How are the other No voters voting in the EU referendum?

[SirChenjin]

I am going backwards and forwards on the EU referendum - so many pros and cons (imo) for both sides and I'm genuinely undecided, which is a first for me in an election.

However, such is my loathing for NS, the SNP, their lack of respect for the will of the Scottish people and their endless threats of another indy referendum (this time using the EU referendum as a trigger, as opposed to the wind blowing in the wrong direction or the price of fish) that I am sorely tempted to vote Out simply to reduce the number of Scots voting to stay in whilst sticking up 2 fingers to that odious woman in my own small way

Anyone else feel the same - or are you taking a more mature, pragmatic approach?

[WankersHacksandThieves]

I genuinely haven't decided either Sir , I'm similarly disposed to "Oor great leader" as you are. I've changed name recently but we've been on threads together before.

I'm not sure you can play the averages. What SNP want is an overall UK vote to leave and a Scottish vote to stay. If I vote stay to reduce the likelihood of an overall Brexit vote and then stuff their plans, then I could be contributing to the SNP Scotland stay vote and If I vote leave I could still be playing into their hands by forcing through the Brexit and then giving SNP a mandate to stay depending on how everyone else is voting. It would therefore be helpful if all UK eligible voters could let me know their plans? It's all looking to close to call in the polls.

I should probably just look at the info available and make my mind up but I'm a thrawn cow. :o

[SirChenjin]

I know - me too

I suspect that the Yes camp will be voting tactically - anything to force another referendum - so given my to-ing and fro-ing I'm tempted to take that approach too, given that I'm still an undecided voter. Something has to be the deciding factor, right?

[WankersHacksandThieves]

So, we know that the SNP faithful will have a block vote one way or the other - we just don't know what the message has been. There must be a secret code word to be released before the vote. Maybe obscured in the middle of a speech or in a headline somewhere - we need an insider to spill the beans...

Or yes, I could read all the available info and decide based on my view of the issues...

[morningtoncrescent62]

There were lots of I'm With Nicola people at the I'm With Nicola stall in my local high street on Saturday campaigning for an In vote. I'm reading this as block vote In.

I'm also undecided, but leaning towards Out. I've been reading some of the articles on this website to get some idea of the alternative arguments for staying in, seeing as how I'm not impressed with what's being argued by either of the official campaigns.

[SirChenjin]

I suspect that they're going for In - whilst banking on an Out vote in the rUK. Convenienting forgetting that Scotland voted to remain part of that same UK, they will continue to waste time and money on destabilising Scotland by calling for a 2nd indy ref, whilst ignoring the things that matter to the majority such as education and the economy, both of which are shit under their watch.

Hmm...decisions, decisions.

[cheeseandcrackers77]

I'm edging towards out.

On some of the pro indy fb pages a good few SNP supporters are voting out and don't agree with N'S stand however on saying that there is a worrying amount who want out but will vote in so that we get independence and then they believe we will have another vote on the EU and they will then vote out.

Astounding they believe this the SNP are pro Europe there is no way on hell if they get independence they will allow a vote on the EU.

[Jbck]

Im a remainer but I hate noxious Nicola and devious Dave with equal gusto.

I am even more nervous than during Indyref.

[nulgirl]

I've been having exactly the same thoughts. My idea of hell is a Brexit followed by a 2nd referendum and entering Europe as a new nation on a shitty deal. I think I'm going to vote remain and hope that sufficient English people join me so we can keep the status quo. Not enamoured with the EU as an organisation but I like the concept of a united Europe. On partially factored into my thinking is seeing Boris and Nigel's squirmy faces on election night.

[LassWiTheDelicateAir]

I will be voting remain. I genuinely want to stay in but even if I didn't I could not bear another indy referendum.

It would however be hilarious if Brexit won in both rUK and Scotland, and even more so if rUK voted remain and Scotland didn't.

[Iknownuffink]

I will be voting to remain and relish the thought of another Indy referendum.

[WankersHacksandThieves]

Thanks for the insight Iknownuffink

Can you tell me what is so bad about your life currently that an independent Scotland will improve? What do you see getting better and how?

Just heading to bed by the way so will pick up on your answer tomorrow in case you reply and think I'm ignoring you :)

[SirChenjin]

I'm curious nuffink - an independent Scotland within a structure that determines so many things about our lives from many miles away? How do you see that panning out from an economic, fiscal, political and legislative POV?

[cdtaylornats]

If we ever did leave the UK I suspect that EU membership would be the only thing that would save us from the insanity that is SNP policy.

I am pro-EU but sorely tempted to vote out simply on the grounds that Sturgeon has spoken so loudly about Scots wanting to stay in that her position would be untenable..

[LunaLoveg00d]

I'll be voting to remain, and i'm a very strong NO voter. I do think we're better off in Europe for a whole host of reasons and pay zero attention to anything nasty Nicola and her henchmen say.

If there was a second IndyRef in the future because Scotland had voted "in" and the rest of the UK had voted "out", I would still be a NO to independence because I'd rather be in the UK and out of Europe than in Europe and out of the UK.

It's all very complicated.

[SirChenjin]

Agree cd

Luna - I completely get what you're saying, but I suppose I'm coming at it from the POV that the more Scots that vote Out the less of a mandate The Numpty and her acolytes have to call another indy ref - which was one of the most destabilising and divisive periods in our history.

[GrouchyKiwi]

I'm voting Stay despite the spectre of another referendum (although polling shows there's little appetite for that).

DH and I are seriously considering moving to NZ in the event of a Brexit and second Indy ref.

[SirChenjin]

Polling shows there's little appetite - and yet she sticks 2 fingers up at us regardless.

We're leaving too if that happens Kiwi - I suspect a lot of people will.

Out of curiosity as I'm still very much on the fence, why are you voting to Stay?

[GrouchyKiwi]

I'm voting stay for a mix of selfish and less-selfish reasons.

Selfish: I can live here as I have an EU passport. The uncertainty of a Leave vote is incredibly unsettling. I also like the ease of travel.

Less selfish: I think the UK does better within the EU than it would do outside it, much the same as Scotland being a part of the UK. The EU certainly isn't perfect - and I'd really like to see reform when it comes to the bureaucracy and the more interfering rules that come from Brussels - but the overall reasons for the EU are good. I can only see economic difficulty for the country if we Leave, and though I don't think that would have too much impact on my family personally, it would cripple the country and lead to even more poverty than we already have.

Coming from a small, isolated country, being part of a bigger whole is, IMO, better.

[WankersHacksandThieves]

I suppose I'm coming at it from the POV that the more Scots that vote Out the less of a mandate The Numpty and her acolytes have to call another indy ref - which was one of the most destabilising and divisive periods in our history.

The only problem I have with that is, what if they already have enough Scots voting to stay in and all we do by voting out is up the overall out vote meaning Brexit happens and therefore she gets her dream scenario?

Despite my personal internal wrangle, I think I am leaning towards In. However I think we will get shafted regardless as I think that there will be resentment and a disinclinement by the other Euro nations to allow the UK some of the opt outs that it would like as they will say the UK people gave a mandate for Euro rule.

Damned if we do and damned if we don't.

[WankersHacksandThieves]

I know disinclinement isn't a word btw, I just preferred it to disinclination :o

[SirChenjin]

The only problem I have with that is, what if they already have enough Scots voting to stay in and all we do by voting out is up the overall out vote meaning Brexit happens and therefore she gets her dream scenario?

Because if the Go vote in Scotland is higher than she thinks it's going to be then she has less of a leg to stand on - and the opposition parties will jump on that.

The economic arguments seem to stack up both for and against, depending on who you listen to - as you say, damned either way.

[WankersHacksandThieves]

Yes and the news this morning about whatsherface leaving the Brexit campaign over the "lies" about the NHS data used as part of the campaign will hurt them I think - there will be swift campaign to discredit her I think.

However, maybe you could vote Go and it will still be carried as a Stay?

[WankersHacksandThieves]

I think the whole thing here is that, unlike the Indyref where a blind man in a dark room could see that the figures just didn't stack up, no-one really knows what the impact will be so there is a lot of guess work and speculation. There was an element of that in Indyref to be fair as there is always some stuff you just don't know but it was an easier economic decision than this one I think - though I may be talking bollocks. :)

[SirChenjin]

I think that's it Wankers - the indy ref was (imo) economic common sense v. blind nationalism, whereas this one is harder to call economically and there is less of a sense of nationalism/patriotism.

However, maybe you could vote Go and it will still be carried as a Stay? - what do you mean by that?

[WankersHacksandThieves]

I mean that if the tide is quite clear down south (given recent actions) that there will be a Stay vote overall, you could feel more comfortable in voting Go to hack of the SNP in Scotland even if you actually would rather remain in the EU. So there would be less of a dilemma given the size of the Voting population.