Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide, which can point you to expert advice and support.
ZOMBIE THREAD ALERT: This thread hasn't been posted on for a while.
Can I forgive this much deceit?(708 Posts)
I am trying to figure out whether I can stay,have couples counselling, and try and work things out. Or....whether it is just too much betrayal and deceit. My mind swings between the 2 on a twice daily basis.
Background: DP has cheated on me with 2 women. He met with each one 4/5 times during my recent pregnancies. He has also met up for drinks with a few more. He met then through married affair websites.
I found out about the websites 10 weeks ago, and about the women 3 weeks ago. He followed the usual script of denial, deleting, minimising etc. Then I was contacted by a woman and he had to come clean.
He has started psychotherapy to deal with his issues. He says it was about the buzz of getting girls to be impressed by him.
How do I work out what to do for the best? Obviously he is desperate to work things out. I am prepared to listen at the minute. We have 3 DC. 2 are very small. Help me to make sense of this please!
I rarely say it but LTB.
Seriously he was shagging other women whist you were pregnant. Total deal breaker IMO. At a time when you were probably feeling extremely vulnerable he was off, admittedly, shagging someone for a boost to his ego!!
Actually - having checked the timeline he has written for me - he slept with the first woman twice after I gave birth to my middle child. When they were 4 months old and 6 months old.
He is a total shit. LTB. Sorry.
It's scary leaving, especially if you have children. But don't stay with him as a compromise or because you're scared to step out on your own.
I suspect many men will never change and why would they when they can get away with it? The behaviour you describe is shocking. You'd never start a relationship with a man and tolerate that. So what are your reasons for staying? For the children .....so they grow up with the example of a loving relationship that he is showing them???? Don't fool yourself that they won't know. Stress and tension leaches out of you and they will.
Can you get over it? Probably not. There is a small minuscule chance you might and you're clutching onto that straw rather than take the step on your own.
Will he change? Probably not. There is a small minuscule chance he might and you're clutching onto that straw.
Remember the 3 pigs building their houses? The straw house is blown over.
I agree. However, he is taking going to therapy. He doesn't like who he is. He does want to change. Is that enough?
The issues are, can you get over it, and very importantly can you live worrying he will do it again forver because that's what your life will be like. I couldn't.
I seriously doubt it. It's not vindictive but counselling doesn't erase the pain and doesn't restore trust.
There also seems to be a standard set of platitudes used when cheaters get busted. 30 minutes once a week raking over stuff, for me, would accomplish nothing.
So really, it boils down to your capacity to forgive and forget.
No idea. Do you think it's enough?
He didn't want to change until he got caught. He was happy enough to sink ball deep into any woman he could until he got caught.
Did he come home to you all sweetness and light, happy and loving? After having dipped his dick elsewhere? You know this is a man who is happy to lie to your face. How do you build trust when you know what they are capable of?
how much is he 'sorry' and how much is he sorry he got caught?
He betrayed you, he lied to your face, he admitted only what you could prove? How much more is it possible there is that he is holding back because you can't prove it?
I think it would take a lot of work. You'd certainly need to see a lot more from him that apologies and talking about going to therapy.
When's his first appointment at this therapy?
What do you get out of this relationship now?. That question needs serious thought.
Some men are very adept at telling the woman what they so want to hear.
In answer to your last question, no its not enough. its far too little and far too late. He only came clean as well when you were contacted by another woman; he kept minimising everything till then.
(A short burst of therapy is not enough either. He may be several years work for even the most forgiving of therapists).
Stepping out on your own is very hard but he is really not worth it now.
He has always had a choice and he made a conscious choice to act like he did. No-one forced him to message other women or sleep with them.
Yes, that's true. And his choice wasn't even to shag about randomly, it was to actually join a website and find people to have affairs with! He went out there to look!
That's, well, if there's a scale of shittyness, it's fairly close to the top.
And if he admits to fucking 2, it'll likely be 6 and if he admits to having a drink with 4, it'll likely be 12.
Oh, but I withdraw my last question, I see he has actually started this therapy. I missed that bit.
It's just the level of deceit and selfishness that is hard to get over, I imagine. My wife has just had a baby. I am going to trawl the web looking for women to shag. You've just had his child. Instead of being a team, instead of gazing at this little person he helped to create, he's out there actively seeking women to betray you with.
and, btw - you really need to get yourself tested for STDs.
For me - no, it wouldn't be enough.
In any case, you say in one post that he's talking about going to therapy and in another post that he's started psychotherapy to deal with his 'issues'. Which is it and is that really true? I'd be thinking that that was also a convenient tale to keep you happier for a while.
I couldn't live with this man for another umpty years or so. Hard though it might be to leave, could you genuinely live with this?
You need to leave. It's hard to get over when a guy actively looks got another woman. My exP looked and cheated before and after I had DD, for this so called buzz. Everytime he looked at his phone, sat on the laptop, went out alone, my mind made went through every possible thing he could be doing. And it makes u become very angry and unstable in a way.
I ended up leaving when I had my daughter.
It's hard being on your own but it's not forever and better than being treated like shit x
You would be an utter fool if you did, sorry
The man is a sexually incontinent prick. This is not going to change after a bit of navel gazing by him.
You are spending family money for him to boo hoo about how hard it is to keep it in his pants ?
What an utter waste of time and money
I agree about getting tested for STDs
Personally I could forgive the sex, but the fact that he joined a married persons sex site and then searched for and took many women out on dates is too much for me.
It's one thing to have a drunken ONS, or hook up with someone at work, but to actively go out there looking too have an affair is unforgivable IMO.
He only wants to change because he has been caught out, and I doubt very much he actually wants to change and is in fact just trying to tell you what you want to hear.
Honestly, I don't think there is much choice, you need to LTB, otherwise you are showing him that that kind of behaviour is forgivable and there is nothing to stop him doing it again.
If he genuinely wants to get help and work on things then he can do that, away from you, and then if he does make improvements then maybe you could try again in the future.
But as far as I am aware there is no therapy that can cure being a bastard.
"But as far as I am aware there is no therapy that can cure being a bastard."
He hates who he is?
Well, he is a loathsome, worthless shit, so if he has any honest feelings at all he should hate himself.
Not really your problem though.
He deliberately and repeatedly put your health and your babies' health at risk.
He doesn't really give a fuck about any of you.
He started therapy 5 weeks ago. I know he is going. When I talked about counselling, I meant couples counselling. We would do both.
You arw right - it is the selfishness and deceit that are killing me.
He says that he used a married affair site because " I justified it to myself that it was as safe a way as possible of getting the kick that I needed and not hurting my family and you as it was with like minded people that were also looking for a bit of a buzz."
I don't think you are asking yourself the right questions ... It's more can i keep putting up with this , because I don't think he will stop just because he has been caught ,especially as if you stay now after you know , he will take that as a green light and keep doing it , he obviously likes it and you have effectively said you are prepared to put up with it has he has told you what he is like !
So sorry what a shit bag .
The very fact he wants strangers to be impressed by him is so pathetic to be embarrassing and I am sure you do not want to be embarrassed by your children's father.
You deserve more.
He could have admitted everything immediately but he didn't so he showed you no respect. I am sure you want respect from the father of your children.
You sound really really lovely and I am sure you would do just fine without this idiot in your bed.
If he really wants to change he can do that while living in his own crummy bedsit while you stay looking after your children. He does not need to do it while still enjoying all the comforts of home. If he is genuine he will agree to this and it will come good. If he isn't then he will soon be living the single life and you will already have started getting used to being the only adult in this relationship and will be doing just fine.
You could forgive.
Should you, though?
After his lip service after being caught (hating himself, sure) he's very likely to revert to type.
If you want to have any chance, I think you need to leave him. He should be earning your trust, not you going to couples therapy.
Personally, I could forgive a drunk one night stand, if there were no lies.
Not this level of deceit.
Will you be able to really ever trust him again?
"and not hurting my family and you as it was with like minded people that were also looking for a bit of a buzz."
This is such bollocks. There is NO justification for cheating on your partner.
"it was as safe a way as possible of getting the kick that I needed"
How can you listen to him say that and have any feelings other than total repugnance?
The kick that he needed?
This is who is he is - a man who doesn't get the "kick" that he "needs" from the birth of his child, one of the most intense experiences in life.
No, this is a man who "needs" to leave his wife at home with their baby while he spends family money on his latest conquest and risks bringing STIs home to everyone.
He is just a really crap person.
The lies he told deceived you about that. But now you know.
What everyone else said... So sorry this has happened to you, but people like this do not change. Why should they? There is no incentive to change as people let them get away with this behaviour time and time again.
He didn't mind who he was unti he got caught, and his supposed justification is a totally load of old bollocks.
What makes me sad is time after time, women forgive this shitty behaviour for the kids, struggle in an on with a flailing relationship, killing themselves to try and be superwife. Whilst this teaches their children to accept unacceptable behaviour... Only for the man to bog off and leave them a few years down the line anyway. Flog a dead horse for nothing.
You deserve so much better, and instead of staying for the children, LEAVE for the children. As that is what will be the best for them in the long run.
Join the discussion
Registering is free, easy, and means you can join in the discussion, get discounts, win prizes and lots more.Register now
Already registered with Mumsnet? Log in to leave your comment or alternatively, sign in with Facebook or Google.
Please login first.