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How hideous is going no contact?

(251 Posts)
NumptyNameChange Mon 28-Oct-13 15:08:07

not sure how much to write but after my sister had a hissy fit over nothing and threw me and my son out of her house in the rain without our coats (and with my keys in my coat pocket) in front of her own children (her daughter was really upset by it all) i have refused to go 'back to normal' re: forget anything ever happened yet again.

as a result i've ceased to be invited to family gatherings for over a month and no one wished me luck for an interview or asked how it went and basically i'm being punished for not playing the game/the role/etc that i am meant to.

another posters thread on here has really brought the dysfunctional dynamics of my family to life for me - they were anyway but you know how when you read it in someone else's life it's so much clearer?

anyway my role was always scapegoat and whipping boy (i'm female btw). no matter what successes i have it won't change a thing. things going well or that in any way disprove the role i've been assigned are just ignored.

i have never in my life been asked by my mother how i am or how things are going. i've never had an apology even when she has been absolutely monstrous. i'm pretty sure she is a narcissist - ticks all the boxes etc.

i have built pretty good boundaries over the years and laughingly refer to my teflon coating that lets the abuse slide off but i find myself wondering why on earth i put up with it at all or allow these people who are so keen to destroy me in my life.

could say lots more but not sure if i'll regret putting this out there. my parents are due to go away for a long spell soon, i haven't seen them for about a month despite living close by and i would actually rather not see them before they go away and rather not have my son go there as at the minute it feels really important to me for us to be together and not polluted by all the extended family madness. i suspect the pressure will come on soon or the 'you're such a bad person' trip.

i massively miss my sister's children but i no longer feel i can put up with all the shit i have to take to be in their lives. i'm tired of being painted as someone i genuinely don't even recognise and never did even as a child and having motives and intentions and actions attributed to me that bear no relation to reality. i'm sick of the crazy making of people behaving monstrously and then just lying or pretending it never happened or that i'm the crazy one and it was all my fault somehow. i'm also sick of allowing my son to be around people who don't have the most basic respect for me.

not sure what the point of this post is - maybe just to put it out there.

NumptyNameChange Fri 08-Nov-13 06:43:16

you're right - and i know rationally i would never do that to ds. but somehow the little human bad things i do as a parent (for example brush him aside when i'm busy/tired etc) end up feeling like evidence that i'm the same when really they're clearly totally different as you say face.

it's totally the crazymaking business that makes it so hard to feel confident and the fact of knowing that everything was done in such a deniable way and she has outright denied so many things and point blank lied with such utter conviction that you do end up doubting your own memories sometimes.

i think if you're sensitised to seeing yourself as bad then even the tiniest bits of being human seem like looming evidence of it. confirmation bias in a way i guess. i do have a rational head and a lot of insight so i can rationalise and see but god it is exhausting sometimes. would be nice to not have to work so hard at it itms.

my mum never hit me that much - i can remember a few hysterical slapping incidents but i think it stopped fairly young as it didn't really serve her and there was no way she'd have wanted to give me evidence. i remember comparing red hand marks on my thighs with a friends lump on her head once at primary - her mum was a thrower, mine a slapper.

but i'm realising there are different ways of physically abusing your children than just hitting them - so refusing to get them medical treatment or to attend to their injuries fits in there i think. these people are sneaky and she knew i'd use bruises or other physical signs to get away or 'show her up' so she had to find deniable ways to hurt me. like how the worst of the emotional abuse would be without witnesses - not all of it mind as she had the family under control enough to tolerate and even enjoy (in the case of my sister) me 'getting it'.

hmm. bloody families! i read something that made me laugh out loud yesterday because it was so resonant of my family - someone wrote something about how if their family was involved in a major car accident no one would call 999, pull people out of burning cars or take any essential action until they'd decided whose fault it was.

NumptyNameChange Fri 08-Nov-13 06:46:43

i see this in the next generation too - like someone is hurt and instead of addressing the hurt they're panickedly scrambling to deny it was their fault and establish who to blame.

i was always the one saying, it doesn't matter whose fault it was at this point, x is hurt, that's what matters right? or the milk is spilt let's clear it up rather than spend half an hour arguing over blame ffs.

FestiveEdition Fri 08-Nov-13 07:06:46

Personally - I would move while the parents are away on their trip.

That is not flippant. The story you tell is so familiar it is painful.
No contact works best when you are as far removed as possible from any chance of random meetings.
For me, it took away some of the fear.

If you are going to be made redundant, and have reached the point of knowing that NC is the only route to staying sane, then I would absolutely consider a massive life change.

Just the spin that worked for me.
{flowers] OP. Its hard.

FaceDirectionOfTravel Fri 08-Nov-13 07:26:47

Have you heard of gaslighting? Look it up it will explain a lot about the crazymaking.

I don't have any particular advice about actually going NC except that you sound very strong and you are learning to trust yourself. It is hard for you to know what is right for you even when they aren't around.

baytree Fri 08-Nov-13 13:26:53

The other thing is how Narcissistic people are like vampires. They suck all your confidence and any attempt you make to live a normal life. They push all the blame onto you, re-invent situations by gaslighting.

I was wrong in one of my earlier posts to say disengage. I think you are beyond this and telling us you want/need to move away. Stay strong, everyone here is supporting you.
So that is 1 narc versus all of us, a quick count I made it 25 posters plus you of course. Take that step if you can or start empowering yourself by making a plan.

One of the things that has amazed me, is how being released from the clutches of my narc family, how I see things and people so much more clearly; it's like I am seeing life in 3D colour IMAX, whereas before it was a blurred black and white portable. Does that make sense to anyone?

AndTheBandPlayedOn Fri 08-Nov-13 15:49:23

I agree with spammy, face directionoftravel, and bay tree.

It was abuse, NNameChange...the negligent kind. Sorry you went through that for so long.

I think my beginning point of healing was when I forgave myself for being me. Normally, I was always quiet. But when I did speak I was sarcastic, perfectionist, tactless... And all of the frustration of being someone like that (anger of frustration). I was tired of being me, if that makes sense. So I started to change and keep my opinions to myself and be happier for it. I guess you could call it an epithany of self awareness.

Then I started to notice social dynamics more objectively, instead of constantly being on guard to protect my inner child so to speak. I grew up perhaps. But it was more than that. It was looking at and understanding that first of all I really did not have a good childhood (which my toxic sister would probably contest to this day-but I am NC so can not say for sure wink)...and second, how that upbringing really did affect me, and not in good ways!

My mother died when I was 18, father passed on when I was 36, and I am now 51. I live 80 miles from toxic sister. So I am pretty safe from the injustices of face to face interaction.

Toxic a Sister is and always be in denial about her behavior. To that I say, denying it does not change the fact of it, or the effect of it.

Sorry for the long post, just some background so you can have an idea where I am coming from with this.
NNameChange, moving is the answer, as I think you have already figured out with that job interview. Don't stop-go get another interview!

AndTheBandPlayedOn Fri 08-Nov-13 15:51:11

Sparky, not spammy...
And I also agree with FestiveEdition, (I did not mean to leave you out).

AndTheBandPlayedOn Fri 08-Nov-13 15:52:39

Spanky, not sparky
blush

AndTheBandPlayedOn Fri 08-Nov-13 15:54:48

And the slapping and hitting about the face was obviously physical abuse.

NumptyNameChange Fri 08-Nov-13 16:25:23

unfortunately i'm really not in a position to move right now. i live in rental accommodation with a secure tenancy now after being stuck with a property in the last recession and ending up with a mortgage shortfall i would not have a good credit rating for the first time in my life. so renting through letting agencies would be out - and it would be anyway if i'm about to be out of work. i also have pets.

it's one to work towards really.

for now i kind of need to keep things simple, focus on sorting my head out and staying away from them and working out what to do next. it would be easier obviously to just disappear but not really viable at the minute with finances and living arrangements as they are. so i'm going to have to find the strength to be no contact in close proximity which will mean riding out a bit of a storm i should imagine. christmas being the first huge battle but if i get through that without giving in then it should be plain sailing.

NumptyNameChange Fri 08-Nov-13 16:25:58

and thank you - i like the idea of it being 25 of us against them. two narcs unfortunately - mum and sister.

baytree Fri 08-Nov-13 16:27:34

Hi And the band

Your comment "and then I started to notice social dynamics more objectively". You are spot on and have said it better than me. That is exactly what I meant when I said I see everything now in 3D. You stop anticipating/adapting/waiting to respond and manage but instead step back and see real life and become more natural (the real you), relaxed,positive and sociable.
NNameChange, that is what you can be too. Natural, relaxed etc..

baytree Fri 08-Nov-13 16:30:46

Often the way Nnamechange that there is a parent and offspring narc combination. I have that too. You have more in common with us 25 than with those two.

Keep posting and growing

(smile)

AndTheBandPlayedOn Fri 08-Nov-13 21:33:30

It was my experience as well, regarding mother/daughter narcissism. Mother was a bi-polar alcoholic...but she was also really big into social standing stuff (we were upper middle class). I was assigned the role of invisible child, and as such, was the go to target for any itch to redicule or diminish to satisfy mother's superiority needs (narc supply).

Toxic sister (you can guess: the golden child) was trained by observation from a very early age how to treat me...her brain was hard wired that way, so to speak. Perhaps her consistent denials that there is anything wrong with her behavior are genuine...but that does not mean that I have to sacrifice my mental health by some sort of f&¢ked up default. Her ignorance of the social dynamics is not my problem to solve.

Thanks, baytree smile

Salbertina Tue 12-Nov-13 19:00:22

Bloody hideous ime, especially without network of support - loyal dh and understanding friends...which i dont have. Feel c v lonely with it all and has ripped apart my foundations.

Be careful what you wish for and remember the books can only guide you so far..

baytree Thu 14-Nov-13 20:58:25

How long has it been for you Salbertina? Big hug from me

NumptyNameChange Fri 15-Nov-13 15:52:53

hi again.

text from my sister today pretending nothing had happened and inviting us to go for dinner on sunday. suckered me a bit on my way to see someone about a new job.

utterly bizarre given how things were left between us - though actually absolute standard practice for my family.

found myself wavering in the face of such 'normality', then wondered what to say, what to do etc. in the end i just replied 'no thanks'. am dreading the abusive message i feel is likely to come in return.

NumptyNameChange Fri 15-Nov-13 16:07:31

oh it's just come, " suit yourself. poor, poor (your)ds "

NumptyNameChange Fri 15-Nov-13 16:12:13

i'm meant to bite now of course - defend myself, say why this is really happening etc but i KNOW there is no point. it's just fuel on the fire. help!!! it is hard not to defend yourself and point out yes actually, poor ds that he has an aunt who thinks it's acceptable to throw him and his mother out in the dark and rain without their coats, poor ds that he has had to witness such ridiculousness and no, i won't expose him to it anymore.

utterly pointless isn't it? someone around to remind me not to feed?

Holdthepage Fri 15-Nov-13 16:36:32

Ignore, ignore, ignore. The one thing drama queens can't stand is having people take no notice of them, so just leave it at the "no thanks" you have already sent.

AndTheBandPlayedOn Fri 15-Nov-13 17:11:02

She had to get in the last word so let her have it. Engaging further is not going to resolve things any better at all. She is using your dc against you; it is bait: leave it.

Good luck for the new job!

RandomMess Fri 15-Nov-13 17:47:45

Ignore and if possible block her number grin

pollyglen Sat 16-Nov-13 08:47:46

Reading your posts i felt i needed to offer support as i am in exactly the same situation as you i am NC with my own 'DM' for almost four years and two years down the line NC from golden child 'DSIS'.
Word for word i could have written your post with regard to being the scapgoated could never do right bullied child.Even as an adult i was never good enough and every detail of my life was picked over critised and mocked.My achievements were never noted or commented on.
NC in the main for me is great as it feels as if a great weight has been lifted not having to deal with the dysfunction and nastiness however unfortunately i live in a small town and have to see my sister daily and the mother has a nasty habit of turning up on the doorstep on special occasions spouting her crap to anyone who will listen about how evil i am for denying her a relationship with her grandkidssad.

Anyway,just wanted to offer support OP,you are most definately not alone.

NumptyNameChange Sat 16-Nov-13 09:30:35

thanks polly - sorry you're going through the same and like me you live in close proximity.

my sister's text got to me, i found myself thinking well maybe it could all just go back to normal etc. her 'poor ds' comment to me saying no thank you to something she wanted us to do just confirmed the obvious though.

i need to steel myself to the whole 'poor ds' thing as no doubt there's more of it to come. behave atrociously and expect to get away with it. when you don't just wait a while then offer a carrot whilst pretending nothing has happened - if it's refused whack with a stick. then wait a while and repeat.... ad infinitum.

if she's have scrolled up on the conversation (text history) she'd have seen how ridiculous it was - that her last message was full of lies, manipulation and abuse and her next one was the pretend everything is fine and nothing has happened and issue an invitation, then in response to 'no thanks' more nastiness.

it's just.... farcical really.

it's hard to believe people are really like this even when you've grown up with them. i don't know 'normal' people who behave like this. i have never had friends or partners or associates who think this is normal behaviour and who'd treat you awfully, abuse you then act like nothing had happened and invite you to dinner.

it's just bizarre.

pollyglen Sat 16-Nov-13 10:19:46

NNC,you are quite right normal people don't behave like this and i don't know anyone else who behaves like this.Why would happy loving people mistreat one of their own family?This is why you are a better person for doing something about it.

The texts are just bait.They are trying to reel you in.They want you to doubt yourself so you get sucked back in and they get their whipping boy back.
My sister seems to be following the same script as yours is."ooh polly won't speak to me or the kids and i don't know why","polly is a cow who is stopping all the cousins from seeing eachother" blah blah etc.
The last straw for me was my mother and sister were obviously starting to target my DD as their next victim and the alarm bells started ringing.

keep strong and protect your child that's what a good parent does.

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