Saint albans boys v haberdashers boys

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does anyone have any experience of these schools ? And would they be a good second choice to harrow school ?

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[happygardening]

Dont know much about them but I do know a bit about Harrow. Harrow is full boarding only and its point of entry is yr 8. Boys need to be conventional and they're not big on dyslexia etc. I suspect its not as academically selective as St Albans/Habs although unbelievably over subscribed the last I heard was 8-9 applicants for every place. It seems to me that there are significant differences between Harrow and the two you mentioned if you looking for a boarding school there are plenty of other alternatives if your son does not get into to Harrow.
One final point nearly everyone we know who's either looked at it or sent/sends their children there will tell you the parents are very wealthy and like to flash their money around!

[MrsJAlfredPrufrock]

My eldest son had offers from both Habs and St Albans and after careful consideration we chose St Albans. I'm v pleased we did. They are v similar results-wise but I felt the boys at St Albans were more individual and quirky and that St Albans understand it's not all about the grades.

[FessaEst]

My DB went to St. A and, whilst not liking it per se (he was not a school person!), he did well, got good grades and made life-long friends. (He's 33 so this is not current stuff but a reflection on the place I think).

Habs is ultra, competitive and academic, the families I know with boys there were more obviously wealthy etc, whereas St Albans seemed a bit less so. Depends where you feel comfortable to a certain extent.

Depending on where you live, St A is a bit easier for independent travel to/from as lots of public transport into St A.Habs you are reliant on coach routes or lifts.

[domesticgodessintraining]

Both Habbs and St Albans are very academic schools, downloading the entrance tests will show you that boys really need to be 2 years ahead of the National curriculum to even be in with a chance of being offered a place.
Personally I prefer St Albans over Habbs, the pastoral care at habbs leaves a lot to be desired IMO.I feel they?re more interested in their results over the well being of the child.

[darienmum]

According to FT, school ranking, Hab is 20th and St Albans is 60th.
Both are very highly competitive to entarance exam.
You can check each Web site for the sample of exam.

[wordfactory]

Habs and Stabs are very academic. Tought ot get into and rigorous once there.
Habs is a London school and so much more urban iyswim and the boys come from a much wider catchment. Culturally it is very mixed with high numbers of jewish and muslim boys. Stabs is more local (although in recent years boys are coming from further and further away) and less mixed. The sport is much better at Stabs.

At sixth form, Stabs becomes mixed with girls from mostly other local private schools jpoining.

What I would say is that neither of these schools are remotely akin to Harrow. They are academic day schools, where Harrow is termly boarding (with very few exeats). Habs in particular has no illustrous history (Stabs does to some extent, being very old and attached to the abbey), whereas tradition and history are what Harrow is all about.

[MrsJAlfredPrufrock]

Re St Albans Sorry I was rushing a bit the other day. My eldest son has now left the school and my second son is still there. They are very different boys and the school has catered/caters brilliantly for each. One is a rugby-mad scientist, the other a poetry-loving chorister. I find myself continuously surprised by their breadth, and depth, of experitise. I keep discovering new things about the school's facilities, staff, and extra curricula offering. It's been the ideal school for them both, in entirely different ways.

We were keen for the boys to have local friends. Also, if they play sport, they will likely be at school (sports pitches) every Saturday... when there are no school buses. So do make sure the geography works for your chosen school.

Good luck.

[MrsJAlfredPrufrock]

Times League Tables published last month

14th Habs Boys
29th St Albans Schoool
47th Harrow

[Moominmammacat]

My DS got into both (but went to selective state) ... and I would have been happy with either. Habs boys v. confident but not cocky, St A, always pleasant. Both a bit monied for my taste but both totally unlike Harrow. I'd chose on which is easier to get to.

[Makkapakkaakkawakka]

Word factory. Habs has a huge long and rich history, it was founded in 1690 and always has been part of the city guild of Haberdashers. A quick look on Wikipedia will give you the full and long history.

[wordfactory]

I'm sure that's right, but it's not a big part of their ethos iykwim.
Habs is a modern multi cultural school.

[LaurieFairyCake]

Habs is a very multi cultural school.

DH got a full scholarship there (working class) and he was never looked down on by those with more money - he said it was surprisingly egalitarian.

yes, very academic and very sporty.

St Albans - much more into church/choir and in a town centre so a bit more 'distractions' available.

[bulletpoint]

Thanks a lot for all the useful information. Most of the points seem to support what i had already been told that saint albans might be a bit "nicer" than habs, but we have a friend whose son goes to habs and seem to think its wonderful, horses for courses

[happygardening]

MrsJAlfredPrufrock parents who choose Harrow are generally not that interested in league tables; it selective but not obsessively. If they want high academic standards and a world famous name then they are more likely to consider Eton. Habs might have "a huge long and rich history" but ultimately Harrow is probably only second to Eton in terms of its "tradition" "history" and worldwide fame. I personally don't like either but many many people do hence they are both very over subscribed.

[MrsJAlfredPrufrock]

Happygardening I realise that. And league tables are little more than useless. But things are changing at the Big Name schools. Entrance to Eton is now entirely down to an academic meritocracy, well that and having the £29K pa fees (although they are generous to those with low family incomes -- though in reality, I suspect that means research scientists who are living off an Oxford stipend rather than someone who works on the shop floor in Jewsons). It's no longer possible to have your old Etonian pater put down your name when you're still a foetus.

I wouldn't want my children to go to any of the big name indy schools as there's so much prejudice against them.

[happygardening]

I am not one of Eton's fans but I hope that when deciding on bursaries even Eton would weigh up equally the financial situations of both.
Secondly I frequently read on MM about "prejudice" against "the big name indy schools" and am always interested as I my DS is at what is considered to be the most academic/intellectual boys school and a very big name. But listening to parents with boys further up the school and looking at the university destinations of the boys at my DS school this currently does not seem to be the case. Perhaps surprisingly even if there was prejudice I wouldn't move him to a less well know school.

[MrsJAlfredPrufrock]

happygardening - THE MOST academic/intellectual boys' school. Considered by whom thou? The parents who chose it for Ptolemy? The old boys? The Head? The Times? The FT?


I didn't mean prejudice from university admissions teams, I meant prejudice in life.

[happygardening]

MrsJAlfredPrufrock Im genuinely interested in your comments re prejudice in life. My DH has never experienced this and the only anecdotal evidence we have of any prejudice is a barristers chambers not short listing old Etonians!
Do you have actual experience of prejudice against children form the big names in the independent sector?
With regard to my DS school the view that it is the most academic/intellectual boy?s boarding school is generally held by all those in the independent sector! But this does not make it right for everyone or mean that it is better than others although the boys themselves and most parents believe it is of course.

[MrsJAlfredPrufrock]

The big name independent schools are ridiculous in so many ways. I don't doubt the education on offer is mostly v high quality and the facilities superb. But it comes at not only a high price to those paying the fees but also a high price to our very unequal society. The tailcoats fly in the face of Britain's claim that we are a classless society. The days of old school-tie leg-ups are over and the party in the City is well and truly over.

Harrow, Eton, Oundle and Winchester (among others) are ridiculous in ways that NLC, co-ed Westminster, Oxford High and St Albans (among others) are not.

The term "typical public school boy" remains pejorative. It is probably better in life to try and remain attached to the caravan of the society in which you live. Especially if you're arrogant enough to believe you are born to serve that society.

[MrsJAlfredPrufrock]

The big name public schools seem to refuse to accept that the party's over.

[happygardening]

MrsJAlfredPrufrock I'm not sure what your trying to say by the following:
"Harrow, Eton, Oundle and Winchester (among others) are ridiculous" surely you don't think not being coed makes you ridiculous thats just personal preference and
"The big name public schools seem to refuse to accept that the party's over."
Perhaps you could expand on these comments.

[MrsJAlfredPrufrock]

happygardening I ve just seen on that other thread that your son goes to Winchester. And your husband went to St Paul's (as did my bil) which would definitely go on my less showy list. Why Winchester? Is you son in college or a commoner house?

[happygardening]

Its alright you don't have to be embarrassed I've just made a dig at you on the other thread so we're equal!! My son is a commoner at Win Coll. He also got a place at St Pauls (which we all loved its a schools firmly in the 21st century) but he would have had to have boarded and there are now hardly any boarders left and none in his year; there were about 180 when my DH was there. I don't know how much you know about Win Coll but we choose it because it is actually less showy than that well know school off the M4. There are no tail coats or boaters here the head is trying very hard to down play a lot of that stuff and I believe turn it into an academic/intellectual centre of excellence. It is offering generous bursaries and trying to open its doors up to children from state schools etc. We are not looking for an old school tie leg up or want my DS to emerge as a "typical public school boy" or even particularly interested in results we wanted real intellectual stimulation and loved the house system. We looked at loads of schools for my other DS so feel I am quite an expert and IMHO only Win Coll offers this; there recent move to only the Pre U I believe has help facilitate this. There will now be hundreds of posts disagreeing with what I've written but this is my view and my DS2 has never been happier since he started there.

[MrsJAlfredPrufrock]

Nothing to do with being coed btw. You must surely see that there is a case to be answered wrt showy privilege?