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Can I forgive this much deceit?

(708 Posts)
alphacourse Tue 25-Jun-13 06:45:07

I am trying to figure out whether I can stay,have couples counselling, and try and work things out. Or....whether it is just too much betrayal and deceit. My mind swings between the 2 on a twice daily basis.

Background: DP has cheated on me with 2 women. He met with each one 4/5 times during my recent pregnancies. He has also met up for drinks with a few more. He met then through married affair websites.

I found out about the websites 10 weeks ago, and about the women 3 weeks ago. He followed the usual script of denial, deleting, minimising etc. Then I was contacted by a woman and he had to come clean.

He has started psychotherapy to deal with his issues. He says it was about the buzz of getting girls to be impressed by him.

How do I work out what to do for the best? Obviously he is desperate to work things out. I am prepared to listen at the minute. We have 3 DC. 2 are very small. Help me to make sense of this please!

mumat39 Fri 30-Aug-13 23:49:11

Sorry AF, I keep cross posting with you! Except you put it much more succinctly than I ever could.

AnyFucker Fri 30-Aug-13 23:52:05

Nah, mum

Same message, similar words smile

alphacourse Sat 31-Aug-13 00:07:07

I told him to leave.He wanted to stay.

He is doing things to change. Being proactive. BUT it is still all about him. And I doubt the change could be quick enough.

I agree he should be bending over backwards - which is why I am so incredulous! He says he is lost and has no idea what to do. But it seems logical to me!

he could win awards at being a twunt! He seems to have a natural knack at fucking this up! everything he could do wrong he does! His award-winningly poor at communicating, except for sales etc. He cant talk about feelings or empathise.

My parents know what he has done. My Mum sent him some photos of the kids while we were out (trying to keep the channels of communication open to make things easier for me). He didnt even acknowledge them!

alphacourse Sat 31-Aug-13 00:08:27

I keep trying to look at the actions - I am just disbelieving and keep thinking I have misinterpreted them, or making excuses for him!

AnyFucker Sat 31-Aug-13 00:12:35

do you want to grow old with a person like this ?

really ?

He communicated well enough when he was conducing his infidelities didn't he ?

Why not now ? With you ?

he has a cock between his legs and no emotional intelligence is that what you are saying ?

then if that is the case, his days are numbered. Swordsman that he is right now it won't last forever, with you or anyone else

alphacourse Sat 31-Aug-13 00:14:54

No - I don't want to grow old with this reality. His communication with the other women was all bullshit -big-I-am - not about feeling of emotions.

He has zero emotional intelligence and empathy.

AnyFucker Sat 31-Aug-13 00:16:15

Then he can never be the man you want him to be

it is that simple

He can't "learn" this stuff

he has always been selfish and you have always carried him and excused him, haven't you ?

alphacourse Sat 31-Aug-13 00:17:07

Yes

alphacourse Sat 31-Aug-13 00:18:42

He has always been selfish. I have always excused him. He can't magic the ability to see things through another's eyes can he?

AnyFucker Sat 31-Aug-13 00:21:09

You can do it because you have emotional intelligence. You were born with it. It is innate.

How you choose to use that gift can be advantageous to you. Or it can be your downfall.

AnyFucker Sat 31-Aug-13 00:22:33

You must be exhausted, love

Just because I keep replying, don't feel obliged to respond.

I have teenagers, not little ones. I can sit here all night.

alphacourse Sat 31-Aug-13 00:32:38

Thank you so much - I really needed to chat tonight. I can't keep wishing he was something he isn't can I. It isn't fair on either of us.

I know he loves us. I know he doesn't like who he is. I know he wishes he could turn back time. i KNOW those things - truly. I know he is going to psychotherapy to try to address these issues, and is having CBT as well. But that doesn't help me NOW does it?

AnyFucker Sat 31-Aug-13 00:34:13

get some sleep, love x

alphacourse Sat 31-Aug-13 00:39:10

Yes - littlest is calling already x

mumat39 Sat 31-Aug-13 00:49:09

Alpha, you are kind, big hearted and generous in your selflessness.

I think you have been used to being the one to make things better for him because that is in your nature. He knows this and he is taking advantage.

I struggle with anxiety and depression. I think alotof that started when I met my ex in my 20's. he was good looking, smart, clever and all the things I thought I would never have in a boyfriend. A few months in, the emotional blackmail started, and I kept I ing in, believing that he was hurting and needed me. So I stayed and we to married, he kept on asking me, and in the end I said yes. I was 21. The day of our wedding I knew I had made a mistake, but I kept thing I went ino this and he needs me, so I stayed. For 10 years. In the end he cheated on me and that was way out. Thankfully we didn't have any kids. Your p's actions remind me of how my ex behaved. He minimised and got angry, said sorry, got more angry. In the end I just stopped communicating. I used to hear from him every so often, telling me if only I knew him now, how much he had changed blah blah. But, at the time, he would all, he'd be in the car outside his girlfriends place of work, waiting to pick her up. When I found out, I told him he hadn't changed at all and that I didn't want him to contact me again. Again, I got a few emails, but only when he wasn't well, in the end, it was just more emotional blackmail. Oi, remember me. I'm still here. Don't you forget about me. I deleted emails that came in and blocked him, so I don't hear anymore. My depression now is most definitely rooted in that experience. I kept trying o help. I gave everything of myself but he just kept taking and there was nothing in it for me at all. It is nearly 15 years ago that I left and about 13 since I to divorced, but it still affects me. I wish I had just blocked him sooner, got out sooner. He was another cake eater, but by putting up with it, I was almost like asking 'another piece?'

This is a long winded way of me saying you have to protect yourself and block him out as much as you can, in terms of you. You can't heal or decide anything if he is there tugging at your heart strings at every opportunity he get. You have to have contact for the sake of your DC, but you don't have to see him. Yes they need to see him, but it could be on your terms, not his.

You almost need to step out of yourself and look at it as if it was something that your best friend, or daughters were going through. Make a list of all the things that have happened in the last couple of years that have maybe niggled, and then how your ideal man would or wouldn't have behaved and how he has behaved. Maybe seeing it in black and white might help.

It won't take the pain or hurt away, but it might be that your hurting for someone who he actually isn't, maybe ever or maybe just anymore.

I'm probably not making much sense, but he has already let you down, affected your health and is relying on you to keep doing what he asks. Next time he tells you when he is coming over, just tell him it's not working for you, him coming over, especially at bedtime. Suggest he takes dc out somewhere. Or if he has to come to do bath time, you go out, consider him a babysitter. He comes in, you go. If he wants to do bath time, then ask him to sort his flat out so he can do at least dc2's bath time there and dc2 can have a sleep over. These are just maybe things to try, to protect yourself from his constant intrusion when you have asked for space.

Sorry for my long ramble.

I hope you get some rest tonight. xxx

mumat39 Sat 31-Aug-13 00:51:50

I can't keep up with you two. I'm such a slow typer. I feel like one of those annoying peeps in a pub that keeps trying to join in the convo between two good friends. Sorry blush

<goes off to interrupt someone else>

AnyFucker Sat 31-Aug-13 00:54:33

Don't be daft mum

it's all there for posterity smile

mumat39 Sat 31-Aug-13 00:56:19

thanks

mumat39 Sat 31-Aug-13 01:02:45

Why are you still awake AF? Are you outside the UK?

I am in the UK and an insomniac. i am a zombie in the day as I can't sleep at night. My dc are 5 and 3, so I should sleep earlier but just can't. How old are your teens?

Alpha, I hope your littlest just wanted a burp or fart and drifts off to sleep again soon xx

AnyFucker Sat 31-Aug-13 01:08:38

My kids are 18 and 13. Am in the UK.

I am also an insomniac, but one of those that doesn't actually need much sleep. Luckily.

Jux Sat 31-Aug-13 01:20:22

Just finished reading your thread.

He really does take the biscuit, doesn't he? And you are so kind, you keep trying to interpret what he does in the nicest possible way.

I have read on MN, and in other places too, that when a couple split up it is a bad idea for the NRP to have access at the family home. It causes confusion in the children giving hem mixed messages, which upsets them more and prolongs the misery. (I have also read threads where the NRP used the time at the family home to poke about, check the laptop, read private mail etc too).

I think for the sake of your children that he should take DC2 and 3 out to the park for instance, return DC3 in an hour or whatever you think best, and then maybe take DC2 off for some food somewhere local.

This gives you some time with DC1, or time alone if she's at a friend's.

He can do the same at the weekend if he's having DC2 overnight. Visit to the park with DC3, return DC3 and go off with DC2 for the day and overnight?

You are managing really well, but you are treating him as if your relationship is still extant. Detach! Not easy when he's strolling into your place as if it's his still, and he's still sending you chummy little texts (33 a day shock!).

Would he pay attention if you asked him to stop, and to only communicate about access or urgent and important work matters? Wonder what the therapist would say about it.

Hope the results of your MRI are good and that the stress lessens appreciably as you get to grips with all this shit. Not the life you expected, but perhaps you can turn it into the life you want, given time thanks

mumat39 Sat 31-Aug-13 01:22:36

I think I love being awake when the house is quiet, ie when the dc are in bed and DP isn't snoring on the sofa grin so I can MN in peace

I can't get by on little sleep, I dread to think what I'll be like when I'm older.

Right just had my first yawn so need to get to bed before the sleepiness passes. And it's only 1.21. S early for me.

G'night AF. Hope you get a good nights rest too.
Xxxx

AnyFucker Sat 31-Aug-13 01:26:57

I am heading up very soon. x

Mosman Sat 31-Aug-13 13:15:10

It's fine not have decided, the ball is completely in your court but my god if he comes back it all has to change, the attitude, the entitlement, the balance of power.
Nobody would feel very forgiving towards him right now because he isn't acting like he even cares.
I insisted on two weeks of no contact at all and it did me the world of bloody good.

Mosman Sat 31-Aug-13 13:16:27

Oh and the DC never missed him in that time, aren't even fussed if they miss a phone some times they just kind of roll with it and if THEY can be arsed with him they engage and if they can't they don't.

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