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Too good to leave, too bad to stay, support group. Anyone?

(181 Posts)
Salbertina Mon 26-Aug-13 19:00:59

Not necessarily looking for advice, just a little handholding from any others in a similar situation.
Not even read said book but the gist of it sums up where i am right now! Anyone??

TeeBee Mon 26-Aug-13 20:18:42

I'll quietly hold your hand while dealing with the same shitty situation.

Salbertina Mon 26-Aug-13 20:45:02

Thanks, Tee, yours too. Hard to know what to do for the best, isn't it? Been years like this!

SecretJewel Mon 26-Aug-13 20:50:50

Me too :-(

I am a million miles away from being 'happy' in my marriage.

But, there is no way that I am 'unhappy' enough that selling the house and struggling to get by on benefits with 2 small children, would be a better option.

There is no answer to it. Apart from my rubbish marriage, the rest of my life is ok so will just be plodding along for now.

Salbertina Mon 26-Aug-13 21:12:19

Are you sure you'd be struggling by on benefits? Checked out child maintenance etc?
Fairly clueless here still

shootfromthehip Mon 26-Aug-13 21:31:41

Been in this situation for years. Got the courage to stop it all last week. It's no way to live. <<offers hand>>

SecretJewel Mon 26-Aug-13 21:36:51

Well, I'm fairly clueless too(!), but there's no way we could fund anywhere near the lifestyle we have now.

And if dh paid a decent amount of maintenance, then he wouldn't be able to afford a house for himself.

We are generally civil, courteous (sometimes even nice!) to each other, but we're just not 'happy' together and I think the love has gone sad.

It's not brilliant, but the alternative seems even worse.

I suspect there are A LOT of couples like this, but it's one of those things that people don't talk about isn't it?

Support thread sounds great smile. Would love to compare thoughts with others in a similar situation, x

FatOwl Mon 26-Aug-13 22:05:32

Pulling up a chair

This is me

My H is EA but we have three kids (two still living at home), and he has a secure, well paid job.
We also live overseas and if I left him I would have to return to the UK and would probably not be entitled to any benefits (we have been gone 10 years)
I've not worked for 10 years either, and returning to work would be challenging. I'm not qualified for anything.

Leaving would be so difficult, staying (for now) is preferable. I am not unhappy all the time. Sometimes its OK. Most of the time it tolerable and I have my coping strategies.

I am lucky that he doesn't take too much notice of money and he is not tight with money. I spend very little money on myself and am buidling up a "running away" stash in an account he knows nothing about. Just having it makes me feel better knowing that I have it.

SecretJewel Mon 26-Aug-13 22:13:26

That sounds difficult FatOwl sad

I have considered saving for a leaving fund too. Haven't quite got to the point of starting it yet. I think mainly because the sums of money seem so unachievable. I'd never get enough to leave. May as well just spend it on making myself as happy ad possible now hmm

FatOwl Mon 26-Aug-13 22:17:45

It is, but I go through ups and downs.

It can be OK for a few weeks, then bad for a few weeks. I just plod on, others are in a worse situation- ie he's not physically abusive, not esp controlling- I have friends and hobbies etc.

He is just a miserable sod and puts me down a lot

SunshineBossaNova Mon 26-Aug-13 22:49:50

Another one here.

grounddown Mon 26-Aug-13 22:50:22

Me too sad

whodhavethunkit Tue 27-Aug-13 04:35:06

Me too sad

Emptychairs Tue 27-Aug-13 09:49:33

Hi, me too!
I've been asking for some help a bit now on mn also.
Gave me the courage to ask for couple counseling, but as my dh is ea this is plodding along somewhat superficially. When one issue is dealt with up pops another.
I'm also a stepmother and the advice I was given on that particular board was basically detach and its helped a lot.
So I've started detaching from dh (again, like you, our cofunded lifestyle is too complex to give up atm, kids etc).
Although I work ft this does not help much. I've taken up driving again and this has worked miracles for my self esteem.
A mnetter gave me a great link for assertiveness training (to be found under thread of people pleaser).
IMO, its essential to build up your self esteem (and the nest egg) and take it from there. Who knows, once you respect yourself dh can either respect you more or punish you for it, and when he does you can move on without guilt and regret.

Halfahundred Tue 27-Aug-13 10:01:50

Am in this situation too. How do you make yourself detach? Not care about all your once cherished dreams smashed to smithereens? Struggling with this bit..

Overtiredmum Tue 27-Aug-13 10:23:53

I'm in this situation but taken the steps to start again.

It terrifies me starting again. At 39 I have 2 failed marriages under my belt but two wonderful DCs who are being my strength and motivation.

It was the toughest decision of my life, my family has disowned me along the way and I have lost quite a few friends.

I am stronger every day and optimistic about the future, although I know everyone is waiting for me to fall flat on my bum.

gaggiagirl Tue 27-Aug-13 10:31:13


IntheCorner Tue 27-Aug-13 12:13:13

Me too.
In a bad patch right now, and I hope it only is a patch.

We have 2 dcs, DD at Uni and teenage DS.
Ok house in a nice area.
H works full-time, me part-time, very little spare cash each month.

Things go from good to ok to bad. Most of the time the ok outweighs the good and the bad. I can live with that. But then the bad rears its ugly head.

DCs old enough to see that things are not right, when they are not right.

But I can't afford to pull the plug and then have a satisfactory standard of living for me and DS. As SecretJewel says, we don't have enough income between us to maintain two households.

Plenty of people worse off than me, I know, but at times this is so hard.

Thanks for starting a support thread.

SunshineBossaNova Tue 27-Aug-13 13:09:31

DH is an alcoholic. He's a reasonable human being during the day, but in the evening he turns into a slurring, over-affectionate bell-end. He falls over and injures himself, once spectacularly knocking a hole in a wall. Our sex life is absolute crap, because he's drunk so often.

If I leave I will have to take a room in a shared house, because I'm a student and can't afford to rent a flat. I'll also have to leave behind my 19 year old cat, who I love dearly.

I've already married and divorced one alcholic - but it was easier with XH as he was abusive too. But DH is kind and lovely when he's sober...

I've bought the 'Too good to leave' book, and have another one on the same subject. I've read neither, as I keep hoping things will get better but they don't.

Does anyone else find indecision is making them feel like shit?

Overtiredmum Tue 27-Aug-13 14:46:05

Sunshine I think it's the indecision that makes it worth, you spend most of your time trying to justify your feelings, but down the line, you're still in the same place? You can be married to the nicest person in the world, but if they don't make you happy?

I'm 5 months in, still living in the same house due to working patterns which is far from easy. DCs are very accepting of the position, although I am under no illusion the future will be hard at times.

I work full time, evenings at the moment, but will be switching to days, and the house is sold just waiting for the sale to go through.

This has been the hardest decision of my life, but I am happier, the DC are doing great - that's all the motivation I need.

comingintomyown Tue 27-Aug-13 17:10:19

I feel so bad for you guys

This time four years ago I was living in a gilded cage in a marriage I knew was wrong like a rabbit in the headlights. We were together 17 years with two DC and I dined out on our past happiness to keep me going and just made the best of it as in many ways I had a very good life.

Luckily XH had the guts to end it and in the end it was a swift and clean break.

Lots of heartbreak, without doubt the hardest time of my life, and a year long journey recovering from the worst.

My day to day life is much harder as a single Mum working FT and my future financially less rosy and assured.

But inside I am whole , I feel emotionally clean. I dont cry very often at all. I wake up most days feeling pretty much the same . I am happy.

The day XH told me he didnt love me anymore and we spent the day in turmoil I remember him saying that one day I would thank him for ending it. He was absolutely right.

FatOwl Tue 27-Aug-13 17:19:01

Sunshine, my DH is a functioning alcoholic, who is unreasonable and belligerent by the end of the day. I have to talk to him in the morning to get any sense at all.

Overtired and Comingintomyown, thanks for your input. You I where I'd like to be, but can't see it for a few years yet.

I am thinking of retraining as a TA. As I said I live overseas and there is one international school who has a TA training programme. It's a different school to the one my dds go to.
To do that though, I would have to give up a major volunteer role which I really do enjoy (but isn't salaried), and is almost my entire social circle. But it would be a means to an end.

comingintomyown Tue 27-Aug-13 19:02:01

Do it FatOwl my biggest hill to climb was getting back into work and you can keep the social circle in a different context no ?

BadSpeakingSkills Tue 27-Aug-13 23:06:51

I'm here. Marking my place and offering support /hand holding where I can.

I returned to work when youngest was 12 months old, I couldn't face not having just even a bit of financial security for myself and DC's.

Since finding this board 12 months ago I've recognised so many behaviours in myself sad I've been emotionally detaching myself more and more as a means of self preservation if that makes sense. My H doesn't want to spend any time with me alone, when I made suggestions to go out/get a baby sitter/ do ANYTHING without dc's it got rebuffed or "We can't afford it." or the one that really brought me to tears "We're a family so we should do everything as a family not just you and I anymore because that's not how it is anymore" sad

I get depressed and moody but then when we have a good family day out (these far out weigh the lonliness atm) and I just find myself thinking "Guess this is how it is now" and throw myself into my hobbies.

I've never written this down before and now I have - I can't stop crying. sad

Overtiredmum Tue 27-Aug-13 23:46:46

It can be very lonely, can't it? Nothing was really to blame in my case, I too just drifted further and further, to the point i felt I was living with a stranger hmm

WhiteandGreen Tue 27-Aug-13 23:54:04

I read that book about 3 years before I left my exDH.

Read 'Feel the Fear and do it Anyway' about 3 days before I left! grin

Very happy now 9 months down the line, and have been since I made the decision.

I had started to think that leaving marriage was the most massive thing I could possibly do. Fantasised about it all the time. Gave it a million times more thought than I did about actually getting married. Best thing ever.

People say 'ooh, it must have been so difficult to leave'. But actually the difficult part was making the decision, because the good times were still good. But the bad times were getting worse, and lasted weeks and weeks and weeks, and always returned.

For me it was the realisation thing things would never improve. And the thought of being old with him was horrid. Really horrid. And the idea of being free was, and still is, blissful.

FatOwl Wed 28-Aug-13 07:49:12

It is lonely definitely.

We lead pretty much separate lives, I have my friends, he has a few (He is very antisocial) None mutual.

I have been in the UK for a few weeks on my own with the DDs. DH is at home, I'm due to go back on MOnday for school to start on Thursday. Feeling glum, have had a lovely holiday, caught up with my sister and best friend and their kids, also leaving dd1 behind for uni (Feel so proud she got in, but so sad to be leaving her behind)
Having spoken to DH, he seems in quite a good mood at the moment though, so we'll see how it is when we get back

Salbertina Wed 28-Aug-13 08:41:25

Hi everyone well, good to have company but shame to hear so many of us are stuck.
Feel v trapped, overseas also dependent on dh as no right to work, he earns alot more than i can in future tho i brought all the equity in at the start (now since depleted), don't know how to unravel all this! But slowly dying inside, have been for years. Not a bad man but I don't love him or fancy him and he undermines me constantly with the kids making parenting extra hard work.

raspberriesareforever Wed 28-Aug-13 08:55:58

I was in this situation 7 years ago. We had a very comfortable lifestyle, I worked part time. We have 3 DCs. EH was verbally abusive and a bully, used to tell me I couldn't afford to leave him. All suggestions of counselling were met with a sneer. Finally I told him I wanted a divorce. It was a horrible and difficult 2 years but I came through, realised I was eligible for working and child tax credits and I have not regretted the divorce, not ever.

A couple of years ago I inadvertently became emotionally attached to a man who turned out to be married - his DW could be one of you lot. Miserable marriage, no sex or intimacy. He wanted an affair (I don't do affairs).

Moving on, have finally joined a dating agency and am at long last enjoying being me.

Just wanted to give a bit of hope really. There are options should you choose to be brave.

FatOwl Wed 28-Aug-13 09:17:39

Salbertina, being overseas for me is the unsurmountable hurdle. I have no residency rights without him, and if I wanted to take the DDs I would have to take them out of school, away from all their friends and everthing they have ever known. (they were 2 and 5 when we moved here- now 12 and 15). Most of the time it isn't so bad I feel the need to do that.
When the dds have gone though I can't imagine staying.

Salbertina Wed 28-Aug-13 09:25:50

Its a nightmare, isn't it? Feel such a fool, gambled everything to come here, overall been pretty shitty for me and dc1 but great for dhs work and dc2. I have no rights here, no indep bank acc and cant take dc without hid permission. Doublebind, wouldn't be easy anyway. Have you explored options w lawyer versed in local and uk law??

grounddown Wed 28-Aug-13 10:06:31

Sometimes I get brave and can visualise leaving, especially after all the help and support I've received on here. Then we have a good day with the kids (tiny kids) and I think I can cope with it the way it is. I am jealous of my friends in their happy relationships, getting married and buying family homes, I think what's wrong with me that I can't have that?
It's awful.

Overtiredmum Wed 28-Aug-13 10:28:11

Think the worse going for me was feeling like I couldn't tell anyone, I just carried on the pretence. In hindsight, that is the mistake I made cos five months on, H still struggles with the comprehension that I just don't want to be with him, but then he tells me "I could have left you years ago!" - he is resentful of my decision to work evenings and not need any child care, as opposed to working days and paying most of my wages out.

OvertiredandConfused Wed 28-Aug-13 11:34:52

Wondering, for the first time, if this is where I am sad

Been married for 14 years. DD12 and DS10. We've had ups and downs, but until now, the ups far, far outweigh the downs. He's been grumpy, but never EA.

Recently - last few months - he is permanently grump and withdrawn. Snappy with me and DC. Shouts a lot. Lots of silence. No interest in anything except TV. Resents helping at home. For the first time, I'm aware that I'm trying to anticipate his behaviour / reactions and modify mine accordingly. I am not prepared for this to continue.

Last couple of years have been hard - I gave up work for 2 years to try and manage the house, DCs etc (long commute meant we were both out of the house for 12 hours). This crippled us financially and we have lots of debt. I'm back at work (and back to long commute) and we're managing the debt sensibly. I'm not happy. DCs are not happy.

He's not having an affair. I do still love him and am sure he loves me. Sex hasn't been great since DC but we always had lots of physical contact, affection etc. Almost gone now. I'm lonely, unhappy and the environment isn't one I am prepared to tolerate for me, much less our DC. Desperate to find a way out of this.

tessa6 Wed 28-Aug-13 11:40:39

These are really tough situations and heartbreaking paralysis. I'd really recommend the book the thread is titled after. In the meantime, would it be helpful to mention some of the questions the book poses, with firm advice how to resolve based on the answers?

For example, if god or some other omniscient being said it was okay to leave, would you feel tremendously relieved and have a strong sense that finally you could end the relationship?

AKVS Wed 28-Aug-13 11:55:29

Hi, I'm torn and going crazy.
My partner and I have been together for about 10 years.
We have a 3 year old toddler and a house.
I dont work. I study part time and look after our child.
He works a lot but gets paid good and we live ok.
He never lets me worry about money.
He's helpful, dedicated partner and wonderful father.
I'm very sensitive and emotional. He's not.
He doesnt like to talk, any problems - we cant talk about it aferwards or it will turn into the same argument.
He can be nasty, detached and aggresive - cant touch him or get into his personal space.
If slapped in the face. He would return the favour.
He's a good man. He is. Sadly in the last 6 months I have lost intrest in sex :/ I'm missing intimacy.
Its hard. Confused :/

I really feel for u guys.

AKVS Wed 28-Aug-13 12:01:51

Secret Jewel - I feel the same - I'm not happy but not unhappy enough to leave and put my toodler through hell of a brake up. My partner is a wonderful father.
Its really hard and confusing.
Our relationship seems solid.
But do I want that relationship for the rest of my life?

grounddown Wed 28-Aug-13 12:02:04

I want someone to tell me what to do, I don't want to make the decision myself, how cowardly hmm

Overtiredmum Wed 28-Aug-13 12:41:31

Grounddown, that's how I felt. I stupidly believed i would have the support of my family - instead they have treated me like I am mentally ill and disowned me. I have had to make all the decisions on my own, with the support of mn

grounddown Wed 28-Aug-13 12:52:23

I am lucky to have a supportive family however my mother is very pushy and tells me to LTB all the time. If I don't I am sure our relationship will be very affected. They have even offered to buy me a house so I can just walk away, if only it was that easy. He is very emotional and makes everything my fault, I end up doubting my decisions especially regarding how my leaving will affect the children. He doesnt see why I am so upset and resentful of him. It's exhausting!!

spudalicious Wed 28-Aug-13 12:56:02

Oh. Lots of handholding for all.

I was in a similar situation until 6 months ago. 13 years of a relationship (since I was 21) with a functioning EA alcoholic.

2 years ago I was diagnosed with cancer - once I'd been treated and recovered physically and emotionally I issued several ultimatums. All ignored. I left the day he picked my DD up from school when drunk.

I think had I not had the kick up the arse from cancer and had him do something so far over the line I may well still be there. It must be so hard to make such dramatic changes when there is no one reason you can point to to say why.

FWIW - I am so much happier now. I hardly recognise myself.

Overtiredmum Wed 28-Aug-13 12:58:41

The DC have been my main concern but they really have been very accepting and are much happier, because I am happier x

spudalicious Wed 28-Aug-13 13:07:09

Sad that you had no support OvertiredMum. My family and friends were amazing and so supportive (and some very thankful that I'd left). It made such a difference.

grounddown Wed 28-Aug-13 13:09:43

Support does make a difference, you must be very strong

Overtiredmum Wed 28-Aug-13 14:03:02

I agree, support is really important. Of the good friends I have left, they have been amazing. MN has also been here in my absolute darkest hours - I have a long-running thread somewhere!!

I have along way to go, and the future terrifies me, every single aspect of my life will change - home, work, life! But there's light at the end of the tunnel and I am ready to take on the challenge smile

Strugglingtocopejustnow Wed 28-Aug-13 15:51:23

I had the same dilemma 12 months ago. Making the decision was the hardest thing ever. But I did. I worried about the kids, older primary school age, but they were absolutely fine. And if asked now they say its better.
There wasn't any abuse, or fighting. I just stopped loving him like a husband, more like a platonic friend.
We lived together for a few months when we had made the decision, and I think this helped us both come to terms.
6 months I've lived on my own with the kids... And I'm happier, but it can be lonely.
I like having my own place to do with as I please, financially I'm doing ok.
I miss the kids when they are with their dad, but enjoy the time to recharge.
Good luck to you all x

Salbertina Wed 28-Aug-13 15:58:23

Goodness, such heartache hmm
Good to hear stories from the other side though.

Overtired, like you i foolishly thought my family wd be supportive at such a time but dm & df showed a similar, unbelievably disloyal, toxic and unfathomable reaction shock some friend have been great but all hot their own stuff. Honestly don't know if I've got the strength to do this from overseas without family support. I know many deal with much worse and need to build my resilience, i feel. Here's to all finding strength.

Salbertina Wed 28-Aug-13 15:58:24

Goodness, such heartache hmm
Good to hear stories from the other side though.

Overtired, like you i foolishly thought my family wd be supportive at such a time but dm & df showed a similar, unbelievably disloyal, toxic and unfathomable reaction shock some friend have been great but all hot their own stuff. Honestly don't know if I've got the strength to do this from overseas without family support. I know many deal with much worse and need to build my resilience, i feel. Here's to all finding strength.

yentil Wed 28-Aug-13 17:02:22

Marking my placehmm. Two children under ten. I have no want for intimacy with DH nowhmm. Lovely father and husband but we co parent and thats it. my family and his would disown me and the children just adore him at home.....i wish i didnt want to leave but I'm not happy and dont know when it all switched off...i cant keep pretending i want him.....i don't know how to leave. So much fear of poverty. We can't afford two places. I work full time. Don't think I'm eligible for benefits and I don't know what to do next. I earn too much (49k) for help from the government too poor to support home and family alone - he couldn't live outside the home AND help me and childrenhmm and I wouldn't want him living badly as he's done nothing wrong. Been together 17 years. Married 9.

metoo22 Wed 28-Aug-13 17:19:16

Hello everyone. I just read this book, as suggested I think by Tessa6 in a post last week - thanks, it is just the thing and I recommend it even though normally I run a mile from self help books. I am in the same situation as all of you. So sad to read all your stories.

I've been with dh 25 years and we have three teenage dcs. I've been unhappy for a long time, we haven't had sex for probably 6 years. That's me. dh is very passive, lacking in energy or initiative but is a good man. He is from another country and came here to be with me and we have basically got into a pattern of me being responsible for everything which hasn't got better over the years. Throw in a fear of conflict (both of us), we have just muddled along unhappily. But I am feeling close to a crunch point. Finances, sense of responsibility for him and worry about how he would cope, as well as what grounddown said - wanting someone else to decide for me?

Sorry, I'm waffling. I guess we all have lots to say. Thanks Salbertina for starting the thread. The book is quite good, has specific questions to ask yourself. The one Tessa mentioned above is a key one for me.

Take care all. x

tessa6 Wed 28-Aug-13 17:21:00

What did you conclude, metoo?

Strugglingtocopejustnow Wed 28-Aug-13 17:25:54

Yentil, I earn less and have still afforded a lovely house smile
What about the equity in the family home?

FatOwl Wed 28-Aug-13 17:35:04

I am trying to make plans to train myself for something so I would be employable if/when I do leave and return to the UK.

I have looked at being a TA, there is one international school that does a TA training programme. I worked in Childcare before we left the UK.

But have also been looking at the CELTA qualification. (Teaching English as a second language) - I think I am qualified to do it - I have a degree and have done Teacher training way back before I got married but never actually worked in a school) I just scored 100% in the online English proficiency check (Thank god for that!)
There is a centre in my city that i can do it part time over three months. It's quite expensive though so will have to get it past H.

metoo22 Wed 28-Aug-13 17:36:31

On that question, Tessa, if that were the case I would say 'yes' and do it. But in general I have not concluded... I am in a weird suspended state at the moment as dh is away for a month. I feel relieved yet sick and not able to really enjoy the time as I am constantly thinking about what to do. I think I am going to say that we have to rearrange rooms so that one of us can move out of ours. I know I need to be much more direct than I have been so far.

Strugglingtocopejustnow Wed 28-Aug-13 18:10:55

Metoo22- the decision is the hardest part. Trust me.

yentil Wed 28-Aug-13 18:52:09

@Strugglingtocopejustnow I live in a suburb of London. I really have invested sooo much effort into planting roots here (childcare/schools/communte to work etc) so couldnt even fathom moving further out (cheaper)....I can't get a flat for less than 300k hereconfused. My only support (sibling) here too....equity in home maybe 50k each. That's a 250k mortgage. I could just about pay my own way in current house if u stopped doing anything extra curricular (doable) but that would stop when interest rates rose (I have been wracking my brains about how I would cope when we came out of this low interest rate bubble. Also where would DH who earns 15k less than me go? A bedsit? He's also older and not likely to earn anymore than he does now. Short of a lottery win I can't see a way out.

RumAndBoak Wed 28-Aug-13 19:26:01

Ok I'll join you all, I have 2 lovely children, 12 years down the line my husband and I are so different, I'm relaxed and he is intense and a workaholic. I have tried to explain my needs and to get him to prioritise and stop him being so detatched from the little things that matter. In his head we are his world, in mine we are a tick on the list: wife- check, kids : check.

Now I am typing this I feel like I married the wrong person, we aren't the same. I don't turn to him because the details of my life aren't interesting/ important to him and he will not make the situation feel better/ add anything. I love him but I am not in love with him. He is a decent man and a wonderful dad when he's not on his blackberry.

I am here going through the motions because I cannot bear the thought of sharing time with the children and I do not want them to go through the ensuing turmoil. My life isn't bad but my marriage isn't really a marriage. I haven't a clue what to do.

atosilis Wed 28-Aug-13 20:43:59

I'll join. I've posted on here loads because of this position.

I snapped today, feel very guilty, and have handed in a 3 page letter to my husband's GP. Page 1 explains that my H is becoming more and more physically and mentally/emotionally ill. H went mad at me on Sun night, he was drunk and totally irrational. Enough.

Pages 2 & 3 list physical info (weight increase), dreadful diet and alcohol with the medicines/drugs he has to take. It lists examples of his sweating, shaking and inability to stand still without support sometimes. There are also examples of his aggressive behaviour and depression.

Don't know what I intend to achieve but I do want to let the GP know that when H goes for his next check-up and says, "I'm fine!", he bloody isn't and I am close to breaking point.

But, when it's going well, it goes well(ish). I am aware that I go out of my way to avoid arguments and omit details without actually lying.

Salbertina Wed 28-Aug-13 20:47:40

Oh atolisis! Are you staying out of duty, guilt? Sounds v hard. Do you have to be a hands on carer for him??

metoo22 Wed 28-Aug-13 21:55:03

Atolosis that sounds so hard, and it sounds like the letter to GP was very much needed, I hope s/he takes notice.

Yentil I haven't tried to actually work out housing costs yet but like you I just cant see how we can possibly sustain 2 homes, earnings just too low.

Strugglingtocope, thanks for your encouragement. It's helpful.

atosilis Wed 28-Aug-13 22:01:46

No, I actually work full time with a 2 hr drive a day. A lot of the time he can be perfectly fine, the 'too good to go' period, but he takes differences of opinion badly. When he shouts, wow.

Coping strategies help a lot. I do feel bad about telling tales to the GP but hope he will advise H to look after himself a bit more. He might throw the letter in the bin for all I know but I've tried an avenue.

TrippleBerryFairy Wed 28-Aug-13 22:08:13

I'll join in as well. Not married but we own a house and have a son so i stay in this because of hope one day things will change and he will deal with his issues that make us all unhappy. In the meantime im on my 2nd counsellor cause i need to be able to talk to someone otherwise i would probably become physically and mentally ill.

The loneliness, i sometimes after yet another argument go through contact list on my phone to see if theres anyone i could call and talk to but theres no one i can open up to. We are happy and normal couple to everyone who knows us (i do wonder about the neighbours sometimes, they might have hears snippets from our arguments which would be rather disturbing...)

Lostwithoutacompass Wed 28-Aug-13 22:11:22

Hello... I posted about a year ago (love but not in love with DH) and whilst I am not at all in my ideal situation, hopefully I might help someone find some clarity or ideas..

Like many my DH is kind, etc. long story short I think we have just grown into different people but lack of sexual chemistry was a main factor.

It's very hard trying to have support and understanding from people when there is nothing apparently wrong in the relationship. However, someone once posted here that if you are this unhappy then that in itself should be reason enough to justify a change. I have had to really steel myself to not talk about this with my mum anymore because I ended up being floored with guilt (your poor dh, why did you have children with him, etc). Like I planned all this... I would love her understanding but its not going to happen so I thank my lucky stars for my friends instead.

I read the love you but not in love with you book and it was helpful but to be honest I think I just wanted someone to tell me I was allowed to feel the way I was feeling. That felt like a big step.

I tried to make sure I was sure about how I was feeling. I finally spoke to my DH about it which was bloody hard. That all sounds very simple but I made myself physically ill with the stress and unhappiness. All I can say is that a year on I am feeling much better. The indecision really is horrendous.

We are still living together but recently I finally said I needed us to go into separate rooms. However horribly hard and sad each conversation/change has been, I have also felt huge relief. Having your own space in a home that does not necessarily represent much happiness for you is so important.

I found the "playing happy families" thing really hard (my DH seems to be in denial about the whole thing) so in a bid to slowly adjust mine and his but mainly the kids lives, I now bow out one day and evening at the w/e. This has given me breathing space from DH and the situation, made him step up to looking after little kids by himself (and he's enjoying it) and the kids don't really bat an eyelid when I go. They didn't even say anything when we went into separate rooms but do refer to my room as mummy's room etc. I have rea that its not necessarily divorce but how parents behave that is crucial and as a child of divorced parents I agree. I deeply wish the "ideal scenario" was still ours but it is not...

We jointly own a home and I am still a sahm but am now looking for a job. Once I am hopefully earning I will suggest we split the finances and go from there.

So why haven't we sold the house and and gone our own ways already, as I would ideally like to do? Because I think it would kill him, emotionally as well as financially. And also, it's bloody scary!! It's all been very slow but hopefully he will eventually understand that it is for the best and hopefully the kids will gradually adjust.

What I am very long windedly trying to say is that it doesn't have to be one huge jump but little steps can help regain some form of sanity. Genuinely no idea where I will be this time next year but am in a much better place than this time last year. X

SunshineBossaNova Wed 28-Aug-13 22:48:45

Thanks Lost. I had a blunt conversation with my DH today: I told him frankly that I would have left earlier if it hadn't been for the cat. (No children, but my cat is 19 and has been with me all his life.)

I'm feeling a bit raw, as I think is DH, but I'm glad I got it off my chest. I don't know what I'll do next, but I'm glad to have said it.

metoo22 Wed 28-Aug-13 23:15:00

Thanks Lost - sorry for what you're going through but it helps to read about it. It sounds like there's quite a bit of similarity to my situation. If I am brave enough to talk directly to dh we will have to find a way to stay living in this house I think too. We're in London, kids are big so really not OK to move them, and anyway work, friends etc all here, but the prices - just impossible. I'm glad to hear you are feeling better even without a finite break.

Mozarela I went to a therapist myself today for the first time, hoping to get some help working myself out as I approach tall this. That won't help the budgeting but I feel like I really need it for a bit. What does yours say about your situation?

8isgood Wed 28-Aug-13 23:18:58

You can be brave and just take "that leap"
Just jump!!!
I did after nearly 30 years with my husband.
Met when I was 16 and he was 17 - 3 children later and I was aged 45 and sad so so sad!!
My situation was different I know as I was subjected to many forms of abuse but ultimately I did still love him :-(
But I wasn't "in love" with him!!
I'm now two years down the line - it's been tough so tough and in many ways still is.
I've lost all our mutual friends, his family whom I'd know and loved since my teenage years but I'm happy, my kids are happy :-)
So be brave
You get one life
Just "take that leap"..........
It will all be fine ......

Ginga66 Wed 28-Aug-13 23:22:21

This sounds familiar. I tried joining the EA thread but the pressure to leave makes it hard. I have two dcs four and dh has difficulty with emotions. He is a very good father and does a lot of housework bu he can't manage the kids on his own or so he says?, I doa lot of childcare, up four times a night with baby and work part time as does dh. I am the bread winner too.
Things amble on ok with some lovely moments and w do have sex, bu there is very little care for me or respite r romance. I never ge a lie in. He never buys me flowers or books a date night.
He complains or being tired or I'll. I have disc lesion and trapped ulnar nerves. He has never offered to take kids ou so I can ave a lie down or offered tosleep with baby.
We had a huge row today as I asked him to watch kids while I went to dentist with v bad tooth. He asked me to take them instead. I was so tired I go angry a which point he calls m mental and thn says its my hormones - his interfering overbearing mothers theory.
I took the kids out all day so he could do stuff thn went out in the evening too.
I do ge time out but he nearly always drafts in his mother. He is their dad ffs!
At any rate my four year old very much needs stability as he is super sensitive.
I still love dh despite his ack of interest in m welfare.
There s no good solution is there.

Ginga66 Wed 28-Aug-13 23:24:57

This sounds familiar. I tried joining the EA thread but the pressure to leave makes it hard. I have two dcs four and dh has difficulty with emotions. He is a very good father and does a lot of housework bu he can't manage the kids on his own or so he says?, I doa lot of childcare, up four times a night with baby and work part time as does dh. I am the bread winner too.
Things amble on ok with some lovely moments and w do have sex, bu there is very little care for me or respite r romance. I never ge a lie in. He never buys me flowers or books a date night.
He complains or being tired or I'll. I have disc lesion and trapped ulnar nerves. He has never offered to take kids ou so I can ave a lie down or offered tosleep with baby.
We had a huge row today as I asked him to watch kids while I went to dentist with v bad tooth. He asked me to take them instead. I was so tired I go angry a which point he calls m mental and thn says its my hormones - his interfering overbearing mothers theory.
I took the kids out all day so he could do stuff thn went out in the evening too.
I do ge time out but he nearly always drafts in his mother. He is their dad ffs!
At any rate my four year old very much needs stability as he is super sensitive.
I still love dh despite his ack of interest in m welfare.
There s no good solution is there.

Yani Thu 29-Aug-13 00:12:03

Sadly, this thread rings a bell. sad

TrippleBerryFairy Thu 29-Aug-13 00:17:16

metoo, being a therapist she doesn't pass the judgement or advice although she does say I am being generous when I start saying that perhaps the problem is me and my perceptions.

We go through cycles where things are ok (too good to leave when I wonder why on earth I need the therapist at all) and then proverbial hits the fan and I am glad I see her.

Our issues (from my POV obviously) are around his porn addiction and all that goes with it, the whole relationship is tarnished by it and the fact he was doing it while I was pregnant, then disengagement when DS was little, pushing the blame on me (e.g. my leaking boobs don't help his libido), rejection to the point where these days hell would freeze before I initiate sex with him, I found out he was using webcams when he was too drunk one night to delete browsing history etc etc, you get the picture. And he is shit around the house, I do all the cleaning, take care of the garden, laundry, etc... He was sexually abused as a teen but I am not entirely sure that is the root cause of the addiction. It sometimes feels that he likes to use the abuse that happened as a deflection in order to not address the porn issue... Same way he uses tiredness or alcohol in order to avoid conversations with me about all the above. Like today, he had 4 drinks on the way home from work and refused to engage in anything re our latest argument and went straight to bed.

We were on holiday last week and he proposed, bought an engagement ring and I said yes, needless to say the ring is stuffed in my jewelry box and 6th sense is screeming at me that I would be the ultimate fool to go along and marry him.

What makes it difficult is that he is not completely rotten, he has good qualities and can be sweet and funny and is generous so it seems silly to leave because there is no 'real' reason...

Tbh I have been thinking about separation since DS was born so 4 years now. God knows how many more I will spend in this limbo. I so wish he would just man the fuck up and address the addiction and do something about it, do fuckingsomething about it...

metoo22 Thu 29-Aug-13 12:06:57

Mozarela that sounds like a really horrible situation. I have seen 2 therapists now, and think I have chosen which one I will see. I feel scared but at the same time sort of excited and I'm pleased that I have got the ball rolling. I'm not sure how it will affect what I decide/do about my marriage, but I hope I will understand my own feelings and motivation and actions better. e.g. why I feel so responsible for h.

Overtiredmum Thu 29-Aug-13 13:00:54

Oddly, that seems to be something most of us are confused about - feelings of responsibility for our H/partners?

metoo22 Thu 29-Aug-13 18:43:41

Yes it does seem to be a pattern... How do you think that came about with you Overtired? For me I think it's partly because he came to this country to be with me and I have made excuses for him, under the guise of being supportive. I suppose I encouraged him to be independent, study, etc but never got angry about his lack of initiative or progress, instead it was always 'well its easier for me to do xyz'. But he's been here 25 years so why we are still in that pattern I don't know.

Overtiredmum Thu 29-Aug-13 19:03:47

I don't know, I think for me personally its more to do with the fact that I earn more, and because its me that has finished it "for no apparent reason", I'm taking away his stability? Does that make sense?

Although, ridiculously probably, I have offered him two thirds of the sale profits, have asked for no maintenance for DC when I eventually move out, because I want make sure he has money to do stuff with the DC.

But saying that just recently I am reaching the view the I want to go 50:50 with the sale proceeds, especially when he threatens to "sabotage" the sale hmm I have discovered he has been stashing money in a bank account, his family is looking after it for him and paying money in etc, so whilst I am contributing nearly £1k a month more in wages and struggling to make ends meet a little, I feel he is laughing at me abit?

Count me in.

I have spent 11 years (9 of them married) with a narcissist- how I wish I'd had found MN before I did. He works hard but has had addiction problems with gambling and alcohol in the past, and has a daily cannabis habit. The only reason he has any control over either is because I permanently hold his bank card and only give him a far too bloody generous weekly allowance.

We both have DCs from previous relationships and each of our youngest (teens) lives with us. As we are joint HA tenants, we have equal rights to live here (although I was in this house many years before we met) and the housing dept has no obligation to help if we split.

I work PT so couldn't afford to rent privately, and he has nowhere to go even if he wanted to.

He is moody, EA, and I tread on eggshells constantly. Apparently he can't talk to me, even though the whole world treats me like their counsellor.

There have been many periods where he emotionally withdraws. The latest alleged misdemeanor of mine has seen him choose to sleep on the couch for 2 weeks, not speak and refuse anything I cooked.

He thinks he's right, and assumes I will beg to sort things out for the sake of peace. Not this time. It's over for me but I'm just stuck sharing the house. One problem money would solve...

atosilis Fri 30-Aug-13 10:40:30

I feel responsible for my husband too. He is obviously very depressed, he is at home all day and has too much time to imagine scenarios that don't exist.

Last night I said, 'No-one has been talking behind your back and deciding where you should go at the weekend, the world does not revolve around you'.

His reply?

'Well it should, I'm treated like I'm invisible'.

The whole finding somewhere else to live, living on my pathetic salary, moving all my stuff out of the house, family reactions - then I think, "Oh it'll sort itself out".

I did tell my counsellor (my sanity saver) that he would be much happier if I shared a room with him, had sex with him and always did what he wanted and maybe I should do that so the house is calmer.

I actually let that thought enter my head!!!

atosilis Fri 30-Aug-13 10:41:50

then I think, "Oh it'll sort itself out".

By 'it', I meant our relationship - not the whole leaving saga

babyseal Fri 30-Aug-13 12:42:50

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

kickassangel Fri 30-Aug-13 12:55:30


Salbertina Fri 30-Aug-13 13:13:25

Thats great babyseal, sounds hardgoing for you but glad you're happier. Like a couple of others overseas on hete, i don't currently have those options - cant work, no benefits, cant take kids to UK without permission. Sigh.

babyseal Fri 30-Aug-13 13:20:37

Salbertina that does sound tough flowers

TrippleBerryFairy Fri 30-Aug-13 21:12:25

atosilis i sometimes think the same, if only i could fix myself (which in a way im doing by seeing therapist because i am aware i am very sensitive to rejection and feeling invisible), if only i could accept that this is my 'lot' and become immune to him looking at porn, not helping around the house and could just be fucking happy with the good bits (which i am when we are in a good phase) then all be fine.

But for whatever reason i cannot do that. I don't seem to be able to suppress the rage that i get when shitty bits stare me in the face. This rage (and desperation and powerlessness that goes with it) are physically affecting me, i become unable to sleep properly and recently i started on occassions 'feeling' my heart, nothing major just dull niggling in chest. Surely continuing like this long term is bound to make me ill?...

It is beyond me how he can ignore all of the above, he burries head in the sand- 'if i dont see it it will go away'. Is that what you do to a person you supposedly love?...

TrippleBerryFairy Fri 30-Aug-13 21:19:53

<<waves at marriednotdead>>
I thought you might find this thread... I dont feel i have the energy to start my own thread and it would take too long to put all on here but maybe if i make some sort of decision i will start it. It is more likely though that i will remain quiet as we make up until we hit the next low, it's too good to leave and leaving is scary in so many ways after all sad

jogalong Fri 30-Aug-13 21:47:49

Can i join your gang.
My dh is controlling and i just feel so low that I'll never have the courage to do anything about it.
I guess coming from a family background where my dad controlled my mum. And she's still with him and still miserable. So i don't really have any other experiences. This is what iv known all my life.
So for now I'll plod on and hopefully one day courage will come from somewhere.
Are there people that are in really happy marriages. Is this not the norm?? Iv never been happy in life so i think they're is not much hope for me no matter what i do.
Sorry for being so miserable

jogalong Fri 30-Aug-13 21:48:19

Can i join your gang.
My dh is controlling and i just feel so low that I'll never have the courage to do anything about it.
I guess coming from a family background where my dad controlled my mum. And she's still with him and still miserable. So i don't really have any other experiences. This is what iv known all my life.
So for now I'll plod on and hopefully one day courage will come from somewhere.
Are there people that are in really happy marriages. Is this not the norm?? Iv never been happy in life so i think they're is not much hope for me no matter what i do.
Sorry for being so miserable

<Waves back at Mozarela>

The feeling of powerlessness is what keeps us in that shitty place, living in hope that he will finally wake up and treat us properly. Except that he's not sleeping, WE are sad

I'm on the edge of taking some kind of control of my own destiny. The thought of spending the next decade and beyond like I have the last one is beyond me. I'm terrified of the future but anything has to be better than the present.

chirpingbird Fri 30-Aug-13 23:22:05

My dh and I have not made love for 16 years. He walked out on me when I wad 36 weeks pregnant and returned 2 weeks later.THings were not bad for a couple of years but he said he did not love me and did not think he ever had
Dr2 was diagnosed with severe autism at age 3 and we agreed to stick together and as the years have passed we are more and more trapped as Dr is now 20 and neither could cop we without the others help
We get on fine most of the timeliness much as we are a team but no physical affection from him not even a cuddle.I still love him.

kickassangel Sat 31-Aug-13 01:49:08

Chirping, we are very similar. We get on pretty well as friends, but not so much as a hug. Dd is ADHD and we are thousands of miles from family so it is just a lot easier to live together. At least now I have a job, so could be independent if I wanted to be.

He says he doesn't love me and I have no desire to be with him as anything other than a co parent.

I would love to live close to each other, share the parenting, even go on holidays together,but not be married.but how do you go from being stuck to that?

My heart goes out to you with a ds who needs extra help as well.

Salbertina Sat 31-Aug-13 08:46:45

Kick, can you afford the setup you describe or is something else trapping you?
Chirping, sounds v cruel, he could have left you free to be with someone who DID love you all these years! But then am a total hypocrite as don't fancy dh, never much did, think i love him but platonically. I met him on the rebound from a longterm guy i was CRAZY for. he knew all about this. i married him as he was a decent guy and i was scared, heartbroken and had given up on idea of marrying for love. Am a cruel coward myself but ironically I'm far more trapped than he is currently! My comeuppance, hey?!

Overtiredmum Sat 31-Aug-13 10:55:03

My worst time of the week - weekends hmm

Salbertina Sat 31-Aug-13 11:08:12

Oh me too, Over! Dread it. Feel guilty for dc but just cannot be around dh right now too toxic, relentless and depressing!

grounddown Sat 31-Aug-13 11:13:48

Well I've told my P today that I don't want this (again) and along with the usual 'but you will ruin the kids lives' he said he will make my life a living hell. I did try to explain that that means he would make the kids lives hell too but he wouldn't accept that. He has also been reading my texts and has discovered that my parents have kindly offered to release some equity from their house to buy a house for me and the kids and is making out like they hate him and they are taking his family away from him. I just don't know what to do.

I guess I should leave the thread because it is no longer too good to stay!

Overtiredmum Sat 31-Aug-13 11:46:53

Don't leave us Grounddown, we are here for you! It's just a natural reaction, the stuff he is saying, my H said the same. What do you want to do now?

I feel guilt too at not wanting to be here, they sense how tense I am around him. He just questioned me what "our" wages go on again, because I refuse to buy him a football shirt out of the joint account?! shock

Overtiredmum Sat 31-Aug-13 11:50:34

One thing my relate counsellor said to me and it's something to keep in mind. My choice to separate from H was through nobodies fault. But he is hurting, and therefore he wants to make me hurt, without realising that I am already hurt and grieving for the end of the relationship, so basically I am getting double the hurt - does that make sense?

When there is no apparent reason for leaving the relationship, it is confusing I guess. My H refuses to see he has done anything wrong.

kickassangel Sat 31-Aug-13 13:10:52

What you are both going through is what makes me stay. I just can't cope with going through the process, no matter how much I want to come out the other end. I spend my life fantasizing about having a small place of my own. I also dread what the fallout from family would be, it could be the end of my relationship with both sets of parents. It would leave dd and I so alone.

Also, which country would I live in? I think I would want UK but dh would stay in US, so even more on our own.

And dd hates any change. It took her a year to adjust to moving here. This would be awful for her. She would want to stay in the US and dh has to give us permission to leave.

We have enough money to set up 2 comfortable homes, and I earn enough to support me and dd, and we live somewhere that would quickly put an attachment on earnings. It would be relatively easy to set up my own small home around here.

So why aren't I doing it?

Redspottedhanky Sat 31-Aug-13 16:05:58

Long time lurker here but,as this thread is particularly relevant,hope you don't mind me joining.
Have been married for over thirty years and have wanted to leave for such a long time but have never had the courage. As I'm getting older this feeling has become stronger. I constantly dream about my own place - where it would be,how I would decorate it etc, but I know it will come to nothing. I know why I stay with my husband - I feel both responsible and sorry for him - he has no-one else apart from our ds who is in her early twenties.
I have seen a counsellor who has told me to go with my gut feeling and that I am well aware what I should do. Still I dawdle - thinking everything will turn out ok without me doing anything about it.
Sorry for the rant !

WhiteandGreen Sat 31-Aug-13 16:09:42

groundown My Ex told me he would make me regret leaving. In the end he didn't act all horrid cos he realised it would be futile. Not saying yours will see sense, but it is possible.

metoo22 Sat 31-Aug-13 17:33:46

Hi Redspotted you are another who feels responsible and sorry for husband/partner, like so many of us. I think this is what I really need to work on myself - they are adults as we are, they should be responsible for their own lives. I feel that my h relies on me for his 'happiness' (actually he's not happy either) and it's not fair. 'If you loved me and would have sex with me I would be happy, it's simple'. The pressure is too much. I don't know what I think will happen to my h if I do end it - but depression or excessive alcohol and 'giving up' are possible. But maybe I underestimate him?

Overtiredmum Mon 02-Sep-13 10:15:39

It's all gone quiet on here - hope everyone is ok.

I survived the weekend, always feel such relief on Monday morning - how sad is that?! Xx

I'm here. Totally agree about weekends. Sundays used to be our family day as I often work Saturdays, but lately it's a farce. DH often refuses to eat with us at the last minute over some trivial gripe that he's blown out of all proportion- he did it again yesterday hmm

I wish he'd just go. Got about the same chance of winning the lottery.

Hope everyone else has made it through unscathed flowers

metoo22 Mon 02-Sep-13 10:46:54

Hi I'm here too. I have been re reading bits of the book. H is away, and I have been enjoying time with dcs a lot, but also feeling sick and worried at thought of the talk that I think needs to be had when he gets back. And will be back at work myself this week which is going to be hard too.
Another question from the book: Do you and h have a pleasurable activity that you look forward to doing together? Not that you have to actually do it a lot but you share the prospect and the planning and the anticipation. That is one thing we no longer have and I think I was made to feel it was petty to worry about it, but I think its basic.

OvertiredandConfused Mon 02-Sep-13 10:53:19

Just had an interesting weekend. MiL been with us since Wednesday - helping with childcare as we both work full-time - so some challenges although I am fond of her and we get on okay in smaller doses! DH has been as grumpy as ever - just the same with his mum as with me and DC so, in a strange way, does make me feel better in the sense that I don't think it's personal.

DS made a comment that when he's asked to put his clothes away is the worst part of his day. This led to a conversation about the worst part of everyone's day. DH stunned me by saying - seriously, not sarcastically - that for him it's when he and I go our separate ways part way through our commute each morning. He was quite shocked and hurt when I found that hard to believe. Hopefully, that's given him some food for thought.....

metoo22 Mon 02-Sep-13 11:19:10

OTandconfused it sounds like you are feeling some hope there? Have you thought about relationship counselling? Maybe the 2 of you could talk better to someone else? Reading your previous post you don't sound quite so far down the road as some?

OvertiredandConfused Mon 02-Sep-13 12:12:25

Thanks meetoo. I don't think we are too far down the road. I just know it's more than the normal ups and downs and want to do something about it while we can - because following this path isn't an option for me.

He won't do RELATE type counselling but he was quite supportive of me seeing a counsellor when I was hugely stressed about work two or three years ago. Think I need to find something for us both that feels more like that to him.

Overtiredmum Mon 02-Sep-13 13:52:00

My H tried to "invite" himself along to my relate sessions, only because I wouldn't discuss what was discussed! I've only had 2 sessions so far but it really helped to have someone neutral to talk to, who didn't judge me and who wouldn't say "why would you not want to stay together, he's so nice"?!

I agree with the having something you do together that you both enjoy - that's something we never did. That's something I will bear in mind in years to come if someone else ever comes along hmm

I realised quite a lot this weekend. I didn't stop all weekend, trying to keep house tidy, get kids sorted for school this week. He seems to have taken the attitude that he doesn't need to do anything round the house. He was supposed to go out for a few beers yesterday, but because I wouldn't pay for it shock and cos I wouldn't 't do his ironing, he decided to stay home and watch football all day, I'm just so bored of it now xx

Salbertina Mon 02-Sep-13 14:28:23

Well not a good weekend. At all. Getting intolerable but still feel stuck. What to do? Not easy, is it?

JuicyShops Mon 02-Sep-13 14:53:35

I am so glad this is not just me

Overtiredmum Mon 02-Sep-13 18:08:13

Do you want to talk about it Salbertina? x

lovemenot Wed 11-Sep-13 18:01:47

Am reading the book this thread is named after. And gaining clarity.

Not sure where it's gonna end up though, but it's not looking good :-(

tessa6 Wed 11-Sep-13 18:03:14

good for you, lovemenot. What questions have you come a cropper with?

Another shit evening, I know it has to end. I've moved into the spare room.

I've been looking at accommodation and I can't face moving out just yet - I need to get my head round things.

flowers to everyone xxx

lovemenot Wed 11-Sep-13 18:31:40

Tessa6, offthetable-itis is a biggie. He ended joint counseling and has since refused to talk about it. He is making some effort since but it's really only a peacekeeping effort, with no major substance. Pretty much as superficial as most of our relationship is. No intimacy either - he decided he was ending our sex life due to it's sporadic nature. No discussion on how to improve it, just a decision he made on his own and didn't share with me. By the time I figured it out, I didn't care.

tessa6 Wed 11-Sep-13 19:05:58

oh so sorry, to sunshine and to lovemenot.

Sounds horrible. thinking of you.

tessa6 Wed 11-Sep-13 19:05:58

oh so sorry, to sunshine and to lovemenot.

Sounds horrible. thinking of you.

Hello everyone, had no idea this was where we were all hanging out and although I'm sad to see so many people here, I am relieved as I thought it was just me. 3 things keep me here: firstly, we need to get real about money/benefits. If we split up and sold, we would realise only around £30k each. That would not be enough to get anywhere else to live, so I'd have to rent, and that £30k would mean no benefits and I'm self employed so one month I earn nothing next month I earn £600 and so on. So that would mess things up as well - not enough to live on, but too much to claim benefits. And he doesn't earn enough to support himself if we had two houses, let alone us. Its only by pooling resources that it all works out (just).

Secondly, I've spoken on here before about us staying together as we have long term health problems and there is a certain amount of mutual caring - the first night apart I'd probably have some sort of incident meaning I'd have to ring him and ask for help (no family).

Third and final, but most important (I think) - I reckon he would lose the plot. I read something in a newspaper about men who flip because their wife, children and home is a sort of trophy that defines who they are, it gives them respectability at work etc, its all they have (true in his case). Even if he didn't flip I would be constantly scared of him turning up screaming and crying and worried about the effect on the children of seeing him like that.

We've been married 25 years (silver wedding next month thank god there's no party etc sad) - I fantasise about being able to leave but I wouldn't want another relationship and we're in our 50s so what's the point? I get on and do as much on my own/with children as I can, he sits indoors and nurses his phobias and delusions.

I suppose the worse thing is my Mum was like this too, and she died when she was a couple of years older than I am now. I can look back and see how awful it was for her, and how I then couldn't manage relationships as a result, and feel sick to think that my DDs might make the same mistakes yet again like some bizarre time warp.

Little bump to see if anyone who was on thread would like to update?

mcmooncup Thu 12-Sep-13 12:43:34

I love the phrase "emotionally clean".
That is what you get when you leave these shit marriages.
Money can't buy that smile

Ivedunnit Thu 12-Sep-13 15:41:30

Ok I have been lurking for too long!
My Dh is EA and also a functioning alcoholic. He is a good Dad we have a DS between us and a DSD of 24 who lives with her Mum in another country.
I have lived with many years of EA from when he comes home drunk and tries to pick a fight each and every time blaming me , or DS.
Then having suffered post natal depression that is thrown at me as being a psycho.
He has with held intimacy for many years with the excuse that he didn't want me to get pregnant......
Currently we have been intimate perhaps 4 times this year.
He works shift a mix of days and nights and thus there are only about 1 day in 7 it would be deemed acceptable to him to have sex. As he either has to get up for work at 5 or he is drunk and arguing.
Financially i can do it and up unitl this week I just didn't have the guts.
We live outside the Uk with no family support. But when my DH asked me this week if we were going to split I answered honestly that maybe it is for the best to have two happy parents than two unhappy.
I just can't do it anymore. I am back on the Anti d's and this is a direct result of living with him.
Enough is enough I hope my change in user name says it all.
I have been to the bank and they will give me enough to buy him out.
I have told him this week that it is either counselling or out and he says he doesn't need counselling as I am the one who is wrong in the head.
So we are meeting tonight for dinner to try and talk civilly about how we move forward.
He wants DS 50% which I agree as long as the drinking goes. I believe whilst he is a good father this is motivated by the need not to pay maintenance.

I am married 13 years already divorced once.

I just feel I have been trying to make things right for so long and that is just not possible anymore.

elmerelephant Thu 12-Sep-13 18:47:03

I too am in this sad situation,my DH has been having EA's for years, I am now up to number 10 that I know of. I have no words of wisdom sadly , every time its sooo hard, but my son needs another year of stability to complete his exams, so I can put off any final decision till next August. Ive been amassing a running away fund, and you never know this time next year I may be off, yeah right.............

Overtiredmum Thu 12-Sep-13 20:20:32

Feeling totally sick at the thought of working days. I've worked evenings for 8 years and I didn't have the DC then, so all new territory to me.

The house sale is going through, waiting to exchange, at which point I can find somewhere to rent, but I really need to try and do that in the space of the next 3 weeks, starting my new job, I won't be able to get time off during the week to complete and move. If I can't rent somewhere before I have to move, it will probably mean I will have to find six months rent in advance, as I will be on three months' probation for my new job. I will have the money, once I complete, but its not ideal timing. So everything is really dependant on stuff happening next week, I just feel sick with worry

I can't find anywhere I like the look of, and if I need to go the route of renting somewhere once I've completed and started my new job, what do I do? Clear the house, store it with the removals, stay in a hotel or with friends for the week, and then move into the new rented house on the saturday? Is that do-able?

Any advice gratefully received. I am feeling quite low and lonely tonight, am terrified of the future, but it has to be better than what I have at the moment. I am still getting the occasional "I'm not babysitting the DC so you can work!". I have had no contact at all with dear parents for a few weeks now, although I know they are still in contact with H.

Some days I get texts saying I love you no matter what, the next day he;ll be completely normal and chatty and almost friendly, and like tonight, hes all said and depressed. I still feel guilt but I am just getting exhausted with it now.

Our wages still go into the joint account, I contribute quite a bit more, but am struggling to get to the end of the month. I found out he has been stashing quite considerable sums of money from gambling on websites and other stuff, which makes me sick to the stomach. Its not about the money for me, its about the fact that they all still feel I should sit tight and make the marriage work - when will they understand there is no marriage. I get constantly accused of having affairs with any man I even dare have a conversation with

My life is on the up, I just still very stuck with no way out at the moment. Anyone offer me a shoulder?


Notmyidea Fri 13-Sep-13 06:24:28

Have a shoulder OTM, you're a braver lady than I am. Just look back at all the posters here who are out the other side, they say it's worth it.

I'm so glad to have found this thread as I do not dare complain about my marriage in real life, except in frequent rows with the husband. Somehow complaining about the lack of healthy relationship makes me sound and feel like a spoiled brat.

Ivedunnit Fri 13-Sep-13 08:55:02

So we had dinner last night to discuss DS and the split of everything. I lasted 30 minutes before I walked out. You can only listen to how it is all your fault so many times.
MY DH need serious help but can't see it at all.
He came home and apologised for upsetting me in the restaraunt but has never apologised for the verbal abuse.
DS knows as DH took him with him to view a house today . WTAF. Not the way I had planned for DS to find out. I then was told from my BF that DS is telling everyon that it will be grand as they are getting a dog. ARGHHH!
He told me this morning that he does not want to end the relationship - why would he ???
But is not prepared to go for help either together or himself. That takes me back to status quo.
I feel sick this morning at the what seems unsurmountable tasks ahead of getting organised and out of this hell hole.

mrsibley Fri 13-Sep-13 17:03:14

I am on the verge of leaving my relationship but am very scared of the financial implications, amongst many other factors. I have no job and am financially dependant on dp. What would I be entitled to? I have 2 dcs aged 3 and 6 months. I know nothing about the benefit or tax credits system.

Has anyone in a similar position looked into this?

Salbertina Fri 13-Sep-13 18:52:39

Clocking in. Nothing to report. Plus ca change.

Sorry there are so many of us but thank God for MN.

Not sure about financial stuff bit think you can check online. Am in similar sit except overseas and stuck! and probanly snyitled to bugger all. Certainly here anyway

harassedmotherof3 Sat 14-Sep-13 17:08:32

My husband is also EA and functioning alcoholic. He won't leave, so think my only option would be solicitors letter and file for divorce if he won't co-operate with separation agreement. Such a final move, and it would be hell living with him while it goes through. He's been rude to all my friends and family, so if I want to see them I have to do it myself.

therewearethen Sat 14-Sep-13 19:38:39

This couldn't have popped up at a better time for me. DP is moving out at the end of the month (I told him it was over, again) but I'm in 2 minds if its for the best sad

He's my best friend, together years, 2 kids, no DV or EA that I can tell but not been happy with certain things which I brush under the carpet but every few months I think I'm better off on my own sad

There was no fight at all from DP this time or last come to think of it which means he doesn't want me doesn't it?

Ivedunnit Mon 16-Sep-13 10:19:27

So we have a family holiday booked for October and "we " decided we should just go on it as normal.
I have tickets for a concert this week and asked my friend to come. When I told DH he went mental and said we are going to Tenerife together in October - I pointed out that was for the benefit of DS.
I feel as if I am living in a twilight world. Meanwhile he is showing me the documents of houses he is viewing.

BranchingOut Mon 16-Sep-13 12:38:27

Hi, cant post in detail now, but signing in.
How did you all read the book? I can't really buy it and read it in the evenings opposite him!

littlecrystal Mon 16-Sep-13 13:30:30

I am getting emotional while reading this thread. I have been there.. or I was. I symphatise a lot with this thread as I am still one leg in it.
Several years of emotionally detached marriage where we just grew apart and just few weeks ago almost reached the point of separation. It did not help that all we do is work, take care of 2 DC and have no time or money for any fun stuff. I was ridden with guilt as this is my second marriage and my current husband blamed me with the same thing (one of the things) as the first i.e. not cooking enough – quite a small thing but hit my head hard. Somehow I managed to pick both my husbands being quiet traditionalist husbands, where a wife must cook and take care of home. While my idea is we both have equal hands to help with things.

Anyway, while being almost on a brink of separation I googled a lot about how to save the marriage and came to the 3 conclusions: 1) I have neglected my husband 2) one must start making changes from him(her)self 3) if I feel strong enough to handle divorce and single mum life, I may as well be strong enough to try and save my marriage. So, equipped with the internet knowledge I am now trying to see if making effort FOR my husband will make any difference. The effort is not that big, mainly cooking every evening and showing affection and care. He responds well. I thought long and hard how I feel about it as it is quite traditionalist and submissive but I like the result that I see, I finally made my husband smile and talk to me about his day and appreciate my efforts and even responding to my little requests for help. I hope that this will help him to rethink his behavior and change for good, too.

This is what most of us does with any new boyfriend anyway so I figured I will try all of this with my old boring husband. A part of it may be pretending, but I have read somewhere if you repeat enough times “I love you” you will start to believe in it.

For me at the moment this is better solution than separating/divorcing as we have 2 little boys and my heart breaks to break the family apart for the sake of happiness. Yes we are entitled to happiness but who said that we live for happiness – no one ever has 100% happiness and it is all very relative. I live for other things too, like comfort, security, stability, 2 parent family etc. If it breaks my heart to get divorced for the second time, then I’d rather won’t do. Or at least not until DC reach the age of 16 (>10 years to go). Though I wish my marriage would be better, I don’t feel like a victim to stay in the marriage.

On the other hand DH and I both work and go out with friends so we get enough of “me” time so we don’t feel deprived of the chance to pursue my own hobbies, friends etc.

I divorced my first husband about 10 years ago. We were still in love when we divorced but were too ambitious and stubborn with each other. In the hindsight all could have been reconciled if we had more wisdom. I do regret my first divorce on occasions.
Sorry if I am being to explicit here. Everyone’s to each own life path.

littlecrystal Mon 16-Sep-13 13:41:03

A joke, hope it enlightens your mood:

A wife goes to a divorce lawyer: “My husband wants to divorce me, how I can take revenge?!”
Divorce lawyer: “Be super sweet and super nice to him for the next three months and then file for divorce yourself”
After 3 months:
Divorce lawyer: “When are you going to book an appointment with me for filing for divorce?”
Wife: “What divorce?? We are in the Carribean on our second honeymoon!”

Salbertina Mon 16-Sep-13 13:42:21

Gosh shock - hope it works out as you want, radical though. Or rather not. Think my dh wd love similar treatment but i really do expect him to pull his weight at home more so daren't budge an inch...

Biscuitsareme Mon 16-Sep-13 14:29:46

littlecrystal so basically you are trying to save your marriage by giving in to your OH and doing more than your fair share of the housework? I'm all for being pleasant to others, but this 'cooking a meal for him every night' sounds a bit doormat-like to me.

Ivedunnit Mon 16-Sep-13 14:35:57

I am also divorced and married for the second time. I am so embarrassed that this has also failed. More so as we have a child now involved.
But I have tried to look past my DH's faults and pull together but this is not possible if there is only one person prepared to work at it and the other person will accept no blame.
Many times in the past we have been close to this point and I have always pulled back. And again this time it was put to me was I sure that I wanted to end this. Thisis so he has someone to blame again - it wasn't him that ended it. Though he did by his actions and refusal to acknowledge the EA.
littlecrystal I hope it works for you.

littlecrystal Mon 16-Sep-13 14:44:32

Well that's the thing - trying to figure out the fair share does not work for us. Yes I come from work earlier than him so I cook dinner. So far he cooked all his meals for himself but that contributed to us drifting apart. He still cooks on weekends for himself and family not that I love his food very much
Yes I will take his coat and pass his slippers if that helps to save the marriage.
No I am not and will not be a doormat. This is a strategy. He contributes in other ways (car, DC, cleaning house etc). But I want to do what is important for him.

I don't know if it works long term but at least I will give it a try.

TrippleBerryFairy Mon 16-Sep-13 16:03:07

littlecrystal, what you are trying to do sounds very tough. I couldn't do it though (eventhough i sometimes contemplate trying to be perfect partner for a week or so...).

I started reading the book and got first blow with the first question- was it really good in the beginning? No, it wasnt really as very early, from around month 3 i noticed there were issues as he didn't want to have sex and i wondered wtf is going on? But then we went on holiday and 4 months in i got pregnant. And we are together since and he still doesnt want me (eventhough he claims otherwise but surely actions speak louder than words) and rarely touches me.

Where do i go with the knowledge that its hard to fix something that wasnt even there in the first place? I'm not sure yet so i stay where i am for now...

fromparistoberlin Mon 16-Sep-13 16:12:15

me too

I decided that whilst its bad (and it has been) I cant bear to only see my kids 50% of the time (he is a SAHD)- I am working on it. lets see till he has his next blow out eh?

fromparistoberlin Mon 16-Sep-13 16:14:39

and, I miss him. but next time he has a mega fucking temper I dont know how I will cope

Ivedunnit Mon 16-Sep-13 16:18:08

mozarela i am in the same place as you , when I think back was it ever right or did I just make it right !
I have whole list of stuff that I have put up with, not affairs or the likes but EA of the extreme form that if a friend told me they were putting up with this I would have told them they were crazy!
There is no intimacy in our house either. We were on holiday a few years back and DS was of an age to willingly participate in the kids clubs. So I thought woohoo- 2 weeks of loving. After the first time he told me not to expect this every day ! I think we had sex twice on a two week holiday!

lovemenot Mon 16-Sep-13 16:19:15

Just finished the book. Got clarity. Big row last week, I offered an apology that wasn't accepted and I was not offered one for the horrendous stuff he said.

I'm done. Just have to figure out how to end it and protect mine (and dd's) interests.

Ivedunnit Mon 16-Sep-13 16:31:12

Who is the Author of the book ?

lovemenot Mon 16-Sep-13 16:51:08

Mira Kirshenbaum

lovemenot Mon 16-Sep-13 16:51:25
KingRollo Mon 16-Sep-13 20:03:18

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Notmyidea Mon 16-Sep-13 21:29:18

Not having a good day here, eithersad Just waiting for the row once dd1 finishes her homework and goes to bed.

KingRollo Mon 16-Sep-13 21:30:04

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Overtiredmum Mon 16-Sep-13 21:56:54

Do you want to talk about it KingRollo?

KingRollo Tue 17-Sep-13 00:14:35

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

KingRollo Tue 17-Sep-13 05:41:35

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Salbertina Tue 17-Sep-13 06:21:56

Good for you, King. Not at all easy but at least you've made up your mind to leave, sounds best in then circumstances. From my experience, much better from kids' pov to do sooner rather than later, your baby will have no memory of these hard times at least.

Overtiredmum Tue 17-Sep-13 07:51:56

So sorry KingRollo, how are you feeling this morning? X

therewearethen Tue 17-Sep-13 08:08:08

That's shit kingrollo, leave the twat to it, she's soon get bored when he does the same to her!

Just an update: DP is moving out at the end of the month confused

Babylonmoo Tue 17-Sep-13 08:19:12

I'm very sad to read about some of your situations. Happily I'm not in this position myself -I think I read the thread to see how I can avoid it developing. We just recently had a baby and I said to my DH that we now had to stay together forever but be happy together and stop any rot in its tracks. My parents got divorced when i was very young and I am determined for that not happen to my children. However divorce is not the worst thing for children. As parents you have the biggest influence on your children's lives. They will learn a lot about relationships from seeing your relationship. Where these are loveless at best or abusive at worst this is a terrible example to set your children. While knowing this doesn't change the financial, practical and geographical problems a lot of you face, don't use the children as a reason to stay - you are doing them no favours in the long term. Good luck to all of you.

Overtiredmum Tue 17-Sep-13 08:28:08

Congrats on the baby Babylon. I admire your determination to avoid any problems in your relationship, although I'm sure we would all have hoped to avoid the same too. No-one can predict life and circumstances. Xx

Babylonmoo Tue 17-Sep-13 08:49:30

Sorry if I sounded smug- I genuinely didn't mean to or imply that anyone is to blame etc. my point was that I have two very strong slightly conflicting feelings since having the baby- one is no divorce and the second is not staying together solely for the kids. Not easy.

fromparistoberlin Tue 17-Sep-13 09:06:03


i am sorry, look i just want to say that as painful as it is, he has given you a big fucking GREEN CARD to LTB

seriously, how much more misery can you take? Many people stay because their partner/life etc makes it nigh on impossible to leave

I wish you every luck, and I can imagine how shit you feel


you deserve better, and you will find better!

to quote: He never thinks about me, doesn't bother about me, doesn't take care of me or make sure I'm ok unless I'm literally in tears in front of him.

FUCK THAT for a game of tennis

sweetie, this is shit. But him having an affair has actually done you a favour as now you have to finish, and given your sentance above....its eating at your and dragging you down

good luck, sending some happy karma your way XXXX

Overtiredmum Tue 17-Sep-13 09:25:09

Babylon I didn't mean to imply you that. I genuinely admire your determination and there is no reason to believe your marriage won't be a long and happy one.

I'm like you, although my parents never divorced, they separated on many occasions so I fully understand your point about staying together for the sake of the DCs. It taught me many lessons and has made my mother very bitter now, to the point that she has completely rejected me. My DC have experienced first hand my unhappiness over the last year or so, so I want them to see if you are unhappy with something, change it, never make do.

IntheCorner Tue 17-Sep-13 10:17:32

Littlecrystal, I'm interested in your approach as I have considered doing the same. Things have been pretty bad for a few weeks now (but with some nice times here and there). But I think I would have to stifle/change so much of myself if I followed your approach that I would be unhappy.

I've been coping with feeling this way to a greater or lesser extent for 9 years or so, found various coping strategies, and been ok on the whole. Now youngest is almost at school leaving age, I have to seriously consider whether a split would be easier, in a couple of years' time.

Right now, we can't afford to run two households, we like where we live, we are happy with the school.

And yes, I'd like to know how people manage to read the book? Or are your Hs so uninterested in you that you can read it while he sits staring at the TV?

Sorry, I'm rambling. This thread is both helpful and very sad indeed. I can't share with anyone in real life - they appear to either be really happy in their relationships, or have their own problems.

Ivedunnit Tue 17-Sep-13 10:37:26

To Fellow posters can you tell me was it ever good or did you make it right ? As mosarela said and I agree it was never right but I made it right!
I am angry with myself for getting myself in to this situation worse so now DS is involved also. But I have to make a choice for him and for me. I don't want him to grow believing that what he sees at home with regards to relationships is correct.
DH put an offer infor a house today but it was refused. 3 weeks I ago I was 'happily' married. I am sad that he will not go for counselling, but I guess that is a big flag for me.

Notmyidea Tue 17-Sep-13 12:42:10

Ivedunnit, for me it's parenthood that has changed me beyond all recognition. I now need a level of affirmation, support and forgiveness from him that he's not willing or able to give and that I could never have imagined as a bright young thing. I've read a fair few self help books over the years, (counselling feels like an unaffordable extravagance that would add to our burdens) but he's just not willing to put in any effort or talk with me. I was very close to leaving him before ds was conceived. I had been had been back at work after my older two for a few years, building some financial independence from him and rediscovering my self esteem. I even wonder if he did some condom-tampering which resulted in ds to put us/me back to where we were. I love ds very dearly and wouldn't change him for the world but another baby wasn't what I'd been planning for this stage of my life.

BranchingOut Tue 17-Sep-13 13:05:26

I sometimes really wonder whether divorce is the answer in the longer term, especially when you take the problems of old-age into consideration.

We recently saw a friend who separated from her first husband a few years back, who is now splitting up with her second partner. Her situation is not good from a financial or a practical point of view (3 children) and it does give me pause for thought....

Ivedunnit Tue 17-Sep-13 14:46:35

For me it is I made it right from the start rightly or wrongly! I look back and see how many situations which I should have reacted differently.
I am unsure if I really didn't know DH or didn't accept that I knew full well and was trying to kid myself.
Took the papers to the bank today for the equity release. I should know next week if I can afford it or not.

Salbertina Tue 17-Sep-13 15:12:45

Wry smile at thought of all of us reading the book blatantly in front of our better other halves. Or under the covers at night?! Not even read the whole thing - read a kindle sample which was useful (and nice and covert) , just lurk a lot on these types of threads hmm and seen it often recommended.

Salbertina Tue 17-Sep-13 16:08:18

Branching- just been reflecting on your post. Wonder what Gransnet feedback would be? Lessons to learn from our elders and all that.

fromparistoberlin Tue 17-Sep-13 16:14:36

my solutuon so far (with the help of my therapist) has been to try and stop hating him. Its been suprisingly helpful! hissing "you fucking arsehole" cunt under my breath at every interaction has not been great, not suprisingly.

NOW, I am not saying I will put up with shitty behaviour

but me being contrantly fuming, angry, resentful, , when deep down I love him, was a mess

I dont know, but this thread is helpful. as for a long time I have found that the knee jerk LTB reactions whilst well meant, are not always practical

butterballs9 Tue 17-Sep-13 16:40:14

I started a separate thread before seeing this one. I am in the 'too good to leave' camp. There is nothing wrong with my husband. But I realize that I no longer want the constraints of marriage. But I can't bear the thought of divorce - financially it would be crippling and there would be massive disapproval from family. Our children are nearly grown up so that is not so much of an issue (although it would still be an issue, obviously!) When I look around at my friends, my marriage is in better shape than many so there must be an awful lot of people out there who do feel 'stuck' in their marriages.

BranchingOut Tue 17-Sep-13 16:40:32

I often wonder at the perspectives of people who are quick to say LTB very quickly. Have they done so themselves, or are they in the first 5 years of a relationship where everything seems good? I might one day start a thread and ask for the perspectives of people who have been in a relationship for 15 - 20 years: just what is realistic for life within a long relationship?

butterballs9 Tue 17-Sep-13 16:57:38

Divorce is not necessarily a great option. One of my friend's divorced her emotionally abusive husband and he continues to make her life a misery. She actually thinks she would have been better off staying married to him as he is now so bitter about the divorce and is determined to 'punish' her. It's a horrible situation.

gottachangethename1 Tue 17-Sep-13 19:01:00

I could have written a lot of these posts myself. My husband is verbally and emotionally abusive. I left him a few years ago but my self worth was so low that I took him back.
I'm going to see a counsellor and hope this gives me the strength to leave him once and for all. I live my life walking I egg shells and like metoo22 I am made to feel responsible for his entire life because he moved here two decades ago to be here with me.
Think this thread is the right place for me- sadly.

KingRollo Tue 17-Sep-13 19:13:40

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

MisguidedAngel Tue 17-Sep-13 20:34:19

I've just read this whole thread and feel very sad for you all, and I can relate to a lot of it. I was married for 27 years and it was never very good from the start - but he was a good man. We were both young and my self-esteem was so low I thought I was lucky that anyone wanted me. These days, we would have lived together and found out it wasn't working - back then in the 60's it wasn't like that.

I wasn't happy (crap sex life and no emotional connection) but I escaped by putting all my energies into the children, and later on into my work. He left me - he'd been having an affair and she pressured him into leaving. At first I was so shocked, angry and scared. I'd never lived on my own and didn't think I could cope. But within weeks I felt a huge weight lifting from my shoulders. Both DD said they weren't surprised. Then he wanted to come back and I said no. I've never regretted it, he has.

But I was lucky - both DD had left home, there was enough money for me to have a small but lovely house of my own and I was earning enough to support myself. Many of you are not in that position. I should have had the courage to leave - I respect those of you who do. So many of us (women) seem to feel that our needs are less important than any one else's. Now my mantra is 'me first, you a close second'.

Not much help to those of you who are going through it - but I have been sincerely touched by your stories and I want to send you all my good wishes for the future.

Ivedunnit Tue 17-Sep-13 22:05:15

kingrollo I was ready to go last July and I stayed to put some money behind me and to put the utility bills in joint names. Previously they were all in mine.
You are doing the right thing step by step!

Thiswasntsupposedhappen Tue 17-Sep-13 22:33:14

Hello ladies please may I pull up a chair?

Found out 18 months ago my husband had been visiting massage parlours for 12 months. He went about every 2-3 months for a massage and a happy ending. I can't even believe I am writing it. Even still.

Two beautiful children. We are in out 30'a . He has said it was his way of coping with stress and work. And he wanted to be pampered. Something he didnt get from me ( with two young children at the time.)

He says he regrets it terribly, but it doesn't erase what he has done. I gave up a successful career for our children. I am now retraining in a new area to get a job asap.
He still says he regrets it all, he was selfish. But I can't f

Thiswasntsupposedhappen Tue 17-Sep-13 22:34:26

Hello ladies please may I pull up a chair?

Found out 18 months ago my husband had been visiting massage parlours for 12 months. He went about every 2-3 months for a massage and a happy ending. I can't even believe I am writing it. Even still.

Two beautiful children. We are in out 30'a . He has said it was his way of coping with stress and work. And he wanted to be pampered. Something he didnt get from me ( with two young children at the time.)

He says he regrets it terribly, but it doesn't erase what he has done. I gave up a successful career for our children. I am now retraining in a new area to get a job asap.
He still says he regrets it all, he was selfish. But I can't forget what he's done. It repulses when I think about what he's done.

Iam making a money pot for the children and I. What worries me is being

Thiswasntsupposedhappen Tue 17-Sep-13 22:35:57

Hard up and struggling.....

Sorry to post again my laptop was playing up x

KingRollo Wed 18-Sep-13 02:39:37

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

fromparistoberlin Wed 18-Sep-13 08:20:41

I think for everyone, at some stage there is a tipping point

where we say fuck this, I cant go on

kingrollo has reached it!

many of us have not yet. I was chatting with a friend about our last mega row last night, and it was not comfortable to hear what I was saying

aiaiaiaiaia!!!! noone said it was easy this life business

Salbertina Wed 18-Sep-13 08:56:56


Misguided- thank you for your wise words of experience. There's hope then!

IntheCorner Thu 19-Sep-13 08:01:17

Paristoberlin - interesting what you say about trying to stop hating him. I hiss "bastard" when I see a reminder of his damaging behaviour, think "f* off" at some of the things he says. But then I get a reminder of something good we have done, and feel upset that I am thinking of ending it...

Someone else asked whether things were really good in the beginning. I've been thinking about this, too; things were good, but with hindsight, and observing other people's relationships, probably not as good as they should have been. But I made my bed...

And although this thread is helpful, reading it also somehow reinforces the fact that I am not happy. Sorry if that upsets anyone.

For the next couple of days I have to try to like him as we have something important to do at the weekend.

Good luck to everyone.

Salbertina Thu 19-Sep-13 08:16:40

Corner and Paris- thanks for making me feel less of an evil witch! I mutter dark, sweary thoughts about dh too! In the moment this makes me feel better, but somehow once those toxic thoughts are out there, it often feels OTT and awful.

Notmyidea Thu 19-Sep-13 12:44:06

Ah! The muttering under one's breath. I do it and so does dh, and it really, really hurts. I just have to say his name and it's "WHADDA YOU WANT? miserable bitch" under his breath. And I know I'm as bad. I can be feeling neutral, or even quite fond of him and then bam, I feel hurt and unfairly treated, insecure....
I think the difference is that if I challenge him about it he denies it and insists I'm hearing things. If he challenges me while I'm pissed off it starts a row.

IntheCorner Sat 28-Sep-13 16:06:01

Hello, just wondering how everyone is? We had our good weekend last week, but evenings since have been more bad than good...

I'm trying to stand up for myself when he's being an arse, but the result is just that we row. Having to take life one day at a time at the moment. Have the house to myself for a short time so taking the opportunity to have a quick look at MN.

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