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Turning Tavern

(89 Posts)
outtaleftfield Fri 01-Feb-13 15:25:05

Hi I am new to this and could do with some advise, is there anyone out there who was on the previous Turning Tavern threads?

followyourjoy Wed 13-Feb-13 16:31:31

Hi Outta ~ Great that you've ordered the book! will try my very best to answer your questions......
Things are certainly going to get interesting for you! This is not about "switching yourself off" rather switching the mind off (the false self/ego, monkey chattering entity that is the mind). A good exercise for you to do, is to start trying to identify your true awareness behind the chattering ego mind. This mind that chatters to you, is NOT YOU! Try and identify this as the ego, and see that if you tell it to STOP, what is left beneath it? Do "you" disappear when your mind's endless chattering stops? No, what remains is your true self, that is at peace and just "IS". Once you have identified the false mind, you will be ready to deal with it's nonsense.

In order to switch your mind off, you need to be accepting the present moment, saying "YES" to it, not resisting it, and be in your awareness....watch your breath...feel your heart beating, but don't THINK about it. Just surrender to what is, stop trying to control it. Be in the here and now and your mind won't do the running away thing. Keep practicing this, notice how much crap you tell yourself everyday and learn to laugh at yourself and the ego, learn to tell it to STOP!

Believe me, I don't treat everything that comes into my life with ease at all, but I realize deeply that we are here to learn, and that every situation has something to teach us. Once you accept this, rather than resisting it, you can learn to embrace the difficulties as inevitably they provide us with our greatest opportunities to grow. I know it can be painful at the time, but that's life...the pain doesn't stay around, soon will come the joy.

outtaleftfield Wed 13-Feb-13 18:45:14

Hi Follow

What does the ego mean in this context? Normally the ego is a big opinion of yourself?? I am determined to crack this, I get the mind chattering bit and that if I tell it to stop, I am still me, still here. If you do something wrong and you want to resolve it, generally you have to think about it? to make sure you can put it right? If you just switch off to everything how do things get sorted out?

Victoria1971 Thu 28-Feb-13 10:19:44

Yes......me!....This is my first time on here. Maybe I should tell u my tale. I've been in a 12 yr relationship with a man, not married, two amazing kids, and 6 months ago I fell madly in love with my gay female friend. We are together now and it's been the toughest thing I've ever done, trust me! But we are so happy! I have never had any gay tendencies in my life, but I do feel I've met my soulmate and love of my life. I'm having counselling for me to get my head around the 'new' me. I don't flaunt it, I'm rather hidden n very scared, but somehow I'm evolving into this. My children are my priority, obviously, and I do worry for them. Some friends n family have shunned me, which has hurt terribly. But other friendships have strengthened. I'm still going thru the guilt for leaving my ex, although I fell outa love with him yrs ago. My journey continues. Does anyone know of any 'comfortable' places I can relax in with my partner, in South Manchester.........I'm still struggling!

Loveis Fri 01-Mar-13 22:20:50

Hi Victoria - I'm in a very similar situation to you. I've PM'd you.

HappyTitChick Sun 03-Mar-13 18:38:00

Outta - how are things 2 weeks on? I've just found this thread having been on the last Turning Tavern thread.
The joy of others people advice and pearls of wisdom was a boost to me and my journey, I hope you have found acceptance in yourself that your attraction is not wierd or scarey but a trigger to find inner happiness.
I am happily married and have a girlfriend of 10 months. She is also married and both our husbands are accepting of our relationship. We both have 2 DC and they are of similar ages although she is in her 30s and me in my 40s. Its been a interesting road to travel but so much love and happiness, so much being true to ourselves, is coming out of it.
Do let us know how are you? I'd love to help if I can.

outtaleftfield Mon 04-Mar-13 21:50:52

Hi all,
I have been trying to get my head around quite a bit since last writing on here. I got the book that follow recommended and I have been reading it, it is quite heavy going and I find I can't concentrate on it for too long! I have really been thinking about the why people come into your life thing too and what this situation really is about for me. I guess I am pretty lonely. I grew up in a large city, went to a large school, was working from the age of 14, partied hard and had loads of friends. I now live in the middle of a field and am on my own a lot during the week. I have made friends, but also spend a lot of time around people I really have nothing in common with, I feel like i just don't know who I am anymore.

I hadn't seen the 'person' for a while and actually spent time with her at the weekend. For the first time I felt myself looking at her in a different way, I watched her gush over people and it was a bit annoying, she also looked quite frumpy...it felt different. Through this 'self discovery' that follow has opened up for me, I have really had to think about what my truth is and it is to have a future with my husband, I know this is what I want, our relationship does need some tlc and I am now trying to work on that. I truly hope that I don't slip backwards, the 'person' really has a way of getting to the core of me and she has taken up SO much of my head space over the last few years. I am going to try and just live with it and except it for what it is, live with it in the now and right now it feels like time to let go.

HappyTitChick Tue 05-Mar-13 10:35:40

Outta - loved your post; I read such a happier mood and positivity too. Good luck.

amibi Tue 05-Mar-13 14:51:43

Just wanted to say hi to everyone on this thread. I already know some of you smile

I was on one of the turning tavern threads before and it genuinely helped me discover who I really am. I never realised I didn't know who I was tbh, but since meeting my girlfriend 5 months ago, I finally feel like me. I'm in love, which I now know I've never really been before, I'm happy and I've found my soulmate, which is something I never really believed in. What I learnt more than anything though is to stop worrying about labeling my sexuality. There is no need to. I fell in love with a person and like many people on these threads have already said, gender is kind of irrelevant, which may sound odd when you're still in the process of trying to make sense of your feelings, which are often very intense. When these feelings are so new, it's normal to put too much emphasis on gender, why wouldn't you?.....Yes, I'm incredibly sexually attracted to my girlfriend, but my emotional connection we share is like nothing I've ever experienced before, but I don't necessarily believe that it's because she's a woman and not a man. I hope that makes sense.

So I think the advice I would give anyone who suddenly finds themselves struggling to come to terms with their unexpected feelings for a member of the same sex, is to stop worrying about that side of things. Start asking yourself, is that person right for you? Can you see it really developing? Is it just an infatuation? Above all though, if you realise that you've found something special, don't let it go.

outtaleftfield Tue 05-Mar-13 21:47:55

Hi amibi That is such great news that things have worked out for you so well. I agree gender is kind of irrelevant. You fall in love with the person. Actually it was really helpful that you put those questions in your post, it made me think about 'the person' and if I am honest, no she isn't right for me?, certainly not in the long term, I can't see it developing, it hasn't for 3 years really, so unlikely to now, is it just an infatuation? no she shook me to my core, it is truly unbelievable when this happens to you for the first time. However, I don't think I have found something special in her though, i think she simply reminds me of who I used to be.

Muchadoaboutnuthing Wed 06-Mar-13 19:12:53

Hi everyone. Looking for a bit of support at the moment and can't talk to anyone in "real" life so its great to find this thread. I've been married for 12 years and have 2 children. I've fancied women on and off my whole life really but met my dh young (I was 18) and went on to do the whole marraige and children bit quite quickly so never really had the opportunity to pursue my feelings. In all honesty I'm not even sure why I got married. I do love my dh,
but as the years go on we seem to be growing further and further apart.

I recently met a woman who I have completely fallen for. We have to see each other a couple of times a week and always have a quick chat. I saw her the other evening and asked her if she wanted to go for a drink, I nearly fainted with shock when she actually said yes smile
Trouble is she's married as well and I'm fairly sure this is never going to go anywhere. i suppose I need to decide whether I can live with just being friends and having the occasional drink and chat or whether its just going to be too difficult and I should stop now. I'd still have to see her (it's work related but in a very roundabout way, we don't actually work together) but could probably cut out the chats etc.

But I really like seeing her. My whole personality has changed since I met her, even my mum commented to me the other day that I seem happier. (I reacently changed jobs so everyone's putting it down to that). I've never told any of my friends/family that I'm bi so i can't talk about this with anyone. The whole thing is taking up SO much headspace, i can't seem to stop thinking about her. I have actually never felt like this before and it's freaking me out a bit.

HappyTitChick Thu 07-Mar-13 08:39:04

Hi Muchado, so when's this drink? I think you need to use the opportunity to talk, to get to know her better, to see if there is chemistry. Don't rush, don't be too candid. Treat it as nothing more than friends out for a drink. As with all relationships, connection is key.
Does your husband know of your past & present attraction to women? I am sure that, if you do love your husband, as much consideration as posssible needs to be exercised.
Small steps start new journeys. I wouldn't plan the end game but enjoy your thoughts about her and delve deep to find what you want.

Muchadoaboutnuthing Thu 07-Mar-13 18:11:29

Happy we went for a drink on monday night, the day I actually asked her. I was in the place where she works and I was finished what I was doing. I wasn't sure if she was still working or not so I asked her if she wanted to go for a drink some time. She said yes and said she could go then. It was good, she was drinking, I wasn't as I was driving. She thanked me at the end and said she really enjoyed herself and said we should do it again some time. I told her to give me a call whenever she wants and we can arrange something, I kind of don't want to be the one to ask again if that makes sense?

I saw her once this week since then and had a chat, I was up to my eyes in work though so couldn't stay long. I do love my husband and I love my children to pieces and don't want to break their family up. It's just really confusing at the moment, I've really never felt this way before and its driving me mad. I don't even know what it is in particular about her, there's a fairly big age gap and we don't have a huge amount in common.

Dh does know I have been attracted to women before. He used to find it quite amusing but he's very possessive and I think if he thought there was someone I really liked he'd be (understandably) furious about it. He knows about this woman, knows we chat and knows I went for a drink with her. Part of me wants to just stop seeing her altogether but that would basically mean changing job which seems a bit extreme. I guess I should just wait it out and see what happens.

HappyTitChick Mon 11-Mar-13 18:13:19

Hi Muchado, sounds like you felt comfortable in the situation and she "really enjoyed herself". No awakwardness but you also say "we don't have a huge amount in common". I'm guessing you didn't really feel any chemistry or desire as you say "I don't even know what it is in particular about her". Mmmmm. I think I'd focus on my husband here and realise why I did marry him and whether I can be really happy with him. From whay I can see/read, you are perhaps a little bored in your marriage and this woman has excited you. Don't do anything drastic like change your job but turn your feelings to drive something positive into your life - improve your marriage, connection with your husband AND enjoy this new platonic friendship whilst exploring your inner needs and desires.

outtaleftfield Mon 11-Mar-13 19:25:17

Hi much It sounds like you are in a similar situation to where I have been, mine unfortunately carried on for a LONG time and has been really hard. Something has finally shifted in me though thank god. I too was aware that I didn't, if I was honest, have a lot in common with the woman I was fixated on, but still it was out of my control. This thread really helped, in particular the comments left by follow so THANK YOU again follow if you are still following this thread. Her words rang true with me, so read her posts above if you haven't already and leave things up to your heart and not to your head, takes some practice, but i think I have got there. What has happened for me has been extraordinary, I know now that I am bisexual, but that I have married a man I love and I want a future with him. If however, anything ever changes with us and I find myself single again, I am pretty sure that I would be open, infact possibly chose a relationship with a woman, who knows. My obsession with my woman definitely made me realise that, it also made me realise that I don't have enough passion in my life, I mean in my whole life, not just my marriage, so I am looking to retrain and possibly become a midwife, or a councillor and work around teenage pregnancy, a total departure from what I do now! follow said to trust the universe and you don't get given anything that you can't handle and she was right, I just needed to work out what it was that I was being shown. I hope you don't get as tangled up as I did, if I had had some words of wisdom earlier, things may not have gone on for so long.

Muchadoaboutnuthing Tue 12-Mar-13 11:16:06

Thanks for the replies. Outta I'm sorry to hear your situation has been so hard but on a purely selfish note it's great to hear that someone else has been through this too. I feel really isolated at the moment as there is noone I can talk to about this.

I totally get what you say about it being out of your control, thats how I feel as well. I just feel drawn to this woman for some reason in a way i have never felt to anyone else, male or female. I'm a bit of a control freak in the rest of my life so don't like feeling this way tbh. The days I see her and we chat etc i'm over the moon. If I feel she's been curt with me (can be when shes busy) or doesn't have time to talk it leaves me feeling really upset. It's more of an emotional attraction I think, I don't know if its actually sexual which is confusing me even more.

joescheckedshirt Wed 13-Mar-13 13:48:23

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Gay40 Wed 13-Mar-13 18:49:05

The TT does not condone cheating, lying or judging, while acknowledging that for some people the unexpected sexual attraction to women throws up an whole load of other issues.
We are hear to listen, share and give support where we can.

HappyTitChick Thu 14-Mar-13 00:56:16

Hi there joes. I haven't left my DH but I am in a relationship with a woman with his consent.
I had never thought about a polyamorist life (although had wondered why monogamy is the norm) and got married in my early 30s; thereby shelving my attraction to women alongside my attraction to other men. But, when passionately kissed by a new best friend, I HAD to talk to my DH and after much talk and a few hiccups, I am now deliriously happy to have a DH that I love even more and a gorgeous girlfriend.
Honesty, Connection and Communication are the only way. And these can start now.
Best of luck and remember your happiness should not be secondary to the equation.

Loveis Thu 14-Mar-13 21:35:47

Hi Joes - I can offer you some advice. You are welcome to PM me.

outtaleftfield Wed 20-Mar-13 15:28:09

Hi much I was wondering how you are? Has everything calmed down or got worse?!

Muchadoaboutnuthing Mon 25-Mar-13 17:29:47

Hi outta, things are much the same. I've tried to avoid seeing her as much as possible the last couple of weeks. I had to change my work rosta around alot to accomodate staff who were absent so its meant I managed to avoid the place I would usually see her without it causing me any problems from a work point of view.

I have missed seeing her and I know I will have to this week. My feelings haven't changed, I'm still as confused as I was when I first posted. Part of me wishes I had never met her, I don't want to feel like this. I thought I was happy in my marraige before but this has thrown me.

I've been trying what you and follow suggested about leaving things up to my heart as opposed to head, I'm getting a bit better as distracting myself when I'm starting to obsess think about her smile

outtaleftfield Mon 01-Apr-13 22:00:16

Hi much

I find when things aren't going so well with my husband, I start obsessing again. I was doing really well, but feel I have slipped backwards (me and my H haven't had a good weekend!!) It is really a nightmare as it can become so distracting. I know that I don't want a future with my lady, we don't have nearly enough in common for that to be a possibility, also I may not feature on her radar at all. I know that enough people have written on here and said that generally you can feel if there is an attraction and i have felt enough to know that something is going on. What has happened for me through this is I realise that I am probably bisexual and as i have written before if my situation ever changes I would consider a relationship with a woman. My big problem is that when I slip backwards and start obsessing again it really upsets me and I so want to be free of it. I know my marriage needs work and I am trying hard to make us closer, we have been together for 20 years and I can't imagine my life without him. But, when my mind starts going it really stirs me up and I wonder if I should just sit down with her and tell her what I am going through, I don't want a run off into the sunset scenario, so won't feel disappointed if she has never felt anything for me, I mean that, it would be embarrassing, but perhaps this would burst the bubble and set me free. I would love to hear from anyone that has done this and what the outcome was?

I don't know what helpful advice to give you, other than just cut all contact if you can, same would apply to anyone you are seriously attracted to, unless you are in a position to do something about it. I can't do this, I would love to be able to know that I would never have to see her again.

followyourjoy Mon 01-Apr-13 22:36:29

Hi Outta....haven't been on the thread for a while but thought I'd pop up and say hello. Things have obviously moved on for you which is great, but I guess you now want to move it all on a stage further, ie. have some kind of closure. It sounds like you have your head screwed on and are totally in a different zone to before. You've already pretty much accepted that you wouldn't have a future with this lady so that's clear. As your crush has gone on for some time, it's probably become a little addictive & maybe releases dopamine into your system, and you only fall back on it when you're not getting on with your husband...so that tells you it is not really about her but about the feeling associated with the crush. (Only maybe, I could be way off course here.)
I reckon you are ready to talk to her about it and face the consequences. Taking a risk is the only way to really move on, otherwise it will carry on being same old, same old. Life is about taking risks.......you either have a breakdown or a breakthrough! Be brave and empower yourself, you will feel great just for getting it out of your mind, you will feel free. Don't even worry about her, you don't want anything from her and you can't control her reaction, you're doing this for your well-being and for your personal growth. You will both learn something.... Good luck!

outtaleftfield Mon 01-Apr-13 23:13:23

FOLLOW!!!

So great to hear from you!! You always 'pop up' just when i really need you! Yes, very much thanks to you I have moved on, wow....It has been a mad couple of months, I have made some great decisions, a big one is to retrain in a different field, alongside what I already do ( this i genuinely don't think I would have done if it hadn't been for you telling me that I was being given a gift and that the universe doesn't give you something you can't handle) I realised that I had to turn the chaos into something positive and that I need more passion in my life and although I am not hugely happy living where I live, I could make it into a positive time of my life, stretch myself and make it work for me.

I have also realised that although I find this person very physically attractive, I do not want a future with her and you are totally right, i obsess when I am not happy in my marriage, it feels a bit like a kind of self harm thing. ( That sounds really crazy and I am really not that crazy!) I must get some kind of fix from it in a negative way. The councillor I have been talking to has been treating it like an addiction and has discouraged me from talking to her about it, but I am a sensible person most of the time and honestly what harm can come of me just getting it off my chest? Just saying calmly how I have feltl? I don't want her to declare undying love for me, I don't know what I hope to achieve but you are right, i desperately want some kind of closure. I am so glad that you think I am ready to talk to her, I don't think she will take it too well, she will laugh it off and probably make me think I was imagining things ( I remember her kissing me on the lips enough times though!) She has always tried not to spend time with me on our own too so this could be a challenge in itself!

I am still very undecided as in no way want to risk making things even worse for me, but you have given me strength (no Pressure!) and i think it could be a risk worth taking.

You are one cool woman, thank you smile

followyourjoy Tue 02-Apr-13 19:42:27

Outta thanks for the warm welcome! Its great that i might have helped you a little bit...I'm really pleased for you that you've turned a corner, and I think it's always good to stretch yourself, to jump out of your comfort zone....retraining sounds good!

I think you've moved on so much from before and the thing about declaring your feelings to your wiq, I think you really need to tune in and ask yourself will this really help you, or will it create complications that will send you reeling off course. Only you know the answer to that, but really I think these things have a way of sorting themselves out, and you don't have to worry or stress about it. Sounds like you have a mission to get her on her own anyway. I do think that bringing things out into the open would move it on, but it may not be in the way you expect. However, life is about taking risks and that's what it really means to be alive...otherwise nothing would ever shift, everything would be dull and dead. You don't know the outcome, but you CAN control your reaction to it, and how you move forward...ie. it doesn't have to make things worse for you, only YOU can make things worse for you...she doesn't have that power over you. I think you need to feel this on a deep level before you approach her. Basically there is no riht and wrong way of doing things, there is just a kind of flow to everything and its whether you are strong enough and relaxed enough to really follow your true path and deal with everything that comes your way. Sometimes we just are too scared or too expectant of a certain outcome. Then I'd say make sure you are in your higher self, and do it from the right place. Hope that helps.....

I'm sure the feelings come and go as to whether to say anything or not. It sounds like your life will move on when you start your new venture, job whatever, and you'll meet new people and maybe she will fade into the background finally?

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