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Why so bitter?

(35 Posts)
MollyBee Sun 03-Mar-13 17:03:24

I have read the relationship board for a long while now, and what never ceases to amaze me is how bitter some of you are on here. Why?

My OPs come on here looking for simple advice and help in their relationships and most you of come back with the usual, he's having an affair, he's looking at porn, he's exiting the relationship, LTB. Sometimes it's not helpful and I actually feel very sorry for the OP.

When do you feel it's time to stop being so bitter? How do you all live like that?

MollyBee Sun 03-Mar-13 17:04:28

Sorry, typo. My OPs should have read, many OPs

ImperialBlether Sun 03-Mar-13 17:06:21

Can you show me a thread where the OP has come on to ask for advice because her husband is being horrible or distant or is lying or spending too much money etc and it turns out that really he's a decent man and the OP has misunderstand the situation?

NotAnotherPackedLunch Sun 03-Mar-13 17:08:25

Interesting first post.

Ginebra Sun 03-Mar-13 17:08:35

I don't think it's bitterness. I think people are blind when they're in the middle of the storm. There usually IS a reason somebody's partner treats them with a total lack of respect.

I don't think it's bitterness to expect that your partner treat you with some level of respect, and to notice you.

I have a couple of failed relationships behind me but I@m optimistic enough to believe that men don't see through women, or have a lack of respect for them if they want to be with them.

It's not bitterness to expect a bit MORE than jackshit.

What your post smacks of however is "i'm alright, MY life is fine, MY husband is grand, so therefore the rest of you must all be bitter". That's not a very nice attitude, to invalidate the experiences of so many with a wave of your hand, filing it all under 'bitterness'.

But so long as your relationship is ok! (for now)

MollyBee Sun 03-Mar-13 17:09:18

Yes actually, there have been many threads like that. Those ones, just tend to die out/fade out because lots of you can't say, 'yep, we were right'.

NotSuchASmugMarriedNow Sun 03-Mar-13 17:12:20

show us the threads you mean then

Ginebra Sun 03-Mar-13 17:12:22

No there are many, many threads where the OP is making all the comprosmises, the OP's husband won't go to counselling, is very aware of his own needs but has not acknowledgement whatsover that his wife has any needs that aren't being met. MANY threads like that. And there's always somebody who'll come on and say that the wife should bend over backwards a bit further, sublimate her needs a bit more, accommodate her husband MORE. She won't be happy, but he'll be happy.

There are currently at least TWO threads on the relationship board like this.

MollyBee Sun 03-Mar-13 17:12:38

Ermm, no, hope I didn't come across that way, and if I did I apologise. Yes I have been crapped on in the past, but I don't dwell on it (it killed me at the time)

I only wondered why some people never seem able to move on and always see the worst in everyone.

Ginebra Sun 03-Mar-13 17:14:56

Well, Mollybee, don't worry, because even when the OP's husband is a cheating, lying, porn-addicted, gambling, drinking (insert or delete as applicable here) SOB, wives don't generally leave because some random internet sprites on mn told them to. It takes months, sometimes YEARS to see things clearly, and to feel that you have a right to draw a line and say 'this' is unacceptable. So if I were you, I wouldn't worry that there are wives packing their bags because they've been told to by mn.

issey6cats Sun 03-Mar-13 17:15:28

when my marriage imploded i came on here and got some lovely replies from other posters and most of the posters who do come across as being bitter have been treated badly by men after what my ex did to me 15 months later i am still heartbroken at how he treated me and it isnt easy trying to be positive some days so of course im bitter , and generally speaking the women who come on here for advice are either in a shit situation and mumsnetters can point them to the relevant help they need, or just want to rant and this forum allows them to do that, or they already suspect their husband is up to no good and more experienced posters can point out to them what to look for

Ginebra Sun 03-Mar-13 17:16:58

eh, I've moved on thank you very much.

I've moved on precisely because I now recognise a good man from a lazy / entitled man. I am not bitter, but I feel I'm worth more now. I won't accept less. I don't want other women to accept less either. The more women accept it, the less men are motivated to up their game.

I call this OPTIMISM and FAITH. Not bitterness as you call it.

kalidanger Sun 03-Mar-13 17:22:08

'Bitter' is the wrong word. You're thinking of astute, knowledgeable, experienced and supportive, Molly

When I came on here asking for advice it was mostly because I was really scared that it was all in my head. I was constantly asking myself if his behaviour was normal and if it was my reaction to it that was the odd thing.

People reassured me that he was treating me badly. That he was not behaving normally, and that I was trying to be understanding where I should have been asking for respect.

So I asked for respect. And he rubbished that too.

It took me 5 years of trying to make the relationship work before I couldn't do it anymore.

Now I'm in a loving relationship with a man who shows me respect and consideration. Sometimes I have to pinch myself. It's just so far from what I have known.

I don't need to post about him.

People post here for help. Usually after a long period of confusion and difficulties. If I could have those 5 wasted years back I would.

There are plenty of "work on things" responses on here. But where there are clear signs of disrespect, entitlement and abuse, it is fair to give both sides.

I thank god for my shouts of LTB. The dcs and I are all now stable and secure where once we were frightened and unhappy.

It wasn't bitterness that drove it. It was compassion for a woman they had never met who was in pain and alone. Which in itself is an incredible thing.

Feelingpissedoff Sun 03-Mar-13 17:35:25

I came on here because I don't want to tell every little humiliating detail. Speaking online to a group who have empathy & knowledge on the practicalities can be empowering.
Welcome to mn.

Pagwatch Sun 03-Mar-13 17:35:33

Bitter?
About what?
Happily married for 23 years to a fab man. So, bitter about what?

I post on relationships usually when i can't bear to read 'yes he shouts at me, calls me a cunt, won't give me any money and won't help at all around the house. But he's great with the kids' one more time

Ginebra Sun 03-Mar-13 17:39:27

OP, read the thread about the woman who is 40, 8 months pregnant with dc2. Her husband won't let her go to pilates because that is a 'waste of money' even though she paid all his debts and paid the deposit on their house. he can spend what he likes though. on whisky in particular. they earn the same. she got up at 7am with the baby and he slept til ten. he wouldn't let her go and buy second hand stuff for the baby. NICE guy? Misunderstood? does she need to "work at it"???

KeepCoolCalmAndCollected Sun 03-Mar-13 17:41:40

A lot of threads in Relationships are truly horrific, and a lot of advice given is very wise, realistic, supportive and helpful.

Can you be specific and give us some examples?

McBuckers Sun 03-Mar-13 17:43:07

When my husband cheated on me when I was pregnant and again when DD3 was 3 months old, I came on here asking for advice on how to show my husband how much I loved him and how I could change to make him love and want me. The advice I got on this board opened my eyes to how selfish and cruel my husband's behaviour was. Without MN I would have continued to blame myself for my husband's behaviour. The people on this board pulled me through a very difficult time and I am forever grateful for their wisdom and kindness.

Spero Sun 03-Mar-13 17:43:38

If by 'bitter' you mean I have lived through it and would like to share my knowledge and offer support, just in the hope it will help someone not waste years of their life in a relationship that is not just stagnant but abusive, then yep I'm as bitter as a truck load of lemons and proud to be so.

Diagonally Sun 03-Mar-13 17:53:28

I think you are confusing bitterness with experience, OP.

You need to give an example.

WobblyHalo Sun 03-Mar-13 18:05:28

Yip, you are confusing 'bitter' with a whole range of things. Try realistic for one. The women on here have mostly lived through shit and are trying to help other women to learn through their mistakes.

I don't post a lot, but I lurk and read, and it has helped me a lot!

MadAboutHotChoc Sun 03-Mar-13 18:09:41

I was one of the many OPs who came on here and was told that he was probably having an affair - thanks goodness they did otherwise I would have spent months going crazy trying to be the perfect wife while he was shagging OW.

ImperialBlether Sun 03-Mar-13 18:18:58

I was driven nearly crazy by my ex's infidelity. He didn't go out at night without me and it didn't occur to me that he was having an affair. I felt like my world was collapsing yet on the surface everything was fine.

If I'd been able to come on here I know I would have had some fantastic help.

Sometimes the advice is harsh. It has to be when someone is desperately in denial. There is usually one line that hits home and from that moment the woman concerned sees her life how it really is.

Do you really think anyone enjoys watching that happen?

izzyizin Sun 03-Mar-13 18:21:19

'Bitter' suggests one who has an axe to grind, but the perceptive and the pragmatic have no ulterior motive when recounting personal experiences in order to support and advise others.

What's your motive for starting this thread and in what way do you envisage it adding value to this board?

BitBewildered Sun 03-Mar-13 18:39:08

I have a great DH, happy life and am sometimes appalled at the circumstances some OPs describe. My DM had dreadful partners who were abusive in various ways and was sexually abused by her stepfather. Her life has been shit, and my older brothers lives were severely affected by watching their mum being beaten up by their father and once she left him and went into homeless accomodation with 3 small DSs my father came along and did the same thing.

Living in an abusive relationship is awful. People who are in one would be better out of it. If you think I am bitter, that's fine.

ErikNorseman Sun 03-Mar-13 18:42:26

When I found out about H's affair I posted here saying I had text her to 'warn her off'. Anyfucker pointed out that I was debasing myself and feeding his ego, and he wasn't such a prize anyway. I didn't want to hear it then but she was good damn right.

ImperialBlether Sun 03-Mar-13 18:54:12

She's always right, Erik!

sassy34264 Sun 03-Mar-13 18:57:01

Oh dear.

Why when intelligent, experienced women give other's advice (who have asked for it) does it mean they are bitter?

It is nigh on impossible to tell the majority of posters on here to keep trying, try another tack, go to relate, because they are not run of the mill problems in a respectful (ish) relationship.

If the partner is treating them dreadfully with abuse, be it physical, emotional, psychological etc, there is no trying to make it better by changing yourself.

It's not the op with the problem you see.

I wouldn't call that bitterness- i would call it, seeing the wood for the trees.

Which i happen to think that MN is absolutely bloody brilliant for. (I can't praise it enough in rl.)

Saying it's bitterness, is like saying a negative opinion on a pretty women is invalidated because we're jealous. <rolls eyes>

cory Sun 03-Mar-13 18:59:26

My posts on this board tend to be informed by the fact that I have never had anything to feel bitter about.

I was brought up by a decent man who treated my mother and his children with respect, I am married to a decent man who treats me and our children with respect, as far as I am concerned decent men are the normality. Shitheads are not.

There is no need to put up with a shithead because "you can't expect anything better from a man". Yes, you can and you should.

Spero Sun 03-Mar-13 19:16:47

I think the more interesting question here is why the op never 'ceases' to be 'amazed' by the truly awful way some men behave towards their partners and children.

But no, the focus is on how 'bitter' women are.

Interesting. <strokes beard bitterly>

TisILeclerc Sun 03-Mar-13 20:18:37

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

badinage Sun 03-Mar-13 23:01:03

Being in a long and very happy marriage myself, I'm always taken aback by how cruel people can be in relationships and how many people on the receiving end of this cruelty convince themselves that it is normal, acceptable or all they are worth. So I post to reassure people that they are worth so much more than this treatment and to dissuade them from exposing their children to such unhappiness and abuse. I have nothing to be bitter about personally and I also know that good, kind people occasionally fuck up and regret it. But I also have people in my life who've lived in the sort of denial many OPs seem to be in and have then had an awful shock when the truth came out or the abuse got worse/moved on to the children. If a post can help someone like that see things more clearly, I'm glad to help.

pigsDOfly Sun 03-Mar-13 23:35:29

I think you're missing the point of why people post on here OP. Women, mainly are using MN because they often have no one else to turn to in RL who they feel they can speak so freely to.

MN didn't exist when I was married but would that it had. I might have been helped to leave an abusive marriage many years sooner than I did.

I don't read bitterness in the advice given on here. I read anger often, but mainly I read caring help, freely given.

Walkacrossthesand Mon 04-Mar-13 08:23:04

Mollybee appears to have disappeared in a puff of logic, as Douglas Adams would have said. What I was going to say was, (1) the reason that threads that end well (eg someone posts distressed, quickly sorts things out by communicating, stops posting) is because there's no further need to post, not because the vipers can't crow 'we were right'. Bit like the reason things are always in the last place you look because when you find it you stop looking. (2) I'm currently single, I've had my relationship traumas along the way but have learned such a lot about recognising and dealing with behaviours on these boards. Good relationships unfold easily and pleasantly without advice, that's why we don't need to post about them here - and for the record, there have been threads inviting people to say what's good about their DPs, and they've been long. That's what I was going to say! wink

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