Really upset - my fucking mother :(

[ofuckit]

Sorry may be a long one. Have just had a nasty argument with DM. We were talking on the phone about Terry Wogan and that turned into talking about the afterlife.

I am a non-believer and said something to that effect, then DM said basically it must be true because what about the psychic she saw once who was really accurate. Now the backstory is that my dad died when I was a teenager. We used to argue a lot just before he died - all normal teen girl/dad stuff, him not wanting me to stay out late, boys, make up, etc etc! The last time I had seen him I had been sulking and he had said something like 'Don't bother saying bye then!" and I had said something like "no stuff you, I won't" or something equally charming. Then he had died suddenly a few hours later :( :( I still feel guilty about that.

After he died I went off the rails somewhat. Had a v dodgy (and v abusive) boyfriend, got into debts, drugs, various things I'm still ashamed of. But eventually left him (with the help of the Police after he hurt me v badly), and within a few years was in a good, healthy relationship (have been married for years now), paid off debts, have a lovely home, lovely life & lovely DC. All good :)

A few years ago my mum went to see a 'psychic'. She told me she was fantastic and wanted me to hear the tape of the session. I was interested so did, and it really upset me. On it the 'psychic' basically said my dad was ashamed of me and I needed to grown up, get over him and start taking responsibility for my own life. By this time I had sorted my life out, was happily married and had just had a lovely new baby. So it really upset me that my dad was supposedly looking down at me, ignoring all the good stuff and telling me that I was shit. I don't believe all that really, but it still really upset me, and I was also really upset that my mum had apparently wanted me to hear it.

So anyway back to today. I said to my mum I hoped the psychic wasn't 'really accurate' because it would be pretty shit if the last thing my dad had wanted to say to me was that he was ashamed of me. Her response was "Well what do you expect - the last thing you ever said to him was pretty shitty wasn't it!".

So now I feel shit about it all over again. And it appears my mother (who for years told me it was normal dad/daughter stuff and I shouldn't feel guilty), does think I was to blame and wants me to feel shit all over again :( Why though? I have daughters. I would never want to say anything so fucking horrible to them. Maybe she really just doesn't like me very much.

Sorry this is so long btw.

[spanky2]

That's really vindictive of your mum. It's normal teenage behaviour. You have sorted your life out and are doing rather well. Could your mum be jealous of you? I also wonder if because you are doing well and don't need her as much anymore she is saying this stuff so you'll go back to being unhappy and dependant on her. I do believe in an afterlife but a lot of 'psychics' are readers of body language rather than communicating with the dead. Your mum is being nasty. I think you need to distance yourself from her emotionally. Just talk about general stuff. A kind person wouldn't dream of behaving like she does.

[Tywinlannister]

I have a similar back story to yours OP so for you. My Dad was ill for a long time so didn't die suddenly but I have also had psychics try to tell me his thoughts.... If my Dad REALLY wanted to give me a message, would he wait until I had paid £20 to a stranger and then tell them all our personal crap just to pass on to me? No! He'd just give me the effing message, straight, in a dream or what not, and that's if the afterlife even existed! My mum also went through a stage of seeing psychics and they tried the same lines with her. I think basically your mum wanted you to listen so that she could remind you of what a tough time she had with you - my mum often brings up my (minor in comparison to her addictions) teenage demeanours to make herself feel more virtuous. It's her way of telling herself she did a good job, she probably credits herself with how well you've done now. It's odd, I know and the behaviour of that psychic is disgraceful.

[ofuckit]

Thank you Spanky, you are right that I need to distance myself a bit.

I wouldn't like to think my mum could be jealous of her own daughter, but it has been suggested to me by other people before when we've had other issues come up. In some ways she seems much more comfortable with people being miserable than being happy.

An example (I have many!) - we saw her at Christmas and DH had bought me a lovely present and I gave him a big hug in front of her. She got a bit huffy and said I was 'rubbing her nose in it' :(

And another - years ago we were at a wedding with DM. It got late and DM was sitting at a table - not alone, I had made sure she was happy chatting with people - and DH and I got up and had a dance - probably a bit smoochy as it was a wedding; we'd had a few drinks, etc. Suddenly she had disappeared.

It turned out that she had walked out and gone home because 'people were making her sick being so slushy and showing off'. It took me about a fortnight to find this out because she had sulked for that long and refused to answer the phone every time I rang.

But the other side is she can't do enough to help me in other ways - she's always offering to babysit, do things for me, I think she would practically move in if I let her. But then she acts like she doesn't actually like me at all.

Sorry another long rant...

[ofuckit]

Sorry Tywin xposted with you. And I'm sorry you've been through similar

But yes I do agree that the psychic was bollocks. But it still upset me and probably only because my mum chose to sit and watch me hear all that bollocks, and knew it was going to upset me.

And yes I do sometimes get the feeling that she wants to 'bring me back down to earth' in a way because maybe I'm just more happy than I deserve to be, in her eyes?

[VR46]

I'm sorry about your Dad, that must have been hard for you in so many ways. I don't have any experience of that side of things, and I also don't believe in the after-life, psychics etc..

What I do have some experience of is my mum acting jealous towards me as I've got to my 30's and started succeeding in life. I've never gone off the rails like you have as such, so well done for getting back on track and making a great life for yourself... but, I have had issues growing up and made some bad choices with regards to my education and jobs.

As soon as I went back to Uni, got a 1:1, set up a very successful business, my mum seemed to turn on me and I can only presume it's jealousy because I can have children in the future, I'm doing well and she see's that time in her life gone.. and she didn't really do such a great job actually.

Anyhow, back to you. I think you should distance yourself a bit, it's not healthy to feel this way, and her comment about your Dad was just nasty and sinister really. She must have known the effect it would have on you and still said it.. When you are a teenager you don't think about things like that, and no-one thinks about it being their last words to someone, it would be a miserable existence if we did. I really feel for you because you should no way have had that thrown in your face at all.

Mother's can be very strange with daughters, and I always had a great relationship with my mum growing up, but I see it a lot differently now.

[LineyReborn]

She wants to control you. And that will always, always end in tears.

[ofuckit]

VR thank you

Yes I am starting to see it all differently too - I think I've known it for a while but didn't want to admit it to myself

It makes me determined to never be like that with my DD.

[Pipistrella]

I'm sorry. Your Mum sounds unthinking and deluded and very unkind.

No one with an ounce of common sense and sanity believes in all that 'psychic' shite. It's clearly complete bollocks designed to fleece the desperate out of their cash. I despise the whole lot of them.

That aside yes, it does sound as if your mum says things that would only make sense if she didn't like you. It sounds like she is perhaps transferring her feelings about herself onto you. My mum transfers all that onto me - she is helpful and involved with my children etc etc, but underneath it all, she doesn't like me, and hates the way I get on with my Dad, too - it's given me some complex issues all my life. Occasionally it comes out in a way that's very obvious.

I can't say obviously as I don't know you or her. One thing I can be sure of is that it isn't because of you. And you have nothing at all to be ashamed of.

[314Chart]

Wow.

FIrst of all, I have only just patched up a row with my own parents, which exploded out of nowhere when I rejected their advice

Anyway, my take is that your mum is really forcing her script right down your throat. It might be her belief that your Dad was ashamed of you, if that's true, that was harsh and judgemental of him. He didn't love you unconditionally like he was supposed to if that were the case. But of course, it's not the case. Why does she need you to flagellate yourself with guilt? It's not enough for her to lay it at your door that SHE thinks you OUGHT to feel guilty. SHe brings in a ''witness'' to corroborate her beliefs.


Wow. That is a really exhausting level of bullshit for you to deal with. How can you reason with somebody else's medium!?!?! I mean how can you get through to her if she is determined to believe a medium's account that your dad had a low opinion of you. EVEN IF IT WERE true, why would she want you to suffer?

[LovelyFriend]

wow your Mum has sunk to new depths of low with these gems.

Yes of course it is all bollocks but she countered your questioning of her with a very low blow she knew would hurt you/shut you up.

not nice at all

[Cressandra]

So vindictive of her.

The "psychic" was just saying what they thought your mum wanted to hear. And I think that says volumes about your mum, not you. She should be ashamed of herself! Especially torturing you by playing the tape.

[VR46]

Yes, I was the same.

It got to breaking point last year when she was basically inviting herself to stay with us when visiting from abroad. I'm very introvert and so is my partner and she didn't care about the hints that we were finding it too much/too often and just kept pushing and pushing until I had to say something, then the almighty argument lasting months started. But, I've not backed down and I think things have changed a lot now, sadly not for the better as such, but at least I'm doing what I want.

Have you been to the Stately Homes thread? I found it very useful and although people there post with varying degree's of dysfunctional family issues, everybody is welcome and supported. It's just handy if you feel you need to rant.

It's hard though, you know you will never have that mum/daughter relationship you want.. I've found that the hardest to deal with, and my mum isn't even as bad as yours really! Or rather she's not quite been as obvious in her sulking/tantrums (yet). It's just disappointing really.. I still have my dad but he's not really supportive or anything and I see him rarely.. I just wish I had a normal and supportive family that are proud of me, but it seems people get a bit shitty and jealous when you actually are doing well.

[briss]

I also wonder if because you are doing well and don't need her as much anymore she is saying this stuff so you'll go back to being unhappy and dependant on her.

I think this is really the truth of it.

You poor thing it was a really nasty spiteful thing of your mum to say.

[VR46]

"It's not enough for her to lay it at your door that SHE thinks you OUGHT to feel guilty. SHe brings in a ''witness'' to corroborate her beliefs."

I agree with this, it's like she can't be told she's wrong because there are others saying it.. it's pretty much bullying you into believing you were wrong.. why would she want you to think like that?

[Meeep]

Teenagers argue with their parents, it is completely normal.
It would be a very unusual and petty parent who didn't forgive their child for typical teenager fights.

I am not a psychic but I am sure if your dad could pass on one message he would want you to know he loved you and was proud of you picking yourself up after your hard times.

Your mum is being very hurtful, she seems immature and thoughtless, I would distance myself if I were you.

[ofuckit]

That's really interesting (both posts I mean).

I never thought my dad had a problem with me - as a kid things were fine & normal, he was a typical (good) dad. It all went a bit pear shaped when I hit my teens and became a bit of a stroppy cow, but nothing huge. I certainly didn't do anything to make him 'ashamed' (if he would have been) until after he had died.

But yes, what you say about her bringing in a 'witness' to corroborate her beliefs that I should feel guilty - really struck a chord with me.

Maybe she doesn't like that I've 'moved on' and am happy now. She hasn't really moved on at all.

[314Chart]

When she and your dad were together did they often serve up their views about you to you, as a united couple.
My parents have a habit of this. They tell me in a bit of a smug way sometimes (I'm a single parent) that they're united unlike me and my x. And I think that that would be a relevant factor if I were attacking them. But recently I rejected my dad's advice and the two of them were united (as a couple) in being annoyed with me that they rejected Dad's advice and when I tried to reason with my mother on her own I was told off for coming between them and not respecting their 'unitedness'.

So maybe it's hard for your mother to attack you now! boo hoo. She used to have a team behind her when she criticised you or judged you. Now to give the same old judgements the same weight they had before, she drafts in the testimony of the medium.

It is bonkers of course, but ...................

[314Chart]

Sorry, I'm projecting there.

[leelu66]

YANBU, I think she's jealous too. I think some parents will naturally feel envious of things their children have that they didn't have (or no longer have). But most don't act on that envy.

[JolseBaby]

She sounds jealous of you. She sees you having turned your life around, being happy, lovely family - and for whatever reason wants to hurt you. The helpfulness and being over-involved is likely her telling herself (and possibly others) that you need her and that you simply cannot cope without her help/guidance/telling you what to do.

When you strip away all the bullshit, she is probably a miserable and lonely old lady. She misses your Dad, is maybe looking around and taking stock of what is around her. You're grown up with a family of your own and you don't really need her. She's on her own and probably wondering where she fits in now. Couple that with a tendency for amateur dramatics (flouncing out of a wedding because people are being affectionate with each other is really very silly).

I feel for her having lost your Dad. Bereavement - as you know - is very hard and time doesn't always wave the magic wand for everyone. My Gran was widowed in her 40s and went on for another 50 years! She was still talking about my Grandad and how much she missed him, right up until the day she died.

However, she doesn't sound like a terribly nice person - whether she is like this usually or not, only you can say. But it really does sound as if she is jealous of you and the remarks are a way of cutting you down to size; misery loves company etc. My advice would be to take a step back from this and from her. I would also recommend that you see a therapist if you haven't done so already, to help you get a handle on these feelings which have come back to the surface.

[ofuckit]

Actually when I think about it, as a kid it was usually my mum who did the telling off & bossing about. My dad was a pretty quiet figure in the backround, just going off to work every day then coming home and quietly doing as he was told. My mum definitely had the last word on things - and my dad would have always backed her - he didn't have much choice I don't think.

[wheelofapps]

It's all about HER, isn't it?

No slow dances at weddings as it upsets HER, no Christmas gifts and hugs between husbands and wives because it upsets HER, etc etc etc.

Oh dear My MIL and my Mother are rather like this.

But the bit about the psychic saying your Dad was 'ashamed of you' (not even logical anyway as you have 'turned your life around') is really really sad.
That is coming from your Mum I imagine.

Perhaps she did feel ashamed of you at times but she should have talked to you at the time and offered you help and support.
She should certainly be proud of you now, why doesn't she say that instead??

And wanting to play the tape to you

[ClarenceTheLion]

'Psychics' can pick up a lot just from tone of voice. They are very good at reading people - that's their talent, not being able to communicate with the dead.

So one way or another the psychic picked up on the fact that your DM wanted to hear what she said. And given that your life had turned around, and the way you describe your DM, I think she was resentful and jealous that things were going well for you.

And yes I do sometimes get the feeling that she wants to 'bring me back down to earth' in a way because maybe I'm just more happy than I deserve to be, in her eyes?

I read your last post after typing my comment. She sounds toxic. It's not healthy to want to knock your own child down. I would consider having much less contact with her in if I were in your shoes.

[ofuckit]

I do see her much less than I used to. When the DC were little she would babysit a lot (and was always very keen to).

Now they are older I don't need her help much. Therefore I can go a week or two without speaking to her, and then I start to worry a bit, knowing I'll be 'in trouble' for not keeping in touch. Then I'll ring her and she'll ignore me for a few days to 'punish me' I think.

I have opened a right can of worms for myself haven't I?

[314Chart]

To be flippant, I could suggest a pointless game of ''well, your medium thinks I ought to feel guilty?, I take your medium and I raise you one psychotherapist, and well, my psychotherapist thinks ...."

But really I think the best way to get through to her is to say ''i've learnt to accept what happened because it can't be changed. I was a teenager and Dad had the wisdow to understand that" and I know that because he appeared to me in a dream and told me he's worried about you cos you're losing it