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should I send H this email? unsure of self (again)(269 Posts)
I've posted before about my H of six months. Things haven't gone as hoped. I have 2DC who love him to bits.
We have some key issues and I try to address them but in truth they are his issues - drinking and porn/not wanting sex.
And we argue about it.
Or I try to address and he ignores emails or says he won't talk.
Sometimes he does talk.
He says I am pushing and pushing and not leaving it alone and that the curent problems are down to me.
I am at the end now and have said so, but cowardice and low self esteem mean I find it so hard to just stick to it and "be the bad guy" and all his friends hating me and so on. And only married in Jan!
I know it's pathetic.
He's cried and asked me to go to Relate. We have an appontment this week.
I've confided in a couple of friends and they say go so that he can't say you didn't try.
I think I am looking for his agreement to end it
Anyway we've had a discussion again this morning and he doesn't, to me, appear to be taking responsibility and I have drafted this - shall I send it??
Before we moved in together, we agreed that one or two nights a week with no booze to be together was what we'd do so that we could strengthen our relationship and also it might help the sex life.
We agreed drinking in front of the boys to be kept to maybe once a week at pub tea etc. These two seemed to be OK for a while but since our wedding they haven't happened.
You also said you wanted to drink less and you've done that and although it is at a level very damaging for your health , I know you have made a lot of effort with the intake.
On many but not all dry nights (when it's not an early shift so in bed at 8) you tell me you feel anxious and you appear down.
Dry nights have diminished since wedding.
These are facts.
In discussion/argument you make excuses or seem to try to get away from the facts saying for example: "Well if I do a dry night you tell me I'm fucking miserable " as if I am being unreasonable, when it is a fact, you DO look miserable and you say yourself that you're anxious. I have never said that to you at the time, just tried to distract you or be there for you.
You also said you don't do dry nights because I am not supportive, but even if that were true, it's another excuse.
You feel there's "nothing you can say" to make me happy, implying that I have unilaterally decided on the above and demanded that you stick to it.
What we agreed hasn't panned out.
IMHO this is because you have an alcohol problem which persists despite your success in reducing your unit intake.
You appear compelled to put drinking before your health, our relationship and the commitment you made to be a parent to the boys.
Not always, but too much of the time.
You say you're trying but you won't get help.
The nasty words when you're drunk and the accusing me of lying to hurt your feelings and then lying to cover it up - you are saying is my fault. You slagged me off in my own house when the boys could hear some of it. Not OK.
You said you would book a counselling appointment. Now you won't, and it seems you weren't going to tell me that.
You're also now saying the no sex is my fault for being sad and "the atmosphere". That might be true now, as we have the impasse as described above.
But, from the start of our relationship you've been reluctant and say that you have not been able to think of why, saying you do want a sex life, even if your actions say something different - you have turned down kisses and my initiating sex a lot of times.
I think you prefer going solo and aren't admitting it.
We have slept in separate rooms from just a few weeks after we married - with a reason, but one that's not been investigated. I miss you and want to sleep curled up with you but given that you don't come in to me (apart from a couple of times) or work on the snoring, it appears that you're OK with the separate rooms. I have tried to come in to you but as I told you when we moved the rooms, it is hard for me to do that because I get rejected.
Last time I came in for a cuddle you actually pushed me out.
Well it is not words but change in behaviour that is needed.
I have tried and tried and tried, to talk, to not talk and give you time (which you have thanked me for, but now is forgotten) to email to give you chance to think.
I sometimes ask you to delay drinking for a while and it's a "no".
I got a book for us to read you didn't.
You said you'd plan the dry nights and other things the counsellor you went to once suggested but you haven't.
I've tried initiating intimacy and not initiating, I've tried underwear and waiting for the right moment. I've tried to understand about you liking it only when showered...I've masturbated you cos you like it even though that doesn't include me.
I have grown sadder and sometimes cross and then the problems have been blamed on me as if it'd all go away if I were nicer.
I thought I was nice and that you thought I was nice.
I am now uncomfortable around you because you're angry and blaming me.
If you do feel I am unreasonable and unpleasant I would question why you married me?
I am fucking fed up. There's promises been broken and I am now suffering acute anxiety I think, unless my arms and legs are really broken.
I am always ready to try and to take on 50% responsibility, are you? As that would look like going for help, planning the dry nights etc....
My expectations are - what we agreed about drinking or at least you getting help towards it, being treated with respect not nasty words or accused of things and a loving intimate life with my husband.
Can you be clear about what you want and what you're going to do about it?
If the answer is "nothing more" could you be honest about that?
You can have expectations of me/the relationship as well.
If these expectations of mine aren't acceptable and aren't going to happen, YOU SHOULD SAY SO.
If you still want to go to counselling we can do and that's partly why I've set this out here to help me be clear about my point of view.
If you choose not to reply again, I will assume you don't want to go into all this anymore at all
That is really really long.
I doubt he'll read it because he doesn't sound like he's motivated to change.
I used to send emails to my x. Never penetrated his forcefield. When I left he said it was out of the blue mind you.
I would condense that mail to four lines.
thanks chanel I will have a crack at shortening
I feel I have to EXPLAIN and defend myself because he is saying he is doing things. But he isn't
That's awful. I have to ask you though, why on earth did you marry him?
I can't see how relationship counselling will help you, when his problem seems to be an alcohol one.
I'm sorry not to be more helpful, but it seems to me that this relationship is over.
BIWI that's a valid question. We lived together and he made progress with the drinking. But, I made a big mistake.
Thank you for replying as it all helps with resolve.
His primary relationship is with alcohol. Only he can change that. Think long and hard, do you want to support him if he does decide to change? If he isn't for changing then it's going to be a draining and upsetting existence.
It's a very, very sad email. I don't think he'd read it and if he did read some of it, he'd look for your faults in it. It won't make it better.
I would just give up on him. Who the hell wants to live with someone like that? And what an awful example to your children.
I think if you instigated a trial separation, you'd find it would be like a weight lifted off your shoulders and you'd be able to relax in your own home.
Who cares what his friends think? If they are prepared to put up with a crap relationship, then good luck to them. Their opinion should have no impact on you whatsoever.
to you. You deserve some peace and happiness - don't ask him for that, take it for yourself.
What do you get out of this relationship now?. I think you have confused love with co-depedency; codependency often features in relationships where alcoholism is a factor.
I think the earliest you can divorce this man is when you have been married for 12 months. I would seek legal advice asap re your situation.
His primary relationship is with drink and likely has been so for many years, probably preceding you as well. He does not want to take any responsibility for his actions and is quite happy to blame you for this lack of responsibility. He does not want to seek help for his alcoholism. You are not responsible for him. I think that Relate will be a complete waste of time and money due to all the above.
Your children do not have to learn that this is their normal for them. This is not the model of a relationship they should be seeing and learning from the two of you.
Heather I said to him this morning that only he can do it. He says he knows, he talks about reasonably sometimes but then nothing changes.
Imperial I would feel better living seperately; H works shifts so we're not all here together all that much but I want to get out before the DC are any more affected.
Attila I have no answer to what do I get out of it. So I guess the answer is 'nothing'.
Thank you for the replies and the straight talking.
Honestly, I think that's a great email for you not to send, but to print off and take a highlighter pen to choosing what of the multitude of crap he's put you through to put on your divorce petition for unreasonable behaviour.
The marriage was a mistake, good thing is that it's not a mistake you're stuck with.
I think it would be pointless to bother sending it if you want him to change - but worth sending if it makes you feel better before you end it.,
My instinct when reading it was don't send it. You can end the relationship without getting his permission.
I was in a similar problem in my marriage. No longer married and much happier. Alcohol dependency means you will always come last.
thanks cabrinha I hadn't even thought about the divorce itself
I am realising that tales, alcohol is the #1 priority...
Agree with many here, particularly Cabrinha.
My love, you married an alcoholic. No amount of Relate will fix this marriage, not when he's more closely allied to booze than you.
You are the 3rd person in this relationship. Until he decides to deal with his alcohol problem, there is simply no space for you.
You have DC. They can't be allowed to grow up in a home with an alcoholic. There are 3 of you and one of him, he needs to go. He needs to see what has happened to his relationship and family as a result of his drinking.
Everything else you describe in the email may or may not go when he's sober, but I doubt all of them can be blamed on the booze.
This marriage isn't working, and won't work until the problems are acknowledged and dealt with.
The three C’s to addiction recovery are:
I didn’t cause it
I can’t cure it
I can’t control it
You didn't cause this
You can't cure this
You can't control it.
HE is the Only one who can make the changes that are needed.
to be honest and now that you have asked, I am not expecting him to change. I think it is more about setting out what has happened so he can see why I am saying it is over.
I'd shorten it to
We both know that there are substantial problems with our marriage. I want to make it work but can't until you address your alcohol dependency. AA meets <insert details of local group>.
It was probably very helpful for you to write that email.
I wouldn't bother sending it.
I think your husband is an alcoholic. What is really telling is how anxious and stressed he is on days he doesn't drink.
He needs to sort this out. You can't do it for him.
In the meantime you are getting absolutely nothing from this relationship. Going to Relate will only kick the issue further down the road. His problem is alcohol. Until he sorts that out, he can't even begin to sort our his relationship. So you will go to Relate, probably eventually the counsellor will say his problem is alcohol, he will try to moderate, it won't work, etc etc.
6 months in, no children, no happiness, problems from the start - I would cut my losses and I wouldn't care what anyone thought. They don't have to live with him or see their children exposed to this kind of relationship.
Thanks hissy the link looks interesting - I've only read the first bit and already some of it makes sense such as that he is inhabiting a different minset alrogether...
op that's way too long. What about :-
'Mr42, I've changed the locks find some where else to live. Your clothes are in the black him bags in the garage'
Seriously op do not waste another day trying to salvage this. This man has a drinking problem and you working at trying to fix him is just enabling his behavour and he now has the cheek/gall to blame you.
Who cares if his friends fall out with you, your only priority is you and your boys. The only foolish thing to do now is to believe his crocodile tears that he will change - you know he won't
olennas that's great
canyou it was helpful to think it all out and write it.
I did say I would not go to counselling unless he addressed his alcohol issues but he was soooo upset and saying "but give it a chance" and I just caved in, am very annoyed with self about that.
YOU DON'T NEED HIS PERMISSION TO END THIS
I remember at least one of your other threads.
Stop trying to make him understand and/or agree.
Put your energy into the practicalities of gettng him out of the house and your life sorted out.
dutch I know you're right. Gives me The Fear though.
Right now, it looks likely that he loves alcohol more than you and your children. Or rather, he needs it more. It is quite likely he is drinking way more than you even think he is - I'm a recovering alcoholic and while not an expert, know a fair bit about the lies and deception involved in covering up a serious alcohol addiction. He feels 'down' on dry nights because withdrawal can make you feel physically and mentally like shit, basically. He probably feels resentful for you asking him not to drink. Does he even consider himself addicted? Most alcoholics have to reach their own personal rock bottom before seeking help. It varies from person to person, but in your case, you have children to consider, and some 'tough love' might be in order. You cannot continue living like this, and the very real prospect of losing you might be the trigger he needs to seek help.
extrahot that is it, I want him to understand, to have insight.
It's not going to happen is it??
I think also being honest with self I want him to understand so that the split can be amicable and bearable.
it is that he needs it more Lorelei, he needs it absolutely.
Tell him you'll support him through meetings (relate and AA). If he refuses, kick him out. Tell him to call you when he has become the partner you deserve and you'll consider him if you haven't moved on.
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