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I have gained a lodger and lost a friend.(75 Posts)
We have a granny flat above our garage. We aren't renting it out as it would then be liable for council tax and we wouldn't be guaranteed regular tenants as we live in a pretty unpopular renting area.
At the moment we have a good friend of 25 years standing staying it whilst he relocates from London. He came up in January for 2 days and ended up staying nearly 4 weeks and generally was grumpy and nasty to me despite trying to avoid him. He had form for being a terrible moody flatmate years ago and obviously he hadn't changed. He asked us could he stay in the flat whilst he got himself sorted. He is a very old friend and we wanted to help him as much as we could so despite the stress of the previous month we said yes.
I mildly called him on his attitude via email and he appeared horrified and said it was because he was stressed. It was all sorted and I made a joke of it and that was that.
He has been here 2 months and it has been beyond awful. DH and I have done what we can to give him a wide berth but he basically canot be civil to me. If I meet him outside he either wilfully ignores me or snaps at me. Any of the most bland conversation is wilfully misinterpreted and ends up him telling me to shut up. I am not welcome in the flat at all. I have kept my counsel as it was only to the end of April. Now he has basically said to DH he hasn't found anywhere to go. We know he is going to ask DH this weekend whether he can stay on. He has nowhere to go.
It would seem an easy decision- No- but he has had depression in the recent past and I am wondering how much of this might be going? He was meant to be over it and bearing in mind he is pleasant to DH and other friends just not to me I am inclined to think he is just being a pig. Even dh says it is obvious he can't stand the sight of me and is worried he is ill because he can't believe someone could do this intentionally especially when I have very little to do with him and he is basically relying on our good will. He doesn't pay any rent and is to give us a small sum at the end to cover bills and expenses.
I have been ill twice in the last month first with cellulitis from athletes foot and then with conjunctivitis and the GP thinks I am run down and stressed as I am usually fighting fit. How much should I put my health and happiness before someone's suspected mh problems?
He's a freeloader and abusive with it.
He started by intending to stay for 2 days and ended up staying nearly 4 weeks rent free!.
You have mug written all over you and your DH for putting up with him for so long. He is taking you for a ride and unfortunately you have both let him do this to you.
He's been there 2 months this time, Attila. 3 months in total.
And yes, abusive.
He needs to go.
This is your home but listen to yourself in your OP:
grumpy and nasty to me despite trying to avoid him
I mildly called him on his attitude via email
it has been beyond awful.
DH and I have done what we can to give him a wide berth but he basically canot be civil to me. If I meet him outside he either wilfully ignores me
ends up him telling me to shut up. I am not welcome in the flat at all.
This man is awful, sod what he may say to others, he acts like he despises you, I don't know how you could possibly put up with him.
I admit I am a mug for not confronting him sooner but I let him stay for the best of intentions. He asked, we had no real reason not to let him and because he is a friend and has had a hard time we thought it would be manageable. Turns out leopards don't really change their spots but there you go.
Unfortunately it's been a long time since I've been a teenager and when I was I would probably have shouted and screamed but now I don't. Perhaps that's not such a good thing. I didn't want to get into a situation where he was telling people I threw him out and he has nowhere to go and poor him and what a cow I was and then I had to go round telling them no in fact he was a nob because I just cannot be arsed with it. I want him to go and let it go.
He's not a mad lunatic he's just a moody arse who we suspected was sinking into a depression again and there was a lot of us not wanting to deal with that. I don't think that makes me a total mug. It just means my concern was misplaced.
Are you going to ask him to leave?
Yes basically DH asked him yesterday before it kicked off and he is going in 2 weeks. He has a flat organised and a date to get into it then but I think the lack of hot water will drive him out sooner.
Call me a wuss, but I would probably have done no better (until toughened up by my recent divorce). Remember, he is only a licencee, you can chuck him out right now. Get him to give you an actual date of moving out, and if he doesn't go then, chuck him out right that moment.
Sorry, but you never had a friend. At least now you have open eyes.
Just ask him to leave.
He doesn't seem like a very good friend to me. You are doing a him a favour and he can't even be bothered to be civil to you. That is really unacceptable. Your husband needs to have word with him and get him to go to the doctors if he has depression but that is still no reason to be rude to you. If not then he needs to leave
When's he moving out? I'll move in, bake you the cakes, do all your washing and ironing and clean your house in exchange for rent. See the difference? Most people are, at the very least, grateful.
Oh, I have depression, too, as well as post-traumatic stress disorder and some major anxiety issues.
It doesn't give me a license to abuse people and take the piss out of them.
Mm, all these mutual friends who know him as a nice person, who will think you were horrible to throw him out, er, don't they know you as a nice person too? Why would they believe one of you so much more readily than the other? If they do take his side, let them take him into their home and see what a lovely guest he can be with the right host. It would be fascinating to see how that one pans out.
Being a bitch has such a bad reputation.
Your freeloading pest guest is a bitch. He is using your good manners against you, perhaps for his entertainment? Who knows why? It doesn't matter. But he knows you will do anything to not be seen as a bitch.
Please be a bitch. It's ok, really, it is. It will not stain you for life. Some circumstances just cry out for it, but rarely do we see a completely Board Certified, License Validated, AAA Plus Rated endorsement to do so as you have here.
You set the time, not him and his supposed reasons.
garlicyoni : "Cocks & Lodgers - pest removel services"
Throwing him out is basic and legitimate self defense!
It has nothing to do with being a bitch and you don't have to be rude or sweary.
'This isn't working for us. You need to leave. You have xx time to pack your things and clear off.'
And to everything he says, 'This isn't working for us. You need to leave. You have xx time to pack your things and clear off.'
He gets abusive, you leave the room, pull out your mobile and call the police. 'I let a mate in to stay with us temporarily. He's refusing to leave and is threatening me.'
He doesn't clear off, you call them up on non-emergency number. 'I let mate in to stay temporarily. He's refusing to leave and is being abusive to me/threatening/becoming violent.'
Friends think you're a cow, they are just as bad as he is and I'll wager you they would never have let this guy stay at theirs gratis for 3 months.
Fuck them. Find new friends.
3 months of threats and abuse from this bullying manipulative and unpleasant individual are surely enough.
I can't believe how rude he has dared to be to you, apparently safe in the knowledge that he'll get away with it and nothing will happen.
Telling you to shut up when you are doing him a massive favour like this? WTF?
I would still get him out now - not when it suits him.
I would have no issue with being pretend-nice for the next 2 weeks in order to keep the peace and make sure he didn't trash the granny flat. But I would have a big issue with my DH not supporting me/backing me up. If anyone criticises you for throwing the annoying guest out, tell them that they are welcome to have him to stay... I bet they won't offer to have him.
You are absolutely right expatinscotland.
Imho, from the postings, it seemed that OP was equating the final effect of putting him out with being, or rather feeling like, a bitch, whether the actual transaction was civil or not.
As it seems (to me) OP is overly concerned with what her friends think about it, and presumes that they will think "bitch" no matter how Pest Guest is treated-just based on the fact that he got kicked out.
So my encouragement was for Poozlepants to overcome the label and not let that continue to stop her from getting it done.
I've got a feeling he's going to trash the place whether you are "nice" to him or not, and the "small sum of money to cover bills and expenses" will not be forthcoming.
It's not your fault he has nowhere to go! Get him out a.s.a.p. and don't forget to change to locks.
No hot water...turn off the electricity to his flatlet too!
I think you need to go on some sort of self confidence course. What makes you think other people would believe him over you? And if they did, does it really matter? Whats important is what you think of other people, not what they think about you.
This man is not a friend, he really truly isn't. In time you will recognise that and kick yourself for being such a mug. This man is free loading off of you both, and trying to divide and rule, because he knows he can get away with it. He might seem great on the outside, but internally he sounds very unpleasant.
Ah, this reminds me of a book by Diane Athill - After a Funeral. She lets a promising Egyptian writer stay in her spare room in the late 60s. It doesn't pan out well. Required reading for any of us who have put up with neurotics. Get it out the library.
Is he wholly skint? Is there a YHA nearby? He can kip there most likely, it's not too pricey. Obviously if he feels indebted to you it puts him under a certain pressure, hey not excusing him mind, but every time he encounters you it must feel like the unpaid tax bill.
Whenever I'm on these kind of threads I imagine our advice escalating into a Hitchcock Strangers on a Train-type scenario. "Of course, I have the same problem. Now, if I could bump off your tenant..."
She's not going to tell this dicksmack to go anywhere, and the wussy husband certainly isn't.
You made me laugh out loud ProfessorDent!
Well, there's also that Madness song Bed and Breakfast Man, look it up on YouTube.
It's true that there are narcissistic types who are nice to strangers and acquaintances and treat their immediate circle like dirt, anyone who is a sitting duck in their life gets it, and the OP is a sitting duck currently, but usually it is their immediate family. They sort of skim the surface of various folk, projecting their ideal persona, all urbane charm, onto them, while you get the other side, onto which they offload all their banal problems and flashes of nastiness.
And I can quite see why you would put up with it so long; these types get you helping them out, you feel like a dog running after a stick, it's a fool's errand. In other words, you become an enabler. Now there's nothing wrong with helping someone out, and nothing wrong with accepting help, but it can be if you are only doing it to bolster their inflated sense of self-esteem. Often you find the moment you have helped them, they turn nasty because they don't need you any more, or they want to cut loose and feel free and liberated again. It's never an actual relationship with these types.
I think that is very insightful ProfessorDent. We all come across these people from time to time. We see their tedious, unpleasant, grabby side while others just see the delightful person. We end up doubting ourselves.
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