Better to be bottom of top group or top of next group in science?(35 Posts)
Thoughts welcome. I know that DD is working at the level of the middle/bottom third of the top group in science in year 7 (because they all discuss it, don't they? :-) ) but is in the second group. What would be the advantages/disadvantages of staying put and to be in the top % in her current group versus moving up?
i was bottom of top set and spent the whole time being threatened with moving down.....wished they had.
so in conclusion - as long as behaviour of the lower set is ok and the diff pace is ok keep high, if not move down
If she feels confident, it is better to be in higher sets, because teachers usually have higher aspirations, and there is more room to develop. However, it depends on how she responds to not being top of the class.
Have a good weekend.
Bit of an update: she's worked really hard and is going to be in set 1 in September. I'm happy because it's what she wants.
Depends on the child but generally I would go for bottom of the top set. What does your DD think?
DS wants to do science, yes, and he doesn't really 'shine' at anything else. The word 'keen' doesn't come to mind, he can be a lazy little -um- so and so. But he understands that his best 'bet' lies in science.
Does he want to do science, Erebus, is he keen on it?
I couldn't make your choice with DS unless he was very keen because I know DS would too likely get too demotivated being right at the bottom and floundering. Better to find a career path that didn't require triple GCSE. I know being very bottom works for some, though.
Thank goodness GCSE MFL is not required at DS school. Although DS German teacher was the only one who gushed about him at ParentsEve . So MFL back on the table as a maybe after all.
For some reason DS is still in top set maths for y9 ; and has announced he wants to do statistics at GCSE (extra ), his stats exercise was his worst mark all term. But he loves probabilities. Think maybe he's a gambler in the making. I work a lot with stats so will try to keep an eye out for the next project exercise.
DS1 has to go 'up a set' in order to be able to do the triple science he wants to do. Our school only offers double science or 'accelerated pace' triple . He'd be best in normal pace triple but that isn't an option.
Still not 100% sure the top set doing triple will be the right place for him, there are some very clever DC at the school so he will be near the bottom. He'd definitely be 'happier' near the top of a group, but heigh ho!
And no, Y7 isn't too early to be thinking 'GCSE'! At our school an extra MFL GCSE and statistics are offered (or not) to certain DC depending on their Y7 performance!
Where I teach, it would be a case of the sets being adjusted at the end of the year ready for September, unless there was a pressing reason why a child was misplaced in a given group & needed to move immediately.
It would be very normal for the top quarter, say, of set 2 in year 7, to be out-performing the bottom quarter of set 1, & they'd be re-set for year 8 accordingly. Apart from anything else, year 7 setting is based on KS2 SATs, & they aren't a terribly useful measure.
To be blunt, neither parents nor students usually get asked their opinion! If you are working at a level that indicates you'd be best placed in a particular set, that's where you are timetabled.
For us at least, you'd have to be in the lower ability groups, rather than set 1 or 2, before it started impacting on options at GCSE - & being in the less able groups would indicate that triple Science (or in my subject double English) would probably not be the way forward in any case.
I'd advise emailing/ringing the subject teacher, but if your dd is keen to be in set 1 & is doing better than students who are in it this year, you do have a strong case for her moving up.
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My experience daughter has always been top of second set for scienst high enough level to take triple didnt want to done double. Ended up top of second set not enough space in top set teacher said right on cusp as it ere. In core science teacher putwhole set utomatically in forfoundation which i argued endedup paying or her todo higher in biology and chemistry result she got a B. With the additionl she has just sat the same again twoat higher onefoundation. Didnt have to pay this time lol o will see what she gets. Incidentally she has an a. Star in her coursework. So at endof day ithasnt harmed her none. She has spent last few weeks in with top set as they are doing higher paper and she does admit its quieter lol
It depends on the individual. I had a boy in a top set English class who hated it as he knew he wasn't as capable as the others and he begged to be moved down. He was a very talented sportsman and was used to being good at things and therefore really struggled to deal with not being as strong as the others.
Some pupils like the challenge of being in a higher set and if they are hard working and willing to graft then being the bottom of the top shouldn't be a problem.
DD1 was at the bottom of the top maths group last year, and found it quite demoralising.
This year, she was in the lower group, and is getting on much better.
A friend's DD was in the middle group for maths but still got A at GCSE.
Ooh, this came up for DS tonite, chatting with his maths teacher, and DS also expects he'll be moved down a group. It feels like a good move, to be honest, his teacher says he could easily imagine DS moving back up later, but it's worth a try to see if his actual standard improves with the change.
Thanks for all the replies.
She is a hard worker and very determined to be in the top set because she knows that she is getting better grades in tests and monitoring than some in that set. Will keep you posted.
My concern would be that the kids in second group might be less interested, less on task and more disruptive etc.
My dd was given the choice of movi g up but we asked for her to stay in the lower set as she was really inspired by the teacher in the lower set.
I recently discussed setting with my son's maths teacher who said that some children do better at the bottom of top set while others do better at top of second set. If your daughter lacks confidence in her ability in science she might be better off top of second set. If she is someone who is inclined to coast given the chance then I think bottom of top set would be better.
I agree, depends on the child. My DD1 works better being towards the top of a lower set than the bottom of a higher set. I suspect DD2 may turn out to be the opposite.
I think it will depend on the kid; DS1 does best near bottom of the group (he rises to a challenge). DS2 does better working in his comfort zone, so better being top or near top. DD used to be like DS2 but is now like DS1.
DS2 spent much of his life (primary and secondary) bouncing between top and second set (maths and science). He would find the pace of the top set a bit too fast, give up and go down to second.
This would completely demoralise him, and he would drop to near the bottom of set 2 for a while, then get his act together, go up to the top.
He would then be promoted to set 1 and the cycle started again!!
In year 8, when in set 2, I was told at parents eve he was due to go up again, and I asked if he could stay were he was. The school understood my reasons and were happy to facilitate this and he stayed in set 2 up to his GCSEs. Best thing that ever happened
Year 7 is nottoo early to be considering GCSEs.
Some schools begin their science curriculum in year 9, whihc means the decision as to whether a pupil sits double or triple is made in year 8.
Depends on your dc and the set situation.
If they're doing different levels at GCSE then it's a bigger consideration, as there may be a limit as to when they can swap to the other set.
If they're lacking in confidence, they may be better at the top of the lower set. They understand quicker than others, and have the confidence of getting higher marks.
If they're a bit lazy and will coast at the top, they may work better with the challenge of better ones. Dd2 works enough to keep out of trouble, so she'd be better in the higher one, as she wouldn't end up the top of the second one, she'd end up middling.
Haven't really given much thought to the science options at GCSE.
Isn't year 7 a bit early to thinking about it (she's only little! )
Sorry- your daughter not son, got confused with reading the replies of others.
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