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Trying 'The Rules' with OD. Anyone else attempted this?

(56 Posts)
akaWisey Thu 22-Aug-13 16:37:16

That's what I've decided to do. Joined POF last week, bought the Rules of Internet Dating and hoping for something better than I've had thus far….

Not sure how well this method translates however…….the last thing I want is marriage and the principle's all seem geared up to 'snare' a bloke into proposing.

Having said that, I can see all the mistakes I've made in the past with online dating blush and I've been able to rectify them.

Anyone else tried to do it differently and not felt you've sacrificed your own principles?

Dahlen Thu 22-Aug-13 16:52:59

The Rules make me want to vomit personally, but some of them are based on fairly sound principles, such as not behaving in a needy manner and not being too available because you already have your own, well-established and enjoyable life.

However, I would say that any well-rounded individual with a healthy, functional life doesn't need the rules. They should be able to just act in a way that feels right, trusting their own judgement.

Unfortunately, being a fabulous person doesn't guarantee a successful OD experience. While I know of a few success stories, I know of many more attractive, successful and hugely likeable women (and a few men) who have got nowhere with OD. It seems to be overrun with married men who like to send cock pics and women who are looking for knights in shining armour to rescue them, who dwarf the number of ordinary, sane people on them. IMO, the key to successful OD is not so much following someone else's set of rules it's to be far more selective about the sites you use (paid ones have a far higher success rate because they weed so much more effectively), and to recognise that if you don't find anyone that doesn't mean there is anything wrong with you, it just means that the right person for you isn't single at this current time or he isn't on an OD site.

I don't mean to burst your bubble, but a healthy dose of realism is needed for negotiating OD and IMO The Rules doesn't provide it. Good luck in your search though.

dontcallmehon Thu 22-Aug-13 17:34:56

Me. I do need the rules as I tend to get too clingy and reveal too much early on. Had one OD that started well and now after 3 dates he has disappeared. Think the rules would have worked on him.

kittymchotpress Thu 22-Aug-13 17:48:43

let me know how you get on. I don't really think a certain type of approach will affect (effect?) the outcome...if someone's into you, and you them then it doesn't really matter how either of you handle it...BUT I'm coming round to the idea that being a bit more insouciant might be a good idea...might weed out the half arsed ones quicker. Hard lesson learnt - if they are not in touch its not because they are shy, dropped their phone dpwn the loo, had a terrible texting injury. sigh...

lemonmuffin Thu 22-Aug-13 18:30:14

The Rules are great, every time I've done them in a relationship it's worked brilliantly. You do have to make sure you stick to them though.

BreeWannabe Thu 22-Aug-13 18:32:39

Can I ask what The Rules are please? Can anyone summarise?

60sname Thu 22-Aug-13 18:38:15

I did the Rules 'lite' in the sense of trying not to appear desperate and not spilling my guts early on. But generally I think playing games is a waste of time - for one thing it's impossible to sustain a facade indefinitely.
(I have had just one relationship via OD, but we are marrying in the spring.)

60sname Thu 22-Aug-13 18:42:16

Oops, I forgot the bit you put about not wanting marriage, sorry, ignore me. smile

beaglesaresweet Thu 22-Aug-13 19:01:18

Ime it works on men who have been spoiled by other women, i.e. bog-headed ones who are shocked when someone doesn't chase them. But it's not so great on unconfident guys, at least then the rules-light work when you don't show desperation but do encouragethen a bit by initiating sometimes (not NEVER as the rules state, though they do say in the beginning). Imo the true rules aer just impossible to follow for more than 2-3 dates if you really like someone, you haev to be a tough, tough woman confused!

beaglesaresweet Thu 22-Aug-13 19:01:56

60s, do you mean you shouldn't mention wanting marriage on your OD profile?

beaglesaresweet Thu 22-Aug-13 19:02:33

sorry, big-headed, oops!

beaglesaresweet Thu 22-Aug-13 19:12:03

Dahlen, I always enjoy reading your posts, much wisdom there! But I think this one sounds a bit 'uppity', as the reality is, most single women (I'm not saying married ones are all balanced) often do not have 'healthy, balanced' lives, where everything is perfect - finance, social life, kids, work satisfaction, etc. People are not robots, and most of us are not perfect and not that confident, and we do feel needy at times and notr so balanced. Not all women are that strong emotionally. So don't be so condesceniding about 'damsels in distress' as opposed to the minority of 'normal' women, as they can be genuine, intelligent, nice women, just not some paragons of success in life. In a way they have more chance of finding a partner than women who apperar perfect and strong as men are also imperfect and vulnerable (nice ones), and they would relate to a normal woman (I call THAT normal) rather than someone who has it all - and usually has a long check-list for a future partner.

akaWisey Thu 22-Aug-13 19:19:40

I agree that the rules per se are just too unrealistic and yes, I wouldn't be myself were I to follow them religiously. It's true that generally it's not necessary to follow guidelines if one has a strong sense of who you are and what you want. But I haven't previously, having had a long marriage which ended somewhat disastrously. But now I know what I want.

Thing is, I've had many wasted hours and yes, I also agree the rules are more likely to work on guys who are used to getting it all their own way. These aren't the ones I'd go for, but I can now spot those who I would have wasted time on before. I actually didn't have a clue how to 'behave' in a context which, when I was younger and single, was thought to be only for the sad and lonely. Now I do.

And, having followed the initial few (pre-date zero) rules I've got three guys all asking me for a proper real life date, I haven't been a push-over and all of which I've accepted but not for the next week- because I don't want to be too ready to go out with them. That feels good!

akaWisey Thu 22-Aug-13 19:32:00

No I don't want marriage but I do want a relationship, and I'm pleased for anyone who sees marriage as a future - but I've done that and it doesn't have the same meaning for me any more.

60sname yes, that bit about not spilling too soon - even though these guys seem to want to know everything about you. Done that. Went nowhere on every single occasion. So this time my return messages (at least a day after they message me) are short, friendly and what do you know? They've either disappeared OR, I've been asked on a date.

In my situation I don't have the time or the inclination to join clubs, go to singles events/whatever so OD really is something I can do when I've got some time. I also don't agree that a paid site is more likely to get a better result. There are as many wealthy players and time wasters with cash to spend as there are without IME.

beaglesaresweet Thu 22-Aug-13 19:33:30

akaW, good luck! sounds like you've found your confidence and are holding back which of course does work to start with! But I still think that once you really fancy/like someone, it's very hard to posrpone dates, not to worry if he doesn't contact you for longer than normal, and notto try and get closre and share more. That's where the Rules are tough, as according to them, yo ushouldn't share much of yourself at all until he wants to be exclusive, and not to 'light up' in his presence too mucj, I mean, no one is that self controlled, surely?

But what you are doing is sensible, and I agree that it was a completely different ball-game when young (then I had to learn how to DIScourage them) grin

Moanranger Thu 22-Aug-13 19:35:09

I am a big fan of The Rules, especially in this age of texting, you can start swamping a guy with info without realising it. I think sociobiological lay men like " the hunt" and are not comfortable with being pursued. The Rules is built around that concept. I do think men sometimes need a bit of encouragement, but that is not the same as pursuit. In terms of communication, I think 60:40 works well, meaning he is contacting/ initiating just a bit more than you.

akaWisey Thu 22-Aug-13 19:44:38

Thank you beagles. I know it's hard to hold back when you really like someone - but I think the work I needed to do which the rules seem to have helped with is all the stuff about acknowledging when it's a no-goer and not making excuses, just saying "Wisey, he's just not that into you" and moving on.

Conversely there's a huge potential in OD for the rush to false intimacy (done that too blush) which holding back really helps to avoid.

akaWisey Thu 22-Aug-13 19:48:33

Yes, absolutely Moanranger, there are infinite ways in which we can unintentionally 'give' too much too soon - on both sides.

ladybranston Thu 22-Aug-13 20:07:26

i follow The Rules for all my dating - online, real life etc etc. it has literally changed my life and i cannot sing the book's praises enough. i love taking about it too, so happy to continue talking about it on the thread. you should know that Ellen and Sherrie (authors) have updated editions to use for online dating and texting etc. very very useful.

akaWisey Thu 22-Aug-13 20:34:28

lady yes I bought a kindle the other day and the first books I bought were The Rules and the Online Rules!!

I wish they said something about texting - I guess it's the same as any other message (at least that's how I'm interpreting it) so I've just counted the text exchange I've had with potential date and told him I had to go after 4 messages. It's hard not to get into too much information when being asked questions - I'm used to what Ellen and Sherrie would call 'spilling' <cringes>.

Well any advice you can give would be really helpful lady. smile

beaglesaresweet Thu 22-Aug-13 23:13:28

ah, so there is a new book! is it just online or in the shops (or just an extra chapter in the usual book)?

I'm really baffled by online dating, the usual thing is so much more straight forward! You are pushed into 'interviewing' each other, and if nothing happens fast, they just move on prior to the meeting as they interpret short messages or lack of as lack of interest from you - and they aer npt invested until they meet and REALLY fancy you. There is no usual flirtation and building up anticipation online either. I'm really not a fan.

beaglesaresweet Thu 22-Aug-13 23:15:57

the other thing is - you can't really hold back with info, as OD starts with finding out about each other through messages before deciding to meet - you can't just be evasive to all his questions, but I hate spilling lots of info about myself to strangers. Any advice on that aspect, lady, or OP?

akaWisey Fri 23-Aug-13 07:58:51

beagles there is both the kindle and hard copy of the OD Rules.

Yes the idea of 'interviewing' is an issue that I've been thinking about.

The authors ask you to treat the OD messaging thing the same as you would if you met someone in any other RL context. If it were real life, so they argue, you'd spend about half an hour chatting but NOT giving chapter and verse about how shit your ex was (even if that's true), laying your relationship requirements out on display, telling your life story etc.

If after that half hour is up he hasn't asked for your number or email address (!) you move on. If he has offered you his number (which happens ALOT in OD) you return the offer by giving him yours but DO NOT phone him first no matter how attractive he is. Same applies to online messaging - imagine you that half hour chat and stop after 4 messages (I think that's a bit arbitrary though).

They reckon that those blokes who go for the online interview are merely information collectors who aren't looking to meet anyone but are gathering the sort of knowledge which improves their chances of engaging more women but ONLY ONLINE. That makes sense to me and has been my mistake in the past and further to that they argue that endless exchanges of information online kills the intrigue and it fizzles out. That has been true for me - I've simply run out of steam before now. And, after all, you're talking to a photo - why would you share personal information with someone you've never even met? Guilty Your Honour. Done that too. But not any more grin.

I agree, it IS more difficult for any chemistry to build with OD. I don't think being evasive is what they mean. I think they mean don't give very specific information. For example I was asked the typical question last night - "How are you finding OD, have you had lots of dates?". I answered that I'm new, haven't really formed an opinion yet and OD is just ONE of the things I am doing with my life. He didn't press it, I don't feel I was evasive, I was protecting myself because I don't know this guy from Adam. And this is where the experience from RL dating kicks in - if he's really interested he'll take a risk and ask me out on a proper date. What's the worst that can happen? I'll say no thanks and he'll just move on!

akaWisey Fri 23-Aug-13 08:04:43

Sorry this is epic but I also wanted to add (if you're interested!) that there are people, like me, who really do better in life when there ARE 'rules'/guidelines/structure in any context. Rules (or whatever you like to call it) give a framework for containing anxiety and uncertainty and they help keep one grounded in reality even in the virtual world.

Dahlen Fri 23-Aug-13 11:25:50

beaglesaresweet - thanks for the compliments and the observations. No offence taken and feedback is always appreciated. I didn't intend to come across as condescending. Being far from perfect myself, the last thing I meant to imply was that only perfect well-balanced people should attempt to date. The point I was trying to make (perhaps badly) was that if you are a bit lost or have a slightly messy life for whatever reason, you really are so much more vulnerable to the sorts of predators who prey on women who use OD sites and IMO the rules can actually make you more at risk because of the way it encourages men and women to conform to gender stereotypes.

blueshoes Fri 23-Aug-13 15:00:33

OP, I am nodding along to all your posts! I am not doing OD, but I did the rules in RL many years ago and it weeds out the timewasters.

CuChullain Fri 23-Aug-13 15:21:49

To be honest, if when I was internet dating if I found out that a women was using some book as a template/refernce point as to how she conducts herself while dating I would run a mile.

garlicagain Fri 23-Aug-13 15:22:16

I'll ask you fans my big question about The Rules, then grin

They're only going to work on entitled chaps who treat dating as a kind of game hunt, surely? What if you'd prefer a man who's emotionally honest; wouldn't he be put off by manipulative/withholding tactics?

I understand how 'rules' can provide a useful substitute for boundaries, if yours are messy, but The Rules has always struck me as a good way to perpetuate dysfunctional relationships ...

Have any Rules fans read Women Who Love Too Much? Do you think that rejecting co-dependent behaviours would achieve similar results, more honestly?

blueshoes Fri 23-Aug-13 15:30:34

garlic, the Rules only screens out men who are not that into you or who are only after an easy shag.

It does not screen out players/sociopaths/narcissists, EAs who are after the thrill of the case. In all cases, Rules or no Rules, women still have to keep their red flag indicators on.

Passing the Rules test is only a baseline hurdle and more relevant for the initial stages of dating. Going forward, women still need to continue to due their due diligence.

CuChullain Fri 23-Aug-13 15:39:07

@ garlicagain

"The Rules has always struck me as a good way to perpetuate dysfunctional relationships ... "

My thoughts too.

I met Mrs CuChullain through online dating and I found it refreshing that did not follow some daft 'rule book', she was just her bright sparkly self and her attitude was 'this is me, take it or leave it'. She made the first move sending me an email (something many women seem to think is wrong), I liked her profile and dropper her a line back, over the next few days we swapped a few more emails then got chatting on msn messenger before finally swapping mobile numbers and agreeing a time when I would call, it was all open, honest and most of all fun. When we spoke on the phone we ended up chatting for about two hours, after that I knew that a date with her would not be a disaster. We met for lunch, shared a bottle of wine, had a great time than went her seperate ways, I sent her text saying that I had had lovely time and would like to meet again, she responded 5 mins later telling me the same. No wait three days bullshit, no playing hard to get, no 'he has to earn it' notions of entitlement, just up front communication.

I lost count of the number of times that I went on a dates with other women where I followed up said fun date with a call or a text saying I would like to meet again only to be totally ignored and for me to assume she is not interested. I then get some message a week later asking why I had gone silent, apparently to earn another date I had to put in a bit more effort. I didnt like to be made to jump through hoops in order to tick the box on some daft dating rules template so went on my merry way.

It really does not need to be this complicated.

TrueStory Fri 23-Aug-13 16:08:17

I recommend "Millionaire Matchmaker"! Seriously.

Here are her rules (very easy to follow:

1. 2 drinks maximum on a date (head clear)
2. No sex before monogamy.
3. Its in his kiss (you can tell then if the attraction's real)
4. Let the man organise and decide the first dates!
5. Do not give TMI (too much information) until you know him better.

That's it!

Only the very basics of course, there's lots of other stuff to consider. Just don't make my mistakes 1,2,3, & 4 blush.

I would add - watch out for ATTITUDE TO WOMEN IN GENERAL, ex-relationships, porn, and generally (BIG CLUE!!!).

I never liked the Rules themselves as they were very "dead" in the water somehow. I think you can be a real person, but still have some rules.

p.s. Rules are good because we may have a conscience and love agenda but should not assume everyone else has the same agenda!

TrueStory Fri 23-Aug-13 16:08:48

Millionaire Matchmaker is a TV programme on ITV2.

TrueStory Fri 23-Aug-13 16:09:57

6. I forgot - no sexting until in a monogamous relationship either, otherwise you're just another 'sexy babe' (ew), not a real girlfriend.

garlicagain Fri 23-Aug-13 16:17:16

apparently to earn another date I had to put in a bit more effort

Yes, this! If a woman wants another date, why not say so? confused
Surely the bloke who sees her as "too easy" for being honest, has a pretty crap attitude - an attitude that's reinforced by women who think he must beg earn their company?

The Rules only screens out men who are not that into you or who are only after an easy shag.

I'm inclined to say that, if you regard sex as a reward, you probably are playing a game. So Rules would be appropriate! (Another way to screen out men who are not that into you is to ask for what you want.)

kittymchotpress Fri 23-Aug-13 16:35:33 point still holds then; you liked mrs C and she liked you ergo whatever way you played it things would have worked out, happily for all. holding back a bit for a wee while will allow for the time wasters to dissappear of their own volition...and that can't be a bad thing for people looking for a longer term and equal relationship.

blueshoes Fri 23-Aug-13 16:50:11

Exactly kitty. The Rules would not have screened cuchain out because he made the right moves anyway.

I presume that for OD, unlike RL, someone has to make the first contact. So if it was Mrs C who did it, it is not fatal. But having done that, the Rules still apply going forward. Rules are so baseline I don't see the problem.

mrspaddy Fri 23-Aug-13 17:01:05

I know two people who were single and got married within two years of starting th rules and very happy. I think I couldn't really stick to it all myself so didn't do it but funny a lot of things worked for me that are in the 'rules'.. Like only accepting a date on a sat night. I was funny about that.. Ie if a man asked to consecutive weekday dates I was sceptical. Keeping busy, ending the phone call first. Not telling them too much (well I chat away so this wasn't for me) I think a lot of it is nix old ash ironed advice. Not sleeping together etc. like a lot of thins.. Read, take wat you need and then take ip the rest with a pinch of salt. Enjoyed the book though.

mrspaddy Fri 23-Aug-13 17:02:18

Can't get used to this... Old fashioned

beaglesaresweet Fri 23-Aug-13 23:07:58

OP, answering your post on the first page, yes. I agree about structure that the rules give and they do give you a 'talking to' when you start being anxious, I did try thenm in RL and they do help - not to find the right man so much but at least to weed out the wrong ones, and generally to keep being positive.

But I think it's impossible, at least afa I'm concerned, to do this online. You have to be evasive - what you told him was evasive, fine if he didn't press it woth that, but you can't also brush all the questions they usually bombard you with - and in a way understandably so as the whole thing is based on deciding QUICKLY whether to meet and whether to spend time on anyone. They often ask which area of towmn yo ulive in, where you work roughly, your first name - I'm always paranoid as my name is a bot unusual but equally saying that 'I can't tell you yety' sounds very mistrustful...

The nature of the beast is that there are LOTS of people on site and you can't meet all of those whose photo looks ok andthat's it. I myself end up asking questions as I really don't like blind dates, so try to meet only minimal nummber of men otherwise it gets overwhelming and quite depressing tbh to sit through meeting with people you don't even find slightly attractive.

I mean, if you are genuinely new, it's easy to avoid question about te dates, but what if i'm not so new to it, do I lie that i'm new, or do I just ignore the question, or lie about the number. I don't lie as it's not many but people who've been on lots of dates may feel like keeping quiet. It's a minefield!

Mind you, if you found the right 'flow' and attitude, do update us, it would be bice to learn some more regarding how to do it! When do yo uexpect then to call by the way, after a first date? surely timeframes are much shorter than in rl? Also, what is it about 4 messages - yes, but how long?? I think the OD rules can't possibly be so prescriptive.

Dahlen, ah ok! hmm, not sure whether people with slightly messy lives, or unconfident ones. would do better without the Rules - the rules are sensible and protective, and only people who are very together and know exactly what they want wouldn't need them (lots of self control , unerring judgement), but the rest of us kind of need some boundaries to set and often have no clue or just no discipline - so the rules help. BUT because they made them so strict and extreme, people just give up and then feel blad about being weak, so the rules are hardly some cure-all. Still, on balance I think better the rules, than a completely impulsive behaviour with men from naive/unconfident women, of which there are many, after divorces especially.

beaglesaresweet Fri 23-Aug-13 23:28:00

CuChullain, initiating e-mailing on OD is surely exempt from the 'no-no' behaviour', I'm sure the book doesn't advise not to do it - otherwise the person may never even come across your profile. But after she's done that, all the moves were done by you and she responded - yes, quickly, but she did respond. They do actually advise to be enthusiastic so if your other dates were too aloof and showed displeasure it's not 'the rules' grin. They just don't allow to lead, to start with, until a man is 'in love' <devious, eh? but works on big-headed men>.
Agree that if people are a true good match, they don't have to be that picky about following every rule, time frames etc., and I'm sure if she hasn't responded in 5 min but in a day, you'd not lose interest? or even if she didn't respond at all, surely after getting on like a house on fire you'd at least check whether she's got your message! But if she really took the lead, you might have slowed down a bit with your enthusiasm, that's what they claim, i.e. her keeness and taking the lead could have raised questions whether she's desperate for a partner generally, and so on.

blueshoes Fri 23-Aug-13 23:41:01

The danger with a woman sounding eager and initiating all the moves even though the man is lukewarm and indifferent is he would start to think she was up for it, even though she was just showing sincere enthusiasm.

That is a mismatch in expectations. Under the rules regime, that would not happen. Without the rules, she would just be wasting her time when she could have been seeing others.

akaWisey Sat 24-Aug-13 07:40:50

beagles and blueshoes yes, that's the point of the Rules for me - to help me weed out those who are passing the time/looking for an easy shag/players/those who don't seem to like women very much but enjoy the chase.

WRT to being evasive, of course I've given information, just not stuff which I regard as personal and private i.e. how many dates I've had so far because it's personal and why on earth should that be of interest to a potential date unless they have negative assumptions about women who've had lots of dates? This happened to me actually. Bloke on last date I went on asked me how long I'd been on another site. I told him "on and off" for a while. His immediate judgment? "You must be desperate". Date over.

But to put more context around this issue - The Rules were written in 1995 - times have moved on. The online Rules take this into account but the basic principles are the same, how to catch a bloke and get him to propose, use 'feminine wiles' to drive him crazy with longing etc etc. All very 1950's in my view. That's not why I turned to them. My natural inclination is to be completely upfront and honest but the reality is it just doesn't work to do that in OD where some editing is essential to avoid giving too much too soon, not just to the 'wrong' blokes but to any bloke.

I take those points other posters have made about the genuine ones who might need a bit of encouragement to ask a woman on a date - and therein lies the tension for many women, I think.

akaWisey Sat 24-Aug-13 08:17:24

Another thought about Mr and Mrs C.

It's my view that EVERYONE follows some relationship 'script' or other, mostly non-consciously but it's there nonetheless. Mr and Mrs C may have had similar scripts and bingo! There was a fit.

Personally I needed to change mine because it simply doesn't work in OD. But I needed some guidance and The Rules gave me some insights, and that's it really. These, plus posters here who've added their own thoughts and experiences are very helpful, and thank you. I've had confirmation that The Rules as written by the authors are just too arbitrary, to rigid, highly manipulative and they don't all fit with me. However, I do feel validated in the changes I want to make in my behaviour in OD.

As a footnote - guy who asked me if I wanted to go for coffee and I said yes. Told him I am busy for next few days (true) as is he (I have no idea) . He's been texting me in a chatty way but no more mention of said coffee date. So by Tuesday when we're both 'not as busy' and if no mention is made by him I shall raise it. If he stalls, I shall move on. No more contact and no harm done.

ladybranston Mon 26-Aug-13 16:13:32

<b>Wisey</b> – I just read (and re-read) both the books like they are Talmud, truthfully. Not sure who asked but the Not Your Mother’s Rules (latest one) has a lot of information/guidance on texting, complete with a handy dandy text-back time chart.
<b>Beagles</b> I also am very evasive about what I share online – not my last name and very often not where I live. I date Jewish men only, and even though NYC is full of Jewish people, the community can sometimes feel (and is) very small! I find that being playful is a good response – i.e. someone asks so where do you live? And I say oooh top secret! Or you’ll need higher clearance for that information with a smiley wink. As for “how are you finding OLD?” my stock answer is “so far so good!” and then changing the subject.

CuChullain Tue 27-Aug-13 11:31:59

@ beaglesaresweet

Sorry, have only just read your post!

CuChullain, initiating e-mailing on OD is surely exempt from the 'no-no' behaviour', I'm sure the book doesn't advise not to do it - otherwise the person may never even come across your profile.

I have not read 'the rules', but I have certainly had plenty of discussions with my female friends and office colleagues on the topic of dating etiquette and there seemed to be general acceptance that women don’t make the first move, be it online dating or in RL. To me this was an utterly insane position to take and must surely place huge limits on the chances of you finding a partner. Yes, there are some misogynistic dinosaur blokes out there who think that a women asking a guy out somehow makes her unattractive but most blokes I know would find it a breath of fresh air.

But after she's done that, all the moves were done by you and she responded - yes, quickly, but she did respond. They do actually advise to be enthusiastic so if your other dates were too aloof and showed displeasure it's not 'the rules' . They just don't allow to lead, to start with, until a man is 'in love' <devious, eh? but works on big-headed men>.

I disagree, I dont think anyone took a lead as such, the courtship just flowed, she was the one who initiated contact and suggested chatting on msn and I was the one a week later who suggested chatting on the phone, by that stage we knew we were going to meet for a date and given that we were getting on well a phone call was the next logical step, if I had not suggested it she would of.

With regards to the other women I obviously can’t confirm for certain they were following 'the rules' but my suspicions were that they were certainly following some kind of template that advised them to ‘wait a while’ before responding. Apparently being keen is a bad thing. To me initially, it was just a sign that despite seemingly having a good time during our first date they had gone home to have a think and elected not to take things further. When I received emails in a slightly put out tone several days later expressing disappointment that I had not chased them up beyond my initial second date invite I was left scratching my head thinking ‘why the fuck did you not just get back to me saying yes a second date would be lovely’ instead if fannying around. Personally I can’t stand games, I think they are a bit disrespectful and even patronising and any suspicion on my part that said women were playing them was an instant turn off. Why would you want to make someone beg when there is clearly mutual attraction. Maybe I was cutting off my nose to spite my face but generally I prefer it if women had the confidence to act on their feelings rather endanger the whole process by acting deliberately disinterested because of what some book says or dating advice in a glossy magazine.

Agree that if people are a true good match, they don't have to be that picky about following every rule, time frames etc., and I'm sure if she hasn't responded in 5 min but in a day, you'd not lose interest? or even if she didn't respond at all, surely after getting on like a house on fire you'd at least check whether she's got your message! But if she really took the lead, you might have slowed down a bit with your enthusiasm, that's what they claim, i.e. her keeness and taking the lead could have raised questions whether she's desperate for a partner generally, and so on.

You seem to be over analysing things, I would not have expected a response within 5 mins, but I would think it polite to get back within 24 hours barring some emergency or disaster. Even if she did get back within 5 mins I would not have thought any more of less of her for being keen, I would have been thankful for her clarifying her position rather than leaving me guessing by trying to play it cool or stringing me along. Generally I would follow up a ‘successful’ date with a nice follow up text saying I had a nice time and would like to meet again. If I heard nothing back after a few days I would conclude she was not interested and move on. Additionally, if in the phenomenally unlikely event that she did not receive my text what is stopping her from sending one herself if she was keen to meet up again or do ‘the rules’ prevent her from doing that? I am still of the school of thought that some of 'the rules' add more confusion to proceedings than they solve!

akaWisey Tue 27-Aug-13 13:18:59

Thank you lady I don't know if that's the one I've bought or not, will check my kindle.

blueshoes Tue 27-Aug-13 13:53:01

Wisey, what do the updated Rules say about females initiating contact with males in OD?

CuChullain Tue 27-Aug-13 14:01:21


Go on, be brave, drop the man an email!!!!

blueshoes Tue 27-Aug-13 14:34:21

Cu, I won't be doing that as I am married. I only know the traditional Rules but am interested in how the Rules have been adapted for online dating.

CuChullain Tue 27-Aug-13 16:04:43

@ blueshoes


Personally I think 'The Rules' (tm) for online dating should be:

Oh wow, what an interesting and witty profile, he is pretty cute too and lives in the same part of town as me, I think I shall drop him a line and introduce myself.

akaWisey Sun 01-Sep-13 07:35:15

The Rules say categorically NEVER initiate online contact with men - never, don't even answer their ads, don't send cute 'smiley' messages after the first, second or even third date. Wait 24 hours after they message you before replying and keep it short.

So I've been applying the Rules since my first post. Whatever your opinion of this way of managing dating behaviour tbh I feel totally in control, I'm not anxious and over analysing every message, wondering if someone is going to ask me out or not…….because the Rules address all those frustrating and time wasting activities.

I'm online about 10 minutes to pick up messages and to view profiles of men who've messaged me. That's it. Somehow this change in my OD behaviour seems to be attracting MORE not less attention.

akaWisey Sun 01-Sep-13 07:46:53

Sorry just to clarify - if you view a profile you like the look of he'll see that you have. If he likes the look of you too he'll message you. That way you know there's at least a spark of interest there.

Mr C yes, nothing wrong in commenting on a chap's profile - but experience of OD thus far has been , without exception, that when I've made that first move this has happened:

1. No response
2. A polite thank you but nothing further
3. Blocked!
4. Sexual innuendo/request to go offline
5. Other such disappointing results

So that doesn't work for me. It might work for other women, and great if it does. smile

Writerwannabe83 Sun 01-Sep-13 10:25:14

I met my husband via online dating!

His profile had really made me laugh and after 3 day of messaging each other we decided to meet up for a date. We were living together 4 months after that and then married just over 2 years later. We are now expecting our first baby smile

For what it is worth, I messaged him first!! grin

akaWisey Sun 01-Sep-13 12:42:09

Writer that's great news!!

Having said that I've done the whole marriage and kids thing - I think it makes a difference when, as I mentioned upthread, women like me didn't do OD when we were looking to settle down because it just didn't exist!

So it's about learning a whole new way of meeting people and not being 'available' all the time through social networking sites.

BTW I've another date today - picnic in a lovely park all arranged by chap himself. Did it the rules way and I'm not complaining about the result even if he's not my cup of tea (or vice versa) because I'm not having to do any work at all!!! grin

Writerwannabe83 Sun 01-Sep-13 12:55:42

A picnic in the park eh? Sounds lovely smile

Even when I met my husband via OLD it was still quite taboo, only a handful of people knew that's how I'd met him. That was until my dad announced it to everyone in his speech at the wedding though thanks dad hmm

I think it is a little it more accepted now and apparently 1 out of every 3 couples meet online. I chose to do it because I worked in an all female profession, working rotten shifts and most of my friends were already settled - so it wasn't like I had anyone to go man hunting with on a Friday or Saturday night smile

It works really well, I guess it's just a case of finding the right guy!

I hope you have a lovely time wisey smile

blueshoes Mon 02-Sep-13 09:25:50

wisey, picnic in the park sounds lovely. Has having spent more time with him changed your opinion of him? FWIW if he continues to ask you out Rules-way, I think you should continue to see him and keep an open mind.

In later life, I am pretty jaded and don’t get that flippy stomach feeling at first sight anymore. But that is not to say a bloke cannot grow on you. For some of my later relationships, I ended up with them because they were persistent and I did fall in love subsequently. The good thing about a Rules relationship is you don’t inadvertently end up with a passive man who expects you to make all the moves going forward. At least you know if he is actively pursuing you at the start, that spark of energy is there, even if it fades somewhat later on, lol.

Thanks for explaining about Rules in the OLD era. It is so strict, but it makes sense. So long as you leave a small clue, like the fact you looked at his profile, I guess that should be enough for him to go on if he likes your profile. Agree with the fact that the Rules allow you to continue to lead your life without obsessing about when/where/why men are responding to your messages. It keeps the emotional investment low at the start, which is particularly important for OLD.

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