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Think he will never change

(41 Posts)
Unknownmember Sun 08-Dec-13 15:00:54

I've posted many times about H. I'm coming to vent as I have no one to talk to.

http://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/relationships/a1913692-When-is-it-time-to-leave

H had his Xmas party last night. His company included a hotel stay as well. Instead of him traveling while drunk, I said that he should stay the night. But he had to agree that he went to the party only and then back to the hotel. He couldn't go out drinking with people afterwards as that's when problems start.

He always says that I don't give him/ tell him what I expect. So I was very certain this time. And I told him that it's hard for me to trust him this much but he has to show me that his family is far more important than going out and showing he's one of the lads.

So I checked find my iPhone last night and he was out drinking till 4 am. His party finished at 11. I know it might sound like I'm being really demanding, but after six years of broken promises I have to try and take things in my own hands.

But he's shown me that going out is more important than keeping his promises and showing me that he's responsible. I keep hoping that he will have the lightbulb moment and realize what he's losing, but I don't think he ever will

CogitoErgoSometimes Sun 08-Dec-13 15:07:05

Two years ago the man slept with a prostitute and you almost had to abort your baby. His limit for what is and isn't responsible behaviour is set lower than a limbo dancing pole-cat. Six years of you forgiving him and is it any wonder he treats you with complete contempt? Waiting for a lightbulb moment is a vain hope. Sorry....

Mrsfluff Sun 08-Dec-13 15:11:57

Unknownmember, I am sorry you're going through this, but if what Cogito says about his past behaviour is true, then I think it's you who needs the lightbulb moment.

It doesn't sound like he treats his family with the love or respect deserved, do you think this will really change after after all these years?

whitesugar Sun 08-Dec-13 15:15:09

I don't have any idea what the last six years have been like for you. I also don't know any adults who would tell their DP that they can go out to a Xmas party and stay in the hotel providing they go straight home after the Xmas do. I recognise this post from your other similar ones and I said the same thing before. If you don't stop treating him like a child he will have a lightbulb moment one day and will leave you. If you want your marriage to survive I suggest you start treating him with respect. For your own sake get some counselling to address your control issues. If you don't address your issues all your relationships including those with your DC will be very dysfunctional.

The tone of your post reminds me of myself when I am talking to my 14 year old DC.

NakedTigarCub Sun 08-Dec-13 15:15:46

He will only have that lightbulb momment about two years after you have left him.

You are not going to leave him so your only choice.is to suck it up - men will be men right!

Glad im not in your place driving my self nuts trying to control another adult.

You need the lightbulb moment, this is no life for your or your child for that matter.

I have also read your previous thread and have wondered why you have stayed. What do you get out of this relationship now, something has kept you within this, albeit fear of the unknown in leaving and perhaps out of habit.

He will not change and you have to let go of the fantasy now that he will somehow change and become a decent human being. He will not.

tinmug Sun 08-Dec-13 15:19:44

He does know what he'd be losing and he does not care. I agree that it's you that needs a light bulb moment OP. Sorry you're going through this.

Unknownmember Sun 08-Dec-13 15:34:00

I know that he will probably not change. I have hoped for so long but maybe some habits are just not easy to change.

I am afraid to realizing the truth. An what life might be like if I was completely by myself. Maybe I'm not strong enough to cope for that. And te kids

tinmug Sun 08-Dec-13 15:38:46

If you're strong enough to cope with 6 years + of bullshit, broken promises and betrayal, you're strong enough to cope with being a single parent. You can do it.

Unknownmember Sun 08-Dec-13 15:38:48

And the kids, they love their dad. It would e so hard on them.

Whitesugar, I need used to be like this. But after six years of being let down, I've had to assume this role. I do feel like a mother sometimes telling off her child.

I've had to do this because after going out to drink we have had

Him sleeping with a prostitute
Being caught drink driving
Having to go get him at 12/1am with two dc under 2
We've spent over £15000 on getting him lawyers and replacing things

MissScatterbrain Sun 08-Dec-13 15:49:47

Words fail me.

Why on earth are you with this very poor excuse for a husband and father.

What do you think your DC are learning from him? from your relationship?

You need to put them first. He can still be a dad to them if you split up.

You need the lightbulb moment.

CogitoErgoSometimes Sun 08-Dec-13 15:56:20

Your first reason for staying ... you're not strong enough to be independent ... is the real one. All kids love their Dads and that includes abusive Dads, mass-murdering Dads and so on. So that's not a valid reason to stick around in this miserable atmosphere with someone who has no respect for you and no self-restraint. But you mentioned in your other thread that your confidence is down, you're unhappy with your weight and other things that fully explain why your self-respect is too low to kick this man to the kerb where he belongs. I'd strongly recommend that you act first, then work on your self-esteem. The longer you subject yourself to this man and keep forgiving the unforgiveable, you'll never pluck up the courage and what's left of your self-respect will disappear completely.

Come on OP.... you're better than this.

whitsernam Sun 08-Dec-13 15:57:23

I'd say you need an Al-Anon family group - you allow him to keep on with this, in a sort of co-dependent way. You say:
"I've had to do this because after going out to drink we have had

Him sleeping with a prostitute
Being caught drink driving
Having to go get him at 12/1am with two dc under 2
We've spent over £15000 on getting him lawyers and replacing things"

You did not cause this
You cannot control it
You cannot fix this

HE has to do these things. After this much time and this much money, I know I'd definitely LTB!!

maras2 Sun 08-Dec-13 16:01:58

He will never change love.Are you still abroad?If so is there any chance that you can come home to family or friends?Your kids will be so much better off not living with this poor excuse for a husband and terrible role model.

bestsonever Sun 08-Dec-13 16:10:15

...the other reason perhaps is money. If you can afford to pay £15000 on lawyers he's not short of a bob or two. Does that give him the right to have power over you though, do you have suck it up as he provides? Not at all, as happily there is a protective legal system to ensure that he continues to provide after a split - so what on earth are you waiting for?

str8tothepoint Sun 08-Dec-13 16:10:59

Hmm the old iPhone finder, for you to even do that shows you have no trust even after all this time

CogitoErgoSometimes Sun 08-Dec-13 16:12:35

The OP has no trust because their DH is untrustworthy. hmm Lie down with a dog and you get up with fleas....

"I am afraid to realizing the truth. An what life might be like if I was completely by myself. Maybe I'm not strong enough to cope for that. And the kids".

The truth though will set you free.

Better to be alone as well than to be badly accompanied.

What did you learn about relationships when you were growing up?.

By staying with this individual as well you are self sabotaging your chances of actually meeting a decent man. You are also doing your bit currently on teaching your children really poor lessons on how relationships are conducted.

feelingvunerable Sun 08-Dec-13 16:26:13

Could you see a professional for some perspective? Start with your gp. Book an appointment tomorrow.
Ask to be referred to someone who can offer you support.

You really need to gather the strength to think about yourself for a change.
Your dh will not change.

Your dcs will also survive a broken marriage. Rather than being shown such a terrible example they deserve to be around one positive role model.

Having to modify and police another adults behaviour is soul destroying and not acceptable.
Please keep posting.

MistAllChuckingFrighty Sun 08-Dec-13 16:33:11

The kids might love him but he is a terrible example of how a responsible father should act. You are doing them no favours to expose your kids to such a fucked up dynamic between you two.

he can still be their father without being your partner (although the "partnership" seems to be completely lacking, tbh)

Unknownmember Sun 08-Dec-13 16:42:11

We are still abroad. No one in my family has any idea of the problems we have. I couldn't put that burden on them as they already have their own problems.

The money came out of our savings for a deposit on a house.

I'm waiting for him to come home. It's still early morning here. I'm not going to tell him that I know he went out till late. I want to see if he can be honest. But I don't hold out any hope.

My parent had and still do have a great relationship. I think I feel like a failure admitting to the act that I can't manage a healthy relationship. That my husband doesn't seem content enough with me. And what's to say that any man would be content with me, or that I could find someone else.

MistAllChuckingFrighty Sun 08-Dec-13 16:50:53

It's him that can't manage a healthy relationship, not you. And he never will. Cut your losses.

MistAllChuckingFrighty Sun 08-Dec-13 16:51:56

Do you considr a "relationship" with any man (no matter how fucking useless/abusive/disrepectful/dangerous) to be better than none at all ?

maras2 Sun 08-Dec-13 17:18:36

If you were my daughter I'd want you to confide in me and come home with the kids.Why not give it a go? Don't stay any longer he will just break your heart even more.He will not change.He is damaged,broken.Don't let him damage you.

MistAllChuckingFrighty Sun 08-Dec-13 17:19:35

don't let him damage you even more

Jesus woman do you have mug tattooed on your forehead? No? Then stop being one for this guy. DTMFA

ImperialBlether Sun 08-Dec-13 18:06:06

You need to come home with your children. Let your parents help you.

Maybe there are some men who, when they're found out, are so terrified of losing their family they would never ever do anything again. They've realised what their life would be like without them and they don't want it. Maybe that's what happens when people say an affair made their relationship stronger. (I don't know anyone personally who has gone through this, though.)

More commonly you have men who are found out and risk losing their family. When their wives forgive them, or at least promise to forget what they've done, they breathe a massive sigh of relief. However, the difference between them is that these men don't learn. The next time they get found out, they realise they're not literally standing on the brink of hell, they are just going to have to put up with shouting and threats that are not followed through. Later still they don't even get shouted at, because a lot of women have learned by then to turn away, to pretend it hasn't happened.

Your husband is at that stage. He doesn't believe you're going to leave him. He doesn't believe you ever will! He's always been forgiven, no matter what disgusting thing he's done. Is that his history with past wives/girlfriends and his parents?

I know my ex was absolutely astonished when he realised I was going to leave. Flabbergasted. Why would I go then, when I hadn't before? It was almost as though he said it out loud.

You will recover if you leave. If you stay, part of you will die. Eventually you'll be the woman who will see the receipt, see the email, see the love bite and the scratches and turn away and put on the TV, too scared to even think about what it all means.

Unknownmember Sun 08-Dec-13 20:06:52

ImperialBlether, you are right. He hears me complaining, arguing and crying over the same things each time. I threaten the same things. And I always get the same responses. And it starts all over again. I tell him it's like we are trapped in a circle.

My parents know we are having some problems but they don't know what is happening. They have offered to talk to him. But I just think any change that may cause May not be a real change. It would be one out of fear from my parents. Not respect for me, for our kids or our marriage.

CogitoErgoSometimes Sun 08-Dec-13 20:11:57

It's not your parents' job to talk to him or save your relationship, that's between the two of you and, you're right, it should come out of love and respect, not fear. BUT..... if you think things are irretrievably damaged and there is no point flogging the dead horse any more, then tell your parents the truth and tell them very clearly what it is you need them to do. Not talk him round, for example, but give you and the DCs support in setting up solo.

Unknownmember Sun 08-Dec-13 20:33:29

So he's home. And he said 'go on then, I know you are not happy with me'

He said he didn't stick to his promise, but he's fine and nothing happened. The idea that he has hurt me again, let me down again doesn't really matter. Because when he went out he didn't screw up.

I've given up arguing with him. I must be stupid to think he would listen to me. His pleasure, him going out is far more important. I feel like I come very low down on the list.

MissScatterbrain Sun 08-Dec-13 20:48:06

Yes it sounds like you come very low on his list. I hope you come much higher that this on your own list of priorities though.

What do you plan to do?

43percentburnt Sun 08-Dec-13 20:48:13

"Later still they don't even get shouted at, because a lot of women have learned by then to turn away, to pretend it hasn't happened."

You have just done what imperial said would eventually happen.

It's hard to face up to, but he won't change, you will be here in 1 year, 5 years then 10 years time. You can change it though...

RatherBeRiding Sun 08-Dec-13 21:16:04

People can change, but only if they want to. He obviously doesn't want to, and going on your previous history there's nothing you can do about that. You are far better cutting your losses and getting out before you waste any more of your life.

MistAllChuckingFrighty Sun 08-Dec-13 21:40:53

"go on then" ?

what the fuck does that mean ?

give me a bit of a telling off if you must, but I will carry on doing what I want and you do not factor in

that's about the measure of it (and pretty much how it's been going so far)

Isetan Sun 08-Dec-13 21:56:48

This is no longer about what he does or doesn't do, its about why you choose to stay.

Your kids aren't the motivation for why you stay, they are just another excuse for not taking decisive action. Your marriage is dysfunctional and your hiding in it because your scared of the responsibility of your own happiness or unhappiness. Trust me, I've been there and wasted time hiding in relationship that wasn't working, waiting on someone to change who prefers the status quo is futile. If you want different, your gonna have to start doing different.

Unknownmember Sun 08-Dec-13 22:18:53

I know what I should be doing but I don't know how to get the courage.

I've come out for a drive and am grabbing a coffee and some time to think.

His attitude today has really pissed me off. He feels so blasé about it.

I do feel beaten by it.

MistAllChuckingFrighty Sun 08-Dec-13 22:30:10

Speak to your parents. Tell them the truth of what you are living with. Break the cycle of covering for him and pretending all is well. It is very far from well.

This is all you will get though if you don't do something different

tinmug Sun 08-Dec-13 23:13:47

You're not beaten by it, OP: staying with him would mean you were beaten by it. Don't look at this as a defeat: look at it as a choice, a decision by you to refuse to put up with this any more. You deserve better than this.

Unknownmember Mon 09-Dec-13 04:37:28

We are speaking the bare minimum. I don't have the energy of having the same arguments with him. Just because a huge disaster didn't happen this time he thinks I shouldn't make a big deal of anything. And keeping his word, we'll he said sorry and that should be enough.

It's hitting home how little he thinks of and how little he respects me.

Unknownmember Mon 09-Dec-13 05:37:59

We just had an argument. He always manages to make me feel like I'm talking crap and being unreasonable.

His argument is that he may not have stuck yo his word and gone out till very late but he didn't get into trouble. He got back home at a reasonable hour too. So I should be annoyed at him but be glad that he didn't get into trouble.

He also said that he has had a few nights out where things have gone well.

He doesn't realise that the few times have been eclipsed by the huge fuck ups. He promised me after being caught for drink driving that he would go out to the main event and then go home. As he can't trust himself. But he doesn't stick to it.

He doesn't see that he's worn me away. I feel so broken. I'm so unhappy. He's ruining our marriage with all the lies and problems. I'm no longer in love with him.

MissScatterbrain Mon 09-Dec-13 07:20:59

I wouldn't bother arguing with him - its pointless. He will never listen to you and its a waste of energy.

I wold just start taking action by making steps to leave - tell parents/close friends, separate your finances, make plans to pack up and move back to the UK.

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