Mumsnet Talk

Are you ok?

OP I sincerely hope you aren't picking him up and dusting him off .

He felt good about himself after counselling...hmmm...he got to talk about himself a lot and have someone 'validate his feelings' I expect.

Not. The. Point.

You don't need this.

You and your kids deserve better.

Choose a brighter, happier future.

You don't want a divorce.

Yet.

So right now, unlock the loo and come out like a grown-up.

Start talking and be honest. Tell him that you'll watch and wait to see what he does over the next few months without having to be told and you'll start getting on with your own life.

If he does what's necessary without a broom up his arse or the constant idle threats of divorce, you'll be in a stronger position to make a decision once you've got your own self back on track.

By that time, you might find you don't want him. Either way, assuming he walks the talk and you reinvent yourself, you'll both be better people and parents, either together or apart.

OP tell him to go.

Agree again with bad.

You are not ready to follow through. Like I said, this is another part of the dance. Take a step back.

What is your first, honest gut reaction? To shun him but deep down think "at last he's seeing how good we are, that's exactly what he needs to do"?

Bugger what he needs to do. What YOU need to do is detach your mind from his. Think for yourself.

You have two choices. Either accept him exactly as he is OR do something different which is only about you.

And I'm fine actually, thank you for asking OP. I didn't need to be strong. I think you can dump the idea that you have to be strong to get rid of this fuckwit. Because if you subscribe to that idea you will never do it whilst you are engaged in trying to change him. That will only sap your energy and leave you feeling weak. I just took a step back and began observing him.

It was easy after that.

Have locked myself in the loo to type this on my phone. He is waiting for me downstairs and thinks he can talk me round again.

I am so exhausted. I used to be strong and capable and I really hope that one day I can be that way again.

I want a divorce , I can't see any other way (to avoid ending up in a straight jacket)I. Help me not to cave in ...

Good for you OP

Seems he only agreed to do what you want him to when he absolutely has to.. He should have been begging you when you needed it, not just because you are now sticking up for yourself! Take control... It can only get better! Look after yourself hun x

Please stop these knee-jerk threats that you don't have the strength for just yet to follow through on.

You're not yet there yet to say you want a divorce and he knows it.

Being smart means getting the means together to live an independent life.

Making sure that you get your full share of equity if you own your house and it has to be sold. Or getting to keep it for a few more years if you've got very young children and FT work's going to be difficult right now. If you've got older kids but have shelved your career, taking steps to make a new one or get back to where you left off. Re-training, upskilling. Getting out there and meeting new people, or re-connecting with those who you once valued, but fell by the wayside when you did the whole married with kids malarkey. More immediately, get some therapy of your own to help with your your shattered, roller-coaster emotions and lost dreams.

The only caveat to this plan is don't do it if you're still hoping he'll miraculously change and it will all come right in the end.

Assume he won't.

If he does, promise yourself the only conditions will be that he gets his act together, gets some proper therapy and owns up to being a selfish dick all his life and realises that's why he can't keep it in his pants.

This bloke didn't get like this overnight.

There will have been 100 examples of shitty, entitled behaviour where he's put himself first over the years. Look back and recognise them for what they were. Stop idealising him as ever being a great husband and father. He might have passed for a reasonable one at times, but I doubt he's ever been 'great'. Look at your whole marriage in the round.

Oh Besame, well done you, how did you get the strength? Are you alright?

He's just come home and I told him I want a divorce. He got down on bended knee and begged me to give him another chance. Saying how good we are together when things are going well (and we are) but I just can't forget what he's done to our marriage and our family. Says how he'll go to the STI clinic and love me for the rest of my life. I think I'm done though. Someone tell me how to be strong because I have nothing left. Thanks. X

FWIW by the way, I kicked out my DP on yesterday. Compared to your sorry-arsed bloke mine was an angel and he drove me INSANE!!!!!
So it can be done.

OK I now have a large .

I think bad is right too. If you want to show how smart you are you could, for a start, step back a bit from the situation. Act like an observer to what is happening with Mr Gobshite. Treat it like a series of dance steps - one does one step and the dance partner does another accordingly - and so they fit together in a series of movements. Picture it literally if it helps.

That's what you and he are doing. You know it so well you have forgotten how you learned it, it's like second nature. Well, all you have to do is notice how you respond to what he says (because he's DOING fuck all). Once you begin to see yourself in the dance you can do a different step next time. He can only do what he does to you because you are in it together, I'm afraid. You are enabling him to act like a twat. But you can stop that. You can't stop him being a twat but you can stop helping him to be one by stepping away.

When you can do that you'll begin to see what other's are seeing. HTH

Badinage you have hit the nail on the head, that is exactly what seems to happen. I feel like he gets me over a barrel and thar's when I end up feeling powerless and trapped. What do you mean about being smart? I have no self confidence left. How do I break away before he destroys me?

Stop reacting.

Just be.

What happens when you do these knee-jerk, emotional responses is that you regret them later - and all your power gets lost.

Do something different.

Pause for a moment and think about you.

Not him, not what he's done, not what you should do in the moment.

Get some help. Proper therapeutical help. Go talk to someone. Or several; therapists, solicitors, a good friend - and rant here.

Words from him are cheap. Actions speak louder. He's 'done' nothing much, apart from lie.

Practically speaking, how can you be smart here and break away from him?

Thanks to everyone who has replied tonight. I appreciate it more than I can ever tell you.

He texted a while ago from the pub to say how much he loves, adores and worships me. I don't care anymore, God forgive me.* Besame, you are right I am at my wits end and ashamed to admit that I was on the brink of admitting myself to hospital last night before I did something 'stupid' and to be honest, it's only my lovely boys stopping me. I feel so trapped. i am dying inside. think I want a divorce.

OP I have just read through your thread.

Your H has not even begun to work on saving your marriage. CBT does not address infidelity. So great, your H 'feels better' about himself whilst you sound utterly at your wits end.

He is beginning to lose patience with you because he clearly doesn't really feel remorseful for what he has put his family through. Cue, in the near future, another ONS which he'll convince himself is your fault.

He is not a good man. You don't need him and I believe your mental health is at risk if you don't detach from him very soon. You have DC's who need a DM who isn't overwhelmed and preoccupied by what their DF has done/is doing/may do.

TBH if I knew him I'd punch his fucking lights out.

kicked out for a while!

This is going to sound like an odd suggestion, but have you thought about 'just being'?

The kicking him out and letting him back isn't working. It must be as confusing as hell for the kids too.

Your husband's made a choice hasn't he? He knew what he should have done to start putting this right, but he hasn't. He's taken from this situation what's been helpful to him not you.

So you can make a response choice, can't you?

You can choose to be free of any expectations of him and get your own life in order so that you aren't co-dependant on him any longer.

You can focus on you for a while, not what he's done and what he still isn't doing.

You could get yourself some of your own expensive counselling. Pay for retraining. Rediscover old friends/interests, or find new ones. Reinvent yourself a bit.

Every action or inaction in your husband's case, has a consequence.

He can predict what's going to happen at the moment. Things seem to be good and he thanks fuck he got away with it all. Then you have a meltdown and he'll be icked out for a while. Then he'll be let back and the cycle repeats.

How about doing something different then?

Cos' this isn't working is it?

Seriously!!! Omg what does he think was going to happen? A few weeks go past and you'll be ok??

It does all seen to be about him.. My dh did something similar 2 years ago and I still have bad days!

I'm furious for you! He should be falling over himself to make you feel better I stead of trying to sweep it under the carpet.

I'm so sorry you are going through this

Ps. His stock answer is that that was then, he's learned from his mistakes and will be a better person from now on. I don't trust him or believe him.

Please, please, please help me. I don't think I can take much more of this.

Have been trying so hard to go about 'normal' life but I am falling apart. Managed 2 full weeks (wow) without a 'bad day' but have failed miserably the last few days. I am just so hurt and full of anger and I worry I will ever get past that. Husband says he doesn't know how to cope with me on a bad day, damned if he says anything, damned if he doesn't (true I suppose). He keeps asking me how long I will be like this as although he adores me, it's really bad for his mental health (!)

We went out with the boys today and I was fighting back tears. He tells me he loves me but he has obviously lost patience with me and feels I should be handling it better e.g. he complains that when I'm 'like this' he gets nothing from me, no chat, no warmth etc. It's all about him I think. How can I possibly have any wam feelings towards him when all I can see in my head is years of lies and deceit and manipulation.

Frankly, I think I'm almost past caring. We went to the chippy on the way home and he sniped at me again, trying to imply that I was deliberately not listening to him (I honestly didn't hear what he said). He had arranged to meet his friends to watch the rugby in the pub and said 'look if you don't want me to go, I won't'. So of course I said 'no that's fine, you go' even though he could see the tears in my eyes.

He seems to think that because he's said sorry and promised to never shag about behind my back again (sorry) that it makes it alright. Sometimes I still love him but generally I am utterly confused. The past few days I have felt so desperately unhappy that if it weren't for my boys I don't know know what I would have done. Sorry.

I am going through something very very similar and I think I feel much the same as you.

My cheating, lying bastard of a husband is currently going through psychotherapy to sort himself out and has miraculously become the model husband and father. Our 'marriage' has suddenly become everything I ever wanted (apart from the seperate bedrooms!)

You have has lots of great advice on here (which I should follow too!) But I just wanted to add that you are not the only one to feel so undecided when it 'appears' that their partner has changed. It is very difficult to be without the man you love and exhausting to be so torn in so many directions. It would be so much easier for you if he was still with the OW....or accidentally had that little tumble under the lorry.

I don't really know what I'm trying to say....don't beat yourself up for loving the man you spent 14 years with and who has fathered your children. You are supposed to love him because you are a normal, loving human. He is a bastard.

Yes, one of the most important things that a cheater needs to do is to address their personality traits that led to him choosing to have an affair - these could include selfishness, arrogance or entitlement.

It sounds like his counselling was gentle and not at all challenging, maybe the counsellor was inexperienced in the field of infidelity and instead was re-directed by your H to look at less painful things without him having to dig deep into himself? My DH found counselling very hard and at times painful as it was like looking in a mirror and he hated what he saw and he had to talk through difficult issues - he used to come home exhausted.

I am frankly disgusted that he refused to go for STI tests. I hope you are not having sex with him - he may be infected and he has not managed to pass it to you.

I would also expect FULL transparency and openness - no secret passwords, deleting of texts/emails etc.

I think you need to challenge him a lot more and pull him up on these things - e,g lack of transparency and access to his passwords, reading Not Just Friends (its a very hard book for the cheater to read so it does not surprise me that he doesn't want to read this properly), going for a full STI screening, and looking at himself in further depth.

I did! He's done the counselling (and says he finally feels good about himself now), says all the right things to support me, but won't read the book or go for an STI test (which I did and felt humiliated). I suppose that illustrates that despite what he says he's quite happy to go to counselling because it was 'rewarding' and he came away with good feelings about himself, but he is not willing to dig too deep, look at himself any further or really put himself out?