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so I have finally had enough, please tell me I am not BU

(145 Posts)
clodhopper13 Sun 21-Jul-13 11:05:19

Last night I ended my relationship of almost 3 years. I had had a few glasses of wine, but that did not create the feelings that came bursting out.Those feeling have been there for a long long time

I met my now xp after the breakdown of a horrible marriage. I loved him (still do) like I have never loved anyone and felt so happy.

he moved in with me and my kids about 2 years ago, and I became fully responsible for him financially. He has never paid a penny to me for the house nor bills and as he has no income whatsoever, all personal expenditure has also become my responsibility. I just cant do it any more. I have a very well paid job but am in debt and I cant see this situation ever changing. He does some childcare for me , for 1/2 hour most mornings and a couple of hours 2-3 x a week in the afternoons. We have cleaner.

He is trying/ has tried various schemes to make money which involve plans that never work out. He has done some renovation in the house for me - but this has taken two years and is not finished yet. when it is finished ( unlikely now) it will add £20K to the value of the house.

I basically think he is too comfortable and he has said he does want to earn, but not if it means making himself unhappy. I just see me getting deeper into debt, or denying myself any pleasures to make my salary stretch to two.

I was kind of managing with this but I have realised that it will not change. He has been like this for years and found people to support him. I can see that I will have to work for many years and never be able to retire or work part time; I have built up a pension pot and would like to be able to slow down sometime. I am a lawyer and although I love my job its very stressful and I don't want to (have to) work for ever.

Also, our sex life, which was amazing - joyful and intimate has dwindled over the last year to once a month or less. I cant explain how rejected unhappy and unattractive this makes me feel.

so I lost my temper last night and told him to go. He has gone, although he has nowhere to go and no income. I feel desperately upset and have cried all night. But I just cant see a resolution, and I cannot go on like this.....

have I been unreasonable?

EllaFitzgerald Sun 21-Jul-13 11:11:18

God no! He doesn't want to work doing something that will make him unhappy, but it's ok for you to be stressed, miserable and getting into debt supporting him? He's at home all day doing bugger all and hasn't even finished off the renovations? What's he doing, painting frescos on each ceiling?!

EllaFitzgerald Sun 21-Jul-13 11:14:47

My post sounded very harsh, I'm sorry if it upset you, especially as things only ended last night. My typing fingers went much faster than my brain.

You've definitely done the right thing, for you and the children. If he's serious about the family, he'll realise this and take responsibility for himself.

DonDrapersAltrEgoBigglesDraper Sun 21-Jul-13 11:16:59

He is a complete hypocritical user. You have done the right thing.

Don't look back. flowers

clodhopper13 Sun 21-Jul-13 11:17:04

thank you. Im so miserable and unhappy. I loved him so much and I really felt like he was 'the one' My poor kids who have had their lives turned upside down my my marriage breakdown now have t go through all of this again. I just feel like I cant tell him how I feel because he gets so cross but I cant bottle it up either. Its making me angry, I'm such an idiot. I thought I was giving him a hand to get started again. But his 'work rate' is so slow and he never gets aound to most of the things he says he is going to do :-(

feel sick, ill and helpless today

CogitoErgoSometimes Sun 21-Jul-13 11:19:20

YANBU. Sounded like a very one-way arrangement and the words 'cock' and 'lodger' are definitely in the wind. What's the point of having a 'kept man' if he's not even making you happy? Sorry you feel so upset but get your friends around you, have a few wine or brew and I'm sure the weight will lift soon and the sun will come out... Good luck

ratbagcatbag Sun 21-Jul-13 11:20:14

Big hugs clod,but it really sounds for your own sanity you needed to do this. Why should you work yourself daft for him to sit at home all day, the house should be clean, renovations progressing and him at least bringing on something part time.

kalidanger Sun 21-Jul-13 11:21:03

There are many shades of shit relationship but living with a cocklodger is, ime, a very special kind if shit relationship.

WELL DONE YOU thanks Be miserable for a bit if you need to but, also ime, you'll feel free, in control and wealthy in no time at all wine

EllaFitzgerald Sun 21-Jul-13 11:22:34

'The One' wouldn't expect you to finance his day dreams while he made no contribution to the home at all. If he ran the home while you worked, and you were happy with that, then fair enough, that's a job in itself, but can you imagine getting to retirement age and having to keep working to maintain his lifestyle?

What does he get cross about?

clodhopper13 Sun 21-Jul-13 11:39:17

he gets cross because I don't 'get him'. He wants to be self employed and creative - which he is, but doesn't have the commitment to see things through, or if I'm honest, to work really hard in a sustained and focussed way.

He will not consider paid employment. He thinks the child care pays his way

God i feel awful.

kalidanger Sun 21-Jul-13 12:07:05

What sort of adult won't 'consider' paid employment?? He's not right in the noggin and you're well rid angry

My cocklodging ex was very different - worked very hard and what was his was his ans what was mine was ours hmm Honestly, it's a relief when they go.

Hope you feel better soon thanks

FairyThunderthighs Sun 21-Jul-13 12:15:33

He thinks the childcare pays his way? No. He is to all intents and purposes the children's father figure, when he moved in with you and them he took on responsibility for them. I would never dream of paying my partner to look after my child, he does it because he loves him and he loves me.

It must hurt, but you really are doing the right thing. It's no way to live. And no, he's not THE ONE. THE ONE is allowed to have some small faults, like a bit of an untidiness habit, or terrible taste in music (my DP!) But so ething as huge as that is a major incompatibility.

Take care flowers

Don't waver

You are not a means for him to bankroll his affectation of beiing creatively self employed

It will sting, and you will grieve the sorry end of a relationship that wasn't what you thought it would be

Regroup, return all his stuff to him, change locks.

orangeandemons Sun 21-Jul-13 12:21:40

I want to be self employed and creative, have a creative degree.

But that don't butter no parsnips, so I have to work very hard in a job I don't even like. What makes him so special?

CogitoErgoSometimes Sun 21-Jul-13 12:27:45

"He will not consider paid employment."

So he's a work-shy gobshite .... hmm A tenner says he's one of those spoilt brats who grew up with indulgent parents saying 'he's not lazy and obnoxious, he's just so terribly bright & creative and needs more stimulation'. Do you feel awful for dumping him or do you feel awful that you let this Up His Own Artist into your life in the first place?

clodhopper13 Sun 21-Jul-13 12:37:38

I feel awful because I love(d) him. He saved me from the mess I was after my marriage broke down, I was so so happy. Maybe delusional. I thought he loved me (hollow laugh) maybe he does, ... but i'm so unhappy as well. I keep hoping that this is all a bad dream.

RandomMess Sun 21-Jul-13 12:43:10

You may still love him but you deserve better <<hugs>>

Twinklestein Sun 21-Jul-13 12:44:03

He may love you but he's such a tit that it's irrelevant.

You saved yourself from your previous marriage with the added burden of another mouth to feed. That's your achievement.

All he's done is a bit of sex, bit of babysitting & some diy.

EllaFitzgerald Sun 21-Jul-13 12:46:03

Is he cross because you don't 'get him' or is he cross because you're challenging his attempts to suck the life out of you and bleed your bank account dry?

I can't imagine that there are many self employed creative people who are able to make a living without working extremely hard. Even if you agreed to support his creative career, he's too lazy to even do this. As Orange asks, what makes him so special?

I know you're hurting now, but make a list of what he's contributing to your relationship, and ask yourself what exactly you'll be missing out on without him.

ArgyMargy Sun 21-Jul-13 12:46:45

I'm sure he does love you - unfortunately he seems to love himself a whole lot more. Unlikely to change so you are well rid if him, but of course knowing that doesn't help. hmmhmm

puds11isNAUGHTYnotNAICE Sun 21-Jul-13 12:54:47

If he loved you he wouldn't let you work yourself to the bone whilst he did fuck all. That is not love. Sorry.

clodhopper13 Sun 21-Jul-13 12:54:53

does anyone have a partner who has no income ?

I guess I could have coped batter if he was 'house husband' and did the cleaning, washing, gardening childcare... and better if we had ever really discussed it. I did say at the beginning that I was willing to support him for a year - but that was 2 1/2 years ago.

I cant stop crying, but I don't really know why I am crying, empty and sad I guess. I feel that I will never ever get over him

Plomino Sun 21-Jul-13 12:59:45

If he was 'the one' , you wouldn't have been feeling resentful . If he was 'the one' , he wouldn't be considering such an unequal partnership to be ok .

It's all very well wanting to be a 'creative ' which sounds easy , but I can tell you right now it's anything but . My brother is a cartoon illustrator . It took him ten years of going virtually door to door to every major animations company with his portfolio , doing unpaid internships , work experience , anything he could do , to get a foot in the door . It's finally paid off , but he'll still be going a long way before he's anything like well paid .

WHy should you have to work yourself into the ground to support someone who plainly does not support you ? Fuck that .

Twinklestein Sun 21-Jul-13 13:02:15

Might you be crying about the demise of your previous marriage for which he has been a temporary sticking plaster? Did you give yourself time to grieve before you moved onto him? Maybe you just need a period to grieve for everything.

You absolutely will get over him.

Sit down & figure out how much he has cost you over the time you've been together.

You're a lawyer, you can do so much better than this!

clodhopper13 Sun 21-Jul-13 13:08:03

we had so many plans. A holiday booked - the first time we would have had any time without the kids..

thing is he simply doesn't prioritise making money. Its just not that important to him. I do realise how ridiculous that sounds and I know as I write it that it only works if someone (me, his mum) enables him to do that.

he has become grumpy and distant as well - although he says that is me being ridiculous. I just felt hideously insecure ( as though he were only with me for the money) and festeringly angry so much of the time. I can't do that, and do my job and run the home. But under all that I just adored him. really really adored him. I don't know how to get past that. Im ok today but I know one day soon I'll fall over and just be desperate to see him/talk to him/ have him back. And so the merry-go-round will continue (if I do)

puds11isNAUGHTYnotNAICE Sun 21-Jul-13 13:11:34

Money is not important to me. I don't really care if I have it or if I don't. However I do not live off someone else.

He was your knight in shining armour but unfortunately you are now seeing what he truly is. I am not altogether surprised you met when you were low and vulnerable; he saw all that and took full advantage.
Am sure also he was delighted as well when you decided to make yourself fully financially responsible for him. Hindsight is indeed a wonderful thing but why on earth did you do that for him?.

I'd stay mad at both him - and myself for being taken in by such a person. You need to get to the bottom of why you really adored and adore him; there are reasons why you think and thought as you do.

The word codependent re your good self sprung to mind. I would suggest you read Codependent no More written by Melodie Beattie and Women who love too much by Robin Norwood.

You seem nice clodhopper, truly you deserve better than to be treated as a non person as you were by this lazy man. He is the true definition of the word cocklodger. Better to be apart and happier than to be together and miserable as you were. This relationship was all in his favour.

This cocklodger also managed to run your low sense of self worth and esteem even further into the ground. Do not take him back, it has to be no contact with him as of now.

CogitoErgoSometimes Sun 21-Jul-13 13:21:22

"does anyone have a partner who has no income ? "

It's not income that's the issue here, it's attitude and contribution. There are plenty of families set up so that one earns the money whilst the other contributes in other ways. It's a difficult balance to get right as you can see from the number of 'does my DH do enough around the house' threads that festoon these boards. I'm a sole parent but, even in my house, DS (13yo) is expected to do his fair share. Only the fabulously wealthy can afford to be creative with no income... everyone else has to grow up and get real

If he's contributing nothing, expecting to be carried and... worst of all in my opinion... getting nasty if you even try to discuss it, then he has no respect for you. Only contempt.

To prevent yourself from being desperate to have him back, maybe print out this thread, keep it somewhere you can refer to it regularly, remind yourself why it had to end, and then put all your energies into being with people and doing things that actually make you feel better... not worse

orangeandemons Sun 21-Jul-13 13:22:34

Well how does he intend to live if he doesn't prioritise money? There's a difference between wanting a lot and needing to pay the bills. It sounds like he doesn't prioritise it, because he hasn't had to. How did he live before he met you? How old is he?

clodhopper13 Sun 21-Jul-13 13:22:53

I AM nice. Im really fucking nice and really stupid. And really upset and feel like a fool and an emotional mess. Ive neglected my friends, my job, my life, my family - because I love him and I believed it would work.

the books look good - at least its something to do. other than crying.

EllaFitzgerald Sun 21-Jul-13 13:23:45

I have had a partner with no income three times. The first time, I ended up in so much debt, it took me years to pay it all off, simply because he felt he was too good to be doing something that was "beneath" him. The second time, I fell for a hard luck story about how nobody would give him a chance (absolute bollocks, as it turned out - he just wanted to wait until Metallica begged him to join them)

The last time was with my DH when he moved from his area to mine. He did everything in the house while I was at work, meals were cooked and he applied for anything and everything until he got work. It's not what he dreamt of doing when he was a kid, but he works hard and whatever he earns is family money. He hated the fact that he wasn't contributing financially.

Giving someone a chance is one thing. Paying for someone to sit on his arse is something else entirely.

Twinklestein Sun 21-Jul-13 13:26:10

I think he does prioritise money, enough to get into a relationship in order to get it... he just doesn't fancy making it himself.

kalidanger Sun 21-Jul-13 13:27:15

Clod It's been, what, 12 hours? Of course you're upset. Be upset! Wail if you need to.

But you'll be relieved soon. I promise thanks

MissMarplesBloomers Sun 21-Jul-13 13:27:21

It's not the fact that he doesn't work at paid income,

IF he pulled his finger out/worked on the DIY a fair chunk of the day (thereby increasing the house value & saving you paying a builder)

IF he at least did some household chores, laundry etc to save you doing it in your spare time

IF he did load with the kids so you saved childcare fees

IF he was also wonderful in bed & made you feel loved and cherished out of bed

then it might be acceptable- it really doesn't matter who stays at home but a house husband does need to pull his weight. You even have a cleaner FFS what does he do all day?!!

I can get that you are devestated but really you deserve better and if you start believeing that of yourslef it WILL happen!

clodhopper13 Sun 21-Jul-13 13:27:58

he's 55; im 50. before me he lived with his mum; in a friends flat (rent free while she sold it) in another friends house. with another girlfriend. Its been several years since he earned anything and longer since he maintained his own establishment

he gave me his keys back yesterday but the house is FULL of his stuff and he has nowhere to put it....

Dry your tears, he is really now not worth crying over.

You are nice indeed, you deserve a nice man to be with rather than a user cocklodger. But you need to work on your own self esteem first and rebuild that too together with reconnecting with the neglected other aspects of your life.

You loved him far more than he has ever loved you. He saw you as someone to be used and taken for granted, I doubt he knows the meaning of the word love.

Do read the publications suggested.

MadameBlavatsky Sun 21-Jul-13 13:30:07

Be glad that you are realising this now, not 10 years down the line.

It's ok to be a nice person and still have boundaries. He may have been Mr Right Then, but he's not Mr Right Now. Grieve and cry, it's ok to be upset, but don't doubt yourself, you KNOW that he's not the one now.

You and your kids deserve much better than this. My ex was similar, creative etc, but was bone lazy. He could have been a success if he had put his mind to it but couldn't be bothered. HIS problem, nobody else's.

Now focus on you and your kids. You WILL get over him, I promise. Probably sooner than you think.

CogitoErgoSometimes Sun 21-Jul-13 13:32:37

"the house is FULL of his stuff "

Give him a deadline for removing it and, if he misses that, you dump it. Of course he has somewhere to put it. A man like that will have other people nicely lined up to mop his fevered brow....

This man has always sponged off his mother (who enabled him) and his ex girlfriends who all did the same. Such men do not change, I am not at all surprised that he is in his mid 50s. (My BIL is very similar and also enabled and excused by his mother).

What sort of items are we talking about her?. Clothes, cds etc?.
Set a very short time limit for him to collect his stuff i.e 5 days or inform him it will all be going to the charity shop.

EllaFitzgerald Sun 21-Jul-13 13:35:29

Well I'd start by putting his stuff on the front lawn and telling him it's ready to be collected. Where he puts it is not your problem and the longer you're surrounded by it, the harder it will be to start getting over him.

He's gone through life taking from people and giving nothing in return. He's not giving you what you need emotionally or physically, the diy has stopped and the child care is minimal. I know he was probably the distraction that helped you cope with your marriage break up, but he's not so much a knight in shining armour, as a cock lodger in tinfoil. It's like having a teenage boy for a houseguest.

kalidanger Sun 21-Jul-13 13:36:25

A man like that will have other people nicely lined up to mop his fevered brow....

I almost wish I could get away with this sort of crap. How do these people manage it? hmm I'm just not charming enough biscuit

nenevomito Sun 21-Jul-13 13:37:37

This must be so hard for you, but you're really making the right decision. He's behaving like a child who will never leave home.

He doesn't prioritise his own money, but he's quite happy to live off someone else. He's never going to get a job and contribute financially while he has you to live off. It almost feels like you're buying a relationship with this man as you love him.

You deserve better than this. Be strong.

NettleTea Sun 21-Jul-13 13:38:51

"people are in your life for a reason, but that reason is seldom permanent" is what a wise friend told me. He said alot of hurt and unhappiness stems from people trying to keep hold of something which has run its course. Looks like thats whats happened here. He is not doing what was agreed. He helped you through a rough time, but that does not give him the right to live off that good deed for the rest of his life.

KatyTheCleaningLady Sun 21-Jul-13 13:43:06

If you are feeling bad, perhaps it would help to remember that you are not really being kind to him if you continue to enable him.

clodhopper13 Sun 21-Jul-13 13:43:45

deep down inside I kind of know its right that its over. I am not impulsive and I do believe in trying at relationships. but it hurts so much and I have no idea how I will manage at home on my own.

the stuff is a lot. one whole room full plus the usual paraphernalia.

i have no faith in myself as being able to stick to this, although right now he has defriended and blocked me on FB and is clearly very very angry, so i might not have a choice....

EllaFitzgerald Sun 21-Jul-13 13:48:44

Of course he's angry, you've removed his financial support. It speaks volumes that he's not on bended knees promising you he'll apply for work and start contributing. This just reinforces that you've made the right decision.

orangeandemons Sun 21-Jul-13 13:51:19

Despite having no money of his own he is still able to access fb?

I understand you were at a low point when you met him, but didn't any of this ring any bells for you? A 50 odd year old man with no job who lives with his mum? hmm

kalidanger Sun 21-Jul-13 13:52:47

the stuff is a lot. one whole room full plus the usual paraphernalia.

He can take it to his mum's. This is all her fault, probably hmm

Ella is bang on. He's angry, not sorry. HE'S NOT SORRY.,

clodhopper13 Sun 21-Jul-13 13:56:44

yes it did ring bells. but I didn't care, That's hard to write and hard to realise but its the truth. there are many more bells I've been hearing and ignoring over the last 2 1/2 years. Its hard to explain how much he saved me - my ExH was a drug addict and alcoholic who verbally & emotionally abused me and physically abused our children. I still found it almost unbearably hard to leave although I was desperately unhappy. seeing any resemblance ? My Partner gave me self esteem and courage.

and he was gorgeous. And fun and interesting. And of course he still is...

clodhopper13 Sun 21-Jul-13 13:58:49

He's angry, not sorry.

that's a bloody good point. But I am finding it hard to emotionally accept that him being angry is not entirely my fault. That he has a right to be angry with me

MariaLuna Sun 21-Jul-13 14:01:21

Well, that certainly shows his level of maturity, immediately blocking and defriending you on FB! hmm

Throwing his toys out of the pram, eh?!

Let that be the strength you need to know that you are doing the right thing.
Be thankful you have woken up to it now and not another 10 years of wasted time and money down the line.

Twinklestein Sun 21-Jul-13 14:54:59

My Partner gave me self esteem and courage

I disagree, I think you found that in yourself. At the most you can say he inspired you to find this. In fact, he gave you nothing and took everything. It was a con trick.

And to be blunt (I'm trying to puncture your romantic picture) I don't think any man of 55, who is unemployed & living with his mum is 'fun and interesting' he's just plain weird and inadequate.

HansieMom Sun 21-Jul-13 15:06:26

You could have his stuff hauled off to storage which you pay for a month.

You don't sound resolute yet.

clodhopper13 Sun 21-Jul-13 15:16:54

I don't feel resolute HansieMom I feel scared, alone and inadequate. I keep thinking about the things he did do for me; and the things I cannot do alone - eg finishing the work he started.

I think about the good times we had and the good times we had planned and I feel deeply sad. I watched my kids faces this morning when they had to know that another man has left. And I felt utterly rubbish about myself

But, I think I just have to try and take one small step at a time....
Will storage companies do removals ?

antimatter Sun 21-Jul-13 15:27:58

yes, some do storage and removals

would you have to pay for it?

I would in all honest just pay for someone to remove it and nt really bother about where it goes.
Does he care?

akaWisey Sun 21-Jul-13 15:38:30

clod I've had one of those recently - 53, in mahoosive debt but sat on his arse for a good part of the day every day because he was "worth more than some pissy delivery job".

He went back to mummy too. Very, very angry with me indeed.

He didn't love me, and I'm afraid your's doesn't love you either - he loved the life he had with you because he could fester sit on his arse for the last two years.

Without him draining your resources and weighing you down you can most certainly get by, hell you'll do better that because your life will be yours again.

Charming, attractive men who don't have anything else to bring to the table RELY on their ability to spot and reel in women who work hard, do the right thing, don't like conflict blah blah.

So you're not that woman any more and you will pretty soon reclaim your life. In the meantime as other's have said it's fine, in fact I think its essential that you let your feelings run their course. Including anger, which must be in there somewhere. flowers

EllaFitzgerald Sun 21-Jul-13 15:43:11

But Clod, he wouldn't have finished the DIY he started either! Exactly what was he doing that you couldn't do for yourself? Even if you have to get someone in to finish it, you won't be financing him anymore.

You've said he makes you feel rejected, unhappy and unattractive. He's costing you a fortune and getting you into debt. You've got a cleaner because he won't pull his weight in the house, he's as good as told you that he's too good to work at a job he doesn't want to do, but you can work all the hours God sends. I'm really struggling to see how you're the inadequate one, you already cope with everything alone anyway.

I know it's hard, I really do, but you have to take those rose tinted glasses off.

Twinklestein Sun 21-Jul-13 15:56:41

I think you need to try to have faith OP, that once he's gone you will actually feel better not worse.

Because, actually, it will be a huge weight off your mind.

There are plenty of builders around looking for work in a recession, I have no doubt you can find a good one to finish off the work.

Whatever you fear you children may think, you are sending them an important message that it's not ok to lig or to fund a ligger.

clodhopper13 Sun 21-Jul-13 16:12:46

Wisey i'm sorry that you have been through the same thing. Can I ask how long you supported him for before you had enough?

I seem to find it very hard to trust my own judgement and feelings in relationships. I find it hard to believe that I have a point of view that is valid and important to me, and as important as someone else's point of view. I am not like this at work at all, there I am decisive, a leader.

he dislikes my children too, intermittently. Finds them hard work. They are quite hard work I suppose, but I don't like feeling that I have to choose between my kids and my partner

I will need to contact him at some point to tell him to remove his stuff. There is such a lot I cant face packing it up myself and I don't want him here doing it either... If I rent a storage unit for say, a month, what happens if he doesn't remove his stuff after one month? do I keep getting charged for it?

CogitoErgoSometimes Sun 21-Jul-13 16:21:42

For the stuff... short e-mail or text saying that he can turn up on a day of your choosing and collect it or you'll dispose of it. Have a friend be there with you when he turns up so that a) you don't get drawn into conversation and b) he doesn't take stuff that's not his. If he doesn't turn up, you chuck it. Certainly don't pay to put it in storage.

I would like to know what you actually got out of this relationship in the first place till it ended. Your emotional needs were not met at all and in the end you were carrying him and carrying on where all the other mugs (that's how he really sees you) he had managed to con had left off. Such types hate women actually.

Longer term as well you need to totally reassess your whole approach to relationships. Your inherent low self esteem and worth from the end of your first marriage made you infact easy pickings for such a cocklodger like this man who has now thankfully gone.

He's getting access to a computer from somewhere; blocking you on FB indeed. He is 55 going on 14.

I agree with all of Twinklestein's comment earlier particularly this part:-
"And to be blunt (I'm trying to puncture your romantic picture) I don't think any man of 55, who is unemployed & living with his mum is 'fun and interesting' he's just plain weird and inadequate".

My BIL is in his mid 50s, unemployed and still at home with mum and dad and he is certainly weird and inadequate.

You need to start loving your own self for a change, not acting as either a rescuer or saviour in a relationship. As you have clearly seen neither approach works out.

Find a builder, dump his stuff pronto and rebuild your life. Show your children some positive lessons on relationships, they probably only liked him as well because they did not want to upset you.

Re any storage unit he pays for it. That is not down to you. Stop enabling him!. Enabling only gives you a false sense of control anyway.

As the others have suggested have someone there with you when he collects his stuff. A short time limit to collect his items will suffice, give him due notice that if his stuff is not collected then on xyz it will be taken to the tip or charity shop.

balia Sun 21-Jul-13 16:29:37

Put his stuff on the fucking lawn. I'm sure he'll find something 'creative' to do with it - perhaps he can call a removal company and explain he doesn't care about money, I'm sure they'll 'get' him and do it for free.

Look, in many ways you are doing him a favour. Maybe, finally, he will be able to take responsibility for himself.

CogitoErgoSometimes Sun 21-Jul-13 16:36:28

"I am not like this at work at all, there I am decisive, a leader."

You're not applying the same decisive, leadership qualities to your personal relationship because you fear loneliness. This means all the power lies with the person who's continued presence you crave and, if you're unlucky (as you have been), that person will exploit the imbalance.

You shouldn't have to buy a boyfriend...

TerribleTantrums Sun 21-Jul-13 16:38:52

You know when you said he was angry because you don't 'get him', he is actually angry because at long last you do absolutely 'get him' and he found the previous, delusional, you much easier to manipulate.

With the money that you are no longer throwing away on him get a removal company with a packing service. They can box everything up and deliver the boxes to his Mum's house. Let him and her know about a week before the day so that she can clear out space in her garage. Tell them that if the movers can't bring the boxes inside they will stack them in her front garden, no matter what the weather is like.

Trifle Sun 21-Jul-13 16:42:30

Yes, you have been unreasonable. You've willingly allowed him to deny your own children of your hard earned money by frittering it away on him. You've foistered on your children a man who neither likes nor cares for them. you have shown them that in life you don't need to work, you can just find some rich mug willing to support them for free.

Of course he's angry with you, you've pulled the rug out under him and called him out on His freeloading. I expect he's bloody fuming that you've got the audacity to end funding his comfortable free lifestyle.

As for paying for storage for all his belongings, for gods sake grow the backbone you should have developed 3 years ago.

clodhopper13 Sun 21-Jul-13 16:46:42

* Tantrums* that is a GOOD idea. I am sure this will only work if I go no contact. If he comes here - and it will take a day to pack the stuff and move it, I will not be able to cope.

I think I do fear loneliness; and I fear being unlovable. I do know I am/have been a rescuer. I dont know why

At the beginning I thought he had such high self esteem I felt lucky that he chose to be with me. I felt lucky that he wanted ME. And I felt safe and looked after when I was afraid, vulnerable and unsure.

Thank you all so much for talking to me today. I have truly felt that I was being unreasonable not to want to carry on supporting him. Unkind that I was frustrated with his lack of achievement each day. I am so scared that I wont be able to stand the hurt and that I will be either sucked back n or grieve endlessly, romanticizing the relationship. I really need your clear eyed support and advice

bestsonever Sun 21-Jul-13 16:50:55

He got you at your most vulnerable, so forgive yourself for ignoring the signs, perhaps even be glad of the initial hurdle in life he has helped you get through. Don't feel too indebted to him for the emotional support he has been though, as he most likely saw an opportunity in you to support him too and that is what you have done.
This was a relationship of its time, but now it is time to assess yourself and develop your own inner strength - something you cannot do with someone else on the scene easily. Take some time out of relationships, rebuild those neglected friendships and family ties -they really should always feature in your life regardless of there being a man around. I wish you luck, this could be the start of a better future :-)

Was going to ask you what you learnt about relationships when you were growing up. That often gives clues. It is in childhood that you learnt damaging lessons on relationships which you have now to date carried through to your own adulthood.

You need to seriously reign in your tendency to want to rescue "wounded birds" because they are really not. They just want some sap (this is such a type sees women apart from actively hating them as well) to look after them and mother them again.

clodhopper13 Sun 21-Jul-13 17:11:18

You've foistered on your children a man who neither likes nor cares for them

that's true. and very very painful. I thought he would be better at bringing them up than I am. I thought his discipline was necessary. I think really it was verging on the bullying.

I am so weak. I hate myself. I have good instincts but don't listen to them. I have made SO many mistakes

BloomingRose Sun 21-Jul-13 17:14:47

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

BloomingRose Sun 21-Jul-13 17:15:51

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

dunfightin Sun 21-Jul-13 17:49:10

Dear OP, this sounds like me a couple of years ago ... it's a hard thing to process but users are very good at using. He will have played up to your vulnerabilities in the initial stages, worked out what got him accepted, what made your otherwise rational self overlook the red flags. When you became a little on edge, he probably was extra good and helpful. Then he reverted to type ... the type being a little boy who he is still sucking on his mother's tit and thinks other women in his life should love him unconditionally and uncritically.
It sucks, honestly it does. And it will suck when you find he has picked up with the next woman who believes his hard luck story - sadly there are plenty around. You've probably guessed that this too is bitter experience.
Can you get some counselling re the aftermath of your marriage and the nasty dent this cocklodger has left in your self-esteem.
There are some wonderful women on here who will get you through akaWisey and Cogito among others.
Please look after yourself, lean on RL friends and slowly, slowly you will recover.

clodhopper13 Sun 21-Jul-13 18:08:21

You are all so kind. dunfightin and bloominrose thank you for sharing your experiences. Im glad you have both got out /are leaving and are ok. I'm finding it hard to think of him as so calculating. He can be such great company and so loving and caring. Unfortunately, despite my desperately trying to, I have not been able to suppress my growing resentment about the financial stuff.

and I cant talk to him about it/when I have tried to I realise nothing changes/will change

I'm calmer this afternoon, feels like the calm before the (next) storm. I have made a list of the stuff have bought just for him ie not food/bills etc and it comes out to £15K. I know there is more. I am writing down all the things that will be easier if he is not here / all the things I don't like about his behaviour.

you are right that when he moves on it will hurt like hell. I'm wondering what to tell people when they ask why we have split

BloomingRose Sun 21-Jul-13 18:20:09

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

clodhopper13 Sun 21-Jul-13 18:37:59

he believes he costs 'nothing'. to be fair he doesn't go out and buy expensive stuff but he smokes at least 10/day and of course the car needs petrol, tax, insurance etc. I think he just doesn't realise that all this stuff costs. and I didn't mind providing the 'home' and bills for free as the mortgage is the same whoever lives here but I think he should be responsible for his own expenditure. And there in lies the problem

getting tense again worrying about how to deal with the stuff - practically as much as anything. And its behind a locked door for which I don't have a key

Twinklestein Sun 21-Jul-13 18:44:38

His food can't be less than £40 a week so that's over 4 grand on his food alone in the past 2 years... And over 2 grand on fags...

BloomingRose Sun 21-Jul-13 18:46:09

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

akaWisey Sun 21-Jul-13 19:20:20

I only lasted a few months because I could see where it was going clod. Actually what bothered me the most was how utterly BORING he was - he literally had nothing interesting to say because he had nothing going on.

But stop making excuses for him, he's a grown man and grown men DO realise what it costs to keep a home going and a relationship healthy. But some of them, and by now you know you're not the exception to the rule with yours, simply don't want to expend the energy.

I'd text him and tell him he's got X days to come get his stuff or it's going in the bin. Then I'd go absolutely no contact since there's really nothing left to say. He's off your sofa and you must try and get him out of your head.

clodhopper13 Sun 21-Jul-13 19:40:03

This has been one of my issues BloomingRose - that when I asked him how he would manage if I was not there he would say 'I suppose I would have to get a job" but he wouldn't do it whilst with me to make stuff easier for me...

He is angry because I challenged him. Because I don't get him, because I don't understand 'how much he does' - with my feisty hat on I think I understand EXACTLY how much he does not do.

still scared of the future though

clodhopper13 Sun 21-Jul-13 19:46:26

I really can't put the stuff in the bin, its valuable. and important to him. And I really cant face him coming here and packing it all up.
So I think the idea of packing it and having it delivered to him is the best. For me to pack it will take some time- given that I have DC and a FT job. He has not contacted me, and nor do I expect him to, so I have some time to plan.
I need to be no contact.

Bedtime1 Sun 21-Jul-13 19:48:36

You are a lawyer you have achieved a lot in life. Your husband before abused you and the children so this could be where all this insecurity , low self worth etc comes from but before your first husband what was your life like too. Was you quite confident and happy before the first husband? Did you have a good childhood etc.

I think you might benefit from counselling. You need to rebuild you.

Twinklestein Sun 21-Jul-13 19:49:02

Altho' I don't think you should spend another dime on him, I do think a removal firm is the least stressful option. It means you don't have to engage with him or his stuff.

I think you will be surprised how much easier life is without him leaning on you.

Think of all the money you'll save! You could spend that on pampering, therapy, holidays, outings with your kids... towards your pension...

BloomingRose Sun 21-Jul-13 19:53:36

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Alwayscheerful Sun 21-Jul-13 19:59:14

The best idea is a removal company to pack and deliver to his Mum's house, if its a Yale lock on the door it can be drilled out with an ordinary drill and the barel replaced a locksmith would probably charge you £60 ish a new barrel will cost you less than £10 a locksmith will just need your ID, say you have lost the key. I would do it myself. It will be much easier on ou this way, avoid seeing him whilst you feel sad, in fact avoid seeing him at all, focus on our lovely children for now.

Alwayscheerful Sun 21-Jul-13 19:59:29

Your lovely children!

clodhopper13 Sun 21-Jul-13 22:41:59

remind me, when I waver that he resets the childcare part and called me only on Friday to say he had not left the house at 9 am as arranged to go and do something so he could be home for DC1 (1/2 day friday) He had left at 10.45 and would not be back; so DC 1 could wait on the doorstep....

stupid fuck. starting to get very angry

BloomingRose Sun 21-Jul-13 22:48:04

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Viviennemary Sun 21-Jul-13 22:57:29

Both people in a relationship must work together and pull their weight even if they have different roles. It doesn't sound as if your partner is doing this and everything is falling to you. YANBU to be totally fed up with this one sided partnership with you being responsible for almost everything on your own. I agree that it's time to split up. He isn't the one. If he was then you wouldn't be so unhappy with the situation. Hope you work things out and start to enjoy life more. You deserve to.

Graceparkhill Sun 21-Jul-13 22:58:39

You were asking how to explain to people...
In my opinion you don't owe anyone an explanation. You could just say"it wasn't working out " and leave it at that, unless you feel you might get some support from friends by going into more detail.
What you say to your children depends,in part on how old they are.

BeQuicksieorBeDead Sun 21-Jul-13 23:12:06

I wouldn't worry too much about your kids missing this guy...sounds like my step dad. I was so relieved when my mum booted him out....pretended not to be, as she was upset, but kids dont miss much and they will know he is bad news unless they are very young.

There is a whole room in your house full of his stuff? I think you need to start planning what to do with your newly liberated room. What do you like? Sewing room? Library? Playroom for the dc?

There is a school of thought that people like this are actually psychopaths. No, not axe-wielding maniacs, but seriously abnormal: they have no empathy and no conscience and do not believe that other people matter in the least. This man doesn't want to work because he believes that he is so incredibly special that other people should consider it a privilege to feed and house and generally indulge him. You have absolutely done the right thing in throwing him out and your DC will be delighted that he has gone.

whitesugar Mon 22-Jul-13 02:23:54

I second the psychopaths link. My EXH was totally same as yours Clod. I am 14 years away from him, he still doesn't work, doesn't provide for his kids, thinks he is the reincarnation of Jimi Hendrix. I am in massive debt rearing his children. It is not attractive and with the perspective of 14 years can give you a cast iron assurance that it doesn't get any better, the children get more expensive, it just gets harder.

I left that tool 14 years ago and no joke would not even attend his funeral, actually I would have to for the DCs sake, both teenagers. I regret setting eyes on him, he doesn't pay a penny towards them, has reported me to social services, all in all made my life hell. Please listen to me and walk away.

clodhopper13 Mon 22-Jul-13 05:04:12

insomnia strikes....

he really doesn't get it from my point of view AT ALL. I had previously thought that may be he really DID get it , but just didn't want to admit it; on reflection I think he really doesn't. The whole getting up in the morning, having deadlines, having to work even if you don't want to, being judged on what you achieve in a day, having responsibility for bills etc - he just doesn't do it. And I have raised this before - he gets 'ill' if he is 'too stressed'. Its anxiety I think, but none of this is enough for him to actually change what he does.

And I think I thought that because I have money (sort of although I have a lot of debt which is growing slowly) I SHOULD share it with him. But he has started to make comments if I buy something for myself or the kids...And I don't think that's fair.

in fact its all unfair to me. My updated spreadsheet suggests that with 'rent' and bills he has probably cost me in excess of £40K in the last 2 years - since he moved in. And that's being conservative.

He doesn't get your point of view because to him, he is the literal centre of the universe. He cannot empathise properly because he is not interested in anyone else's point of view, problems, difficulties because they are not his own. He is profoundly, utterly selfish. He is 55 years old and selfishness runs through him like a stick of rock and he will never, ever change.
£20k a year? shock that is awful. Simply awful. Just think what that money could have done. Properly finished the DIY - reduced your mortgage - propped up your pension - university fund for the kids - a new car - two amazing holidays - 100 really nice pairs of shoes...

ColinButterfly Mon 22-Jul-13 06:27:38

I read this and thought 'cocklodger' but he's barely even providing cock is he?!

Honestly hard as it is now, you've done the right thing. I agree with SGBs theory about this type of 'person' - my ex was like this. Thought he had a divine right not to work, gave up any job he ever had, leeched off me and his mother, he wouldn't even sign on for ages because even that was beneath him, thought me keeping him was an honour for me. I am fairly well paid but keeping him has gotten me in some debt and if I think about it, it makes me feel ill...I used to tell him I couldn't afford x y or z and about the debt and he just used to tell me I wasn't in debt becaus of him but because I bought clothes or shoes every now and again. I also literally had to do everything - I worked, went to Sainsburys and then cooked. Even if he'd just gone to the shop I'd have felt less stressed.

Sadly I wasn't as brave as you - it ended because he was cheating on me. But I'm glad he's gone now. I realise he brought nothing to the relationship. My revenge has been the fact that I caught him the day before I got paid so he'll have been at a sticky wicket then and he is having to work now. Oh look he can do something besides wanking and playing computer games.

I feel a bit of a mug but I hopefully will always earn money whereas he will give up everything on a whim when suits. It means I'm a good natured person but I need to be careful I don't get exploited.

I'm enjoying my money for me now...holidays, nights out seem cheap because I'm only paying for me etc

I wonder if you maybe need to work on yourself abit - your last partner was abusive but your ex has been financially abusive and I think like me your boundaries a bit skewed. Mine was a pattern of people pleasing etc set in childhood (thanks mum) and I've been having counselling. I'm getting a lot more assertive now.

Stay strong

kalidanger Mon 22-Jul-13 06:58:13

he really doesn't get it from my point of view AT ALL

No, he gets it. He knows what 'rent' is, he knows what 'bills' are - he just chooses to pretend not to, and to freeze in 'anxiety' to shut you up anytime you mention them.

He's not like an ordinary person who is having trouble understanding Real Life. He's a calculating bastard who knows exactly what he wants. Stop giving it to him. Stop being confused! That's easy to say but he's not as complicated as he's convinced you he is.

The door to the room being locked is a BIG DEAL. Hope some other good posters turn up to help convince you of that.

Hope you feel better, and clearer, this morning thanks

clodhopper13 Mon 22-Jul-13 08:04:58

I feel both furiously angry and very tearful.

Not sure how I will cope at work but its a very busy day so I have to go...

colinbutterfly thank you for sharing - it makes me feel less alone to know that other people have been taken in in this way.

I definitely need to work on myself, He must have seen me coming really.

CogitoErgoSometimes Mon 22-Jul-13 08:21:24

Work's the best place to be at times like this IME. Being busy and focused on something means less 'downtime' to sit there mulling over the negative stuff. Get a locksmith round to open that room as a first step. Aside from being a practical move, I think it'll also be a symbolic way to reassert yourself in your own home/life

kalidanger Mon 22-Jul-13 08:41:42

It's also symbolic of his behaviour. You'll never 'get' him either - it's all locked away, far beyond understanding. Fifty-five years old, with a shoebox of SEKRIT -KEEP OUT scrawled in crayon.

Practical steps now. Probably won't come naturally to you, or anyone.

1. Arrange for his stuff to be delivered to his mothers, to a timetable of your choosing
2. Just pay for it to be moved - that's the price of freedom
3. No contact

We know it's hard hard hard but we're here thanks

Homebird8 Mon 22-Jul-13 09:43:51

I read this and thought 'cocklodger' but he's barely even providing cock is he?! and would not be back; so DC 1 could wait on the doorstep

hmm Providing it somewhere else perhaps.

So sorry clodhopper sad. I think you are right to bring this to its end. Practical advice from those who have been there and flowers from me to show you the beauty in the world. Hope work isn't to bad today.

clodhopper13 Mon 22-Jul-13 11:12:57

shit. sitting in my office tears pouring down my face and sobbing huge sobs. Managed NOT to do this in front to the DC yesterday but seem to have lost all control today

I'm not good with loss. or abandonment as Ms Norwood would call it. standing up for myself has never ever felt so hard...

wordyBird Mon 22-Jul-13 11:16:09

Let it out, you will feel ok again soon.
This isn't easy. You'll get there though. brew

KatyTheCleaningLady Mon 22-Jul-13 11:23:31

You will be much happier, soon. There will be low periods that will become further apart over time.

CogitoErgoSometimes Mon 22-Jul-13 11:23:58

Dry your tears and go get a brew and biscuit. It's such a horrible situation to be in and you have everyone's sympathy, I'm sure. No-one goes into a relationship thinking they have to kick ass... we all want unconditional companionship and a nice easy time with the person we think we love. Standing up for yourself is tough.

Good. Those tears needed to come out. Grieve for your dreams but the dry those tears and make new ones.

onefewernow Mon 22-Jul-13 12:59:33

You know a man with this much history won't change at 55.

I really think you need to get some counselling support to help you work out why you fall for these sorts of men, and how to hone your radar for them.

Well done for getting rid.

You know your world will not fall apart without him.

clodhopper13 Mon 22-Jul-13 13:15:30

I can't face telling people IRL. Apart from the kids, I think that's because I have not accepted it, not accepted that I really have the right to do this. Not accepted that my great romantic dream is really over.

But I do recognise that I have done in this relationship exactly what I did in my marriage. Turned a blind eye to glaringly obvious problems that I knew I could not live with long term, became the rescuer. For different reasons, but same syndrome.

God I'm fucked up . Such a bloody people pleaser. Ironically he, exP , has given me confidence, the same confidence enabled me to call time now, rather than in the 10 years it took to call time on my shitty exH

someone tell me you can break the habits of a lifetime

Bedtime1 Mon 22-Jul-13 13:33:08

Before your first husband who obviously knocked your confidence etc what was lifelike before him. Was you happy. Is there more to why you fear being abandoned and alone so strongly?

Bedtime1 Mon 22-Jul-13 13:35:10

I can't help thinking there's more to this from childhood etc for you to feel the need to please people all the time. I mean you sound a very nice person but do all nice people people please?

onefewernow Mon 22-Jul-13 15:45:58

Yes you can fix it. Step one is the recognition.

Why not book some counselling sessions and do some reading simultaneously.

I would suggest Cloud and Thompson on boundaries- a really good book I heard of on here- authors are religious but the book is brilliant anyway, and I'm not a Christian.

The key seems to me to be about recognising where your need to please and rescue came from- probably a learned childhood response VERY common amongst successful women from difficult family backgrounds, rather than marriage, where you likely fine tuned it.

Also, as someone similar, I needed to recognise that stating your needs and expectations assertively is not the same as ensuring you get them met- lots of people let it in one ear and out the other.

Also, if you are assertive at work but not at home, doesn't that say something about your comfort levels in having needs in personal relationship ?

I needed to learn not to be uncomfortable in saying no, and allowing people to own the consequences if their own behaviour. Regardless.

I bet you would find it difficult to state what your unassailable boundaries are. Well, I did anyway. There was always an "unless" clause.

CogitoErgoSometimes Mon 22-Jul-13 17:33:40

"someone tell me you can break the habits of a lifetime"

At least you're getting quicker smile I'll try to brighten your day with a funny story that illustrates how it's possible to change. Not long after having been unceremoniously dumped by my emotionally abusive exH (who I had spent 12 years trying and failing to keep happy) I went on holiday, Shirley Valentine style, all by myself. Lovely.

Second night I'm there and a nice enough bloke asks if I'd like to join him in the hotel dining room. I'm quite happy dining solo but I go along and we're chatting and suddenly I'm conscious that he's droning on about his exW

"She hates me. The kids hate me. The dog hates me....."

The old Cog would have listened, sympathised, offered kind words of comfort but, after 12 years of shit, something snapped.

"I'm not surprised they hate you" I said, acidly. "You're fucking boring"

smile

CalamityKate Mon 22-Jul-13 17:44:46

Sorry, I'm actually laughing at the bit where you describe how cross he gets when you "don't get him" !!grin

Oh poor love. He thinks he's just a little bit special, doesn't he?! grin

I bet if someone actually pointed out that he's a bone idle, deluded cock lodger he'd genuinely be unable to understand why they thought that.

CalamityKate Mon 22-Jul-13 17:46:06

Cogito - brilliant! grin

imademarion Mon 22-Jul-13 18:00:27

He saved me from the mess I was after my marriage broke down, I was so so happy.

I could have written every single one of your posts including the guilt and the self loathing.

May I suggest counselling which will show you that I fact he didn't save you and that you can and will be happy without him.

You sound wonderful, strong and funny and keen to learn and move on. Spend a bit of time getting to know yourself rather than hoping some bloke will take responsibility for your happiness.

I slung all my fuckwit's extensive collection of shit into a storage unit as he was too busy hanging off his mother's tit sobbing on everyone's shoulder to deal with it.

The removal men put it into the unit. And told me that it was piled very precariously indeed, almost dangerously. It made me laugh through the snot and I knew I would be ok.

clodhopper13 Mon 22-Jul-13 19:08:12

cogito - that made me LAUGH ! and I see that you have maintained that position of wisdom !

I have HAD counselling - but I think I couldn't SEE what I can SEE now... I'm bloody broke (ha ha) and not wanting to go down that route right now - but in 3/12 it might be an option

Finished a very difficult and stressful day at work and just been shopping with the kids for food - and had a chat about how we need to work as a team now, I think / hope we can do this...

indemarion who paid for the storage unit ? I have investigated, but I cant see how to pay for a month and then transfer ownership - I don't want to be paying £20 a week for ever... Can I ask how long ago this was for you ?

You are all so so kind, saying nice things about me. Strong is the last bloody thing I feel - but I will just have to push on.

I sent him one text which asked for the key to the locked room and " I will arrange for your possessions to be returned to you" He has not replied. I am scared of how I will feel if / when he does - especially if he turns on the charm

clodhopper13 Mon 22-Jul-13 19:26:05

O christ he has sent me an email

BloomingRose Mon 22-Jul-13 19:31:02

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

clodhopper13 Mon 22-Jul-13 22:19:55

a bit about how I do not understand him. A bit saying I exaggerate ( I do about feelings when under pressure, but not about basic facts) A bit critisising me for not understanding that he is under stress and for ths reason our sex life has faltered.

I have written a very very honest email. and sent it before I could change my mind. I ma in bed, reading 'women who love too much' and feeling ok. I have CHOICES and I can control what happens

imademarion Mon 22-Jul-13 22:31:32

It was about five years ago; the storage guys had seen it all before. I used the joint credit card that he'd made a big swaggery old fuss about getting me (which is used exactly once, at which he almost fainted the total fuckwit, he just wanted to put his hand on my arse in public and smirk about 'giving' me a credit card.)

I could have bought and sold him a hundred tones but like a fool I minded for his bloody ego.

Anyway, I emailed and says I wanted his stuff out and it would either all arrive on his mums doorstep or I'd arrange for it to go into storage.

I think he was so scared if the mad old bat that he agreed to paying toot sweet.

I almost wish I'd kept in touch to discover whether he actually had been brained by a falling piece of cleverly balanced worthless tat.

How much stuff has your chap left?

BloomingRose Mon 22-Jul-13 22:33:02

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Hegsy Mon 22-Jul-13 22:39:00

He's under stress? FFs heard it all now. You are so much better off without him. You are doing fab

Plomino Mon 22-Jul-13 23:20:32

Of course he's under stress . He's got no one to sort out his life and finance it for him . Poor little hard done by wankbadger of an excuse for a man .

Well done . One step forward . Tomorrow is a whole new day . I'd be spending it planning what to do with a whole empty room .

pippop1 Tue 23-Jul-13 00:50:01

What's in the room that it needed to be locked?

You should feel proud of yourself Clod. You know, in your heart and although it is painful, that you are doing the right thing. Are your kids happier with just you now?

Jaynebxl Tue 23-Jul-13 05:08:22

I'm sure it must be possible to get in that room somehow. I'd get a locksmith on the job and stick it all in the back of my car.

Jaynebxl Tue 23-Jul-13 05:08:45

I'm sure it must be possible to get in that room somehow. I'd get a locksmith on the job and stick it all in the back of my car.

Jaynebxl Tue 23-Jul-13 05:09:34

And I'd do it twice, clearly!

clodhopper13 Tue 23-Jul-13 07:21:38

:-) slightly weak smile.

I'm back in that horrible place where I am remembering all he nice things. I'm remembering all the things we did together and how lovely he can be. And I'm remembering that he has done an amazing job on the renovations which would have cost me a lot ( though I might not have chosen to do them) . I cant eat, sleep poorly and feel like I have done him a great wrong. I know he will he hurt by what I wrote and will think its very one sided.

I reckon your children are a lot happier now that's he's gone as well.

How can you write he has done an amazing job on the renovations. Denial is a powerful force granted but these same renovations have taken two years to date and they are still not finished.

No more contact of any sort as of now. Such men I tell you are incapable of feeling hurt; he will soon find another sap (what such types really thinks of women and infact hates all women) to leech off.

Well done for reading "Women who love too Much" by Robin Norwood.
I would suggest you also read Codependent No More written by Melodie Beattie. Counselling for you is certainly a good idea.

You need to get to the heart of why you have such a need to people please (perhaps learnt during childhood and from parents) and unlearn all the damaging crap you have learnt about relationships to date including this one. Then you will indeed move forward.

CogitoErgoSometimes Tue 23-Jul-13 07:40:34

It's a horrible place only because you're a nice person. smile Dumping people... as I found with my holiday experience... is a question of a) drawing the line at letting others take advantage of your kind nature and b) practising until you can do it as easy as breathing. Then you need c) DISTANCE. i.e you get on with something else rather than give yourself any time to dwell on the guilty feelings. It doesn't sound like you've dumped enough people in your romantic career so far. Plus, if he's still in contact, you can't get c)

The time for nostalgia is in a few years when you're in a better place. Now is the time to harden your heart and get people around you that didn't like him....

Hang on
You said the renovations would add £20k to the value of the house
He has cost you £20k in two years
And the renovations aren't finished
That's poor economics, my friend

balia Tue 23-Jul-13 12:03:39

Could you send another email, if you feel bad? Maybe...

"Dear STBX

I agree with you - you should be free to live creatively without stress, to be unencumbered by the trivial day to day matters of life. It would be selfish of me to continue the relationship when I am unable to understand you - a grown man who can't take financial care of himself. I am sure I am exaggerating the need for money, I am a far less evolved creature than yourself; you have told me many times that you cost nothing - I should have listened and given you just that."

Will that help, do you think?

piratecat Tue 23-Jul-13 12:16:03

course you will remember the nice bits, but they don't make the full picture op. As much as you love him, and wanted to be wanted, and wante to care for someone.

He is like my ex dh. I loved him so so much, but underneath he was a very lazy, troubled, boy. He had no work ethic, he left me, and it has been yrs now since then, but i in his eyes had turned into a nag. I just wanted him to live in the real world and leave eveything up to me.

The world revolves around men like this. Don't tell me, he's a Saggitarian?? ( i find this often with men like this).
Day dream, do not stick to things and generally believe everyone owes them something.
They get angry with those they love the most, because they have no c lue where to fit into the world.

This is his problem, not yours op. You have done enough. It will hurt, but that's normal. Ride it through op. xxxxxxxxx

piratecat Tue 23-Jul-13 12:17:46

and 'not' leave everything up to me.

i was glad to be a nurturer, at the start it was very equal in that sense. Yet he didn't want to grow up, and then started to hate me when i did.

xx

AndTheBandPlayedOn Tue 23-Jul-13 13:37:49

The locked room is shock. You really need to find out what is in there, keeping my fingers crossed for you that it is all legal.

The locked room is angry. He moved into your home and then took a part of it away from you...like a dog pissing on his territory? Psychopath is right. That is a as a pure control dynamic as they come, clodhopper.

shock that he would leave a youngster wait on the doorstep!
biscuit <<[Asshole]

All of his anxiety is "your fault" because you are not his doormat anymore. His anxiety can not possibly have anything to do with him, so the blame and shame has to go somewhere...he is having separation anxiety to have to switch to a new target. Please don't waste a moment worring about it. In a month's time, I predict he will be with his new "host" and perhaps rub your face in it-at which point it would be very tempting to send her a lovely bouquet and note of "THANK-YOU".

clodhopper13 Tue 23-Jul-13 16:24:22

I know exactly what is IN the room. its locked because some of the stuff is fragile to stop the children breaking it. There is nothing sinister per se about that part. But for the same reason, as it is valuable I cannot just dump it. I need to make sure it is returned

You don't need to make sure it is returned.
He needs to arrange for someone to come and get it.
If he doesn't, then sell it and make yourself some of that money back!

RandomMess Tue 23-Jul-13 18:44:24

Tell him what date it be available to collect from your front garden. If he does not collect it his tough luck.

Anniegetyourgun Tue 23-Jul-13 19:34:25

Returned? Who bought it?

BeQuicksieorBeDead Tue 23-Jul-13 21:28:51

I am a sagittarius and can confirm we are creative, extremely special and require round the clock care and funding. Now which star sign do I need to look out for that will provide the care I need?!

Dp insists on me going to work and paying some of the bills. The bastard. He doesnt understand me at all.

clodhopper13 Tue 23-Jul-13 22:26:51

both he, and I are Sagittarius..Make of that what you will.

It is the third day I have not seen him and I am ok. Wobbly - cried huge tearing sobs at DS primary leaver assembly this morning when they played 'Those were the days of our lives', and the tears were not for the kids. Had to wear my sunglasses in the school hall. DS was most embarrassed.

We have been in email contact but funnily it has gone quiet since I said we will not be continuing as we are. That I prefer to be alone. I have made it clear that he needs to have employment to finance his personal expenditure. Were the boot on the other foot, I would do bar work, cleaning, health care, anything, to be a contributor. I know he will see this as beneath him. But that will not be my problem as I will not waver.

It is devastatingly hurtful to think that, in reality, he only 'loved' me as a meal ticket. That rather than do anything to preserve/ save our relationship he will walk on to the next sap. But better now than in 10 years. And better while I have my DC at home, who are, I am sad to say, happier.

I will keep updating because I have SO valued your help, support, experience and robust advice

clod x

The simple fact that he is not prepared to work in any way - ie he won't seek a paid job (which there is some excuse for at present: he wouldn't get one) but nor will he do any domestic work - makes it clear that he considers you his inferior, and a creature that ought to be grateful for his mere presence and therefore not complain about having to work hard to support him.

AndTheBandPlayedOn Wed 24-Jul-13 14:24:11

Scrape the parasite off and don't look back.
Sorry to be so blunt.

Yes, clod, it is more apparent that "meal ticket" is what he was after from his behavior now. And it does hurt to be just plainly used. Sorry.

I am curious about the questions from Annie about the precious valuables...how could he have these things if he has no money? Did they all arrive with him, or have you funded these acquisitions?

Kids have a gut instinct too. If they are happier, there is a significant clue there, too, imho.

welshharpy Wed 24-Jul-13 18:25:45

I feel for you, Clod.

Unfortunately my brother is exactly the same as this tosspot. For years he has moved in with women, leeched money and god knows what else from them, never held down a decent job for anything longer than a couple of months and it's usually after 2 years of that when the women finally wake up and kick him out.
During all that time he will plead poverty etc but he still has 3 laptops and countless very expensive mobile phones! He tells these women and my mother he needs petrol money, tobacco etc and they give him that and more besides!! Unbelievable!
It is a pattern which repeats itself over and over.
In-between women he will live, sorry sponge, off my mother who will bend over backwards to please him and generally coddle him all over again - even though he is 44 ffs!
These 'men' - and I use the term VERY loosely - NEVER take responsibilty for themselves and can sniff out someone to enable their bone idle lifestyle sadly all too easily.
Be proud of yourself and your kids and do not look back. He is a total fuck-up and no longer your responsibility x

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