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This seems a pointless exercise to me...

(124 Posts)
moolamoo Sat 15-Jun-13 13:02:43

As stated in the title, a man I have been seeing has told me he needs something from me that seems quite pointless...a week with no contact, to 'think'.

He ended things a few weeks ago, due to him not being in the right head space or something, and has gone through periods of telling me he needs to leave me alone, then saying he cant do that as something keeps drawing him back.

He came round for a talk last night. The gist of what he said is thay he cant work out whether he is madly in love with m or hates me...because I infuriate him so much beyond the point anyone ever has when we argue (I do push things quite far) but at the very same time he is so deeply drawn to me and I make him smile inside (a phrase i have never quite understood).
He doesnt feel like he wants to lose all contact, I make him happier than anyone ever has, we connect so deeply and he has felt pure joy when we have just messed around having a laugh...but doesnt feel like we have a future as he doesnt feel that core 'want' htobbe with me, date me etc.
But then he looked pained and asked why he doesnt feel that want to be with me, given that he feels all that other stuff for me.

We ended up in bed but he couldnt 'do' anything, saying it wasnt right if at this moment in time he cant envisage a future for us.

He then said that he wants/needs a week with no contact between us, so he can work out how he truly feels, whether the attraction is just physical or something more.

I have agreed, as I think the space will enable me to start to move on; as I really feel he cant gain the necessary feelings in 7 days and I dont see how he can work anything out in this time?

Can anyone shed any light on what he might be hoping to achieve? it just seems pointless to me.

quietlysuggests Sat 15-Jun-13 13:04:31

What is your own background? I'm wondering why you would even listen to this shit?
Tell him to fuck off and delete his number.

ChasingStaplers Sat 15-Jun-13 13:08:02

Everything else aside:

'I infuriate him so much beyond the point anyone ever has when we argue'

Red flag.

He doesn't know whether he loves or hates you?
Another red flag.

Run, run away!
Trust me, nothing good will come out of a relationship with this man.

catballou Sat 15-Jun-13 13:08:14

W.ell what do you feel in all this? You've only given his side. Do you like him? Love him? How old are you?

EllieArroway Sat 15-Jun-13 13:13:07

Seriously - tell him to go fuck himself.

Why should you waste even 10 seconds of your time waiting to see if he hates you or loves you?

It's entirely up to him, is it, whether there's a relationship or not? How arrogant.

BabyStone Sat 15-Jun-13 13:13:13

Sounds to me like he is messing you around. Any guy that wants to be with you just when it is convenient for them isn't worth knowing in my opinion. He can't just like you one moment then drop you the next. I wouldn't have any contact with him in the next 7days or anytime after that. He can't make up his mind if he "is in love with you" or "hates you", what's that all about?! A load of crap! Id be trying my best to stay away from him

Dumbledorable Sat 15-Jun-13 13:14:16

I'd be running for the hills.

The poor tortured soul sounds like an utter arse!

meditrina Sat 15-Jun-13 13:14:20

He's playing games - he's dangling the prospect that if you somehow become "good enough" you can have him as a reward. Just enough contact to keep you on a piece of string.

He's telling you that he's a messed up individual. Believe him.

On the assumption that you want to be someone's partner, not their nursemaid, I suggest you get in touch to tell him that this isn't working from your point of view and that he need not be back in touch.

moolamoo Sat 15-Jun-13 13:16:38

Well I did pick up on the 'hate' comment and he just said he keeps coming back, not able to just cut me out and never speak to me again. I think the hate word was used just as a polar opposite to the love comment tbh. Its the sort of thing i would say.

I'm putting up with (if you mean the week to think) because I can use it as cold turkey, if you like. A means to start to move on as I said.

I dont know how I feel if I'm honest. Kind of the same as he seems to; I care about him but cant call it love, but we have both been through a lot lately (seperately) so its caused a lot of hassle which we could both do without, but dont feel able or want to stop contact altogether. I dont think either of us are ready for a relationship so we would both need to put that on a back burner for a good while, but dont see what difference a week will make, whereas he sema to be pinnung everything on it.

TurnipCake Sat 15-Jun-13 13:17:30

Good grief, are you dating my ex?

You have enough red flags to make bunting

Not again!

moolamoo Sat 15-Jun-13 13:20:37

thanks, there is a lot of backstory I cant go into in case a family member of mine recognises me, he is putting it more as wants to be able to see a future for us, as he could before we split, but over the 2 weeks before he ended things we were deteriorating quickly and now he doesnt know why he cant see a future for us when everything else is right.

moolamoo Sat 15-Jun-13 13:22:12

katiescarlett, pardon?

How long have you been seeing him?

All seems a bit too intense?

He does sound very fucked up.

I'd run for the hills if I were you. It's all so very draining.

HollyBerryBush Sat 15-Jun-13 13:27:50

because I infuriate him so much beyond the point anyone ever has when we argue (I do push things quite far)

You've admitted pushing his buttons. So as much as other posters will be stating 'red flag' - I think you're giving him the red flag in a relationship. Why would you want to see how far you can push him? What purpose does that serves?

I dont think either of us are ready for a relationship

you've answered your own question

Walkacrossthesand Sat 15-Jun-13 13:27:51

The scenario sounds similar to one in a long thread a few weeks back, Moola, involving a man who worked at poster's DCs school - hence katiescarletts comment (i think). If this isn't another thread about 'janny' (and I wondered the same) then all well and good. MNers have accurate and long memories! grin

Helltotheno Sat 15-Jun-13 13:28:13

Yes exactly, pointless exercise, the whole thing. Waste of oxygen, waste of words, waste of your time. Move on.

Mumsyblouse Sat 15-Jun-13 13:33:05

You do have a choice here, and the obvious one is to move on from this very flaky guy. But it is your choice and that's what you have to remember.

Protego Sat 15-Jun-13 13:35:22

I have to agree with the comments here - unless of course you have masochistic tendencies?

Oh it's Janitor man again.

For fuck's sake, love.

Somethingtothinkabout Sat 15-Jun-13 13:39:26

Katie, I thought the same hmm

If this man is a Janitor, I think you should leave him alone.

He he's not a janitor, I think you should leave well alone anyway, he's causing too much drama, no need.

Surely there can't be two janny lovers? If I am mistaken, I am sorry OP, but it sounds so familiar....

quietlysuggests Sat 15-Jun-13 13:42:17

Oh actually reading your posts, there are a pair of you in it! A couple of drama queens enjoying the bullshit.
Crack on my dear.

ivykaty44 Sat 15-Jun-13 13:43:20

e has s problem with commitment and he is also testing the boundaries to see how much shit you will put up with

how much shit will you put up with ?

Kernowgal Sat 15-Jun-13 13:45:36

Several months into our relationship, and a few days after a holiday during which he'd behaved horribly to me, my (now ex) partner admitted that he wasn't in love with me, but was very fond of me, and wanted to see how things went. I was devastated and tied myself into knots trying to make everything amazing after that.

However, what I should have done is told him to go fuck himself. The sheer arrogance of it all. The truth was that he was a nasty piece of work who got kicks out of me grovelling to him. I kick myself for letting him dangle a carrot like that and being grateful for it.

I deserved more and so do you.

HotDAMNlifeisgood Sat 15-Jun-13 13:52:30

reclaim http://www.baggagereclaim.co.uk/list-of-posts/ makes good reading.

What you have is a Mr Unavailable. Move on, as quickly and completely as you are able. This tortured soul will just mess with your head and drag you down with him.

Cold turkey, and sticking to no contact, is actually the only remedy. Well done for identifying that that is what you need to do.

moolamoo Sat 15-Jun-13 14:09:57

Ok sorry if I miss something someone has asked.

He isnt a janitor.

I cant remember who said it but the bit about an ex saying they werent into them etc., I do see what you mean but I think the thing thats thrown me was just how he said if everything is so right with our personalities, physical attraction, how I make him feel and all that stuff, why he doesnt feel that core want to be in a relationship with me. He said before he has gone mostly on looks in the past and with me it feels different, but he cant put his finger on why he cant be with me.
It does all sound very strange but I dont think he is dangling a carrot as such, as he hasnt said there is anything 'wrong' with me and last night I talked about just ending it there and then, he said "ok...if you cant give me that week to work through things" so as I said I am giving it, with the intention of not contacting him (ever) unless he contacts me first and if he doesnt,well then i have moved on havent I :-)

Its weird though as he wont sleep with me; not that I would want that but I would wonder what he is getting out of this 'messing me around' if not sex? Ive met men that tell you they care or are confused just to get laid but that isnt what he is doing.

AgathaF Sat 15-Jun-13 14:16:40

Why would you want or need this amount of complicated bloke shite in your life?

moolamoo Sat 15-Jun-13 14:20:59

Reading the baggage reclaim he doesnt sound like a mr unavailable as such, but it did get me thinking, last night when we talked he said he split up with someone about 18 months ago, an old friend came into his life 9 months after that and they started dating - but at that point he hadnt been actively looking for a relationship, he said he had filled in an online dating.profile a few times, got half way through but given up as he "just couldnt be bothered" and then when his previous partner started wanting more commitment than he felt he could give, she ended it.
Then he met me, again when he wasnt looking.

He says he still feels that he needs to be alone and "cant be bothered" with the effort of finding someone and getting to know them again - me and this man had been talking as friends for quite a while before we got together so it just went along without - well too much effort on his part I suppose.

So maybe thats the issue...needs to be single?

meditrina Sat 15-Jun-13 14:27:22

I suggest you stop trying to work out his thought processes, and instead concentrate on yours.

Why on earth would you want to be with someone who has basically said he's only with you because you're easily there and he can't be bothered to be a decent partner?

moolamoo Sat 15-Jun-13 14:27:43

agatha, well I always believe in taking people at face value and giving ppl the benefit of the doubt, as long as Im not being too negatively affected by things.

Day to day I dont think about this issue, dont feel upset or anything like that and I know if I need him, he will be there. I had a bereavement a few weeks ago - an old friend from school was killed in an accident, hadnt seen her in years but about a week after the funeral I suddenly got upset. Phoned this man and he came and sat with me all night. He didnt expect or try anything on, just sat on the sofa, made me a cuppa, chatted and listened and stayed while I had a couple of hours sleep (clothed, on the sofa with him on the chair)...just so I wasnt alone.

He has been a big support so at the moment while he confuses me a bit at times, the positives of what I'm gaining from him being around (even just through text message) outweigh the negative feelings.

moolamoo Sat 15-Jun-13 14:32:01

meditrina - we split up a few weeks ago, he has been here twice in that time in a friendly capacity. He has been very honest in saying he cant see a future for us but doesnt know why, as I said in my last message he is still there when I need him but he has never tried sleeping with me, lying to me or anything like that.
I asked why he felt he cant be with me..as a musing rather than a desperate "whats wrong with meeeeee?" sort of way, lol, and he replied that he doesnt know, wishes he did.and wanted.space to work it out one way or the other.

sorry posting on phone hence typos.

MissMarplesBloomers Sat 15-Jun-13 14:44:28

Relationships should NOT be this much hard work.

Get out now & do yourselves both a favour!

eimihi Sat 15-Jun-13 14:45:21

How could the attraction be just physical, as he suspects is possible but not proven, but yet he claims that being in your company has made him happier than he ever has been? For God's sake!

He sounds like an arrogant, mixed up disaster area.
And he refused sex? A sign of true eccentricity in a man, bordering on madness!

If he's so helpful let him just be a friend who can comfort you... someone you can discuss any problems with your real boyfriends in the future.

meditrina Sat 15-Jun-13 14:46:06

"he can't see a future for us"

Which part of that isn't clear?

moolamoo Sat 15-Jun-13 14:48:09

meditrina - we split up a few weeks ago, he has been here twice in that time in a friendly capacity. He has been very honest in saying he cant see a future for us but doesnt know why, as I said in my last message he is still there when I need him but he has never tried sleeping with me, lying to me or anything like that.
I asked why he felt he cant be with me..as a musing rather than a desperate "whats wrong with meeeeee?" sort of way, lol, and he replied that he doesnt know, wishes he did.and wanted.space to work it out one way or the other.

sorry posting on phone hence typos.

amazingmumof6 Sat 15-Jun-13 14:50:36

erm, he sees no future and can't decide whether he loves you or hates you?!

and you want to be with him why?

my advice is LTB

TalkativeJim Sat 15-Jun-13 14:52:31

Silly arrogant drama queen who enjoys playing tortured soul games - you know, the kind of way a teenager tries to run their relationship because they think it makes them windswept and interesting.

He's an immature twat.

Dump!!

NeverBeenToMe Sat 15-Jun-13 14:54:23

Stop trying to figure it/him out. Tell him to take as many weeks as he likes - you will not be around at the end of it.

"Enough red flags to make bunting" gringringrin

FancyPuffin Sat 15-Jun-13 14:56:24

This sounds exactly like the Janny lover confused

moolamoo Sat 15-Jun-13 15:04:25

Talkativejim, I do agree its all quite over dramatic. As I say though I like to give people the benefit of the doubt and I do wonder whether he is going to dramatically exclaim "I cant do this anymore" next weekend or just go silent on me. Bound to be one of the two but thats my reason for not ending things totally just yet.

Wanted to work out his :-)

Somethingtothinkabout Sat 15-Jun-13 15:16:28

So you think he's either going to ignore you forever, or say he doesn't want you anymore.

And you're agonising over this man, why? Just dispatch him into orbit and move on. What age is he? He sounds about 17!

Helltotheno Sat 15-Jun-13 15:27:28

So hes always gone for looks before OP eh? You obviously don't even see the not so hidden insult in that.

But also you're not taking the consensus to dump him on board either so. . Good luck I guess.

He is a mind game player! Mumsnet had made me so capable of recognising them, for which I am so so grateful.
This man will fuck with your head, maybe even because he genuinely does not know what he wants.
But that doesn't matter, what matters is your own sanity and peace of mind, which will not go well if you carry on engaging with this man!

moolamoo Sat 15-Jun-13 15:33:34

No, how he actually worded it was that he has always gone for looks primarily an then tried to make the rest fit, thinking its love when its actually lust.

He was physically attracted to me at first and still is, but doesnt want to carry on seeing me 'just' in a physical way, he wants this week to work out why im in his head all the time; whether he misses me just in a physical way, or whether its more about missing seeing and talking to me...or indeed, if he misses me at all.

The strange thing is I've given him an 'out' so many times before and hes never taken them.

And im not agonising, I feel fine. Was just curious about what he thinks he might achieve in just 7 days is ll.

moolamoo Sat 15-Jun-13 15:35:36

maggie - and thats why I said I have no intention of contacting him now, unless he gets in touch first. Amd if he does, I wi need to really think about what he is saying and the best course of action to take.

Mintyy Sat 15-Jun-13 15:38:03

Am I totally missing the point?

You think a week apart would be useful so that you could start to go cold turkey?

Well why not go cold turkey from today and never see or speak to the arsehole again!

Where is your self respect? Tell him to FUCK RIGHT OFF!

CVSFootPowder Sat 15-Jun-13 15:38:06

He sounds like a janitor to me.
But giving the benefit of the doubt, OP, instead of tangling your head up thinking about what HE is doing and WHY HE is doing this, how about you change things?
Why not think about how all of this is making YOU feel..is this the sort of relationship you envisage for YOURSELF?
take the focus off him, and all of your emotional energy off him, because he sounds like an arsehole, and put it back onto you.

EllieArroway Sat 15-Jun-13 15:45:09

Sounds exactly like the Janitor to me too. Sorry.

EllieArroway Sat 15-Jun-13 15:46:33

Where is your self respect? Tell him to FUCK RIGHT OFF!

This. This. This.

That really is the very best advice anyone can give you.

Is there some reason why you don't think that you deserve better than this? Self-esteem issues?

moolamoo Sat 15-Jun-13 15:50:09

Well thats what I'm doing. Apart from posting on here of course :-)

I have deleted his number, call logs, messages etc.

As I said, this week will be used to get used to not being in contact with him so that if he doesnt contact me again I will already be used to the idea anyway.

Why does me posting this have to.mean im in emotion turmoil over it all, lol? I dont have a family to look after so on this otherwise boring saturday I was just curious as to what he thinms he might achieve with asking for this week 'to think' rather than just ending it outright which he didnt seem to want to do.

thats all, no drana just wondering.

Confuseddd Sat 15-Jun-13 15:52:56

New relationships shouldn't be this complicated. He sounds awful hard work.

moolamoo Sat 15-Jun-13 15:56:15

Fuck right off? well firstly it just isnt in my nature to say that, dont see the need.

Secondly, Im not crying into my pillow over this, he IS just a man after all.

Thirdly as I keep saying, I like to give people the benefit of the doubt as long as im not adversely affected (and I'm not, as he has been there for me as a friend and always will be)

Fourth; I would like to think that if I ever met someone that I thought might be totally right for.me but had a bit of a wobble as to whether my feelings were genuine or clouded by a fear of commitment or other issues, the person I liked would give mesome time to work it out and not just jump to 'ltb'.

justgivemeareason Sat 15-Jun-13 15:57:30

Yes this sounds just like the caretaker thread - off/on/on/off/ love/lust/he tries to get away/then stays the night/you analyse everything/don't listen to advice/go on and on and on.

Somethingtothinkabout Sat 15-Jun-13 16:01:15

But he doesn't think you might be right for him OP, nor is he right for you.

Come on, you need to wind your neck in. Don't be one of those people. Take control of the situation and don't just passively wait until he decides whether or not he can be arsed. Text him and tell him it's over and not to contact you again.

CVSFootPowder Sat 15-Jun-13 16:01:53

This isn't 'a bit of a wobble' OP. It's not like he's been great with you and then suddenly asked for some space.He's already done this before.
He's a headfuck. Feel free to continue with him if that's what you want from a relationship.

How's the tuck shop going these days?

CVSFootPowder Sat 15-Jun-13 16:02:59

just yes - the same - even down to the sex thing

Lweji Sat 15-Jun-13 16:07:30

Not sure if you're still reading it, but I wouldn't wait for him to get back in contact.
I'd send him a text telling him not to bother contacting you again.

Or wait until he does make contact, but then just send him off, regardless of what he says.

Why you would want to continue in such a roller coaster?

forumdonkey Sat 15-Jun-13 16:10:17

It's don't you want me janny all over again hmm

CVSFootPowder Sat 15-Jun-13 16:13:22

So pleased to see you Donkey grin
tbh it's worth going through it all again if it leads you to another excellent composition !

moolamoo Sat 15-Jun-13 16:18:16

Ok, why am I being compared to a Janitor? a few of you have said that now and I have no idea what youre all on about.

Lweji - the second option is closer to what I was planning on doing on anyway. As I said, he is deleted from my phone so only way i could contact him is if he texts me first. And if he does, I would definitely take a while to think about it before replying, and unless he said he had made.a huge mistake and did a complete turn around I doubt I would respond positively anywy.

Not sure why im being accused of not listening to advice though. I posted asking a specific question which wasnt should i be with him; it was can anyone explain his reasoning. So surely its no ones place to offer advice on.my situation, other than those who can answer my specific question.

moolamoo Sat 15-Jun-13 16:19:59

and no offence meant to anyone, its just I was musing on what might have been going on in his head when he said he needs (not wants) a week (very specific IMO) to think.

forumdonkey Sat 15-Jun-13 16:20:15

CVS call me psychic but I know what you and others are thinking and doing right now. You're all singing aren't you??!!!!

''Don't you want me Janny
Don't you want me Tucky
ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh'

gringringrin

forumdonkey Sat 15-Jun-13 16:23:23

moolamoo why would you want to be with someone who you argue with so bad you hate each other?

Get shut

CogitoErgoSometimes Sat 15-Jun-13 16:27:46

Personally I think anyone who trots out the 'I don't know if I love you or not' line... or anything approaching it.... is either very cruel or wasting your time or both. Life's far too short for that kind of crap.

Agree with the poster who said if he's telling you he's a fuck up, believe him.

I had an almost 5 year relationship/head fuck with a man like this who I should have run away from, screaming. My excuse was that I was very young. Please, please don't put up with this. You deserve so much better.

CogitoErgoSometimes Sat 15-Jun-13 16:30:01

BTW... motivations for behaving that way.

1. 'Playing hard to get'... speaks for itself
2. You're not the only woman in his life and he's trying to choose.

moolamoo Sat 15-Jun-13 16:30:56

We havent argued as such. It was more issues with families on either side causing tension (he isnt a doctor so my family dont think he is suitable, his family think mine are stuck up basically!).

And the hate thing, he says he could never hate me, what he meant was he doesnt know if what he is feeling is love, or just that he has ben used to being in touch with me so often and just fancies.me, like a teenage crush type thing. I get what he meant, as its how I feel too.

moolamoo Sat 15-Jun-13 16:33:35

cogito - trust me its not the second one, I know 100%

He never said he loved me though, that would be worse if he said it then took it back. Hes just saying hes not sure if its.more lust than true feelings.

CogitoErgoSometimes Sat 15-Jun-13 16:38:39

He doesn't know if what he's feeling is love? hmm Sadly, I've met a few too many of these emotionally illiterate types and, whilst all this tortured navel gazing might go down well in a Bronte novel, in real life it's a pain the fucking arse and gets very old, very quickly.

'Real men' I've decided don't need to work out how they feel about something. They have the courage of their convictions.

moolamoo Sat 15-Jun-13 16:53:30

I do agree with that cogito.

I'm sure I will get a long text message next weekend, telling me how sorry he is but cant go on hurting me, he hasnt thought about anything else all weekend etc etc poor me...

To which I will reply that I had been thinking the same thing, but decided to retain enough humility and dignity not to send such a aelf indulgant and arrogant text.

MorrisZapp Sat 15-Jun-13 16:54:35

In your op you say the conflicted feelings are due to how far you push him in arguments, making him infuriated.

Now you're saying its a love/lust dilemma?

Somethingtothinkabout Sat 15-Jun-13 17:00:17

Why not just text now?

And how do you know for sure it's not number 2 on Cog's list? You have no idea what he's up to this week, he could be up to anything. I assume you don't live together?

Lweji Sat 15-Jun-13 17:07:29

If he texts, don't engage on a reply.
Whatever he says, just say you're done.

moolamoo Sat 15-Jun-13 17:09:31

I didnt say that, or at least didnt mean it that way.

We have argued twice, both over the family thing. I am very forthright and hes more of a say nothing type. He is used to people more like him, that will drop an issue when he is a bit vague, whereas I keep pushing for a proper answer.

He says this is one of the things about me that he feels he needs in his life, someone who "will chalenge me and make me see where I am going wrong".

He then said that he doesnt know whether he cant get me out of his head and thinks about me all theime because he is madly love with me or hates.me...when i asked why he said hate, he said he didnt mean that, he just doesnt kbow how he feels as he swings from one extreme (wanting to bewith me) to the other (cant handle the confusion and wanting me out of his life) constantly, but when e tries to cut me out he feels like he just cant or doesnt want to, but doesnt know how i can be so under his skin where he thinks about me constantly and checks for texts off me as soon as he gets on his lunchbreak, but doesnt feel that core want to be with me long term.

moolamoo Sat 15-Jun-13 17:11:26

true, I just dont think he is that type, considering he could have slept with me last night but didnt, yet still shared the bed all night.

Lweji. Will consider it.

NutellaLawson Sat 15-Jun-13 17:19:28

this it's a technique used by men similar to 'negging' (worth googling as an eye opener). It is used to make you feel you good and bad all at once. you feel you could almost nearly have him if only you just worked a bit harder to convince him you're worth it.

This man is manipulating you. Run.

NutellaLawson Sat 15-Jun-13 17:20:54

oh, and his not sleeping with you is part of the technique.

TheNewSchmoo Sat 15-Jun-13 17:21:43

OK, so you don't want advice, you want to know what he is achieving by this behaviour. He is messing you about and keeping you warm. I suspect he doesn't really want to commit, but you are "handy".

My advice, although you don't want it, is to end it and keep it ended, I suspect however that you are as addicted to the dysfunction and drama as he is.

moolamoo Sat 15-Jun-13 17:29:29

Nutella no it wasnt like that. We did stuff....all focused on me, just not full sex. He also said that at least when we dont have sex he gets to touch and be close/kiss me for 4 or 5 hours rather than minutes. Lol.

I know i am sounding like im making excuses but some things people have said are just purely wrong.

He is over dramatic as i said, but i wont be ending things right now just because I want to see which way he plays things after the week he needed has ended.

EllieArroway Sat 15-Jun-13 17:30:04

I had a relationship along similar lines once. In my case, I was fed the "I love you but I'm not in love with you" line.

I was very, very young - he was much, much older. I took the Mills and Boon view that he was struggling with his feelings for me, and he was in turmoil.

Wrong. He wanted to carry on fucking me without getting any of the earache & demands I was throwing at him. It just took him a while to figure out whether the one was worth the other.

People are never confused by their feelings/in turmoil, scared of being in love bullshit - that's stories we tell ourselves so that we don't have to deal with rejection.

I don't think he wants you. Sorry.

CogitoErgoSometimes Sat 15-Jun-13 17:30:28

"he needs in his life, someone who "will chalenge me and make me see where I am going wrong"."

Bloody hell, how long has he been on the waiting list for a spine donor? hmm I can't decide if he's being manipulative or just pathetic but you're not responsible for his personal development, you're not his mentor or tutor and you're not his therapist ... Maybe get yourself a grown-up next time?

moolamoo Sat 15-Jun-13 17:36:45

Agree again Cogito :-)

I really do think he thinks he is in turmoil and its not a manipulation thing.

Hes very much the type to say "fix me" and call me his counsellor.

I DO have issues so I was very conflicted with my feelings for someone in the past, difference is I got counselling whereas he isnt bothering to try and 'fix' himself.

there are people who have always been in relationships for fear of being alone (I had a friend like that) and at some point they realise what theyre doing and make a conscious decision to be alone for a while. Before last night, this is what he said his decision was.

eimihi Sat 15-Jun-13 18:29:17

You said it was really just a casual question on a boring afternoon, simply wondering what was the purpose of his wanting a week away from you thinking about it.

Well, perhaps he doesn't want to get too emotionally involved with you? Perhaps he's been hurt before in some way and knows it can be dangerous to lose control? Perhaps he's really very selfish and just doesn't like the idea of maybe ending up getting deeper and deeper and eventually sharing his life with you and having to make compromises for any woman? Perhaps he doesn't feel that any woman is worth losing complete independence and freedom for, if it came to that? Perhaps he' was very content being a bachelor before he met you? Perhaps your financial situation concerns him? Maybe you've got little or no savings and he has? perhaps he isn't keen on spending money on you for going out on dates? Perhaps he feels inferior socially and isn't at all comfortable that he'd be a disappointment to your family?

Perhaps he has a very low sex drive and other than nice company at a time of his own choosing, preferably, women have never been that important to him? Perhaps he fears you could become very clingy and he finds that off putting because he never wanted a woman dependent on him. It's too much of a responsibility for his liking?

He must be saying to himself surely, "Can i live quite happily without this woman in my life? Or do I need her? Really though? But where would all my inner strength and self-sufficiency have gone if i were to start thinking I have to have her? I don't really need her, do I? She's going to be an added responsibility. My life is going to get hugely complicated and changed if i develop this relationship further. She seems quite keen, actually let me sleep with her, so she must be! Perhaps my not doing anything in bed with her will warn her that I have serious doubts that this is for me. I need time. I just need time to weigh up all this. If she'd just give me time on my own to work all this out."

I think he'll be weighing the pros and the cons very carefully of you in his life, intruding into it, so to speak, and will be trying to decide what is best for him, not you, him. Maybe he doesn't have any strong desire for any woman's love? Maybe he just isn't very emotional or needy at all and has some fascinating interests, and male friends that take up lots of his time.

He simply can't be very physically attracted to you if he could lie in bed with you, a woman he likes, and one whose body he hasn't explored and never had sex with (always a thrill for many a man!)... yet he could resist all this and not do anything? It's amazing! Did he not even get an erection of some sort by just being close beside you? Did he not even get aroused? If nothing else, he must have a low sex drive. I don't think this is at all usual for a man to be like that. You must have been shocked that nothing happened! Did you not feel insulted?

It sounds like he's just not really looking for a girlfriend particularly, doesn't really need one but you've appeared, a bit of a complication for him and he needs to think about it and all the implications of a relationship other than platonic friendship with you. He doesn't want rushed or swept off his feet emotionally by you or anyone. He wants logic and control in every region of his life. He wants to be his own man. He maybe feels that if he ever needs a girlfriend he'll be able to pick one up without too much difficulty.

None of this is very flattering or upbuilding for you. I'm sorry. But anyway, I'm obviously only guessing about his thoughts and might well be far wrong.

On a lonely afternoon I've tried to answer your exact question as honestly and as best I can. It's a case of puzzling out the thoughts that might be going on inside another person's head. Not very easy. Impossible, in fact.

So how do you feel about this? Would you really like a man to fall helplessly in love with you? And not be able to resist you? Don't you want romance of some kind? Rather than a man making calculations about how you might complicate his life?
Or are you not really that bothered about needing a man in your life? I just wondered.

BOF Sat 15-Jun-13 18:34:24

I'm guessing that this gets to 657 posts.

Which is about three hours of my life I will never get back. I might as well watch The Assassination Of Jesse James again.

RoooneyMara Sat 15-Jun-13 18:46:56

I would move on whatever he thinks...seriously, he just isn't worth it.

And I don't care if you are the other poster or not - assuming you're not, then just walk away. You don't have to stick around and wait for him to sort himself out.

He is messing you about big time - I know because I had one of these about 2 years ago, he kept saying, no future, bla bla bla and then wanting to shag me.

I got sick of it in the end and dumped him. He still tries to be 'friends' with me but he can get to fuck really - not because he's a twat but because I haven't got the energy.

moolamoo Sat 15-Jun-13 18:48:38

eimihi Well, no. I'm not fussed about having a man in my life.

He does want a relationship; what he calls a "24-7" relationship, or at least says he does.

Yes he was aroused, says he is whenever he is around me, always makes all these comments about how im the most beautiful woman hes ever seen or been with (I'm not), he just focused on me first and we both ended up too tired for full sex. we have had sex before though as we were seeing each other for quite a while.

He just keeps saying things along the lines of he keeps choosing people based on looks and it always ges wrong after a year or so, he needs to be alone for a while to work on himself so he is in the right place to meet someone for the right reasons, and needs to work out if he feels strongly because its a crush or something more.

But yes, could be just his way of letting me down gently or something.

RoooneyMara Sat 15-Jun-13 18:50:40

Well he obviously hasn't made his mind up yet at any rate.

I don't think he should expect you to wait for him to. I think you should say, actually a week is nothing - go away for at least a month and tHEN come back and see if I'm still here.

And meanwhile you go about your normal life, and take up some dates or whatever and just do your thing.

moolamoo Sat 15-Jun-13 18:51:26

rooneymara - and yes, if he was trying to sleep with me i would put him firmly in the twat category, but he says he cant. And refuses to even meet up until he works out how he feels about me, last night I initiated him staying over, he was ready for leaving until I kissed him & asked him to stay. Yes he could have still left but hey.

RoooneyMara Sat 15-Jun-13 18:52:45

Fwiw - how do you feel about him? Do you fancy him? Love him? Just think he's funny/interesting and willing to give it a go?

Because it doesn't sound like you are all that bothered.

RoooneyMara Sat 15-Jun-13 18:57:12

Oh sorry I didn't read the thread properly - I can see you answered that in the first few posts.

Hmmm...I would just let him do what the hell he likes for a week. or forever

It's not sounding like the love affair of the century, and that's how it should feel, if you are going to get it on properly.

Otherwise it is just playing out some issues on each other.

eimihi Sat 15-Jun-13 18:59:56

You should say, "A week's far too short really. Let's make it a month and see how we feel then. I may have moved on. Who knows? Not meant as a threat but honestly, I've just no idea what'll happen.
See you, maybe chat in a month. or so. Ok?"

See how he reacts to that! If you're not that bothered you can do this.

TondelayoSchwarzkopf Sat 15-Jun-13 19:04:29

Hmm. I've read the York Notes edition Wuthering Heights and I've read this thread. Wuthering Heights is much more interesting the Kate Bush song anyway.

He sounds like a manipulative twat, emotionally abusive and really not that into you. You haven't listened to anyone and show no signs of accepting this reality. I really hope you wake up to it for your own sake.

RoooneyMara Sat 15-Jun-13 19:16:15

I always wondered what Wuthering heights was about...a lot of wailing involved I think... not a great reader myself

moolamoo Sat 15-Jun-13 19:26:45

No signs of accepting it? All ive said is im curious as to whether i will get complete silence in a weeks time, or. a long 'poor me" text.
Ive said ive deleted all traces of him from my phone. How is that not accepting it? :-/

rooneymara - dont know tbh. As it stands now I think hes the sexiest person ever (looks and just general demeanour) and like spending time with him, but feel like when I get the 'its finally over' text week I wont exactly start sobbing like a banshee over it.

So.maybe I wasnt really that into him, either. shrugs

Somethingtothinkabout Sat 15-Jun-13 19:38:58

Well, now we know how this thread is going to go. Same, as the last, and the one before, and the one before that:

OP - Help me understand this man
MN - He's just not that into you
OP - I think he is, I'm not that bothered about him, I don't need a man
MN (x800)- Move on and don't waste anymore of your time
OP - No I think I'll keep flogging a dead horse and keep posting, talking about how I'm not that bothered but bombarding him with texts and when he tried to leave my house after dumping me I begged him to stay and hid his shoes so he couldn't leave, then he slept in my bed but couldn't have sex because he's nearly twice my age and has ED problems.

Lather, rinse, repeat.

I'm out thanks

But might come back for Donkey's next chart-topper.

moolamoo Sat 15-Jun-13 19:42:22

What?!

CVSFootPowder Sat 15-Jun-13 19:44:59

I'm waiting for Donkey again too.
I believe the last rendition was created with the help of a single small glass of wine.
As it's Saturday night, I'm hoping that donkey is planning to imbibe again grin
Yes Donkey, I have been humming the bastard tune as you predicted!

RoooneyMara Sat 15-Jun-13 19:55:51

Guys I don't know if she is the same person but I think it's a bit unfair to start suggesting she is, in case, yunno, she's not. Like last time when everyone thought it was me?

OP - there was a thread a bit like yours a few weeks ago so everyone thinks it's them again. It could be.smile But we don't know that so fttb benefit of the doubt.

moolamoo Sat 15-Jun-13 20:02:12

Well if you think I'm a janitor or shoe stealer or whoever else and you have nothing to offer in the way of advice, why not post on the other persons thread instead of mine?

RoooneyMara Sat 15-Jun-13 20:03:49

I hope you are Ok. Don't worry about it. MN is odd smile

moolamoo Sat 15-Jun-13 20:04:30

and fwiw, was browsing the threads earlier and there was one by purple something where they got accused of not listening to advice.

so how come no one is comparing me to or accusing me of being her?

RoooneyMara Sat 15-Jun-13 20:04:52

I have no idea.

NutellaLawson Sat 15-Jun-13 20:07:03

I'm with somethingtothinkabout. You are not listening. He isn't in turmoil about his feelings, you have bought into his (empty) flattery. you need to make yourself unavailable. Now. He is negging you. That makes him BAD NEWS.

eimihi Sat 15-Jun-13 20:29:12

I'm still trying to imagine you being in bed with a man who you describe as 'the sexiest person ever' and who claims to always feeling aroused when you're around him - yet he didn't make love to you.... just too damned tired, both of you. I have a job getting my head around that!

Surely one very tired person (--especially the male--) would have started something, just something, in spite of their fatigue?

'Tiredness' seems to be ruining people's lives here. Time to start eating spinach... or go to bed and just lie there forever...

piffpoff Sat 15-Jun-13 20:35:51

Ok I've not read very single message as I need to get off the iPad in a minute but it seems clear that you've had lots of advice. Which is to dump this loser and run for the hills, this is the kind of shit I got sucked into years ago when I was very young and didn't know any better.

It all boils down to the fact that if he really wanted a relationship he would not be behaving this way. He wants to keep you on the back burner just in case. You can take this advice or leave it, I suspect you will leave it, but I think it's really better to be on your own than hanging around waiting for someone to make up their mind about whether they want a relationship or not.

moolamoo Sat 15-Jun-13 20:37:31

Ok I really need to go into details, do I? It got to midnight, we had spent a couple of hours talking and kissing, we went to bed and started cuddling up, he kissed my neck, back etc, he then spent a while touching me (you know) and kissing me, that all took about 2 hours altogether with general exploring each others bodies, by then he was too physically tired and I was having trouble keeping my eyes open lol, and as I had to be up at 5 for work we slept. And then at 5am he started kissing me again when I woke up and was turned on again but I had to go have a shower.

Not that mystifying really?

CinnabarRed Sat 15-Jun-13 21:08:09

Two of them, like peas in a pod? Who'da thought?

eimihi Sat 15-Jun-13 21:20:26

Sorry, didn't mean to embarrass you! Not at all.

The only odd bit is that after two hours he wasn't up to high doh with excitement to have you, to go all the way.... rather than 'just too tired'.

Strange his adrenaline didn't kick in and give him super energy!

coffeeinbed Sat 15-Jun-13 21:24:36

It is mystifying actually.
Two hours of exploring and then falling asleep of tiredness?
LTB.

NutellaLawson Sat 15-Jun-13 21:50:03

The not having sex thing, yeah that is part of the pick up artist's repertoire and is one of the techniques to have you wriggling on a hook (he makes you feel great, makes it all about you, then backs out of actually having sex. So you think his feelings run deeper and he isn't just being a twat).

You want to know why he is doing the one week wait? - it's all part of being a PUA (pick up artist). I would lay money on this guy having joined the seduction community and learnt this stuff. From what you've said, his behaviour is just too textbook to be instinctive.

Helltotheno Sat 15-Jun-13 22:01:01

Everyone has advised you! You're fooling no-one with the whole 'see if I care' routine.. obviously you're desperately watching your phone 24/7 to hear from this guy. At least be honest with yourself if you're not going to be honest here.

He's pulling your strings. You're just making it so easy for him. Stop trying to second guess him and read his mind, just text him that it's over and move on already.

JulieMumsnet (MNHQ) Sat 15-Jun-13 22:32:03

We'd prefer it if you could report any concerns that you have to us rather then post them on a thread as you could be VERY wrong. wink

MNHQ

does this man glitter? Is this twilight?

because him being a vampire could explain a lot

coffeeinbed Sat 15-Jun-13 22:47:05

Well, him being an arse might explain even more things.

springytate Sun 16-Jun-13 00:47:33

oh dear GOD.

TELL HIM TO FUCK THE FUCK OFF!!!

AND FUCK OFF SOME MORE!!

TO THE FAR SIDE OF FUCK!!

WASTE OF SPACE WASTE OF SPACE WASTE OF SPACE

PULEASE don't put up with this shite for a second longer.

Tell him to volunteer for a space mission that orbits space for ever. then no-one will have to be exposed to this inexorable shit.

meditrina Sun 16-Jun-13 09:14:25

Not remotely mystifying.

He's seeing if his use of simple, well-known techniques do indeed turn you into an abject doormat who will put up with any only crap from him.

There is nothing unusual, special or unique about the simply dreadful behaviour he is showing.

You don't need to 'explain' this shittiness, just move away from it.

RinseAndRepeat Sun 16-Jun-13 16:11:54

His reasoning? He wants to hold all the cards, call all the shots and enjoy the satisfaction of keeping you dangling while he 'makes up his mind'.

He's not doing this to achieve any other purpose than getting a kick out of messing with your head. That's why it'll never stop and why he'll never change.

You do sound exactly like janitor lady. In which case I think you need a lot of help with your self esteem.

springytate Sun 16-Jun-13 20:52:09

I can't get out of my head that he fiddled around with you for 2 hours, didn't finish the deed; then revved up again a few hours later. When you were exhausted, having had little sleep.

And he's like this AT THE BEGINNING. I can't even imagine how bad he'd get further down the road.

I know I keep shouting but I am horrified at what he's doing. Doesn't it all have a kind of 'dead' feel to it to you? Doesn't it feel airless, no resonance somehow?

That fiddling around with you - and not actually delivering anything - is very probably a metaphor for the theme in your relationship. ie he messes with your head endlessly, until you're gagging and half dead. Even then, he doesn't deliver.

too, too awful sad

TiffanyAtBreakfast Mon 17-Jun-13 11:53:32

Go and buy 'He's Just Not That Into You'. Please. In my opinion having 'breaks' is a complete and utter waste of time and is really just an excuse for people to go and have a quickie with someone else while maintaining the security of running back to their relationship.

TiffanyAtBreakfast Mon 17-Jun-13 11:55:20

Also I can't believe you would stick around for someone who can't work out whether they even like you very much. Leave him and don't give him the satisfaction of deciding.

bouquetdiva Fri 21-Jun-13 20:40:19

OP - Just wondered what happened after your week's break?

ilikecooking Fri 21-Jun-13 21:27:29

I am wondering what's happened too....

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