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Will police inform social services?

(57 Posts)
sillymillyb Sun 20-Jul-14 12:52:57

Sorry I'm not sure where to put this, any advice welcome.

I've posted before about my mums old foster kids - they are young adults with learning disabilities, no social services involvement any more. She has cared for them for 20 years now, so part of the family sort of.

One of them has what can only be described as toddler tantrums - usually about once a week. They can be over anything like missing a favourite tv programme or not being allowed a biscuit before lunch. When she has these she is told to go upstairs to her room which is her safe space and she can scream / cry do whatever there till she is calmer. This usually is fine and she is happy and relieved with this.

My mum was out yesterday, ds and I are staying with her while I have new kitchen / bathroom put into my place. Old foster sister starts kicking off but refuses to goto her room. she picked up a wooden game and tried to throw it at my head, the tried to hit me twice. The first time she hit ds (aiming for me) and the second time she hit me. I pushed her away to try and get out house and she starts screaming. Ds is screaming and I am a mess as she has never attacked anyone before.

I ended up calling the police, who were pretty crap if I'm honest and said they would normally take assault of a minor seriously but as she has learning difficulties they pretty much just sent her to her room and me and ds back in the house.

My questions are.... Will social services be involved? Ds is 2 and was shaken but not hurt.

Secondly, what the hell do I do? I am horrified ds got hurt. I was abused hy a foster brother and feel sick at though of ds being exposed to same influences. My mum keeps saying it was unintentional as she meant to hit me not ds, and whilst I agree, I then find myself saying - but that's not on either? It's not is it? She told me this is normal and going on in thousands of houses up and down the country where people live with people with learning disabilities.... But that doesn't make it ok, does it?

My house has no bathroom or kitchen in and I have no money to rush it through. I've come to a hotel until Tuesday to give me time to figure this out, but I am feeling a bit overwhelmed by it.

I don't know if I'm just over reacting because of my past? I want to kill her for hurting ds, even unintentionally. I don't know what to do.

Ds is asleep in the car right now (we are at thomasland so he's very happy and thinks we are having a "lovely holiday" but if I don't reply it's cos he has woke up.

Please be gentle with me (ice got flamed before talking about the foster kids when they stole from me) as I'm feeling incredibly shaken up about this whole thjng.

Morethanalittlebitconfused Sun 20-Jul-14 12:56:24

You're not over reacting your mum sounds like a pretty ineffectual foster carer if she's allowed abuse of any form to happen and then say it's perfectly normal. It's not normal and you shouldn't have to tolerate it

sillymillyb Sun 20-Jul-14 13:03:10

She isn't their foster carer any more - to be honest I think that's part of the problem. They left care at 25 (I think, from memory so may not be accurate) but they have lived with us over 20 years so it's like she adopted them I guess. Not that that makes much difference, because she is still defending her. She is saying it's not on, but it's like moving forward we just have to forget about it, and I don't think I can. My reactions are all skew whiff!

ouryve Sun 20-Jul-14 13:03:59

Those sort of rages are terrifying enough when it's a 10yo having one. You're not over-reacting about being worried about the effect on your DS.

Was your mum home, when this happened?

sillymillyb Sun 20-Jul-14 13:04:33

My initial concern is where to live - I literally have I where once this hotel booking runs out, except back at my mums. I'm looking at another month I think before my house is ready.

I don't know how to get us out this situation.

ouryve Sun 20-Jul-14 13:05:29

Do you have a friend with a spare room you could rent?

Morethanalittlebitconfused Sun 20-Jul-14 13:05:42

Contact the council for emergency temporary accommodation

AnAirOfHope82 Sun 20-Jul-14 13:06:17

Have you any where else to stay?

You can not let ds stay there as its not safe for him.

sillymillyb Sun 20-Jul-14 13:06:49

My mum was out - that was ironically what had caused the rage as she had decided she had wanted to go with her (half an hour after she left)

They are terrifying, I know it's my job as adult to remain calm and I control but I was shitting myself. My mum thinks I over reacted by calling the police, but I didn't know what else to do. If it was a bloke with learning disabilities behaving that way not a woman, it would be construed so differently.

Beenspotted Sun 20-Jul-14 13:07:17

I remember your last thread. I don't know if social services will be informed automatically. If they are you'll need to be able to answer how you will protect ds in the future.
I agree, and remember from your last thread, that I think your mum isn't doing these girls any favours by making excuses for unacceptable behaviour rather than tackling it. Have you considered calling them yourself and asking for an assessment while you have the police involvement to "hide behind" as far as your mum is concerned? I'd be tempted...

AlpacaLypse Sun 20-Jul-14 13:09:38

I remember your previous thread about the thefts.

In some ways, your mum taking in these two makes me think of a couple of cases I've come across of well meaning people taking in animals without really thinking through the long term implications for their support. What would happen if your mum became unable to care for them at all?

I'm afraid I have no idea what will happen next re police/social services.

sillymillyb Sun 20-Jul-14 13:14:53

I am currently receiving housing benefit so not sure id be considered for emergency housing?

My mum has 2 houses knocked into 1 and she is suggesting she blocks up the doorway and we just stay in 1 half of it. I don't like this idea but I'm not sure why? My gut feeling is no but I'm not sure that's logical?

I agree, she is possibly out of her depth with the girls, but the alternative is them living alone in a bedsit and they would be so vulnerable. If something happens to my mum I suspect the girls would fall to be my responsibility. There isnt any one else.

I'm sorry if im going round in circles. I am struggling with this. Also, I keep being logged out the app so not ignoring people on purpose.

I'm not surprised you are struggling, this is an horrendous situation, and you are trying to be fair to everyone, ds, your Mum and the ex-foster children.

My sister is an LD nurse and says sometimes the police let people with LDs get away with assault because they say 'ooh, he didn't mean it'. Even though my sister says X or Y knew perfectly well what they were doing, it's just that they know they can get away with it. (Clearly this doesn't apply to all people with LDs, just some individuals. And my sister is a very strong advocate for people with LDs when they are being treated unfairly or without understanding - it's just recognising that they are individual people, just like the rest of us, and it's not always appropriate to say 'X doesn't realise'.)

DO get the door blocked up so you can keep ds - and you - safe.

Good luck, hope things get better.

usualsuspectt Sun 20-Jul-14 13:30:43

Would she look into an assisted living place for them?

ChairmanWow Sun 20-Jul-14 13:41:04

I know it's not the same, but I worked with adults with LD for a number of years and I was assaulted numerous times - all the staff were. I can't imagine what it must have been like experiencing that with a toddler there and I certainly don't think you're over-reacting.

If this assault was out of character then perhaps it was because of the absence of your mum. You could stay in the blocked half of the house and if your foster sis is there make sure your mum is 'in charge' at all times, so if the behaviours start to escalate your mum takes over and you remove yourself and your son. If you plan carefully you needn't be at risk of harm.

Hope you have a lovely day at Thomasland thanks

Denizen Sun 20-Jul-14 13:44:05

Yes social services will be informed, they may not do anything about it though. Police routinely inform SS, HV/school nurse and GP whenever they attend "Domestic Incidents" involving children.

sillymillyb Sun 20-Jul-14 21:17:55

Thank you for the replies, I am sorry I'm only just replying. I've just paid a gazillion pounds to the hotel to get wifi as my signal was so shite I couldn't get online with 3G.

My mum won't entertain assisted living I suspect. The girls are very much family to her, and she would feel she has let them down as they would struggle.

It's all a bit of a mess, I sent a message before to my mum and I don't know what I was expecting but her response was so factual, I feel let down because the abuse I suffered as a child I feel she brushed under the carpet - and it's happening again here on a smaller scale.

I agree by the way with the sentiment that sometimes the police want to let those with learning difficulties off. It's hard to gauge intent as an outsider I guess. Foster sister was very defiant in her attitude of, "yes I hit them, I was trying just to hit her though" that I guess she would come across as not understanding what she had done.

I dunno. I really don't know. My mum is my childcare too and I'm just launching a business, it throws everything into the air with everything. I'm resentful of being in this situation, which is stupid!

AlpacaLypse Mon 21-Jul-14 23:49:34

No it's not stupid to be resentful of this situation. Your mum is a lovely kindhearted person who has not thought through the long term implications and has added two people with severe learning disabilities to your family, without consulting you. That's not actually fair.

If she'd given birth to them of course you'd deal with it. But she (and your dad?) made a specific choice to add them to your family's dynamic. You have every right to feel a bit shit.

sillymillyb Tue 22-Jul-14 18:29:52

My mum and I have spoken at length today and I feel so flat and down.

She has said she thinks I'm over reacting and it was an accident. She said I'm using my dislike of fostering and what happened in the past to beat her with, and that I will be holding it over her to her grave and she may as well just die (dramatic huh?)

I feel like crap. I don't know if I am over reacting, I sort of hope I am because at least then she is justifying something justifiable.

How do I move on from this? I think I'll ask for this to be moved relationships as it doesn't really work in chat.

Does anyone know if I would have heard from health visitor / social services by now if I was going to?

hamptoncourt Tue 22-Jul-14 21:07:50

DM is your childcare?

So does this mean that even after you move, DS will be exposed to possible violent outbursts from "foster adult" on an ongoing basis?

Fuck that.

MexicanSpringtime Tue 22-Jul-14 21:21:45

I don't think you are overreacting, but I'm afraid I don't know what your mum can do either. As you say these girls are her "adopted" children so she feels a responsability towards them as much as towards you.

Are they beyond teaching?

sillymillyb Tue 22-Jul-14 21:55:24

I've been looking at childminders today Hampton, I think that's one of the reasons my mum thinks I'm over reacting.

I know she's in a difficult position, I just for once want her to choose to protect us rather than someone she has taken in. It feels like she is making out to everyone I'm making a fuss (like I was when I was being abused as a child) and that I should "move on". I can't make her see that I can't move on, because I have to take steps to stop this happening again, and that finding alternative childcare and hurrying up the work to complete my house isn't me just being dramatic like she thinks.

MrsSquirrel Tue 22-Jul-14 22:28:06

She wants you to 'move on'. You want her to choose to protect you and ds. It's a losing proposition, neither of you is going to get what you want. The best you can hope for is to agree to disagree.

You are not over reacting: you were attacked. She is not going to take steps to protect ds, so you need to. Finding alternative child care is a good idea.

My dp is a social worker and says for certain they will have had the report. It may take them a couple of days before they contact you. OTOH they may decide to take no further action. If you are feeling brave, you can contact them yourself and ask. It won't harm your case if you contact them. It would also be fine to let sleeping dogs lie, if you are more comfortable with that.

hatgirl Tue 22-Jul-14 22:39:26

what would be so bad about social services being involved?

The way I see it you get them involved and they may be able to offer support and probably referrals to behaviour intervention teams that can work with the adult involved around their behaviours.

To be honest the whole situation sounds abusive despite all the love that is involved. Adults, learning disabled or otherwise, shouldn't be 'sent to their rooms' like children. I presume they are claiming housing benefit to stay with your mother and therefore are her tenants?

They certainly aren't going to remove the adults your mum cares for unless either she or the people she cares for wants them to leave, or if social services feel that the adults are being abuse.

Don't be scared of social services.

hatgirl Tue 22-Jul-14 22:40:57

and I get that you mean in relation to the assault on your child... but I think from what you have said the police have already answered that for you.

I really think you should consider some social services involvement for the adults involved with this though.

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