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How not to get into silly games…..

(59 Posts)
curiousgeorgia Fri 28-Sep-12 14:22:26

I've heard the gas lighting term used often and although I've read a lot about it's effects I'm not sure….

So this is a bit of how it is. He is charming and caring, attentive and committed to a future (indeed has begun moving in, bit by bit, although rather sooner than I'd anticipated it has to be said).

Yet when I open up and make myself vulnerable (about my insecurities - we all have them) he seems to go off the radar for a bit and I'm left wondering what that's about. I don't chase him after the first text to say hi, I wait. He tends to avoid conversations that he finds difficult himself.

Our shared vision of where we're at is not the one he tells other people, namely family. It's a partial version. For that reason I have made it clear I will not make our plans public with my family until he decides he can do the same - openly and with us there together.

I AM NOT OW and never have been, although I have been the injured party in a rather seedy love triangle of my ex's making !!!!!!!!!!

I hate game playing and don't want to feel as though this is what is happening - but my usually razor sharp mind is, to say the least confused.

CogitoErgoSometimes Fri 28-Sep-12 14:28:32

Moving in unasked would bother me. Disappearing rather than talk about personal matters suggests immaturity and emotional coldness. Adjusting the story for his family suggests he's not totally convinced.

If I'm honest I'd worry that I was being used until something better came along. Charming, caring and attentive could just be good sales tactics

Doesn't sound good from what you've written here.

How long have you been together? What's his relationship history?

curiousgeorgia Fri 28-Sep-12 14:35:04

Together a year both of us having had long marriages previously.

i was totally faithful and he says he was too.

CogitoErgoSometimes Fri 28-Sep-12 14:40:04

I'm not seeing infidelity. He just reminds me of an old boyfriend who was very pleasant, suddenly got a lot more pleasant when he saw my lovely home, started making plans to move in <dream on> and yet didn't tell anyone in his family (he had an ex) that we were going out together. He was also very keen to bore me stiff with his problems and yet had no time whatsoever for mine. Ditched him...

olgaga Fri 28-Sep-12 14:45:08

If I were you, curious, I'd get a couple of crates to keep all his stuff in, rather than have them lying around in any integrated kind of way!

When he asks you why, you can tell him you haven't made up your mind about him moving in, and wanted to keep his stuff separate in an organised manner in case of any confusion!

Trust your own judgement. You're picking up on some subtle signals.

Re read. Not subtle. Run away!

EHoneybadger Fri 28-Sep-12 16:03:41

Bloody hell cogito your ex sounds exactly like somebody I saw for a short while recently except I don't think my house was quite beautiful enough and he didn't like my dog. hmm

curious he does sound a bit unreliable, I'd be cautious in getting too attached until he is more open.

curiousgeorgia Fri 28-Sep-12 16:15:14

cog I also have a lovely home in a lovely part of the country. He is mad keen to get away from his area.

Sounds quite a familiar scenario actually sad.

staines thanks, because it's the subtlety that I find confusing. I've heard nothing since yesterday lunchtime despite having had a 'heart to heart' (read - he wanted me to bear all) and yet he could walk through the door as if nothing's happened.

I've often thought he isn't convinced but feeds me enough to keep me there. But then I think it's paranoia from my marriage breakdown. That's what is a bit maddening tbh.
Thanks though, this helps.

curiousgeorgia Fri 28-Sep-12 16:20:05

I think it's time I sat and thought about whether we're as compatible as it only feels sometimes that we are (i.e. when we're together) sad

curiousgeorgia Fri 28-Sep-12 16:23:12

Sorry about poor sentence structure - am a bit worried in case he just turns up while I'm on here!

CogitoErgoSometimes Fri 28-Sep-12 16:27:23

You know this guy better than we do from a few pencil sketches. But yes there are quite a few (MN word alert) cocklodgers who are only too willing to share your lovely lifestyle for as long as it suits. smile Listen to your gut instinct and if something feels 'wrong'... and it doesn't have to be rational, far from it... then keep him on hold until you're more confident about his motives.

If you're second guessing one year in it just doesn't bode well IME. Relationships shouldn't be fraught.

curiousgeorgia Fri 28-Sep-12 18:29:14

Funny enough I told him about my ex 'cocklodging' with his affair partner.

He found that hugely funny and then began using that term with me - until I made him shut the fuck up but he still thinks it 's a big joke though!

Thing is I love him. I don't like the idea that some of the posters comments are spot on because I know what I'll have to do. And what if I'm wrong?

Be honest with him - you've nothing to lose and your instincts seem pretty good.
He's rushing into the move together.
He's doesn't seem to be as open about your relationship with others as you would expect.
He expects you to reveal your vulnerabilities but disengages when you do. This is the worst bit for me.
You're entitled to your opinion about your relationship -listen to yourself!

IllageVidiot Fri 28-Sep-12 19:40:41

It seems like your concern over paranoia from your marriage breakdown is actually doing a bit of a number on you - instances of hypervigilance, then rationalising things away and dulling down the signals from your other 'behaviours that are not good' radar.

Being aware of your own behaviour - I might overreact to xyz, am I taking this wrongly- is indicative of actually being much more emotionally astute than you give yourself credit for.

He doesn't sound great. He is holding you emotionally at arms length (particularly detaching from you in public) while physically using all available.
The bit that concerns me is he wanted you to have a heart to heart and know all your insecurities, vulnerabilities etc but didnt reciprocate and then off he goes.

I don't think you can be 'wrong' about behaviour that gives you concerns, however minor they seem as one offs all together they build a picture. It's easy from outside when reading only someone's faults to think and judge more harshly but, and it is a big but, they type of faults a person has can be hugely indicative.
His don't seem very nice.

Listen to your feelings and don't dismiss yourself because you are worried about emotional hangovers. Do you trust in the self-esteem you have now? Do you really believe you have the right to be treated respectfully - if you know you may be wobbly on these then remember how they conspire to talk you away from your best judgement. If it helps be dispassionate - would that be acceptable to me if my friend said her DP did x? If you were my friend I would say - no.

curiousgeorgia Fri 28-Sep-12 20:11:39

Oh illage you have it and that's sad.

You see, everyone else tells me how straight forward, emotionally honest and yes - astute - I am but in a year I have felt my grip (and my self esteem)slipping away, coming back and now slipping away again.

i know he doesn't sound great but he can be lovely. Yet in some degree I see lots in him that if my friends knew about they probably wouldn't be keen - but it's not majorly bad stuff. So that's whats kept me thinking "I can handle this, I'm assertive and whilst he isn't yet here full time i get breathing space or I can choose to not to respond to his calls until I am ready".

I don't think he is "bad" but I do think he likes to be in control and I know he needs to be needed. I want to be needed too, but it feels like the balance is all one-way as his life is so closed off from me.

I know. But it hurts because the beginning was the best thing to have happened to me in years.

MuthaHubbard Sat 29-Sep-12 06:19:43

Curious - are you me?! In a scarily similar situation with a very similar sounding bloke and me being rather like you (straight forward etc) and things being so good at the beginning....reading thread with notebook interest.....

ErikNorseman Sat 29-Sep-12 06:25:33

He's ruining your self esteem and you feel like you have to 'handle' him. Really? That doesn't sound good at all.

curiousgeorgia Sat 29-Sep-12 08:09:45

mutha how do you feel and what do you do?

Recently I made it clear that there are some things that I'm just not happy about and and can't accept in a relationship (ANY relationship). It wasn't a 'manoeuvre' or point scoring exercise and is entirely congruent with who I am.
His response was to say he completely understood and agreed it isn't acceptable but then went on to say he'd do something about it if it made ME happy!

Of course his situation and how he deals with it was there before I came along and he does what he's always done because it's worked for him before. But in my mind he agreed it was not ok, said he'd put it right and then abdicated all responsibility - hence if the consequences aren't favourable for him (or us) it will be all my fault!!!!

That's what I think bothers me - nothing is his fault and he is trying his best for everyone. It's very persuasive, and makes drawing boundaries harder.

Do you find that mutha?

Dahlen Sat 29-Sep-12 08:44:13

It's always better to walk alone than badly accompanied.

The moving in without a proper long chat about it resulting in both of you being fully committed and excited about it is a MAJOR red flag.

I'm sure he can be lovely and charming, but I VERY strongly suspect that once he's in and his feet are under the table, you would find the facade slipping.

I'm really sorry, but try to think of it as a lucky escape and proof that your bullshit radar IS working.

curiousgeorgia Sat 29-Sep-12 09:17:09

I agree Dahlen.

And actually since I haven't seen him most of this week - I've had plenty time to reflect on exactly what it LOOKS like I may be getting in to. That's why I decided to post.

The moving in thing is something we talked about for a while. I moved into my own house a couple of months ago having sold the family home as part of a divorce settlement. He is drifting between a relative's home and mine sometimes calling it 'ours' sometimes calling it 'yours'. But he suddenly needed to 'move in' a couple of weeks ago when things took an unexpected turn at his own house. It was late at night, I said ok, but then discovered that the situation had developed much earlier on in the day when he could have told me and we'd have been able to talk the options over………..

I need to write this down so that I can be a bit more sensible, protect myself and not loosen any more boundaries.

curiousgeorgia Sat 29-Sep-12 09:18:39

thing is he is like a jekyll and hyde - and that's what makes it harder. No one is perfect least of all me, and perhaps we're not as compatible as I would like us to be.

CogitoErgoSometimes Sat 29-Sep-12 09:33:03

Jekyll and Hydes are not good people to be around IMHO because you can end up manipulated and confused. 'When they are good, they are very very good and when they are bad, they are horrid'..... tends to mean that you make excuses for the 'horrid', doubting your judgement, rationalising things as a one-off, a bad day or - as you did with the sudden moving in incident - an unexpected turn. And you tolerate all of this because they are lovely the rest of the time, you like them and want to be accommodating. However, as someone said up-thread, the danger of this type of person is that, once they have their feet under the table, Mr Jekyll gradually takes more of a back seat and Mr Hyde is around more often. The irony is that you're so used to it by then that you don't even notice the transition.

As you say, you're a strong, intelligent, assertive woman. But you're already wondering if you've arrived at this point voluntarily or because he's very persuasive. To me that's a legitimate concern that you should listen to. Out of interest, what does he do for a living?

curiousgeorgia Sat 29-Sep-12 09:54:56

He is self employed and I can't say doing what because I don't want to identify anyone. But - work has completely dried up some time ago.

I'm listening. Hard. I feel stronger and more assured when I have some space.

OrangeImperialGoldBlether Sat 29-Sep-12 10:30:37

What worried me most was when you said you were in your own home but worried that he would find you on here, talking about your problems. You should be able to do whatever you want in your own home. Lock the door! I wouldn't let him just wander in whenever he wants to.

I don't like the sound of this man. I live alone and though I'd much rather live with someone lovely, the thought of living with someone who wasn't right for me makes my blood run cold.

If someone's moving in, it should be done properly, not in the middle of the night because 'something's happened.' It should be discussed properly - it's your home, for god's sake!

If his work has dried up and you have a nice home then I think there are ulterior motives for wanting to be there.

And, personally, the idea of someone laughing at someone for being a cocklodger is vile.

Lavenderhoney Sat 29-Sep-12 14:58:38

Give him a bill for the time he stayed there. Tell him if he wants to move in he will have to pay rent - with a rent book so there is no confusion over him paying a mortgage and you splitting and him trying to get money- and alo half the bills, in advance.

My friend had the same situation in a way, charmer who moved in, no rent, asked to pay, he span a line about his business, got her to remortgage, bought himself a car for work, she asked for rent again, he left for ow with her own house etc.

Why does he want to get away from his area? I do feel for you, it's so disappointing to get this stuff from seemingly great guys.

MuthaHubbard Sun 30-Sep-12 09:26:59

That's what I think bothers me - nothing is his fault and he is trying his best for everyone. It's very persuasive, and makes drawing boundaries harder and thing is he is like a jekyll and hyde - and that's what makes it harder. No one is perfect least of all me, and perhaps we're not as compatible as I would like us to be.

These two comments really struck a nerve with me and is exactly how my bf is.

And in fact things are so similar - almost a year (tomorrow!!) we have been seeing each other, a few months ago he was told he'd have to leave his current accommodation, did nothing about it, how could they do this to him, blah, blah, blah. I offered to help him find something but said nothing initally about him moving in. Few weeks ago we had 'the moving in chat' where I stated that I did NOT want him moving in, too soon, kids to consider, not ready etc, etc and he said he understood my reasons etc.......of course things came to a head (after him knowing and doing nowt for 5 months to find soemthing), he had to leave and muggins said he could stay a few days. After a few weeks later hmm I am today going to tell him that he needs to find somewhere by end of week. There are a few other things he does that is making it very hard for me to think there is any future right now.

I would say I am a nice but firm, strong and happy woman. He is a handsome charmer, who's luck is never 'right', persuasive, rather selfish and childish and right now I am wondering what on earth I am doing and if I've had a brain transplant.

Can't post more right now but will be back curious - just wanted you to know you aren't alone!

curiousgeorgia Sun 30-Sep-12 15:08:52

Mutha -

I would say I am a nice but firm, strong and happy woman. He is a handsome charmer, who's luck is never 'right', persuasive, rather selfish and childish and right now I am wondering what on earth I am doing and if I've had a brain transplant.

Spooky! Can i ask if he's been with you full time since 'moving in'? Sounds mad, but well……….grin

Alliwantisaroomsomewhere Sun 30-Sep-12 15:43:06

Mutha and Curious: that would be very verrrry odd....

Hope you two get some sort of sense made of all of this.

MuthaHubbard Sun 30-Sep-12 16:57:57

Curious - he has, though I am at work during day - as is he but his job is one where he nips in and out all day til 9pm ish....... can't help thinking how similar they sound!!

Honestly, if I was reading this on here/hearing this scenerio from a friends I would be telling them to dump him from a great height!!

When talking to him, I put across my thoughts/feelings/argument re something and feel right and reasonable in whatever my concerns are - yet he always seems to have some comment/view point which makes me doubt what I've said/my reasonableness....if that makes sense!!

curiousgeorgia Sun 30-Sep-12 20:33:25

Well they're not the same bloke!!!!

Having said that - I'm so glad I decided to post.

Having not seen man all week as he's had family duties, he was supposed to come here tonight after he'd worked.

He just phoned. Like there was no plan for him to come. No mention. But if I wasn't busy tomorrow he'd 'come to see me'. I said I didn't know what I'm doing tomorrow and I was going to have an early night. Oh he says, so I guess that's goodnight then (him laughing). Yes I said.

So this is fresh. I am absolutely furious and confused AGAIN but this time it seems so obviously a game plan that I NEED A REALITY CHECK PLEASE.

I think I've met an arse. I've a mind to tell him to come get his stuff.

curiousgeorgia Sun 30-Sep-12 20:35:42

Oh and he asked me if I missed him. He didn't reciprocate when I said of course I do.

He IS a shit. Isn't he?

curiousgeorgia Sun 30-Sep-12 20:45:44

Bollocks. I have just texted him to say I don't want to see him tomorrow.

It's the first time I've done this in a year. But I have had enough. He is just a person and he doesn't have any power to influence my happiness other than what I have thus far given him. Hang on he has texted back….OK

So there we are.

MuthaHubbard Sun 30-Sep-12 21:03:52

Well if not same guy, at least twin or went to same school of fuckwittery.

If I've not seen him for a few days, he does the 'did you miss me' thing with no reciprocation.

The bit about him pretending he wasn't going to see you and then when you said you might be busy tomorrow.....he didn't get the soppy, pandering response he wanted which is why he's acted that way.

And it is bollocks - you seem a strong, sensible woman as you realise exactly what he's doing. And so do I. Yet it is hard to defuse that power to influence your happiness.

DO NOT TEXT AGAIN.......remember how fucking mad/confused he is making you feel - you (and I) know it should be like this barely a year in.

I am an expert at giving people advice I should take by the way.......

curiousgeorgia Sun 30-Sep-12 21:15:00

Thank you mutha I won't.

As it has become customary, when he isn't here I just get on with my life and I've been out with friends this weekend. Each time I do this he goes AWOL or is like he is tonight.

But I have the right to a life of my own. HE was the one who suddenly made the sweeping statement about moving in and is now asking 'if you're not busy I shall come and see you tomorrow'. I am so angry. I have arranged to see a Rl mate tomorrow who has just told me how she sees it from her experience of him/us so far. It was enlightening.

SorryMyLollipop Sun 30-Sep-12 22:00:39

He has damaged your self esteem, he blow hot and cold, you know what you need to do.

You are already detaching from him, well done!!!!

olgaga Sun 30-Sep-12 22:43:54

I think I've met an arse.

Yes, you have. It sounds as though you're about to make a lucky escape. I bet that now he realises you're not the soft touch he thought you were, I expect he'll soon move on to the next "prospect" - if he doesn't already have one lined up.

Box up his stuff and leave it outside the front door.

Hope he doesn't have a key...? If so change the lock. Get it done tomorrow.

curiousgeorgia Mon 01-Oct-12 02:34:57

He does have a key and he WILL turn up here.

I also believe he has been accessing my email account from his laptop as I am on there as a second user and, inexplicably, I noticed the other day that it opens up automatically with my password already typed in. I didn't do that so he must have done. I have just changed all my passwords.

That and probably checking my phone.

I think he wanted to know what I am doing tomorrow so he could come here while i'm at work. I sometimes work from home so tomorrow I shall be here as I don't know what to expect - Mr Charming or Mr Arse.

mutha the scales have dropped from my eyes. I don't feel a twit because i've given this man house-room. I absolutely know that he is the way he is and it's not about me. So actually whether he has another one lined up already or is planning to go back to his estranged spouse (NO - I REPEAT I WAS NOT OW) - I don't really care. From the bits of story he has told me about his 'mad' ex I have been pretty appalled not at what he has said she is like but the fact that he has said some really nasty things. No doubt I will get the same treatment but, thankfully, if he tries that with my friends they'll tell him to piss off because they know me.

I shall probably need to keep coming back here for a bit of hand-holding though. It's not nice really sad

Lavenderhoney Mon 01-Oct-12 03:30:08

Oh dear op, I hope he doesn't turn up and upset you. agree bx his stuff up and can yo get someone to be there when he comes? And if he is moving tell him to bring his key, better yet meet him somewhere busy and swap. Although he coud get a duplicate anyway. Really think you should change the Locks ASAP plus put on a chain, just in case. Oh and btw, if he doesn't show then tell him you'll leave his stuff outside til next week then it's going to oxfam. Otherwise it's there, a reminder.

What woud interest him on your pc? Are you online banking? Personally I would change all my passwords and the password into the pc, and the wifi password.

You are lucky to have nice rl friends

UnexpectedItemInShaggingArea Mon 01-Oct-12 05:33:47

Hand holding always available here smile

You do sound as if you would be much much happier without him.

Keep reading your posts, and good luck with getting rid.

curiousgeorgia Mon 01-Oct-12 06:56:43

Thanks lavender and shaggingarea.

I've slept on it. I am convinced that his behaviour shows the hallmarks of an insecure and needy individual. That's no bad thing but it's better to just ask for reassurance and admit you feel vulnerable than play it out on someone else so THEY feel like shite. I guess it's not in his repertoire to own up to feeling out of control of a situation.

He'd be wanting to see sites I've visited such as fb or other social networking sites i guess. I don't do anything like that but since we met through a dating site hmm I suppose he might want to check if I've been having a sneaky peek (I haven't).


Because he did this to stbx.

Having a look around the house he's actually got quite a lot of stuff here and not just clothes. I'll need a blooming big box to get that lot in!!!!!!!!!

olgaga Mon 01-Oct-12 07:58:25

curious, you really do need to change the lock as a matter of priority. Don't tell him in advance you want his key, but bear in mind he may already have a duplicate.

This is for your safety and security, and it's important.

curiousgeorgia Mon 01-Oct-12 12:33:53

I have a chain and bolt on the door until I can get locks changed. Actually i think he will just accept it anyway - he hates confrontation and will probably think i'm being a typically hysterical woman any way. So be it, if it means a calm break I'm ok with him thinking that.

I've shed a few tears today and I don't think that's a bad thing really. But I don't feel utterly heartbroken or rejected. Thing is, all along i've felt a need to hold back, not give everything to him. I'd be feeling a whole lot worse now if i was looking back and cursing myself for doing that.

There isn't anything here which will serve as painful reminders if he doesn't take them, you know, gifts and stuff.

olgaga Mon 01-Oct-12 15:01:39

I have a chain and bolt on the door until I can get locks changed.


It's not uncommon for people to "change" into someone you don't recognise. No-one would ever give them the time of day if they hadn't developed plenty of superficial charm.

Ultimately, they always revert to type and let themselves down - and everyone who gets involved with them too.

You're bound to feel a bit of despair, that feeling of "back to square one" is grim. But bear in mind that giving people the benefit of the doubt, giving them a chance, is normal and kind. Taking advantage of people's good nature is abnormal and unkind. The problem here is his, not yours.

The good thing is he'll take his problem with him when he goes.

curiousgeorgia Tue 02-Oct-12 08:52:37

Oh I hope someone reads this.

I went to RL friends last night and stayed the night. We talked it all through and I told her everything. I decided that I would tell him that until he :

1. Actually IS divorced
2.Actually has a PROPER job and is solvent (I didn't care what job it was)
3. Actually was honest with his family about 'us'
4. Actually sold his house and settled with his stbx -

I wanted us to separate. And then, if we still felt the same about each other we could begin again, properly and with no secrecy.

However. I arrived at home this morning and guess what? He moved out in the same way that he moved in - under cover of darkness.

Some of his stuff is still here. He just took his clothes but there's other stuff. He didn't leave his key.

I now have to contact him to arrange to be here when he gets the rest of his stuff. I imagine he will be totally cold and detached if I get to speak to him at all. But I don't want him here when I'm not here. I guess he will want to get the remainder of his stuff today. luckily I am off work.

I don't think I'll get a chance to have my say. I think that I had started asking too many questions that he just couldn't answer honestly and he got scared. I had started making (reasonable) requests that he wasn't prepared to fulfil. You know the kind of thing - show me respect not just 'lip service'.

I'm shocked TBH. But I shouldn't be, should I?

curiousgeorgia Tue 02-Oct-12 09:53:34


I don't know how to bump this thread so I'll just hope someone else is as MN geeky as me this morning!!!!

It wasn't my RL friend who said "ditch the bastard" (although she did say that!).

It was him. When he told me last week that he is a fucking good liar (although he hasn't lied to me, of course) - that's when it killed it. He was telling me that I am too good for him and if I've any sense I'll get rid.

What a twunt.

Lavenderhoney Tue 02-Oct-12 12:19:35

Do you mean he let himself into your house while you were out? I wouldn't muck about now, just a figure of speech btw - Put his stuff in a box and leave it outside. Change the locks and don't let him in. When he comes to get his stuff don't answer the door. Personally I would be nervous of him coming and going.

In the distant past a bloke tried similar with me, and I was way too nice, dropping his stuff off . The stuff he left behind and kept meaning to collect, I gave him a deadline then gave it to a charity shop. I was moving house though!

ClippedPhoenix Tue 02-Oct-12 13:06:51

Get those locks changed today OP.

UnexpectedItemInShaggingArea Tue 02-Oct-12 15:38:59

Yes, change the locks.

I'm afraid that no matter how much you would like "closure" it's unlikely you will get it.

Your instincts seem spot on, he's not able to be honest with you so he's no great loss, even if you are feeling crappy about it now.

Gather up his things, leave a matter of fact message about collecting them and then move on, with the support of your lovely friends (and Mumsnet).

Abitwobblynow Tue 02-Oct-12 18:28:20

"Yet when I open up and make myself vulnerable (about my insecurities - we all have them) he seems to go off the radar for a bit and I'm left wondering what that's about. I don't chase him after the first text to say hi, I wait. He tends to avoid conversations that he finds difficult himself. "

Read this. Ring any bells?:

Carla often feels lonely, but she's not sure why. Things look pretty good to outsiders. She struggles with self-doubt. She has tried so hard, for so long, to make Mark happy. She is becoming exhausted and yet, things don't seem to be getting better. She feels frustrated, because no matter what she does, she can't seem to connect with Mark on a deeper level. Sure, they talk. They talk about the bills, chores, doctor visits, the neighbours. Things seem to go fairly well as long as she supports everything he does - and never shares a differing opinion.
And Carla has certainly learned to not be too vulnerable, not to express too many emotions. When she forgets this and begins sharing her heart with Mark, he often says nothing and then quietly dismisses himself into the next room. He gives no response and acts as it she wasn't speaking. She has learned to not follow him to persist in continuing her conversation, lest she get the look - the look scorning her for being to emotional, too sensitive, too intense, always negative, always going on and on. Or the 'Oh no, here you go again' or the 'What, are you crazy?' look.
Carla has learned to shut down, because experience has taught her that nothing productive happens once she gets the look. She has come to know that no matter how hard she tries to express her thoughts or her feelings it only gets worse. She only gets further devalued'

'You might be a Narcissist If... How to identify narcissism in Ourselves and Others and what we can do about it' Paul Meier, Lisa Charlebois, Cynthea Munz

(They go on to describe coldness and withdrawing of affection, sex, and then affairs and the reason why. And believe me they aren't exaggerating)

Walkacrossthesand Tue 02-Oct-12 18:55:00

I'm not following, wobbly - in your extract, is Carla the narcissist and Marks response because he is trying to cope with her - or is it Mark who is the narcissist? Sorry to be dense...

garlicbutty Tue 02-Oct-12 22:33:23

It's Mark, Walkacross. He takes it as read that Carla will be endlessly fascinated by his issues and supportive to him, yet punishes her if she dares to express thoughts & feelings of her own. Like most people in her situation, Carla's learned to self-censor and ignore her own feelings.

Good to hear your cocklodger has lodged somewhere else, georgia, and reassuring that you have lovely friends to shore you up through your disappointment! I agree it's a good idea to get new locks, change all passwords, and so on. Horrible to have to think that way; the man seems to have an overdeveloped sense of entitlement, so it's best to be over-cautious here.

Walkacrossthesand Wed 03-Oct-12 19:52:55

Thanks, GB - sorry to take a while to notice, I wandered away for a bit!

Abitwobblynow Fri 05-Oct-12 10:31:54

So I think what I was trying to say to the OP this is a big red flag, don't dismiss it, test it further and see if he is capable of 'hearing' you.

Because if he won't/can't, you WILL be very lonely with this man. Forewarned is forearmed.

I was warned not to marry my H 'because he will make you very unhappy'. But I wasn't told why and I was too hooked to listen. The fact that 'my' friends subtly didn't like him flew over my head also.

I made my own bed of suffering, IMO.

KirstyWirsty Fri 05-Oct-12 16:59:14

Sounds like your radar is finely honed .. Well done for getting rid

Abitwobblynow Fri 05-Oct-12 19:03:00

Well done for not agreeing to being USED. He knew you weren't going to settle for lip service and being manipulated.

God there are some twunts out there.

PLEASE change the locks. Google it, go to the hardware store, you can do this yourself!

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