Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide, which can point you to expert advice and support.
Been brooding about this. Don't want to drip feed so bit long.
Have been seeing bloke for five months. It has been fun - great sex, lots of social stuff. We both have kids but tend to see each other alone, mutual choice.
This weekend - no kids. Lovely Friday afternoon in bed, both left work early so could spend a bit of quality time together. Saturday had tickets for a show in London, travelled up early, delicious lunch, museum, touristy walk, show, great dinner and home
more great sex
Sunday am, he wakes early to take part in hobby (by prior agreement) I stay in bed, lounge about, have coffee. he returns about 3 hrs later comes back to bed bringing Sunday papers. He asks for cup of tea (although he has just come up stairs) I make him cup of tea and come back to bed.
So we're lounging about, drinking tea, reading paper and the popular omnibus version of a weekly tale of the life of country folk is announced. I am an habitual, though not obsessive, listener, which he knows. Following conversation ensues:
Him - 'oh we're not listening to this shit'
me - 'it's the Archer's I want to know what happens to blah' (don't want to bore you with plot)
him - well you can go downstairs if you want to hear it'(re-tunes to replay of TMS)
me - 'hang on, you're reading the paper, can't I listen to the Archers?'
him - 'No'
me - 'what?'
him - 'no'
me - ' are you seriously saying that I can't listen to the archers while you read the paper?'
him - 'yes'
me - 'you are joking?'
him - 'no'
(staring contest follows where neither wavers)
me - 'I'll get up then'
I am incredulous and completely bemused. I get out of bed, shower, dress, go downstairs. Listen to Archers.
He comes down about an hour later and asks if I'm 'still sulking'. Rather than dissolve into lump of seething fury I tell him I'm leaving, he jokingly asks if he's dumped so clearly knows he's been a knob, tell him I'll text him later and leave.
Bit more background - this is my first relationship since end of EA marriage two years ago. Done the freedom programme and the horrendous divorce.
I feel like 'sending' me for a cup of tea was the tester and then refusing to 'let' me listen to a radio programme was pushing the boundary a bit further. Over reacting or ltb?
Being an Archers Addict, someone turning off R4 in my home without my permission (especially mid omnibus edition when Lilian is having difficult phone-calls with her lover!!!) is well and truly beyond the pale. Dumping's too good for 'em.
Seriously.... anyone demanding I run around making drinks or telling me I can't do anything in my own home would be regarded with deep horror. My house, my rules. Trust your judgement,
Why wasn't he downstairs? why does he get to interrupt your morning when you're lying around upstairs?
Just get rid.
you were in his house and he asked you to make him tea? bizarre behaviour, without even getting in to the archers weirdness. i vote ltb. he sounds quite controlling.
I thought the tea thing was weird. Couldn't understand why he hadn't brought a cup up with him but wasn't particularly bothered until I put it together with the radio thing.
I don't know if it's dumpable but I would not like that at all.
He sounds tricky.
The cup of tea thing then insisting that you go downstairs to listen to your radio show is odd and a touch controlling.
Imagine living with him full time!
I'd be thinking the same as you snoop. I am also massively aware of red flags following an EA relationship.
I have dumped for pretty similiar behaviour. Are there any other times recently he has behaved like an entitled prick?
This is probably the real him with his feet under the table, as it were. A former boyfriend of mine came over to pick me up for a date one Wednesday evening and, without asking, switched the TV onto some football match (which I loathe...) with a cheery 'you don't mind do you?'. He never did it again, I can assure you.
It may not be enough justification for dumping in isolation but keep your wits about you, be assertive and if he shows more selfish behaviour or acts like he owns the place again, have a rethink.
No, you're not overreacting.
DH often watches things on the box I'm not interested in. I let him watch them without making a fuss because I realise we like different things, I love him and I know it makes him happy. He does the same for me.
A decent bloke would have made tea and brought it up to bed.
I would push him away if I were you. Life is too short to be tip toe-ing around your partner because they don't approve of certain things that are important to you.
Trust your instincts
First time he's behaved like a cock tbh. We're both strong willed and stubborn and part of the dynamic of our relationship is that we like a good debate. I would have happily argued the merits of the archer's v TMS but it wasn't like that, he just said 'no'.
It shows him in a very poor light.
Only you can decide if it's a one-off and his dumping comment was a (badly judged) attempt to diffuse the situation. If he doesn't realise that, for you, it wasn't about The Archers, but rather about permission and control, would you be able to tell him?
And does the thought of opening up to him in that way make you recoil, or do you think he would respond well? Your instinctive reaction to that question might show whether you see him as a partner who is good to be with, or if there is something that is putting you into the (unhealthy) place of feeling you're on egg-shells
Just be careful. What you're reading as 'strong willed and stubborn' can so easily become 'controlling'. Similarly 'a good debate' can end up as a shouting match. It's five months in, the honeymoon period is clearly over, and it's when people relax that they show their real selves.
If you're lucky, he'll get in first and dump you for being an Archers' listener....
First time I ever stayed with my now-ex for a weekend I had to endure listening to The Archers. If only I'd taken it as a red flag and got out then rather than years later. But it was her house, so she got to choose....
Actually, with serious hat on, it does sound a bit controlling. I wouldn't necessarily dump, but I'd make sure the rose tinted glasses were off and keep my eyes open for more examples to see whether it was a one off or not.
Were you at his house?
DH would have gone downstairs if he didnt want to listen to the radio.
2 things. Firstly, people who hate the Archers often really hate it - as in can't stand to be in the same room as the Borsetshire tones. So then the question is - who has to uproot, you or him? He may think you've had 3 hours lie-in already while he was out, & it's his turn now. Maybe he couldn't carry tea tray and newspapers up in one go, and if he'd gone back down to make tea & bring it back up, it's him waiting on you hand & foot & maybe he didn't feel like doing that. Just saying.
"So then the question is - who has to uproot, you or him? "
Errr.... it's her home??? He may be a boyfriend but he's still essentially a guest. Would you stay the weekend at a friend's house, demand hot drinks, criticise their radio/TV choices and expect them to obey?
Were you at his house or yours? Not that it should matter but would help set the scene, eg when dh and I were first together I'd be more likely to make the tea in my house.
I got the impression it was his home?
I wouldn't want to listen to the archers either but I wouldn't ruin a cosy morning in bed over it. I'm not one for watching tv but dh enjoys it so I
MN read whilst he watches tv. Seems like he was a bit of a prick about it
I honestly get the 'hate the archers' brigade, tv soaps make me want to throw things at the telly so would not inflict it on someone, if he'd said 'I loathe it, please don't do this to me' I'd have shagged him instead (win-win in my book). It was the straight 'no' that got me.
Agree re the end of the honeymoon stuff. I didn't shave my legs this weekend.
Re the tea, it was just for him. To clarify, I was downstairs when he got back, he went upstairs and I followed then he asked for cup of tea. And no, I wasn't holding a freshly brewed mug myself.
Also, leaving involved a three hour drive home, just to give indication of level of crossness.
Cogito - I also am under the impression it was HIS house, not hers, which is why SHE chose to leave. In which case, she is the guest and you presumably now feel he was completely in the right?
I don't think it matters all that much whose house it was, bearing in mind his bossy and arsey behaviour
I do not like it.
It seems like the beginning of a game to show the other who is the top dog.
What do you feel and want to do?
This was your test. You passed it. Congratulations.
He comes in, asks you to make tea. (softly softly, and you complied so he went to the next level
He tells you you cant listen to the radio.
If you are to listen to the radio, you leave the bedroom.
He was trying to see whether he could manipulate and control you.
He knew this could turn out two ways:
If you had not decided to leave, he would know he could control and manipulate you.
But you left, you showed him that this is not going to happen.
I really hope that you wont go back to him.
That was not meant to be a smiley! It was meant to be : )
My instinct is to address it head on and tell him that I thought his behaviour was rude. I don't think there's any value in going down the route of explaining to him that it seemed controlling or a red flag because if he is a controlling knob he'll gaslight me and if he isn't he'll be completely confused and think I'm a demented neurotic.
Hmm Gold that was kind of my worst case scenario.
Is there a point addressing it at all?
He was rude, no doubt, but he would not understand this.
He made a judgement on your radioprogramme (which he could have tuned out from as he was reading the paper)
He demanded you leave the room, if you were going to listen. You questioned him. He was firm.
He treated you without respect and as a child.
He asked if you were still sulking. I think he has shown his true colours, and your instincts were SPOT ON.
I wonder where he is from.
OK you were at his.... still. Flat 'nos' are never an attractive trait...
It sounds like he was saying/doing anything to get you to leave the bedroom tbh.
When you followed him upstairs he sent you back down to make tea. When you came back up he sent you downstairs again to listen to the radio.
Why did he need to read the newspaper in the bedroom?
gold I think he might be from the land that time forgot......
copper maybe I'd outstayed my welcome?
I'm with Gold.
It's sad, it's a shame, but it's dumpable.
He was probably also making a point of the fact that Snoop had been enjoying a lie-in while he was out and about.
The fact that he was out and about on a pre-arranged spot of hobbying and she was visiting the area only to see him will have passed him by completely ime.
He will have perceived as her having a 'rest' while he 'worked'. This would always be deemed unfair by controlling types.
He was trying to see whether he could manipulate and control you.
How on earth is saying "You're not listening to that shite in my bedroom" manipulative? Surely such directness is the very opposite.
If someone put anything on the radio in my bedroom without asking me if it was all right, I'd tell them to sling their hook.
themaltesecat, if you were my boyfriend, and I had just made you a cup of tea, and you settled down to read the paper in bed, I would not ask you if I may listen to the radio. You are not my dad, or superior, and I am not a casual visitor, but your girlfriend. If you asked me to sling the hook if I turned on the radio to listen to something I enjoy (it is not a rock opera FGS), I would leave and not look back. I would consider you a rude selfish twat.
Well that's another angle Snoop, maybe he was behaving that way to 'encourage' you to leave.
Certainly the sulking comment followed by the Am I dumped indicates he isn't overly concerned
Is it possible that he feels the relationship has run it's course but is one of those that struggles to just say it?
Well... if someone was staying over at my house and wanted to listen to something I couldn't stand, they could jolly well go and listen to it somewhere else. I wouldn't be turfed out of my own bedroom by the bleedin' Archers! But by the same token, being the host and owner of the facilities, I wouldn't instruct the guest to make tea. It would go more like: ok, I really really don't want to listen to that, I'll pop downstairs and make us some tea shall I?
I agree, it's not the one thing, it's the two in combination that make it look dodgy. Keep a weather eye out for any more red flags.
overThinking back Aspie there were a few odd moments this weekend but in the opposite direction, on several occasions he seemed to want me to tell him how I feel about him then withdrew. We do not say 'I love you'. I do not love him, I am enormously fond of him and have told him so. I am not gushy but I am very physically affectionate. He was very sweet all weekend (until 10am Sunday) lots of cuddles, hand holding and kissing whilst out (usually a bit anti pda's) I get the feeling he wants me to commit or sling my hook.
Exactly, Annie Or he could have distracted me with sex (easily distracted by sex me)
Well he could try saying so instead of setting weird little tests
How strange he sounds, and quite hard work too.
I am also someone with a previous ea relationship and always keen to try not to jump to conclusions.
It doesn't sound like particularly controlling behaviour to me, in my own experience it began much more subtly and only really after I was committed (pregnant with ds)
It still pays to be cautious though, the tea and archers thing isn't really what concerns me tbh. It's his attitude towards you being upset that's odd. It's how exdp would have acted. My dh would be mortified to have upset me and wouldn't downplay it that way.
For me it more boils down to how seriously he takes your feelings, does he normally trivialise them?
So not interested in a relationship that's hard work. He has been ticking lots of boxes so far, intelligent, funny, similar sense of humour, very good cook, does not interfere with my parenting. He's never trivialised my feelings before. think it's one to watch but now have a niggle at the back of my mind. Humpf.
Two big fat red flags. And after only five months?
Bin him and be glad you found out this early on.
If you live a 3 hour drive apart, and both have kids, I'm guessing you haven't actually spent a lot of time together during these 5 months?
It reminds me of a dear old friend, who used to suddenly "explode" for no apparent reason. It gradually escalated into emotional abuse (although I didn't recognise this until afterwards), and I had to end the friendship.
I sometimes wondered if random things were triggering "flashbacks" to conflict in earlier relationships. But ultimately, it makes no difference. No-one treats me (or my precious family) like that . . .
Let's say you give it another five months until he does something arsey again. In that time you could have met another man who ticks all his boxes and lets you listen to the archers and doesn't expect you to traipse up and downstairs making cups of tea.
I don't believe he has been mr perfect until the archers. I think you will have ignored, minimised or explained away similar behaviour. I don't think any good will come from a long term relationship where both parties describe themselves as strong willed and stubborn either. Best of luck
Is it not equally possible that he'd just had a bad morning? What was he doing? For example if he was off playing sports and he/his team lost then he might have just been in a grump?
I'm not saying the OP shouldn't be cautious but perhaps we are over analysing an 'off day'
Maybe he just hates the Archers?
Maybe he just wanted you to make him a cup of tea?
Maybe he is rude?
Maybe he is thoughtless?
Maybe he is controlling?
Maybe he is abusive?
Maybe he has faults like the rest of us?
Maybe he was in a bad mood?
Who knows? All anyone can do is guess. So, it's your call. You know him. If this was me, I'd confront him... ' I was upset when you said blah blah blah and when you did blah blah... what do you have to say to that? ' and take it from there.
If you don't want to talk to him about it, then there is your answer.
Personally, I think he sounds like a bit of a twat and you sound like a bit of an over thinker.
My friend's boyfriend once walked out of a formal dinner party to go and listen to the Archers in the bedroom.. that relationship didn't last long either
Certainly not Mr Perfect, can be an arsey git and snapped at me during check in for a flight although, to be fair, I'd been goading him to see if he'd snap........... [childish emoticon]
He'd been playing golf but there was no-one there to play with so had done (? however, one describes the act of playing golf) nine holes on his own and come home.
Who do stubborn strong willed people have relationships with then handbag?
He's a golfer?! Well that just changes everything - ltb
The Archers has much to answer for mardy.
Dear John I think you've nailed it. I'm going to talk to him and report back. I'm definitely an over thinker. Must GET A JOB.................
Thanks Aspie that's why I held that nugget back, I knew people would have stronger opinions about golf than either the Archers or emotional abuse
Could it be just possible that he likes your tea and hates the Archers.
In our house this could have happened any given Sunday. DH likes my tea and is unequivocal regarding his dislike of Terry Wogan.
He'd also snap at me at checkin if I'd been deliberately picking a row. Surely everyone bickers at the airport.
He's done a thing you don't like. Talk about it rather than go to the extreme, unless there's really more to it and you feel this is part of a trend.
Just to add, it really gets my back up when someone is mean (like your DP in this case), then when the other person doesn't just smile and say OK fine, the mean person tells them they're sulking. What they mean is, I can do what I want and you have to put up with it - cheerfully.
Yes you're high maintenance luv
Takes one to know one i'm afraid
Just talk to him and then make a decision. Lots of luck.
You're not over thinking, you're more aware of things because of your past. That's a good thing. When you've been in an abusive relationship your sense of what's normal becomes warped. You're keeping your eyes open so you don't sleepwalk into a bad situation.
You've only been together 5 months - he's ordering cups of tea, calling your fave radio programme crap and deciding that you can't listen to it, he's accusing you of sulking and he's taunting you with ending the relationship and you're having staring contests. This sounds pretty unpleasant. I don't know if he's controlling or not...but he's certainly got a strong sense of entitlement. I'd get the hell out tbh.
Yes you're high maintenance luv
typed a long reply which got lost but to summarise agree with lovingfreedom,ltb and find yourself a nice man who adores you and would be happy to make you a cuppa 5 months in! they do exist
Being stubborn isn't a desirable character trait is it? If both parties dig their heels in, how do they come to a compromise? Your partner stubbornly refused to let you listen to the archers. This didn't make you feel good.
Strong willed is another one. What does it even mean? That you know what you want and go out and get it? Fair enough, but what if that is at the expense of others, where do you draw the line?
If I felt myself to be stubborn I would work on being more flexible without compromising my boundaries. If I felt I was being argumentative for the sake of it, I would work on why I was doing that. I'd perhaps consider I was being bloody minded because I was scared of being abused so I was giving as good as I thought i would get from the beginning to protect myself or perhaps to give myself the opportunity to be able to explain it away as a passionate relationship or '6 of one, half a dozen of the other'.
I think what is important is that he was an arse, you didn't really pull him up on it and he didn't apologise for being an arse. If you were to ring him now and say 'you were a bit of an arse on Sunday morning, expecting me to traipse round making tea and then being all rude about me wanting to listen to the archers, what was all that about?' what would happen?
Maybe he just doesn't like the Archers.
I'm planning to do just that in about 30 mins handbag, will report back.
Well? What did he say? <interested>
You're clearly not compatible - you need an Archers-loving boyfriend
Fairly recently (20 months rl) I had one similar (in *my home*). I adored him on many levels but....
I dumped him.
The problem with abusers is that they don't punch you in the face on a first date. Things would be so much clearer that way. Instead though it's hazy ahead and clear in hindsight.
OP- how are things now, did you have a chat tonight?
How did it go?
I vote LTB by the way.
Well the way he treated you struck a chord with you and raised red flags, you need to listen to how he makes you feel, not just the good bits.
He didn't sound very upset by the prospect of your relationship ending. That's what would make him 'dumpable' to me. He may genuinely hate the Archers, he may have wanted to lie in bed to read the paper ( good for spreading it all out), he might think you make a great cup of tea. He certainly could have been much politer about it , especially the radio program. He should not necessarily feel contrite about asking you to go downstairs but I think if he cared about you, he would have apologised for the rude way in which he went about it and would have felt dismayed that you were hurt by it. Instead it seemed as though he were laughing at you😓. I wouldn't even call him back to explain that I was hurt actually. If he called, I'd probably tell him that I can't see the relationship continuing.
You're not over-thinking and you're not high maintenance. Just for the record.
Him coming down an hour later and asking if you're sulking is SUCH a telling comment.
Why would you be sulking unless something had gone down, and someone had done something to piss the other right off? He's basically admitted to pissing you off, and rightly so. He knew full well what he did.
And - here's the things - there was utterly no need to forbid (because that is what he did) you to listen to the Archers. He was reading. The radio being on was no skin off his nose. The only reason he did that was to see if he could do it.
And he didn't get away with it. The whole atmosphere in the house changed after he did it, and he knew full well that you were Not Happy. He now knows how far he can push you, which isn't very.
By all means give him another chance if he's that good in the sack - but my last dollar says he will need that other chance, because anyone who tests someone in such a ludicrously controlling way so obviously and so soon into a relationship won't be able to help themselves. I say you deserve better. And there is better out there.
Morning, I went to bed early-ish (old lady emoticon) and was woken by the phone at about 10.45. Was himself being a bit needy. Will have to have the chat later and report back.
Tend to agree Somerset. The way I look at it is that I'm not currently interested in a big romantic full on relationship. Having finally escaped the car crash that was my marriage I am primarily interested in getting laid and having fun. If this doesn't meet the criteria I'm happy to walk away. I think the only thing I'd say in mitigation on his behalf is that his marriage ended more recently than mine and she left him. The way we met was completely unexpected and the relationship has developed very nicely to date but I get the sense that he has more feelings for me than vice versa and he might be struggling with that.
Not that that's ever an excuse for cuntish behaviour.
OP sounds a little like you're making excuses for him? Put your own interests first here at this stage, especially having relatively recently escaped an EA relationship. It's easy to fall into the trap of thinking because he's mean to you it shows he cares [been there emoticon] No it doesn't. It show's he's got the potential to be an abusive arse
So, because his wife fucked off that excuses him being a twat to you ?
Why did his wife leave him ?
The normal reaction to someone not feeling the same way about you as you do about them is not to be horrible to them.
No, I'm saying it doesn't excuse it at all, just provides an insight. And that it's an insight into the sort of man I don't want to be with. Not interested in needy point scoring bitter fuckers!
She told him the relationship had run its course, his daughter has told me in confidence that there's someone else. He thought they were having normal lowish level problems that would sort over time and was shocked when she ended it. She told him it was over about 18 months ago and moved out a year ago. We met in July.
Any time spent on your part thinking about why he's being mean/rude or even thinking overly about how he's feeling and so on at this stage is time you could better spend taking care of yourself.
Also the 10.45 'needy' phone call? it just is all sounding like something you might be better off without OP, from an objective POV. Find a man who can look after his own emotional needs while you look after your own.
See... You were going to pull him up but he's being needy so you're not saying anything, presumably not to add to his burden. Not ideal IMHO. I see him doing what he wants and you accommodating him (archers, tea, ringing at antisocial hours).
Perhaps he saw his marriage problems as small but she felt they were huge. Perhaps it was an exit affair. Perhaps she is an evil cheating bitch. I dunno. Has he done any work on unpacking what happened? If he hasn't perhaps a year is too soon to be with someone eise anyway regardless of whether he is abusive or not. At worst he is and is looking for a new victim, at best he's an emotional mess who is looking for someone to sort him out. Either way, you don't have to be involved if it not what you want
YABU, the Archers are unbearable. The signature "tune" is used by the North Korean secret police for torturing dissidents, but it only makes me want to hang myself.
<head on desk>
You are excusing him, lowering your expectations, and rewriting history with this man, so that you can justify to yourself why you should continue without pulling him up.
Ah well. Your life your relationship.
I thought she said it provides an insight into the sort of man she doesn't want to be with, ergo she's dumping him?
I hope I'm reading her right, anyway.
I did not get that she was dumping him, only that she was not going to say anything, and that this was ok because she just wanted fun now anyway?
And that it's an insight into the sort of man I don't want to be with. Not interested in needy point scoring bitter fuckers!
I read this as she's dumping the fucker, no?
Her last post said she's not interested in needy point-scoring bitter fuckers, so I'm hoping that extends to not seeing him anymore. As I don't know what fun is to be had with such a person. But maybe I'm being optimistic.
Lets hope you are right!
He's a numpty. Had the convo, he knew he was in the wrong, tried the 'well, I hate the Archers line' (accepted) suggested that it was still out of order to simply forbid me something and that he'd spoilt the weekend. He said 'So that's it is it, I'm dumped?' I said that I didn't think it was completely necessary to end the relationship because we'd had a disagreement. He apologised. I said I preferred to discuss issues and reach compromise rather than deal with an absolutist which seemed to confuse him.
I don't think he's used to debating things like an adult, I don't think he's used to compromise, I don't think he's for me.
Just for the record, I don't not say anything anymore (dreadful grammar). I certainly do want fun and being told what to do is not fun - unless it's the 'put this in there' sort of being told what to do.
Glad it's sorted. When will you tell him as sounds like he thinks it's still on?
Oh dear. Hope you're OK, snoop
I have to say that his behaviour was the very definition of a red flag. Just run a bit of bad behaviour up the flagpole and see if it flutters.
My ex did this. Demanded (I don't even remember what he said, I was so dumbfounded) seconds on the roast dinner I made. I was so astonished that my head started buzzing and... I got up to get him seconds. He left for work the next day (after I doubtless shagged him that night as sex is head-turning for me too!), I packed up his bits and texted him to collect them. He rang and invited me to an hotel and we had a marvellous time But it got worse and worse, he pushed, I pushed back and then it got really insane and I ended up having to call the police.
It's just feels ridiculous to have to heed these seemingly tiny warnings but they flabbergast us for a reason. Because they are bullshit.
Be careful think over what you are gaining from this "relationship", sounds too controling the NO word , but it is your life I would personally dump him and look to finding someone nearer to home spare you the 3 hour drive when you are pissed off at them.
DH always mocks the things I watch on TV but who cares. I don't. So I laugh at the films he watches which are truly juvenile. Puts on Po face. I think it was fair enough for him to say it was rubbish but not fair to say you couldn't watch it. What a nerve. But it's not really enough for anybody to say if this means there is no future.
Join the discussion
Registering is free, easy, and means you can join in the discussion, get discounts, win prizes and lots more.Register now
Already registered with Mumsnet? Log in to leave your comment or alternatively, sign in with Facebook or Google.
Please login first.