Xmas Triggering Old Stress With Mother

[NamingtonChangersons]

I am a longterm poster, but have NCed. I don't know how to start this... Xmas is triggering a lot of sadness for me. I have a lovely DP and 18 month DS and we are v excited about making Xmas magical for him. A few days ago, when chatting about the festive season, DP casually started reminscing about his childhood Xmasses and saying how he feels a bit wistful that as an adult you never again get to feel that wonderful feeling of magic and the whole world seeming safe and lovely, etc., etc. I thought about the Xmasses of my childhood and realised that not only did I never feel that at Xmas, I never really felt it ever. Ever since then, I feel really overwhelmed with grief for myself as a small child, however self-indulgent that is.

This is going to be very long, but I just want to get it out somewhere, even if no-one replies (although I hope they do).

I think what I really want is to know the opinions of outsiders on the stuff that's upsetting me; like I want to know if I'm being oversensitive and silly or if it's bad. I didn't suffer any sexual or physical abuse at all, and had parents who love each other a lot and got on well, great extended family and a nice DB. Solid middle class background, blah blah. My parents loved us a lot... But my Mother loved me far too much. Still does, in fact. She is a very clever and creative woman who has mever been successful and is always been frustrated by life. I have always felt, right from being tiny, that I only exist to be something for her - a family joke (I don't laugh) is that even aged as young as 2, I would get v upset and yell "Me not your dolly, mummy!". Of course, no-one knew what I meant, but it's been the pattern of my whole life; being the thing that cheers her up, gives her meaning and motivation. She needs constant approval and recognition and appreciation from me. But not even a genuine thank you or compliment is enough - if I am not gushing, then she is angry or crying, saying I hate her, I'm cold, etc. She doesn't treat my brother this way and certainly doesn't treat him like he's a lesser child, she just doesn't require him to be whatever she's missing inside and he's always been allowed to just be himself. Ironically, having a bit less of the stifling attention has led to him being far happier and more successful than me.

She really has always treated me like a non-sexual third party in her marriage. My father is really insensitive and not one for talking about feelings, etc., so she uses me for her emotional needs, always has. This also involves moaning endlessly to me and sharing all sorts of details (thankfully, never sexual ones).

Okay, so I'm getting to the point now, I do apologise for being so long. Every Xmas, she insisted that all my grandparents came, to make it a special family Xmas. She would make big plans and refuse all help, even to the point where me and my brother would practically be in tears asking to help because she was so stressed. Did I mention yet that she is a martyr, grrr?! The thing is, that she would constantly moan to me for ages before Xmas, during it and afterwards, and even at other times in the year, about how she hates Xmas, how the very mention of it makes her feel suicidal, how everyone takes her for granted, and so on. Going into minute detail of how hard every tiny aspect is, belabouring how stressful all the shopping and cooking was, you name it. She did and still does, this weird thing where she will sort of screech and get tearful and manic if people try to talk about Xmas being nice. It goes without saying that she would then expect me to have a wonderful time on Xmas day, and be full of the carefree magic and awe that my DP mentioned, and of course, I couldn't, being all too aware that she was suffering (or so she said). Then she would lose her temper at me for being ungrateful and I'd be the focus of all her anger and stress about Xmas. I just couldn't win! Oh, and she also told me that Santa Claus didn't exist when I was 4 because she thought it unfair that I didn't know it was her and Dad putting in lots of thought, money and effort! My Dad went ballistic at that and my brother was allowed to believe in him as long as he could do.

This year she is just as bad, although somehow managing to get all excited about Ds's Xmas, taking him to see Santa, etc. When she has started moaning, I've told her that I don't want to hear it, because she always does it and that it's not going to rewrite the past, she has to let it all go, it was her choice to do all that in the past,but above all, it's not fair on me to keep hearing all this shit about my childhood. She then gets upset and says, with genuine surprise, "but who else am I supposed to tell it to, then?!". Then the tears and anger start, apparently I hate her, I've never loved her, I make her want to die, blah.

I just can't cope. As she gets older, she wants to moan and bitch to me even more and it's hellish. I don't want to exist to be her free counsellor. I guess what I want to know is, for my own reference and so I never repeat it with my child, what is a normal level of how much a child should know about a parent's stress and unhappiness, how bad do people think her behaviour is, and above all, coping strategies. Cutting her out of my life is not an option. She is otherwise lovely and I have health issues which mean that I need help from my parents in the day quite often. My Ds also adores her.

Thanks for getting to the end!

[CogitOCrapNotMoreSprouts]

Her behaviour is very selfish and very very extreme, although I recognise some of the elements... martyrdom, sharing TMI, complaining that no-one cares, the 'suffocating' controlling aspect... in my own DM.

The only coping mechanisms I've developed are a thick skin and a sharp tongue. Bit like a toddler, pick your battles to start with & learn what to ignore. Don't 'feed' the minorly irritating stuff by responding either negatively or positively. Blank expression. Close down any moaning and bitching flat when she gets started on favourite subjects, even if you're risking tears and tantrums by doing so. "I'm not interested in X so leave it". Be firm.

[HotDAMNlifeisgood]

Oh my god. Poor you. Seriously. As a child, you were being required to parent your mother : to be responsible for her emotional well-being.

And even now, she sees you as an extension of her, not as a person in her own right who is entitled to set boundaries with her and to say "no".

I recommend therapy, if you can afford it.

Also, have a read of this book. I think you'll find your mother in chapter 7, "The Smotherer".

[NamingtonChangersons]

Thanks, Cogito, you always give sound advice. I've been doing the blank thing with smaller stuff, which works because she tries to moan about smaller stuff in a jovial 'life's a bitch, eh?' tone, and I pretend to not get that she's wanting lots of sympathy and congratulate her on coping and not being a moaner, as that means that she'll make herself look bad if she then flips it and gets mad.

I do the other stuff too, but she won't drop it. She then wails to my father who has the fucking cheek to tell me off for not caring about my Mum. I am currently in his bad books for, the last time, she went off on one and he told me off, pointing out to him in no uncertain terms that a) HE should be the one she tells all this stuff to, not letting her dump it all on me so he can have an easy life, sacrificing my emotional needs for his and b) If he actually listened to her and, moreover, if he would stop enablng her for a fucking second, he might have either encouraged her to get some counselling or told her to sort herself the fuck out decades ago.

Everything then becomes about how I'm difficult, ungrateful, uncaring, etc. I also try to make nice for the sake of my son. I honestly don't think she knows how to engage with me unless she's getting me to feed her narcissistic supply, be that endlessly fishing for compliments or telling herself I'm a horrible, cold daughter when she loves me so much. I guess I need to be even firmer - if I'm going to get called cold for not indulging her, then I guess I might as well actually be a bit cold, eh?!

[NamingtonChangersons]

Hotdamn, I am waiting for Psychotherapy on the NHS to start in Feb. All the talking in the initial assessments really opened up wounds and I'm here stuck with them metaphorically bleeding all over me and I struggle to keep them closed. I think you have summed it up really well, that I had to parent her. I've long thought (have actually told her before now), that it's been like I've been parented by a particularly hormonal 13 yr old girl. Will check out that book, thank you.

I am quite gobby and do tell her she's out of line and why (I studied psychology at Uni), but it doesn't change things.

[HotDAMNlifeisgood]

No, and it won't change things - as you well know since you studied psychology - because she doesn't want to change, does she?

The Stately Homes thread on this board has plenty more resources on the first post, and it is a safe place for you to bleed all over from your emotional wounds while you wait for your therapy to start. Congratulations on getting that set up, by the way.

[AlmostAChristmasHipster]

I do empathise - I have a very similar relationship with my mother and I have no wise words, I'm afraid. I wish I did but just know that you're not alone x

[CogitOCrapNotMoreSprouts]

"if I'm going to get called cold for not indulging her, then I guess I might as well actually be a bit cold, eh?!"

You've no choice really. Pity that your father is backing up her childish/bullying behaviour. My Dad and I have always had a bit of a pact in that regard! But yes, be as cold, distant, hard-faced as you like and don't take any criticism from either parent. They're taking advantage of the fact that you can't walk away and leave them to it.

[fuzzpig]

Oh Namington :( it sounds really awful. Childhood doesn't have to be horrific and full of physical/sexual abuse to leave lifelong scars (and I say that as an abuse survivor). And it's ok to grieve. You are grieving for a lost childhood.

And you are not being self indulgent by being upset/talking about this. Just the fact that you are even asking if you should be feeling like this is a sign that you have never been allowed to feel your own feelings. You have spent your life being smothered and guilt tripped for feeling anything that wasn't under your mother's control.

HotDAMN has it absolutely right, I have been expected to parent my own mother too. She does have friends but for some reason needs to use me as a counsellor. Including details of her emotional affair, an actual affair before I was born, and the sordid details of sexual problems with my dad. I should not have to hear that. Why the hell should I be expected to support her when she has never supported me, her child?!

Regarding Christmas - of course you want to make it magical for your little boy, and it will be. It's ok to be sad too though. Don't put pressure on yourself to make it perfect, because you don't need to, and IME it only leads to upset! You are breaking the cycle by confronting this and that is a big deal - you should be proud :)

[NamingtonChangersons]

Thanks, everyone, for such supportive replies. People giving me uncomplicated, unconditional support and niceness feels a little strange, although fab :)

I AM breaking the cycle. I work every day on not letting my DS be the be all and end all of my life. I mean, he is, but in a healthy, nurturing, positive way. Strangely, apart from snapping at DP, which I am working on, I find it very easy to parent in a way that feels very nurturing and wholesome to me and I am very vigilant about not expecting too mich from DS or making him responsible for my emotions. I think it's because you really do learn on the job when you have kids, so, for me, I've brought a surprisingly small amount of baggage into it, and the baggage tends to be me perhaps being a bit too hippy-dippy, which is no bad thing, I guess.

As for how I handle Mum, it's hard. The 2 factors that make it so difficult are these: 1) She has an obsession, there is no other word for it, that EVERYONE is telling her off. If she is in one of her moods and someone politely and discreetly tells her that she has a bit of food stuck in her teeth, they are telling her off and her world is over and she is bizarrely humiliated. Any attempt, however sweetly, to not engage with her shit is telling her off. It is exhausting. Not only is it pathetically immature, it handily shuts down any attempt to not indulge and enable her.
2) My Dad. They are virtually always together. Any form of assertiveness towards her shit makes him bellow at me, be really nasty, tell me I am a terrible daughter, I'm mentally ill, he storms out, etc. Again, he shuts down any behaviour that is not enabling them both, even if that actual behaviour would be perceived as actually very nice and loving by everyone else! I can be talking quite mundanely about some trivial matter, or something in the news, say, and my Mum will suddenly screech his name, because she's suddenly perceived some slight in what I've said( or often merely because it's boring her, I think), and then he'll verbally lay into me. I've tried tackling him calmly and coolly after the event innumerous times, but he insists that if my mother is upset then I must be at fault. Whether he genuinely can't see how ridiculous that is or refuses to, I can't tell and it's immaterial anyway, when the result is the same. I've also asked him how come her feelings need protecting and not mine, when she is the mother and I am the (albeit adult) child, but he just gets confused and says things like 'me and your mother are a team. We agreed when she was pregnant that we'd always show a united front'. Which is great, but not when it means letting your partner be shit to their child. Also, if he is ever twattish, my mum has no qualms about telling him to pack it in (one of her more functional points, I think).

Then they go away and tell themselves what a strange, ungrateful, mentally unstable daughter I am, who is always telling them, making them feel bad about themselves, trying to dictate their behaviour and prevents us all getting on. Of course, they love me fiercely, but it's a shame I'm that way And, of course, they have no idea how on earth I got that way!