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Husband left and took our two boys !

(45 Posts)

MNHQ have commented on this thread.

Minnie05 Tue 10-Sep-13 12:58:22

My husband left last week and took our two boys with him to be honest we haven't been getting on for a while. But I thought after a couple of days he would bring them back (he has taken them before and bought them back) This time however he turned up with a court summons to keep me away from them all ! I couldn't believe what he had done ! My dad passed away a year ago and I'm on anti depressants ! He tried to claim that if he wasn't here some sort of harm would come to our children ! I was totally gobsmacked ! I have never harmed my children even when I was at my lowest point I never touched them ! I can't believe this from a man who was supposed to love and protect me. Anyway we went to court yesterday he has moved so far away it took me three hours to get there. Basically the outcome was they stay with him during the week and I get them Friday till Sunday. I'm absolutely devastated I haven't seen them for over a week now and I wasn't allowed to phone them I spoke to them on the phone yesterday after the judge told my husband I could have as much phone time as I wanted. My youngest broke my heart when he heard my voice he said I miss you mummy where are you. I feel constantly sick I can't eat I can't sleep and I can't stop crying !

This all sounds a bit pre-meditated to me. Do you have proper legal advice?

Can't really help, just didn't want to read and run. Hope you're ok. Do you have RL support?

Juiciestorange Tue 10-Sep-13 13:01:22

Don't want to read and run, I'm so sorry you must be devastated. I'm sure someone wise will come along soon but it might be worth getting this moved onto the Relationships board as there is more traffic

Dressingdown1 Tue 10-Sep-13 13:11:51

OP so sorry you are going through this. You don't say how old your boys are. What about schooling etc? Normally the courts don't like children having to change schools and if they have moved 3 hours away, it must be an issue. You definitely need some legal advice.

Minnie05 Tue 10-Sep-13 13:29:01

Hi all thanks for your replies yes I think it was premeditated as well it all happened so fast ! One minute they were there then they were gone ! I honestly think he has been planning it for a while. I don't work so I can't afford a solicitor and I'm not entitled to legal aid. I am waiting for cafcass to get involved and was told by the judge it will take up to 17 wks! So that now means I won't even get to see them over Xmas ! Also I have two daughters with me he is not their biological dad but has bought them up for the past 12 years. Mt sons are aged 8 and 6 and one of my daughters is 12 and the other is 20 and she is 5 months pregnant. He has ripped the whole family apart !

Minnie05 Tue 10-Sep-13 13:30:15

He told the judge he has got school places for them where he now lives !

Juiciestorange Tue 10-Sep-13 13:37:44

So he gets to remove them from the family home, school, siblings and you and the court agreed? That's monstrous. Do you have RL support?

Minnie05 Tue 10-Sep-13 13:44:02

No I didn't agree I had no choice in the matter ! Im disgusted with him and the court. I've got two sisters and my mum for support they all came with me. No one can believe what he is doing I think I'm still in shock !

Minnie05 Tue 10-Sep-13 13:49:12

At first he was going for full custody and supervised visits for one hour a week ! The judge told him there was no way that was going to happen. Then he asked for me to see them one weekend a month which she also declined. So for now I have to be grateful that they are allowed to stay with me every week from Friday 6pm till Sunday 4pm it's not ideal at all but for now its better than nothing. I'm hoping when cafcass get involved I will get them back permanently!

Dressingdown1 Tue 10-Sep-13 13:53:41

If at all possible please get some legal help, maybe ask for help in the legal forum on MN?

The problem is that the longer you leave it, the harder it gets to overturn the status quo. The courts might be unwilling to uproot your boys again so that they can move back to their old home and school etc. Time is of the essence, in my experience.

SilverApples Tue 10-Sep-13 13:57:21

'So he gets to remove them from the family home, school, siblings and you and the court agreed? That's monstrous. Do you have RL support?'

Women do this on a regular basis it seems. Not usually the male partner.
OP, you need all the legal advice and support you can muster, so post in relationships. Lots of experience there.

morethanpotatoprints Tue 10-Sep-13 14:04:25

OMG, this is just terrible, I am so sorry for you.
I can't believe he is just allowed to do this, I hope you get them back soon.
Have you been to citizens advice, can they help at all.
I know you have probably done this already, but could the Police not help as he took them without permission, or maybe too late now.
I am so shock and sad for you, it just seems so bizarre that he will get away with it.

Minnie05 Tue 10-Sep-13 14:06:01

Thank you all for your time your words of wisdom and for taking the time to read about my problem.

newpup Tue 10-Sep-13 14:43:00

I am sorry, that is awful, worse than awful! You really need good legal advice. I am not sure how to change things but I agree with the poster who said that the longer he has them the harder it will be to turn things around. Can your mum and your sisters help with legal costs at all?

Juiciestorange Tue 10-Sep-13 14:51:50

Sorry OP I meant and the court agreed, obviously you didn't. Should have been a comma instead of an and before the word you.

itried Tue 10-Sep-13 18:04:53

Minnie, you could contact MATCH Mothers (Mothers Apart from their Children) for advice and support. Also, if you haven't done so, try posting your message in Legal Matters.

JulieMumsnet (MNHQ) Tue 10-Sep-13 22:15:32

Hi, Minnie.

We've had a few people ask if we can move this into another area for you in the hope that more people will see this. Please do let us know if this is what you want us to do.

We hope you get this sorted.

MNHQ.

Minnie05 Wed 11-Sep-13 06:20:44

Yes please I'm grateful for all the help I can get.

Orianne Fri 13-Sep-13 09:03:04

Are you any further forward Minnie? I hope your weekends goes well with the boys.

Ledkr Fri 13-Sep-13 09:07:47

Oh how scary that this can happen?
Have you tried citizens advice?
Are there any organisations that can help you?
Does he work? Who will look after them when he does a d where us he living?
Surely this is flaming kidnap!

PTFO Fri 13-Sep-13 13:38:15

This sounds VERY planned. school places a three hr drive away, new home, uniforms, untilities, job EVERYTHING! A whole new life.

Your ex has thought this through in advance, spoken to a lawyer and ripped you apart.

How many mums do you think are on anti-depressants? shitloads, no judge would take kids off a mother on these, without evidence that you had done something so terrible. what is it he's saying you have done?

Talk to a very good lawyer NOW, sod the costs if it means getting them back, do u have family that can help?
Get character refs, gp notes anything that could help, neighbors anyone that can back you up as being a good solid mum.

I really hope you sort this out. I don't understand how your allowed them at weekend but not live with you if what he thinks you had done was so bad IYKWIM. you should be able to speak to them anytime!!

Alibabaandthe40nappies Fri 13-Sep-13 13:43:05

Everyone leaping on this with outrage, just stop and think about the countless threads on here where the advice given to the woman wanting to leave her relationship in difficult circumstances.

Make plans
Don't tell him what you are doing
See a lawyer
Make sure you have all your financial info

Seems that this man has done all of the above.

We have no idea what has gone on in this relationship, none.

Lilyloo Fri 13-Sep-13 13:49:06

I would be very surprised that a judge has given primary care to the father and allowed him to take them out of their home / school without some previous history more than the op being on anti depressants.

I agree that good legal advice is very important right now op.

bundaberg Fri 13-Sep-13 13:55:17

i was going to post exactly the same as alibaba.

OP, i hope that you can move forward with this and that you are able to access legal help.

nameequality Fri 13-Sep-13 14:01:23

OP - please phone [[ http://www.rightsofwomen.org.uk]].

Does their Dad work? Do you? Were you the primary carer? How can the court agree to removal from the primary carer? Hope you can get some good advice soon.

nameequality Fri 13-Sep-13 14:02:00
cestlavielife Fri 13-Sep-13 14:18:13

given that you are apparently seeing them every weekend from friday to monday here are clearly no concerns over your abiity to care for them.

hold onto those days with them.
be strong for them when you with them.

so you need to speak to solicitor about his presumed arguments for taking them away (has he moved closer to his family?)

depession/bereavement/being on ADs alone is not a good reason. there must be more to it than that. (on his side or yours or both eg any violence between you? )

how will they travel to and from you?

cestlavielife Fri 13-Sep-13 14:20:24

if they do come back to live with you, what will the arrangements for contact with dad b? what will you be proposing?
those are thins to think about too

TheDietStartsTomorrow Fri 13-Sep-13 15:17:05

Without knowing anything about the OP and without hearing te husbands side of the story, we cannot by default assume he is being unfair. Yes, a mother has rights but so does a father and above all, so do the children.

Why it acceptable for a woman to make secret plans to leave a husband but not acceptable for a man to do so?
Why is it okay for a woman to have the kids on the weekdays and dad to have them on weekends and not okay if this was reversed?
Does anyone know anything about why the judge ruled that way? Does anyone know anything about the reasons why it was claimed tht the children could be harmed?
What about scenarios where it was later on realised that the children did suffer abuse at the hands of the mother or thy she wasn't mentally or physically able to look after the kids?

Yes, the advice to take legal advice is the correct thing here but not one of us was in that court room when the judge made his decision to allow the children to live with the father and to automatically have sympathy for one party in the equation here without knowing the full side of the story is an injustice.

Ezio Fri 13-Sep-13 15:27:21

Im amazed that he was allowed to keep them with him, i assume you were a SAHM, i thought the courts dont like to upset the balance.

Also as their mother, i thought you had a say so in where they live and their schooling.

It seems your role as a mother has been almost ignored. Will they take the 8 year olds opinion into account, or is he too young.

bundaberg Fri 13-Sep-13 15:43:51

"Im amazed that he was allowed to keep them with him, "

why??? he is their father!

Ezio Fri 13-Sep-13 15:50:17

As i said after Bundaberg, the courts normally allow the children to stay with the SAHP, so the children arent shunted about.

bundaberg Fri 13-Sep-13 15:53:37

the court allowed the children to stay with the parent they were living with. which was not the mother.

if he took the children to a safe place, was caring for them, had them in school and the mother didn't try and get them back then I can totally see why the courts wouldn't just judge that they should be removed from him!

bundaberg Fri 13-Sep-13 15:54:15

and as others have said, we don't know the details. I am guessing that there is far more to this than what has been posted

CoffeeTea103 Fri 13-Sep-13 19:58:48

I'm thinking the same as alibaba and bundaberg. There is more to this story. The court wouldn't just uproot the kids from their home, school, family without a valid reason. He is their father so why shouldn't he have the same support.

springydafty Fri 13-Sep-13 23:08:03

Because abusive men can take the children and spin a yarn about the mother to the PTB. By the time it is sorted out, the kids are settled in the new address, and the courts won't shunt them about. So the courts order that they stay put.

Have you spoken to Womens Aid OP? 0808 2000 247. Call between 7pm and 7am as the lines are busy during the day.

Were you the SAHP?

bundaberg Fri 13-Sep-13 23:09:52

Oh yes silly me he's a man so must be abusive
And women can never be the ones at fault.

OhDearNigel Fri 13-Sep-13 23:14:16

OP
Google Bar Probono unit. They may be able to help fix you up with a free barrister. All chambers do probono (charitable) cases.
Good luck xxx

springydafty Fri 13-Sep-13 23:22:50

Get a thread bunda. YOu can snark on that to your heart's content. leave it out on this one.

AllThreeWays Sat 14-Sep-13 00:10:03

A family has split up. one parent has care. The other parent has them every weekend. Seems normal to me. You have the best bit of the week with them OP. This happens to men all the time, any often get less access.

AllThreeWays Sat 14-Sep-13 00:11:14

^ and they often

WhiteandGreen Sat 14-Sep-13 00:40:11

Do you believe your DH cares for them well?

BoneyBackJefferson Sat 14-Sep-13 09:51:42

Seems to me that the SAHP has followed MN requirements to the letter, and that as the SAHP has left before only to return and for things not to improve they have finally found the strength to leave and protect their children in doing so.

kilmuir Sat 14-Sep-13 09:58:47

I do not understand why its so awful. He is their father. Op may not be the ideal main parent. Typical mumsnet

Offred Sat 14-Sep-13 10:03:15

I think being fair what the posters were getting at is that normally it is frowned upon to uproot children drastically like this in terms of both changing their geographical location and who is the main carer. That is not something courts normally support.

These threads are always really hard because it is very possible there has been an injustice in that when it came to court the current situation was considered the one that there was a presumption not to change through no fault of the OP's. Of course it is possible there is more to the story.

But on the basic facts I think any parent who steals children away from the other is pretty awful tbh. I've had a very abusive ex, I know others who have too and I don't believe anything justifies that when you can perfectly effectively rely on courts to protect children from abuse if you push them to.

That's what is awful to me and I would feel that way whether it was a man who had done a flit or a woman.

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