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Am I a selfish person?

(96 Posts)
Greyhorses Sat 23-Feb-13 19:17:50

Sorry everyone this could be very long.

I am feeling very betrayed and hurt by DP at the moment and really am unsure what to do from here.

We have been together around 6 years, i am 22 him 26. In this time I have lived in various places with family members as my parents divorced when I was younger and both remarried. I earn a poor full time wage but work a typical 40-50hour week, the only pleasure I really have are my two dogs (relevant as renting with two guarding shedding monsters=impossible)

I have wanted to buy a property for many years since I was 18 when we lost the family home etc but have waited for DP as he always had an excuse why he couldn't move out of his parents home. Degree,masters,we travelled etc etc. He has been looking into doing a PGCE for some time though but never got around to applying due to one reason or another. He is generally a very negative person and everything is an obstacle.

It came to a head some months ago when my mother who I am staying with ATM temporarily as I fleet between mother and father and grandparents is moving out into a smaller rented house leaving me stuck. I have very poor relationship with my parents but tolerate each other. I discussed this with DP who agreed we should look for a house. He set the criteria and we found a property which exactly matched this, lovely house in need if renovation very cheap in a nice area (of his choice). We offered and offer was accepted but contracts not exchanged yet. The offer is based in my wage alone.

Tonight he drops the bombshell that he has gotten onto the Pgce (great!) but now does not know if he can afford to pay mortgage on what small loans he would get. I really don't know what to feel other than selfish as I am happy for him but I can't go on with this life of limbo anymore and need to feel I belong somewhere! I am devastated about the house as it really was/is perfect and I was looking forward to renovating etc with Dp! I feel so let down and second best and am wondering whether to bite the bullet and go myself or just resign myself to the fact I will be waiting for another 2-3 years at least living this horrible life of going to and from houses with the clothes in my bag. I have no friends to share with, no one and rentals won't touch me because of dogs (they are childhood dogs from divorce of parents neither of which want them as both parents accuse the other of owning the dogs, they were my dogs at home parents have never dealt with them) and so getting rid is not an option at all.

I just really don't know how to cope with this and which way to turn now. Do I break this tie and just go it alone or do I stick with my 6 year otherwise happy relationship knowing it could be years before he will break the apron strings. He is so attached to his family home and is in no hurry to leave and can't see my point of view at all :-(

What would you guys do if you we're me?

Sorry for depressing moaning :-(

expatinscotland Sat 23-Feb-13 19:22:09

Go it alone. This person is not a partner.

Lucyellensmum95 Sat 23-Feb-13 19:25:01

My gut feeling is to wait another year - it really is only a year, so next year he will be earning a good wage (well goodish) and you will have your money too.

Totally understand about the dogs, id be getting rid over my dead body type too.

Saying that, it does seem to be him that is calling the shots - why is this?

I don't feel able to give any particular advice and I'm sure a lot of the wiser MNetters will be along soon with that. However, just on the point of not being able to rent with dogs - it really isn't impossible and many landlords really don't mind. The Dogs' Trust do a 'Lets with Pets' campaign and pet-friendly landlords and letting agents have regsitered with them. Here's the link:

MrsWembley Sat 23-Feb-13 19:28:19

If you've been able to sort out a mortgage and make an offer based on your wage alone, I'd say, go for it!

This opportunity may never come again. His PGCE will be over before you know it, then he may be ready for what you have to offer or he may prevaricate more but at least you'll have a home.

CailinDana Sat 23-Feb-13 19:29:34

You are letting him dictate your life. How on earth did you not know that he was applying for the PGCE?? It sounds like he just lives his life whatever way he wants and expects you to go along with it, regardless of how you feel. There is absolutely no point in being with someone like that, as you will never have a genuine relationship. You will always be on the back foot, wondering what he'll spring on you next. Go it alone.

DioneTheDiabolist Sat 23-Feb-13 19:32:56

OP, I an so sorry that you don't have a stable home. However if you want one, you are going to have to provide it for yourself. Your dogs are clearly not a priority for your DP, nor are your living arrangements.sad

I'm not saying you need to end this relationship, I am saying that you need to do this yourself. And you can. The offer was made on your wages alone, so go for it and if he moves in with you, he can pay rent.

deste Sat 23-Feb-13 19:38:17

Don't wait any longer, just go for it. In a few years time you will have the house as you want it. I would have a break from him before his negativity rubs off on you.

catsmother Sat 23-Feb-13 19:38:17

If the mortgage has been approved on your wage then I'd go for it - to get the security you want and need. This may mean you wouldn't be able to renovate as quickly as you'd like without his financial input but if, for example, you got a lodger - or even two depending on how big house is - their rent would help out that maybe as well as with all the other bills and the mortgage.

You could still have a relationship with him - that's up to you ..... it sounds to me though that he's certainly not ready for the next step ATM.

BTW if you can get a mortgage at 22 on your own then you're doing really well and should be proud of yourself. I'd grab this opportunity if I were you - yes, prices may drop in the future still, but you might also find lenders tightening up lending criteria even more if you wait.

MidnightMasquerader Sat 23-Feb-13 19:38:20

You are only 22 with you whole life ahead of you. He is not going to change.

The answer is honestly very simple and straight-forward.

catsmother Sat 23-Feb-13 19:42:44

BTW, am not sure why you're asking if you're a selfish person ? Think you've done great looking after your dogs - unlike your parents who sound rather selfish and irresponsible actually.

i would go it alone too. you cant put your life on hold waiting for someone to decide when/if they want to settle down with you and move in with you. it sounds like he doesnt know what he wants. does he actually want to be in a relationship with you?

you want a place that you can call home. if you can do it, then do it. moving from house to house cant be fun at all

kalidanger Sat 23-Feb-13 19:46:39

A moody, grumpy, bossy and changeable mummy's boy is not The One, OP. Go it alone.

If the mortgage is based on your wage alone why do you need him to pay it? I don't get that bit.

kalidanger Sat 23-Feb-13 19:48:55

Is he saying you're selfish? If so that's a big red flag...

Xales Sat 23-Feb-13 19:49:14

You are the one on whose salary the mortgage is based so you can afford it alone. Yet he is the one who has set all the criteria and you have gone along with this.

Get the mortgage and deeds in your name only. If he moves in with you make him sign that he has no claim to your assets and his rent is not contribution to your mortgage. Don't let him move in until he has agreed a fair percentage payment as his living expenses. Not a waffly 'I may not be able to afford X, Y or Z'. Hard numbers towards rent, utilities and food. Don't get into the situation where you are supporting him.

I would suggest you actually get a lodger rather than move this person in.

I think you need to look very carefully at yourself and your relationships. You have poor relationships with your parents and tolerate each other. I think this is leading you to accept a pitiful poor second best romantic relationship with a partner who thinks way more of himself and what he wants than he does of you. There is nothing wrong with him wanting to travel , study more etc. It is wrong that he is doing it riding roughshod over your wants and feelings. Not good in a partnership.

I suggest you see if you can get some therapy to look into yourself and why you are happy to settle for this.

NatashaBee Sat 23-Feb-13 19:51:36

I would go it alone. Who knows where property prices will go in a years time, and it must be awful living out of bags and going back and forth. Can you get a lodger to help you pay the bills, as someone else suggested?

HellonHeels Sat 23-Feb-13 20:09:06

Buy the place on your own, get a lodger in to help with mortgage costs. Sounds like it might be a good time for a break from your negative partner for whom everything is an obstacle.

Greyhorses Sat 23-Feb-13 20:17:38

Thank you for the kind replays everyone- didn't expect it!

I would have been happy to wait but there's always a reason to delay things iyswim. We have actually nearly moved a few times but he backs out for one reason or another. I actually loaned out my beloved horse last time to make it easier financially for us not to even move and never did get him back incase we decided to move again.

The house itself is a steal. It's 20k cheaper than the valuation due to wanting a quick sale (I am a FTb so can move quickly) and is the first house to come up in the street since 2007. its a nice and quiet row of 3 bed semis with huge gardens so people don't move often. This one is an inheritance and a bit of a state.
I can get a mortgage alone but it is scary to have that amount of debt alone when paying for bills etc also. It's doable but I would be stretched compared to if he came and paid half. I can do it I'm just scared of doing it and regretting it?! The house could easily sell for that I paid and then some if I needed it too. The work it needs is substantial although the majority I can do myself some of the costs are unavoidable- windows and doors in particular plus needs a new kitchen, the rest is cosmetic. My dad says I could stay with him temporarily while work is done but he is in a difficult position as he married a lady with young children and rent a small house with a strict no pets landlord so could ask for a few months but not long term.

I have tried to rent numerous times but once even the dog friendly landlords meet mine they generally say no. The rent is also in the region of 500pcm here, whereas the mortgage would be closer to 300pcm which is a big saving.

He does generally call the shots mainly because I don't know the area well and I tend to rely on him for things. I do speak to my parents but have a lot of issues with particularly my mother and as much as I love her I can't live with her, she has bipolar type episodes which make her turn on those closest to her hence why she is better living alone and I am better off out. On the face of it life is perfect. I am qualified in a half decent career, I have a really nice new car, dogs, I have a few friends (although none I could talk to about this) and family yet feel so lonely and unsatisfied with life :-(

kalidanger Sat 23-Feb-13 20:19:59

It does strike me that, the way you've described it, something good happening for him means three more horrible years for you. You're in such a fantastic position with the house! I'm envious as hell. You can't possibly stop now and continue sofa surfing and wait for him to catch up. That's just not the way it works. He's just not at your level.

44SoStartingOver Sat 23-Feb-13 20:21:37

Grab the house with both hands and hold on tightly.
It will be your sanctuary and an accomplishment to be proud of.

If your boyfriend comes good, then great. If not, you will still have your sanctuary.

A 3 bed means you could get a lodger if necessary.

Don't let him decide your dreams.

kalidanger Sat 23-Feb-13 20:23:51


If you can afford it then go for it alone. As 44So says get a lodger if necessary to help with bills.

As for your DP you could be having this conversation for the next 10 years as to why he won't commit to you.

Just because he doing PGCE doesn't mean he will be able to get a teaching Job.

Phineyj Sat 23-Feb-13 20:26:04

The house sounds great & it sounds like you really want it. Yes you could rent with dogs if you were determined (we managed to rent with cats) but you'd still be in an insecure situation -- the landlord might decide to sell or change their mind about pets, etc.

A side note -- I recently qualified as a teacher and from what you say about your DP's personality and attitude I have some doubts that he will get through his PGCE. Also, PGCE's don't guarantee a job -- far from it in some areas/subjects. Even if it goes okay there will be a lot of stress and moaning, and I would doubt he would have time to help with renovations.

A lodger definitely sounds like a better bet than moving your DP in.

44SoStartingOver Sat 23-Feb-13 20:27:06

Yes dammit, take the house

Get the house on your own, don't put his name on it. Do not let him stop you from moving forward in your life any longer. The relationship may work out, it may not, but you will resent him immensely if he stops you from achieving your dreams by dragging his feet yet again. The house sounds great - Do it!! Doing up the house could also become a hobby for you. something else to help you feel fulfilled. :-)

Arithmeticulous Sat 23-Feb-13 20:28:26

Would you want to live in this house, this area if he hadn't been involved in the decision making?

If so, go for it, without nobber boy though wink

If not, get back out there looking for the house you want, in an area you know and like - then get on and make a home for you.

notnagging Sat 23-Feb-13 20:33:34

Don't rely on him for your decisions op. if you can do it alone, go for it!smile

44SoStartingOver Sat 23-Feb-13 20:33:37

God no, don't put his name on deeds!

Partnership is v serious. Not what you get from him ATM IMO.

Listen to an older, battle scarred woman, a house that is yours, that you can improve will make you happier.

I'd like to see you with a few more mates though. How about asking one to be a lodger?

You can even let the boyfriend sleep over if it suits you.

Greyhorses Sat 23-Feb-13 20:41:50

Thank you everyone :-)

It's a very daunting prospect is all as the house would need head to toe renovation (think time warp with its own mattress in the front garden, wood panelled walls and ivy growing through the windows, but it has so much potential. It would take me a long time to renovate on my wage so a lodger mightn't want to live on a building site?!

I am speaking with the advisor next week about where to go from here to he has until then to decide I suppose but I have a feeling he will get cold feet and run-again. He does this with all commitment, it took me 3 years to get him on holiday just the two of us as he was scared of just incase. He was very enthusiastic at the viewing but then seemed to go flat at talks of money and repayments etc! He has not said directly he does not want to buy the house but is refusing to discuss anything as 'it might not happen yet' which leaves me in some sort of limbo. I have arranged everything and he has done nothing.

I think he is worried about completing his pgce and renovating a house but at the same time where is the cut off point? I have waited 6 years so far, and have been asking him to move out since I was 18 so 4 long years of having no place of my own. I have always supported him but he has said on occasion I am selfish as if he does not do this pgce he will be stuck in a job he hates for life so maybe he is right!?

Greyhorses Sat 23-Feb-13 20:43:21

Ps, have no friends that would live with me. In all honesty I have two both of which are living with partners. I have acquaintances but not friends unfortunately!

44SoStartingOver Sat 23-Feb-13 20:48:28

Ah, but by the time your new home is ready for a lodger, you may well have a candidate.

Your boyfriend is thinking about what will make him happy.
You need to think about what will make you happy.

Your salary will increase, you will learn DIY skills, you can buy in some help, get a better relationship with your mum.

When you want children, you will be much better placed to adapt your career to suit (if you want to).

Ime starter boyfriends are a poorer investment than starter homes.

TempusFuckit Sat 23-Feb-13 20:48:46

Take the house, make it yours and yours alone.

You're both so young - I don't think either of you are being that selfish really, you both need to work out what you want from life yet.

Take in a lodger by advertising. (A friend of mine did that, a sexy fireman moved in and they're now happily married with a child wink),

Grey I bought a do-er upper on my own, working full time, with a 5 yr old daughter as well.

No central heating, only half double glazed, new kitchen & bathroom needed & I was terrified at first of the financial responsibility.

I am currently sitting beside the fire in my sitting room, DD is upstairs reading, my house is cozy & gorgeous even though it took me a long time to do the work over the years.

If you can separate out the issues with your BF (who really doesn't sound committed at all) & go for it yourself I think you should. If it works out with your BF, great, you'll have a house & a relationship, if not, at least you will have your home for you and your dogs.

kalidanger Sat 23-Feb-13 21:00:59

OP You're not selfish at all. He's trying, again, to control you. Accusing someone of being selfish when they want to do something for themselves is textbook. It's designed to give a feeling of unease and doubt. Nothing too specific, but no one wants to think they're selfish. He wants to make you feel bad so you don't do what you want.

DioneTheDiabolist Sat 23-Feb-13 21:15:56

You say you feel lonely and unsatisfied with life, I'm not surprised Greyhorses. Life has dealt you a very difficult hand. But you really sound amazing. You have had to work much harder for the things others take for granted and at 22 you are way more sorted than me or my friends were at that age.

A mortgage is scary.
A load of DIY is scary.
But it's all doable. Buy your house. Do what you can yourself with it one room at a time.

You do not sound selfish. You sound intelligent, driven and very capable. Now get yourself and your dogs a

Illgetmegoat Sat 23-Feb-13 21:21:17

Sweetie you sound very unsure of yourself but look at what you have already done on your own!

Take that house, if you can afford it without starving or selling an organ, take it - it will be yours , your place to be safe and settled and happy. I was shunted around a lot, pillar to post to north pole, moved out of home at 15 and lodged with family, rented as soon as I hit 18. Renting was better than moving around but since we bought the house I feel completely different. Happier and I feel I finally have stability I so wanted. It still needs some work but we're getting there - but when I'm here snuggled in bed in my finished bedroom, dogs and cats on the end of the bed I honestly couldn't care less we still have a temporary bathroom ceiling and 1 and a half kitchen drawers! Considering I DIY and some of the things I learned how to do - I know you can do it, it's really not that hard if you read the instructions, they just like to make it look tricky or just aren't very good at it! (crass generalisation there, lovingly tongue-in-cheek though).

I'd be ditching the deadweight personally but if you don't want to don't - move on with your life, take your house and start to live to your own schedule - you can get to know the area on your own/with friends you don't need him, just google maps! - and if he gets left behind in your wake, well he didn't want it enough did he? He is happy to advance using your support as a springboard, keeping you down and in your place, now you are finding out that it is not reciprocal and after 6 years it's hard to admit your partner isn't what you thought, this is more than a negative outlook. Go forward, it will be so worth it - if he comes, fine, if he doesn't then you know for sure he is a manchild that wanted you to provide for his needs above your own, just like his mother did - baby, ain't nobody got time fo' that! smile

minimus Sat 23-Feb-13 21:21:30

OP you're not selfish at all, you sound very thoughtful. Please go for the house if its what you want. I totally understand your desire for the stability & security that a home of your own will provide for you and your dogs. That's what should come first, not your dithering b/f's needs or timescale.

On a slightly different note, I notice you say that he is generally 'a negative person and that everything is an obstacle'. I'm in my early forties and I have lived with someone like that. It is not easy no matter how much you love them.

Similarly to you, I was ready to buy somewhere when I was in my early twenties but my partner at the time wasn't so we rented for ages and moved house loads instead. I know I can't change things but now I'm SO MUCH older I can see that I shouldn't have let someone else sway me. I still have the odd moment where I wish I'd gone ahead with buying in the area I wanted all those years ago. Def agree with others, don't let him move in without contracts/payment agreements etc.

So go for it and very best of luck to you smile

ImperialBlether Sat 23-Feb-13 21:46:02

If he's a negative person, teaching will finish him off!

Buy the house. Advertise for a dog-loving lodger who is working (out all day so no electricity bills then.)

Don't put his name on the deeds. Don't put his name on the mortgage.

You can do it. A lodger would be a great way of making new friends. Ask one of your more sensible friends to help you vet them. The lodgers, not the dogs!

catsmother Sun 24-Feb-13 00:42:48

I really don't think you'll have a problem getting a lodger regardless of the house being shabby/old-fashioned/in need of repair etc so long as the basics like a usable bathroom, heating, cooking facilities are there. In fact if you're honest up front that there'll be ongoing renovation as you can afford it, and ask for a rent slightly less than what you'd get if the house was in tip-top condition, then I'm sure you'd get lots of interest as so many people are strapped for cash right now and many would be delighted to save money even if it means they have to "endure" a house that isn't in perfect condition.

The house sounds really fantastic - not least with a big garden for the dogs, and the mortgage sounds a bargain. I don't know where it is or what the going rate for a room in a shared house is there but surely a lodger's monthly rent must come very close to paying the mortgage in whole - if you got two lodgers that'd help even more. Please don't pass up this opportunity ... you don't need him to do this .

pollypandemonium Sun 24-Feb-13 00:50:53

Get the house and get a lodger (or two) to help with the bills. You can earn quite a lot tax free (I think it's 5000 a year?). Follow your heart and make it happen.

izzyizin Sun 24-Feb-13 00:56:54

Make sure the house is in your sole name and take in a couple of lodgers who will be happy to pay a little less than market rate for a room while you're getting together the cash to renovate.

I recommend you put 'chefs preferred' on any ad you place for house-share as I've yet to meet a chef who wants to get in the kitchen on their days off or any other time smile

pollypandemonium Sun 24-Feb-13 01:00:41

Also get a green deal assessment which will give you a loan to do energy saving work to the house (double glazing etc). That gets paid back through your electricity bill, which your lodgers will help you with!

exexpat Sun 24-Feb-13 01:11:06

If he really wanted to buy a house with you, the PGCE would not be an obstacle. DH & I bought a wreck of a house just before my final year at university and did it up during that year. I still managed to get a first class degree. And that mortgage, even if only paid by one of you, is less than many students pay for a room in a grotty shared house.

I think I agree with everyone else: go it alone, and get a house-mate if necessary to help with the bills. Maybe see if you can find someone who'd be willing to pitch in with wall-paper stripping, painting etc for reduced rent?

SevenPalms Sun 24-Feb-13 01:14:26

I think the selfish ones in your life are your DP and parents. They, as adults got the dogs, they should look after them or they should have taken one each. Waiting around for your DP and looking after the fallout of their divorce is very mature and unselfish of you.

Greyhorses, you are a strong woman. If you can get the mortgage on your own, then do it. Your DP is 26 and he is still a student. Where is it going to end TBH. If I were you I'd get the mortgage and let out a room.

When I was young my mum died and my Dad got a girlfriend within days. He used to leave me alone in the house at night and go off to hers and come back about 11.30pm. I was terrified. I soon learn't that he was putting his own needs before mine. He later kicked up a stink when I wanted to move out, but move out I did. I realised that the only person who can make me happy is me and that I am responsible for myself. I am not a selfish person, but I do not rely on others to fulfil my dreams, I can only do that myself.

Go for it.

Whether or not you buy this house, dump the man. FFS you are 22 years old and you have already spent 3 years trying to get this useless, selfish, lazy whinarse to commit to you. He doesn't want to. He is Not That INto You. And you don't need him. You are young enough to build a fabulous life for yourself, you have over a decade to decide whether or not you want children, why on earth are you letting yourself be dragged down and limited in your options by this man? Having a male partner is not compulsory, and nice men who are solvent, kind, interesting and competent are not that difficult to find.

Chubfuddler Sun 24-Feb-13 05:13:02

Buy the house. Dump the boyfriend. Listen to the older women here who would have loved to be in your shoes at 22 knowing what we know now.

Jayne266 Sun 24-Feb-13 05:25:26

What a amazing opportunity you are very lucky with the house. I
Agree with other members and if your worried about the relationship side you can just say your buying it yourself and carry on with the relationship you have. But be aware I
Have heard of situations before where someone has done all this then the dp stayed over a lot and unofficially moved in.

You've been together 6 years which, by my reckoning, means he was 20 and you were 16. That is a big age gap at that age. I am wondering if he started seeing you at this age because he was already a bit of a young 20 and thought going out with a 16 year old he wouldn't have to grow up. Now you are rushing ahead of him; job; home; dogs; life. I think he may just be one of those men who doesn't grow up takes time to grow up.

If you want this house, go for it. Don't put him on the bloody paperwork whatever you do.

Passthesaltdear Sun 24-Feb-13 07:12:54

I was in exactly same position six years ago and felt very proud of myself and never looked back wink

GeordieCherry Sun 24-Feb-13 09:24:57

22 with the chance to get a mortgage by yourself?? I'm so jealous!
I got mine in my late 20's after dithering for a wee while. Wish I'd done it sooner
IF you'd live in that area regardless of what he thinks he wants, go for it. That house is your pension if need be, security for right now, & a great opportunity to prove to yourself how capable you are

To echo others, really don't put his name on anything. It's not unromantic to look after yourself. If he does move in, financially contribute equally etc, then sort that out later. Look out for #1

Good luck!

ThingummyBob Sun 24-Feb-13 09:34:13

Ime starter boyfriends are a poorer investment than starter homes.

44SO speaks so much sence in this one line. I wish someone had said the same to me at 22 grin

OP, you sound lovely, sensible, sorted and mature. Your DP does not. You are not sharing life goals at the moment. This may change in time. Or maybe not.
Either way, if you can get the house on your own then do it! Worry about the diy etc when you have the keys in your hand and your name on the deeds. Nothing feels better I assure you grin

cooper44 Sun 24-Feb-13 09:34:26

Totally take the house! Buying is so daunting first time - it seems like a huge burden but actually it's not at all. Cheaper then renting and this house sounds like a great deal. You can't really go wrong and if you struggle just get a lodger.
Sounds like you are being really held back. He sounds like a burden rather than a partner.

knitknack Sun 24-Feb-13 09:40:22

For goodness' sake DON'T put his name on the mortgage if you DO decide to go ahead... make sure that this is YOUR house!

CogitoErgoSometimes Sun 24-Feb-13 09:42:49

General rule in life if you're a considerate, 'normal' woman ... be a bit more selfish. smile

Have met so many (too many) women in my life that think wanting to be #1 priority makes them selfish, who never push themselves forward, who undersell their abilities & achievements because they don't want to be seen as big-headed ..... Have rarely met a man who thought the same way. That's why so many idiot male run organisations whilst capable females flounder in junior roles. Have also met too many women who put their needs on hold because they're trying to please some idiot partner. Big mistake

So don't hold back. Go for your dream of your own place even if it takes you years to get the thing into shape. Realise your ambition for you, not for someone else. If you need to 'use' people along the way to achieve your goal.... rental money from a lodger or a favour from a friend... go for that too. There will be ups and downs, of course. That's part of the fun. But one day you'll be able to stand back and look at your lovely home and think 'I did that'.

Good luck

kalidanger Sun 24-Feb-13 10:05:18

This thread is lovely. Everyone is so delightedly envious of the wonderful position you're in re: the house and your opportunities grin And no one thinks you're the least bit selfish. The 'selfish' thing is actually completely bizarre and doesn't fit the circumstances one little bit. So, have a think about that and don't forget to put your 'progress pics' in the DIY/Property threads wink

MyHeadWasInTheSandNowNot Sun 24-Feb-13 10:26:06

I just want to give you a big HUG. You are doing so well for yourself despite your parents - you are a credit to yourself.

I don't want to upset you, but really, your boyfriend/partner isn't good for you. I know how hard it is to make the break (I was 24, we'd been together for about 8 years), I felt like he was my life, I felt 'too old' to start again, (I find it so hard to believe I felt like that then!! I'm 44 now and 24 seems SO young!), I felt we'd put too much into the relationship to let it go & that we should 'make it work' - but we did split up and it was the best thing for both of us. It was hard at the time, but soon got better. He isn't your world and I'm sorry to say it, but you are certainly not his.

If you were 'the one' for him he would be doing so much more to make your life happier, to provide you with the security you have never had (not financially, but emotionally) and to build a life with you - but all he is doing is constantly letting you down and making pathetic excuses not to do things.

You sound like you have a lot of get up and go - he will just bring you down.

He sounds like he has his own issues and he needs to deal with them and you need to get on with your own life.

Buy a house to make a home of your own (you can always rent it out if you want to travel or whatever later on). It doesn't have to be this house. Think about it all - the level of renovation required, the location, how affordable it is on you wage alone (then any other income/money from someone sharing is a bonus not a necessity) and if you can afford it on your own (including council tax, power, gas, insurance) then go for it.

I hope you take my advice and really look at your relationship... it's not a supportive one sad

IF you do end up letting him move in with you (which I really hope you don't) then go to a solicitor and pay to have something drawn up that will stand up in court to say he has NO claim to your house AND do not subsidise him in anyway - he pays rent, he pays half the bills and half the food etc. Otherwise he will keep using you and it's not on. You are young, you only need to be responsible for yourself and to be looking out for your future.

ALSO - make sure you can afford to do it if interest rates go up.

Let us know what you do smile

MyHeadWasInTheSandNowNot Sun 24-Feb-13 10:28:25

Oh and another thing. The house sounds like it's in a bit of a state - so make sure you pay to have a FULL survey done, you don't want any surprises once you start doing it up!! (needs a new roof, is subsiding, dry rot, or a million other things).

Go for it! He will either grow up or you can happily get rid knowing he never will.

Good luck

kalidanger Sun 24-Feb-13 10:36:11

And another thing from me; making you wait for 6 years and now making you wait for 9? No no no. How long would you have to wait for marriage? Then for DCs? I mean, if that's what you're into. He's basically in the same position he was when you got together! And needs years and yeas to catch up. He'll never catch up.

Corygal Sun 24-Feb-13 10:39:31

OP - you are lovely and I bet your dogs are too. Go it alone - it will be great. Get the house in your own name, look around for someone else who appreciates your fine qualities and loves your furry friends.

just buy the house (sorry i haven't read all the posts)

but seriously GO FOR IT!

don't spend your life waiting around on him.

Keepyourknickerson Sun 24-Feb-13 10:57:43

He sounds a bit like a 'life time student'. I'd be worried that after the pgce he'll want to study for a phd/doctorate or anything other than face the responsibilities of working and leaving home.

You need a very positive attitude for a pgce btw.

You'll be fine on your own, and maybe you'll meet a keen diy-er who isn't afraid to leave home. Good luck with the house - it sounds like a great opportunity.

Greyhorses Sun 24-Feb-13 11:03:30

Thank you everyone for being so supportive.

I did ends up having an argument with DP last night and most of this came out. He told me he is basically scared of the work level during a Pcge and also the financial responsibility. I told him I will be going with or without him and he is insistent we can make it work

I am planning on speaking to mortgage advisor tomorrow to discuss the practicality of it all. On paper I could afford it alone but then the cost of the work would be in the region of 5000 to get the house in a habitable state (for windows,doors etc) and then any decorating work on top of this although this can be on an as and when basis. I am unsure if i can borrow this money also? for example, if the house is 60k can i thrn borrow 65 to help me get the basics done? I will definitely be getting a survey done however but luckily my dad has many contacts for help with work on a budget.

I am waiting to hear from the vendor also as we still need to finalise the details of the offer so it is all very 50/50 at the moment but I feel this is the right thing for me to do at the moment, if it is at all possible! :-) I just hope I get some good luck for once!

Thanks again everyone, wish I had so much support in real life!

lottiegarbanzo Sun 24-Feb-13 11:04:13

The house sounds amazing, other houses will come along but you can't expect something like that when you want it. Does the area suit you?

Do think through the financial implications very carefully and make sure you can manage. Worst case though, you can always sell.

You might be able to get lodgers at a reduced rent who will put up with it being unfinished and worked upon, provided it's safe. Be careful when choosing them, interview carefully, check references, use a standard contract and go with gut feeling about whether they are ok or not, you don't want more difficult people causing you problems.

Yes, definitely get a proper survey done on the house (building survey, used to be called structural).

Moving house is not cheap, even as a ftb, make sure you factor in solicitors fees, survey, stamp duty if relevant.

You have a new car? Cars are not investments, they depreciate massively. You could think about selling the car and buying something cheaper but reliable to give yourself some cash for moving.

On the boyfriend, it is worrying that he can't see your point of view and doesn't seem to want to try. You live a very insecure life and need security and autonomy, that should not be hard to understand. He must be very complacent and not want to understand, as his life and family circumstances are perfectly comfortable, thanks very much. That and the negativity are not a good signs for a partnership or a future together. Maybe he'll grow up. As a sweeping generalisation - which clearly does not include you - most people are very self-absorbed up to around 26, many do then grow up and notice that the world is not only about them. But, he can come to you on your terms. You need that security and you have a life and many choices ahead of you.

catsmother Sun 24-Feb-13 11:10:20

Have just checked back to see if you've made a decision yet. Another little tip (apologies if you're already aware) is Freecycle ..... amazing what you can pick up for free, and much of the stuff people give away is furniture, often because they're redecorating rather than because it's rubbish - so you'd probably, in time, be able to pick up a couple of bed frames, dining table, chairs, drawers, all sorts of kitchen equipment, rugs, sofa ..... I've seen all of that and more on my local Freecycle.

javabean Sun 24-Feb-13 11:13:11

My first thought was that you're 22 and there's no rush to buy your own home, but having read the rest of your posts I changed my mind and agree with everyone else posting that you should grab the house and go it alone smile You sound like you've achieved so much, and a stable home would be brilliant for you so you don't have to rely on your bf and your family. Even if you had to advertise for a lodger to help cover the bills, it'd be a great investment for the future (my DH did this before meeting me, and it worked out really well).

FWIW, I know loads of people who did PGCEs, and all of them managed to rent somewhere to live on the loan. Knowing the price of rents in this city I don't expect any of them paid less than £500pcm (including bills). Most students manage to find rent out of their loans!! If your bf wanted to, he could sort out the finances.

The financial responsibility will be terrifying no matter how old you are or how much you earn, and I don't think it'd be any less terrifying if your bf agreed to buy with you - you'd be forever worrying about him backing out! Good luck with it smile

lottiegarbanzo Sun 24-Feb-13 11:14:33

If he's not sure about the financial responsibility he can always live there as your lodger. That would give you some cash for renovations and him the freedom to leave to live with his parents if money is too tight. (Bit tricky charging anyone rent to share your bedroom, which is not actually available to let out but, if you're not comfortable taking rent from him, he would at least contribute to bills).

If you do buy together you must do so as tenants in common, with an agreement drawn up by a solicitor, which at this stage will be based on deposit and commitment to the mortgage. Think about how you value both of your input to renovations at the outset, as this could get really complicated later.

Branleuse Sun 24-Feb-13 11:16:33

go for it alone and get a lodger x

CheerfulYank Sun 24-Feb-13 11:17:01

Take the house, honey. smile

he'd rather live free with mummy and daddy than pay bills. i did a pgce - managed to keep a roof over my head at the same time funnily enough

catsmother Sun 24-Feb-13 11:17:27

Ooh x-posted. Glad to see you're seeking further financial advice but please please be careful about protecting your investment if boyfriend moves in. Am a bit hmm how he was so reluctant all of a sudden but now is back to insisting it can work. At whose expense ? Am v worried if he does move in with you he'll use his study to advoid helping with repairs etc and his "impoverished" student state to advoid paying even a small share of bills.

If he's worried about studying and financial responsibility he should stay at home which you said right at the start he's in no hurry to leave. You can then review the situation about moving in together if and when he's in a better financial position, but you'd remain in control. I think you'd feel very resentful if he moved in now and couldn't contribute.

Bogeyface Sun 24-Feb-13 11:18:25

I rather think that he will suddenly change his mind and move in with you when you are the one responsible for the mortgage and bills. You know what you will have then? Your very own cocklodger!

Do no live with this man, he basically wants a mummy he can have sex with, and thats not attractive in anyones books is it?

brass Sun 24-Feb-13 11:22:39

your welfare doesn't appear to be anywhere on his priority list does it? If it's like this now there isn't going to be an epiphany any time soon and you will have wasted some more years out of your life.

You say the offer is based on your wage alone. What do you need him for? You sound like you want to get somewhere in life even though you are younger than him. If he isn't holding you back how much further could you go?

Sort out a home for YOU.

kalidanger Sun 24-Feb-13 11:24:59

Your very own cocklodger!

Oh, good god, of course!! Yes, this man has been in intense training for a long career in living off other people for 26 whole years. He must not be allowed to go from his mother to you. He's not had one ounce of practical responsibility, and however hard things are in 'this financial climate', a 26yo who has never learned to cope with life on his own is not partner material.

This thread is kinda about 1. The bf and 2. The house. I don't think there should be any connection between the two.

ginmakesitallok Sun 24-Feb-13 11:25:09

You will only be able to get a mortgage based on the valuation of the property. If house is valued at 60k, then you'll only be able to borrow a % of that. How much deposit do you have?

Bogeyface Sun 24-Feb-13 11:25:28

I should add that although you are younger than him you are clearly way ahead of him in the maturity stakes. Frankly at 26 he should be champing at the bit to get his own place. A year, 2 years, 5 years, I dont think this man will ever be on the same page as you, so best to do whats right for you.

Definitely take the house, its too good a chance to pass up on!

slatternlymother Sun 24-Feb-13 11:25:39

Another one piling in to add support.

I've been there with barely tolerable parents; it's not nice is it? <sympathetic> There's a fab relationships board with threads all about coming to terms with toxic parents, if you're wanting support with that.

But back to the topic at hand... go for it girl! And ditch the loser, you sound so effortlessly cool and together, why do you need him?

Bogeyface Sun 24-Feb-13 11:30:23

And never underestimate the power of having your own home when it comes to relationships/life. You dont need to rely on anyone else, no one can take it away from you (if you get legal advice and an agreement in place before you move ANYONE in so they can't claim a share of the house) and whatever happens, you will always have a home.

Skullnbones Sun 24-Feb-13 11:30:46

I agree with everyone here. Take the house, in your name only!! Do not let him on the deeds. And if you do decide to let him move in, he must pay rent to you and a share of the bills. Otherwise, ditch his ass and follow your own dreams. I am 10 years older than you and didn't get my first house until I was 29. It too was a fixer upper. It has take three years and we still have work to do. But it is mine. I love it. Do what YOU need to do.

LiveItUp Sun 24-Feb-13 12:05:56

How are you being selfish? You're not stopping him from doing his PGCE. I gather you don't live together now so nothing need change there - he carries on living at home, you in your new place. Keep the relationship going if you really want to.

Once you have bought a place and put roots down I bet you will soon develop a social life too. It's much harder to do that living out of bags as you are now. And you get an enormous feeling of self-achievement when you have sorted your own place out yourself. Go for it. For YOU.

changeforthebetter Sun 24-Feb-13 12:29:18

Buy the house and get a lodger, if necessary. This is your chance to give yourself some stability. Not sharing the cost with your boyfriend means you have complete control - scary but so worth it.

Your boyfriend sounds a bit of a nightmare. If he gets through
the PGCE (it is a very hard year), and then gets a job (lots of experienced staff going for posts which might previously have only attracted newly-qualified staff), all well and good. He may have to move, depending on his subject speciality. Both PGCE and NQT are bloody hard work. If he is already inclined to be negative then he is not going to fun to live with.

Please plan YOUR future without making everything dependent upon him. You sound very sorted out for 22. You can do it! smile

Dear op, you are my daughter's age, and you sound very sorted. I'm so glad you've said you will go ahead anyway with buying the house.

I think just say I am buying myself a house. If you, as my boyfriend, want to come round at weekends and help me renovate it, that would be lovely. I understand you are scared about becoming independent and responsible for yourself and so you best stay living with your parents. When you reach the stage where you feel responsible enough to come and live like adults together, and you have the money, we'll talk about it, if we are still together at that time.

You don't have to live together. You don't have to split up if you don't want to. You are a young FREE woman, and you can do what you want.

Very best of luck smile

hippoCritt Sun 24-Feb-13 13:11:16

Another one here saying get it in your own name, don't let him move in, maybe stay if you want him to. You sound incredibly strong, you have already been through so much.

There are also websites to rent out a room Mon-fri so if you work similar days you'd have your house to yourself at workends if you were decorating etc.

Good luck to you

Sausagedog27 Sun 24-Feb-13 13:28:59

Buy the house op! But on your own, don't get him put in the deeds. He does sound like a bit of a cocklodger- protect your interests, don't worry about him.

If you are daunted about the amount of work, try listing it out on here - the property DIY boards are fab (I'm on there a lot) and we can guide you in relation to the work. It's good to make a list of the immediate/medium term/long term projects so you can get an idea of costs etc. ie windows- what's wrong with them? Boiler, electricals, roof all worth thinking about now.

Good luck!

Sausagedog27 Sun 24-Feb-13 13:30:13

Ps I bought my house on my own at 22- I needed to get away from family etc. it was the best decision I ever made!

Greyhorses Sun 24-Feb-13 14:01:20

Thank you everyone. I am speaking with my advisor on Monday so will have to think about what to do then. I agree this is something I think I must do alone it is just not how I imagined 'our' life to turn out :-(

In terms of the renovation it needs:
Windows double glazed upstairs, new doors, new kitchen and bath (rest of bathroom ok) but the return could be huge. I offered 10k less than asking price which is over 40k less than the selling price of the last house in the street. I have a 10% deposit and legal fees but wouldn't have much left for renovation at all so may need to borrow in the short term which is also a worry!

I do have a new car but it has depreciated to the point if I sell I will be in negative equity of 4k so can't really as I will have minus 4000 to replace it with. I do need a reliable car to get me the 20mile commute to work hence buying it as it is very economical at 60-70mpg, although with hindsight it proberbly was a mistake :-)

SevenPalms Mon 25-Feb-13 01:12:33

You need to ditch the loser and find yourself a new boyfriend who is a builder or handyman wink

KeatsiePie Mon 25-Feb-13 06:02:23

Take the house! Take it. It sounds perfect.

Don't put his name on it (tell him, you can always add his name later when he's sure it's what he wants).

Don't let him move in (tell him, he can always move in later when he's sure it's what he wants).

Move in yourself and then look at your situation as if it were a dear friend's. Pretend this is someone you adore and think highly of: she's working hard, she takes good care of her dogs, she's caring to her parents no matter how trying they are, she's motivated to build herself a fulfilling life and willing to get out there and do it (such as buying the house!), she's making some friends, she's talented, she's smart, etc. etc.

Now think about whether this boyfriend adds value to this person's life. Is he hardworking? Is he motivated? Does he actively want, and is he actively working toward, having a fulfilling life? Does he act in a caring and responsible way toward the people he loves?

I'm not saying you have to rush to break up. But I do think this is a really, REALLY good time for you to evaluate -- not meanly, but fairly, with some detachment -- whether this guy is bringing as much to the table as you are. Note again I am not talking about money or looks. I'm talking about whether he wants to live happily and productively, like you do. Believe me, in the future you do not want to be dragging him through your shared life, nor do you want to be putting your shared life on hold until he is ready to live it.

HoneyandRum Mon 25-Feb-13 08:16:41

Hello Greyhorses, my parents both died when I was in my teens and I know the feeling of not having a home a place where you're always welcome, where they always have to let you in when you're at the door, where you can relax and not be waiting to be moved on and so you'll always know you have a place to be at Christmas. My dad died when I was 19 and was also bipolar so I've lived with the affects of that too.

What you seem to be saying to us is "at this time in my life I need a home more than a relationship". I agree. Forget BF for a moment, what do you need to progress any further, you are clearly telling us you need stability. I don't know if you've noticed but your BF is not very stable, stuck in a rut maybe but I'm talking emotional stability. It sounds like you are parenting him somewhat.

Here's a little nugget I picked up in my 44 years do NOT get into a relationship with and definitely do NOT marry someone who is not happy. This bloke is not happy - he is the only one who can change that. It should be clear to you after 6 years that you can't change that. Maybe you've been clinging to him as some form of consistency from when you were 16 but I don't believe you are in the same place emotionally as you were then. You have the strength to understand what you need, find it and do it.

Also successful relationships usually have partners with equal ambitions or life goals. You are much more focused and forging ahead while your BF is not your equal in ambition or goals. His main goal seems to be avoiding work and responsibilities, not taking them on.

Practicals: definitely have a full survey and walk through the house with one of your dad's contacts to get estimates on all the work so you know what you're dealing with financially. But you are so young and you're a tough cookie so I don't think it will be difficult for you to live in a "work in progress" for a few years. The relief and joy at having your own home will more than make up for it. And if it truly all goes tits up financially you are so young you could easily start over. As so many women here have already said, with no children or responsibilities to others this sounds like the perfect time for you to forge ahead.

From what you have said the benefits of owning your own home outweigh the risks to you at this time.

exexpat Mon 25-Feb-13 10:28:31

Thinking about it, if the only reason you picked this particular house, with all the work needing doing on it, was because it fitted your boyfriend's specifications, but you are now worried about getting the work done and paying for it by yourself, is it worth having another look to see if there is any other property around for the same sort of price (ie same mortgage) that you would like just for yourself and which might not require so much investment of time and money in doing it up?

If you are removing your DP from the house-buying equation, there is no need to be bound by the requirements he set. You might prefer a smaller house or flat with less work needing doing to it, particularly if you are working long hours.

lottiegarbanzo Mon 25-Feb-13 11:35:57

Remember the advisor is trying to sell you a mortgage, for his commission.

Loads of excellent advice here (and HoneyandRum's point about happiness is excellent, I'm keeping that, so many people think the next relationship / job / life change will 'cure' them and make them happy. It can help but not unless they sort themselves out first). Notwithstanding that, I'd just add that I don't think your BF is that unusual for a 26-year old. If he hasn't lived away from home at all for university that's a bit odd but if he's been coming back between courses, until he's got a 'proper job' (which he is making real progress towards) that's really quite normal and something many parents on here would recognise and support. It's easy for people to point out his imperfections as a partner but, he is young and, were he their son, there might be more sympathy for giving hom freedom to grow up and perhaps even concern at his becoming 'tied down' so young (e.g. what if he can't get a teaching job locally and needs to move to develop his career?).

People, especially when young and absorbed in developing their own careers and identities and, IME especially when they've had a comfortable, consistent upbringing, can be shockingly bad at stepping outside that bubble to empathise with others whose life experiences are different. It's no excuse, this is your BF, he should really care about you and want to understand your feelings and your POV but, I'm just saying he's not that unusual for his age and stage. You are, you know it and I think you're doing exactly the right thing by identifying what you really need and focusing on securing that. Whether the BF turns out to be right for you in the longer term is another question but you don't need to make any decisions about that now, just practical ones about your home.

Whocansay Mon 25-Feb-13 13:24:20

Buy the house on your own. Get a lodger. Ditch the flakey boyfriend. I suspect he's keeping his options open if he's going to Uni, tbh.

HollaAtMeBaby Mon 25-Feb-13 19:58:42

Buy the house.
Dump the boyfriend.
Get a dog-loving lodger.
Feel awesome grin

I'm delighted you are looking at the practicalities, here are a few more, (I hope!)

Don't get too caught up in doing everything at once. Is the roof leakproof? Are the doors secure? Are the windows solid (i.e. not rotten?)

You can live without double glazing (unless you are beside a motorway!) Good thick curtains (interline them with cheap fleece throws from Ikea). Is it security you are worried about? Get extra locks from B&Q.

New doors - are they in a state, or just a bit drafty? Get stick on draft excluder (it'll buy you a year or two).

Kitchen - have you a cooker, sink, washing machine? Really you will survive with just those.

All these things are nice but not essential. I have a confession. When I moved in, there was an open filre (with a back boiler that heated the water), an immersion heater, and two storage heaters - one in the hall, one on the landing. That was 11 years ago. The two storage heaters lasted about 3 years. I then only got central heating (OFCH) 18 months ago. Electric blankets on mine and DD's beds were a lifesaver (and so cheap to run). Compared to her friends in school, and my friends, we actually suffered less head colds and sore throats - I reckon we were a bit tougher due to the slightly more demanding living conditions.

You are only 22 and have two lovely cuddly hairy hot water bottles dogs to keep you warm.

If your folks offer you a present for moving in, choose something practical. Mine gave me the house alarm.

Modern life has us spoiled, I think. I remember as a student some of the places I viewed, no one would ever consider these acceptable nowadays.

However I do love my comfort (my kitchen where I am sitting and typing is toasty warm from the CH tonight) - I'd be the last person on Earth to enjoy camping etc, but lots what you mention are cosmetic things. I bet if you took a week off work with a skip and a couple of extra pairs of hands, you could get the place de-ivy-ed, and a fresh coat of paint would go a huge way to making it habitable.

Whatever you decide, please separate out the BF from the house, I think you have two different issues there and shouldn't let one affect the other.

Lord this post turned epic! I only intended to add a couple of lines! The best of luck whatever you decide (and if you do buy, would love to see the before and after pics).

yes... please remember the pics! cause im a nosey cow i love seeing things like that grin

shadesofwhite Tue 26-Feb-13 18:21:53

I second this idea,

Get the house and don't put his name on it, you are deAling with all the financial aspects of it so why put his name on it? hmm Tough love grin .

If you lurk on MNet a lot you can tell how difficult it is when you sacrifice all you have or couLd have had for his sake YET he is unsure of what he wants you'll realize that down the line . Be glad he is opting out now than after you get the house smile

By the way Dump the twat if he tries emotional blackmail making you feel selfish

Good luck hun.

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