How not to get into silly games…..

[curiousgeorgia]

I've heard the gas lighting term used often and although I've read a lot about it's effects I'm not sure?.

So this is a bit of how it is. He is charming and caring, attentive and committed to a future (indeed has begun moving in, bit by bit, although rather sooner than I'd anticipated it has to be said).

Yet when I open up and make myself vulnerable (about my insecurities - we all have them) he seems to go off the radar for a bit and I'm left wondering what that's about. I don't chase him after the first text to say hi, I wait. He tends to avoid conversations that he finds difficult himself.

Our shared vision of where we're at is not the one he tells other people, namely family. It's a partial version. For that reason I have made it clear I will not make our plans public with my family until he decides he can do the same - openly and with us there together.

I AM NOT OW and never have been, although I have been the injured party in a rather seedy love triangle of my ex's making !!!!!!!!!!

I hate game playing and don't want to feel as though this is what is happening - but my usually razor sharp mind is, to say the least confused.

[CogitoErgoSometimes]

Moving in unasked would bother me. Disappearing rather than talk about personal matters suggests immaturity and emotional coldness. Adjusting the story for his family suggests he's not totally convinced.

If I'm honest I'd worry that I was being used until something better came along. Charming, caring and attentive could just be good sales tactics

[stainesmassif]

Doesn't sound good from what you've written here.

[stainesmassif]

How long have you been together? What's his relationship history?

[curiousgeorgia]

Together a year both of us having had long marriages previously.

i was totally faithful and he says he was too.

[CogitoErgoSometimes]

I'm not seeing infidelity. He just reminds me of an old boyfriend who was very pleasant, suddenly got a lot more pleasant when he saw my lovely home, started making plans to move in and yet didn't tell anyone in his family (he had an ex) that we were going out together. He was also very keen to bore me stiff with his problems and yet had no time whatsoever for mine. Ditched him...

[olgaga]

If I were you, curious, I'd get a couple of crates to keep all his stuff in, rather than have them lying around in any integrated kind of way!

When he asks you why, you can tell him you haven't made up your mind about him moving in, and wanted to keep his stuff separate in an organised manner in case of any confusion!

[stainesmassif]

Trust your own judgement. You're picking up on some subtle signals.

[stainesmassif]

Re read. Not subtle. Run away!

[EHoneybadger]

Bloody hell cogito your ex sounds exactly like somebody I saw for a short while recently except I don't think my house was quite beautiful enough and he didn't like my dog.

curious he does sound a bit unreliable, I'd be cautious in getting too attached until he is more open.

[curiousgeorgia]

cog I also have a lovely home in a lovely part of the country. He is mad keen to get away from his area.

Sounds quite a familiar scenario actually .

staines thanks, because it's the subtlety that I find confusing. I've heard nothing since yesterday lunchtime despite having had a 'heart to heart' (read - he wanted me to bear all) and yet he could walk through the door as if nothing's happened.

I've often thought he isn't convinced but feeds me enough to keep me there. But then I think it's paranoia from my marriage breakdown. That's what is a bit maddening tbh.
Thanks though, this helps.

[curiousgeorgia]

I think it's time I sat and thought about whether we're as compatible as it only feels sometimes that we are (i.e. when we're together)

[curiousgeorgia]

Sorry about poor sentence structure - am a bit worried in case he just turns up while I'm on here!

[CogitoErgoSometimes]

You know this guy better than we do from a few pencil sketches. But yes there are quite a few (MN word alert) cocklodgers who are only too willing to share your lovely lifestyle for as long as it suits. :) Listen to your gut instinct and if something feels 'wrong'... and it doesn't have to be rational, far from it... then keep him on hold until you're more confident about his motives.

[stainesmassif]

If you're second guessing one year in it just doesn't bode well IME. Relationships shouldn't be fraught.

[curiousgeorgia]

Funny enough I told him about my ex 'cocklodging' with his affair partner.

He found that hugely funny and then began using that term with me - until I made him shut the fuck up but he still thinks it 's a big joke though!

Thing is I love him. I don't like the idea that some of the posters comments are spot on because I know what I'll have to do. And what if I'm wrong?

[stainesmassif]

Be honest with him - you've nothing to lose and your instincts seem pretty good.
He's rushing into the move together.
He's doesn't seem to be as open about your relationship with others as you would expect.
He expects you to reveal your vulnerabilities but disengages when you do. This is the worst bit for me.
You're entitled to your opinion about your relationship -listen to yourself!

[IllageVidiot]

It seems like your concern over paranoia from your marriage breakdown is actually doing a bit of a number on you - instances of hypervigilance, then rationalising things away and dulling down the signals from your other 'behaviours that are not good' radar.

Being aware of your own behaviour - I might overreact to xyz, am I taking this wrongly- is indicative of actually being much more emotionally astute than you give yourself credit for.

He doesn't sound great. He is holding you emotionally at arms length (particularly detaching from you in public) while physically using all available.
The bit that concerns me is he wanted you to have a heart to heart and know all your insecurities, vulnerabilities etc but didnt reciprocate and then off he goes.

I don't think you can be 'wrong' about behaviour that gives you concerns, however minor they seem as one offs all together they build a picture. It's easy from outside when reading only someone's faults to think and judge more harshly but, and it is a big but, they type of faults a person has can be hugely indicative.
His don't seem very nice.

Listen to your feelings and don't dismiss yourself because you are worried about emotional hangovers. Do you trust in the self-esteem you have now? Do you really believe you have the right to be treated respectfully - if you know you may be wobbly on these then remember how they conspire to talk you away from your best judgement. If it helps be dispassionate - would that be acceptable to me if my friend said her DP did x? If you were my friend I would say - no.

[curiousgeorgia]

Oh illage you have it and that's .

You see, everyone else tells me how straight forward, emotionally honest and yes - astute - I am but in a year I have felt my grip (and my self esteem)slipping away, coming back and now slipping away again.

i know he doesn't sound great but he can be lovely. Yet in some degree I see lots in him that if my friends knew about they probably wouldn't be keen - but it's not majorly bad stuff. So that's whats kept me thinking "I can handle this, I'm assertive and whilst he isn't yet here full time i get breathing space or I can choose to not to respond to his calls until I am ready".

I don't think he is "bad" but I do think he likes to be in control and I know he needs to be needed. I want to be needed too, but it feels like the balance is all one-way as his life is so closed off from me.

I know. But it hurts because the beginning was the best thing to have happened to me in years.

[MuthaHubbard]

Curious - are you me?! In a scarily similar situation with a very similar sounding bloke and me being rather like you (straight forward etc) and things being so good at the beginning....reading thread with notebook interest.....

[ErikNorseman]

He's ruining your self esteem and you feel like you have to 'handle' him. Really? That doesn't sound good at all.

[curiousgeorgia]

mutha how do you feel and what do you do?

Recently I made it clear that there are some things that I'm just not happy about and and can't accept in a relationship (ANY relationship). It wasn't a 'manoeuvre' or point scoring exercise and is entirely congruent with who I am.
His response was to say he completely understood and agreed it isn't acceptable but then went on to say he'd do something about it if it made ME happy!

Of course his situation and how he deals with it was there before I came along and he does what he's always done because it's worked for him before. But in my mind he agreed it was not ok, said he'd put it right and then abdicated all responsibility - hence if the consequences aren't favourable for him (or us) it will be all my fault!!!!

That's what I think bothers me - nothing is his fault and he is trying his best for everyone. It's very persuasive, and makes drawing boundaries harder.

Do you find that mutha?

[Dahlen]

It's always better to walk alone than badly accompanied.

The moving in without a proper long chat about it resulting in both of you being fully committed and excited about it is a MAJOR red flag.

I'm sure he can be lovely and charming, but I VERY strongly suspect that once he's in and his feet are under the table, you would find the facade slipping.

I'm really sorry, but try to think of it as a lucky escape and proof that your bullshit radar IS working.

[curiousgeorgia]

I agree Dahlen.

And actually since I haven't seen him most of this week - I've had plenty time to reflect on exactly what it LOOKS like I may be getting in to. That's why I decided to post.

The moving in thing is something we talked about for a while. I moved into my own house a couple of months ago having sold the family home as part of a divorce settlement. He is drifting between a relative's home and mine sometimes calling it 'ours' sometimes calling it 'yours'. But he suddenly needed to 'move in' a couple of weeks ago when things took an unexpected turn at his own house. It was late at night, I said ok, but then discovered that the situation had developed much earlier on in the day when he could have told me and we'd have been able to talk the options over???..

I need to write this down so that I can be a bit more sensible, protect myself and not loosen any more boundaries.

[curiousgeorgia]

thing is he is like a jekyll and hyde - and that's what makes it harder. No one is perfect least of all me, and perhaps we're not as compatible as I would like us to be.

[CogitoErgoSometimes]

Jekyll and Hydes are not good people to be around IMHO because you can end up manipulated and confused. 'When they are good, they are very very good and when they are bad, they are horrid'..... tends to mean that you make excuses for the 'horrid', doubting your judgement, rationalising things as a one-off, a bad day or - as you did with the sudden moving in incident - an unexpected turn. And you tolerate all of this because they are lovely the rest of the time, you like them and want to be accommodating. However, as someone said up-thread, the danger of this type of person is that, once they have their feet under the table, Mr Jekyll gradually takes more of a back seat and Mr Hyde is around more often. The irony is that you're so used to it by then that you don't even notice the transition.

As you say, you're a strong, intelligent, assertive woman. But you're already wondering if you've arrived at this point voluntarily or because he's very persuasive. To me that's a legitimate concern that you should listen to. Out of interest, what does he do for a living?