bed at about half 7? Interestingly he didn't have tea and supper yesterday then woke up at 6.30. I know that's still amazing compared to even a few weeks ago, but makes me wonder if it's a food thing?

I'm on phone so no name checking I'm afraid. I'd just recommend reading the book to see if there's anything you can relate to. I found that there were a couple of things I was deffo doing that contributed

Anyway, I am talking like it's a done deal and we're only one week in wink. I'll keep an eye on this though and let you know f anything changes either way.

Good luck all, ESP the pg ladies!! Xxx

feeno Sat 07-Jul-12 07:52:52

Anything is worth trying cuz I'm on my knees here with exceedingly heavy boobs and bump adding to the pressure.

So we had 3.30 day before yesterday, 4.10 yesterday, 6.30 today.

But let me give you some context on the 6.30 today. He woke at 1.30-didn't sleep again till 3. Then woke intermittently from 4-6 and woke for good bawling his eyes out at 6.30.

Looks like his gums are swollen again so another week to 10 days of teething hell plus stupid o'clock wake ups to deal with. I have suitcases under my eyes!

Bubba in belly likely to be poor sleeper too by the looks of things-kicks like mad day and night!!! I'll have no hair left by the time they're in nursery.

feeno Sat 07-Jul-12 07:54:21

Fuckety fuck fuck

feeno Sat 07-Jul-12 07:59:52

Plus-it's my brother's engagement party today-aaaargh! So not only am I gonna look as big as a bus no matter what I wear, I will also look like I'm 20 years older than him!

Boooo!

Thanks Lmilla by the way xxx

fififrog Sun 08-Jul-12 18:39:53

feeno I hope you enjoyed the party! smile

God save me I can't take much more of this. She's mostly been eating ok the last couple of days but naps have been terrible, mornings absurdly early and she's just a misery. Had another couple of days of 30mins plus crying at end of 1.5hr nap (note required resettling in middle). Yesterday to bed at 6.30, tonight I just couldn't take any more after she arbitrarily decided she wouldn't eat because the food was 'too hot' - blooming stone cold after all the fuss. First time ever I didn't offer her some bread. She was asking for cake of all things. I was close to losing the plot. Anyway in bed at 6.15 tonight. That doesn't bode well for tomorrow but I couldn't take any more of her shouting/whingeing/gurgling that's been going off and on all bloody day. Oh, and yesterday. And she's such a joy during the all too brief periods in between...

WHAT WENT WRONG? DD was all over the 6.30am recently and I was enjoying that. Today 4am. 4 flipping am. And, she napped at 10am so will be miserable come bedtime (different timezone).

feeno Mon 09-Jul-12 05:34:12

fifi I feel for you-hugs and sympathy.

Same to you mrstp although I am soooo jealous of the 6.30 starts before that.

We had 4.35 today-FFS!

I'm seriously gonna die young with all this stress. Can't take much more-whose idea was it to have another? Certainly not mine. Well after this crap, DH will have to go for the snip-I'm not going to do this EVER again

We are only having one, mostly because DH can't cope with the lack of sleep which he doesn't really deal with anyway. 4am again today. Although she did come in with me for an hour so maybe nap will be later <crosses fingers>

Don't be jealous of the 6.30am stuff, feeno. It was a beautiful week but now I know how the other half lives envy

feeno Mon 09-Jul-12 17:24:28

I just want to cry lots sad

SrirachaGirl Mon 09-Jul-12 17:31:54

I had an early-rising toddler. For 3 or 4 years he was up every morning between 4:30 and 5:30. He's 7 now and we've managed to get to 6:30 (doesn't matter what time he goes to bed)...Not what I'd choose (I have to wake up his siblings to start the day) but I can live with it smile.

thinkfast Mon 09-Jul-12 22:26:35

Sorry to see you're all still here.

We seem to have exchanged one problem for another. After 17 days of coughs and colds (Ds) including 10 days and counting with a stinking cold (me) I've had just over 2 weeks of Ds sleeping most if not all of the night in his pushchair with me on the sofa next to him. He couldn't sleep lying down and was much better upright although we have had extremely restless sleep and frequent night wakings he seemed to generally make it to about 7am and one day even til 8.30!!!!!

Tonight is night 3 in his cot. Last night I lost track of the number if times he woke but he didn't wake in the morning til 6.45. So I've concluded if we have a crappy nights sleep we get a bit longer in the mornings. A good nights sleep generally means a pre Dawn alarm cry angry

thinkfast Mon 09-Jul-12 22:28:12

Sorry that wasn't clear - when I say sleeping most if not all of the night in his pushchair I mean that was the location rather than he was sleeping through (except for one night)

thinkfast Tue 10-Jul-12 03:26:46

This is not good <yawn>

feeno Tue 10-Jul-12 03:46:02

Sounds awful! I know how you feel though. Ds had stomach bug-then terrible teething and now nasty chesty cough keepin us up half the night. It's been approximately 4 weeks of hell here now. Back to teething with the cough as well.
Bedtime was disaster yesterday. DH away business since last night so on my own with bump and toddler. He cried most of the day-didn't eat much or drink milk. Cried throughout bath and bed routine. Screamed the house down for about hour and half because he didn't want to go in his cot. I had to stay in the room with him till he went to sleep. Felt so sick couldn't eat. He has always been happy to go in his bed since very young age, even through Illness so no idea what's going on now.
I woke at 11.10 and 2.30 from pure anxiety-lying awake waiting for the boy to wake up. Can't sleep!

feeno Tue 10-Jul-12 04:44:57

FUCK! 4.35 again

DD wanted in bed with me at 1am this morning. I am destroyed. Hold my hand while I sleep train tonight will you?

feeno Tue 10-Jul-12 15:15:17

I'll hold yours as long as you want love...bless you x

LittleMilla Tue 10-Jul-12 21:38:16

mrsterrypratchett have you read the Ferber book that I've been banging on about. We had a wobble this am (6am) that coincidently was when dh got up for work hmm and so I'm blaming him! Aside from that we've had over a week if c.7am shock.

Im begging you all to read this as it makes me sad to read about how shit things are sad. I was there just 3 weeks ago.

X

Which is the Ferber book? I tried shush pat and all that. Didn't work in the slightest.

feeno Tue 10-Jul-12 23:55:50

How is it going? Ds in bed for 6.15pm-Only one nap-awake since 4.30 yesterday. He is now awake-been awake since 11.45pm. Lack of sleep will kill me by the looks of things...

feeno Tue 10-Jul-12 23:58:34

Just looked up Ferber b

feeno Wed 11-Jul-12 00:01:06

Sorry, accidentally sent last post unfinished-just looked up Ferber book-it's called solve your child's sleep problems-I'm pretty sure he's the controlled crying guy. 5 min checks then 10 min checks and then 15 min checks till dc goes to sleep.

Thanks feeno. I do a very mild form of that. I don't leave DD any longer than about two minutes. It worked very quickly last time I tried it so fingers crossed. I'm in Canada so it isn't bedtime yet. She only had a short nap. I don't know if that is a good or bad thing. She has become very clingy to me when she is sleepy at the moment. I wonder if this has anything to do with the sleep issues.

You won't die from lack of sleep feeno you will just wish you had. <weeps>

feeno Wed 11-Jul-12 00:20:50

Most likely she is clingy due to the sleep issues. Since my son has been waking at night again and up to start the day from 4am onwards he is desperate not to go into his cot at nap and bedtime. I can only attribute this to the lack of sleep because before this he has always been happy to go to bed and the early waking was our only issue. Now it's tears at bedtime, nap time, silly early waking and night waking. I did CC with him at 5 months after which he slept ok for a while but he has never been consistent-EVER-which is what truly drives me potty I guess
I weep with you- wept all day pretty much- looks like another day if weeping tomorrow. Ds still awake

feeno Wed 11-Jul-12 00:49:21

Still awake

feeno Wed 11-Jul-12 01:06:44

Still awake FFS. Not crying or anything. Just chatting to himself in the dark and keeping me awake for fun. Checked on him just to make sure-gave him ibuprofen in case it's teething even though not crying-just covering all bases really. Left him alone-still lying there awake, listening to his lullaby-eyes wide open-please PLEASE go to sleep. I won't be able to get back to sleep now for hours and just when I feel drowsy-I guarantee he'll be up again to start the f-ing day. In despair

Oh feeno what a nightmare. I never had insomnia before DD. My first pregnancy symptom was insomnia and I feel like I haven't slept since. I know what you mean about being awake even when they have finally decided to sleep. I was awake for ages last night when DD was spark out.

feeno Wed 11-Jul-12 01:36:40

Still fucking awake

feeno Wed 11-Jul-12 01:39:36

Insomnia is crap-but my son is making it worse-his sleep patterns have become so poor and mine have become poor in correlation. It's the anxiety-thinking he's gonna wake up, he's gonna wake up and sure enough he does. Like now-he's been awake since 11.45 and is still awake now.

feeno Wed 11-Jul-12 01:41:01

And I lie awake once he's asleep too-complete pants really.

feeno Wed 11-Jul-12 05:51:21

After 3 hours if being awake between 11.45 and 2.45, he then woke up 5.45 to start the day. Fucking rubbish. Shit night doesn't even really mean much of a late fucking morning here. I've had 2 hours of sleep. Each day gets fucking worse.

woollyjo Wed 11-Jul-12 05:56:13

dd3 woke at 4.30am for the day, I got to bed just after midnight, currently dd1 sounds like she is trying to come through the celing. 9hr day today - urgh!

feeno Wed 11-Jul-12 06:01:21

After 3 hours of being awake between 11.45 and 2.45, he then woke up 5.45 to start the day. Fucking rubbish. Shit night doesn't even really mean much of a late fucking morning here. I've had 2 hours of sleep. Each day gets fucking worse.

feeno Wed 11-Jul-12 07:00:24

Sorry for profanity-can't help it at moment sad

LittleMilla Wed 11-Jul-12 12:25:18

Ferber is the cc chap, but this book goes waaaaaaaay beyond that stuff. For example, it helped me realise that by giving DS milk whatever time he woke up in the morning we were conditioning him to wake up at that time - he was being hard wired to be hungry at that time. So by shifting his milk time later and later we now have 7am as the earliest he's allowed milk. I shifted this gradually over a week or so.

If you've got problems with them waking in the night there are really practical solutions on how to tackle that too.

Not just about cc so I'd strongly recommend getting a copy so you can identify your own issues and then hopefully get some advice that will help.

I was cynical. Now I am not - DS woke at 6:50am today. IT WORKS.

feeno Wed 11-Jul-12 14:04:51

I'll try anything littlemilla. Will order today off amazon

DD must have heard me talking about CC. She didn't wake up until 5.53am. Slept all night. I was awake every 15 minutes from 1am thinking I heard something and dreaming about sleep training in between. I actually dreamed it was 4.12am, then woke up and looked at the clock and it was.

I've realised how far off the mark we are. I think 5.53am is a gift. I was at dinner last night with parents of the mythical 8pm-8am baby. Same age, same everything, just sleeps.

feeno Wed 11-Jul-12 14:45:10

Completely empathise. I can hear him crying when he's not and am constantly ready to jump out of bed even though I don't really go to him when he wakes-stupid really but this is what sleep deprivation does to you. I've been prescribed antid's by my GP now as I'm in such a state but just done some research on the possible effects on the unborn child so will try my best to hold it together until dc2 comes along

Sorry if I've somewhat hijacked this thread-helps to vent somewhere somehow.

Just ordered the Ferber book.

feeno Wed 11-Jul-12 14:49:40

PS littleM I've been giving ds his solid breakfast first since 5 months old and then milk about hour later so he never has anything before 6.30am full stop. Do you think that there are other things I could still be doing/trying to understand from what's in the book? In any case, it's on it's way and I thank you for trying to help me

Xxx

thinkfast Wed 11-Jul-12 19:24:37

Oh feeno! I remember the insomnia crap. Your own sleep patterns are so messed up and you are so overtired you can't even sleep when they sleep. sad

Can't imagine ever having another one and doing this again

Going to buy the Ferber book and try cc when Ds is fully over his cold.

Good luck tonight everyone!!!!

LittleMilla Wed 11-Jul-12 20:48:22

hi feeno other suggestions include leaving them for longer before going in - so leave for 5 mins, 10 mins etc. Longest we left DS for was about 25 mins shock. But he wasn't crying, just whinging. Again, I'd so wanted him to shut the f*ck up blush that i'd been going in to him quicker and quicker. Not letting htem have a nap until 10am.

Have a skim read and see what you find. I just found that I was doing stuff that I hadn't realised and through a few tweaks we've got one of those mythical 7:30-7ish babies. You might find that you're already doing lots of the suggestions (I was doing a few) but there could just be one thing you're not that could make the difference.

We've also been able to shift to one nap a day and he's averaging about 1.5 most days.

thinkfast Thu 12-Jul-12 00:22:40

Argh on my 4th wakeup of the night already

Bloody hell thinkfast.

feeno Thu 12-Jul-12 04:09:10

thinkf you poor soul. How terrible.

littlem thank you for the stuff above. Cant wait for book to arrive so I can get started.

feeno Thu 12-Jul-12 06:37:04

How'd rest of the night go think?

Really hope you managed to get some sleep. X

thinkfast Thu 12-Jul-12 07:37:21

Thanks Feeno. We seem to have replaced a good chunk of about 5 hours sleep followed by an early wakeup with frequent night wakings and a 6 or 6.30 wakeup. Why on earth does he keep waking up???

feeno Thu 12-Jul-12 07:43:47

How old is he? Could it be his molars? I think my son's are starting and it could explain stupid o clock starts and night wakings. He's 15 months old now.

thinkfast Thu 12-Jul-12 08:41:52

Feeno can your dp do one night shift so u can get one full nights sleep?

feeno Thu 12-Jul-12 18:28:13

Hi think, he was away until yesterday on business so I think I really suffered more without his help, especially being 28 weeks preg. But he's back now and I gave him the monitor, put my ear plugs in and went to sleep. Still woke at 4am-that's all DS's fault!
Hope you have a better night tonight!
Thank you

thinkfast Thu 12-Jul-12 19:22:28

You too!

Meggymoodle Thu 12-Jul-12 20:29:06

Hello ladies. Have been lurking around just keeping an eye on you all and sending you all huge waves of sympathy. Just to let you know that the early waking has been totally miraculous since the jubilee weekend but just this week we have hit the 18-month sleep regression so whilst we have post-6am wake-ups we're up for 3 hours in the night shock. Anyway sending you all sympathy and virtual caffeine.

fififrog Thu 12-Jul-12 21:25:53

Gosh you poor things! Hasn't been a barrell of laughs here since I last posted but On the scale of things DD's teething episode is over (even if tooth appeared then sodding vanished back inside - why do they do that???). WeirdlyDD has also suddenly turned into a will-exerting tyrant, but everything is Ok. Early early still though 5am ish though got 5.25 this morning.

Re Milla's book - I can't bring myself to buy yet another sleep book, but you see DD has been waking anywhere from 4.50 for six months now, and I have only twice fed her before 6, so I can't be reinforcing her wake up that strongly. Why would holding out another half hour help, I keep asking myself. And I never go in in the night unless something really unusual is going on (ie ill or once I think she must have had a nightmare or something). In the morning I leave her inthe cot til 6 regardless of what time she wakes. So really I don't see there's much more I can do.... Still if they have it at the library I might take a squiz.

Hugs to all you desperate ladies. fee, I turfed DH out and coslept last wed when DD hadn't eaten for three days and wouldn't settle. Helped a lot!

fififrog Thu 12-Jul-12 21:27:49

Ps should have said well done to Milla and LO smile dead jealous though!! X

LittleMilla Thu 12-Jul-12 21:31:37

fifi there might be more that is relevant to you but wasn't for us IYSWIM. Those were the two things that I read and went "ah-ha" but must confess that once we found our cure I didn't read other stuff.

Someone said on here that there are often copies in the library, but mine was about £3 off amazon. It's the only one I have read since DS was a few month's old so don't I'm probably not as demoralised/disallusioned wink.

I just hope that it might help all ofyou guys as I know how bloody hard it is! x

fififrog Sat 14-Jul-12 08:33:45

Incredibly we had 6.30 this morning! She woke at 5am as usual, shouted for a minute or two then back to sleep. Don't know why this morning she decided to go back to sleep but it was a welcome change smile

Hope the rest of you are doing ok!

feeno Mon 16-Jul-12 07:43:22

Had few days of post 5am wake ups which I was so grateful for I felt like I had no reason to whinge. Then today back to 4am. angry FFS

Meggymoodle Mon 16-Jul-12 11:51:13

Hi ladies....soooo I'M BACK. Bugger bugger bugger. The last 3 nights have been 5.45am, 5.15am and then this morning 4.50am. Not as bad as you feeno but frankly I could do without it all over again as I guess it'll be another 6 months until we get another post-6am break. DS was up at midnight last night so I had about 4 hours sleep having not gone to bed early enough. Am hanging and DD was utterly vicious with lack of sleep this morning. I so hope she naps for long enough this afternoon otherwise we'll all be crying this afternoon.

feeno Mon 16-Jul-12 13:21:09

Believe me Meggy I know exactly where you're coming from. We've had EW for approx 8 months now and getting nowhere fast. Seems to be getting worse instead if better. I hope it is just s bloody long phase like everyone keeps telling me it is but 8 months doesn't feel like a phase!
You have my sympathy-its hellish.

Can I complain about DH? Please? He decided to 'finish a chapter' last night and kept me awake with his coughing and rustling. An hour and a half later DD starts screaming. Between the two of them they will be the death of me. This is after a few nights of broken sleep which I took all of.

Then this morning, to add insult to injury, he kept 'zoning out' (i.e. not listening to me) like he was the tired one.

feeno Mon 16-Jul-12 18:47:23

I can totally relate

fififrog Mon 16-Jul-12 21:50:54

At least DH is well behaved though god knows what he's doing now thumping around upstairs, he'll wake DD soon!

Well our good night's were short-lived too. Just as we thought I was safe to stay up and watch wallander the cr4p started again... Miserable little thing today too. I think the blasted teeth are up to no good again, not that that explains the early mornings...

thinkfast Tue 17-Jul-12 01:38:10

My eyes are so red and sore. Ds go back to sleep!!!!

Meggymoodle Tue 17-Jul-12 08:07:35

Bleurgh 0520 again this morning so we are well and truly back into the pattern of EWs - I could weep. It's been such a lovely 6 weeks. Now just in time for the summer hols we have this nonsense starting again. What a cow! Ah well, there we go, not a lot I can do as I haven't changed anything. Will just have to start going to bed earlier again and deal with it. Frog - I think teeth have something to do with it as well - or am I grasping at straws yet again?....

thinkfast Wed 18-Jul-12 07:29:10

Several night wakings and 5am 2 days in a row. Work today sad

feeno Wed 18-Jul-12 10:25:45

This is so crap. We all seem to be at our wits end with this. 4.50 today. I'm destined to be woken pre-5am for the foreseeable future it seems or post 5am only with night wakings. When new baby comes in October I can see myself becoming a sleep deprived dithering wreck of a woman that becomes a mere shadow of what I once was. Sob.

Meggymoodle Wed 18-Jul-12 11:01:48

feeno have you got any family that can give you a night off? It's hideous when you're pregnant.

We had 0640 this morning but with an hour up between 4 and 5 so I'm not sure that really counts.

feeno Wed 18-Jul-12 11:41:45

Hi Meggy
Yes, my mum and dad have been amazing. They took DS to stay with them last 3 nights but stupidly I've been lying awake stressing about them losing sleep because of him. I just havent been able to switch off at all and keep checking my phone to get updates on what time he is waking up. Stupid me! I just want some consistency really so that I can get some consistency back in my own sleep patterns. The anxiety about DS poor sleeping is getting to me and it seems I have true insomnia now. Aaaaargh!

Meggymoodle Wed 18-Jul-12 14:16:27

It does wear off feeno. I was the same with DD for ages in that I wasn't getting proper sleep even when she was. I took some kids anti-histamine for 3 nights running and it knocked me out. I figured if you could give it to babies anyway, whatever miniscule amount she was getting through the breast milk was unlikely to cause her harm.

I feel so sorry for you. Being pregnant is knackering at the best of times. If you're stressing about your parents, do what I do - go and stay with the kids with them, then they do the early mornings and even if they don't do them all it's a break. Also, they can take the kids for an hour or so in the day so I can sleep. It's fab.

feeno Thu 19-Jul-12 04:53:30

He's back home and today is 4.20 wake up time

Meggymoodle Thu 19-Jul-12 07:39:46

feeno that sucks. I have no words of wisdom or comfort, but you have my every sympathy. Have you tried letting him scream it out for a bit? How old is he? How pregnant are you?

I think I would try and let him go back to sleep just ignoring him while you have only one in the house. We've been quick to leap up with DD because otherwise she always wakes DS but if she were on her own, I'd leave her until six. Today I' going to buy a digital timer to put on her lamp in her room and see if we can at least get her waiting quietly....

feeno Thu 19-Jul-12 11:42:33

Thanks Meggy. sympathy is good...my dad keeps Telling me to stop moaning about it, he's a very unsympathetic guy but he helps with DS so cant complain too much blush We've been leaving him until 6 every day forever-he very rarely if ever goes back to sleep. We've tried one nap and for a few days he sleeps a little better and then he's back to c.4am again. I'm starting to wonder whether I should just push 1 nap now 100% of time just to try and get some consistency into our lives. He is in the right age range so...
I'm pretty pregnant at the mo-28 weeks but look about 40 weeks and feel it too. This pregnancy feels way heavier than my first-I was all neat and tidy with a cute bump. This time I'm huge all over-quite depressing really.

fififrog Thu 19-Jul-12 13:42:02

feeno you sound like you're having a real shocker. Hugs! It seems like you really do have the worst of the pack. I moan about DD waking early but unless there's some illness or teeth issue it's never before 5am. And we get to 5.30 much of the time these days. But she goes to bed at 7 and teething/illness aside again sleeps really well. So 10.5ish hours a night, can't really complain. I have tried almost everything suggested in several sleep books to no avail, bar two: firstly wake to sleep because no way will that work. She's spent enough time waking at 4 or 4.30 and even 5 of her own accord. The other thing I haven' tried is a super-late bedtime. This is one extreme measure suggested by Marc Weissbluth and I've read it somewhere else as well. Keep them up as long as poss, ideally say 10.30pm, for about a week to get them so tired they have to sleep later, then gradually bring bedtime forward until you find a sustainable balance. Sounds scary, but if leaving him for 1.5 hours doesn't work then I'm not sure any gentle techniques are going to get you anywhere.

Re one nap - I decided once she'd done it a couple of times to "enforce" it, as two naps were just getting me worn out an stressed. and she got used to it pretty quick. Though Even now, 3 months later she drops off in the pushchair or car in the morning but I try to avoid this if at all possible as it messes up pm nap no end.

Meggymoodle Thu 19-Jul-12 14:08:51

I would go with the one nap too. I have the same pushchair problem in the morning but generally it works. It took a while for her to get with the programme but now she's fairly into it and for what it's worth, for a while it did sort out the early waking.

feeno Thu 19-Jul-12 19:08:24

Thanks Meggy and Fifi for advice on the one nap and the hugs and sympathy. Sometimes it helps to know someone understands how crappy this whole scenario is. I'm going for the one nap-he is just over 15 months so he's definitely old enough and it is too stressful trying to manage two. The only thing I've gotta be wary of now is over tiredness cuz that's another thing that causes his early and night wakings. He's beautiful and I love him but I don't love the sleep deprivation he's causing.
FWIW Fifi I tried wake to sleep a while back, big fat flop! The only thing i haven't tried is the keeping him up super late thing-the overtired monster scares me too much to try it. But maybe I'll be desperate enough some time soon.

Thanks again gals thanks xx

feeno Fri 20-Jul-12 05:01:58

Sooo, he only had one nap yesterday between 11 and 12.45, but he still woke at 4.10 this morning. FFS. Him and his father will be the death of me...snoring from one and stupid o clock wakes from the other. F-ing ridiculous. This is no life.

We had nap hell yesterday. DD fell asleep in the car really early for 15 minutes then refused to nap. Aaaarrrrgghh. I didn't know how much I was relying on that nap. Then 4.30am wake-up but was persuaded using controlled crying to go back to sleep for an hour. The problem is that I didn't go back to sleep.

Meggymoodle Fri 20-Jul-12 19:33:51

Ladies, you have my every sympathy...yet again.

feeno what bedtime are you doing with one nap?

By the way, have you all tried the baby whisperer forum site? There is quite a lot of good advice on there about early waking. Obviously not good enough though or I wouldn't still be here!

Anyway, much caffeine and love to you over the web.

feeno Fri 20-Jul-12 19:56:06

We do super early bed times to try and counteract OT monster. Tried for 6 yesterday, he was asleep by 6.20 and today he was in bed by 6 again but took him till 6.35 to fall asleep. I've gone back and forth with 1 nap 2 naps for the last two months and I'm determined to stick it out now...I don't know what else to do really, read all the books (inc Ferber and Weissbluth) but nothing in them i didnt already know or try. Ive also checked out BW forum too but nothing doing. The only thing left is keeping him up super late but I'm scared of that too. I've got a feeling he's already OT as it is, which is probably compounding the problem but there has to come a point where his body will need to make up all that lost sleep. I mean he was obviously tired this morning when I finally picked him up after 6 as he was bawling and rubbing his eyes but I'm a bit helpless as nothing works really. In the last 8-9 months though things have gotten progressively worse in that he wakes up for good if it's 4am whereas in the past he'd go back to sleep. Anyway I'm blathering on now. Just so tired and fed up and depressed.

feeno Sat 21-Jul-12 04:52:35

4.35

feeno Mon 23-Jul-12 09:45:26

I think I need help sad

thinkfast Mon 23-Jul-12 16:58:21

Feeno IMO bed time around 6 is too early. Have you tried7.30 or 8?

feeno Mon 23-Jul-12 17:10:12

Hi think. Bedtime is at 7.30-8pm on 2 nap days. When he's been on one, because he's been awake from around 4am, I can only manage to keep him going till around 9.30ish. He then wakes about 1.5-2 hours later which means I have to do the early bedtime to avoid OT. I've tried so hard since he was 13 months old to transition him to one nap but he just keeps waking so damn early it's near impossible. Yesterday was 2 nap day as is today. He went to sleep just after 8 only to wake 9.5 hours later at 5.30 or so. He's miserable on such little sleep. He's only ever really happy when he gets that magic 11hours but so bloody elusive. Dunno how to do the one nap thing when he seems chronically overtired and keeps waking so damn early. I wish I could keep him going till 11 or so but he's so tired from missed night sleep. I find if I keep him awake too long in the mornings, his OTness affects the nap making it shorter and then I'm stuffed.

Meggymoodle Mon 23-Jul-12 19:13:21

feeno I posted on here before and it's gone sad

Anyway, I suggested getting a sleep specialist to do some work with you. Google and see what you can find in your area. Friends of ours did it for £50 and they said it was the best money ever spent.

Re. the one nap. Start with it at 0930 then push it out by 10 mins every 3 days or so until it's at a more acceptable time.

Good luck for tonight.

fififrog Mon 23-Jul-12 19:32:22

I am not sure I can help much, but I'll tell you a bit more how it went with us for the one nap thing. I spent a good couple of weeks forcing her to stay awake - taking her to playgroup to distract her, watching tv even if she really couldn't do anything more, stuff a sandwich down her at about 10.30, nap about 11 then lunch when she woke. After about two weeks I found I could keep her awake til 12, which was great because she was about to move up a room at nursery and they only have one nap at 12.30. During this whole time she was waking about 5.30 on average but often at 5am. At first it felt like we'd never get into a routine and I couldn't believe she could take staying awake til midday, but they just need to get used to it.

I have a friend whose little boy would have his one nap at 10 or so for about 5 months when not at nursery. Another little girl we know sleeps mostly in the morning too. So there's nothing to say you have to keep him up til after lunch.

The one thing I will say which will counteract the "stick consistently to one nap for a while" suggestion is that I do usually give her a half hour in the morning at 9 or 9.30 if she had woken at 4.30 - but that time is pretty rare for us normally coinciding with teeth or illness, it's not currently a habit, though we have had phases of it before.

Interestingly, I have become a little more relaxed about naps since going back to work, because sometimes she will only manage a silly short one at 10 am or something when my mum has her, but she can cope ok. The thing is though we're working from a stable base - when it's all over the shop they do just seem to get wound up don't they and nothing works.

feeno Tue 24-Jul-12 11:32:08

Thanks ladies. meggy I think I know about the £50 sleep consulting service online. I did explain my situation to her and she basically very unempathically told me she couldn't help. I've been working with a sleep specialist from the US and still nothing. The US lady has been far more sympathetic and encouraging me not to give up.
fifi as we did 2 nap days 2 days in a row, I decided to push DS for 1 today. Managed till 11.

I think the kind of help I need now is professional/psychological. Seriously negative thoughts and I'm starting to hear DS crying in the night even when he isn't. Going absolutely loopy but living on 2-3 hours of fragmented sleep a night every night being pregnant would likely do that to many...(clutching at straws)

I used to hear DD crying in the night when she wasn't. I can't vouch for my sanity, just wanted you to know you are not alone.

fififrog Tue 24-Jul-12 20:18:08

Even I think I hear her crying from time to time and I've had 6.5hrs plus for the last five or six months. I can't imagine what it must be like on so little sleep...

DesperatelySeekingPomBears Tue 24-Jul-12 20:52:30

I'd like to add my horrid demon to the list...

3.35am for the past five days. Before that it was hit and miss, anywhere between 4-5.45

But seriously, 3.35AM. I cried this morning, literally sobbed. I don't know how he does it because the little beggar won't nap during the day for longer than half an hour at a stretch, I am literally nauseous with tiredness.

feeno Wed 25-Jul-12 10:39:02

DSPB OMG!! I sooooo feel for you and send you virtual hugs-you poor soul. I had 3.28 one day and was beside myself but it was just one day. Sympathy for you

DesperatelySeekingPomBears Wed 25-Jul-12 16:29:19

Dunno about you Feeno but I fully intend to barge into DS's room when he's about 15 at around 3am, screaming incoherently and then possibly shitting myself for good measure... Let's see how he likes them apples!

fififrog Wed 25-Jul-12 19:11:10

DSPB I don't know how you have the strength to make us laugh when so shattered! 3.30 is beyond the pale.

feeno I had a thought this morning. Maybe you need some sleeping pills or something to allow you to sleep through the anxiety for a few night's and make DH deal with the tiny tyrant?

Best of luck for tonight, ladies. Heat not helping but we can always hope, eh?

Meggymoodle Wed 25-Jul-12 21:04:40

feeno - totally second the idea of sleeping pills - sleepeaze from Boots works very well for me. Did I post about this a while back? Seems to be ringing bells. Definitely worth a try for a couple or 3 nights.

DSPB - 3.30 is not early waking, it's night waking!! What a flipping nightmare. Is he up for the day at 3.30?? What time does he go back to sleep?

DesperatelySeekingPomBears Wed 25-Jul-12 21:08:59

Meggy If I'm lucky he'll have a nap at around 9/10am. If I'm not lucky he'll be awake and thoroughly miserable until around 3pm. I was talking to my mam about it and apparently I was exactly the same as a baby and she used to tell me that she hoped that one day I'd have a baby of my own that wouldn't sleep...

Oh how I laughed when she told me that [hollow laugh]

feeno Thu 26-Jul-12 10:51:28

I'd love some sleeping pills right now but worried about taking any whilst pregnant. I often go to bed at 8.30 but takes me till after 10 to fall asleep, I'm then awake again between 12 and 1 and then up for good around 3 as I can't switch off. Can't ask DH to deal with the little tyrant at mo. he's fasting for Ramadhan (I can't cuz I'm pregnant) so he doesn't eat till 9ish, can't go to bed till after 11 due to prayers and then has to wake at 2.30ish to do the pre-dawn breakfast before fast begins. He leaves the monitor with me after that as he needs to get a little bit of sleep in before having to wake at 7 for work. DS was up for good at 4.55 this am. I am feeling so beyond normal at the moment and just don't know what to do anymore. I'm not being a good mother cuz I'm not functioning and can't be a wife cuz we get no time together, not even in bed and I haven't had the energy to see any of my friends for a very very long time.

fififrog Thu 26-Jul-12 20:22:54

Oh damn forgot you were pregnant! Bloody hell (excuse outburst) you are suffering! Sorry to hear Ramadan has got in the way too. It never rains, eh? Maybe you could talk to your GP? Of course, you may not want to take anything anyway, but maybe they could at least advise you if there was anything they consider safe. I can't think what else to suggest (other than the scary super-late business). I wish I could think of something. I feel really bad for you.

Of course the others of you with 4.00 monsters I feel bad for you too! Our 5.10 seems like a dream child in comparison...

meggy how are you doing by the way?

feeno Fri 27-Jul-12 13:41:57

Thanks fifi. Seeing midwife monday so maybe she can help but IME midwives tend not to be sympathetic to these things. Yup, you're right, it always pours round here!
DSPB I fully intend to wake DS at stupid o clock when he's older and I may even be persuaded to to a big shit for him but a wee would prob suffice!

Meggymoodle Sun 29-Jul-12 21:27:10

feeno - kids anti-histamine knocks me out as well if I haven't taken anything for a long time - that might be OK whilst pg as I think you can give it to tiny babies but definitely worth asking the midwife.

frog - up and down to be honest. Some mornings she's doing brilliantly - we had 06:45 the other morning but of course, that was the morning that DS woke at 05:45 so not so much respite - although I'm aware that's a lie-in for some of you! Then this morning it was 0520. I ignored her until 0600 - she woke up very happily calling "mum, daddy, henny come in" (henry is DS which she can't say properly yet!) so I wonder if she's having too much day sleep - but hey who am I kidding? I've been looking for reasons since she was six months old - she's 19 months now.

Meggymoodle Sun 29-Jul-12 21:28:56

DSPB - at least you know your mum survived and presumably you do not still wake at ridiculous-o'clock so I guess there's hope for us in there somewhere (trying desperately to see a silver lining here!).

Oh feeno we were just talking about what a terrible time of year Ramadan has fallen this time. Much worse when it is in the summer. I'm back in the UK with a jetlagged DD, jetlagged me and jetlagged DH. It's awful. No sleep for me the last two nights. DH has taken her tonight.

fififrog Sun 05-Aug-12 21:29:46

Ladies are you all still alive? I've been "on holiday" visiting parents and inlaws. She's had a couple of post-6ams this week mostly I think because of keeping her up til 7.30 because we want to watch Sir Chris Hoy and friends... Home today but tried to keep her up that extra half hour again - so hard, keeping her entertained much harder at home! Will see how that pans out...

Really hope you're all doing better - our post 6's have been balanced by some 5's and a night of vomiting but overall we've had a decent week.

daisylulu Mon 06-Aug-12 12:08:11

Hi ladies

Please can I join?

My 15mo DD has been an early riser on and off since she went through the 9 month sleep regression (which begun at 7 months and tbh I don't think she's actually ever recovered from!).

Just as I start to think we are overcoming the early wakings something comes along to cock it all up. I thought the clocks changing would help - it did for a bit, then crawling and walking would help - it did temporarily. We settled into maybe a three week period of 6 am starts but then she decided to drop the morning nap and it's been pretty shit since then.

I don't think there are any magic answers anymore as I thought moving to one nap might actually be the magic answer. Instead I wonder if we've spiralled into some overtired hell that we'll never get out of.

I'm fed up with feeling like a zombie and looking like I've aged about 10 years in the last 15 months. And I feel like my DH and I are bickering and not getting on like we used to. I want to enjoy every minute of having DD (as for various long and sad reasons she will probably be an only)-I am feeling resentful that if I only got a bit more sleep life would be more peachy (or maybe I'm just deluding myself!). We try to go to bed early but being back at work is not always possible.

I feel a bit better for having ranted blush so thanks if anyone has listened. I do wonder if DD is about to have another developmental leap (trying to talk) but I seem to have been saying that for the last 8 months!

waybuloony Mon 06-Aug-12 15:35:34

I'd like to join too please!

DS1 (age 3.5) has always been a terrible sleeper, never managing to nap for longer than 45 mins until he suddenly 'got naps' aged 3 (fortunately while I was pregnant) and always waking early. 5am was normal for him for a long while, though excruciating for us. Lately we seem to be stuck at 6am which I can cope with but now DS2 (10.5 months) seems to have caught the early waking bug.

We've had four 4.55am starts from DS2 in the last week and I'm mortified that it seems to be happening all over again. I've tried leaving him but he never goes back to sleep (he just sits up in his cot) and ends up waking DS1 which is a scary prospect as the last thing I want him is him waking up earlier than 6am again!!

Plus, DS2's naps have gone to pot too. Just had a two hour lunchtime 'nap' session that mainly consisted of him waking every 20 mins and me going in and settling him only for him to sleep for another 20 mins and the cycle to start all over again.

I've tried all sorts of routine shifts and I've never really found a solution, apart from putting him to bed early...which I know sounds like it shouldn't work but actually it does help. Last night ds2 was asleep by 6.30 and woke at 5.30 so had a full hour and a half more sleep than the night before.

The thought of another two years of this makes me shudder....but actually I feel marginally better for having got it off my chest!!

daisylulu Wed 08-Aug-12 14:01:36

Hi waybuloony - not sure if there is anyone else out there but I'll keep you company... How was DS2 since you posted? Do you think it could be a 'wonder week' or developmental spurt causing this regression? I know DD's naps and sleep become even more shockingly shit when going through a wonder week.

We had 5.20 this morning and 5.30 yesterday - could be worse. Could be a lot better though. The thing that's really bothering me is that DD is obviously tired when she wakes. Previously when she was doing her early wakings she seemed ready to start the day but now she is grumpy and miserable all morning until she goes down for her lunchtime nap (she will NOT go down for a morning nap).

Think I'm going to try your suggestion of early bedtime. Though being at work today realistically I'm not going to be able to bath until 6.15pm tonight and I'm not sure that's early enough.....

We've been on holiday and the jetlag has meant that DD has been up much later. This was meaning 8am wakings <weeps with joy> but she has steadily moved earlier and earlier. She woke today at 5.55am after having gone to sleep at 10pm. I shudder to think what will happen when we get back home. I can't cope with losing sleep on both ends.

fififrog Wed 08-Aug-12 21:20:06

Hi new ladies, most of the gals who started this thread seem to have moved on, hopefully to better sleep! I too have assumed things like moving to one nap would help (but no). What a bummer to have two of the little blighters at it - you're putting me off having another!

Terry I really hope your LO gets a bit more sleep... Getting eaten into at both ends is a nightmare!

Keeping DD up til 7.30 nigh on impossible the last two nights and we've also had 5.30 and 5.40 since we got back. It is depressing, but at least it's post-5.30.

feeno Thu 09-Aug-12 07:05:40

Hi all...I've been try

feeno Thu 09-Aug-12 07:06:59

Sorry, posted above by mistake. My DS was in an OT cycle cyz I had tried pushing him to 1 nap before he was ready and making the mistake of keeping him awake too l

feeno Thu 09-Aug-12 07:12:39

Aaaaaargh!!sorry-stupid phone! I was keeping him awake too long so he was OT and sleeping less and less. I went back to 2 naPs (well 1 and half as am nap was causing early waking for us so pushed it to 9.45-10 and capped at 30 mins) and then early bedtime for a couple of days. I dont want to jinx it but this week we are now on day 6 of 1 nap and DS has been consistently doing 11 hour nights or little more. Unfortunately my sleep is still shite. Keep waking between 12-3am and unable to get back to sleep. At least DS is sleeping though and that is the main thing

feeno Thu 09-Aug-12 07:16:14

I think the key was not doing cold turkey-he couldn't take the sudden routine change so I had to shift him gradually. Still open to 1.5 nap days with early bedtime if he gets OT again though.

Tried kids antihistamine for couple of nights and managed about 5 hours of sleep or so which was nice while it lasted. Don't want to keep swigging it back though just in case.

daisylulu Thu 09-Aug-12 12:43:54

Hi feeno that sounds promising. I think we made the move to one nap too quickly. We are trying for an earlier bedtime to see if we can get out of this OT state. Only trouble is DD now has horrific cold and will only fall asleep upright so I hope I'm not storing up trouble by allowing her to. If I don't though she takes ages to fall asleep and we fall further into the depths of OT.

You have my sympathies re insomnia. I had it bad back in January. You can see how our DCs also end up sleeping less and less when they're stupidly sleep deprived. Only thing that helped was persisting at going to bed earlier myself and then it's eventually I started sleeping better and could push my bedtime later (the irony is that as I've typed this I've just realised exactly where I've been going wrong with DD!!!!)

Daisy17 Thu 09-Aug-12 12:55:36

Oh thank god, we're not alone. Bless you all. smile

Misery loves company grin

feeno Fri 10-Aug-12 05:48:55

Well, we are back to a 5am wake up today-jinxed it-grrrr!

feeno Fri 10-Aug-12 05:51:53

p.s. daisylulu have u tried a karvol plug in? We found they helped DS to sleep better at nights when he was all bunged up at night. We'd give him a good steam before bed and leave the plug in on all night to release its vapours. May help u?

daisylulu Fri 10-Aug-12 12:05:18

Thanks feeno we do have a plug in and I think it helps a bit. We had 5am too this morning so you have my sympathies sad

took DD to doctors this am and it turns out she has ear infection. Feel like a very bad mum now for nearly screaming 'FFS just go back to sleep' (we are getting it both ends at the mo as she also won't settle at bedtime without an hours battle). Anyway hoping that the antibiotics kick in and at least we have an easier to settle happier baby even if she does still wake early <lives in hope>

Does anyone else find uncontrollable rage at hearing about good sleepers? blush my mums friend casually mentioned yesterday that her 16mo granddaughter is 'quite good' and sleeps from 7pm-8 am! I literally wanted to weep. I know babies are all different but I would chop my right arm off for a 6am start!!

fififrog Sat 11-Aug-12 21:48:39

Hi folks feeno fab news that you managed to break the cycle. So sorry you had another 5am but I think just be prepared for some blips. You know he can do it now so let that give you confidence. I am sure you will have seen the likes of omama and loveis saying it took 6 weeks to see improvements with a new regime.

FWIW I think we have finally broken the back of our problems, thanks to Chris Hoy ;-) My suspicion has long been that DD needs 10.5 hours max and that means you either take a hit in the evening or the morning. Anyway we finally seem to have managed to get her to make it consistently until 7.30 and touchwood she hasn't woken before 5.30 for 10 days. That's the compromise I've been looking for. Fingers crossed it' not a coincidence!

Right, gotta concentrate on Tom Daley...

waybuloony Mon 13-Aug-12 10:47:14

Hi daisylulu - thanks for your reply and sorry to have gone awol. Just been stuck in a sleep deprived stupor for the last week or so....

How's your dd? Have the antibiotics made a difference to her early waking?

Yes I feel the same rage brewing when people tell me about good sleepers. It makes me so jealous, I mean what is it that they do that I don't? I sometimes feel like I'm the only one that's not been let in on the secret that is sleep.

And also people moaning about their child waking them up early when what they mean is a one-off 6am start!! I mean try doing pre-6am for the majority of the last three years!! And relax.....

No real progress on ds2. It's definitely an OT thing with him. We went to stay at my dad's a few weeks ago where things really improved. We were out and about in the afternoons a lot. He always sleeps really well in the car and had usually dropped off in the back on the way home. My dad's house has a driveway out the back so I could leave him asleep in the car and sit snoozing in the garden until he woke.

After two days of this his morning nap started to get longer - more like 1.5 hours instead of waking after 30 mins...or if he did wake he'd easily resettle. He would then do his 1.5 hours in the car in the afternoon. And then he started doing 11 hours at night - for five mornings on the trot he woke at 6.30. I honestly felt like a new woman!

My dad lives by the sea so it was either the sea air or sleep really does breed sleep. I thought we'd cracked it but for some reason as soon as we got home we were back to square one!!

This morning we had a 5.30 start and one grumpy baby. He's just had a 30 min nap, woken really grumpy again and won't go back. Honestly, sleeping, is it really that hard!?!?!

FanjoForTheMammaries Mon 13-Aug-12 10:53:29

i might need to join this thread..DD is nearly 6 and today tried to get up at 215am for the day props up eyes

I have also come to the conclusion that DD just needs less sleep than other children. About ten hours in her case.

About people with children who sleep. I try to control the rage by repeating to myself that DD eats vegetables and fruit, she is happy, she is developing really well. She is happy and friendly and independent. My friends with children who sleep all have challenges and I wouldn't swap then for mine. Except at 3am last night when I would have killed puppies for a child that sleeps.

leebitton Wed 15-Aug-12 07:16:48

Urgh.
5.03am.
That is all.

fififrog Wed 15-Aug-12 18:53:04

Well of course teeth had to start up and ruin everything... Sigh!

way we had a similar experience on holiday in Cornwall in June - slept way better than normal, 2nd naps and 11 hour nights.

Terry please can I have a child who eats veg? ;)

fififrog Wed 15-Aug-12 18:53:35

2 hr naps

Tonight broccoli, tomato and asparagus and chips <channels parents of sleeping children> it is all me, not luck or genetics at all.

DD has taken up snoring and I am on holidays so cosleeping. So, sleeping but snoring or not sleeping.

feeno Thu 16-Aug-12 13:22:43

Hi again everyone...

With kids, it's always one thing or another isn't it? If it isn't EW, it's naps, if it's not naps, it's teething, not teething then a virus, not a virus then fussy eating, if eating is fine then it's tantrums...and the list goes on.

My question is, when can us mums stop having to just 'suck it up' all the time? I know the answer-never-but we're allowed to rant aren't we???

My PND or AND, or general insanity has been terrible lately so I'm not posting as much...but I'm still lying awake with you all at stupid o clock praying for sleep. I'm thankful DS is sleeping better though-still very erratic but you can't have it all.

As for rage, I've got plenty of that going, I could spit fire at those perfect mummies and daddies with perfect kiddies. I'm sure it's all a big fat act and behind closed doors, they struggle just as much as the rest of us but don't want anyone to know.

daisylulu Thu 16-Aug-12 14:38:49

DD is not great waybuloony but thanks for asking. She is now on her second course of antibiotics – I took her back to doctors today for her ears to be checked and I was very relieved when he said the ear infection in her left ear had cleared up – only to be told she now has one in her right ear. Oh and she’s cutting a molar. Fun fun fun sad

Sleep is horrific. DD has spent last three nights in bed with me – I am conscious of the slippery slope we are going down but I am too tired to sit there holding DD upright (only position she will fall asleep in due to pain of ears). It’s ironic that as soon as I start moaning about EWs something more dreadful comes along - its like the cosmos wants to show me things can be a LOT worse. Right now the thought of putting DD to bed at 7.30 and having her sleep through until 5/5.30 feels like a far fetched fantasy....

feeno totally understand where you are coming from. It always feels like one problem is replaced with another. I think I need to lower my expectations of parenting as I have always been a perfectionist and it always seems like everyone else is coping much better or has a better sleeper or eater. But even with the sleep and food issues (dairy/soya allergic) – I wouldn’t swap DD for anything. She’s happy (well maybe not right now but she’s ill), clever, funny and willfull. I am sure that all parents get their challenges in the end and I like to think that I’m having mine uploaded now.

I think the nail might have been hit on the head re less sleep – OT aside, when DD was sleeping well a few months ago it was from 7.30/8 until 6. I think DD only needs 10-10.5 hours with a longer nap in the day. And that’s all there is to it. But for now, I need DD to get well, overcome the OT and sleeping in her own bed before I worry about EWs.

feeno Fri 17-Aug-12 09:04:16

It's so hard when they're ill-suffering all round.

We've had teething hell here again-it's relentless!

For me at the moment, probably due to my poor mental health, I'm struggling to find any positives. It sounds awful I know, but I really don't think I was cut out for this mum stuff-I have no idea how I'll cope when DC2 comes along in about 8 weeks time-not looking forward to that at all. I know, Im a pretty shit person for saying that but I know I'm not even close to perfect.

feeno if it is any consolation, I don't think I'm cut out for the baby stuff. Since DD was tiny it has got progressively better but I still feel out of my depth and all that. I think we might be made for school years, or teens or whatever. The baby people will be lost but I think I might be OK with a 12 year old.

We have teething here and a stomach bug and I am flying to Canada today. She seems to have stopped vomiting but who knows.

fififrog Fri 17-Aug-12 16:42:52

Such a good point about being a perfectionist. Even if you're not, I reckon most people gravitate naturally toward things they're good at and so being parents comes as a big shock. Not to say we're not all good parents, but just it' not something we chose to do because we know we can do it well. Hours and days of wondering whether you could have done something differently that would have avoided some issue or other. Feeling hopelessly clueless. Etc. But in the end, all we can do is love them to pieces and accept them for who they are, owls or larks both, and hope that their habits align more with our own before we die of exhaustion!

fififrog Fri 17-Aug-12 16:47:08

PS I posted before I'd seen the last few posts (thread didn't update) sorry so many bugs and evil teeth playing up at the moment. fee I'm sure it will be fine. Might even be better when #2 arrives and you start being physically more yourself again, plus you will probably have stuff to do when you're awake at night - unless you're cursed with a miracle sleeper that is wink

TheProjectManager Sat 18-Aug-12 20:41:28

I am there wih you every day and can't believe I haven't read this thread before!!! You are my kindred spirits... Just makes me feel so much more human to see all of you going through carbon copies of my life!!

Without talking about nap jiggling or overtiredness/ teething / advice from others - smug friends stealth boasting I just want to lament that the effect this is having on me has been

No social life ( to scared!!)
Relationship in tatters ( we've both put on weight and im so angry when I'm in bed that I think dh is scared to come near me!! besides which we bicker constantly
Spend days off work going over the routine again and again until I'm more than obsessed - I'm working four days ahead of myself sometimes - trying to work out what I've done 'wrong'
Sat in the car in supermarket car park sobbing and not wanting to go home - three times in 6 months!!!
Loosing all confidence in myself and hating my completely blessed life as I spend so many hours dossing around trying to be enthusiastic whilst I'm waiting for eight am to arrive
Isnt it amazing the way it affects your life??
I couldn't even dream of getting enthusiastic about a holiday - last one was pure torture it was like an ordeal that had to be survived - that just cost us money!!!

And yet I adore my little guy with every part of me - what I wouldn't give for him to sleep later !!!

Thanks all for making me feel so normal - oops nearly bed time !

fififrog Sun 19-Aug-12 12:36:32

Hey project how old is your tiny terror out of interest? Sorry to find someone else having a shitty time of it too...

FFS I should have known better - I totally cursed it by saying later bedtime seemed to be working. We're now back stuck at sodding 5.19 and I have some kind of pseudo-tonsillitis (thank heavens no fever) that is making me really resent the extra book reading. Also worried now DD is only getting about 11hours sleep total in 24. She's been super quick to fly off the handle and meal times are a constant battle, but who knows whether overtiredness is the cause, or maybe she has the same virus as me or maybe it's just another evil phase. She's really mean to DH too. This morning I wanted to move her for a second so I could grab more duvet. Said go sit on daddy's lap for a second. Cue hysterical sobbing and "no no no no no no no". He's not even allowed to touch her books.

Not sure whether to revert to earlier bedtime so she gets a bit more sleep. We worked so hard to get to 7.30 and I keep thinking surely she'll need more sleep soon!

TheProjectManager Mon 20-Aug-12 07:18:08

17 months - so we're on the nap dropping merrygo round as well !!

Another weekend of arguments - all petty - all started by me - seriously I need to park this and grab control of my life!!!

fififrog Mon 20-Aug-12 07:53:27

Mine's 17months too. Terrible 1.5's and all. Don't think we're close to nap dropping though!

I think I can now beat you all. Since we got back home the jetlag means that 3.30am is the latest she has awoken. I was supposed to be back at work today but got so sick with a stomach bug (no doubt my immune system is loving the lack of sleep) that I have had to call in sick. She is also co-sleeping and kicking me constantly.

20 months BTW.

feeno Tue 21-Aug-12 19:14:08

Omg mrs tp! ThAts awful!

We've had hell for about 7 days now with NW and EW and crying ALL day and not eating or drinking.

DS is cutting top two canines. How much longer is this likely to last? I don't know if I can take much more-It really is not fun right now in our house. Good job Ramadhan is over.

Much sympathy to you fifi. It's so shitty when u think you've cracked it and it all goes back to pot.

As for being a perfectionist-I am so not one. I'm literally just about hanging on by a thread trying to get through each hour of the day. I cry most days at how crap I am at being a mum. I feel bad for DS-he's really hard work, DH, my mum n dad all agree, but he deserves better than me.

God, I knew I never should've had kids-I always knew deep down I don't have what it takes, but I got persuaded by my husband who wanted my MIL to see a grandchild from her bestest son before she died of cancer. She passed away when ds was 3 months and i was in throes of severe PND. Now I wish I was dead.

I sound terribly negative. I'm very sorry ladies. I am very depressed I guess.

feeno Tue 21-Aug-12 19:19:32

Ps project I can totally relate to the crying in the car. I've done that many times and cry even harder when I know I have to go back home.

I really and truly love DH with all my heart but we are just getting through rather than having a relationship. I'm surprised he hasn't dumped me. I find all sorts of faults with him because I'm so tired and frustrated all the time. He isn't perfect by any means but then neither am I!

fififrog Tue 21-Aug-12 19:45:22

Oh fee I wish I could think of something to say that would help cheer you up. My great aunt had three kids, number one was ok but packed off to boarding school age six so she worried like hell constantly, number two would play for two hours in the night, and number three was very premature and deaf and barely slept at all. My mum reports going into the bathroom one day age about eight to find auntie lying on the bathmat "don't worry darling i'm just having a little rest". Anyway, her words of wisdom were "it feels like a life sentence but it isn't".

Really hope those canines appear. We had a week or so of teething with canines a few weeks back and they VANISHED again. So not fair. You want to see something for the suffering!

Guess what- 6.30!!!! grin Sooo not what it sounds. Took 45 mins of crying to get her to sleep, woke at least three times in the night if only briefly. DH also unable to sleep. Every time I got woken I ended up having a coughing fit. Evil throat infection, in agony, probably viral and because still bf can only take paracetamol. At least it's an excuse to eat ice cream!

feeno I decided to have a baby because DH wanted one too. I wasn't planning on having any. My MIL died when DD was a few months old too (colon cancer and eventually every other kind of cancer). It's very hard and I do sometimes think that having her around would have been easier. We don't have any parents/siblings in the area. I get quite jealous when I see what help other people get. Mean of me, I know. You never know, feeno you might get one of those perfect sleeping babies this time around. If not, you know where we all are!

This thread has really helped me. People go on about MN being a nest of vipers but it is nice to think, at 3.30am, 'I'll go on the bloody sleep thread and tell them how awful it is today. At least they all understand'.

waybuloony Wed 22-Aug-12 14:47:49

Big hugs everyone! Sounds like so many of us are having a rubbish time of it lately. The hot weather hasn't helped with early waking either I don't suppose.

Project - I'm totally with you on the relationship in tatters thing. We bicker constantly too. A few times I've thought lately that we're not going to get through this but then the thought of coping with these sleep issues as a single mum would be unbearable...not that that is a good reason for staying in the relationship. I just hope that there is something salvageable once we're both getting a full night's sleep again. Someone tell me when that will be....please....

Meggymoodle Fri 24-Aug-12 13:05:43

Hi ladies - just popping in and out every whit and while to see how you're all getting on. Big hugs and sympathy to you all. We are up and down with DD - I have to say we are doing way more post 6am than pre so I am eternally grateful for that and feeling way more human. However, DS (3.5) has now decided he's going to kick off every night as he doesn't want to sleep on his own....great fun. Often we have middle of the night shenanigans too which is fun sad so basically, it's either one or the other and sometimes both in the middle of the night. Devastating really as DS was always my miracle sleeper. Ah well, this too shall pass.

So hope you ladies get some success in the EW arena. I have confidence that eventually they grow out of it - after all, you never hear of a 15 year old getting up at 5am.....

fififrog Sat 25-Aug-12 19:38:12

Hey Meggy, nice to hear from you, good to hear one of your kids is playing ball wink

I bought a groclock - been trying it out myself to check it doesn't lose time relative to clock in our room. DD came in the other day and it was still on night as I'd somehow got the time on it wrong, and excitedly said "moon! Moon! Moon" then this morning I had to put it on again so she could see the moon... I have a feeling she could just lie in bed all night shouting "moon"....

Where's feeno? hope everything's ok? thinkfast has been v quiet recently - do you reckon she's got it sorted?

feeno Sun 26-Aug-12 12:14:03

Hi fifi still here. Still battling EW and teething troubles. My younger sister gave birth to a little boy yesterday after a very traumatic labour. My mum was in tears afterwards...she couldn't sleep because she'd seen my sister go through hell and back.

Anyway, long story short, baby n mum are ok now. Still in hospital and hoping to be home tonight.

Ladies thanks for all the support and sympathy. It can be a lonely place struggling through motherhood. Helps to know I'm not a alone.

mrstp it's really really tough when you decide to go against your instincts for love. And losing MIL to cancer so soon after birth of our children is double the pressure. It was tough pregnancy and it was touch and go whether she would make it by the time I was due. I had visions of me in labour while MIL would be dying. In the end, I was really glad she got to see DS. But it was terribly difficult coping without DH at that time as he needed to be with his mum.

The relationship almost broke down but somehow, not sure how really, it didn't and we're still together. I just wish I wasn't so bloody depressed and could feel positive about new baby and my life in general but I'm in such a dark place right now. Lots of pressure to take medication by docs but I'm far too scared of what affects it could have on baby. Feel stuck between rock and hard place!

feeno Sun 26-Aug-12 12:18:55

Ps fifi. Your DD sleeping any better yet? And mrs tp? I hope jet lag has resolved itself?

Fifi, we had same thing as you in that about month ago we thought canines were coming. Sickness, crying, not eating, pointing to mouth and general meltdowns. After 8 days of that, they disappeared. But they're here now. Both top ones have just cut through after about 10 days of hell with DS and it appears bottom ones are trying to erupt now. I'm so so tired of teething!

feeno Sun 26-Aug-12 12:23:00

Hi Meggy! Sorry to hear your DS is playing up now. However, hearing that your DD is doing more post 6 to pre 6 WU is great news!

Hugs to all!

fififrog Mon 27-Aug-12 20:36:01

Hi feeno great to hear you got those canines! One less thing to bother you at night! We are still canine-less here. And congrats on the new neice.

Don't know if any of you lot are wonder weeks believers (I know littlemilla was) but DD is just in the middle of th last one in the book. Her speech is coming on at an incredible pace, she seems to be learning the difference between nouns and verbs, and is mimicking everything. This morning she took great pride in telling me it was dark and suggesting I turn the light on! I love this stage of development, the changes are just so obvious. DD has also been really really perky this weekend (helps that she's seen all 4 grandparents - for various long involved reason she's not seen either grandpa for months). And I finally shook the bloody throat infection after taking the penicillin, so have been able to sleep myself - hurrah!

Anyway, that's life: just wanted to inject some happiness into this thread smile sleepwise we've had a couple of 5.45's a 5.15 or two and reached the magic 6am this morning. So can't complain!

Something I've noticed recently is that DD I now pretty responsive to just knowing you're there if she wakes in the night. We had another of those weird waking up and screaming the house down incidents - I went in, patted and stroked her back for literally a minute, said "it's ok, back to sleep" left the room and that was the last I heard! Last night MIL slammed the kitchen door just as we were off to bed and I woke DD who started crying "mummy mummy" (first time she's asked for me specifically) and I just stuck my head round the door, said "back to sleep" and bythe time I'd brushed my teeth she was asleep. Little girl growing up!

fififrog Mon 27-Aug-12 20:37:55

"It woke DD" not "I woke DD"! why would I do that??!

feeno my MIL was given 6 months to live when I was 3 months pregnant. I didn't tell DH but I had a whole plan worked out where he could be with her and my cousin would be my birth partner. Happily she beat that estimate by a few months and got to hang out with DD. It is very hard because DH is understandably emotionally absent in lots of ways. It's got loads better but was very hard.

Jet lag has resolved but DD is now co-sleeping how the hell did that happen?. Anywhere between 5.30am (when she sleeps like a log) to 6.30am (this morning when she had spend all night chatting, kicking and whining). We lose the sleep somewhere, don't we? DH is taking her to his sister's house for three nights in a month. I will be asleep from Friday night to Monday morning!

Meggymoodle Tue 28-Aug-12 19:17:58

Hi ladies,

Sorry to hear some of you really struggling. Just to make you feel better (in terms of "been there done that and there's hope") or worse (in terms of "don't come on here telling us about the fact you're sleeping you bitch unpleasant person") both my children slept through last night - hallelujah!! I have gone with the risk of putting DD (she's the EW in case you've forgotten!) under a duvet, and despite the fact that she woke freezing this morning, it was not until 0645! She normally cries out at least once in the night but I heard nothing last night. I re-covered her with the duvet when I went to bed at 10am and when I got up for a pee at 3am so not sure whether she'd have died from hypothermia otherwise.... Am hoping she'll get used to it in time for winter.

Anyway, we'll see what tonight brings....

All the best for tonight and tomorrow morning. waybaloony - just wanted to say, the relationship thing is a nightmare when you're totally shattered the whole time. It does get easier when you're on a full night's sleep. Is there any chance you can go out just the two of you? It's worth splashing out on a babysitter. feeno - good news on the new arrival but sorry your sister had such a rough time. frog we're on big speech developments too, it's utterly hilarious. Nice to enjoy something of our kids occasionally rather than moan about them the whole time, which I otherwise do!

fififrog Thu 06-Sep-12 21:07:10

Hey ladies, anyone still there or has thread run it's course? We are mostly on 6am at the moment - hurrah! Never any later, mind. Have also finally managed to stop breast feeding - had 4 mornings when no issues, not even asking for milk until nearly breakfast time. Now she's got a stinking cold I think she's kind of regressed - went nuts this morning til I took her down for milk at 6.30.

The down side of this relative success is that she has been super grumpy and a real nightmare at dinner time. Oh well, I do think we've made real progress with the morning waking. And Although last week we had lots of mummy mummy in the night, it has now gone away again, thank heavens.

Hope you're all doing OK? Fee when are you due? Must be getting closer...

MrsTerrysChocolateOrange Thu 06-Sep-12 21:26:46

Hi everyone. At the risk of jinxing myself, things are much better here. I broke over the co-sleeping and decided enough was enough. Put DD down in her crib, expecting a night of hell. She cried for 15 seconds I counted then off to sleep and up at 6.30am. Since then we have had after 6am every morning <touches wood>. The only time I have been awake before 6am was when DH woke me at 5.30am. He won't be doing that again because he is buried under the patio. I still feel tired but it is normal tired not crazed, angry, weird, forgetful, out of my mind tired.

BTW, this is MrsTerryPratchett. I name-changed for the cancer/leukemia month.

fififrog Thu 06-Sep-12 21:49:01

Great Terry! funny I was looking at your name thinking "i'm sure it was Terry pratchett I must be going mad!" wink

MrsTerrysChocolateOrange Thu 06-Sep-12 21:50:51

That would be the cumulative lack of sleep! I'll be back to normal in October. I may adopt this name for Christmas, though.

feeno Fri 07-Sep-12 14:27:05

Hi ladies-we're back to pre-6 here-grrrr!

I'm due in 4.5 weeks-Aaaaaaaaargh!

Scared shitless

feeno Fri 07-Sep-12 14:30:39

Ps-congrats to u both by the way-it's so hard to crack that 6am barrier-well done on the success. I hope I have some success bloody quick or I'm stuffed!

fififrog Fri 07-Sep-12 20:16:35

Well, I am not hopeful it's sorted for good, I'm sure we'll always be blighted to some extent and sleeping later than six is still a distant memory. Did you feel you were having some success the last few weeks? Hope the last four weeks treat you kindly smile

MrsTCO think I am just used to calling you Terry! Prob wouldn't even have noticed except that I am reading Mr Pratchett at the moment!

MrsTerrysChocolateOrange Fri 07-Sep-12 20:29:57

Oh feeno I wish you a sleeper this time.

Glad to hear you are reading my normal namesake fifi he is pretty great.

LittleMilla Mon 10-Sep-12 15:55:22

Hi all,

Just a quick one to say that DS has continued to sleep past 6am, 7am and sometimes 8am. We have had a blissful week of a growth spurt where he started being WOKEN at 8.15am. Rediculous. But this morning was a more normal 7:20am.

Not trying to gloat in any way, just to say that the Ferber book appears to have been what we needed. I know it isn't for all of you though.

Good luck, especially feeno. Perhaps when the new one comes and you physically CANNOT be around as much your LO may sort themself out <wishfully thinking for you!>.

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