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Dh wants to talk-think it might spell the end.

(312 Posts)
houseworkhater Thu 04-Apr-13 15:40:04

Have been together 20 years with 3 dcs.

Most people view us as being well suited and happy together.
Anyhow last year dh said he might leave. I was at my wits end. he said he basically wanted more sex and the house to be tidier.

I ran myself ragged upping the anti. I was literally following the dcs around moving everything in sight endlessly cleaning, throwing things away all to make it easier for me to keep this very tidy house.

After a time I began to think fuck this.
I went away for a few days with 2 dcs and when I came back the house was in a right state. Ds, who stayed at home, immediately said he was starving. Dh was in the pub. I asked dh to come home. He didn't, when he did I asked him to leave as this time I was the one who laid down my demands.

I told dh to stop going out so much and start and put his family first. He stopped going out as much and really made an effort.
We stayed together and have talked things through.
We have both tried to make more time for each other etc.

It is hard as dh is having to work very long hours and is always tired. On top of this he has joined a band. The money does come in handy but the trouble is none of the band have children, only one is married and they are all much youinger than him. He told them that he won't play every weekend but it seems to be taking over. He has told me that one of the band has offered to let him stay at his if we do split up.

I think dh might take him up on the offer!

I am so mad. I know he feels that sex is virtually non existant but he is either in bed before me, tired or out with the bloody band and then I am asleep when he returns.

I really want to make it work. the dcs have no idea that anything is wrong.

Any advice?

Thanks.

MadAboutHotChoc Thu 04-Apr-13 15:56:22

This has all the hallmarks of an affair.

He has checked out of the marriage, is spending lots of time away from the family, picking petty fights, being critical, selfish and entitled. Also the fact that sex is non existent suggests he is getting his sexual thrills elsewhere sad

houseworkhater Thu 04-Apr-13 16:07:40

Mad- thanks for replying. I really hope that isn't the case. We are going to talk again when he gets in.
I really don't know what else to do though.

Finola1step Thu 04-Apr-13 16:21:13

But house what do you want? He isn't the only one who gets to decide if it's the end. What do you get out of this marriage? What do you want from this marriage?

Sounds like he wants his cake, to eat it and for you to then clear up his crumbs.

Sorry but I'm with Mad on this one.
And.....!!!! he said he basically wanted more sex and the house to be tidier.
Seriously!??? Well then, why can't he tidy the house????
Right now, he's sounds like a waste of space.
How much better off are you with him???
How much worse off would you be without him???
You don't seem to even want to have sex with him.

CogitoErgoSometimes Thu 04-Apr-13 16:51:46

"I really want to make it work"

But he doesn't. He's just happy to have you running around scared he'll go and, in the meantime, do whatever the hell he pleases. It's a big win-win as far as he's concerned.... I think you should take the initiative and dump him before he dumps you. 10-1 this 'band member' with the spare room is female...

MadAboutHotChoc Thu 04-Apr-13 16:54:12

Take control and tell him you deserve more than this. You do not have to take this shitty behaviour lying down.

houseworkhater Thu 04-Apr-13 16:58:14

I did tell him that he would have to do more around the house as I already do more than 50%.

I do want to spend more time with him and do want sex with him.

I want us to be a family and enjoy doing things together.
I admit that sex has died off and maybe that is partially down to me but I have felt angry with him and wanted him to be there for me.

I don't expect us to be together every waking hour and am fine with him being in the band up to a point.

At the moment I don't know what to feel. Angry and resentful also wanting to make the marriage work.

Annielove Thu 04-Apr-13 16:59:13

Felt i had to reply, i too had almost the same situation with my husband after 4 children and 20 yrs of marriage. He too was in a band, it spelt disaster for us, he became even more arrogant and i found myself running around trying to please him. He would do gigs, talk to lots of females, take numbers etc etc. Horrible horrible situation. I completely lost myself trying to keep him happy. He is now dating a 26yr old , he is 47. I really hope you will be able to say enough's enough rather than hang on to the bitter end like i did. Think about your happiness always. Good luck.

MadAboutHotChoc Thu 04-Apr-13 17:01:40

Has he tried to improve things?

Is he suggesting ways of spending time together?

Probably not.

I am not surprised you do not want to have sex with a selfish entitled and distant man.

juneau Thu 04-Apr-13 17:03:45

It takes two to make a marriage work and it sounds like you're prepared to put in the time and effort - but is he? If he is, then dumping the band would be a start. Marriage counselling might help too. And a holiday or even a weekend away where you two can spend a bit of time together and perhaps get the mojo back in your marriage. I think he needs to be honest here though as a starting point - does he want to work at this or not? Because if he wants out and has already mentally left, you're going to be flogging a dead horse.

How old are DCs, OP? Could they help around the house a bit more, rather than you following them around, tidying up after them (obviously not if they are: 2, 1 & a few weeks old - hence my 1st question!)

Ask him what investment he feels he's making in the marriage.

houseworkhater Thu 04-Apr-13 17:06:15

I'm feeling resentful right now. I told him this last time.
I am the one who has spent more time looking after the kids. He has carried on going out, sure we have done lots of things together but he has had a good wife as far as i am concerned.

He thinks I moan too much about money but that was one of my concerns before. I am the one who thinks of saving,he thinks for today.
He has put doubt in my head again by saying things aren't right again for him.
I know he has spoken to a friend before and he told him to put up with it! Not in so many words but that his life is good and what is he moaning about.

I am feeling ill thinking about it now.

StoicButStressed Thu 04-Apr-13 17:18:52

Not surprised you're feeling resentful house - I would be steaming, never mind just resentful (tho yes, would be a shitload of that too).

What time are you having his deigned little 'chat'?

Here's my advice - go look in the mirror (literally) and see yourself/who've you've become (in every sense from physical to pyschological to your own goals and aspirations etc etc.)

Ask YOURSELF if all you see matches who you recall yourself being (apart from the obv one of all of us a year older each year, though DO include self-care etc)?

Then ask yourself what you would say to your daughter/sister/neice/best friend if THEY were in YOUR position? My guess is that l'il voice we all have in our heads and our gut instincts will give you more answers than we can.

But we WILL be here to help ok? Big un-MN hugs from me to you xx

(and a sharp kick up arse of middle aged man struggling to re-find his youth and not having his family as no.1 in his world).

CogitoErgoSometimes Thu 04-Apr-13 17:23:23

Don't feel ill. Stand up for yourself and don't accept any more criticism. Don't think much of your friend having to tell him to 'put up with' you.... hmm Up your standards...

FunnyWords Thu 04-Apr-13 17:24:56

Sounds like my dh, apart from the band thing, as when ever we argue or these "talks" come up, it's always about sex / housework!

I don't really have anything to say that will help but I hope you are ok!

houseworkhater Thu 04-Apr-13 17:32:26

I just feel so depressed when I was beginning to feel happier.
I did think the sex thing would rear it's head again.

My dd1 has even said that she hasn't seen her dad for a while. She was out till late last night though.

I think the band are an issue as he isn't as young and carefree as any of them.

I will have to tell him this.

In the past I have told him that I must feel he puts me and the kids first. part of the sex issue I think has been because I have felt let down and that no, I haven't felt loved and wanted enough. I hope that makes sense.

My dcs are 16, 14 and 10 so not young.

he accused me last time of shouting too much at them. This made me shout at him! I've told him to bloody well help more then and stop leaving me to do it. He was shocked so i told him that in the past I had felt let down, he should have been around more to muck in.

this all sounds bad. he is a good dad. Runs around after the kids etc but I do feel like I have done the majority of the hard work.

Want to try and stay calm when we talk and loose it again.

juneau Thu 04-Apr-13 17:34:46

Joining a band and wanting to hang out with a bunch of guys younger than yourself = classic mid-life crisis. Is that what all this is about - his MLC? It certainly sounds like it.

Tortington Thu 04-Apr-13 17:35:50

do you work and have outside interests?

( i think your dh is being very selfish, and it sounds a bit like a little boy wanting a lollipop)

I think you need to wait until he tells you what he wants to talk about. In the meantime think about what you want and tell him this. Then take it from there. We don't know at this point what he is feeling.

CogitoErgoSometimes Thu 04-Apr-13 17:37:47

MLC my arse.... it's just selfish behaviour and if there isn't a woman on the horizon I'd be very surprised. Threats to leave, demands for a tidier house, accusing the OP of shouting, having a 'band member' to go stay with. He's making himself as horrible as possible so that the OP says 'get out' and he can then sob into his pint with his band/OW that 'the wife doesn't understand me'....

Hopasholic Thu 04-Apr-13 17:38:33

Do some digging before he comes back to 'talk'

How's he going to manage working full time and playing at being the next Bono when you tell him he'll be having his DC's 50% of the time? (even if you have no intention of this being the case)

I'd err on the side of 'this is your chance to tell me the truth' because this really does sound like the typical 'midlife crisis aka met someone else'

So sorry if this is not the case but please do be prepared.

houseworkhater Thu 04-Apr-13 17:39:13

Cog- it wasn't said quite like that. I think what he meant was that it was a very small price to pay to stay in what he thinks is essentially a good marriage. His friend said that no relationship is perfect.

I told him before that he either did more housework or he got the kids to do it as I am sick and tired of asking/nagging them.

I also pointed out that as I do approx 80% of the housework including all the gardening and decorating, then I won't be doing any more. so that was his choice either he does more or he gets the kids to do it.

I also work as well.

He has said before that he thinks he jas a problem.

Mumsyblouse Thu 04-Apr-13 17:40:48

Whatever it is, it's unlikely to be something you want to hear, why make an appointment with your wife to discuss things (only men who have something to say do this).

I would get yourself into a calm state so that whatever he has to say, you don't immediately react. His demands about the house are ridiculous, even his friends know that, and you feel unloved and unwanted- how is he going to fix any of that?

My guess is that he is going to say that he wants out, and my second guess is that he will say there is no-one else but actually being in the band has given him a new set of possibilities and he's being a twat in a mid-life crisis.

I might be wrong, but it's very unlikely he wants to talk about who is mowing the lawn next week.

however much you fight it, you cana't fight against someone in this mind-set, the best thing to do is listen, absorb and then wonder what is going to be best for you, not for him because he is prioritising his own feelings, you need to prioritise yours and the childrens.

best of luck

NaturalBlondeYeahRight Thu 04-Apr-13 17:43:48

I might be stupid, but what about calling his bluff? Right now. End it first, if he wants it to end then you keep your self respect, if he realises what he has lost and that the grass isn't always greener, then you get to make him work bloody hard to win you back.
Your rules this time!
It does sound like he is checking out of the relationship at the moment.

houseworkhater Thu 04-Apr-13 17:44:22

Hopa- that is exactly it.

I told him last time, when i was shouting, that noone else would put up with this crap.

When he mentioned leaving before I told him that he will have to have the kids overnight at least one night.

I don't think the thought had even entered his head, he is so used to me being there.

I have thought of it today that he will have to have them on a weekend and it would cock up his band.

Although I'm not sure if the eldest 2 would go, I have no idea.

i have to sign off now. Got to go out.

Will keep you updated.

lunar1 Thu 04-Apr-13 20:50:22

Hope things are going ok op.

houseworkhater Thu 04-Apr-13 23:11:20

We have had a talk.
Dh has said he doesn't think he wants to be married anymore.

There isn't much I can say to that.
He said it is a mixture of things, not enough sex, me arguing with the kids, the house not being as tidy as he would like it.
He admits that I do a lot of housework, but says I do all the same things, citing that he knows I: do the washing, drying, ironing, putting away of all laundry. Clean the bathroom, clean the en-suite, clean all toilets, clean the floors, sort the kids out, do the dishwasher, do all the decorating, gardening. Apparently this is not enough.

He also thought that even though he is out with the band or is tired because of his day job, that I should make opportunity to have sex.

I really don't know what to say.

I feel sick.
He has defended his time with the band.

I have told him that I have bent over backwards to accomodate his time with the band.

He began to say that he has also had a hard time, begrudges having to hand over money for things. his mates think it is appalling that I should ask him to pick up some milk and bread on his way home from work, I wasn't working that day so I should have done it.

He has gone to bed and I could go up but is there a point.

He has said that he is beginning to think that after 20 years perhaps family was never for him.

Alibabaandthe40nappies Thu 04-Apr-13 23:19:50

What a fucking twat he is.

I'm a bit speechless that he's putting it all on you.

If he is keen to end the marriage then he had better move out and into somewhere where he can have the kids to stay.

Are you going to speak to a solicitor?

AnyFucker Thu 04-Apr-13 23:20:02

There is another woman

I would bet my house on it

This is how the script starts

I am very sorry

You must tell him to leave, he has made his choice

50shadesofknackered Thu 04-Apr-13 23:23:43

Tell him to get out of your bed, pack a bag and FUCK OFF! What a complete arse! He doesn't want to be married anymore? Fine! You don't want to be married to a selfish tosser that is desperately trying to relive his youth by playing in a band, ffs, when he should be with his wife and family. Op, you deserve so much better than this. Don't stand for his shit, he has made his feelings clear so it's time you move on too. Who knows, without him you may be happy be free to live a life that doesn't involve walking on eggshells trying to keep someone happy when they only want to make you miserable. Bastard!

Finola1step Thu 04-Apr-13 23:25:40

Oh my goodness house. My jaw has hit the floor. Perhaps family was never for him! Unbelievable. And it has sloped off to bed. I never use the C??T word ever, not on here or in rl. But for that lump of lard, I will make an exception. He, my dear, is a CUNT. Now for those not familiar with the south London meaning of that word, it has much more to do with a person's behaviour towards another and his general shitty attitude, than the more widely accepted association with female genitalia. In fact, for real authenticity, one would shout the word at full volume after the word Fucking.

Now all that energy that you have been spending on trying to keep things together.

Doha Thu 04-Apr-13 23:26:38

And remind him he will have the DC's 50/50 so he had better find himself suitable accommodation to have them overnight as you won't be moving out. (even if you have no intention of 50/50 custody)
Really sorry OP but you will probably be happier without him in the longrun.
As from now down tools as far as he is concerned. No more washing cooking tidying for him. Does he realise he will have to hand over money for the Dc's?
He thinks the grass is greener..well he is in for a shock isn't he!

houseworkhater Thu 04-Apr-13 23:28:22

He very nicely said that he might still pick dd1 up and bring her home on the night she goes out and that he will still take dd2 to her hobby on Saturday. Too bloody right I thought cos otherwise he will be the one explaining why they can't go.

Feel sick, in 2 minds weather to go up to bed and try and touch him.

Finola1step Thu 04-Apr-13 23:28:43

Oops posted too soon as can't believe the language I have used!

That energy, use it to focus on getting him out. Think about the practicals and the financials. Access to bank accounts, savings etc. Get legal advice quick. Keep posting.

OrangeLily Thu 04-Apr-13 23:29:15

So you should skivvy for him AND shag him?! Is he out of his fucking mind!? But he won't even go to the shop for a pint of milk without feeling hard done by? This is all so he can play with his fucking band.

He's either shagging someone else or he's actually completely lost his mind. (Either that or discovered some ridiculous time machine that takes him back beyond the 50s).

Flojobunny Thu 04-Apr-13 23:30:04

What 50shades said. Call his bluff. Go upstairs, grab a suitcase and throw it on the bed and tell him in no uncertain terms to fuck the fuck off..

TheSecondComing Thu 04-Apr-13 23:30:48

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

AnyFucker Thu 04-Apr-13 23:31:52

Touch him ?

Why would you want to do that ? confused

Flojobunny Thu 04-Apr-13 23:32:57

Try and touch him? NO, please don't lower yourself to that. He has just completely shattered you and has gone off to bed like he doesn't care. He should be sat with you now explaining exactly what is going to happen in this split that he has apparently planned.
Do not think that by fucking him tonight, he will stay, he will fuck u and then still leave.
Have some dignity and go pack his bag for him and throw it out the front door.

houseworkhater Thu 04-Apr-13 23:32:58

I really don't know.
I think i am loosing my mind a bit tbh.

Corygal Thu 04-Apr-13 23:34:01

You poor poor thing - it's premature to say it, but I suspect you may be well rid.

He's got a severe case of grass-is-greener and is idiot enough to follow it. Ironically, the band thing would give him the cool he wants if he was a husband and father, but under the circs this ageing lech act looks a bit tragic, to be honest.

I would make it clear that he's welcome to leave. I would also explain that he has to talk to the kids. Him, not you. And that he will take them half the week when he moves out.

I suspect temptation with other women, if not a girlfriend.

joanofarchitrave Thu 04-Apr-13 23:34:10

What do you want OP?

It might be feasible to get past this but do you really want to?

Do you have either his or your parents you can talk to - are either couple still married? I'll bet if they are, they've faced something like this. And what they say might surprise you.

I think starting to tell people (not bandmates) that you're facing a major crisis could make him realise what an absolute arsehole he sounds like. At the moment it's mostly been happening in his head. Take some control.

Flojobunny Thu 04-Apr-13 23:35:16

If he hasn't already cheated, he's thinking about it.
He's willing to trade 20 yrs of marriage, to hell with u n the dc for some woman he hardly knows.
Why the hell are u still under the same roof?

Corygal Thu 04-Apr-13 23:35:30

Oh, and remind him that his actions will cost a lot more than a loaf of bread - maintenance of the house, you and the kids will be rather pricy. But hey too late now.

Finola1step Thu 04-Apr-13 23:36:16

Touch him? Surely kick him out of your bed so you can get in and get some sleep. OP please listen to what he is saying. He wants out. He even sounds like he regrets having your children.

Corygal Thu 04-Apr-13 23:38:47

I agree - start to tell people he's basically said he doesn't love his family and that you just don't know if you should have him back, let alone want to.

Oh what a twerp. Middle aged midlife crised twerp.

Get angry. Get him to leave.

See a solicitor and sue him to kingdom come and then some more.

houseworkhater Thu 04-Apr-13 23:40:48

I am going to go and try and sleep.

He is working tomorrow so I won't see him all day.
I am going to go out and see a good friend I think, just to get some perspective.

Thank you for all the replies.

Hissy Thu 04-Apr-13 23:42:32

Oh I'd touch him alright...

With a baseball bat the toe of my boot up his arse...

So cross for you OP, I'm so sorry, but I agree that there's no chance of this being a decision he has come to all by himself.

Angelico Thu 04-Apr-13 23:43:54

Really sorry OP sad He's a complete twunt who has had the security of family life for years and is now having a mid-life crisis. I'm also guessing there's another woman - or at least the prospect of one. Maybe in his head he thinks he is being noble - doesn't want to cheat on you but wants to be free to shag around.

Look after yourself and your children. He's an adult and he'll have plenty of time to repent the choice he's making. He has checked out so don't degrade yourself by trying to pander to him.

fieldfare Thu 04-Apr-13 23:48:37

He drops that bomb and then goes to sleep?! Wtaf.

I'd be informing him that if he no longer wants to be married then pack a bag and fuck off. You do not need this emotional bullying bullshit.

jollydiane Thu 04-Apr-13 23:55:51

20 years is a long time to be with anyone. Looking back, have you had a happy marriage? I'm not saying forgive and forget but marriage needs to be worked at and I don't think I would do anything hasty.

I think talking the situation through with good friends that knows you both is excellent advice.

Feel confident in yourself, know that the situation could be turned round if you both want to, if you have generally enjoyed the last 20 years can you get that magic and love back - do you even want to try?

My very small tip is go to the hairdressers and get a new modern look that makes you feel good, treat yourself to a new outfit - do this not for him but for you. Feeling confident about yourself and taking control is very powerful.

Finola1step Thu 04-Apr-13 23:57:32

My final thought for the night house. If he has gone up to bed, alone, has he managed to drop off to sleep? Or at least start winding down for the night? If he has, after everything he has said tonight, then he has no compassion for you whatsoever.

You and I are complete strangers. Yet I can't get to sleep just yet as I am so outraged on your behalf. And yet your husband of 20 years drops the mother of all bombshells and them slopes off to bed. That says all you need to know. Goodnight house, try to get some rest and keep posting tomorrow. There will be lots of support for you.

MadAboutHotChoc Fri 05-Apr-13 00:03:35

The reason why he is sleeping like a baby is cos he checked out mentally and emotionally ages ago - unlike OP who is now trying to get to grips with this terrible bombshell, wondering what the hell has happened sad

Op - please do not degrade yourself by offering sex or trying to be the perfect wife.

skyebluesapphire Fri 05-Apr-13 00:10:49

house - I am sorry, but my XH started his little "Im unhappy, I don't feel the same, I don't want to be here any more" chat with the same lines... the house is a disgrace, I want more sex (I thought 2-3 times a week was pretty good, but apparantly not!). He was always tired and always asleep, yet it was my fault that we werent shagging every night of the week.

Like the others have said, it does sound like "the script". I told XH that if he didnt want family life, he shouldnt have stayed with me for 10 years and had a child.....

On the night of the second time that XH left, I got upset as I was insecure, he started off saying he was confused, then said he was leaving again. Then as it was around 2am by then, he just fell asleep. (we had been on the point of having sex just prior to this). He fell asleep. While I went in the other room and cried solidly for 3 hours.

If he can drop a bombshell like that and then just go to sleep, I am sorry, but it does not appear that there is much care or concern left for you and your feelings sad

Stay strong, ask him to leave while you decide what you want.

Leavenheath Fri 05-Apr-13 02:07:50

He was having an affair last year when he said he wanted to leave, that much is obvious. I'd say it never ended or it's a different one now, probably linked to this band in some way. Have you had the 'I love you but I'm not in love with you' speech? If ever there was a telltale sign of an affair, it's that.

While he's still there, check his phone although I'm sure he's sleeping with it.

Don't beg him to stay. Really, just don't. Just ask him to leave without dragging this out. I'd be inclined to tell him you know he's having an affair though (and who it's with), but keep schtum about how you know that. Might as well put the frighteners up the little fucker before he goes.

CogitoErgoSometimes Fri 05-Apr-13 07:53:19

Hope you're OK this morning OP. Don't let him stick around to insult you with more of this rubbish. Make him leave and let him take his pathetic criticisms with him. (Shouldn't have to pick up a pint of milk?...hmm) People grow apart, they have affairs & whatever, and if he had anything about him he would have the decency to be honest about why he's leaving rather than saying 'marriage was a mistake' and trashing the last 20 years of your life.

Get him to explain to the kids why he's going as well. They'll see through him.

Good luck

pinkypig Fri 05-Apr-13 07:55:05

Thinking of you. Agree there must be another woman or prospect of one. Also agree he has checked out of the marriage and this is one of the things I found most hurtful when it happened to me 5 weeks ago. You still care, he really doesn't, he's moved on and it will take you a while to catch up.
There seem to be SO many men doing this to fabulous womena and their families at the moment. It is so sad but there is nothing you can do to change him. All you can do is change your own life for the better so you and your kids have a happier life from here on.
I really hope get some perspective from your friends and some lovely hugs etc. Stay strong!

onefewernow Fri 05-Apr-13 08:07:06

Of course his friends don't think he should pick up milk! Because. MLC men only surround themselves with single laddish mates who reflect their views. He is a teenager in a mans body, and with girlfriend to match I bet.

I'm sure you do tell off the kids. Parents do; so no surprise he doesn't. Because he identifies with them on their level.

fuzzpig Fri 05-Apr-13 08:18:11

Ugh what a despicable excuse for a man.

Glad he's at work today - pack his bags while he's out. Have them waiting by the front door when he gets home. He wants out, he can fuck off.

So sorry op. family life is not for him? Well he's already had a family and he will find it much harder without you. He will have to have the children to stay and give you money to support them. They will make a mess at his place too, when he gets one, and it will be him clearing up, not you. So all the stuff he finds difficult will be more so because he won't have your support in the background. And he will have to explain himself to his children.

This stinks.

Anniegetyourgun Fri 05-Apr-13 08:52:23

May I just add that if there is any chance at all that your husband of 20 years (for whom you presumably still care) will see the light and realise what an idiot he's being, chucking him out so he sees what he has lost is the only way that might work. Being Superwife didn't do anything at all, did it? It just relegates you even further into the domestic appliance category. What you have to prove yourself to be is an independent, strong human being who will not be walked over. None of this setting you up to fail (wanting a tidier house while being a messy bugger himself, wanting you to discipline the children quietly without backing you up, wanting more sex whilst being either out or asleep) and then whining about it. He can ship out and see how he likes them apples. I dare say Band Girl (assuming she exists - I bet she does) can accommodate him on the sex front, but as for the tidying, well she's young, free and single isn't she, why should she want to wash his pants?

There is no guarantee this will bring the idiot back into line, of course. There is also no guarantee that if he does realise what he threw away and comes grovelling back, that you'll even want to take him back by then... But the one thing that is guaranteed is that if you think being really really nice and giving him sex will make him stay, you are sadly deluded and you will despise yourself for it later, even though none of this is your fault.

Hopasholic Fri 05-Apr-13 09:31:53

Oh god what an absolute twunt. Get angry & get him out.

He has no respect for you whatsoever & I'm quite sure he's not telling you the truth. Really sorry you're going through this. Do some digging and don't let him walk all over you.

flowers

putyourhatonsweetie Fri 05-Apr-13 10:52:05

Thinking of you and wishing you luck through today. flowers

SundaeGirl Fri 05-Apr-13 11:16:18

Hope you are with a friend this morning, OP, and getting lots of RL support.

I second everything Annie said. If you want your DH to appreciate everything he's got in you/your home/20yrs of back story together then he'll need cold water poured over his fantasies about what life will be like outside the family home. Unfortunately, there's no way you'll be able to explain it to him as he's not wise enough to see it. Send him packing for a bit and don't indulge him with 'what can I do to make things better?'-type chats.

houseworkhater Fri 05-Apr-13 13:07:41

Hi,

I have been to a friends who knows us both well.

She cannot believe that anyone would think me awful to ask dh to collect milk.

She also thinks he is having his cake and eating it with all this band stuff.
She has told me to make him take the kids overnight at least once a week if he goes.

We/me do a hell of a lot of running around for the kids. I don't think he realises that if he moves out he will be forced to make a choice between the band and the kids.

DD1 is out late Friday and Saturday with her hobby. I am the one who brings her home. If he had the kids Friday or Sat he couldn't do this unless he packed the band in. there is no alternative.

i don't know whether to spell this all out to him or wait to see if he leaves and then drop the bombshell that I will not accomodate him if he goes.

He starts work early mon-fri so cannot have the dcs to sleep midweek.

I think deep down i want the marriage to work, I imagined staying together forever. I didn't go into marriage or have 3 children lightly.

I have told him that I want to be put first, the kids and myself. not his bloody band or anyone else.

He doesn't seem to see a link between lack of sex with how I feel in the pecking order.

He has cited a couple we know saying how happy they look together. I have pointed out that ok but they spend Sat/Sun together, not apart.

I feel angry and have told him that I feel like I have been used as a cleaner/maid/nanny whilst he has pissed about.

My friend tol dme to stop washing his stuff and not to move any mess the kids have made.

She also said she cooks once a week only. Her dd2, same age as my eldest does all her day time meals and most evening ones.

Feeling pressure from everywhere, kids, dh and life itself.

So angry that he wanted to be a family man 20 years ago and now that I have put my energy into it he feels it may not be for him.

He is working with his beloved band tonight so I won't see him today. In fact he is working with the band Fri/Sat/Sun but I always have a go apparently, even though I don't stop him doing anything he feels "pressure".

houseworkhater Fri 05-Apr-13 13:14:51

His mother has asked for dds to sleep might ask her to take them.
Was going to suggest me, dh and ds go shopping together tomorrow as ds needs some clothes.

Feel like screaming.

His mum and dad will be devestated, not that that matters.
He said lots of people have said not to stay for the kids, they will survive, then went on to point out all the people we know who have separated, as if I need a list.

I don't know what to do, he won't be her to talk.

I feel so angry that someone could do this. Why did I marry him, why did I have 3 children, why am I stuck her.

i don't know whether to tell dd1 what he has said.

I think he accomodates her to get her on his side, so I will look like the baddy.

Tells me I shout at them, thinks I should cook all the meals for everyone.

Leavenheath Fri 05-Apr-13 13:21:49

Why are you still writing as though this relationship can be saved by any input from you?

It can't. He wants out. He's having an affair.

houseworkhater Fri 05-Apr-13 13:25:59

Because I still want to make it work if it can.

SundaeGirl Fri 05-Apr-13 13:28:01

Glad to hear you've been getting some RL support. And your friend is right, he's having his cake and eating it.

I'm not sure suggesting shopping together tomorrow is a good idea. To most people, that we be a family activity but I think your DH has checked out and will see it as drudgery. Sorry, but I think he's in domestic=bad mode.

Could you suggest you go and watch him jam with his band at the weekend? Even as I type that I think he doesn't deserve that kind of support from you, but it might be a good idea to show up so that any potential OW know you aren't too far away.

Pandemoniaa Fri 05-Apr-13 13:30:15

I think deep down i want the marriage to work, I imagined staying together forever. I didn't go into marriage or have 3 children lightly.

I can quite understand this. However, it sounds as if your husband checked out of your marriage some time ago. I also suspect another woman but even, in the unlikely event, of this being a fact, he shows no sign of interest in making your marriage work.

You may want the marriage to work and you might even persuade him to give it a go. But do you really want to spend your life waiting for the next time he decides to check out? Because that, I fear, is exactly what is going to happen.

SundaeGirl Fri 05-Apr-13 13:34:40

I think you can still make it work - but you will not be able to I still him with the joys of family life if he's high and happy on the joys of freed-from-family-gigging-on-the-open-road-type mentality. He needs to see that the life with you is REAL and the one he's hankering after is an illusion. The big problem here is that, unfortunately, he's not going to listen to what you say (because, well, you would say that wouldn't you) so life is going to have to show him the hard way.

Scary as it is, There's a lot to be said for sending him packing for a few days. No drama, no chats. Dream scenario: you text 'I've taken your things to your mother's. You can stay there while you work out if family life is for you.'

BalloonSlayer Fri 05-Apr-13 13:35:01

I read the first few lines of your first post:

Have been together 20 years with 3 dcs.

Most people view us as being well suited and happy together.
Anyhow last year dh said he might leave. I was at my wits end. he said he basically wanted more sex and the house to be tidier.

I ran myself ragged upping the anti.

And thought AFFAIR.

My friend had this. She ran herself into the ground trying to be perfect while he sat and sneered telling her she was fat and ugly and needed to "sort herself out" or he would leave. She kept trying. And trying. And weeping. And beating herself up.

Of course there was another woman all along.

Eventually she found out and they broke up. At last now she can now see him for what he is, and wonders why she exhausted herself and put herself and her children's needs last while attempting to pointlessly placate a complete and utter turd.

Leavenheath Fri 05-Apr-13 13:35:42

You still want it to work even though he's been lying to you at least a year and is playing around?

Have some self-respect.

He doesn't respect you does he? And he'll respect you less if you ignore what's going on and beg him to stay. It didn't work last time and it won't work now. He's probably got less respect for you now than he did the first time he threatened to leave. He knows you'll put up with any old shit just to keep him, but even after being able to do all that to you he still wants out. Let him go and act a bit smarter here.

SundaeGirl Fri 05-Apr-13 13:35:55

(That should be 'instil' not I still)

Hopasholic Fri 05-Apr-13 13:38:24

But if he wanted it to work he wouldn't be with the band. He'd be with his family. Make him wake up. You won't do this by taking all the crap he throws at you and trying to change yourself.
Wake him up by chucking him out. Let him know that his behaviour is not acceptable. If you want it to work then you need to make him see that you are NOT a doormat at his bloody beck and call. If he doesn't want it to work then that is his loss.
Have you been through his phone/emails etc? because I would have by now.

houseworkhater Fri 05-Apr-13 13:42:06

Yes I have thought of going to watch the band (at least for some of the gig) Sundae. Think I will do that.

Pand- I'm not sure right now what will happen, but I feel I have to give it a go if i can.

SundaeGirl Fri 05-Apr-13 13:44:53

I totally get why you want the marriage to work, and from what you've posted it still can. Even if he has been having an affair, there are plenty of people on these boards who have got their relationships back on track and not lost everything they've built up.

It sounds as though he's found band life intoxicating and freeing while home life represents obligations (which it does) and ordinariness. Right now, he's decided not to see the value in those obligations or normality, and it sounds as though he's deciding to express himself as a non-family guy.

There is very, very little you can do about this as he sounds well and truly off on it. However, you can protect yourself by keeping your dignity and shutting off his easy access to the nice bits of warm family life.

clam Fri 05-Apr-13 13:45:06

You can't 'give it a go' on your own though.

Flisspaps Fri 05-Apr-13 13:45:51

You cannot make a marriage work in your own.

It sounds like he doesn't want to be married any more. And that's not your fault, that's him being an arse. I bet his band mates have said sweet FA about picking up bread and milk. I bet they do a fair share of the housework.

No matter what you do, you cannot make him want to give up his OW remain married sad

Pandemoniaa Fri 05-Apr-13 13:47:43

I quite understand that you feel you have to give your marriage a go but what I'm saying is that this needs to be a two-way process. I see little evidence that he's prepared to play his part, tbh.

houseworkhater Fri 05-Apr-13 13:53:49

Right I have sent him a message asking him what he is going to do. It's difficult as I won't get a chance to speak to him face to face until tomorrow.

I can't carry on in this state of no mans land.

toomanyeasterbunnies Fri 05-Apr-13 14:00:44

It really sounds like an affair. The first three lines of your OP made my heart race as it was exactly how things were for me. I said he couldn't be having an affair, he's too busy, he's not the type...but yes he was. He started acting an arse when the affair started. Pointing out all my failings, the lack of sex and attention - all to make him feel better about what he was doing.

I am sorry you are going through this but if you do some digging I really wouldn't be surprised if you found an OW on the scene.

pinkbraces Fri 05-Apr-13 14:16:07

Please stop being the underdog, you dont have to be in no mans land, you dont have to wait for him to make a decision - you do it.
Show him that you are fully prepared to let him go - and do so.

You want to save your marriage - but unless he wants the same you cant. Please take some control and you will feel so much stronger.

Good luck

CajaDeLaMemoria Fri 05-Apr-13 14:19:57

House...come on.

He's told you what he wants. He's told you what he's going to do - he's leaving, because he doesn't want to be married. He regrets marrying you, he regrets starting a family, and the only way it's semi-bearable to him is if the house is like a hotel, the children are out of sight and out of mind, and you are ready for sex whenever he wants it.

You can't save this. It's not saveable. Of course that hurts now, but it'll hurt so, so much more if you beg and plead and try and make it work, because it won't. He has completely disengaged.

I wouldn't point out to him that he'll loose band time to the children, either, because you don't want him to stay for that reason. If he's not already having an affair, he's going to be very soon, and you don't need that hurt and humiliation.

He's made his bed. Pack him a suitcase and kick him out for a while. Then see how you feel after a few days to heal and strengthen up. You might find that the harsh, sudden reality of what he's giving up is enough to make him think again, or you might be a lot happier without him, but the longer you stay sleeping in the same bed, the worst it'll be. And the easier you'll make it for him.

AnyFucker Fri 05-Apr-13 14:22:40

Fgs, Don't trail after him to watch him playing rock star in his band

It is very likely his love interest will be there and you will look pathetic

find your self respect, please

This man is checked out. You can't save this, all you can hang into is your dignity

AnyFucker Fri 05-Apr-13 14:23:56

*onto

specialsubject Fri 05-Apr-13 14:28:53

a man who wants more sex and a tidier house can hire a hooker and a cleaner.

a man who wants to save his marriage would be trying harder.

sorry - it looks like game over. Start working on your exit strategy. And if you leave, make sure you tuck those prawns in the curtain poles. :-)

Agree totally with what CajaDeLaMemoria has said.
Pack him a bag as soon as you can the tell him to leave.
You need some space and time to process all this.
Take control - you can do this!!!!

If I can add my little bit of advice - don't be afraid to go to your GP and get some medication to help you get through this if you need...something to help you sleep, or generally take the edge off things. It's a huge shock to your system.

ivykaty44 Fri 05-Apr-13 14:38:42

a marriage is between two people and it needs two people to make it work - It can't work when only one person is in the marriage wanting it to work and the other behaves like a cuckoo in the nest.

Sorry but the others are correct - he is having an affair

Rather than be in no mans land why don't you take yourself away for a few days to stay with a friend and leave your family to fend for themselves - they will be fine.

Give yourself some time to think really hard about what life you want (its no good talking and one person lies which is what he is doing when you do talk)

Do you want a life as a skivy or do you want a life for you that includes the children

ClaireDeTamble Fri 05-Apr-13 14:41:43

Don't let him make this choice.

He has told you what he wants - call him on it. Pack his bag and leave it on the doorstep for him to collect it.

If you still want to make it work that is up to you - it won't happen while he is having his cake and eating it. After he has been lived on his own, been responsible for his own cooking, cleaning, washing and time with the kids, maybe, just maybe, he will realise that he has given up a good thing and will agree to change / counselling or whatever you feel he needs to do to help repair the marriage.

If he doesn't, and it is what he really wants, then you are better off with him out of the house so you can start to rebuild you life without him. Don't let him stay, dangling you on the string of possibility of working it out - it is no way to live.

Alibabaandthe40nappies Fri 05-Apr-13 14:45:45

Bloody hell you are giving him ALL the power and control here.

Where is your self-respect OP?

Do not trail along to watch the band, his friends will be laughing at you.

fuzzpig Fri 05-Apr-13 14:46:15

Agree with anyfucker, please don't go to the gig. Don't bother with him at all. Well apart from sticking his stuff in bin bags perhaps, ready for him to cart off somewhere else - and that's only so you can shove him out the door ASAP rather than waiting for him to pack himself! Don't bother telling him how much harder he'll find it on his own (true though it is) - why warn him? Fuck it, he wants to leave, let him!

IF there is an OW, I wonder if last year when he was threatening to leave he actually had her in mind but then it fizzled out so he ended up staying. However IMO it doesn't really matter if there is/was someone else or not, he has totally checked out of family life and has treated you horribly, you deserve better. You will be miles better off without him.

abbyfromoz Fri 05-Apr-13 14:54:30

You don't sound happy at all... And yet you want to make it work?

Hopasholic Fri 05-Apr-13 14:58:06

The only reason to go to the gig is to catch him unawares.

I know it must sound like we're all having a go at you but we're not. Please take note of what others are saying OP

If he cared about you, you would not be having to have a discussion about a 20 year relationship via a bloody text message.

Get some space.

ladyjadie Fri 05-Apr-13 15:09:05

I have sent him a message asking him what he is going to do.

Gahh! Next time (if there is one) please make sure you are telling him what to do, not asking him what he wants! You're only making yourself look weaker and more pathetic to him! That will only make you seem more annoying to him. Making unmarried life all the more appealing.

You want him to sit up and take notice? Then take charge!!

If he told you that was your only hope you would do it. But he's a shit and we want you to be happy. He only wants himself to be happy. Please take the advice here. flowers

SundaeGirl Fri 05-Apr-13 15:17:13

'Do not trail along to watch the band, his friends will be laughing at you' hmm I don't think anyone will laugh at someone's wife going to his gig. She is his wife of 20yrs - it's really not trailing.

That said, they might feel sorry for you, OP, which isn't great either. When I was suggesting going to the gig it was really because I thought you didn't sound ready to kick him out for a bit. Having him leave is the optimum IMO, but if you can't face that and need to do something 'with' him then maybe don't make it shopping for the DCs clothes. However, it sounds too far gone to be remedied (at this stage) with any sort of family/coupley outing.

Xales Fri 05-Apr-13 15:22:47

Gob smacked that someone can tell their wife of 20 years that they don't want to be married any more and then go and sleep like a baby in the marital bed.

Knock that on the head from tonight.

He wants out of the marriage fuck off the to couch/spare room.

Dont suffocate him!

He wants out? Let him go! TELL HIM TO GO!

If he is ever going to come back, it is not because his wife is pleading, nagging, and begging acting pathetic, it is because she stands firm and calls his bluff.

Tell him to go, let him handle his dirty socks, his meals, and juggle his children and the band. Let him taste what single life is for a middle aged man in a band. (pah!)

houseworkhater Fri 05-Apr-13 15:42:13

He has replied saying he wants to leave.

I have told him to go asap.

I have told him he can have kids tomorrow, to sleep wherever he is going. He replied that he can't have them overnight-band.
I told him he can either:

1)take dd2 to party
2)pick her up and drop her off at his mums, which I think would be better.

He replied can't pick her up/take her to grans as working with band-again.

Kids out at minute I really want to tell them that their dad is leaving because he has come to the conclusion that actually he did really want them > I know i shouldn't say this but I really want to tell them this.

I am very close to actually telling him that actually I won't be having the kids tomorrow night and that he either takes them and cancels the gig or tells them that he puts the band above them> Am I being selfish? I actually don't know.

My dd1 also has a job and needs collecting Sat night, again I do this.

I have thought about all the things dh will have to do.

If she stays at his Sats he can't do the band and pick her up. I have just thought he might book her a taxi.

I know this may sound trivial. i feel like screaming and smashing his fucking face in.

houseworkhater Fri 05-Apr-13 15:46:16

Sorry for garbled post.

Party is Sunday

Band playing tonight, tomorrow
and Sunday.

Should I tell his mum?

Kids (2 of them) sleeping Sunday.

Oh and got this text AFTER telling him I will come and see band Sunday so he obviously doesn't want me there.

I don''t think i can trucst myself.
When do I tell the kids?

Should I tell the kids?

Should I not say anything to them yet?

I feel like I am acting out of hurt and don't want to say/do things I may regrtet. not to him but to kids.

houseworkhater Fri 05-Apr-13 15:48:12

I don't want to come over all hysterical but I can't have him here and I'm not going to make it easy for him.

He will have to choose between kids and band, I know he will.

Corygal Fri 05-Apr-13 15:49:13

No. Don't tell the kids anything. But tell everyone else.

geologyrocks Fri 05-Apr-13 15:51:09

let him then. tell him that he is taking the kids, let his mum know whats going on then olan an evening with your friends.

tell your kids first though, say that husband doesnt want to be married anymore. if yoy say anything horruble about him they could resent you, so thread carefully.

mrsfiddymont Fri 05-Apr-13 15:53:06

So, he wants to leave. Have his shit in bags to collect from doorstep and do not let him in the house...he has left already. Inform him you are seeking legal advice and that the normal arrangement for seeing children is every other weekend and once during the week. You will be seeking advice from the CSA and will be getting a STD check up!

Corygal Fri 05-Apr-13 15:54:16

Thing is, in order to have a decent relationship with the kids he will have to be involved a lot from the word go. So dont back down on him taking them non stop - but dont let slip any of the awful things he's said to them.

Be straight with his mum about this.

houseworkhater Fri 05-Apr-13 15:55:59

Thanks Corygal.

I have a feeling my eldest dd may want to go with her dad. I won't stop her.

I think he has been buttering her up so to speak.

Whenever I ask her, firmly to move her stuff, or mention the fact that she is old enough to make her own sandwich or get her own drinks ready, he does tell me not to, put he never backs me up to say come on x move your stuff.

Perhaps that is why I am calling him on having them Saturday nights. I know he can't have her and do the band. Her hobby runs too late for him to pick her up.

I am thinking ahead but should i stand firm and refuse to collect her on his days?

It sounds so petty but why should I do it?

Am I being awful in forcing her to see who comes first, her or the band?

Corygal Fri 05-Apr-13 15:58:59

No you aren't. Make sure you've booked something else that means you can't collect her - avoid awkwardness. How old is she? Taxi?

mrsfiddymont Fri 05-Apr-13 15:59:30

supposing he had ow, he may try and move in with her..your eldest wouldn't go then.

Stick to the weekend arrangements that suit you, he has been making sure he is ok for long enough. He will have to put his family first now if he wants to maintain a relationship.

classifiedinformation Fri 05-Apr-13 15:59:55

I think that trying to force the dc care onto him this weekend would actually not be very good for them as this idiot man obviously couldn't give a toss about their lives.

Whilst I know it will be hard to deal with, I think you should keep their normal routine going. However, I don't think you should just allow him to keep eating his bloody cake. Take this time to sort out what you need re paperwork etc and then stuff his clothes and other annoying crap in bin bags and leave it by the door.

You will need to explain it to the kids, but it would be a very bad idea to completely bad mouth him to them as it will cause them hurt and give him more reasons to think he is superior.

Text him back and tell him he has until the end of the weekend to find a new address. Then congratulate yourself on finally being rid of such a bastard!!!!

Really, really feel for you housework. sad

houseworkhater Fri 05-Apr-13 16:04:37

Maybe he shouldn't see them tommorrow.

I think he will feel as though he has done his duty so to speak for the weekend.

I can get round the fact he isn't here.
If he takes dds they may wonder what is going on and i don't want to hurt them.

Leavenheath Fri 05-Apr-13 16:04:46

He replied that he can't have them overnight-band.

No, that actually means can't have them overnight-OW

Don't think too far ahead about where the kids live. Today's task is to get him out of the house and tell the kids what's going on. It's my guess the older ones have already tumbled that he's been having an affair.

Corygal Fri 05-Apr-13 16:04:57

Housework - my heart bleeds for you in this awful situation that is not of your making and couldn't be less your fault.

It strikes me with some force that he is trying to leave not just you but the family - that is not acceptable or good for anyone esp DCs. I think you should get the help you clearly require in the appalling task of getting him to take the DCs. Also, it will make him realise that leaving isn't the merry skip he'd envisaged.

larrygrylls Fri 05-Apr-13 16:05:35

Housework,

I think people on this board encourage people to give up on long relationships too quickly. On the other hand, if you are going to stay married, it has to be on your terms, not his, which means that he goes for a meaningful period of time, right now. Then, if he changes his mind, he has to win you back, and no need to make it easy.

Tell the children the facts. No need to sugar coat them, but no need to exaggerate either. They deserve to know what is happening. Please don't use them as pawns. If your husband/STBXH wants to step up, that is up to him. But if he doesn't, you have to be there for your children. There is no point in giving him ultimatums about the children unless you can coerce him into doing what you want, which you can't, realistically.

So, tell all your friends and relations everything and see a good divorce lawyer. Get the divorce going ASAP. Even as a negotiating tool, being served papers has a remarkably sobering effect on someone wanting a second adolescence.

I have no sympathy for him. On the other hand, good people can behave badly (and he is behaving very badly) so chuck him out but leave the door a crack open, just in case he sobers up and comes back suitably apologetic and prepared to fully participate in your marriage and step up as a father. Frankly, I doubt it will happen and you will find yourself well rid of him.

Leavenheath Fri 05-Apr-13 16:06:09

I can get round the fact he isn't here.

Don't lie to your children.

Leavenheath Fri 05-Apr-13 16:07:43

What leave the door open so that when his miserable little affair is over, he can come back?

Fuck that for a game of soldiers.

houseworkhater Fri 05-Apr-13 16:09:17

That's just it Corygal- I won't allow him to cherry pick when he sees dcs.

It will break dcs heart if they cannot do their hobby, dd1 lives and breathes it.
So that is why i will insist, even if not straight away, that he either has them Fri night or Sat night.
Either way he will be trailing around after dcs and won't be able to go out or be in the band at those times.

larrygrylls Fri 05-Apr-13 16:09:29

Leavenheath,

Plenty of people stay together post affairs. It is up to the OP how she feels about that. In addition, you don't actually know for a fact that he has had an affair. He may simply want to sleep on floors and have no responsibilities....

SundaeGirl Fri 05-Apr-13 16:11:24

Can you have the DCs this weekend? Or send them to his mums if they are used to that? Don't disorientate them if not necessary - they aren't there to be used.

I also agree that a lot of the advice on here might be geared to giving up on relationships too quickly. From what you've posted I think you can still get your marriage back (with pain) but you can only do that by shutting him out now. Do not let him see you hurt/cry. Stay strong! (Easier said than done though, I know).

Leavenheath Fri 05-Apr-13 16:14:57

Yes people do stay together after affairs, but that only works if they admit they've had them and haven't left to try out the OW for size first while lying about the reason they've left. Any woman who took a man back after that would have no self-respect at all.

SundaeGirl Fri 05-Apr-13 16:16:09

Please go carefully, OP. ^It will break dcs heart if they cannot do their hobby, dd1 lives and breathes it.
So that is why i will insist, even if not straight away, that he either has them Fri night or Sat night.
Either way he will be trailing around after dcs and won't be able to go out or be in the band at those times.^

This sounds as though you are tempted to used the DC to mess up his band. Zero will be achieved by this, except hurting your DC. I'm not suggesting that you will just have to accept whatever scenario he presents but this is early days. Family mediation can help in the future. Right now, just stick to what you've been doing and your DCs will be grateful for you being a rock.

You should get a formal contact agreement drawn up asap, and start formalizing the divorce. I think standard is ever second weekend and one night per week?

Corygal Fri 05-Apr-13 16:21:55

Well one night of band and two/three of not band is reasonable. He's the one saying he can't see his DCs because he's in a band.

Leavenheath Fri 05-Apr-13 16:23:24

I just don't understand all these snarks about people giving up on on relationships too quickly.

If one person's given up and has told the OP that's the score, she's got no choice but to give up too. The husband's made it quite clear it's over and he wants to leave. Telling the OP she doesn't have to give up is just prolonging her agony and is cruel IMO. It's much better that the OP cuts him off and gets on with her new life, instead of begging and worse still waiting for his mid-life crisis to be over.

houseworkhater Fri 05-Apr-13 16:25:13

Yes I can have the dcs this weekend. I have them every weekend.
Dh does his share of taking them places, he always has.

I just don't want to make it easy for him by letting(if that's the right word) him cherry pick when he will/won't see them.

I don't know if this is reasonable or not. everyone I know who has separated seem to operate on this basis.Ie nrp has them on set days for set times and that is that. they have to fit their life in around that.

Is this reasonable?

I am taking dcs away next week anyway (pre arranged) without dh.

SundaeGirl Fri 05-Apr-13 16:26:37

'Formalising the divorce' - the relationship isn't yet over. It might be, but it might not.

If the OP's H finds that life on the open road isn't what he imagined, it isn't impossible to imagine him realising what a colossal mistake he's making. If the OP still wants to take him back after that then good (if she doesn't, all good too - her choice). Of course, the OP has to take him at his word and treat it as though he was leaving. But most break ups are longer and more complicated and often have opportunities for salvaging the relationship if the parties want to.

onefewernow Fri 05-Apr-13 16:34:53

HWL it is a well worn strategy to be the nice dad, and the crap H.

My H used to have it down to a T when he had online goings on with OW.

Regardless of whether your H has OW or not, he hasn't treated you well, he identifies with the kids as though he is a teenager himself and he wants them onside. He won't admit it, but he knows at some level he is unfair, and he wants them to make him feel better about himself , and for you to feel worse about yourself.

My h didn't stop this until school started to complain eg about homework etc, and at that point, at joint meetings, I started to tell them openly about our differing strategies. Turned out he was far less willing to defend publicly what he tried to defend at home.

Even the silence when you are annoyed with a teenager or child- he intends it to communicate silently to them.

Believe me, I know ALL about that issue.

Alibabaandthe40nappies Fri 05-Apr-13 16:35:11

OP - you are quite right to insist that he takes some responsibility for his children. It sounds very much as if he thinks he is going to bugger off and live his life as a single and childless man, turning up occasionally to play 'fun Dad' while you do all the shitwork. Sounding familiar?

Don't let him. Go and see a solicitor and insist on a formal contact arrangement.

larrygrylls Fri 05-Apr-13 16:36:04

Sundae,

I totally agree with you. Chuck him out and talk to a lawyer. However, don't burn all bridges yet, especially involving vengeful acts with the children. That way closes all hope of an (eventual) reconciliation. And, even if it does end in divorce, it makes things very acrimonious and expensive. I have seen so many divorces turn out this way (including my parents and PIL). And for what? If you have children, you have to find a way to co-parent and a civil relationship is useful for that.

No one has suggested begging or losing self respect, or not getting on with a single life. All the above would be detrimental to any hope of a long term reconciliation anyway. Crude squabbles over the children are just as demeaning as begging. The best way to self respect is maintaining one's dignity.

larrygrylls Fri 05-Apr-13 16:38:59

"Don't let him. Go and see a solicitor and insist on a formal contact arrangement."

Surely someone should want to see their children?! I would hate, as a child or adolescent, to know that I was going to stay with my father because a court obliged him to have me.

I am not familiar with this area as I am married and both my parents and PIL divorced with late adolescent and adult children, respectively, but can you force someone to see their children against their will?

onefewernow Fri 05-Apr-13 16:41:01

No they can't force him, and shouldn't.

If he only wants the fun end of it, though, they will see through it sooner or later. They aren't dim!

catsrus Fri 05-Apr-13 16:45:46

Don't use your dcs to get at him - you will lose them too.

I was totally honest with mine, I could not, and would not, lie to them so when they spotted something was wrong I told them (they were all teenagers). They have all said they appreciate the fact I was honest and know they can trust me to be honest. My exH lied about the OW for months and it will take a long time before he rebuilds trust with his dcs. one does not have contact, one resumed contact after a year, the other maintained contact. only one of them has met his new wife.

You need to detach from him and support your dcs in maintaining any contact they want with their father. It is not about what is easy for him - it is about what they need. I pity my exH for missing out on seeing his dcs grow wings and finally fly the nest - they are turning into lovely adults and it's been a great couple of years for me getting to know them without being part of the 'mum and dad' unit.

Hopasholic Fri 05-Apr-13 17:16:05

I don't see it as you 'using your DC's to get to him' at all.

It's about making him face the music rather than making the frigging music.

If he wants to go his own way then that's fine but with that comes the reality of shared access. When exactly is he going to see his DC's if he works full time and plays bloody gigs all weekend?

You're right to be bloody angry with him OP. I am!

I'd send a friend to watch the gig and report back.

fuzzpig Fri 05-Apr-13 17:37:44

Maybe it would be better to just get him out for now, it gives you some space to gently tell the DCs what's happening, and start any contact arrangement after your trip away.

Telling them now and straight away sending them to wherever he's staying (which if it isn't an OW, is possibly just some guy's couch?) would be very unsettling IMO.

houseworkhater Fri 05-Apr-13 17:44:38

He has finished work and gone with the band.

He didn't even come into the house.
I just happened to see the band van driving away. I knew he would be in a terrible rush and originally had said I would make him some sandwiches to take.
Needles to say he knew better than to assume I'd do that now.

I did think he would come into the house and at least bring his work clothes in.

Think he has gathered I'm not amicable at the moment.

I won't make him take dds tomorrow, they will just wonder what the hell is going on.

houseworkhater Fri 05-Apr-13 17:46:21

I don't think he will sleep here tonight, I think he will sleep at this "band members" house.

i have made it clear to him to go.

houseworkhater Fri 05-Apr-13 17:46:47

Booked a hair appointment and bought some new shoes too!

Xales Fri 05-Apr-13 17:49:59

I think that now he has 'ended' it with you he will be shagging someone else tonight if he isn't already sad

Get yourself to the CAB and a solicitor. Work out what you are entitled to. Knowledge is a position of strength.

Also if you have any doubts that he may have played away please consider an STI check.

mutantninjamyrtle Fri 05-Apr-13 18:04:52

...but... make sure that you inform him that you are very upset and the weekend after next you will be going away to get some space and think everything over. And HE will have to have the children that weekend.

So he has plenty of time to organise something, but also can't shirk his responsibilities. You should not be expected to carry the children on your own now that he has swanned off into the land of mid-life crisis.

AnyFucker Fri 05-Apr-13 18:09:11

I think he thinks you two are now on a "break" Jeremy Kyle Style

He can go shag a few silly young girls, and come back when he needs some home comforts/his socks washed/his sandwiches making etc

But it wouldn't be "cheating" 'cos you were "on a break"

OP, you are not going to watch the gig on Sunday are you ?

JaceyBee Fri 05-Apr-13 18:20:42

As far as I understand it standard access/custody arrangements for separated couples are one night in the week and every other weekend. That is what myself and most other separated I know do anyway. I think you should push for this. Why should he get all the opportunity to Pisa about with his (almost certainly shite) band every weekend while you look after HIS dcs?! You need to have the same opportunities to go out, see friends, shag around, meet someone else as he does. He doesn't know if he wants a family anymore? Well tough shit, he's fucking got one! Don't let him duck out of his responsibilities.

Ruprekt Fri 05-Apr-13 18:30:03

Goodness there are some horrible men out there.

How can anyone be married for 20 years, have 3 kids and then decide it's not for them.

Well done on hair appointment and new shoes OP!!smile

Get angry now and do not go and watch him on Sun night. If he is having an affair she will be there.

The time is now to sort your own life out and pursue your own hobbies and interests. I would make life difficult for him too.....just cos I could.

Git.

Leavenheath Fri 05-Apr-13 18:38:34

The OP's kids are 16, 14 and 10. The older two can decide how often they want to see their father and to make the arrangements with him directly. No need for OP's involvement at all, apart from needing to know where they'll be at any given time. Which leaves the 10 year old. Children of that age are coming to the point when they have strong preferences about where they want to spend their time. At that age, they often don't want to spend a whole weekend at dad's and will probably prefer evenings and days out. OP can sort all this out at later date. Most important thing now is to get husband to move out officially and tell kids he's left. Then next week go to solicitor's.

houseworkhater Fri 05-Apr-13 18:43:29

I would have gone to watch the gig on Sunday before all this.

I don't think I will now as if he wanted me there he wouldn't have said he wants to leave.

I don't want to go and feel like crap.

Ruprekt Fri 05-Apr-13 18:45:50

Will you be ok financially houseworkhater?

Definitely don't go......get a movie and popcorn and snuggle on sofa with or without kids. smilesmile

houseworkhater Fri 05-Apr-13 18:53:13

Yes my eldest 2 can decide for themselves when they see him. But I am not having the eldest go and then expect me to pick her up and take her from A to B because he has other arrangements.
I won't do it.
I don't want her to suffer but I have sacrificed my own needs for 16 plus years.

I just won't do it and dh will have to make a choice, he will have to tell her no and explain why he won't be there for her. Of course he might put her before his own needs, that is his decision.

I am more than happy to do drop offs and pick ups when I am looking after the kids.

I have told dh this during our talks, he just doesn't seem to realise how fortunate he has been with me. That sounds awful but I have repeatedly told him that it won't be like this. You are either married or single, I don't do inbetween.
He seems to think that I will arrange my time around him. I told him that I won't be a nanny.

My good friend and her dp have both said in the past that dh has a very good life, he just doesn't realise it. When my dh heard this he got annoyed with her dp, saying what does he know.

houseworkhater Fri 05-Apr-13 19:00:52

Next weekend I have arranged for a sleepover for dd2 at ours.
I am going to stick to that and I have invited the mums around too. We are good friends so if this situation is still in place I might tell them what has gone on.

I also have committed to something involving both dds and the sleepover girls so i will continue with that.

I don't have a problem with that.

We are also going to see dd1 in a show soon.

Hopefully I will find the strength not to push him over the balcony during the lights down.

cjel Fri 05-Apr-13 19:18:10

Stay strong and calm. House, I would leave the next couple of weekends as set but make it very clear that he has to have them every other weekend after that. They have to stay with him from friday to sunday not just picked up and brought back to you. they should all have to stay at his, Your weekend will be for you to do what you want and that should be made clear to him that doesn't include having to be home for DCs. It is harsh but as you said either you are a family living together or you are not. Your dcs are not just for when he can fit them in. You co parent and if he doesn't like you shouting at them he shouldn't be leaving them in your care any way. They all need to see you are not housewife and mum. YOu had life before Dcs and are now going to have a life after them.

carabossse Fri 05-Apr-13 19:55:15

Re: the suitability of his living arrangements. Two weeks is sufficient for him to sort that out or book a hotel that they can all stay in.

OP it'll be a difficult transition but you must not consider the how and why and where of how his new life is. I know you're used to looking after him but just let him sort it all out. It's for him to be reliable and think through the details now e.g. what needs to be done, how will that work out. It'll be a wake-up call too.

Your children can stay with him a few times then decide on longer-term arrangements that suit you and them. I agree wholeheartedly that fitting in around his commitments and continuing to do the heavy lifting of being a parent when he does odd occasions to suit himself is the wrong way to begin. Your children will only respect you if you show self-respect.

Good luck. And start taking control.

(fwiw I expect that if he doesn't have an OW it's not for want of trying. He probably has an idealised view of what his wonderful life would be if you weren't holding him back. When the offers from nubile young Swedes don't materialise he'll likely be back with his tail between his legs only for you to be back in this position in a year our so when he again feels constrained. Just my opinion of course.)

carabossse Fri 05-Apr-13 20:04:31

To clarify- above when I said "if you weren't holding him back" I meant that's what I think his opinion probably is- it's not mine! He sees you and his family as a responsibility and the single life as some sort of magical world of opportunity that he can't fully explore or enjoy because of his family responsibilities.

lulu2 Fri 05-Apr-13 20:23:31

Have you considered still going to the gig?

AnyFucker Fri 05-Apr-13 20:31:57

why, lulu ?

Leavenheath Fri 05-Apr-13 20:55:17

When the kids are meant to be with him, there must be a very clear expectation that he will be doing everything for them. Their washing, their ironing, their meals and their ferrying around. You're dead right about that.

It's exactly because he's had such a cushy number with you that means he's found some other woman to look after him. Let's face it, he'd have a job surviving on his own wouldn't he? No way would he do that willingly.

ChippingInIsEggceptional Fri 05-Apr-13 21:11:05

LULU what the hell would she want to do that for?

He's a complete and utter wanker - he really is. I hope you can see that for yourself soon. It's hard when your heart is breaking, but he's been walking over you for far too long!

SundaeGirl Fri 05-Apr-13 21:22:30

I think there's a chance he's not a complete and utter wanker (although he's behaving like one). It's possible he's completely high on OW/Band Life and cannot see sense. Best course of action: leave him to it.

Magicmayhem Fri 05-Apr-13 23:45:10

Ladies you all seem under the usumption that MR houseworkhater must have the children certain times... actually my solicitor told me its easier to stop a Father seeing his children than to make him see them... My ex does no more than he has to and cancels them at the drop of a hat... has never taken them on holiday... and refuses to feed them doing a weekly visit when he picks them up at 6pm as he says he can't afford it... and there is nothing I can do...

good luck houseworkhater...

skyebluesapphire Sat 06-Apr-13 00:34:16

My XH sees DD every other weekend. When he first left it was one night a week and every Sunday. Now he regularly forgets to ring her in the week, and doesnt have her on a Friday night because he wont arrange his work around her. So he has her 10am Saturday to 6pm Sunday every other weekend and the rest of the time is his own to do whatever he likes with, while I have to arrange work, and social life and everything around DD.

You are right in that there is no in between. When XH first left, I let him come in the house twice a week, cooked him tea, let him put DD to bed. I did this because I thought that we were having a trial separation and that that it would help. I also made it quite clear to him that this would stop if we were getting divorced.

XH chooses not to have DD in the holidays too as he has to work. This is something else that he has gone back on, as in mediation last year it was agreed he would have her on Mondays in the school holidays. Now he says that if he has her, he will have to work and she will have to go with him

happyAvocado Sat 06-Apr-13 00:53:33

I have put my life on hold since ex and I split.
I do all the drop offs during the week as I chosen to work 7-4 pm so I am at home by 5:30 to take them to their activities.
He hardly sees them and I am very upset about it as they complain they don't see him much (10 min in passing in the last 3 weeks!).
I am going away on a business, but when I am back in 2 weeks time I am going to insist he does look after them every other weekend whilst I go out or just do noting in my own company smile

something2say Sat 06-Apr-13 07:42:00

Ijust wanted to stop in here to give a massive hug to the op who probably feels horrible after the last two days.

But also to say this.

Don't worry too much about the women and the band. My boyfriend has been a musician all his life and he and his friends are all loyal to their wives and girlfriends. Your husband may feel that he didnt develop music enough, not that he wants to chase women or be adored by the, for being on a stage. If he is in a band he will have a lot of work to do to give a good performance, forget staring at women. It is about the music at the end of the day. I once brought this up with my partner, what about all the glamorous women!!!! When I might be at home with a baby one day!! And he took me in his arms and said that was far more important to him, a happy home in the madness of touring, a stable anchor. There aren't thy many groupies believe it or not, and they are not looked upon hugely favourably.

Having said all this, I do agree with the others when they advise you to let him get out there on the road if he wants to. It may be exciting for him at first and he may love th freedom, but everyone needs a home to come back to. The road is lonely, the music business is cruel and he may be ditched out of the band....wait and see. Meanwhile I loved the advice of the haircut and new clothes.....let him realise what he has lost....you sounded to me like a laugh and like you two had been good mates....let him see a bit of that again.....but let him miss it first.

I will be at your back watching how this one turns out. Good luck xxxx

cjel Sat 06-Apr-13 09:11:02

what a lovely post something. I would strongly advise OP to start looking after herself as well.

CouthySaysEatChoccyEggs Sat 06-Apr-13 09:56:57

Pffff...bollocks to 'letting him have a home to come back to'.

He WILL have a home to go back to - wherever he rents now that HE has ended their marriage.

Why the hell should the OP take back someone who has so little thought for her?!

Don't be a doormat, OP.

I think you are right to insist on set contact, EOW and one midweek overnight AS MINIMUM.

If HE doesn't want to do that, then HE can explain that to the DC's. Let them see what a git he is from his own mouth.

I would, however, tell the DC's ASAP that he has decided to leave the marriage. They are too old not to be told straight away. Just say it matter of factly, and direct any questions they may have to their father - they can ask HIM why he doesn't want to live there any more!

Yes, he might tell them a load of bull - but at 16 & 14, they are certainly old enough to see through BS.

something2say Sat 06-Apr-13 10:22:01

I didn't say let him come back to a home, I said let him see that everyone needs a home to come back to. If he decides that he has made a mistake and wants to come home, she will then hold all of the cards.

WorrySighWorrySigh Sat 06-Apr-13 14:00:03

How dare he think it is okay to spit on his current life then turn his back on it claiming he didnt want it in the first place. I dont think that the OP kept him tied up in the cellar, only allowed out to go and work. He wanted to be with OP or he would have left long ago.

This very silly and selfish 10 year old in a man's body has decided that he wants all the fun things. Well, he is a fool. Life isnt like that.

We are not entitled just walk away from our lives and commitments because we have decided that life would be more fun somewhere else.

cjel Sat 06-Apr-13 14:23:17

Oh worry. That resonated for me, mine took OW out and when we went away to discuss it he said he wanted to travel(i don't like flying) When I ponted out all the places he had been to ( Aus,NZ,Bahamas USA, Malaysia,Europe, etc etc. )he laughed and said he hadn't been to russia. we travelled europe together. I left. two years later the only trip abroad they've done is europe for the weekend. It really is sad that they think all this adventure is worth the grief they give their Dcs and Dgcs in our case.

houseworkhater Sat 06-Apr-13 15:38:40

Hello,

Woke up this morning and assumed dh had gone.

Wenut downstairs and he was asleep on the sofa.

I went to my gym class and anticipated breaking down.
It went well,lots of people speaking to me wanting to know my arrangements for the weekend. Ii can't be that bad I thought, people seem to like me, perhaps it's just at home that I am such a bitch.

Thinking about it lots of the gym people have asked me to go on nights out and you know what, I never have. All because it hgas never fitted in with dh or kids.

Went out with ds, didn't stay in town much, oh well he isn't a shopper!

Told dd1 that her dad would have to take her to her pt job, he has.

Anyway me and ds are back in house. Dh text me and says dd2 at her friends, he is out.

I ask him when he is leaving cos if he doesn't then I will go. He replies saying that he is out(band) at 6 so I will have to pick both dd1 and dd2 up.

I tell him I am going out, just to friends or family, so he will have to get dd2 and repeat about him leaving.

He has text back saying that i know he is out with band and has told dd2 friend's mother that I will collect her!!!!!

The twat has no idea that bloody leaving/separating means we are no longer together!

I replied saying that as of now I don't give a flying fuck what he does or doesn't do, his arrangements are no longer my concern.

I am bloody gobsmacked at this. Is this normal?

I can't even fucking pack a case and go, as I can't leave dd2 alone (dd1 at work).

God he really thinks he can have it all his way doesn't he? He needs it spelled out to him that now he has decided to go, his responsibilities will increase not diminish. Because you will no longer be there to back him up.

Selfish, stupid fool.

Suggested text to twunt: "As we are now not together as a couple, you need to leave and find an alternative place to live. It will need to be suitable for you to have the children every other weekend. When you have the children, all pick ups and drop offs will need to be arranged by you. You may not assume that I will help you with these arrangements because I will make arrangements of my own for my time when the children are with you. I am also entitled to a life and some freedom from time to time. Now that you are a part time dad, I'm sure your time with the children will be more precious to you than ever, so obviously you will not allow the band to stop you doing your fatherly duties."

houseworkhater Sat 06-Apr-13 16:07:49

I am going from tearful and soul destroyed to pissed off, resentful and bitter.

He is with the band all weekend-we could have gone somewhere under normal circumstances.

He was either working (normal job) or with the band all last weekend and yet all he can think off is that we don't have sex often and that the house, although very clean is not immaculate.

I feel like running away.

I am verging between telling the kids and not saying anything.

Yes we should tell them together but he is NEVER FUCKING HERE, so we can't tell them together.

I think I need to go out, I think I'm going to have a breakdown. Sorry for sounding dramatic.

I am going to do this weekend-bloody ruined for me even though I am off work, then do as planned next weekend. Then that is it.

He will have to sort the kids out and take them for the weekend. He has even managed to sherk his responsibilities as he hasn't driven anywhere, I know wherever he is will involve him having a beer with friends and that I can't have a glass of wine as I, rather conveniently for him, have to pick up both dds at separate times.

Obviously he can't pick dd2 up as he will have been drinking.

houseworkhater Sat 06-Apr-13 16:13:05

Scarlet- that is exactly what I am thinking.

I just can't be bothered replying back to him, he just doesn't see any link between how I feel and the lack of time he gives to his family, or how this could possibly relate to my sexual feelings.

I think I am going to call at my mums, it won't be easy but I don't want to be in the house.
It has never bothered me before. I am thinking of all the things we could be doing together if this hadn't happened. Feel like life is slipping away from me.

onefewernow Sat 06-Apr-13 16:23:11

Pack his bags.

Do it.

He is taking the piss, and then some.

He is making it clear how he sees this split: that he will go when he is good and ready, and that you will pick up anything, whenever and whatever he doesn't fancy.

You MUST take back control of your life.

Pack his bags.

houseworkhater Sat 06-Apr-13 16:30:20

Right I have just text him to ask when he is leaving, and to ask about the kids.

He has text back 3 months!!!!!

I have told him to come straight home as I must speak to him asap. He is coming, been in pub!

I cannot live like this I really can't.

MadAboutHotChoc Sat 06-Apr-13 16:30:48

yet all he can think off is that we don't have sex often and that the house, although very clean is not immaculate.

talk about scraping the bottom of the barrel hmm he wants to throw away 20 years for these pathetic reasons.

I am even more convinced there is an OW - selfish bastard angry

Take control, pack his things and tell him to fuck off.

MadAboutHotChoc Sat 06-Apr-13 16:32:13

He says 3 months becuase its not convenient for OW to have him yet.

Tell him he has to leave NOW. Take control please otherwise you will have months of this crap.

WorrySighWorrySigh Sat 06-Apr-13 16:34:21

If you have decided that it is over then I would get things moving sooner rather than later. With family commitments gone he may decide to 'give the band a real go' and give up his job.

Before he mortgages your future so that he can set himself up for a life on the road you need to make sure that you get what financial security you can based on him having a proper job.

AnyFucker Sat 06-Apr-13 16:36:03

Perhaps OW is not free for 3 months ?

BalloonSlayer Sat 06-Apr-13 16:37:42

Can you have his bags packed by the time he arrives?

Or at least have the suitcases down from the loft...

Angelico Sat 06-Apr-13 16:44:01

So sorry OP. I am so angry on your behalf. He does not get three months to fuck you about. Tell him he has till next weekend. Get to a solicitor on Monday. He's a bastard.

pinkypig Sat 06-Apr-13 16:57:05

I really feel for you House.

He really has to leave now to give you some space and time to sort out how YOU feel about your life, your kids, and reflect on what has happenend over the last couple of years.

I think if you step back and look you will see that he is not the man you thought he was/he used to be. He has said he wants to leave. Make him go now.

So sorry for what you're going through but you will be ok and you and your kids deserve MUCH better.

pinkypig Sat 06-Apr-13 16:58:19

Agree find yourself a family law solicitor as soon as you can next week to discuss in theory at least where you stand.

Troubledjo Sat 06-Apr-13 17:00:47

At the moment this is all very new and you must be feeling very emotional. I really would try to focus on one step at a time - you don't need to decide all your childcare arrangements right now. I would try to get some space so you can think about it all a bit more calmly. The best way to do that for now is to get him out of the house - at least for a while. I would try to be very calm (easier said than done I know) and just tell him you need some space and you think it is best if he moves out for the time being.
You don't need to issue any ultimatum or make this a permanent thing - it's a perfectly reasonable request. Once he is gone then you can decide how YOU want to move forward. As for the children, it's really hard but try not to get them too involved. Maybe just tell them something fairly neutral like 'mum and dad haven't been getting on very well and you both need some space while you try to work things out'. I don't think you need to do that together if he isn't around. Or if you want to make it more about him then you can say 'dad isn't happy' but then you run the danger of sounding like a victim.
And, unfortunately, the reality is that you can't make him do his fair share of parenting if he doesn't want to. Sadly my daughter's dad has done very little but I have always made it a priority to make sure that they could have a good relationship regardless of how much or how little he did in practical terms. I have never made excuses for him but at the end of the day he is her dad - you don't want your kids to feel torn between the two of you. Children are very perceptive and they will see how it is and who does what for them without you having to say anything.
It takes time to work all this out though and you have lots of stages to go through - as I said at the beginning, don't try to race ahead too much, just take one step at the time and make decisions when things are a bit calmer. Good luck.

Gigondas Sat 06-Apr-13 17:01:04

Hang in there houseworker- keep that anger and kick him out.

He can find somewhere else to live.

And you are completely right to respond that if you are seperated, that is it . Not there to do his errands.

I predict ow wont last cos he sounds like a fucking tool.

Three months? I'd want to tell him he has three hours!

No. No. No. And no again. He cannot just announce he's had enough of family life and doesn't like being married, and then hang around like the proverbial bad spell for three fucking months!

What is giving him the impression he is in charge of how this goes? I believe the op is about to enlighten him about that one!

ivykaty44 Sat 06-Apr-13 17:20:57

Is this normal?

it is very very normal for a man to want to seperate and then expect everything to stay the same - this is it seems how a lot of men work. They think they can leave and the mother will just carry on the same picking u after them and texting them to nag them.

it comes as a bit of a shock to many on both sides that this is what is thought to be the carry on.

My advise would be to spell it out loud and clear and sick to your guns - if he texts to say you must do pick up - you text back and say

Can't do that as I am over the limit to drive as not my weekend - you will need to sort out your own arrangements for your dc

Don't back down and get it straight from the start

Disengage - what he does or doesn't do is no concern of yours - don't get drawn into an argument and remember the good ole mms saying

no is a complete sentence

if he wants to go out drinking with his buddes and playing band thats fine

but on your weekend off you do what you want to do -and don't answer calls from him - let him text which gives you time to work out how to text n and o

if you give an inch he will take a mile and carry on playing in the band and having a carefree life when he really has three children that are also his responsibility

SundaeGirl Sat 06-Apr-13 17:33:44

Pack his bags and drop them off at the pub for him.

Finola1step Sat 06-Apr-13 17:36:11

Wow House. So let me get this straight. He wants out of the marriage. He isn't sure if family life is for him. He wants to play "band practise" as and when it suits him. He decides if the house is clean and tidy. He decides if there is or isn't enough sex in the marriage. He decides your schedule by making himself unavailable for the children. He decides when he wants to parent.

And now he gets to decide that he will stay for another 3 months!

Why? Because that's what suits him and his plans, whatever they may be.

Time to get angry OP. Time for black bags on doorstep. Because OP you may have forgotten this but you get to decide who lives with you. You can decide that enough is enough. Good luck.

Ahhhcrap Sat 06-Apr-13 17:40:33

3 months!!!! He us taking the piss big time... So your expected to put your life on hold and live in a horrid atmosphere.. Sod that.. Pack his bags and tell him to pick up this afternoon .

ATouchOfStuffing Sat 06-Apr-13 17:43:11

Why would you bother supporting him in the band when that seems to have been a major factor in him wanting to leave his family? Let him play with the kids and then in a few years when they all get married and have kids he will have to face the consequences of what he has lost.
You deserve better than this and, being a single parent myself, I actually believe you would be happier on your own - you do everything anyway so just one less person to worry about and clean up after!

Cheeky twat. Tell him, no sorry, 3 months of this will be death by a thousand cuts, piss off now please. you will feel so much better when you take some control back. Take care x

ATouchOfStuffing Sat 06-Apr-13 17:48:56

sorry seem to have missed a page.
He said before his band mate could have him - tell him he has to leave today as you aren't living with someone who has checked out and you are not a maid in a hotel.
You must be strong here - he is being an arse so don't beg or bend to his whims. He needs to grow up and the only way he might appreciate you i by living on his own and seeing that the grass isn't greener.

IAmNotAMindReader Sat 06-Apr-13 18:12:15

Right he has told you its over, nothing you do is good enough. His band comes before his children and he has somewhere else to go and is still treating the home as his own.
He wants you to crawl over broken glass and jump through his impossible hoops while he lives the life of a carefree teenager.
Mid life crisis, affair or him ramping up emotional abuse (which is what this now is) by setting you up to fail and constantly moving the goal posts and telling you how unreasonable everyone else thinks you are it doesn't matter he is going to damage your mental health the longer he stays and he doesn't care so he needs to leave now.

ClaireDeTamble Sat 06-Apr-13 18:17:07

Pack his bags for him and boot him out. Seriously. Do it tonight and put the deadlock on the door when you have collected the girls.

3 months indeed. Pffffft.

50shadesofknackered Sat 06-Apr-13 18:47:09

What a tosser! 3 months shock Please take control of this situation and stand up for yourself, he is treating you like a fool. Why should you leave your home and more importantly your children? Why should his actions and treatment of you possibly affect your relationship with them? Pack his bag and lock the door! You deserve better! I know you would like your marriage to work (why is beyond me when he has treated you so badly) but this will never happen until he is forced to face up to the realities of being single. I do really think op, that even if he suddenly changes his mind, declares undying love for you and begs forgiveness, that you are just setting yourself up for future heartache if u take him back. He will do this again and again, and again and again..... I also think there is probably another woman, so please be strong and kick his sorry arse out.

Corygal Sat 06-Apr-13 18:49:38

Honestly...

"YOU'VE GOT THREE HOURS NOT THREE MONTHS".

Start packing the stuff.

Messandmayhem Sat 06-Apr-13 19:03:23

Who the fuck does he think he is? 3 months? Is he high?

Tell him he has 3 hours before you pile his stuff in the garden and torch it to pack whatever he wants and fuck off to his bandmates sofa.

No no no. Pack his stuff. Leave it outside. Tell him his bandmates can help him move his stuff. Tonight. Maybe his OW could help too?

Sorry this is happening to you.

3 MONTHS?
What planet is he on?

cjel Sat 06-Apr-13 19:47:33

Sorry he is behaving like this, it must be a nightmare for you, you had wanted to save this relationship, Now is the time to start saying how you want things. He must leave now and understand that you will not be dictated to by him any more. You will be lovely company for your friends at the gym, you will be able to choose to go out or stay in. This next little while will seem like hell - it will improve when you have your own head space to consider what you want without him telling you what you must do anymore.

MadBraLady Sat 06-Apr-13 19:48:07

<delurks> Is he having a bloody laugh??

Three months is very precise isn't it. Almost like the kind of timescale somebody (an OW, say) would have on moving out of whatever their current domestic arrangement is. hmm

He needs a wake-up call up the arse preferably.

carabossse Sat 06-Apr-13 19:48:19

For your own sanity and for your children's sake you must close this off this weekend. Tonight or tomorrow is plenty of time. The idea of three months is ridiculous. He believes that he can live in your home with you doing all the work while he lives like a teenager.

No more asking. Tell him that as of hh:mm o'clock you no longer live together and that if he hasn't collected his things by then you'll leave them in bags outside. Or if youre up to it say that you're leaving at that time and he'll need to be home for the kids.

MadBraLady Sat 06-Apr-13 19:51:44

Gosh, this has made me cross. Sending you brew, flowers and strength, house. He needs to feel some consequences.

Scarlet is bang on here: He needs it spelled out to him that now he has decided to go, his responsibilities will increase not diminish. Because you will no longer be there to back him up.

Angelico Sat 06-Apr-13 21:42:41

Shrek Forever After is on... I can't help thinking about your situation OP.

Shrek / OP's husband: 'I didn't know what I had till I lost it.'

captainbarnacle Sat 06-Apr-13 22:22:57

Three months! No no no.

I think you need to plan your life without him - and that means not relying on him to be a weekend dad either. Chuck him out, say he's welcome to have the kids on a regular basis - and that means all the journeys, all the pick ups, the whole weekend - or not at all. The kids need stability. You need to stop relying on him for anything at all.

I worry he'll choose the band and his new life over his children. But that is HIS CHOICE. You can't make him be a Dad. And you shouldn't be in a limbo future with him hanging around for 3 more months, and you being a taxi service and babysitting service for his children. You deserve WAY more than that.

Take control of your future.

skyebluesapphire Sat 06-Apr-13 22:54:55

I hope you are Ok. I do agree though. He can't agree that its over and then think that he will stay for 3 months. If its over, its over. if he refuses to go, then you draw up very strict ground rules which means that you no longer do anything for him at all.

your H needs to understand that when the DC are with him, he is responsible for them, any clubs, any pickups dropoffs etc. he cannot expect you to run round after him still.

My XH seems to only want Dd when it is convenient to him. He seems unable to understand that i have a life too, that I have to work too and that i have to arrange everything around DD for most of the month. He has to do it for 4 days a month, 2 nights. The other day he asked if he could bring her back early as he needs to go out. I replied no, get a babysitter like I have to.

I understand that you probably dont want the marriage to end, I felt the same, but your H has made it pretty clear that he is out of it. that means that he needs to face up to the reality of what life will be like from now on. You need to agree a set schedule for access for starters. and he needs to be there for his DC, work or no work.

olgaga Sat 06-Apr-13 23:11:22

When you are done with the immediate trauma and can face thinking about the future, there's some good advice and links here.

Good luck OP.

DixieD Sat 06-Apr-13 23:36:13

3 MONTHS?? Is he fucking serious? Dickhead. 3 months my fucking arse. Fucking joker. 3 MONTHS? He has no shame whatsoever. He doesn't give a shit about you. You are just a doss house until his better accommodation is available.
Tell him to get fucked you useless tosser that your family one is not available to someone who has decided family life is not for them and to piss off to his wonderful band mates couch.
Fucking hell my hand is actually itching to slap him.

DixieD Sat 06-Apr-13 23:36:54

*home not one

houseworkhater Sun 07-Apr-13 00:27:12

Right.

Very, very long and exhausting story cut short as I am going to bed.

He came home we talked at my insistance.
I asked what more could possibly be done. he said it was all my fault.
I said he had to go.
he said he can't have kids blah blah.

I told him either go now or I will go.
In the end I left and went to mums.
I chickened out of telling her.

I had second thoughts, text him asked him to come with me to take dd2 tp party. i told him I would come to gig.

He then said he had told ds. Ds was alone in house he said don't come to gig, may confuse dcs(????).
I picked up dds and had no option but to tell them that dad and i were separating.

They cried.
I saw his phone.
I am crap with technology so I had to ask dd1 to get into it.
Saw a womans name.
Had to ask dd1 to check who it was, she saw the text, begged me not to read them.
Of course I did and made a note of her name and no.

I had to go out then and when i came back the phone had gone!!!!

I hadn't read everything but got this gist.

I made enquiries, my good friend came round totally flabergasted.

She told me to ring the woman. I did I told her who I was and that I knew she knew my husband, she said she vaguely knew him.

I called her a liar, told her I knew everything. She hung up i text her and told her what I thought of her in no uncertain terms. I rang dh, he didn't answer, he did text.

I text him back and told him to see a good solicitor and that I will be applying for divorce citing adultery and that bitch who knew heis a married man with 3 children will be named as the ow, for her ancestors to forever see.

His bags are packed i have told him not to come into this house again. I said police will be called if he comes in.

Right to the very end I was doubting myself and would have let him come home until I found the messages.

He denies evertyhing.

I have contacted a friend, she has given me the name of an excellent divorce lawyer.

I have had to tell his mum we are apart.

The kids were upset, i really didn't want them to know about ow but I couldn't hack into his phone alone.

DD1 says she hates him.

says he asked her earlier who she would live with if we split up.

She has said if she ever meets this ow she will "kick the fucking shit out of her" She never swears but I have sworn to my friend all night, in privacy.

None of them can understand why there dad has done this.

we have google ow. dd1 cannot believe it.

After all this and me offering to alter do whatever to save marriage and dh saying no/not seeming interested.

His last text begged me to talk to him, face to face.

He has said i can't call her a whore. i have said I will call her and him what the fuck I like.

Turned phone off, not answering any more calls.

I actually feel better as at last I understand that none of this is my fault.

Thank you all for your wisdom and help.

x

Runwayqueen Sun 07-Apr-13 00:32:24

I have no words of wisdom, but just wanted to send you a hug. Sorry that you are having to go through this

McPie Sun 07-Apr-13 00:35:17

No words I could ever say you could make this any better for you but I wish to offer you the most unmumsnet hug ever

skyebluesapphire Sun 07-Apr-13 00:39:08

(((hugs))) to you. sorry that you had to discover that, but like you say, maybe you can start to realise now that this is not your fault, that he is just one more bastard following that fucking script.

I dont swear much usually, but these sodding twats drive me to it as well.

I will bump the Mid Life Crisis script for you as well. it may help if you recognise some of the behaviour.

i am so sorry that you are going through this. Please stay strong. Kick him out and keep him out. Arrange regular contact for the DC with him and do not enable his relationship with them. i tried hard to make XH see Dd, but if he doesnt want to, there is nothing you can do about it. I think that your XH will be very selfish like mine and say that work comes first etc etc...

get some sleep, you need it xx

skyebluesapphire Sun 07-Apr-13 00:40:29

cant remember if this has been posted on your thread or not and too tired to check, but here it is

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/relationships/1527705-Midlife-crisis-this-is-the-script?msgid=38310054#38310054

ATouchOfStuffing Sun 07-Apr-13 00:50:59

Oh god House - so so sorry it has all come out like this. I am glad you have found your anger though, as it puts him into the position he needs to be in; the one who fucked up.
In a way, although she may wish she didn't know, DD1 sounds as though she will be a lot of support. I think your family know how hard you have worked to save a marriage that their father simply walked out on emotionally. They will know that he didn't think of them when he did it too, which is possibly something to bear in mind when thinking about their reactions over the next few months.

I am thinking of you here - you must be pretty shaken. Just hold onto that anger and do as much as you can logistically working things out - call CSA etc. Keep busy and work on getting what you want from this situation. Heaven knows he has been getting what he wants for long enough.
Huge wine and unMNly hugs.

Finola1step Sun 07-Apr-13 00:57:27

house you are amazing.

Night night. Keep posting tomorrow. There will be lots of support and advice. Take care.

ChippingInIsEggceptional Sun 07-Apr-13 01:10:41

Hug brew wine chocolate...

He is one of the many utter bastards sad It's a script - we can tell you what will happen next, almost word for word sad

I'm sorry your kids had to see those texts and I'm sorry there was an affair for them to find out about, but as there was I'm not sorry they know. It's actually better for the kids to know the truth than to wonder why/blame themselves/blame the remaining parent etc. The truth helps them make some sense of what is happening - as shit as it is, and your reaction to it helps them to understand that putting up with shit like that isn't what you should do.

One of the first things you need to do is direct your anger to your H - HE is the one who has broken his vows, she owes you nothing and is inconsequential - you have to do that for your own good. Direct ALL of your anger at HIM.

Stay strong and don't let him try to talk you around about anything.

putyourhatonsweetie Sun 07-Apr-13 01:26:27

delurking again to tell you I think you are amazing ...picture your life without this utter bastard holding you back.

lunar1 Sun 07-Apr-13 03:31:38

I'm do sorry it has all come out like this, you are right you can call the pair of them what ever you like. Stay strong tomorrow, we are all here for support.

jynier Sun 07-Apr-13 03:57:22

So sorry, house, but thought that it would come to this conclusion.

You will have lots of support on here to help to get you through the terrible and painful shock.

Best wishes, thinking of you and your family. x

Sailormercury Sun 07-Apr-13 05:24:23

((Hugs))

50shadesofknackered Sun 07-Apr-13 07:26:57

I'm sorry this has happened but at least it's been the final straw and you've taken action. Good for you! What a bastard he is! At least he can't sweet talk the kids now. You've done the right thing op, stay strong and make him pay with the divorce. Lets hope the ow is worth it.

What an evening you had, so sorry. But at least now you know. Now the truth is out and it is not what he has been telling you all along. It was so awful of him to try and blame you for this.

Sounds like your anger will help you to deal with him. I think you said before that he'd been sucking up to your eldest dd and that she may go with him. Not going to happen that way now. Stupid stupid man.

houseworkhater Sun 07-Apr-13 08:07:19

I am exhausted.

He picked his stuff up from outside where I left it.

Thankfully he took my threats seriously and didn't try and come into the house.
I know realistically I can't stop him coming but my friend has said her dad will change my locks if I want.

He has repeatedly denied having an affair, having sex, saying it was all sexy banter with a friend. I asked him how he knew this friend, whom I knew nothing about, even though we have been together 20 years.

He said he has known her 15 years!
Although from the texts I managed to see she is connected through the band.
She is more than 10 years younger than me.
My friend knows who she is and says she is not attractive, not that that matters.

It read as though she is breastfeeding!!!!! Yet they were having chats of a sexual nature!!!

Myself and friend howled at the thought of dh showing the remotest interest in another man's baby, she really doesn't know him well at all.
She has 3 kids.

Oh and rightly or wrongly when i text her I told her we had had sex the previous night and that he told me he loved me, she is just another of his whores. Oddly enough she didn't respond.

He would like to talk now, I have got it all wrong. apparently texting ow that "He has told the kids" just means he has discussed our problems with a friend.
The only rl friends I have told have been best friends who dh knows.

Anyway, dd2 is at the party today, she is worried her dad may not come for her and will I let him in if he does. I have told her not to worry, of course I will let him in to get her. If he doesn't come I will take her to the party.

I told him I would meet ow at the gig tonight. Ii am not going just wanted to put the wind up their cosy little plan.

MadAboutHotChoc Sun 07-Apr-13 08:09:11

So sorry - but I know from experience that its like having a boil lanced, messy but at least you know what is really happening instead of having to swallow all his lies, getting your head messed up.

Hold your head high - you know none of this is your fault. It is all about his ego, issues and flaws. Stay strong x

houseworkhater Sun 07-Apr-13 08:11:52

Scarlet- my eldest dd said straight away, before the discovery of the ow, that she was staying with me.

I am sorry that she saw the texts but she says she is glad as she knows the truth. She says her dad is a bit of a child. Turns out when I took ds into town he didn't bother to prepare lunch for either dd. Dd2 was starving when i picked her up and it was after 6pm. Of course he had been too busy texting the ow to care about such trivial things as feeding a 10 year old child.

MadBraLady Sun 07-Apr-13 08:14:03

House, I'm so sorry. What a cowardly shit. sad

something2say Sun 07-Apr-13 08:28:52

Terribly sorry to hear what happened. I wasn't sure everyone was right earlier, especially about the OW, but now it has played out exactly that way.

At least you know it wasn't ever you. Did the texts make it obvious?

fuzzpig Sun 07-Apr-13 08:43:38

Oh no sad

I really thought everyone was jumping to conclusions about the possibility of an OW, I'm sorry it has turned out to be true. Although at least it gives you concrete evidence, there's no denying his affair.

Certainly explains the 3 month thing... long enough for her to tell her own H (if there is one) and her DCs hmm

Really glad you got him to leave.

something2say Sun 07-Apr-13 08:49:53

I thought the 3 months was about saving for a deposit and first months rent.

I wonder what today will bring? Is he going to want to come and talk?

houseworkhater Sun 07-Apr-13 08:56:06

I couldn't read all the texts.
I planned to read them when I came back but he came and got his phone, he obviously realised he had left it. I did wonder if he had left it on purpose but he can't have done or he wouldn't be so defensive.

The texts didn't say they had had sex or done anything. They did talk about her coming to the gig and she sounded all childish, not like a grown woman with children.
My dd1 clearly saw a text where he had stated "I have told the kids, I will be staying at X's (band members) tonight." So she knew he was married.

They talked about her breasts, and how hard they are because she needed to feed her child!!! She talked about getting a babysitter so she could see the band.
There was a future date and place mentioned where one of them, can't remember who, had asked the other to see a band that I had never heard of and the other had agreed to go.

I cannot remember when this took place, dd1 said I was reading the texts in the wrong chronological order, hence why I needed her to help me.

We had to leave and dd1 begged me to stop looking, the one about telling the kids upset her so much.
Dd1 said she would be able to forward all the messages to a save place for me to look at later, but when I got back he had collected his phone.

To be fair there was nothing that I saw that implicated actual adultery, my friend, whose exdh committed adultery thinks he hasn't actually do it yet. But she thinks that it will/may have led to that if I hadn't caught them both and called them both on it.

Luckily I made a note of this woman's name and number. he had rung her yesterday.

The also spoke about betting on the Grand National.

He categorically denied meeting her yesterday, even though I tried hard to bluff him.

She hung up after saying she vaguely knew him, then I said oh I have my dhs phone, yopu know him more than any vaguely don't you.

From our research I don't think she is married. Believe me, spiteful as it is, last night if she had have been I would have found his number and told her husband everything.

I have also told him (friend advised) that I have copied every single text to a secure sight and that I know everything. All not true.

I don't think he has had sex because he really believes I have copied the texts but he has chosen the green grass on the other side now.
Especially since the last things I said to him before I found the texts were that I would come to see the gig and we could spend today together, have a drink at the party or do whatever else he wanted.

I gave him the chance and he refused it.

What a shit.

Do you think you will tell her husband?

MadBraLady Sun 07-Apr-13 09:00:49

If he does, house, you know what to do - "we will talk through our solicitors". Be a broken record about it, don't get drawn in to his self-regarding drama. You need to prioritise yourself and the DCs now.

Stick to minimal communication necessary to sort out their lifts etc, though TBH you may just find he fucks off for a bit and you need to do everything for them for a while. Well, good luck to him. He wants freedom, he's got it, and all the work that goes with it. I wonder how intolerable and awful he will find it that he now has to pick up his own chuffing milk from the shop.

And try to do something nice for just you and the DCs today, you've all had such a rough time. Wishing you all luck and strength.

oh x post

something2say Sun 07-Apr-13 09:04:49

Yes and how is he going to get on living at someone else's place with their kids and mess and routines? Saturday night crashing is one thing, Sunday night / Monday morning is a completely different thing. Not that that makes a difference to you.

I am gutted for you. Fuck him though.

It seems "freedom" to him is a young single mum with 3 very young kids, breastfeeding and nappies. What a twat.

He has said he did not want a family after all. Seems he wanted her family.
Ask him where is the sense in that?!

What an utter utter poop.

SundaeGirl Sun 07-Apr-13 09:14:40

Poor you, what a horrific time you're having. I second letting him go for a bit. Life will be more predictable if you don't have to rely on him for a couple of weeks. After that, he'll need to take more responsibility.

Don't tell her DH, you'll just get drawn into drama. Right now you've not hurt anybody, tell him and you have.

Notsoblonde Sun 07-Apr-13 09:19:23

So sorry to read this, what an absolute twunt! Can you do some digging on is computer? it may be painful but could give you more evidence, does he have a fb account etc, use your anger and get a solicitor.

"Right now you've not hurt anybody, tell him and you have."

I totally disagree. She would not hurt anybody by telling a potential partner. The hurt would be caused by the OW and her husband, who have been playing away. OP would merely be the messenger telling OWs partner that she has been romancing another womans husband.

TheDoctrineOfSnatch Sun 07-Apr-13 09:37:47

Your H couldn't be bothered to get lunch for your DDs?

Bell end.

SundaeGirl Sun 07-Apr-13 09:41:35

Never be involved in someone else's pain if you don't have to be - and the OP doesn't have to be involved. It's really not her call.

I recently heard a story about a DH who found out his wife was having an affair from a pissed off phone call from the other wife. He was by the bedside of his dying brother.

Don't do it, OP, you just can't know what's happening in the DH's world.

MadBraLady Sun 07-Apr-13 09:43:44

I think House said she can't find that the woman is married so it's irrelevant.

houseworkhater Sun 07-Apr-13 10:05:44

I am going out with dd1.
Dh has texted dd1 to ask if he can come, she has said no. He has asked her to reconsider his mother's feelings and go and stay at her grandmaas, she is really upset. i have cried over this. yet again another person's feelings come before mine. I am devastated and he thinks it ok for both dds to leave me for 2 nights.

something2say Sun 07-Apr-13 10:18:21

Terrible behaviour!!!! Divide the family to make himself feel better.?? Get out of the home my dear, it will do you all good xx o glad it's sunny as well. X

ChippingInIsEggceptional Sun 07-Apr-13 10:27:43

I hope you have a nice time with DD1 smile What a knob asking if he could come!

It's a shame you couldn't read all of the texts, but please don't assume they haven't had sex as it will make you much more likely to consider forgiving him (you are already making excuses for him) - also, don't be too surprised if her baby ends up being his sad Utter twonk saying 'he doesn't think he really wanted a family' then getting involved with a woman with small kids - has he NO brain at all?

My crystal ball says that in 12 months you are going to wonder why you put up with this asswipe for so long grin but for now, just hang in there, knowing it does eventually hurt less x

As an aside...why didn't your DD2 make herself a sandwich or something - she's 10, quite old enough not to end up starving because an adult hasn't made her lunch?!

He's not doing himself any favours now with the dcs. Stupid man. Try and have a lovely time out with your dd.

ATouchOfStuffing Sun 07-Apr-13 10:42:04

Yes you go out and enjoy as much as possible today. DC know who is being silly here but it won't be easy for them. The more fun and inspiring things you can do together the quicker the bad times will go for all of you. Try to be spontaneous and enjoy your freedom!

MadBraLady Sun 07-Apr-13 10:48:30

Have I got this right?? He is asking his devastated daughter to run round doing emotional work for family members HE has upset by ending the marriage? This just gets lower and lower.

StoicButStressed Sun 07-Apr-13 11:06:22

House - huge hugs and more okay? I know you will be felling all over the place now but PLEASE try your best to:

Hang on to the rage and use it to strengthen you.

DON'T ever forget how you felt when you saw the confirmation of OW (Honestly I would spill it out in pages of writing it as both carthartic but - way more importantly - if he now tries to make you wobble, you can re-read it to remind yourself of REALITY)

This 'man' TOLD your DS you were splitting up - with obv NO thought for DS or DDs - when DS was alone; you two hadn't in any way agreed a 'comms plan' for DCs to minimise impact on them? Ditto left HIS 10 yr old child hungry? Please, don't forget those and ALL the rest of it, as you don't need me to tell you what an UTTER c*nt (sorry, really is ONLY word can think of) he is underneath the person you THOUGHT you were married to.

PLEASE contact CAB; Lawyer; W'Aid TOMM - ask your (fab sounding) friend if she can help with DCs or leave them at your or 'D'H's Ma's house whilst you do that lot.

Accept offer to change locks, as suspect he WILL try crawl back - and whilst you're (very validly) in that 'all over the place' bit, you may well fall for it if he gets you at a vulnerable moment.

And please, please, PLEASE try and look after yourself (the basics - eating properly/sleeping etc, as well as the go treat yourself.

He has lied and lied and lied and lied so however tempting it may be to believe him if he says something part of you still wants to hear, you KNOW it is/will be just pure BS.

As best you can, literally 'name the day/date' your marriage ended so you don't FORGET it HAS ended. Will help you out of that hellish no-mans's quicker than if you don't have it as a FACT in your head that this is OVER.

And lastly, please (seriously please) & no matter how vile it feels, or how much you may 'think you don't need to, PLEASE go to an STI clinic ASAP.

Wishing you and your DC's a better future - I know it may not feel like it right now, but you really have just been freed from something horrendous. And you WILL be happy one day when past the shock/rage/sadness/mourning for a marriage you thought was forever. I promise you that is a fact. Hugs xxxx

PS Sorry long but I do know that YOU need to know all of the above in order to survive right now and then to move forward (just as I can see many others also do KNOW that here, so you are NOT alone ok?)

Leavenheath Sun 07-Apr-13 11:12:09

Of course they've had sex! Men don't leave their wives and tell the OW that they've 'told the kids' just for sexy banter, or what ever nonsense name he attributed to his cheating. I'm sure he hasn't known her for 15 years, but he's certainly known her for at least a year because it's now even more obvious he was cheating when he threatened to leave a year ago.

What a horrible thing for a daughter to read about her father. I know you were stressed and not very techie with phones, but I'm really uncomfortable with that bit. Telling the OW you had sex with someone who's been treating you like shit and has had a long line of OWs makes you look a bit of a mug too.

Just get rid. Now you know how much he's been lying to you and how much this has hurt your DD, focus on you and your children now. DD is going to need a lot of help.

PenelopePortrait Sun 07-Apr-13 11:35:57

house I urge you to listen to the posters who are advising you to keep out of the drama. Think only of yourself and your DC's, cut him out of the picture for now. If you involve yourself with where he is, what he's doing, who said what to who and try and and 'talk' sense into him, then the only person who will be stressed and hurt is you.

From what you have said, ,my guess is he will expect you to 'give him a hard time' by phoning, texting etc.. I would do none of those things, get on with sorting out finances, solicitors, advice etc..

Your silence will put the wind up him far more that shouting will do. Tell him F all!

Mimishimi Sun 07-Apr-13 11:45:29

I'm really sorry for you. It just doesn't make sense ... if he wanted a carefree life and didn't think he was cut out for family life, why on earth would he be chasing a single mum with three kids? What will he do when she asks if he could pick up some milk and bread for her?

Leavenheath Sun 07-Apr-13 11:58:51

It does make sense. All that rubbish about 'family life' was just what he said instead of admitting he was having an affair. Every rubbish excuse he gave for his decision to leave should now be discounted. He left for someone else. That's all the OP needs to know.

skyebluesapphire Sun 07-Apr-13 12:08:33

house - you are getting some great advice on here. Please take some time to look after yourself. I know it is difficult, but try and eat something, just little and often and drink plenty of water. Make an appointment to see a solicitor and sort out tax credits, council tax discount, etc etc. You will start to feel more in control again if you sort all of these things out.

Ignore anything from him unless it is do to with the children. He needs to understand that his life from now on is going to be very different. Put yourself and the kids first now, dont worry about him and her. I know how hard it is, I really really do and cant always follow my own advice, but the less contact you have with him the better it will be for you

tessa6 Sun 07-Apr-13 13:08:41

OP, I know it must be awful and I really feel for you but you need to lower your defences slightly maybe and realise that it has always been about this affair. Of course he has slept with her. They have been in an intimate long-term relationship, probably since before he started talking to you about any dissatisfaction in the relationship. Until you detach, you will have no chance at finding happiness. He cannot be believed anymore.

Inertia Sun 07-Apr-13 13:34:11

House - delurking here. Am just appalled at everything he's done, but it takes an incredible level of twuntishness to try to make his distraught teenage daughter to go and comfort his mother, because he is too busy with his band and OW to clear up his own mess.

Glad you have found your anger and seen through his lies.

He's a waste of oxygen. You and your children are worth more than this.

It's probably not worth trying to force him into parenting the children at weekends. He doesn't give a shit and will reject them over and over in favour of OW and band. Make sure you inform CSA of the band income too, BTW.

houseworkhater Sun 07-Apr-13 14:07:41

I'm back in now, been out and had some fresh air.

He has text begging me not to involve "an innocent person" in the Divorce. He obviously thinks I am going to divorce him now, but I will bide my time and seek advice first.

I have not replied to his texts.

Someone rang my mob earlier then hung up when I answered. I didn't give them the pleasure of me ringing back.

Leavenheath Sun 07-Apr-13 14:10:54

She's got a partner then and he's shitting himself. Chances are, so is she.

She probably said 'give me 3 months to get rid of my boyfriend'.

Now you've scuppered the whole plot grin

houseworkhater Sun 07-Apr-13 14:12:07

He also text dd and asked her to come to the gig so they could talk.

She said no, she has told him that he is even letting this band lark ruin their relationship.

If he wants to speak to her she has told him that it won't be anywhere near the band.

I have told all kids they can see their father whenever they like, I won't stop them or feel betrayed.

SundaeGirl Sun 07-Apr-13 14:16:57

Sounds as though you are making all the rights decisions. Stay strong!

How is your DD doing?

"An innocent person"? Who's that then?

You are an innocent person.

Your dcs are innocent people...

Well done for not replying

houseworkhater Sun 07-Apr-13 14:18:26

DD1 seems ok.
Dd2 is very quiet and trying to make sense of it all.
Ds looked ill and pale yesterday, he keeps saying he is ok. I asked him if he wanted to go with his dad to take dd2 but he said no.

SundaeGirl Sun 07-Apr-13 14:23:46

Can you all go to the cinema this evening (or similar take-mind-off trip)?

Mimishimi Sun 07-Apr-13 14:28:46

I think Leavenheath is on to it. The OW probably is partnered or possibly she didn't realise that your H was planning to leave you and isn't ready for him to move in as yet. If you are able to find out who her partner is, you should be telling them ASAP. Quite possibly she is the partner of someone closely involved with the band ( either a member or crew) and he's afraid of the fallout with the rest of the band. He should not have the luxury of thinking this will all go according to his or their plans.

He should not have the luxury of thinking this will all go according to his or their plans.

This.

MadBraLady Sun 07-Apr-13 14:37:17

I second SundaeGirl's suggestion. You're doing great with the No Contact, House. Please, please give this midlife crisis loser, his OW, her possible relationship and his "band" as little headspace as humanly possible over the next few days as you recover from the shock and support your DC.

ProphetOfDoom Sun 07-Apr-13 14:55:09

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

DonkeysDontRideBicycles Sun 07-Apr-13 14:56:57

shock sad angry

No advice to offer that hasn't already been given but he has treated you so shabbily what a letdown: another selfish "I deserve to be happy and to hell with anyone else" mid-life crisis fuckwit.

I wish you luck and from your posts think you will get on fabulously.

DontmindifIdo Sun 07-Apr-13 15:25:28

The innocent person in all this is you!!! His panicking sounds like she's got a partner and while it was fun for her for a bit, to suddenly lose everything to be with a middle aged bloke who's got 3 DCs to pay for and more importantly, a wife not a partner - so will take half the assets as well as child maintenance, suddenly he does'nt look like a good package compared to what she'll be sacrificing. She doesn't even know if he'll stick around for her, or if he'll just screw up her relationship and then she'll have to fend for herself.

Oh yes, refusing to engage is good. Let them panic. I bet she's cutting contact and running scared.

cjel Sun 07-Apr-13 16:07:41

I would say buy your favourite foods, play favourite radio/tv fill your house with things that make you happy. Def new bedroom/bedding. And don't waste one minute of your life on this OW. Focus on you , moving forward and your future. 'They' are nothing to you and you will feel much better if you don't dwell on them and give them 'you' to discuss. <<Hugs>>

carlywurly Sun 07-Apr-13 16:11:21

I'm so sorry this has happened to you. My xh followed the script also, it is vile beyond belief. They are so predictable it's unbelievable.

I think that given ow appears to have a young baby, his weirdness started last year, and shes discussing breastfeeding with him, I would be asking some strongly worded questions about when their affair started. You need to know how involved he is.

You will be happier without this idiot, really you will. It's just a horribly painful path to tread in the early stages.

Angelico Sun 07-Apr-13 17:12:28

So sorry OP. At least you can see the twat in all his worthless glory. Take care of yourself x

houseworkhater Sun 07-Apr-13 19:33:55

Hi all,

Once again thanks for all your help and support.

I have done some digging, honestly I am starting to think that I might be good at setting up my own private eye business, and he first text ow on New Years eve. Band played the night before and he messaged her around lunchtime new years eve.

Band played N Y E and myself and kids went to my friends.

He was all for coming to my friends after the gig but suddenly didn't.

I brought this up the other day as it had registered in my mind for some reason. Claimed to have gone to band members and just changed his mind about coming.
Anyhow straight after texting me and saying he was on his way, he text her and never arrived at either my friends or home in time before I went to bed.

All clear now.

I'm leaving the thread.

Once again thanks for the advice without critising me.

I honestly thought that he would never, ever do this.

He asked for a reconsiliation this morning.

I have not responded.

Now I know all the signs and feel better than I did a few days ago.

Gigondas Sun 07-Apr-13 19:36:41

All the best hw - stay strong and wishing you all the best for you and dc.

MadBraLady Sun 07-Apr-13 19:47:11

All the best house. You deserve better.

cjel Sun 07-Apr-13 20:15:31

All the best and if you do reconcile. Make him go to counselling, maybe together, and don't let him move back until you have worked on this for several months. Look after yourself.xx

DixieD Sun 07-Apr-13 20:24:00

Be careful with a reconciliation. She has spooked and has probably dumped him. Don't rush into anything.

MadBraLady Sun 07-Apr-13 20:25:24

Agree with Dixie!

Doha Sun 07-Apr-13 20:25:50

he only wants to reconcile to protect the OW. Noone can be so awful and have such a dramatic change of heart so quickly.
Perhaps his damaged relationship with his DC's may be bothering him but bottom line nothing has changed. He will still prioritise his band and friends over you.
I predict, if you reconcile, a further split a few months down the line when he has covered his tracks better and the OW has got rid of her OH

skyebluesapphire Sun 07-Apr-13 20:25:55

All the best for whatever direction your life takes.

AnyFucker Sun 07-Apr-13 21:12:39

I don't think OP has any intention of reconciling

I think she has him bang to rights and has discovered, through her superior detective skills, exactly when this bloke checked out of his marriage

MN has been a great help, so far, for her

If I am wrong then MN cannot help, I am afraid, because if you would reconcile with a bloke like this, there is no help for you whatsoever, I am afraid

Ruprekt Sun 07-Apr-13 21:32:22

HWH ....why are you leaving the thread?hmm

Please stay and let us know how you get on with things.

Take care.

Agree with AnyFucker

Good luck.
We are here whenever you need an ear

jollydiane Sun 07-Apr-13 22:32:53

Dear House,

Just wanted to wish you well. Many of us will be thinking of you and wondering how life turned out. I have no doubt that I would have enjoyed your company. Enjoy your new hairstyle, your new shoes your children but most of all enjoy life.

Until we meet again on some other thread. wink

Xales Sun 07-Apr-13 22:40:47

Does he want to reconcile mean he is going to participate in family life more and reduce the band practice shit? Or cut out his new friend? Nah don't think so.

It means he will consider your option to try and be a stepford wife while he carries on doing what he wants.

Nice for him. Thanks but no thanks.

skyebluesapphire Sun 07-Apr-13 22:46:33

also meant to say, why are you leaving the thread sad

we will all still be here if you need a chat again

Mimishimi Mon 08-Apr-13 01:01:10

Asking for a reconciliation so soon after dropping the bombshell means that he is trying to play for time until he can figure out what his next move will be. If he can string you along with hopes that he wants to get back with you, perhaps he can get another three to four months of accommodation where I am sure he is assuming he has a woman who will be pulling out all stops (sex, cleaning, cooking etc) in the effort to keep him. You are worth so much more than that.

Asking for a reconciliation so soon after dropping the bombshell means that he is trying to play for time until he can figure out what his next move will be. If he can string you along with hopes that he wants to get back with you, perhaps he can get another three to four months of accommodation where I am sure he is assuming he has a woman who will be pulling out all stops (sex, cleaning, cooking etc) in the effort to keep him. You are worth so much more than that.

Bang on.

DontmindifIdo Mon 08-Apr-13 10:22:07

I hope you are getting the real life support you need, keep that anger and use it to push through what's best for you and your DCs, he's not put you first for months so there's no need for you to.

The 'reconciliation' could well be because he saw it as a choice between you and her, and she, while having had fun, isn't about to take him on, so now he wants you back. The fact that he could easily end up with neither and actually it's not his choice now, probably hasn't registered. But it will. And then the pity party will really start. Dont fall for it and try to shield your DCs from it as much as possible.

Inertia Mon 08-Apr-13 10:28:52

Glad to see you have a bit more clarity now House, and we are here if you need a listening ear.

Sorry to say I agree with Mimi about the kind of reconciliation he has mind -and would add that he's probably also planning to use the promise if reconciliation to keep you quiet as far as OW's partner is concerned. Take care House.

houseworkhater Mon 08-Apr-13 17:54:51

Hi,
Didn't intend to post again as I assumed there was nothing more to add.

I am still distraught, feelings swaying wildly. Today I feel very ugly and unloved.

He has started texting begging forgiveness, asking for reconcilliation. saying he will pack the band in, do whatever I want, put me first. It is all his fault now apparently.

I think the ow has gone cold, that is my gut feeling. I think the shock of me ringing her and spelling out to her what she has done and how it isn't just a bit of fun anymore, plus what it could do if her oh finds out, have given her a cold hard slap in the face.

Think she is still married but "serarated" so my h is a bit more undesirable now.

He still denies having sex with this woman but has admitted to sex texting. Says he has got it wrong and should have listened to me.

Been to have a chat with a solicitor today. No plans yet and things still quite muddy.

She did howl with laughter when I mentioned h's plans on how childcare would work. Ie on a weekend he will do something with them in the morning and I will run around after them on an evening, leaving him free to conduct his affairs on a weekend night.

She did mention relate and so has h.

To be honest I don't know if anything could save the marriage as I don't really think I will spend the rest of my days with him.

Still hard for dcs.
He has asked if they want to go out with him this week, ds and dd2 up for it, dd1 says no.
Solicitor suggested dd1 go somewhere with him even if she just screams her hatred for him and nothing else.

It dawned on me at the solicitors that I actually don't know where he is staying, I don't care.

Solicitor made me realise that financially I could manage so that is good.

I don't have to actually do anything, oh and from the brief description I gave her, I would definately be able to divorce him.

So there it is.
I have told him I don't want to talk, not until I feel better. The door is not open.

The only other text I have sent was to say when is he picking the dcs up. I am swaying between telling him to come and get them and just leaving it.

He has text both dd1 and ds telling them that I haven't answered any of his texts and is everything ok.

I think tonight we will all watch a dvd and I might have a glass of wine, going away later this week with dcs and we will have a great time.

AnyFucker Mon 08-Apr-13 18:06:20

You sound just about as good as it is possible to be at this stage, love

Good on you for seeing him for what he really is...you have taken a shitload of grief over the last few days after initially making excuses for him and being unable to accept he could do something so shitty

You are waaaaay ahead of him, dude and much too good for this inadequate piece of shit..

BalloonSlayer Mon 08-Apr-13 18:06:36

Blimey that didn't take long, did it grin

Well done you for staying strong.

The ball's well and truly in your court now. I think you should try to keep it there as long as possible, not rush into anything until you are 100% sure you know what you want.

(I have a cynical feeling that if you welcomed him back with open arms today he would be back to his old ways within a week.)

MadAboutHotChoc Mon 08-Apr-13 18:08:35

Glad you have come back.

I know how hard it is and it will take you months to process your feelings and thoughts about his betrayal. Don't make any long term decisions and just focus on taking one day at a time.

Now that hard cold reality has burst his fantasy lust fuelled affair bubble, he is beginning to realise what he has to lose and is now coming back with his tail between his legs begging for forgiveness

You may find reading shirley Glass's Not Just Friends helpful as it has helped so many others on here.

Sugarice Mon 08-Apr-13 18:09:35

He has proven that he is sneaky , untrustworthy, uncaring of your feelings and and a first rate twat.

Do you want to live with someone like that?

You are way too good for him and he is just waking up to the fact that he may be alone.

Don't fall for his froth and sad face act.

something2say Mon 08-Apr-13 18:28:30

I'll share that glass of wine with you. After yoga tho xx
Well done x see how quick he turned about.
Did you book a haircut or anything like that?

Xales Mon 08-Apr-13 18:33:14

So in 4 days he has gone from not loving you and wanting freedom and will leave in 3 months,to there being another woman, to please don't name an innocent in our divorce, to I have made a mistake.

Colour me cynical but I don't think he expected you to cotton on and be so decisive so is having to scramble to get you back in line for somewhere to live.

DontmindifIdo Mon 08-Apr-13 18:46:48

yep, to me it sounds like suddenly all his fantasies and plans have had a big bucket of cold water ie reality. The OW has a small baby, she's not going to throw away her lifestyle for him, she's obviously say "jog on love" - he's realised he's not able to control the situation with you, and is really going to lose you, the DCs and it all.

Do what's best for you, don't give what he wants any head space. This is about what's best for you and your DCs.

AnyFucker Mon 08-Apr-13 18:52:59

This thread is an absolute example of how to regain the upper hand in one fell swoop.

So many times, we see poor women who have been dealt similarly devastating blows hanging on, too frightened to make the fucker leave, trying to turn into the perfect wife and sexbomb in the mistaken idea that he will somehow regain all the respect he once had for them

the only thing that motivates these men is loss

it's become an MN cliche now, but it is true

MadAboutHotChoc Mon 08-Apr-13 19:01:45

AF is right re loss being the motivator for cheaters - because you have been strong and dignified, he is already coming back to you begging for forgiveness.

Take your time though in making decisions about your future and remember that you are in control.

cjel Mon 08-Apr-13 19:04:57

Well done OP you are doing so well. All the emotional weirdness you feel it normal. I would try to ask him not to be texting Dcs to get answers from you. Your relationship with him is nothing to do with them, it is all distressing for them without feeling l like they are stuck in the middle.

skyebluesapphire Mon 08-Apr-13 19:17:49

well done for coming back.

Like Mad says, dont rush into any long term decisions. You need to be sure what YOU want now. He has blown everything apart, and he has to wait on you now. Just take some time to yourself for now. It may help to go to relate even if the marriage is over, just to talk things through finally. My Xh refused to go, but it would have helped me to answer some questions.

Have a good few days away.

Must be tempting to tell him you'll get back to him in three months, that you'll need at least that amount of time to figure out what you want to do.

(Seeing as he was saying he wouldn't be ready to leave for three months)

Ponyinthepool Mon 08-Apr-13 20:28:11

I want to give you a big kiss!!

In the short space of time since you started this thread, you've come a HUGE distance in restoring the independence and self respect he's been systematically dismantling. You've gone from bewildered to empowered in a few short posts. It's great to see.

Don't piss on the little turd if he's on fire. He continues to act with concern for his own welfare alone. He didnt care about abandoning you, you owe him no consideration whatsoever. Hoisted by his own petard, good and proper.

He may just have done you a favour House, I think this might be the start of a much better life for you.

Hopasholic Mon 08-Apr-13 20:28:51

Just wanted to say a big Well Done flowers

Have a good evening with your DC's

I wouldn't enter into any further discussions with him. Silence from you may be the way for him to in finally admit how far he has gone with the OW.

ExcuseTypos Mon 08-Apr-13 20:53:54

You must be terribly shocked at the moment, but well done for gaining the upper hand and keeping your self respect.

Whatever happens in the end, he knows not to mess with you, ever again.

4some Mon 08-Apr-13 21:07:01

(Writing under my new name after STBXH found my posts.)

Wanted to add how amazing I think your attitude/clarity is.

It is such a shock when someone we think we have such utter faith in does something so terrible.

It is ultimately your decision what you do next. Take your time. I hope whatever you choose to do ultimately brings you the peace and happy future you deserve.

lazarusb Mon 08-Apr-13 21:31:42

I've been lurking since the beginning. Your pain has been horrible to witness but I just wanted to say I admire your strength. There's another thread at the moment where a man has suddenly realised that he's totally underestimated the woman in his life and is now shit scared and begging forgiveness and reconciliation. Well done for all the steps you've taken so far. I think your relationship with your children is fantastic and dd1 is an absolute star.

All the best to you x

Well done. You are an inspiration.
Awesome. (You may not feel it but you are)

MTBMummy Tue 09-Apr-13 08:31:18

House been lurking since the beginning and just wanted to add you've come such a long way, you're doing amazingly well.

I really wish I'd had your strength when I first found out about SBXH cheating on me, I took the road of it all being my fault and doing everything possible to keep him, all I did was lose my dignity and let him know he could get away with it, which he did for another year before I eventually realised and got rid of him.

He has got to have a think about some of the things he's said to you - eg doesn't want family life any more, he's leaving "in 3 months" !!, etc. They are pretty big deals. Surely he hasn't forgotten?

Walkacrossthesand Tue 09-Apr-13 13:59:28

He was taking you for granted to such an extent that you and your existence as a separate human being were completely invisible to him - you were just part of the package labelled 'home', which he thought he could put down & pick up at will. He reckoned without you....

Troubledjo Tue 09-Apr-13 22:34:45

I really hope the break with your DCs gives you some space to think - and also forget for a bit and just have a nice time with them. They sound like great kids.
I would really recommend Relate. I went for a while when I split with my XP - he came one time then refused to go again and I carried on on my own. It really helped me to talk to someone neutral, to work out what I was feeling, get the negative stuff out of my system and work out how to move on. It's really hard to get a sense of perspective when you are in the middle of it all and sometimes an outside person can help with that.
Also, you often have to put on a brave face in front of DCs as you want to reassure them and it helps to have a space where you don't need to do that.
Before going to Relate I was finding it really hard to see a way forward. I would definitely recommend it and often think of the advice I was given even now (8 years later!). Oh, and I know it's a cliche but it does get better! Just take your time and don't be rushed into anything...

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