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Advice needed - OW problems resurfacing.

(125 Posts)
Lilly3000 Sun 10-Feb-13 17:35:33

My husband of 22 years had an emotional affair about a year ago. A woman friend (married without children) came to him and told him she was in love with him, had been forever. He / we were going through a difficult time with work, money shortages, his mother dying and general day-to-day shite. They had lots of things in common and she said that they were soul mates, destined to be together blah blah blah. She said she knew how to help him find happiness ( yoga teacher) and that her love was 'unconditional'. Like an idiot he got hooked on the escapism and flattery. It went on for a couple of months; clandestine meetings and a kiss. It all came to a crashing halt when I felt suspicious and listened to a message on his phone, telling him that her husband had found out and had asked her to leave. DH admitted what had been going on and I was absolutely devastated. He wrote to her severing all contact the next morning.

Since then has undergone a year of counselling, endless soul searching and as a result everything is much better between us now. He's even started going to church - bit weird for me as I don't go, but I can see it helps him. It has been a very, very rocky road but one that we've both tried very hard to steer a course on with the help of the brilliant Shirley Glass book. He's far from innocent is this but I do believe it was a strange period of madness that he regrets very much. We've managed to keep this from the children. So far so good.

That is until last week. They both work in the same street but he has managed to avoid any contact for 12 months. Last week she flipped in the street, shouting that he couldn't treat her like this and that she could make everything very difficult for him. She insisted her love had been 'unconditional' and had never meant to hurt anyone. This is in spite of her husband marching her to the park and showing her a family with young children, pointing out that this is what she was trying to break up. She said to DH that he 'must hate her to treat her this way'. Actually he's scared that if acknowledges her then I will be upset and we will take a step backwards. In order to calm her down he said that he didn't hate her but he had to go. She calm down immediately. He came back, got himself into a state about it and then told me. It's all feeling a bit bunny boiler. A friend of mine says she's nut and needs to be 'managed', i.e we need to stop ignoring her. This fills me with dread in case she tries a range of irritating spiritual hypocritical excuses to worm her way back into our lives. What do you think? By the way, I hate her with the fury of seven hells ;) but I know it's not good for me and I look forward to the day when she is a dim and distant memory.

CartedOff Sun 10-Feb-13 17:55:15

" In order to calm her down he said that he didn't hate her but he had to go. She calm down immediately."

Have you heard of the phrase "Any attention is better than none?" This applies to her. She'll feed off any scraps she can get. The only thing he and you can do is refuse to engage and continue to ignore her. You don't have to manage her! How on earth is that your responsibility? shock If she harasses you, you contact the police. That'll soon teach her that she can't scream at people in the streets and follow them around.

The ONLY reason she calmed down is because she got a response. That's what she's going for. You can't give her anything- she'll feed off of it. She'll start up whenever she wants a response. He has to keep ignoring this person.

notonlybutalso Sun 10-Feb-13 17:59:50

The only hold a mistress has over the man is if his wife doesn't know. You do know, she knows that you know ergo she has no hold over him. Don't get drawn into power games. If your OH did as you described when accosted it seems to me that it was the right thing to do, and will probably have the desired effect. If she continues to accost him I would suggest he resolutely ignore her. Oh, and keep a diary of all this, just in case you need to escalate to a complaint to the police about stalking type behaviour. But I don't think you will - it took her a year to follow up on the severing of links.

izzyizin Sun 10-Feb-13 18:01:04

'Stop ignoring her'? Your friend's as nuts as the ow sounds to be. Has s/he by any chance indulged in a spot of bunny boiling in the past and feels some empathy for the nutty one?

This smacks of tales from Reader's Digest Toytown - 'the man who ran away with the fairies for a couple of months, succombed to the embrace of a witch, and found religion'.

Given that they work in the same street, how's he managed to avoid encountering her before? Does he hide behind post boxes, duck into doorways, put his umbrella up in front of his face?

Your h and, by default, yourself, need to continue ignoring Ms Dundee-Cake and, if she should accost him in the street again, your h needs to make it plan that any further such encounters will result in her incurring a visit from Mr Plod the Policeman.

As for your 'friend', I suggest you 'manage' her/him to the Christmas cards only section of your address book - and stop sending them after a couple of years.

izzyizin Sun 10-Feb-13 18:02:05

make it plain!

badinage Sun 10-Feb-13 18:03:21

If there had been a 12 month break in contact, what did she mean about 'treating her this way'?

Is his position that he ended things and has never seen or heard from her since?

What did he say in his written communication to her when he ended it?

MajesticWhine Sun 10-Feb-13 18:06:56

Best way to manage is to completely ignore. Unless she gets really out of order, in which case, report her for stalking.
"Spiritual hypocritical excuses" - like what ? Do you mean suicide threats? Is your DH still susceptible to her bullshit?

Lilly3000 Sun 10-Feb-13 18:07:16

Yes, I see your point. My friend has just come out of an unrequited love affair and she says that to be ignored by the person you have given / foisted your heart on to is very painful. This can make people angry and mental beyond reason (?). My DH has a work reputation as a man beyond reproach (ha!) and we live in a very small town. I'm just worried our teenage children don't get wind of it. Don't know if we should arrange to speak to her husband about it and get him to explain the need to blank her. She has 'boundary issues' according to him :/ All wisdom on the subject says that you should sever all contact, so that's what he did. Brutal, but the only way to save our marriage. I sent her an email at the time, outline the damage she had done and she wrote back saying that it had never been her intention to hurt anyone. I just can't get my head round that one.

kalidanger Sun 10-Feb-13 18:08:29

Do you absolutely know all this has happened exactly like he's told it for 100% certain? My first though is " came to him and told him she was in love with him, had been forever." = he wishes


Tryharder Sun 10-Feb-13 18:09:27

I feel for her. Some man tells you he loves you and that you are soulmates and then it all comes crashing down and you realise that your soulmate was just a tawdry wanker who lied through his back teeth. And then said soulmate goes back to wife as if nothing ever happened and then you just want to scream at the fucking unfairness of it. If she ended up leaving her DH for your DH, then I would imagine that she feels doubly bitter. And who could blame her really?

I feel for you also; none of this was your fault. I am sorry that you feel such hatred for her because in the end your DH was the one who had the affair much as you excuse his temporary madness etc.

However, having said that, I do agree with the above poster who said that continuing to ignore her is the best option. Cruel to be kind and all that.

It just bugs me that the man who had the affair gets off scot free while the OW is landed with all the blame and hatred.

Lilly3000 Sun 10-Feb-13 18:09:37

Izzyizin that made me laugh out loud! Yes, he has been hiding!

Lilly3000 Sun 10-Feb-13 18:12:50

Tryharder, you've got the wrong end of the stick. He never said he loved her, or that they were soul mates. She said she had alway loved him from afar and ( get this) they had missed opportunities to get together in PREVIOUS LIVES!!!

She never did leave the marital home by the way.

Cailinsalach Sun 10-Feb-13 18:15:51

Hmm. Her intention isn't worth the paper it's written on. It's the consequences of her actions that cause the harm.

badinage Sun 10-Feb-13 18:18:06

And he said nothing? That's a very full-on response from a woman to a man who was saying nothing similar, isn't it?

So is he saying he hasn't had any contact with her at all in 12 months?

And again, what did he write to her when he ended it?

Lilly3000 Sun 10-Feb-13 18:19:08

MajesticWhine (great name) 'Spiritual, hypocritical excuses' mean 'the universe tells me to be true to myself and take risks, I only wanted your happiness' etc' Bleurgh. I don't think he'd be susceptible to it, but when a negative is framed as a positive ( I only wanted to help you) you can come away feeling confused and like you've done something wrong.

Lilly3000 Sun 10-Feb-13 18:26:06

Badinage, I've cross-questioned him like the Stasi over the last year and it all seems like it was delivered on a plate. "She did the talking" was how he put it smile Honestly, I'm not in the 'it's not his fault' zone - dear God over the last year I've hauled him over the coals for being a twat of huge proportions - but I have to deal with that. The OW I could do without. He hasn't had any contact because he scared himself stupid about losing his family. The email I sent her said in no uncertain terms that if she saw me in the street she would be very wise to cross over. At one point she saw me in the supermarket, dropped her bags and fled!

Lilly3000 Sun 10-Feb-13 18:27:57

Oh, the email when he finished with her said that I knew everything and for the sake of his marriage and family he was severing all contact. Short and painfully sharp.

kalidanger Sun 10-Feb-13 18:37:04

I do apologise OP but are you sure she persuaded him, it was only a kiss and he absolutely cut off all contact? And all that drama in the street? It all sounds quite unbelievable.

It's quite normal for cheaters to only tell the bare minimum they can get away with.

Like an idiot he got hooked on the escapism and flattery. It went on for a couple of months; clandestine meetings and a kiss.

Like a liar he met her for sex, he means.

izzyizin Sun 10-Feb-13 18:38:09

Your friend says that to be ignored by the person you have given / foisted your heart on to is very painful. This can make people angry and mental beyond reason (?)

Only if they're predisposed towards being 'angry' and 'mental beyond reason'. Otherwise, they suck it up on the basis of 'win some, lose some' and 'tis better to have loved and lost' and other such platitudes.

I suspect you need all the laughs you can get and I'm glad to have put a smile on your face, Lilly, but, sadly, it doesn't diguise the fact that your h is cowardly little tosser as are so many who hide behind their reputations as apparent men of honour.

One person needs to sort this and that is the turd man that is 'beyond reproach' and he needs to do it direct with his ex-ladylove if she catches him again skulking behind a pillar box, or walking into a lampost because he can't see beyond his umbrella.

In short, it's time for the deluded lad to man up and stop getting mummy you to fight his demons battles for him.

The 2 of you go to see her husband? What are you thinking? Completely ott and guaranteed to foment more angst all round. Put the twat to the test and see if he passes with flying colours. If not, LTB.

Lilly3000 Sun 10-Feb-13 18:41:37

Calinsalach - yes, but I don't think that she thinks that consequences are important for the spiritually enlightened! Apparently I was 'like a wall' around him, making it difficult for her to speak to him about it before. No shit sherlock. This didn't stop her from trying to be my friend in the years precedeing.

I think there are two explanations for her apparently irrational behaviour - either she has some mental health problems, or your DH has not told you the full story. I'm afraid I think it is the latter. The comment that she could make things very very difficult for him speaks volumes

Lilly3000 Sun 10-Feb-13 18:49:44

Kalidanger, I appreciate it sounds strange, but I've known him for a very long time. I can't explain why I know he's telling the truth, any more than I knew it was time to check his phone, but I do. She definitely wanted to have sex but he knew there would be no way back. I think the trigger was the week before. They had bumped into each other in a carpark, nobody else around. She had said 'hi' and he mumbled hi back, got in the car and drove away. I think that maybe she saw it as an opportunity to speak privately and he didn't take it. In other words, I think she thought that I was the only thing getting in the way. 'Cowardly little tosser' is absolutely right, but what else is he supposed to do? I mentioned talking to her husband because he phoned me right at the beginning to see if I was alright and to assure me that she was going to leave DH alone from then on.

Lilly3000 Sun 10-Feb-13 18:53:37

Twogoodreasons, I think she is talking about his professional reputation (they work in similar fields). Everybody thinks he's the dog's bollocks. Also he didn't need to tell me that bit.

izzyizin Sun 10-Feb-13 18:59:57

It certainly comes to something when the 2 wronged parties take it upon themselves to micromanage the behaviour of the 2 guitly parties, doesn't it?

What does this say about the dynamics of your respective relationships? Maybe you'd be better off with her h and, frankly, that should be the only reason why you should be contemplating makiing contact with him.

I mean, come on. A year's gone by and last week was the first time she was able to nab him as he skulked out of his office/shop? Mark the date in your diary and wait to see if it turns into an annual event.

A word to the wise; check out the congregation at his new place of worship and tell him no way Jose if he expresses his intention of joining the choir.

badinage Sun 10-Feb-13 19:01:35

Ok so you know her personally and all this stuff about her believing in woo zen bollocks can be verified by you personally then?

Because I've got to admit I'm having trouble here believing that a woman would lay her soul bare and risk everything for a man who said and did nothing to encourage her. Even one who believed in fairies and although I detest that 'on a plate' phrase, yes even one who did more of the running, if only at the start.

All this aside, given that your husband said he was ending the relationship 'for the sake of his wife and family' and not his own sake because he wanted the relationship over and realised he loved you more than he wanted an affair, I think it's not 'closed' in her mind is it? She probably still thinks that if her husband hadn't found out and you hadn't seen that message, your husband would still be with her, especially as he didn't include his own views when he ended it.

Wouldn't it be a good opportunity if he bumps into her again to tell her unequivocally that he regrets getting involved with her, takes just as much responsibility for it and wishes her no harm? That he was mad to risk the relationship he wants to be in and feels terrible about hurting the woman he loves?

Or couldn't you be sure that he'd say all that?

Lilly3000 Sun 10-Feb-13 19:06:59

Izzyizn, you make a really good point about the micromanaging, it's just that if DH felt he had to speak to her about fucking-off, then he wanted to be sure that her husband knew it wasn't a cosy chat. I think I got mentioned so that everybody knew what was going on. Remember - the adrenaline buzz of this relationship was the deceit. I think the year thing was the trigger. This is the first time in 22 year this has happened, so I don't think it's a habit. (Plus her husband is a sanctimonious knob ssh)

JamieandtheMagicTorch Sun 10-Feb-13 19:09:01


The OW had an affair too, so i wouldn't feel too sorry for her. But I do get that it is easier for the Op to believe her H rather than her.


That's an excellent summary.

kalidanger Sun 10-Feb-13 19:11:56

He's lying!!!111!!

JamieandtheMagicTorch Sun 10-Feb-13 19:14:06


Sorry that was rude of me to address other people first. I must say that my first insctinct was that there is probably more to this than he has told you, but that thisncould develop into a stalking situation, and I would want to keep a close eye on that, as others have said.

Lilly3000 Sun 10-Feb-13 19:14:40

Badinage, again more good points. Yes, she is dead 'woo zen'. I did feel hurt at the time that he didn't say 'I'm ending this because I love my wife' but to be fair he was all over the place then and I don't think he knew how he felt about anything, particularly me. He said that all his feelings felt dead, which makes me think he was depressed. His mum had been ill for a very long, awful time, which is no excuse but goes some way to explaining his unhappiness. You have to remember he finished it because I found out, not because he got tired of the adrenaline buzz. I think you are absolutely right about what the OW thinks. But because he's a man, he doesn't understand the need to explain feelings ( sorry for the generalisation, but it's often true). When she stopped him in the street and began the ranting, he did say pretty much what you've suggested, although he was caught off guard.

JamieandtheMagicTorch Sun 10-Feb-13 19:17:55

You are making a lot of excuse for him. I'd have thought that a prerequisite for trusting him again would be that he actauly stops being crap about expressing his feelings and tries a bit harder.

Lilly3000 Sun 10-Feb-13 19:21:10

Jamieandthe MagicTorch - do you mean like going to a counsellor weekly for a year? What about joining the local church for answers? Do you mean like that?

badinage Sun 10-Feb-13 19:25:29

What about you?

Have you got closure?

From what I've seen in RL, people in your situation need to know they've got the whole truth and they need to know that the OW or OM was told exactly what this was and why it had to end.

I don't get the impression you've got that, even though you've done a good job convincing yourself what he's said was the truth. And if you want the OW to know the truth, this is an opportunity that not many people in your situ get. I hope he didn't/doesn't waste that.

I think lots of women in the OW's position don't get closure either. She obviously hasn't or she wouldn't be behaving like this. I don't think he has to be cruel, just honest with her. Tell her that this was a mistake that he really regrets and that he's just as much to blame for it as her. It's much better for the two of them to have no hard feelings for eachother and to be hard on themselves instead. It's of much more help to you and her husband if they take their halves of responsibility for this. She seems to have been blamed by everyone and from an objective point of view, that doesn't seem fair.

Hatpin Sun 10-Feb-13 19:50:02

How much independent proof do you have of what happened, or is most (all) of this your H's explanation?

The "drama" element is absolutely key imo.

Some people get off on the idea of their (multiple) love interests scrapping over them and declaring undying love and all that. I suppose it boosts their tiny egos that little bit more.

I'd check.out the church thing too.

JamieandtheMagicTorch Sun 10-Feb-13 19:55:20

OK. That may have been unfair.

If he got depressed again or if life was hard has his counselling enabled him to have a different response - to talk to you rather than seeking solace from another woman?

What do you think he gets from church? Do you think it is the uncritical acceptance the OW was , apparently, offering him?

Lilly3000 Sun 10-Feb-13 20:31:00

Interesting. It may be that unconditional acceptance I suppose. Personally I think love IS conditional, unless you are talking about children. The people at the church are really nice and accepting. His brother came out as a transsexual a couple of years before their mum died and it was difficult for him to accept that his 'brother' was gone. Acceptance of difficult truths has become horribly familiar to him.

Also women have always flocked to him - the more off-hand he is the more they seem to love him - and I had to learn to become very trusting, which is why this particular betrayal, after such a long time, was so very hard. Badinage I don't think I'll ever have complete closure to be honest, but this doesn't mean that i plan to shortchange myself. I insist that the attention I get now is top quality! Before all this I thought that if DH was ever unfaithful then I would end it. The last year has taught me a lot about myself, mostly that you don't always behave how you predict. I mourn the loss of the old 'us' but like the new 'us' better. I like the new 'me' better. Hatpin - I don't have lots of documented proof. I did see a number of emails - hers long and lyrical, his not much more than a series of grunts. The counsellor ( married, devout, old) was connected to the church, so that was the link.

Lilly3000 Sun 10-Feb-13 20:33:13

He doesn't know whether to blank her, glare at her or say "Perhaps I should explain....."

Lilly3000 Sun 10-Feb-13 20:43:46

Jamie - I think he is learning to confide in me. I know that sounds odd after such a long marriage, but we all have different coping mechanisms. He kicked a 30 year marijuana habit at the same time as ending the affair. Weed enabled him to cope with his feelings, putting a cloud over them whenever things got hard ( she felt she could save him from this too). He stopped it himself because he felt it stopped him from solving his problems on his own. It has been an intense 12 months in the life of an imperfect man. It has been a success story really, because the odds were stacked against us. I just don't need her crazy shit when I can see light at the end of the tunnel.

izzyizin Sun 10-Feb-13 20:54:00

Aw jeez. You couldn't make it up, could you?

The well-respected stalwart pillar of the community has a long standing relationship with the 'erb and was caught allegedly before he got his leg over with a female contortionist yoga teacher...

Bring back the Screws of the World.

Don't forget to let him know that when if it comes to divorce, you'll be compelled to spill the beans when you get religion and feel the urge to confess all to the assembled congregation.

<waves hands gospel stylee and cries 'Hallelujah'>

badinage Sun 10-Feb-13 21:12:41

I'm not very comfy with the tone of some of this thread. It's not really a jokey subject is it, a poster's devastation?

If I were in your shoes love, I think I'd want him to 'explain' but only if I could trust him to say the right thing and thought that would put a stop to it all. Maybe that's the problem though. He should have rehearsed 100 times over what he would say to her if he bumped into her and although I think it's fair enough that you've got an input into this, you might have more respect for him if he'd handled it with aplomb.

FWIW I do think some people are a bit vulnerable to this sort of thing when other stuff in their life is going a bit belly up. And I think couples can get past this as long as there's complete honesty and changed ways.

AnyFucker Sun 10-Feb-13 21:19:13

Also women have always flocked to him - the more off-hand he is the more they seem to love him - and I had to learn to become very trusting

and you are still having to train yourself to trust him, in the face of very good reasons not to, aren't you ?

nope, not a laughing matter

and certainly not a matter to be swept under the carpet

OP, your defensiveness here, and your excuse-making for your husband's frankly crap and dodgy behaviour is very concerning

Lilly3000 Sun 10-Feb-13 21:23:03

Izzyizin - I don't plan to divorce him - I love him. Why else would I go through all this? A long marriage is about the good times as well as the bad. No, I can't say we have had a boring life but we've always tried hard not to hurt anyone else. It's not really very funny. I don't think I would laugh at someone else in this situation. I was asking for advice, not ridicule. Drug addiction, Leukemia and infidelity aren't the first thing that spring to mind when I'm looking for entertainment. Badinage - thank you for being kind.

Lilly3000 Sun 10-Feb-13 21:37:46

I don't think it's defensiveness. We've grown up together and noone is better placed than me to decide whether he is to be trusted or not. Yes he's made mistakes but he isn't a bad person. He's a terrific father for example. He's the only person who can have me laughing until I feel sick. Is this me being defensive or trying to be honest? Should I throw that away because of a stupid mistake? So far the worst he has done in a 20+ year relationship is have a brief fling and smoked rather than drank. It doesn't make him fecking Hitler! I'm independent minded enough not to jump on the ' leopard can't change his spots' bandwagon, or any other kind of bandwagon for that matter. Remember - I'm a year down the line and I've got a perspective on this that I didn't have at the beginning. I'm a lot stronger and more experienced than you might imagine. I don't need advice about handling him, I wanted advice on handling a weird OW!

badinage Sun 10-Feb-13 21:57:16

It might be a bit of defensiveness, but I think that's maybe understandable the way this thread's gone. I think it's right that posters were querying his version of events but if you know the OW yourself and you've seen E mails and the like, you've probably got a lot more to go on than a lot of people going through something like this. The thing is love, don't let any of those instincts to stick up for him when he's being attacked on here, get in the way of you getting the advice you need for yourself. That's the most important thing. And if there's stuff you're still not sure about, don't feel you can't say so eh?

AnyFucker Sun 10-Feb-13 21:58:47

Oh, I dunno

Presumably you trusted him before this sorry episode began ?

in which case, you were mistaken < shrug >

you are blaming the other woman, instead of blaming your duplicitous partner...a common mistake

it's also common to fall, back on the "he's a good father" cliche

and Les dawson made me laugh, but I wouldn't have wanted to be married to him shoot me down and make me the villian of the piece for criticising your man (if it makes you feel better,and is easier than facing up to facts)

Lilly3000 Sun 10-Feb-13 22:10:15

She has no children, is approaching the menopause ( yes she's older) and has lot of time to think about this. Her husband is away a lot and she thought that DH was the man for her. I've known her for a long time and you would think she was sweet and harmless, but apparently not. I know all of this is hard for people to believe, but she is not a normal person. She believes she operates outside of the rules of normal society and guilt does not feature. Meditation provides her with all the permission she needs. It's all very unusual but then a lot of the people we mix with are! Jeesh. DH hates any sort of confrontation so this is his worst nightmare, but I guess it's a bed he made. I don't like the way she's started glaring at me though.

Lilly3000 Sun 10-Feb-13 22:15:36

sigh Anyfucker - I DO blame him, but I have to live with him. He hasn't stopped her in the street, but she has, disturbing the ground again with crazy behaviour. Yes he was duplicitous but he's tried really hard to make amends.NO, I will never trust him in the same way again. Should he give me blood? What exactly do you expect him to do? Being a good father isn't a cliche, it's important if you want to have happy children. And I do.

Lostonthemoors Sun 10-Feb-13 22:16:20

I think it's perfectly possible to move on with a relationship after adultery. I know someone who forgave her DH an affair and they then had a further 15 years of happy marriage before he very sadly died.

Many many people have affairs, whether full or just emotional and people do rebuild relationships after infidelity.

You know him best.

To answer your question, I think he should try to avoid her entirely from now on and if she confronts him he should just say 'good morning' or something similar and walk on. Otherwise, I would ignore it.

thanks to you - sounds like a very difficult year or so.

Lilly3000 Sun 10-Feb-13 22:18:15

Thanks Lostonthemoors. It has been. Wouldn't wish it on my worst enemy.

AnyFucker Sun 10-Feb-13 22:19:26

A year on, he should be dealing with this/have dealt with it

instead, he is wimping out and letting this OW into your life again

You are the one on an anonymous website, looking for support a year on

what is he doing ? Telling a couple of jokes and playing with his children.

'Course he is...he got off scot free and has two women glaring at each other in the street and fighting over the prize that is him

he is the centre of this seedy little drama...and you have him right there in the starring role

Lilly3000 Sun 10-Feb-13 22:24:05

Wow Anyfucker it's not just me though is it? You're here too for example.

That post is so littered with inaccuracies I don't know where to start....

AnyFucker Sun 10-Feb-13 22:28:14

You are asked for advice. It's entirely up to you what you do with it.

Lilly3000 Sun 10-Feb-13 22:34:35

Lots of the 'advice' on here is about how naive I must be and what a terrible person my DH is. Very little of it is advice on the subject I actually asked about which was....oh, you know what, I can't be bothered..... Thank you to all those who helped. I appreciate it. For the others, I really hope that if you find yourself in a similar situation it works out. But you WILL need to bend in the wind.

AnyFucker Sun 10-Feb-13 22:47:40

No, you are asking us to join you in your wholesale condemnation of the mad and kooky OW and to have some sympathy for your conniving H

Not going to happen...

TheOwlService Sun 10-Feb-13 23:06:35

Spot on.

I feel sorry for the kooky one. There is probably more to it all than meets the eye and the OP probably isnt in the loop.

Feckthehalls Sun 10-Feb-13 23:21:50

OP you and your husband sound like sensible, decent individuals who have worked through a (big) blip in an otherwise happy life together.

I don't think you have too much to worry about.

good luck x

Lilly3000 Sun 10-Feb-13 23:23:58

Thank you Feck.

Looksgoodingravy Sun 10-Feb-13 23:23:58

I can totally understand the way you must be feeling.

As others have suggested keep a log of any further incidents. Twelve months on and ow makes a rather impressive reappearance. This must have been a pretty big blow.

FWIW I would feel exactly the same with regards to the ow. Yes your dh was a complete idiot and is very lucky to have you in his life still but the ow isn't blameless, she knew about you and your children.

I would find it hard knowing dp worked in the same street as the ow so you've done pretty well coming to terms with the fact that this is just the way it is and then this happens! I'd be fuming tbh.

Ignore her and log this and any further incidents.

JamieandtheMagicTorch Sun 10-Feb-13 23:24:27

I don't know. I think it's entirely possible the OW is a kooky pain in the arse.

But what strikes me is that this really ought not to be a problem if you feel you can trust him to robustly defend your marriage. So either there is something going on, or he is secretly liking the attention, or he is a bit of a wuss who needs someone or something else to sort out his problems. What is he frightened of? The worst is over - you know about the affair.

What I think he should do is take control rather than leaving you to do all the worrying. And that means telling her straight out that he loves you, is with you, then if she takes it further contact the police about harassment.

JamieandtheMagicTorch Sun 10-Feb-13 23:26:47


Sorry I sound a bit harsh. I don't men to sound harsh to you. I completely get what you are saying. I have also been married a long time and know these things happen, and can be got over.

Lilly3000 Sun 10-Feb-13 23:27:20

He's more of a wuss i think but he tells me he's rehearsed his "I love my wife, please go away speech" in case she does something similar again.

JamieandtheMagicTorch Sun 10-Feb-13 23:29:25

Good luck. I am off to bed now smile

MajesticWhine Mon 11-Feb-13 07:06:24

Jamie has it right. DH should be the one doing the worrying here, and dealing with her very robustly.
By the way, just re-read your OP - clandestine meetings and a kiss - so he didn't actually shag her then? Perhaps this is the secret that has yet to get out and that's why she could "make everything very difficult for him". Are you confident you have the whole truth?

Lilly3000 Mon 11-Feb-13 08:31:33

Morning. Majestic - other than cross questioning him like about a thousand times, no. For him the line was sex, for me the line was the deceit. I've made it clear that sex isn't the deal-breaker here and he's been given plenty of opportunities to fess up. You have to remember that we've been together since our late teens and the idea of having sex with anyone else is a big commitment. He described it as 'all very restrained' ( other than her enthusiastic announcement of long unrequited love) which I think was part of the thrill. They only actually met a handful of times and mostly with other people there. Yes, he must deal with her, it's the only way. I can see that now. It's just that 'kooky' appears to be a bit of a loose cannon and a year down the line it has shaken both of us. Maybe she really DID love him, or at least an idea of what he was. In which case maybe the quote "love has its reasons, of which reason knows nothing" holds true. I DO trust him not to go back to her, I just don't understand why she's still pursuing him when he is clearly not interested.

Lilly3000 Mon 11-Feb-13 08:40:12

Looksgoodingravy - thank you for being understanding. Sometimes I see her and I don't understand why she doesn't want to hide. I think in her shoes I would probably want to move away. It must be painful, seeing him and me still together when you've done your level best to put a spanner in the works, when you offered everything 'unconditionally'. When the truth came out, he dropped her like a hot stone. Not very gallant, but I can't say I'm not glad. I'm trying to understand her not for him, but so I can stop hating her. It's really hard but tbh it would be a lot easier if she would fuck off somewhere else or stop glaring at me. Maybe I will start keeping that log.....

kalidanger Mon 11-Feb-13 08:51:08

He's lying.

Lilly3000 Mon 11-Feb-13 08:56:30

Kalidanger - thank you for your input sighs wearily again

50shadesofgreyhair Mon 11-Feb-13 09:03:49

Lilly - do you think that you and your husband could confront her together?

A suggestion to consider: he contacts her and arranges to meet her for coffee. Unknown to her, you go too. You both sit her down, but hubby does all the talking. He tells her in no uncertain terms that he wants no contact with her again, and that his love is for you and you only. Then you both get up and leave.

Would that be possible?

Good luck, you're a mature, intelligent woman and know the ins and outs of your marriage better than anyone. No one really knows what goes on in marriages, and nor should they, so we can't, and I certainly won't, judge your decision, or try to dig deeper.


Lilly3000 Mon 11-Feb-13 09:18:07

50 - lovely message, thank you. I have thought about this but my heart races at the very idea. Honestly I don't think I could bear being in the same room as them both. I have a horrible feeling she would try to extend the 'healing hand of friendship' to me. This is probably the grown up approach I suppose. It would be very hard for me not to say anything. It would be very hard not to want to hit her with a chair (grin). The thrust of this is that she still sees no harm in telling a married man of her true feelings for him and offering him an alternative, no strings attached. I have a problem with that. I know it's all his fault for walking through the door, but as someone who trades in apparent well-being, I just don't understand what on earth she was thinking.

izzyizin Mon 11-Feb-13 09:25:45

It seems to me that what you've proposed is degrading to both women, Saffy, and is unlikely to achieve anything other than an exercise in boosting the twat's ego futility which is unlikely to be enhanced by the sweeping violins of a Hollywood movie when he makes his pre-rehearsed declaration of undying love for Lilley.

Furthermore, the ow may leave any such meeting convinced that 'he wouldn't have said those things without Lilley's hand being up his arse' or that having to have Lilley write his speech present means that he cannot trust himself to be alone with her and therefore she's still in with a chance... if only she can get past the goalkeeper.

If you're tempted to go down that path, Lilley, may I suggest you organise a tug of war on the local playing field with him as the prize awarded to whichever of you can drag him into over the line as this would be a be a far more dignified solution than coffee pour trois when the trois is under the illusion she's meeting him for cafe a deux.

Lilly3000 Mon 11-Feb-13 09:37:41

I don't want to be the goalkeeper. I have been and honestly If I hadn't God only knows how far all of this would have gone. But I don't want to do it any more. I think there's lots of good stuff in what Saffy says but at the same time it is very possible that she will see me as being that 'wall' again. Am I mad? Is it ok to tell a married platonic friend that you have always loved them and that it's your destiny to be together? That you are prepared to be there for them at any cost?

50shadesofgreyhair Mon 11-Feb-13 09:39:30

Izzy, you're being a bit dramatic me thinkssmile

He isn't a prize being fought over, the winner is his wife, who has said clearly that she has done a lot of soul searching, knows her marriage, knows the man, and is determined to stand by him, in the words of the old song. So that's her choice. Lilly - the point of what I suggested is that you don't enter into dialogue with her, but that you are there with your husband, a united front, and he states calmly and clearly what is going to happen. Then you walk away. It requires no explanation, no hurling chairs (although I know you naturally could do this) and no tit for tat tug of war playground crap. There is no competition, there was a man who made a mistake, and the woman he made it trying to stir up trouble. If I was her, nothing would get the message across to me more than the man I wanted, telling me calmly and clearly that it is all over and that she is to leave him alone, and his wife standing as cool as cucumber by his side as he said it. Then they both get up and walk away. A united front, a cool, calm direct message, and you go.

That's what I would do, for what it's worth.

Lilly3000 Mon 11-Feb-13 09:57:02

Yes, the battle was a while ago and she lost unequivocally. It wasn't even a battle really as it was a no-brainer. He didn't love her at all, but the illicit thrill and flattery was addictive. She's not exactly a minger either. Shameful I know, but people aren't perfect. My moral compass is fierce and it's probably hard to live up to. Before everybody gets all upset saying I'm making excuses, that is what you have to do to a certain extent in all long-term marriages, otherwise it just won't work. The key is to know the difference between being understanding and being a proper patsy. I don't think I am being a patsy.

MajesticWhine Mon 11-Feb-13 09:57:38

No of course it's not ok. She's bang out of order. And she needs to be told in words of one syllable. I quite like Saffy's idea too. But there is a risk that doing something like this will feed OW's obsession, and that she will quite enjoy the drama.

MajesticWhine Mon 11-Feb-13 09:59:37

Sorry, that was a response to the earlier post, not the one just now.

BelindaCarlisle Mon 11-Feb-13 10:01:35

I don't believe the park bit. Apart from that you poor thing.

Lilly3000 Mon 11-Feb-13 10:04:53

Majestic - hmm... yes. This is all very helpful. Sometimes I think that the 'unconditional love' she was offering may have made him happy for a while ( he was very unhappy at the time). She felt that she could provide an 'outlet' for him that I couldn't and that somehow her wisdom and devotion would improve our marriage. She was very into the celebration of the self. I remember her telling me how she never had children because they took up so much time.

Lilly3000 Mon 11-Feb-13 10:06:07

Her husband phoned and told me about the park bit. Apparently she has form.

izzyizin Mon 11-Feb-13 10:09:30

Mmm... life as a county (pun intended) & western song. Now there's a concept to conjure with...

It seems to me that in her thread Lilly has struck the odd of note of triumphalism at having won her man back but, given that she has variously described the ow as old, menopausal, nutty as a fruitcake, and other epithets which suggest it wasn't much of a contest to wrest him from her arms, I'm wondering why she's spending so much time attempting to anaylse the ow's reasons for honing in on her h especially as she's described him as a veritable babe magnet which, in itself, should surely be explanation enough?

You've said you like your 'new' marriage and you also like the 'new' you, Lilly. Maybe it's time to send the ow a note thanking her for services rendered?

Fairylea Mon 11-Feb-13 10:10:09

After a year of no contact she randomly flips in the street saying he can't "treat her like this"..... ?!

Something smells really fishy here. I think there's been contact in the year that you know nothing of. Sorry.

Lilly3000 Mon 11-Feb-13 10:16:30

I understand why she likes him, I don't understand her lack of respect for our family. I don't understand why she apparently can't take a hint. I don't understand her anger or lack of guilt. I don't understand why a year on she is raking it all up. Until I understand this it's hard to forgive and move on.

Lilly3000 Mon 11-Feb-13 10:18:41

Honestly, I've been watching him like a hawk. There has been no contact at all. Not even a 'hello' until last week. I think that's the problem.

Lilly3000 Mon 11-Feb-13 10:20:41

Apparently he isn't treating her "like a human being". She is insisting on acknowledgement.

izzyizin Mon 11-Feb-13 10:26:35

What does it matter why she's behaving as she is or what she wants? If she makes a complete tit spectacle of herself, the police can have a word in ear about the necessity of decorum in public if harassment charges are to be avoided.

One encounter after a year of him morphing into the invisible man every time he enters and leaves his workplace? Why has it rattled your cage so much?

Lilly3000 Mon 11-Feb-13 10:29:33

Why? Really? Because I thought everyone had moved on. We feel like the door was closed. Obviously she doesn't and I'm scared that she'll do something stupid like start telling everybody or that our children will find out.

izzyizin Mon 11-Feb-13 10:40:22

So she starts telling everybody and she/you/he risk being laughed at, or your dc - who are now teenagers - find out their df's a fool human? Shit happens to all of us and you'll deal with it as a when a pile of manure lands on your head doorstep.

What is the point of living in fear of something that may never happen? Read what happened to Job for a salutory lesson in the danger of fears becoming reality.

50shadesofgreyhair Mon 11-Feb-13 10:57:07

Izzy is right Lilly; shit does happen, and it's bloody horrible, but you have done nothing wrong in all this. You have convinced me that you want to save your marriage, and indeed, you have saved it. What I'm sensing now is that you want it all swept away, and to move on, and for there to be no fallout. You thought it was over, buried, dealt with. The hard fact is that your husband, whether he was depressed, had a lot to deal with, whatever, made a mistake. The fallout is his, and his alone. You are not to blame for this. All you have done is forgiven him, and last time I checked, that wasn't a crime.

You say you're worried that 'she'll do something stupid and tell everyone or our children with find out'. Your worry is the elephant in the room here; she has your fear as a weapon, she senses it, and she's probably going to use it, if he doesn't acknowledge her existence. You disarm her. So, you have to develop a tough skin, and sit back and wait for her to 'do something stupid'. Then you simply shrug your shoulders, look people in the eye, and say, yes, he did get close to having an affair with this woman, I found out, we worked through it, it's history and we are stronger than ever'. You could even get in there first, and tell a few chosen people the truth. You have nothing to be ashamed of. You can't cover for him, or be responsible for him. You might balk at this, because he might not like people knowing. Well, he's going to have to face the consequences of his mistake. He's a grown up. You all are.

If you confront her with your husband, and simply state what I suggested upthread and walk away, you will achieve two things - 1, you will see him tell her that it's over, end of. 2 - you will hear him say what you need to hear him say to her, that it's you he loves. Earlier you said that he said he was staying for the family, and it hurt you, that he didn't say because he loves you. You excused this by saying he was in a bad place at the time. After the work you've both done on repairing and improving your marriage, he's not in a bad place now, is he? So now he can look her in the eye, make his statement, and you can both walk away. And if she spits her dummy out, and tell people, so the hell what? You confirm it if people ask, and you tell them it's history.

badinage Mon 11-Feb-13 11:06:43

I'd have thought it was obvious why this has re-opened fresh wounds and brought back some fear.

But if the worst that could happen is that she starts telling others, including your children, you will deal with it. It doesn't do kids any great harm to know their parents are capable of fucking up. As long as part of that life lesson is understanding what adults do to repair the harm they cause from their mistakes. And some reassurance that it won't happen again. They might even remember this when they are adults and they face similar crises in their relationships. Your husband would have to take the lead on this though - not you.

In fact if the worst happens, there might be some other blessings. I don't think it helps cheaters to face up to what they've done if they're allowed to keep it secret. As he's been allowed to go about his life with his reputation intact, it must have distanced him somewhat from the reality of his actions and the consequences thereof.

I like Saffy's idea, myself. Either that, or he finds a way to get the right message to her that is so unequivocal that it closes the lid on this once and for all.

I do think being a 'wuss' as you describe him was probably a contributory factor to this happening, so if he's still like that, it's a problem isn't it?

Lilly3000 Mon 11-Feb-13 11:18:55

Sorry, I've been up at the school taking in forgotten P.E kit. Yes 50- 'Earlier you said that he said he was staying for the family, and it hurt you, that he didn't say because he loves you. You excused this by saying he was in a bad place at the time. After the work you've both done on repairing and improving your marriage, he's not in a bad place now, is he?' Absolutely, it would be good to hear in that setting. Badinage - Our kids are so settled and lovely, I don't want to upset them with this daft adult shit. But you make a good point that they will see we tackled it head on, that problems can be overcome. 'In fact if the worst happens, there might be some other blessings. I don't think it helps cheaters to face up to what they've done if they're allowed to keep it secret. As he's been allowed to go about his life with his reputation intact, it must have distanced him somewhat from the reality of his actions and the consequences thereof.' Yes, I hadn't thought of that.
Is he still a wuss? He still hates confrontation but he is definitely prepared to say whatever he needs to to mend us. Maybe that meeting is the way forward after all.

badinage Mon 11-Feb-13 11:29:59

I think it does older kids good to know that marriage isn't a fairytale and that in the real world, even if you love your partner to bits you can fancy other people. Or they'll fancy you and so you need defences in place to deal with people who wish your relationship harm.

The wuss comment came from what you said yourself and yes I do think he needs to get better at confrontation, or he could sleepwalk into something like this again. If he'd sent woo lady packing at the first fence, none of this would have happened would it? Part of being a grown up is to stop being so bloody polite with idiots and to be curt and dismissive of people who are out to cause trouble. If he still can't do that, it's a problem.

MadAboutHotChoc Mon 11-Feb-13 11:41:08

Having been there before, I can sympathise with your fear of the DC finding out - but those who say its not the worst thing that can happen are right.

If my teenage DC were ever to find out about DH's affair and given how OW was an old friend, it is a very real possibility, I am sure that the fact that unlike their weak and selfish grandfather and uncle, DH manned up and repaired our marriage will serve as an important and useful life lesson for the DC.

Take a chill pill, let it go, let him deal with him and instead focus on the rebuilding of your own life smile

Lilly3000 Mon 11-Feb-13 11:41:15

It's funny. A big part of his job is telling people 'how it is' in no uncertain terms. He's fine about to delivering difficult news that people don't want to hear but he's historically been terrible about confronting emotional stuff ( I've always thought he was a bit autistic that way). He's much better at it these days - I actually think the church malarky is helping with that. Maybe this latest confrontation is God testing his progress !!!!! smile Maybe it's time he grew up and faced the music.

MadAboutHotChoc Mon 11-Feb-13 11:42:22

And yes, the fact that he is afraid of confrontation is a vulnerability that he needs to look at.

Lilly3000 Mon 11-Feb-13 11:43:47

MadAbout - that's good advice. Sorry to hear about your own personal shitstorm. It sounds like everything is good now. At the beginning it's hard to believe it will ever be better, but it can be.

MadAboutHotChoc Mon 11-Feb-13 11:46:31

Yes, things are good but as you won't be surprised to know its been a hell of a journey that I never ever want to repeat smile
Good luck!

izzyizin Mon 11-Feb-13 11:49:50

What a good idea not.

Accompanying him to a meeting with the ow will scream insecurity on your part. It's saying you really can't trust the poor babe magnet diddums to say what you want him to say needs to be said and keep his flies zipped hands off her.

There's also the small matter of luring the ow to a meeting a trois under the false pretence it's going to be a deux. Quite apart from the possibility she'll cause a scene on the spot at discovering she's been duped, you'll be condoning further underhandedness on his part - and, if my memory serves me right, it was his underhandness that got you into this fine mess, was it not?

The problem is that a year on, you've discovered you're no further on and the ow will be the spectre at the feast for as long as you can't trust him. And you no longer trust him. do you? Saying you've been watching him 'like a hawk' says it all.

In choosing to deal with his infdelity 'in-house', so to speak, you've had no outlet for your feelings, no opportunity to share your experience in rl with those who'd understand where you were coming from and respect your confidence.

It's probable you indulged in the hysterical bonding that is a not an uncommon phenomenon when a spouse is exposed as a lying skank who has been putting it about in theory or in practice, and you used those feelings to convince yourself you'd not only 'won' him back from the harpy but had also rejuvenated your marriage and yourself.

Due to events beyond his control, he may well have been in a bad place. But you were going through those same events by his side, weren't you? Did you find yourself in a place where you were lusting after the bloke in the chip shop that looks like Elvis om for a little light relief from your cares and woe? Thought not.

It's always a shock when we discover our idols have clay feet, which is why we're best advised not to raise anyone above ourself. You've learned a hard lesson and in many respects his behaviour with the ow has given you a gift that'll keep on giving for years to come - unless he steps up to the plate and works to convince you that he's staying in the marriage because he loves, adores, and worships you and there's no place he'd rather be than by your side.

Has he made any noises which have gone some way to convincing you that he's not just marking time until the dc have flown the nest, at which point he'll be looking to stretch his wings too?

AnyFucker Mon 11-Feb-13 11:55:36

I think it would be cruel to lure this woman to a meeting under false pretences. I understand about closing ranks against her, but would you need to be quite so manipulative about it ?

yes, she she has been manipulative on her own account...but do further wrongs make a right ?

there's a great big elephant on the thread here

why, after 12 months has she popped up saying she "won't be treated like this" ?

treated like what if there has been no contact since she was allegedly packed off back to woo la-la land ?

there's some la-la-la-la going one here, and I suspect it isn't her

badinage Mon 11-Feb-13 11:55:52

I think you need to stop taking the piss izzyizin. This isn't comedy theatre and no-one's laughing at your lame strike-outs any more.

AnyFucker Mon 11-Feb-13 11:55:58

on not "one"

Lilly3000 Mon 11-Feb-13 12:07:02

"The problem is that a year on, you've discovered you're no further on" Er...yes we are. " And you no longer trust him. do you? Saying you've been watching him 'like a hawk' says it all. " I'd be an idiot not to watch him. He handed over his phone and his email passwords without me asking.

I never doubted his faithfulness before, I thought he may occasionally flirt but there was a line not to be crossed. I watched it happen to other couples again and again and I thought we were immune. Not so. It came as a terrible blow as I just didn't see it coming. I will never trust him completely again, but that doesn't mean that progress hasn't been made or that I don't love him. It's not about what he does to prove his love, it's about me protecting myself. Trusting someone completely is a daft idea anyway, it puts them on an unrealistic pedestal. 'Hysterical bonding' undermines a year of trying to rebuild our marriage. I can assure you it has been much more than that. As MadAbout says 'it's been a hell of a journey'. As for nest flying - he's made no sounds about that and I don't know why he would.

Lilly3000 Mon 11-Feb-13 12:11:33

AnyFucker - I know it sounds weird, but she is, she really, really is. I think it was all to do with him not stealing precious moments to talk when she bumped into him in the dark and empty carpark last week. I wasn't there stopping him so I think it was a wake up call to think it was actually HIM who didn't want to talk to her, even after all this time.

AnyFucker Mon 11-Feb-13 12:15:50

Believe it or not, I am on your side smile

Lilly3000 Mon 11-Feb-13 12:18:44

Thanks wink

badinage Mon 11-Feb-13 12:20:44

No marriage is immune is it? Because there are two people in it and you can only keep a check on yourself and not the other person. We've been married for aeons and I never think we're immune especially when I've seen this happen to others. So I know what you mean and it must have been shattering. But it does sound like good's come of it and there's been a lot of rebuilding in the past year. I don't think it's odd that you've been vigilant either. Like you say, it would have been strange if you hadn't been.

What does he think is the best thing to do Lilly? Which is a different question to what he wants to do. Are you discussing this thread with him?

Lilly3000 Mon 11-Feb-13 12:22:40

Just say for example that there had been meetings during that last 12 months. Why would he tell me about her outburst in the street? Or her saying hello to him in the dark and empty carpark? I wasn't there, he didn't have to tell me. It would have been a lot easier to have kept all this to himself.

AnyFucker Mon 11-Feb-13 12:25:54

Perhaps she threatened to give you information you are not already privy to ? He thought he'd make a pre-emptive strike and tell you some more guff about how crazy she is, and get his story in first ?

These would be my thoughts.

badinage Mon 11-Feb-13 12:26:54

Because she seemed more volatile and unpredictable this time and he feared a shitstorm and though he ought to warn you?

Because he's been trying to 'manage' her and she's realised this and won't go quietly?

Or because he's telling the truth and he really hasn't seen her for 12 months, but it would be odd if that was the case for her to complain that he couldn't 'treat her like this' if that was old news.

Lilly3000 Mon 11-Feb-13 12:27:09

Badinage - lol no, I'm not discussing it with him, which is deceitful on my part I suppose. I needed to try and get it straight in my head so thought that asking for advice from people who may have had similar experiences would help. I think it has. He's not sure what the best thing to do is. Should he reawaken the whole thing by discussing it openly with her or should he just hope she goes away? He WANTS to go and hide in a hole smile

izzyizin Mon 11-Feb-13 12:28:41

IMO human life is a tragi-comedy bandinage. If we didn't have the courage to laugh in the face of adversity, or the ability to take the piss out of the absurd, the ridiculous, the sublime, and the egocentric posturings which can accompany these conditions, this world would be the unrelieved vale of tears some claim it to be

FWIW, this is a public board which allows all/any of the varied views held by members of the broad church that is mumsnet to be freely expressed here and, as OPs are free to disregard any responses that do or have meaning or resonance for them, diiffering philosophies and writing styles are not worthy of comment.

Lilly3000 Mon 11-Feb-13 12:30:10

He didn't say she was crazy, I've managed to draw that conclusion myself. Grabbing someone in the street and shouting at them because they looked at the pavement and not in your eye counts as crazy in my book. I think maybe she thinks what she did was not so bad and we should be over it by now.

badinage Mon 11-Feb-13 12:39:03

I don't think you were engaging with the OP to laugh with her Izzyizin. I think you were hoping that other posters would join you in laughing at the poster and her husband. That's the difference. Lilly told you last night that your joking wasn't helping her, so I can only assume you're writing for a different audience and not the OP.

Lilly I think wanting to hide away is his default, but he needs to face this if he's going to regain some of your respect, I'd have thought.

izzyizin Mon 11-Feb-13 12:42:01

As the one most directly affected by his enounter with the ow, how does your h propose to deal with it should it occur again?

Lilly3000 Mon 11-Feb-13 12:42:41

When he finished it he offered no explanation other than he needed to protect his family and there was to be no more contact. Bang. Brutal. Humiliating I imagine. She badgered him a few times to 'open up and talk' but he ignored her completely for fear of me finding out and reading more into it. She thought they were friends, and hoped for more but he shut the door in her face. Not kind but necessary at the time.

Lilly3000 Mon 11-Feb-13 12:44:26

As I said Izzi, he's been rehearsing his " I love my wife" speech. The question is whether he should take it to her or wait for the next outburst.

Lilly3000 Mon 11-Feb-13 12:47:31

Badinage thank you for the defence, I'm not used to it as I'm normally the one doing the defending. It's nice smile

AnyFucker Mon 11-Feb-13 12:50:22

Lilly, I think you should stop "defending" and start looking at your weak husband with more realistic eyes.

This is his fuck up. Stop doing his thinking for him.

Lilly3000 Mon 11-Feb-13 12:56:56

I had a feeling my last comment would provoke that reaction. What I mean is that I'm the first one to plough in and tell the teenager to get off the swing so the little kid can have a go, or the first one to step in if someone is picking on someone else. I agree completely that he has to do his own thinking, but it's hard not to want to step in and help when he's like a rabbit in headlights. I never said he wasn't a coward when it came to women.

Lilly3000 Mon 11-Feb-13 13:00:13

I used to say he was weak and I didn't understand why he didn't man up. She told him he just hadn't met the right woman. That worked brilliantly for me. Not.

izzyizin Mon 11-Feb-13 13:15:49

'Defence' is markedly different to 'derailing'.

If the ow were to encroach on your territory by, for example, coming to or lurking outside your home for no legitimate purpose, Lilly, she could be accused of harassment.

However, providing she doesn't make a habit of it to the extent that it can be regarded as stalking and that there is no real or implied threat in her words, she's free to say what she wants to your h in a public or private place.

Given that you live in a small town it's something of a wonder that all/any of the parties concerned haven't encountered each other on the highways and byways in the past year.

As this is the first occasion in 12 months that your h and the ow have come face to face, I can't see that any advantage can be gained from taking the fight to the allegedly vanquished enemy, so to speak.

It seems to me that placing too much importance on this accidental encounter has the potential to cause consequences which may be as undesirable for many as they could be humiliating for a few.

Lilly3000 Mon 11-Feb-13 14:10:23

Have just spoken to DH and explained that I need him to handle the situation 'robustly' and that I don't feel the need to be involved unless he really wants me to be. He said he wasted to do that. We talked about if the children found out and both agreed that it was only a big problem if we didn't try to work it out. We have gone to great pains to ensure that our children have a contended life, but that probably means they'll be secure enough to take the rough with the smooth. Thank you to everyone on here who's helped me/ us to get this clear. I feel much better smile x

Lilly3000 Mon 11-Feb-13 14:10:52

wasted wanted

hollolew2 Mon 11-Feb-13 14:58:29

unfortunately it's your husbands fault. the minute you let someone else in there is bound to be trouble. My exh had an affair 11 years ago part of his mid life crisis they hung around in the same 'cocaine crowd' when I found out he finished it with her never went back but she's never left either of us alone.
I cut ties with old friends of mine to stay away from her madness. she even sent her son to the same prep school as mine even though it's an hour drive away. I caught her outside my house last month ( she must have thought I was at work). she's bloody obsessed! I've lost count of the times her husband has given me dirty looks and followed me around the school playing fields like as if I had an affair with her ( sorry too fussy). she asks people about me all the time.she tells them she's scared of me! well fuck off back to your part of London I never go to and stop hanging around ! i've asked her what shes doing a couple of times and she says its a free country she can do what she likes hmm ok my office is in the city ,you don't work and you live an hour away why are you outside or around the corner every other week?
I worried about it when the kids were little now there grown up doing their own thing and not around a P.C friend of mine says its not enough for a stalking charge so i just ignore her.i text me exh saying your mates here every time i see her( it gives me satisfaction!).
it's a certain type of woman they see it as a game or competition and they are mad! he has to tell her in no uncertain terms to bugger off but thats never stopped my one ! good luck loks like you may need it.

Lilly3000 Mon 11-Feb-13 16:18:58

hollow thats really awful! And you're not even together any more? Why isn't she harassing him? Is her problem with you? Crazy is as crazy does I suppose.

Bedtime1 Tue 12-Feb-13 05:44:37

I don't want to be mean but something doesn't sit right here. My thoughts have been similar to Anyfucker.

Why after 12 months is she having a go? I think he's been leading her on and has lied about not being in contact with her to you. That's why she said those word too him. It's better to know the truth than live a lie, no matter how painful it may be. You've said yourself he's a weak man.

anonacfr Tue 12-Feb-13 11:47:58

I know. It is rather odd- if you live in such a small and they work in the same street is there really any way they could have avoided each other for a whole year?
I agree with AF and Bedtime. Are you sure you've heard the whole story?

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