Secondary school streaming

[AMM99]

Hello - I'm new here, so please bear with me if this has been covered off before. :-)

My daughter is starting secondary school in September. She got 5s in all her English SAT results, and 4s in both Maths and Science (tbc - mixed messages from teacher assessment and final school report but likely to remain at 4). Given this information, where is she likely to end up - her new school stream by academic ability. As an aside, she is a hugely confident, outgoing personality with a lot to say for herself! - do they take personal characteristics into consideration when streaming also?

Any advice/comments appreciated,
Thanks!

[cory]

do they stream by subject or by overall ability? In dd's school it is by subject so you can be in different sets for English and Maths. Also, they take their own tests into account, and it is fairly easy to move up (or down) the sets.

[feckwit]

My daughter's secondary don't stream until year 8 so I am guessing all will be different. Surely the teachers will be experienced enough to do what is right for your daughter?

[chopchopbusybusy]

I think it's more common to have sets rather than streams so each subject is treated individually, but you should ask the school how they do things.

[AMM99]

Thanks for taking the time to reply! Cory - I understand that they stream by overall ability i.e. they are all allocated a 'house' and the house is indicative of the ability but I just wondered if the 5s in English and her personality would mean they would place her in a higher set or would the 4s in Maths and Science mean a slightly lower set? Feckwit (fab name!) - I'm sure the teachers are experienced enough to do what is right for my girl, but I'm new to this so just wondered if anyone had any experience of streaming so I know what to expect. Thanks!

[Themumsnot]

No experience, I am afraid, of that sort of overall streaming - most schools set on a subject-by-subject basis. However, many schools do CAT tests (which are based on aptitude) early in Y7 and use those results to set. So they may not set straight away. It is very out-of-fashion now to stream and not considered best practice. You would be probably best off seeking more info from the school on their exact methods.

[AMM99]

Themumsnot - thank you! DD has just told me that whilst I was travelling with work in June that the Y7 students visited and told her that they carried out CAT tests - who knew?!!! Not me obviously. :-)

[activate]

DS1 and 2s schools do tests in the first 3 weeks of secondary - they then stream in English, Maths and Science but group in all others - the sets are fluid and children move up and down half-termly - some students get pushed to bottom set for poor behaviour and have to work their way back up to top set

[AMM99]

activate - thanks. I can see some fraught evenings at the dining room table coming up! When we do maths, I can actually see her eyes glaze over. :-)

[activate]

I have that problem with DS3 and reading questions properly in English

[tooearlytobeup]

Hi, I dont know if this will help, but my daughter is just going up to year 7. Her new school places them in sets from the beginning. She had all 5's in English Maths and Science, and is placed in the top set. The other children I know from her existing class who will be in the same form had mainly 5's but also some 4's. Their new school will then review at Xmas. They have 5 streams in each year.

[bellavita]

I thought CAT tests were used pick up on such things as dyslexia? and were not used for steaming. This is my understanding from our exams officer in the secondary school I work in.

[bellavita]

Streaming

[bruffin]

DCs' school use CATS for streaming and target setting, along with SATS. The do their CATS in July as part of the induction days.
I posted similar to the above when DS started secondary, he is now going into yr11. He has very high science, high maths and comprehension but only just scrapped a 4 for writing. His school split into 3 bands. Top band is J and that is then split into 3 classes. He was J1 for Science, Hummanities and MFL and J2 for maths and english. He struggled with MFL because of dyslexia type problems and was put down to J2 in yr8 and was eventually moved to J1 for maths.

[bruffin]

Also Bellavita - I had heard that CAT tests should pick up problems, however his CAT scores are only seperated by 2 points, so didn't pick up his literacy SN issues.

[Tortu]

Gosh yes, I really don't like the sound of that. Placing students in houses based on ability doesn't sound to me like there is a very flexible system in place.

Just to say that every school I've worked in ignores the SATs completely. Students are coached so well for them that they are more a reflection of the primary school than the student and hence irrelevant. We always carry out our own assessments. In my current school students are not setted until their first half term. Tests in each subject are carried out in the first week and then teachers basically just watch them for the next 6 weeks. As we also have a lot of behavioural concerns in our school, we also set for behaviour.

[mummytime]

I can't imagine sending my kids to such a school. The inflexibility is unbelievable.
BTW at DCs secondary several children have moved from 4a to 5a in Maths in one year, and at least one to 6a! I guess they would all have been stuck in the middle to bottom streams/houses. I really can't believe the house thing!

[TalkinPeace2]

Old style streaming does not meet with the guidance of "every child matters" and with computerised timetabling is now comparatively rare
setting - in subject groups is much more common and much more constructive
DDs comp has
maths / IT / science
English / MFL / humanities
tech / pe / arts
(I think) as the three streams of setting
and it works a treat - ensures she meets others in their 300 strong year group while normally working with those at the same level as her.
When DS joins I gather they have stopped setting in Yr 7 for other than Maths but it kicks in during year 8
In years 10 and 11 they are in sets for every subject and only the top ones do triple science, Latin, Russian and Japanese
(((comps ))) - so much better than the GDST I went to !!

[inkyfingers]

Mine go to a pretty large school so they stream into 2 broad bands and within that set for maths and English etc. Avoids have 200+ pupils all doing PE or French at same time. But means if you're in A or B that's pretty much where you stay even if you can move sets in your stream.

[inthesticks]

In year 7 and 8 mine are "banded" in all subjects apart from Maths which is set strictly according to SATs results. Those with level 5a are in set one.
The banding is a looser streaming. There are 3 levels. The higher level includes roughly, those with level 5 in Eng and Maths , Band 2 is those with mostly level 4s and band 3 is much smaller and includes those with SEN.

[erebus]

Gosh streaming! How quaint!

DS's school doesn't set in anything except maths when they've been there half a term and have done CATS, and MFL from the start of Y8.

They sort of 'set' according to aptitude, there on in, as in the cleverest DCs go on the triple science trajectory, the less clever double science etc; the least academically able might do a BTEC in performing arts.

Whilst we parents all gasp at the relative lack of setting, let alone streaming, the fact remains the school produces the best exam results for a state comp in the county, so is obviously doing well by all its pupils so it must know what it's doing!

[generalhaig]

am puzzled by this - ds2 is about to go to an 'outstanding' secondary - just had glowing OFSTED and gets very good results

it's partially selective (25% get in on the test) and the kids are streamed from day 1 - there's extension, upper, middle and support - and they do all their lessons in their stream

if it's not good practice, why did the OFSTED inspectors praise the school to the skies a couple of months ago ... (genuinely confused here)

[titchy]

dd's school is quite rare in that it sets in all subjects from year 7. They do CATS durign the first half term, and lessons in their tutor group, then after October half term, their CATS, SATS and class work determine which set they go in.

The year group is split into two parallel bands, with each band doing Maths, English and Science at the same time, so movement up and down sets in these subjects is easy. Humanities are timetabled together, as are MFL, and practical subjects (Art, ICT, DT), and again children are set for their overall ability in, e.g. MFL.

To answer the OP - personality will not (at least it shoudln't) make any difference as to which stream she goes into.