So two and a half years on dd2 is still not sleeping through. I really am desperate for some solutions for this.

[Slubberdegullion]

I normally don't do 'please help me' threads here, but to be perfectly honest DH and I are really at the end of our tethers. We have 1 -2 hours of hour nights sleep missing because of dd2 and her antics.

Virtually every night (she'll maybe sleep through once or twice a month) she is up and awake, we can set our clocks to it, 2.30am and she's off.

Usually it's just yelling for me. I'll go in and put her into bed (no eyecontact/talking etc). Then I try to leave her.

So she will commence one of the following
a) nudity and/or pooing
b) mucking about in her room (bouncing on the bed, chucking toys about, taking clothes out of drawers etc). There is now a stair gate on her bedroom door so she can't get out.
c) The usual one. Screeching. Ear piercing screeching.

One or all of the above goes on for 1 to 2 hours. Every night.

I have run out of energy and ideas on what to do.

We end up going in several times to either redress her, or get her off the chest of drawers. I regularly (to my great shame) completely loose the plot with her. This is of course a waste of time but at 3.15 I just do not have any patience left.

I'm sorry, this is very long. Writing it down has helped. Telling me what to do will be even better.

TIA

[IdrisTheDragon]

I don't have any suggestions I'm afraid (which I know is no use) but I do have a 2 year old DD who doesn't do sleeping through. I share the feeling of knackeredness.

[gingerninja]

Have you tried the opposite and actually sleeping with her? Wonder if that would break the cycle, she'd feel more settled and you could start to gradually move back to your own room. Sounds like you're both pulling in opposite directions. hope you get some success soon

[Slubberdegullion]

Thanks kama.

I really want to be told 'the only solution to this is to leave her completely'. It's just the will power seems to utterly evaporate at that time in the morning. That and DH muttering away under his breath about the importance of him getting to sleep as he has a job to go to. I won't go into the number of times that comment has turned into a fabulously massive row in the wee small hours.

[tinpot]

Does she still nap in the day time? Cutting it out might help if she does.

[law3]

hi, have you tried sitting with her until she goes back to sleep.

My ds 3.6 hadnt slept a night, someone on here gave me the advice of just putting him back and sitting there until he was asleep, took about 20 minutes first night, then got less and less. After about a week, took 5 minutes.

[Slubberdegullion]

gingerninja, yes we tried co sleeping.

Although it wasn't sleeping. It was DH and I pretending to be asleep and dd2 leaping about the bed, pulling tampons and condoms out of drawers, knocking over water etc.

Her circadian rythmn seems completely stuck at 'I am awake and doing stuff at 2.30am'.

[law3]

sitting in the same room that is

[gingerninja]

Poor you, sounds tough. I'm sorry I don't have anything better to offer. What about a sleep clinic? Could your gp refer you?

[Slubberdegullion]

nap cut down to one evry third day. We have tried enforced short naps every day and no naps. Neither made any difference. She really still does need a short day time sleep a few times a week.

[Slubberdegullion]

ginger, DH is a GP, when I sugested it he PHSL in a 'you have to be joking that sort of thing doesn't exist up here'.

law,I could try sitting in the same room. She would bloody love that though 'wehey Mummy's come in to play with me'.

Anything is worth a try though.

[popsycal]

we have the same
we spent last night at an overnight sleep clinic checking for sleep apnoea
Have you had her checked out medically

[lornaloo]

She is doing it for attention so ignoring her will work eventually. Do you ever speak to her about it? Perhaps in the day time you could tell her she's going to be a good girl tonight and sleep nicely? When she wakes up put her back to bed and dont say a word. Dont pay any attention to what she's doing. Be consistant with it as hard as it may be. I would get rid of the gate that will just make tantrums worse.

[popsycal]

ah just re read that your dh is a gp

[funnypeculiar]

Now, feel free to say 'shove off you silly moo, I've already tried that' BUT what got ds finally sleeping through consistently (at about the same age) was a good old fashioed star chart.
We were tediously clear about exactly what consistuted a star (in his case, 1 star for not having any milk in the night, 1 star for going back to sleep quietly & not crying). When he got 5 stars he got a treat of his choice (His own punnet of strawberries!). We reinfoced this every evening & every morning. It took about a week for it to work. Completely, totally & utterly to my shock & surpirse (didn't think we had a chance) he didn't do anything, unlike your dd, just sat in bed and shouted & screamed & bellowed for milk! In your instance, I think I'd agree with kama that I'd get rid of all possible distraction from the room, even if its a PITA for a while

And huge, huge sympathy, I lost it with ds a few times, and felt awful about it. (To be fair dh shouting at him actually seemed to do some good!) esp when you feel like they should have it sorted 'by now'

Only other thought -from NCSS - could you set your alarms to 2.15 (hideous thought I know!) so that you're there when she starts to rouse/calm her back into sleep before she notices it (have never tried this, btw!)

[law3]

slub - the person who gave me the advice, was seeing a sleep therapist and passing the info onto me.

I sat in the same room, not on the bed, lights off, totally ignored him, just sat there. I just told him, lie down, its time for sleep. I was suprised he didnt even attempt to get out of bed. If he spoke i didnt answer.

I was amazed that it worked, after 3.6 years of trying everything i could think of.

[lornaloo]

FP I think star chart idea is good.
Never underestimate the power of a star chart. .

What do they say...award good behaviour not bad. Think thats probably the key here.

[funnypeculiar]

6h, & another NCSS suggestion (again, untried by me!) a 'sleep book' where you take photos of her bedtime routine, and clarify what you want over night
eg.
dd has a bath & puts on her pjs (piccie)
dd brushes her teeth
dd has stories & cuddles with mummy/daddy
dd goes to sleep
picture of moon - dd sleeps all night in her own bed, if she wakes up she can XXX what ever you think acceptable, then go back to sleep
in the moring dd comes into mummy & daddy for big cuddles

[Slubberdegullion]

Thank you all for your suggestions, sorry I had to go out and get dd's and a whole load of boring mumsy bollocks.

funnypeculiar & lornaloo, I have thought of a star chart, but I'm not sure if dd would get it. Her language is OK but not fabulous and there is this time delay. Going to bed routine is fine, she goes down now with relatively little fuss, it's just I'm not sure if she would remember the chart at 3am.

But hey I really am going to consider everything.

Good ideas about removing everything from her room, that's relatively easy to do (does make the nudity/poo smearing option more likely though) .

I like the sleep book too.

We're off on holiday next week (will not attempt sleep training there) but when we get back I'm going to try and sort this.

Thanks to all again

[funnypeculiar]

Good luck

PS ds's star chart was on right next to his bed. When he woke in the night we would say 'well, if you don't cry & go back to sleep, you can have a star. If you don't have milk, you can have a star. Five stars & you get your strawberries.' Took about 4-5 days before he started choosing the star over the milk/shouting!

[Slubberdegullion]

. MN is great sometimes. I can't see the wood for the trees atm. Star chart by bed: brilliant and obvious!

[gingerninja]

Hope you have a good holiday, let us know how you get on.

[Slubberdegullion]

I'm ridiculously hopeful that oodles of fresh welsh sea air will make her sleep very soundly indeed.