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I am right to say no to this aren't I?

(67 Posts)
Mollymom Wed 01-May-13 19:33:59

Exdp and I have been separated a month now. He hasnt yet moved out and dd doesnt onow anything yet. Exdp wants to take dd camping this weekend with him and ow. I do not think this is a good idea at all and want to say no. Am I right? The thought of this gives me a huge amount of anger. They willbe playing happy families I think

Lweji Wed 01-May-13 19:38:53

The OW being there, I'm afraid you'll have to get used to it at some point. Sorry. sad

But, then he should tell your DD what is going on. ASAP.

Can you put pressure on him to move out, if he's playing happy families on weekends?
maybe even pack his belongings this weekend?

BitOutOfPractice Wed 01-May-13 19:40:50

Hmmm. I think it's MUCH too soon to introduce the OW. How dos he plan on explaining to DD who the OW is?

How old is your DD OP?

Hope you're OK - it all sounds very upsetting

Mollymom Wed 01-May-13 19:44:06

Dd is 5. The plan is to tell her just before he moves out to hopefully reduce any confusion. Dd has never met ow up to now.

BreasticlesNTesticles Wed 01-May-13 19:45:31

It's bloody dreadful!

Your dd needs to adjust to you two being apart. Then, he can introduce the OW. How confused will she be to see her father with someone else?!

He is clearly a knob.

wellcoveredsparerib Wed 01-May-13 19:45:34

no,no,no! completely inappropriate and really confusing for her.

I think you dd needs to meet the ow before a camping trip this weekend. I personally think she needs to have met her a few times beforehand and she'll be extremely confused especially if she doesn't know about her parents not being together anymore.

OhHullitsOnlyMeYoni Wed 01-May-13 19:46:36

I think it would be very silly to just expect her to be fine with it and go off with a woman she has never met!
You need to explain this to him.

Mollymom Wed 01-May-13 19:48:11

My thought exactly. How is he going to explain ow being there but not me? They are bound to be affectionate in front of her too arent they?

Too soon and your dd doesn't even no her yet.
I would say no and keep it that way until this ow is a permanent fixture in your dd life.
You only separated a month ago, this woman might not be long term.

He's a bit of a tit tbh and clearly thinking of himself rather than his dd!

Mollymom Wed 01-May-13 19:50:55

Am hoping she is not permanent but suspect I will be wrong. she is half his age. Dreading if they have kids :'(

Why hasn't the twat moved out yet?

OhHullitsOnlyMeYoni Wed 01-May-13 19:51:34

Nail on head choccy

He is a complete and utter selfish dicksplash. Disrespectful to you and your dd and not really fair on the ow either not that I give a shit about that

That said I'm not really sure how you can stop him sad I assume he has parental responsibility gor her, and as such can make decisions about her too.

Do you think if you explained why its such a bad idea he would bin his stupid plan.

What a nightmare for you, have you got plenty of rl support thanks

Mollymom Wed 01-May-13 19:54:35

He hasnt moved out yet cos the place he and ow are going to is not available til the end of may-the financing of that may be a while other thread tbh. He did suggest asking his parents if he could go there but he doesnt seem to have done that.

Ahhhcrap Wed 01-May-13 19:55:44

It's selfish and way too soon IMO

scaevola Wed 01-May-13 19:55:48

DD is going to have to meet OW. But I think on a camping trip before the separation is fully effected is far too much, far too soon.

Mollymom Wed 01-May-13 19:56:28

Am hoping he will see sense but he can be very pig headed

ilovepicnmix Wed 01-May-13 19:57:08

Completely right to say no. Crazy idea. Totally unfair to your daughter.

CharlieUniformNovemberTango Wed 01-May-13 20:00:59

Crazy crazy idea.

Yes the OW may stick around and be introduced at some point but it's very very unfair to throw your DD into a full weekend in cramped conditions with someone she doesn't know.

She could find the whole thing so unsettling but have no chance to back away from it in a tent!

If he is serious about being with OW he needs to consider your DD's needs over his own "happy family" fantasy.

Spending time with your dads new partner should never be started like this.

What a selfish man sad

overtheraenbow Wed 01-May-13 20:03:19

I would say no you are not happy, I spoke to my sol and she told me although I can't stop it I can object. I told my exp this last weekend and told him I objected and wanted it written for future reference . This seemed to make him a bit nervous ( perhaps I had more information about it as he is representing himself and doesn't have solicitor to advise him legally as he is tight as well as arrogant
Eventually after some pressure from me saying i assumed he was goin to ask the chn if they were 'willing to neet her' and IL's he relented and actually asked the kids who told him they did not want to meet her .
You could try the same. Though you may have to tell her first .
I agree it is rushing her op but he's doin it to make life easier for himself and her and validate the ow existence. My exh is doing it with all of his family too.

Squitten Wed 01-May-13 20:14:47

Typical self-centred twat. He has his new life all ready so he'll just shoe-horn his daughter into it without any thought to her needs or feelings. Perfect.

Definitely say no

Mollymom Wed 01-May-13 20:21:32

Thank you all. Will try to explain it to him prob from dds view point. Fingers crossed eh.

PurpleThing Wed 01-May-13 20:26:52

dd needs to get used to the idea that you two are no longer living together before she is introduced to anyone else. Different people recommend different timescales, varies between 6 mo and 2 years ime. And I would think it is best to build it up gradually not a whole weekend in a tent together (is it even one of those ones with separate bedrooms...?)

It's part of glossing over any guilt and difficulties he's caused by expecting everyone to jump into what he wants. Sorry you are having to deal with this.

Skinnywhippet Wed 01-May-13 21:40:47

Half his age!?

Walkacrossthesand Wed 01-May-13 22:07:22

Emphasise that this is not about you objecting to OW meeting DD and being part of her life - you accept that through gritted teeth with lots of deep breaths. It's about handling the disclosure to DD that her parents are splitting up, which needs to be done sensitively, and the introduction of OW definitely happens after DD has been told, and in a gentle, phased way. This is going to blow her world apart and he needs to acknowledge that and do whatever he can by way of damage limitation. Tosser.

eatmydust Wed 01-May-13 23:19:05

It is much too soon. Please don't be rushed into telling DD you are separating either just so he can take her away for the weekend with OW.

He needs to understand that his priority is his DD.

Mollymom Thu 02-May-13 00:05:50

Fairly big discussion had. Apparently I am having it all my own way and stopping him from seeing dd! He said he hardly sees her now as it is when I suggested a gradual introduction to ow...He has agreed not to take her this weekend but he wants to tell dd next weekend and then begin introducing ow from then in preparation for them moving in together on 25th may.

Mollymom Thu 02-May-13 00:06:52

Skinny-yeah he is 43 she is 22.

Hissy Thu 02-May-13 00:13:02

DD is 5.

She can't handle all this information at once FGS.

It's not all YOUR own way, he's thinking with his DICK. he needs to leave it until a good couple of months after he moves to tell her about the OW, and then gradually do meet ups.

She is your DD, and his. If he fucks this up, he will damage her emotional development. I don't care how twatstruck he is, this is his little girl.

AgnesBligg Thu 02-May-13 00:14:01

Utterly bizarre. How can he think this a sensible idea? Just no.

Honestly, some people.

Mollymom Thu 02-May-13 00:20:26

Wish someone could get this in his head. He is very pigheaded and if its not his idea then it must be wrong. What can I do to limit any problems for dd?

SirRaymondClench Thu 02-May-13 08:00:23

Kick his arse out of the house and let DD get used to you two not being together for quite a while before even thinking about introducing her to his new bit of stuff.
What a selfish bastard! Men that do this aren't doing it 'for the kids' they are doing it to validate their new relationships. He doesn't give a fuck about DD in this scenario its all about his OW and him.
Absolutely do not let him take DD camping with this woman this weekend, it will screw her head up!

Walkacrossthesand Thu 02-May-13 08:20:19

Hang on a minute - he's in a new relationship but living in the family home until ... it's convenient ie when he can move in with OW?? shock How did that come about? Why hasn't he left to live somewhere else until he & OW move in together? Where do you fit in to all this?

Mollymom Thu 02-May-13 09:00:54

He wont move out. He said last night he will not go to his parents. All my fault he isnt seeing much of dd at the moment even tho he has been canping every weekend and is out every night

SundaysGirl Thu 02-May-13 09:10:58

Well thats just ridiculous. If he is still living at home how can he possibly not be seeing his daughter unless he is choosing to spend his time elsewhere?

Walkacrossthesand Thu 02-May-13 09:25:37

I do hope you aren't doing his washing for him...If he's out/away half the time anyway (with OW one presumes), why doesn't he get one of those 'city-break apartment ' places - rent one of those for a few weeks? It's simply outrageous that he's openly 'switched relationships' while still living with you - how did that happen?

Mollymom Thu 02-May-13 09:30:29

Not doing his washing or cooking any food for him. He has hardly been in the house other than to shower and change for a long time really so obviously my fault he hasnt seen dd much!

ladyjadie Thu 02-May-13 09:52:18

This is awful behaviour on his part. Did you separate because he cheated, or did this OW come into the picture after?

If he cheated and still thinks he can live with you while flaunting his new relationship that is disgusting. Disgusting! Is there a reason you can't chuck him out? (no idea of legal stuff)
He is being a selfish cunt. I think you are being entirely reasonable not letting your DD go camping with him and her. Too confusing, especially when he's still living with you.

Unfortunately as he is obviously such a self-absorbed wanker it's probably like banging your head against a brick wall to try to make him understand that.

LineRunner Thu 02-May-13 10:01:19

What a twat.

Stick to your guns on this, OP. He is off his head on a heady combination of selfishness and lust mania (sorry) and sadly you will have to do his share of the caring about DD's welfare for a while.

You were right to say no.

Kick this bastard out!

Your daughter needs time to adjust to you being apart. I assume he will introduce her to ow on the 25th when they move in together so he needs to be out the house now so your dd has a chance to accept whats happened before then.

You ex is a twunt of the absolute highest order, I'd leave his stuff in the garden, lock the doors (leaving keys in so he cant gain access) and relax.

Where he goes is not your problem.

Mollymom Thu 02-May-13 11:21:38

The relationship with ow started before we separated. We werent particularly happy anyway but I thought things could have been worked at. I posted another thread last week about him going shopping for stuff for his new place with ow when I am still waiting for him to sort out a new windiw fir dds room-he wants a mate to do it-been waiting for this since september!

Lweji Thu 02-May-13 11:41:21

Change the locks on this twunt and let him argue this in court.

He is not really living there anyway. It seems that he's just making a point.

Im just shocked youre letting him use you in this way! How are you supposed too deal with the end of the relationship and move on when he keeps popping back? In his head he has already left you and your dd sad

Change the locks, ring csa and start explaining whats happening to your dd before she has to go have overnights with the ow. He is taking advantage of you

DameFanny Thu 02-May-13 12:29:41

Is it worth pointing out to him that DD is most likely to be really angry with him if it's made plain to her that he's ditched you for someone else? Worth appealing to his self-interest, since he has so much of it?

Mollymom Thu 02-May-13 14:32:12

I think he will find someway of making it my fault like I have primed dd or something!

AndTheBandPlayedOn Thu 02-May-13 14:58:10

Molly, imho, he is using your niceness against you. At this point, why on earth do you give a s#!t what he thinks regarding "you getting it all your way"? He is clearly projecting his position on you (he is the one having everything his own way) to try to stop you in your tracks so he can go on having everything his own way. Stop falling for that manipulative mechanism...today.

Give him a choice this weekend: he can not go shagging camping and move his stuff out, or you will move his stuff out for him...and that'd be in bin bags in the front yard for him to pick up on his return. And change the locks.

Imho, you will need to tell your dd. He obviously Isn't going to do it. It sounds like he was just going to throw dd and ow together and let the small child "figure it out for herself". angry on your behalf.

KBabs Thu 02-May-13 16:10:19

Even from a devil advocate opposing position I doubt the OW (from their perspective) would be impressed to be put in the situation of this either.
I am mindful of and appreciate this "lens" is not a perspective either for OP or her DD concern but does form part of the current landscape.

OP I hope it works out for you and your DD sounds like you will be well shot of him and hopefully move your lives onto higher quality relationships you both deserve. Having myself had a father demonstrating similar behaviour with a number of OW when I was a young child, I can assure you kids can see through this woeful behaviour, not that I am wishing it on them IYKWIM.

<Big hugs>

Fleecyslippers Thu 02-May-13 17:02:46

Typical behaviour of an cheating wanker. And he won't change his attitude despite any reservations that you have because he and OW are selfish, self centered and think that the sun (and your DD) revolves around them and their new found 'lurve affair' hmm

The best thing that you can do is raise any concerns that you have in a calm and consistent way with specific examples of how his actions might affect your daughter. How confused and bewildered she will be and how adding OW into the mix so soon is the most selfish and idiotic thing ever (Don't say idiotic to him though cos that makes you the spiteful EX wink
I would force the issue of telling your DD NOW. Why is everything on his terms ? (Actually I already know the answer to that)
Your little girl is already bound to sense that things are not quite right. I would tell her as soon as YOU feel comfortable doing so because you are the one who will be left drying her tears while he fucks off into the sunset.

And after the initial upset, the best thing for you to do is continue to be the centre of her world, the solid, dependable base who is consistent and secure.

One day at a time OP - you WILL get through this but you need to get some control back over yours and DDs lives. He is an arsehole of the highest order sad

Please everyone bear in mind that she cannot throw him out of the house if he refuses to leave. A person cannot be forced out of a house that they own, or co-own, for adultery without a drawn out legal process (ie an agreement to sell the house and divide the proceeds). I know it's a really shit situation to have to put up with, but given that he has announced his intention to move in a month or two the OP's best option really is to put up with it until then.

However WRT this camping trip, glad you have put a stop to it Molly as it would have been very distressing for your DD to be stuck in a tent with a woman she doesn't know at all and no sign of you.

YOur best bet now is to get some legal advice WRT maintenance, access etc. This man is going to put his own interests first, all the time, so it's a good idea to be fully informed of your rights, DD's rights and his responsibilities, because you can't trust him to tell you the truth about anything.

OhHullitsOnlyMeYoni Thu 02-May-13 17:09:02

Is the trouble that you feel by telling DD you are making it 'real' OP?

Mollymom Thu 02-May-13 18:00:10

Thank you everyone. After complaigning he isnt getting to see much of dd he is still going camping with ow for the whole weekend! Me and dd have got lots of lovely thingd planned with friends so she wont notice him being gone. We do joint own the house. Have already completed a tax credit claim and told him how much maitainence I need. He doesnt want csa involved but if he doesnt pay I can then go down that route. Will tell dd next week and let her teacher know. Dont think ge has thought of that kind of stuff

OhHullitsOnlyMeYoni Thu 02-May-13 18:03:18

Well done, you have sorted that out well.
He isn't thinking using much above the waist atm so sadly a lot of the practicalities may well be left to you. Hope DD copes well with the news x

Walkacrossthesand Thu 02-May-13 18:51:59

This may be premature but, with my crystal ball, and mindful of the big age gap, I foresee a fairly rapid deceleration of their lurve orbit once real life gets in the way - at which point he will likely come crawling back sobbing that he wants his family life back.... I do hope you will be able to remember, at that point, how little heed he's paying you and DD now - it's as if you no longer exist, isn't it!! - and keep your door firmly closed. Then brace yourself for the venom of a man spurned, because of course none of this will be His Fault.

Skinnywhippet Thu 02-May-13 21:15:01

Gosh he's stereotypical. What does she see in him? Is she prepared for a step daughter?

OhHullitsOnlyMeYoni Thu 02-May-13 21:21:13

She probably thinks he is house trained and older=wiser. She has no doubt been fed a pack of 'woe is me' bull by him and thinks all he needs is a good woman. Of course, it will be the OW who is at fault (as in OP). She is too young to have come across this man before; she should be running for the hills. She will learn.

Mollymom Thu 02-May-13 21:52:38

No idea what she sees in him but perhaps she is after some kind of father figure-ex alluded to something bad happening to her. Think he probably has fed her a long line of me not understanding him type stuff. Hope it doesnt last long. I would never have him back whatever happebs tho.

SabrinaMulhollandJjones Thu 02-May-13 22:00:44

Too soon, definitely.

SabrinaMulhollandJjones Thu 02-May-13 22:04:29

Ooops - sorry didn't notice there was a page2&3 to this thread! Hope you and dd have a nice weekend together.

IneedAsockamnesty Fri 03-May-13 00:53:36

Solidgold.

People sling their partners stuff out the door loads,it happens its a fairly usual reaction to cheating or other such behaviours it only becomes an issue if the other party takes them to court.

Not a good tactic for a provable abusive person to try because that's classed as another incident of DV but for a perfectly reasonable none abusive person who has come to the end of her teather due to OW being flaunted and the total lack of consideration towards her dd's emotional well being it would be considered not a abnormal response.

Certain types of people tend not to bother with occupation orders because they imagine they cost thousands take months and in the absence of actual physical violence are unlikely to be obtained but lets hope he never learns they cost 70 quid and get issued for more reasons than violence

PurpleThing Fri 03-May-13 03:08:41

SoldGold is right though. If he starts to make a scene when he comes "home" and finds the locks changed and the police get involved they will say that she has no right to bar him from his home. This was my experience even though stbxh was actually renting somewhere else already, he still had a claim on our marital home for a long period (a year I think). And that kind of scene is going to be very distressing for OP and dd AND give ex the ammunition of The Police being on his side.

OP, "you get everything your own way" is clearly a laughable accusation when he is having an affair and taking so little responsibility. Please do not listen to his attacks against your character. Please consider what is in your dd's best interest and try to enforce that.

Have you thought about mediation? It can be difficult with someone who is manipulative so don't stick with it if he is being a nightmare. But it can help to make him justify how his actions benefit dd to an unbiased by-stander. What do his parents think?

Please also get legal advice.

Mollymom Fri 03-May-13 06:56:47

His parents know we have split but not sure if they know about ow. They are fairly old so wouldnt want to distress them by bringing them into it. They are supportive tho. Getting legal advice is a good idea. Will look into that next week. Hadnt thought that he was being manipulative but he is! I feel like I am starting to see the real him now.

IneedAsockamnesty Fri 03-May-13 09:18:54

It would be unusual for the police to do anything other than say it. Because they mostly go down the its a civil route line.

And in reality they cannot force you to let someone in unless that person has a court order they have no powers what so ever to make you let the other person in.

IneedAsockamnesty Fri 03-May-13 09:24:03

Of course I'm not actually advocating that anyone do that. And I would always say to anyone who asked me anything from a legal angle 'go see a solisiter'

Sockreturningpixie: yes, people throw their partners' belongings into the garden and tell them never to come back but this will only work if the unfaithful partner accepts the punishment. If s/he knows his/her rights and simply refuses to leave, then changing the locks won't stop him/her calling a locksmith and changing them again. If there is no court order to keep an unfaithful partner out, then s/he can break a window or force a door to get into the home; it's not a crime to break into your own home.

simplesusan Fri 03-May-13 19:04:25

So you have been separated for a month and your ex has already made plans to move in with another woman! Good God what a total shit.

I personally wouldn't be so accomodating.

I would be telling him to leave and not making life at all easy.

No your dd should not be meeting let alone going away with the ow.

Tell him no.

Tell him to go and fuck himself.

Go to a solicitor and get some good, solid legal advice.

Take care of yourself and dd.

Then later on down the line come back and celebrate with us and we will all do a merry gig with you, rejocing at how much better your life has become without this manchild.

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