Bloody SATS

(465 Posts)
Ledkr Sat 11-May-13 08:33:11

I know they are important to schools but its madness at dds school. They've gone on and on at them a out it for months, extra homework, extra lessons and generally created a great deal of expectation and stress.
Poor dd gets migraines and they are currently rife due to her worry over sats. She thinks they will impact on her going to her already allocated secondary school.
Then yesterday she came out with a list her teacher had given them. Apparently it's bed early a d a good breakfast (preferably cooked) which obviously all children need everyday.
It seems ott to me but hey.
Anyone got any comparisons?

Sparklingbrook Sat 11-May-13 08:36:51

I'll second Bloody SATS Ledkr DS2 has been given the past papers homework pile from hell for the weekend. angry

Here is my stressy thread re pencils.

Secondme Sat 11-May-13 08:49:40

dd did SATS last year and they gave her a timetable for the week before along with breakfast ideas and a meal idea for the day before SATS started...confused
Timetable was stuff like 7;30am wake up, 8;00 good breakfast 9:00 school, etc. But it was completely different to everyone's timetable-everyone woke up at different time.

Ledkr Sat 11-May-13 09:16:34

Haha like we don't give then a good breakfast any other day.
I' might give dd mc ds brekkie every morning out of spite.
Why are they so obsessed?

spanieleyes Sat 11-May-13 09:23:21

I've told my year 6's to go and enjoy the weekend and NOT to do any homework! I run a breakfast club during SATs week ( because some of ours come to school without any!) and we play ball games for a bit before breakfast-just to wake us all up!
( Actually the reason we become "obsessive" is that OFSTED and parents judge schools on their results, the pressure on Year 6 teachers can be HUGE sad I want my Year 6's to do the best they can to show off, the school wants them to do the best they can to keep OFSTED from the door!

jellysmum77 Sat 11-May-13 09:25:08

They are so obsessed because sadly schools are judged on the results they get. The progress the children make doesn't matter anymore according to the new ofsted criteria, it's all about every child getting the expected level. Trust me, the teachers hate them as much as you and the children.

mrz Sat 11-May-13 09:42:02

We are providing breakfast before school (most won't have had breakfast at home) In past years we have opened the pool before school for a swim or splash around ...children have been told to relax definitely no homework.

Sparklingbrook Sat 11-May-13 09:46:05

I have just looked at DS's HW pile-

He has spellings (15) to be learnt by Thursday. Then select 5 of the words and write a sentence using them containing an adverb. adjective and connective and colour code them.

A past maths SATS paper.

A 9 page English paper about Synonyms and antonyms, superlatives and I and Me.

What a fun weekend. The maths paper looks hard.

mrz Sat 11-May-13 09:48:13

Obviously the school don't know a great deal about preparing for exams/tests Sparkling shock

Sparklingbrook Sat 11-May-13 09:49:18

But he has been doing past papers for months mrz. He is actually still asleep. I won't wake him up to do SATs stuff.

My DC's school and the school where I teach have given instructions only to have a relaxing weekend. Both do breakfast each day during SATs week.

The pressure on the school and the yr6 teachers is immense. Your pupils MUST show 2 levels of progress in KS2... OR ELSE! It's horrible sad. The teachers are stressed and sleepless. Every room has been booked out for the ones needing extra time and/or readers. Two members of staff for each group, even if it's just a single child. It impacts the entire school. We're ALL glad when it's over... school disco on Friday!

mrz Sat 11-May-13 09:56:31

Our pupils and staff are quite relaxed ... Y6 teacher and pupils just back from a Comenius visit to Turkey, swimming in the Med, climbing Mt Olympus and making new friends

Sparklingbrook Sat 11-May-13 10:06:56

I hated exams. Sitting at a desk in rows with the invigilator clopping up and down. All that 'turn your papers over' and 'ten minutes to go'. Makes me feel peculiar just thinking about it. That was at High School too.

When I was at DS1's school I saw one of those 'QUIET! Exams in Progress' signs and felt a bit sick. sad

muddysamazingyoni Sat 11-May-13 10:07:47

SATS are a swear word in this household at the moment. angry

I have sent DD away on pack holiday this weekend. Alot of the parents decided not to let their DDs go as they had revision to do.

My DD is so stressed by them. The school have been practising since after Christmas.

The school DD goes to in Sept. has their own test system as they know the primaries teach to the SATS and the DC are often lower than the grade achieved.

Roll on the end of next week. smile

Then DS2 starts his GCSE exams!!

Sparklingbrook Sat 11-May-13 10:10:13

DS2 doesn't go to High School til Year 8. I will be more interested in next year's CAT scores.

Snorbs Sat 11-May-13 10:20:13

My DD was supposed to be doing the level 6 SATs for both maths and English but I had to put a stop to maths. If she was pushed really hard she could probably have got a fair mark but the stress it was causing her really wasn't worth it. She's 11 FFS.

If she's going to be having sleepless nights I want it to be in excitement about something fantastic, not stress due to tests that won't have any real impact on her education.

When my DS did his SATs at the same school three years ago it wasn't anything like as pressured.

littlemiss06 Sat 11-May-13 11:11:25

Our schools been horrendous this year! Both my girls will be doing their Sats next week, one year two, one year 6 thankfully the little ones haven't been too bad but the older ones, they've had kids in tears with the stress, im lucky that my older daughter is so laid back, she was put in two groups for extra work as she's sitting level 6 as well and then on top of that the amount of past papers they've had to do has been unbelievable to the point they've barely had any free time, think the teacher must feel under so much pressure this year as she's been really off and more aggressive in her attitude to the kids which isn't like her. My other little girl has sen so im hoping its kept very low key and chilled out for her as she got pretty upset with a practice test in exam conditions. To be honest ill be glad when its over and done with so they can enjoy the rest of the year and fun things that are coming up

everlong Sat 11-May-13 11:17:21

Isn't the end result an overall assessment of the work they've done throughout the year, not just the sats paper?

Ds in in yr 2 and even at this young age I'll be glad to get May out the way.

Feenie Sat 11-May-13 12:11:49

No - in Y6 there are two results in Reading and Maths - a teacher assessment and a test result. It's teacher assessment only for writing and a test result only for the new SPAG.

The two results in Reading and Maths are supposed to have equal weighting, but they don't - OFSTED is only interested in the test results, and have planned their agenda around them before they even arrive.

everlong Sat 11-May-13 12:13:25

Sorry I meant for yr2 sats.

Sparklingbrook Sat 11-May-13 12:14:17

DS1 did them at the same school in 2010. I don't remember this level of stress from then.

spanieleyes Sat 11-May-13 12:30:24

It gets harder every year to escape the clutches of OFSTED! This year , it is expected that as a minimum standard, all schools should have at least 60 per cent of pupils at the end of Key Stage 2 achieving a level four or above in both English and mathematics( which is relatively easy to achieve) and not be below the median school scores for the percentage of pupils making expected progress between Key Stage 1 and Key Stage 2 in English and in mathematics. In 2012, the median school score for English was 92 per cent and for mathematics 90 per cent.
SO you need to be above average to be above floor targets, and so everyone has to be above average!!

jellysmum77 Sat 11-May-13 12:30:45

Year 2 report the teacher assessment level x.

lljkk Sat 11-May-13 12:47:21

Nothing, no stress, bit of excitement & nerves. School had a netball tournament this week. Maybe they were told to relax. DD & a bunch of other yr6 girls are meeting in town for shopping today.

DD says the reading test is hardest one so she's quite glad it's the first day, get it over & done with.

BooksandaCuppa Sat 11-May-13 13:33:46

Regardless of your take on how much pressure is acceptable in the few months beforehand (extra classes, past papers etc etc) surely only the dimmest teacher/Head could think extra work the weekend before is a good thing...I prescribe fun, sleep, playing, chilling and decent breakfasts all round for all year 6s this weekend!

Feenie Sat 11-May-13 13:40:38

I know a local headteacher who has promised the children who achieve the top two highest marks in the school £50 cash each.

How's that for pressure - not to mention elitism and bribery? shock

maresedotes Sat 11-May-13 13:44:23

DD1's teacher has told them to have the weekend off, thankfully. The last few months have been very full on though. I don't agree that it's partly the fault of parents because we are obsessed with a school's results. Wasn't a consideration with me for either of my children (different schools).

SATS results mean nothing to the child because they already know which school they're going to and they'll get more tests once they start secondary.

Also, once the SATS are over, the children concentrate on their production, week away and days out. There seems to be not much teaching involved.

BooksandaCuppa Sat 11-May-13 13:44:38

shock

fallenempires Sat 11-May-13 14:28:57

Ledkr it's the same at our schoolsad

Dancergirl Sat 11-May-13 16:10:16

What really bugs me about SATS is that at our school, if your child is ill during SATS week, they are phoned and encouraged to come in to do what they can!!

Sorry, if my child is too unwell for school then they're not coming in. Makes me bloody angry.

WilmaFingerdoo Sat 11-May-13 16:20:08

Oh fucking sats. Ds was in tears the other night. "Well it looks like i'm rubbish at maths then. I'll get a crap score and be in bottom set in high school" and on.

The kids don't really have a clue what these tests are for except that the pressure, after school revision clubs 3 times a week since march (compulsory) breakfast club next week (compulsory) is beyond the ridiculous.

WilmaFingerdoo Sat 11-May-13 16:21:52

Oh and ds class were all told the tale of the vomiting child driven to school by the headteacher with a bucket and the hospitalised child doing them in his hospital bed.

KatAndKit Sat 11-May-13 16:29:39

After school revision clubs and breakfast clubs can not be compulsory. As a parent it is up to you what your child does and does not attend outside of official school day. If your child does not want to go to revision club then don't send him. Surely it can not be true that medical staff would allow a hospitalised 11 year old to do an unnecessary test while sick? It's not like its an A level or anything.

Manchesterhistorygirl Sat 11-May-13 16:37:13

Sats can fuck the fuck off. Ds1 has just done his ks1 sats and he's been beyond stressed, poor boy. He's been doing practice papers since they went back after Easter and not allowed out to play if they hadn't completed all questions on test papers correctly. He is 7! I'm tempted to book him out for the week when he's yr.6. I hily doubt that his attendance record will matter by then.

BackforGood Sat 11-May-13 16:40:48

shock That's shocking Feenie, and horrible.
I speak as the Mum of 1 dc who would probably have won that when she was in Yr6, but would have been absolutely appalled. IMVHO she is already lucky enough in her life that academic work comes easily to her, it would just be awful to think that anyone would then give her cash rewards for having that luck in the first place.
Really, really sad that anyone who thinks that is the right thing to do is holding the position of HT.

everlong Sat 11-May-13 16:44:42

Manchester that's sad. Poor boy.
Ds is even 7 till the end of August. His school are pretty full on with sats even at this age too.

Some mums are really stressing about sub levels etc.

mrz Sat 11-May-13 16:45:00

Why on earth is a school doing practice papers in KS1 when the test results aren't even reported!

everlong Sat 11-May-13 16:46:37

Ds's is private and I'm guessing that the excellent result attract parents?

Manchesterhistorygirl Sat 11-May-13 16:47:08

Probably because they know they're a bit in the shit right now. We took it up with school who stated that it was ds1 putting too much pressure in himself and not in fact them!

nlondondad Sat 11-May-13 16:53:04

The pressure on schools to deliver good, or even higher SATS results is tremendous. It comes through OFSTED where, these days a poor result can trigger being put in a category, which could (and has) meant the end of the Head's career. (Forced Academy status, and all that stuff)

BUT

I have to say that it does also come a LOT from parents. Instead of sats scores being used as one of a number of indicators, diagnostic yes, but only up to a point, all too often they are used as a if they were the sole measure...

mumofthemonsters808 Sat 11-May-13 16:56:06

I can't fault our school they are providing a free breakfast club and a free trip to the cinema next week for all the hard work the children have put in. DD taking it all in her stride, she is very laid back even agreeing to going to bed at 8.30 next week.

mrz Sat 11-May-13 16:58:11

but the KS1 tests won't make the slightest difference Manchesterhistorygirl ... they aren't reported

Ledkr Sat 11-May-13 18:38:17

The trouble is that the results aren't really true as the chikdren have been effectively hothoused through the last term to get better scores.

mrz Sat 11-May-13 18:40:40

Is it an infant schools or a primary? hmm

mrz Sat 11-May-13 18:41:17

sorry that was for sparkling not the OP

Sparklingbrook Sat 11-May-13 18:42:54

DS2 is in a Middle School mrz.

LynetteScavo Sat 11-May-13 18:44:54

But all state school children in Y6 are "hot housed" so the results are some what true.

I wish DS2 didn't have to go through Y6. Y7 will seem like a picnic in comparison.

mrz Sat 11-May-13 18:46:45

No they aren't Lynette

darthsillius Sat 11-May-13 18:47:37

I know of a head who last week told the y6s if they didn't do well in their sats they would never get a job!

Poor kids.

Sparklingbrook Sat 11-May-13 18:51:55

I have to say though that his school is brilliant on the whole. DS2 has had a male teacher for the first time ever and built up a great rapport with him, so enthusiastic, it is brilliant to see.

Picturesinthefirelight Sat 11-May-13 18:54:37

These threads are so sad. I'm so glad dd isn't doing them. She's got normal school exams next week but there's been no revision or anything.

Feenie Sat 11-May-13 18:57:28

No, some schools manage to provide the broad and balanced curriculum the children are entitled to without the endless revision and hot housing.

LynetteScavo Sat 11-May-13 19:00:53

I'm glad to hear some schools do Y6 well. smile

None around here though.

Ledkr Sat 11-May-13 19:01:41

lynn yes that's the only good thing that yr 7 seems less daunting now.
I was told two weeks ago that unless my poorly dd was actually sick she should come to school cis of the upcoming sats hmm she had a temp and could hardly move with weakness and nausea.

mrz Sat 11-May-13 19:06:25

SATs test 7 years of education, why are some cramming this into the final year

Ledkr Sat 11-May-13 19:11:00

Good question. I asked our head teacher but he couldn't answer me.
I also asked if dds extra maths lessons would continue after the sats. He said no.

LetUsPrey Sat 11-May-13 19:18:01

DS1 is also on SATS next week. School seem quite laid back to be honest. No past papers been sent home with the exception of one this weekend. He doesn't seem stressed about it but has said he's a bit worried, which I've told him is normal. As long as he knows he's done his best, then that's fine. They're getting toast and fruit as snacks.

We did get a letter asking that we ensure that they go to bed at reasonable times which went down really well with DS1 grin. I think he imagined me packing him off to bed at 7pm every night.

I imagine the teachers are stressed though but they seem to be keeping this from the pupils.

It's a bit sad to read how much stress some of the schools are putting children under.

fishoils Sat 11-May-13 21:19:32

Would it be possible to homes chool for Yr 6 and miss out the SATs? I mean that for us - not everybody would want to do that, obviously.

Would it impact the child once they start secondary school?

mumsneedwine Sat 11-May-13 21:33:29

My youngest, taking SATS next week is currently at Windsor Horse Show sleeping in a tent. She will be home tomorrow night about 9pm. I have 4 kids already done SATS/GCSEs/Degrees and I can honestly say I couldn't care less. She will do the ridiculous number of papers she has next week (10 in 4 days - really !!!) and I hope do her best. But she is 11 and a kid so if she does rubbish then that's OK too.

Hugglepuff Sat 11-May-13 21:56:30

Dd and I have had great chats about how she can only do her best, and that's fine! We went off for a great weekend camping last weekend and dd came back with a broken right thumb ( obviously not a natural at goal keeping ) she now will have a scribe and can't hold a pen. Ho hum .... Could be worse ! Am having to persuade her not to try right handed cart wheels !

Hugglepuff Sat 11-May-13 21:57:38

Oops meant one handed cart wheels .... Right handed cartwheels definitely a no no !

outtolunchagain Sat 11-May-13 22:14:21

Ds currently at PGL , his school doesn't do SATs ( independent ) and I am so pleased . There was a little bit of stress with entrance exams in Jan but nothing like the SATs reports. This stress I'd just ridiculous hmm

MNBlackpoolandFylde Sat 11-May-13 22:25:26

I am dreading this next year, dds school do optionals and teachers have had half of class in tears last two years, really made some of them poorly over it including writing scores on board sad

Makes me very cross!

mam29 Sat 11-May-13 23:36:57

I think dd1 must have year 2 next week not sure as school not sent home any test papers.

Contrast to nearby high performing infants they been doing past papers since sept in year 2.

Spoke to 1 year 6parent at dd old school and pressure this year immense due to poor ofsted last year focussing on attainment.

When we moved to new school copy year 2sats results in prospectus so maybe not published widely but at request of parents year 2 info given?

Dancergirl Sat 11-May-13 23:52:12

Good question fishoils Yes you can home ed. You could even continue with school up to SATS and then say you are withdrawing him/her.

TBH reading this thread I do wonder why parents don't just boycott them by not letting their child sit them. I mean, what can the school do, they're not going to physically force your child into school if you say you're home edding/they're ill etc.

CouthyMow Sun 12-May-13 02:24:17

My DS's school expect us all to get them there 30 minutes early. Yeah, RIIIGHT!

I have to travel by bus, with 3 major roads closed in our town, but first have to ensure my 15yo DD with LD's is out of the door at 8:05. And she will not leave one minute early, or the world will end. But if I'm not there to get her out of the door, she won't go.

I usually leave at 8.15am. To get there for 8.30am, I'm going to have to leave at 7.45am.

gringringringrin

<<Pigs are obviously flying over a blue moon...>>

It's for some free breakfast club. As if we aren't going to feed our DC's before they leave?! confused

(This is exceedingly unlikely, given their class...)

DS1's only comment was "cool, two breakfasts". hmm.

I'm assuming the HT thinks I have perfected time travel, or that I'm going to borrow the effing Tardis for a week, as last time I checked, I can't leave the house at 7.45am whilst still being able to get DD out of the door at 8.05am.

(The HT does know what time DD has to be pushed out of the door, as if I struggle to get her to go, then the DS's might be slightly late, occasional issue, but definitely known).

DS1 is just "yeah, whatever" about the SATS - he doesn't seem fazed by them. Not even the lvl 6 ones.

His view is that "they are all for the school league tables anyway, otherwise why does the Secondary do CATS tests in the first half term to set us. Maybe a bit for GCSE predictions, but a prediction only says what they think you will get, not what you actually get. As long as I do my best, what's the worry?"

He worried far more over his 11+, tbh.

CouthyMow Sun 12-May-13 02:26:10

DS1 - no homework, told to rest and relax over the weekend, and also told NO past papers (pushy mum territory in this school...)

CouthyMow Sun 12-May-13 02:30:12

DS1 showed two levels of progress by the end of Y4/start of Y5. The school have still pushed him - end of Y2, he was lvl 3. End of Y4/start of Y5, he was hitting lvl 5c. Now working in class at lvl 6 English, lvl 7 Maths.

I guess that's why he seemingly feels far less pressured than his classmates? To show two lvls progress since Y2, 'all' he has to show is what he was capable of at the end of Y4/start of Y5, so anything past that is for him and the school's prospectus, I guess!

CouthyMow Sun 12-May-13 02:34:21

God, Wilma, is your DC in my DC's class?! shock That is exactly what the HT said at the meeting we attended...

shock

CouthyMow Sun 12-May-13 02:39:11

Wonders whether Wilma's DC has a residential trip the week after SATS?!

mrz Sun 12-May-13 06:50:32

"The kids don't really have a clue what these tests are for"

I don't think most people have a clue what these tests are for either ... many seem to cling to the idea that it's a test of the school ... erm no!

CalicoRose Sun 12-May-13 07:12:48

Those who ate reading and panicking about their younger get kids being stressed / pushed like this - remember this is MN.

Neither of the 2 kids my school go to stress the kids out about SATs. Both still provide a 'broad and balanced curriculum'

Obviously, from reading MN, some schools get it wrong. But there's no reason to assume most, or even lots, do.

If you're unhappy with the way school handle SATs I bet you're also unhappy with loads of other things which you've brushed under the carpet. Ie handling SATs badly is just a symptom of a bad school. Nothing more nothing less.

WilmaFingerdoo Sun 12-May-13 09:06:38

Couthy , no the residential was in November grin
sounds like standard issue threats then.

A good friend who teaches yr 6 in a different school told me breakfast clubs are only offered in schools

"Handling SATS badly is just a symptom of a bad school" hmm complete tosh.
Ours are a fantastic school. No complaints other than the heavy handed way they've dealt with SATS. My DD is in reception and I couldn't be happier.

WilmaFingerdoo Sun 12-May-13 09:12:02

Sorry missed a bit.

Breakfast clubs only offered in schools with bad attendance or punctuality which is odd because our school has improved no end in that department.
There's so many tales around its hard to know what to believe.

Feenie Sun 12-May-13 10:17:27

A good friend who teaches yr 6 in a different school told me breakfast clubs are only offered in schools with bad attendance or punctuality

That's a bit of a daft thing to say. SAT breakfast clubs are very popular, usually as a treat and a camaraderie thing than a way to solve an attendance problem - that would be more of a long term thing, and would take much longer than a week to solve.

SuffolkNWhat Sun 12-May-13 10:27:16

We used to have a balanced curriculum for our Y6s (middle school) but intervention classes have sneaked in since OCTOBER! and I have been teaching half sized classes because they are out doing extra English & Maths. Seems pointless IMO because our school (along with all our middles) are closing in 3 years time!

As a teacher of a foundation subject SATs screw up my data more than benefit the children.

outtolunchagain Sun 12-May-13 10:41:43

Mrz what are they for then because I did think they were to test the teaching in the schools?

Genuine question by the way

Feenie Sun 12-May-13 10:45:45

The results are used to set statutory individual GCSE targets for children.

outtolunchagain Sun 12-May-13 10:53:51

But those targets are used for the schools to judge how well they are teaching and value added etcThey are not used to incentivise the children . I cannot even remember what ds1s SAT results were and certainly was not aware that his teachers at GCsE knew or were even interested in his SATs .

Feenie Sun 12-May-13 10:59:14

But his teachers will have been very aware - they will have known what they needed to aim for with him, determined by his SAT results.

outtolunchagain Sun 12-May-13 11:00:59

No his GCSE target were set using something called MidYis ,or something like that , neither of my younger two have ever done a SATs exam so they would have difficulty setting targets using them

outtolunchagain Sun 12-May-13 11:07:18

Sorry didn't mean to sound argumentative ,but if the child doesn't then reach that GcSE target is that used to judge the child or the school,because if it is used to judge the school then the tests are for the school's benefit and not the child's if you see what I mean.I just can't see what the child is getting from these tests but maybe I'm missing something.

meditrina Sun 12-May-13 11:10:30

"This year , it is expected that as a minimum standard, all schools should have at least 60 per cent of pupils at the end of Key Stage 2 achieving a level four or above in both English and mathematics"

Then the standard has gone down

Level 4 was the expected level that all children should achieve (barring SN or major social factors like ESOL/newly arrived). And so it should be close to 100% at level 4. To set a new standard which accepts 40% of children not achieving the basic expected level staggers me.

CouthyMow Sun 12-May-13 11:18:48

But using Y6 SATS results as a way of predicting GCSE results is incredibly flawed, as my DD proves.

Y6 SATS, she didn't achieve a lvl. Mostly because she was still working on p-scales. Her GCSE predicted grades are now done the old-fashioned way, because she made so much progress in Y7 and Y8 once the Secondary actually gave her decent help with her SN's that the computer generated ones bear no relation to where she is working now in Y10!

According to the computer generated GCSE grade predictions, my DD will get U's in every subject. According to the teacher predictions (who h I trust FAR more!), she will get G-D, mostly D's and E's, depending on subject, and may just scrape a 'C' in Science.

Why use results from a test at 10/11 to determine what GCSE grades a 16yo is likely to get?! It's quite plausible for a DC to have a major developmental leap between 11 and 16.

What was wrong with teacher predictions, like when I was at school? They were usually spot on.

Or DC's that have unsupported SN's at Primary level being far better supported at Secondary level, thus rendering their SATS results useless for the purpose of GCSE grade prediction...

I trust DD's teachers to know what level she is working at now than some computer program that thinks that her achievement at 11yo will be able to predict her GCSE grades at 16yo!

CouthyMow Sun 12-May-13 11:22:27

So do the schools try to aim PAST that grade set by a bloody computer? I'm glad DD's does, or her Secondary education would have failed her as well as her Primary education!!

If all the school taught my DD was how to get U grades on her GCSE's, I'd have been hopping mad!

Instead they ignored the predictions based on her SATS results, and pushed her and helped her to get where she is now.

The only lesson she is on the borderline for a U grade is Maths, and her goal is a G, as she desperately wants to achieve a grade, rather than no grade.

Startail Sun 12-May-13 11:30:34

I hope spanieleyes doesn't mind I'm going to repost her comment

*" It gets harder every year to escape the clutches of OFSTED! This year , it is expected that as a minimum standard, all schools should have at least 60 per cent of pupils at the end of Key Stage 2 achieving a level four or above in both English and mathematics( which is relatively easy to achieve) and not be below the median school scores for the percentage of pupils making expected progress between Key Stage 1 and Key Stage 2 in English and in mathematics. In 2012, the median school score for English was 92 per cent and for mathematics 90 per cent.
SO you need to be above average to be above floor targets, and so everyone has to be above average!!"*

This is why your DCs are having such a shitty Y6 and why my DD2 had SATs coming out of her ears last year and her big sister didn't.

It's the same rubbish with 3 levels of progress at secondary that's put their perfectly good senior school in SM. It absolutely sucks and is ruining any chance of our children getting a rounded education and sucking the fun out of schools angry

Sparklingbrook Sun 12-May-13 11:33:26

Well i have produced the clear pencil case, and all the pens pencils protractors that are required. Just want tomorrow to come now. DS2 is adamant he is going to do the past papers today and is just about to start the maths one. sad

Sparklingbrook Sun 12-May-13 11:45:39

No-we are looking at the SPAG one. Synonyms and antonyms. Great.

Sparklingbrook Sun 12-May-13 11:52:36

<boggles>

Feenie Sun 12-May-13 11:55:54

So do the schools try to aim PAST that grade set by a bloody computer?

Good schools and teachers do, yes.

But these are government set targets, and could affect the aspirations a poorer school/teacher has for a child.

I don't know what the government sets for a child with no SAT results, outtolunch - it's not a typical situation though.

mrz Sun 12-May-13 14:06:47

outtolunchagain the prime purpose of the SAT tests is as an assessment of the child and to set individual targets for the child. The fact that KS2 results are used to produce league tables is a bi-product much loved by the press and some parents.

Sparklingbrook Sun 12-May-13 14:28:07

I am starting to feel nervous for DS2. he has just said 'if I don't do very well in my SATS they can always look in my books'. sad He is expected to do well but his teachers have said he has a habit of making things more complicated than they need to be.

AnaS Sun 12-May-13 16:36:57

My dd has hardly eaten for a fortnight and has had a sore throat too with no obvious signs of infection. My Mum reminded me that I always got sore throats and mouth ulcers when I was sitting exams. She is only 11 years old ffs - she doesn't need all the pressure that the school is heaping on her. I was all for doing very little (if any) school work this weekend but the school sent home a pile of things that she has got wrong in the past. Great - now her confidence is rock bottom having spent the weekend struggling with the hardest bits. That's really going to help isn't it?

LackaDAISYcal Sun 12-May-13 16:51:35

DS's school are providing breakfast all week! Mainly it's a ploy to ensure they are all there on time, but it saves us the bother!

They have been working towards it all year to the exclusion of pretty much everything else and the week before last they had a week of mocks. Past papers, under exam conditions and everything, then last week they have been working on any issues that arose from their mock papers. Thankfully they have been told to have this weekend off to relax. Their justification for doing all the past papers etc is so that when they do the exams it is just another mock up and they will breeze through it.

We've been told to go easy on them, let them have their favourite foods, do what they want to relax (apart from computer games) etc. As if we will let him dictate!

My DS is stressing though <and making everyone else miserable >. He has a tendency to chew his lip when worried and has today sucked on his own face so hard that he now has a "lovebite" all round his lips and is refusing to go to school tomorrow at all <long suffering sigh>. We have done an emergency shop run to get some arnica cream, but it isn't going to go away by tomorrow. I'm now stressing that he will get the mickey taken which will ruin his concentration and he'll do badly.

Can't wait till it's all over.

seeker Sun 12-May-13 16:53:52

Do remember everyone, that this time next year they will be doing end of year 7 exams. More of them, much harder and generally a bigger deal. Don"5 mollycoddle!

cory Sun 12-May-13 16:57:59

seeker Sun 12-May-13 16:53:52
"Do remember everyone, that this time next year they will be doing end of year 7 exams. More of them, much harder and generally a bigger deal. "

Not a bigger deal in any of the secondaries dc, their friends or the dc of friends have attended. Far more hysteria over the SATS ime. Secondaries have their GCSEs to think about. And even those seem to take place in a calmer atmosphere than SATS in dc's junior school.

LackaDAISYcal Sun 12-May-13 17:04:09

DS's year 6 of two classes have four teacher and two TA's this year to get them through and achieve the best results.

Great that they have had all the additional teaching support, but the school are mainly interested in getting good results rather than the pupils' welfare and progress. Especially as a rival school has appeared on their doorstep by virtue of the high school next door to them becoming a Through School and now having a primary phase. They are worried about losing pupils and hence funding.

LackaDAISYcal Sun 12-May-13 17:08:11

Sparkling, our school are providing all necessary equipment thankfully. Presumably so they don't have kids turning up without the right stuff and then having to rush about finding spare kit. Easier for everyone they said if it's all provided.

Sparklingbrook Sun 12-May-13 17:10:58

Yes it's really weird Lack Ds has supplied all his own stationery since Year 5 so it just carries over into the SATS. I am assuming it's because he is at a Middle School.

Snowsquonk Sun 12-May-13 17:13:17

This term - half an hour PE per week, no topic work, just English, Maths and SATS revision. DD has enjoyed a level 6 booster group but has gone from being a child who revelled in tests to one who is completely and utterly fed up with them.

Patronising letter home on friday reminding us parents about the need for a good nights sleep and a breakfast before school - isn't that necessary most of the time for good performance? DD is aware that the results will have little or no effect on her future as her secondary school will CAT test her in June - more test - whoopee!

SuffolkNWhat Sun 12-May-13 17:15:27

At our Middle school all pupils are expected to have their own equipment too Sparkling

IfNotNowThenWhen Sun 12-May-13 17:18:36

I always thought SATs were for the school, and the school only.
I didn't think they impacted on the child at all.
What would happen if a parent boycotted the SATS in protest? Would that affect the child?

ClaraOswinOswald Sun 12-May-13 17:19:40

DD has just started her periods. As if SATs week wasn't stressful enough poor thing. Thinking of writing a note to her teacher so she can make sure she's ok.

Sparklingbrook Sun 12-May-13 17:23:06

Oh thank you for saying that Suffolk I started a thread asking what was going in the clear pencil case and I was the only one supplying anything. grin

Oh Clara poor DD. That's a lot to deal with.

LackaDAISYcal Sun 12-May-13 17:25:11

Aw, poor DD Clara sad. You should be able to mark this time with lots of mum and daughter bonding instead of her having to do a bunch of exams. Maybe arrange something special for Thursday evening?

mrz Sun 12-May-13 17:26:01

IfNotNowThenWhen ...the government would probably predict GCSE results based on the FS profile wink

Anthracite Sun 12-May-13 17:26:07

I remember when my DD1 was in Y6 at a state primary. She spent her whole year doing SATS practice. She hit level 5 at the beginning of Y5 and basically learnt nothing for 2 years. My younger children have been SAT-free, partly because of DD1's waste of 2 years.

LackaDAISYcal Sun 12-May-13 17:28:45

Oh, and I'd have a word with her teacher; I'm sure they will keep an eye out for her.
I remember flooding everywhere during my first period as I had no real clue about sanitary towels and stuff (inspite of having two older sisters hmm). If I was in the middle of an exam when that happened I would have died of embarrassment.

ChewingOnLifesGristle Sun 12-May-13 17:37:23

I am heartened to see that others regard SATS in the same hmm way that I do.

I am starting to think that 'impressive' SATS scores for a school are a clear indication of a relentless cramming regime and a depressing and unimaginative yr6. hmm

IfNotNowThenWhen Sun 12-May-13 17:41:26

I might boycott then. The school will hate me grin

Sparklingbrook Sun 12-May-13 17:42:17

I just want it over now.

ChewingOnLifesGristle Sun 12-May-13 17:46:29

Can you boycott though? We've been old on pain of death to be there. Can they do much if you're not?

Mind you dc wouldn't want me to single them out for that (even though I'm dead against SATS, I try not to let my feelings known too muchwink although I'm sure they know)

BooksandaCuppa Sun 12-May-13 17:47:05

Ooh, seeker - you took the words out of my mouth...

Ds has his exam week this coming week in year 7: 3 hour long exams every day. Full on exam conditions; full essays expected; lab work in science under exam conditions; listening, speaking and writing tests for two languages; written music exam and proper art exam. For year 8 setting (and possibly to see who can sit yr 9 scholarships...)

Last year's SATs seem like a breeze.

That's not to be dismissive or disrespectful to year 6 dc and their parents - but if your future secondary does 'proper' end of year exams, SATs will just seem like good preparation.

(I would say ds's school fell somewhere in the middle of the camp of no pressure to lots of pressure...but I don't think testing at the end of seven years' compulsory education is a bad thing at all. A Head telling lies about their significance or offering money for results is another thing).

MrsSalvoMontalbano Sun 12-May-13 17:47:49

Shocking that schools put this much stress on DC, simply for the schools' own rating in the league table - is entirely for the HT benefit, not the DC! Obscene sad

Sparklingbrook Sun 12-May-13 17:49:11

I remember telling DS1 that it was to test the teaching not him.

mrz Sun 12-May-13 17:50:53

Parents have been doing that for years so now everyone believes it even though it isn't true

Sparklingbrook Sun 12-May-13 17:55:00

It was in the middle of the night and he was awake worrying so I would have told him anything so he got some sleep.

Idontknowhowtohelpher Sun 12-May-13 17:55:56

dd2 has been in tears this afternoon about the Year 6 SATS. Her HT made a rare visit to their classroom on Friday to insist they came in even if they are ill or he will come to collect them. She is really worried about being ill tomorrow now. and just the 12 pages of revision homework this weekend...

Sparklingbrook Sun 12-May-13 17:58:08

A lot of the children will be ill tomorrow. On the loo with nervous tummy. sad

LackaDAISYcal Sun 12-May-13 18:05:39

DS has just had a huge meltdown about tomorrow. Buuut, he has been an arse about something and is in trouble, so I think the SATs worry may be a way to ellicit sympathy and a get out of jail free card hmm

I think he is taking the school's "let them do what they like" advice to heart a little bit too much. I don't think they meant paint your little brother green and then encourage him to decorate the walls with the same colour and then try and get him in trouble for it angry

ClaraOswinOswald Sun 12-May-13 18:07:02

DD has been in the shower for about an hour singing so I'm just letting her get on with it. I'm usually shouting about electricity and hot water by now.
smile

serin Sun 12-May-13 18:08:02

I have only read page one, so apologies if this has already been said but we need to rebel against this ridiculous abuse of our children.

They are just little children to place them under such stress will only increase the chances of them becoming stressy adults.

It is such complete nonsense, DH was in the remedial class on starting high school and climbed his way to a PhD.

Anifrangapani Sun 12-May-13 18:08:09

No revision or homework here. Thankfully. Can't wait for Thursday.

mrz Sun 12-May-13 18:15:06

The only year we had pupils crying over the SATs was the year the unions boycotted the tests

lljkk Sun 12-May-13 18:16:07

In a way it's good that so many of you have children who care so much. It bodes extremely well for their future. I am quite sure that DS2 won't give a damn when he's in yr6. Nothing any adult says will affect him. Same old rotten school silly tasks to do just a different day in his mind. Though at least he can look forward to mostly dossing for the 7 weeks afterwards. And changing schools 5 months later (will be same shit different school for him, of course).

He'd like a breakfast club, though. Hobbit throwback genes, I suspect.

Secondme Sun 12-May-13 18:22:41

Felt so sorry for the less able kids last year when dd did SATS. Put under loads of stress and pressure. sad

mrz Sun 12-May-13 18:25:41

Mine is perverse lljkk, he loved tests because it meant he didn't have to do any work all year hmm

cherrycarpet Sun 12-May-13 18:35:52

Well it's the night before the dreaded SATS! DS1 is a bit nervous but we've had a lovely chilled out day and took our 4 DC's to a stunning bluebell wood where they ran about having fun. We haven't been doing loads of practice papers as I've trusted the teachers to bring them up to the level they think they're capable of. There's been a bit of extra pressure in the classroom over the past two weeks but nothing too severe. He's sitting one Level 6 paper (grammar) but only found out about that last week so hasn't had time to stress about it.

I will be wishing DS1 good luck in the morning and giving him some porridge for extra brain power (!) but reassuring him that it will all be OK whatever the outcome. All over on Friday and his class will be having a big party.

Sparklingbrook Sun 12-May-13 18:39:29

I have Science written on the calendar for Friday?

lljkk Sun 12-May-13 18:40:16

DD is relishing the challenge.
She even mentioned determinedly getting to bed by 9pm tonite shock.
Normally I have to mega rant about her light still being on at 11.

Feenie Sun 12-May-13 18:47:59

That is an internal assessment then, Sparkling - there are no Science tests this year, not even sample ones.

mrz Sun 12-May-13 18:50:03

There isn't a science test this year so it must be an internal thing Sparkling

Sparklingbrook Sun 12-May-13 18:50:18

Oh right. Thanks Feenie. I will declare the SATS officially finished on Thursday in that case. smile

Feenie Sun 12-May-13 18:51:15

I am starting to think that 'impressive' SATS scores for a school are a clear indication of a relentless cramming regime and a depressing and unimaginative yr6.

Careful there, ChewingonLifesgristle - there are plenty of schools who provide a broad and balanced curriculum AND still get very good results, mine and mrz's included.

piratecat Sun 12-May-13 18:54:40

when do they start, tomorrow or tuesday, is it the same thru the country (england here)?

dd was off ill on friday with a 24 hr stomach sickness, so not sure if anything was sent home.

Sparklingbrook Sun 12-May-13 18:59:09

Tomorrow with Reading pirate

mrz Sun 12-May-13 18:59:33

Yes they start tomorrow and end Thursday (England)

ClaraOswinOswald Sun 12-May-13 19:02:23

Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong but I think it is:
Monday- reading
Tuesday: SPAG
Wednesday: Maths Paper A
Thursday: Mental Maths then Maths paper B (calculator)
Friday: And breathe....

Just spoke to DD, she said she's fine, asked if she wanted me to speak to her teacher and got an eye roll followed by "Mum, I'm fiiine, stop stressing!" She's so cool.
smile

piratecat Sun 12-May-13 19:12:12

thankyou, we are so not stressing or bothered here. Yet that may be that school have had a very relaxed approach. She's worked hard this term, when well. Maths has come along lovely (best teacher she's ever had- and now I can see how crap a few have been tbh).

She says she's not worried, and i have just said, nope neither am I, you just do your best sweetheart.

SaltaKatten Sun 12-May-13 19:20:46

As a year 6 teacher I am also looking forward to the end of this week. The pressure from above is horrific but I have been trying very hard to not pass this on. We have been doing a lot of revision but I've tried to make it fun as much as possible. Woe betide me once the results come back if they aren't good enough though =(

ClaraOswinOswald Sun 12-May-13 19:24:18

Several teacher friends are really feeling the pressure. It is unfair on the kids, the teachers, everyone really. Surely there must be a better way. It all seems so unnecessary. 10 and 11 is so young.

DS is not at all stressed and neither are we.
School do breakfast club which he's quite happy to go to - DD said the breakfasts were great when she went a few years ago. Mind you they were even better on the residential trip she says !
DS is doing the level 6. He might have some small chance in Maths I think.
But Level 5's much more likely I would think.
He already has his place to follow DD to good secondary school and that's what matters to us.
But he'll give it all his best shot as good practice for him and we know it's important for the school and the teachers and staff.
I don't mind if they've been doing lots of past papers and "cramming" - honestly DS just takes it all in his stride. A little work might be good for him wink

oh and DD did hers 3 years ago and I can't even remember what she got, and neither can she.

Sparklingbrook Sun 12-May-13 19:36:53

Same here juggling DS1 did his 3 years ago. Have no idea what he got. He's doing v well in Year 9 so it was probably ok. confused

PinkyCheesy Sun 12-May-13 20:46:39

Some schools will do a teacher-assessed science test on Friday.

As our yr6 teacher put it: "science is still a core subject and Ofsted will, at some point, still ask for evidence that the required skills are being achieved. The best way of evidencing that is to sit a quick test so all children are under same conditions. Might as well do it Friday morning when they're still full of adrenaline, and then they will not have to hear the word 'test' again until they're in secondary school."

It won't be revised for, nor moderated, just taken in silence and marked by teacher for the files. Makes sense to me, especially as I am also a parent governor and the thought of Ofsted questioning me about evidence terrifies me!!

pointythings Sun 12-May-13 20:47:50

I wonder about the end of Yr7 exams and how dreadful they will really be - DD1 has had termly exams at the end of every term under full exam conditions, she seems to take it in stride. She's certainly finding it much less tough than SATs in Yr6.

And two languages? DD1 is only doing French at her school, not starting German until next year.

Feenie Sun 12-May-13 20:59:19

The best way of evidencing that is to sit a quick test

What a load of codswallop!

The best way of getting the narrowest possible snapshot, more like.

My eldest is currently in Y3 so we are still a few years off this.
Our school gets consistently strong results for SATS even taking into account we are a small school and with a small cohort so each child carries a large percentage. Our school do not seem to stress the children or staff out, no endless past papers and pep talks. Our Y6 have had a great year so far and done a lot of different things and interesting topic work, same is true for the whole school so I don't think it is fair to say that exerlent SATS results are a sign of a pushy exam factory of a school although I do know that for some schools this is the case and like everything else there is a large variation between schools.

Every year though when these threads come up it does make me think though, next to each other on the education threads we have people worrying about school allocations, talking about either wanting or rejecting schools in large parts based in the schools T6 SATS results. Then in the next thread we have this, concern for stressed children being pushed too far by schools despite to maintain their results.
By the time our children reach Y6 I think most parents have seen past the whole SATS results thing they spent so much time worrying about when choosing a school for their 4 year olds and can see how the results can't and won't tell you how your child will do through primary school or the quality of education their child will receive.
I wonder how it is though that so many people can't seem to put the dots together.

fishoils Sun 12-May-13 21:05:44

If you don't do the SATS - do they not know where to put you, if children are streamed, in Yr 7.

What are the consequences for your child of boycotting?

Does anyone know?

Picturesinthefirelight Sun 12-May-13 21:07:43

Some of dd's friends will be going to state secondary schools I. September and won't have done SATS. As far as I am aware it's never been a problem in the past.

BooksandaCuppa Sun 12-May-13 21:09:42

pointy I don't think the end of yr 7 exams will be 'dreadful'; just that there's an exam (and sometimes two or three) for every subject in the curriculum - so there's just a LOT more to them than SATs - testing only two subjects. I think SATs are good practice, that's all: they have to have their first exams at some point.

(Ds is doing French and Spanish - I feel a little that with them being so similar, he's not doing as well as would with one one its own, but I think he'll get there!)

roadkill - couldn't agree more.

loopydoo Sun 12-May-13 21:15:07

I think SATS are a complete waste of time and so unnecessary and stressful for the poor children. DD hasn't slept before midnight for e past three weeks (she already has sleep issues anyway).

She has decided to just sit there and not do the papers!! She said she might try a bit in English but defo not maths (she is already getting level 5's so it's not as though she needs to up her levels).

She hates pressure and I'm really worried about her. There seems to be more stress over SAYS than there does over GCSEs!!!

DDs school also said about breakfast.....dd never eats brekkie as she can't face it, even though I tempt her with lots of healthy options so hoping she doesn't flake out during the tests grin

Feenie Sun 12-May-13 21:19:08

She has decided to just sit there and not do the papers!! She said she might try a bit in English but defo not maths (she is already getting level 5's so it's not as though she needs to up her levels).

How can she already be getting 5s if she is going to sit there and not do the papers? confused

I can't quite believe you seem to be posting that with some glee, btw.

loopydoo Sun 12-May-13 21:25:08

No I m posting it glee, just saying what she has said.
What I mean is, I can't do anything about it.....I can't sit there with her tomorrow and make her write it.

She is cross about doing them and tells us she isn't going to do them.

Fom out point of view, if she does nothing, it doesn't matter. She is working at level 5 in maths and 5/6 in English so what I meant is, we know she usually works hard so it's not the end of the world from our point of view. Of course, the school would be annoyed if she didn't fill them in (and I'm sure she will do them and is just being hissy with us) but as they are only for the benefit of the school in reality, we won't tell her off if she did decide to just sit there.

Dancergirl Sun 12-May-13 21:25:33

idontknowhow This makes me SO angry angry

How DARE the Head threaten the children like that!

Of course no-one wants their child to be singled out by not doing them, but I would be seriously interested in starting a campaign to boycott. Funnily enough, there was a letter in The Sunday Times today suggesting such.

loopydoo Sun 12-May-13 21:26:42

That should have said NOT posting it with glee

mrz Sun 12-May-13 21:29:09

She may be working at level 5 but the level that will be officially recorded and passed onto her next school will not be level 5.

loopydoo Sun 12-May-13 21:29:57

idontknowhow I would make a formal complaint if the HT said that! Not entirely sure the governors would be happy with him saying that! If a child is sick, then they cannot make them go to school!!

Feenie Sun 12-May-13 21:30:30

Yeah, stuff the school - they've only spent 7 years getting her to those level 5/6s after all. So what if they are now 4% or whatever down before they even start? hmm hmm

loopydoo Sun 12-May-13 21:30:34

She is in a middle school so not moving up in September.

inappropriatelyemployed Sun 12-May-13 21:30:58

Utterly, utterly pointless. No matter how much teachers say they are hardly doing any work towards them and 'it's no big deal' and 'we deliver a rounded curriculum' blah, blah, blah, they know their schools stand or fall on these results as parents and Ofsted place value on them.

But what is the benefit to children? None.

inappropriatelyemployed Sun 12-May-13 21:36:42

And so what if a level is not formally 'recorded' by taking SATs, surely any decent secondary school can sort out a child's level for itself.

Or are you saying secondary school teachers are truly so stupid and its a case of 'computer says no' so we can't possible stream or teach this child for the next 6 years because they didn't have a formally recorded level for KS2 SATs to plot our data.

It's all bollocks. Take an arbitrary point - test a child and then as long as they follow a linear path along said arbitrary data graph, job is done. It is fundamentally flawed because it rests on an assumption that tests at 7 or 11 reveal ability or capacity to perform at 16. Based on what evidence??

loopydoo Sun 12-May-13 21:37:46

feenie I wouldn't have said the schools have spent 7yrs 'getting' her to that level......she has never really tried to get good results. She just does what she does and is at the corresponding level.

As a forces child, she is on her 5th school so not doing too badly considering the upheaval she's had. For us, emotional stability and having nice friends she enjoys spending time with is of far greater importance than her academic grades at this age.

Sparklingbrook Sun 12-May-13 21:38:19

I am so glad there are other Middle School parents around loopy, the SATS don't feel quite as life and death with regard to Secondary School sets, Next year's tests are more important.

loopydoo Sun 12-May-13 21:41:26

To be honest though Sparkling' we really don't care about any exams until her GCSEs. I really think the govt have stopped appreciating that teachers are extremely capable of regularly assessing their pupils through normal class tests and their work.

I don't think our middle school has yr 7 tests?

Sparklingbrook Sun 12-May-13 21:42:24

I think ours has CAT tests. Whatever they are.

loopydoo Sun 12-May-13 21:44:12

My SIL who is a teacher told me the other week that if a yr 6 child is not likely to get level 4s, then they aren't given extra help as is likely they won't achieve good GCSEs. And that kids who are already achieving level 4 and above aren't helped to move on either as they already know those kids will do well at GCSE.

So she explained that the schools are really only bothered about those kids just below level 4 who they can pour all the resources into to get them to up their levels.

loopydoo Sun 12-May-13 21:44:40

I don't know what CAT tests are either grin

mam29 Sun 12-May-13 21:45:44

Would a primary school do level 1 and level 2sats in same week?

dd1 said her teacher was out class a lot last week.
last few weeks been normal weeks no difference
so dont think shes done year 2 sats yet.

made bit more obvious as shes one of 10year 2s in class with 20years 1s gues year 2s be taken to seperate room.

we done no prep.

spoke to teacher few weeks ago she said dd contining to make progress.

shes still in lower group guided reading, getting one to one help rom ta twice a week for reading and spelling since xmas something called snappy sounds and rapid read.

she loves scieince but dont think they test that anymore.

Maths seems like shes improed but she tells me most of her maths groups are year 1s.

would the sat level be diffrent to end of year level in report out in july?

does a low level in year 2 mean she would struggle in year 6?

shes bit like me can get good results but needs to work hard for it.

Feenie Sun 12-May-13 21:49:44

So she explained that the schools are really only bothered about those kids just below level 4 who they can pour all the resources into to get them to up their levels.

Only in shitty schools - and then those same results are used to set targets for equally shitty GCSE results.

Feenie Sun 12-May-13 21:51:40

Also, your SIL in talking out of her derriere anyway - schools must also ensure children progress by two levels between KS1 and KS2. So if children who attained 3s in Y2 'only' get 4s, the school is in big trouble.

loopydoo Sun 12-May-13 21:54:49

I may have misunderstood her explanation I guess.... Think she may have said something about the two level thing.

But yes, the school she works in does have a lot of children with SEN and EASL pupils.

Feenie Sun 12-May-13 21:55:56

But yes, the school she works in does have a lot of children with SEN and EASL pupils.

Sorry - not sure what you mean there.

mrz Sun 12-May-13 21:56:48

I'm not sure what SEN and EASL pupils has to do with it hmm

loopydoo Sun 12-May-13 21:59:10

When feenie said a shitty school, I was explaining that the school where my SIL works is a school with a high number of children with special ed needs and English as a Second Language so has a much higher proportion of children who don't achieve level 4.

ipadquietly Sun 12-May-13 22:04:44

As a teacher in a school with many forces children, I can assure loopy that all the same rules apply. In addition to providing a stable, welcoming environment, we also have to ensure our children make good progress (2 levels progress through KS2). We rely on other teachers, their KS1 assessments and their tracking through KS2.

(Sometimes, we despair.)

So, although I agree that emotional stability is very, very important, academic progress is just as important - otherwise the child is being disadvantaged through the chosen lifestyle of his/her parents.

mrz Sun 12-May-13 22:04:53

High levels of SEN and EASL don't equate to a "shitty" school. That has more to do with staff and attitudes.

Feenie Sun 12-May-13 22:07:16

And low aspirations.

aristocat Sun 12-May-13 22:09:13

My DS has his SATs too and they are expected to start school at 8:30 for brain challenges and active, physical games to 'wake them up'

SuffolkNWhat Sun 12-May-13 22:09:25

CAT tests are traditionally used in 8-12 middles (years 4-7) whereas 9-13 middles (years 5-8) used solely TA levels to pass onto Uppers.

Sparklingbrook Sun 12-May-13 22:09:26

DS2 has just come into our bedroom mithering about tomorrow. I have returned him to bed. He says he can't get to sleep.

Sparklingbrook Sun 12-May-13 22:10:31

Oh right Suffolk. Our Middle School is Years 5-7.

loopydoo Sun 12-May-13 22:18:08

I wasn't agreeing that sen and EASL meant that the school was shitty! Quite the opposite, although in SILs school, it is the case that a lot of children do not reach level four due to language/SEN difficulties.

loopydoo Sun 12-May-13 22:18:30

Our middle school is yrs 5 to 8

loopydoo Sun 12-May-13 22:40:34

ipadquietly we dot believe our children are missing out on academics. Far from it. To us though, after having moved ten times in 12 yrs, the happiness of our children outweighs their SATS results.
Of course, we want them to do well academically and we are lucky that they are both above average t the moment in most subjects, however, I think it's a poor tale when parents place everything upon academic merit and not the wider aspects, such as emotional welfare, confidence, self esteem etc.

Found out this morning that dd1 (year 3) has sats this week. Is Monday morning here in a British school overseas. No extra homework or fuss, she's pretty calm about it and mentioned "some tests"....

CouthyMow Mon 13-May-13 02:01:15

Good luck and a peaceful morning to all of you whose DC's start SATS tomorrow.

Sparklingbrook Mon 13-May-13 06:57:21

Oh god. The day has arrived.

everlong Mon 13-May-13 07:02:07

It'll be fine. Try not to stress.
Why are you so worried confused

Sparklingbrook Mon 13-May-13 07:05:19

I think it's just me and my stress of exams. Brings it all back I think. DS2 seems fine. I just feel for him. smile

everlong Mon 13-May-13 07:09:51

Ah I know. It's probably worse for you. Just be all bubbly and nonchalant if you can.
And promise him his favourite food tonight wink

Sparklingbrook Mon 13-May-13 07:20:44

Whenever I am stressed I always have a dream that involves packing in a hurry, or that I am taking my exams and I haven't revised. sad

DS2 is up and chirpy and doesn't seem to share my anxiety fortunately. grin

WilmaFingerdoo Mon 13-May-13 07:26:15

I am annoyed. This morning I came down to hearxa conversation between ds and dh about the changing of the thresholds. Dh was telling that was nothing for ds to worry about. When I asked how he knew about thresholds he said the teachers had told them.
Why?
Why precisely do they need to know that?
Adding additional pointless pressure.
Filling their heads with stuff they DON'T need to know.

lljkk Mon 13-May-13 07:54:50

shock I am astounded at the breath-taking power of it, like the Gods have idly & reflexively stomped on us for Hubris (given the effort DD & me have both went to, to enable her to do L6 SATs):

She has been vomiting since last night. Can't even keep down water at the moment. I have no idea what the school will want to do about her SATs.

I know she's truly ill because she's not wailing in hysterics about the prospect of not getting to do the tests.

Hugglepuff Mon 13-May-13 08:35:05

My Dd's year 6 teacher was lovely - kids told to do no revision and to just relax this weekend.
And that's exactly what we did - art stuff and chalk now covering the kitchen table !
Off to fracture clinic to get Dd's thumb checked and then off to exam - only four days and it will all be over !

Hugglepuff Mon 13-May-13 08:41:06

Big hug to you IIjkk - hope your dd is ok

morethanpotatoprints Mon 13-May-13 08:50:28

It is unfortunate that SATS pressure falls onto y6, but its the fault of Ofsted and parents really.
If teachers didn't have to jump through so many hoops and have the pressure from Ofsted it wouldn't be so bad. If schools weren't judged by parents on these results, it wouldn't be too bad.
There are so many threads on here about not wanting to accept a satisfactory or in measure school place for dc, you can't have it all ways.
Its all so wrong when it is the dc who are pressurised so much.

Sparklingbrook Mon 13-May-13 09:01:56

That is very true more. When parents look at SATs results to choose a school no wonder the pressure is on.

muddysamazingyoni Mon 13-May-13 09:12:13

Well we've had a mini meltdown this morning. sad

I was cooking DDs eggy bread and she came into the kitchen and burst into tears, saying she didn't want to go to school.

We had a talk over breakfast about trying your best etc. I'm phoning the school in a minute dd gets the school bus to let them know.

Bloody SATS.

Sparklingbrook Mon 13-May-13 09:16:13

sad muddys. I has 'I'm nervous' just before DS1 left. sad

Sparkling I have that packing in a hurry stressy dream too, usually about coming home from a trip. Could our mad panicked drive through Miami (a few years ago) looking for the car-hire and then the airport have something to do with it ?

Glad your DS2 was OK this morning. My DS was doing well too, all super organised about his early start for breakfast club, but he did have a minor wibble at one point saying why couldn't he have extra time too (as many do, including his DSis a few years ago), because he says he's never finished a reading (comprehension) paper. He says he reads slower than others and can't remember what it said afterwards.

I feel for him as I think I'm the same. Always have to look for each answer one question at a time with comprehension stuff. But I said just have a read through and try to get a general idea of things.

Ooh, I wonder if he's doing it now ? confused - (general parental angsty face !)

ClaraOswinOswald Mon 13-May-13 09:45:40

lljkk Hope your DD is ok. Poor you and her.

DD went off quite happily today with a four leaf clover in her pocket and an extra drink. She is quite level headed but lucky to be one of the eldest. When I think of her friend who won't be 11 until the end of August I feel so sorry for her.

It's a lot for kids to be put through and the pressure is huge, on the children and the school. A school can't get "good" without good data and anything less brings Ofsted and HMI in like a shot. It shouldn't be like this.

I think the whole Ofsted culture is really wrong, with teachers dreading being "Ofsted'ed" and some children subsequently put under too much pressure, and the curriculum becoming too narrow, driving out the development of a real love of learning through interesting, broader, project work which can respond to children's interests, and teach more than the 3R's
(That short-hand makes me laugh actually with the implied spelling of Writing and Arithmetic grin)

I think there should be much more of an advisory role and relationship from those going into schools, with advisors who are experts in their field getting more alongside teachers and helping to spread and promote best practice. I think (a long time ago) it was possibly more like this, perhaps before education became such a political hot potato ?

peeriebear Mon 13-May-13 10:03:18

I've deliberately said very little about the SATs because DD is not very academic. I just said they were tests for the school, not her, and she should just relax and do her best. She's in breakfast club this week as it's free in SATs week, so she'll have a chill with her friends before it all.

piratecat Mon 13-May-13 10:25:13

lljkk

hope your dd is ok?

my dd started with a sickness bug thursday night which lasted 24 hours, it could be a bug?

Dancergirl Mon 13-May-13 10:29:21

lljk your poor dd

What do to? Sod the SATS that's what. Let your dd rest at home today and don't rush her back to school tomorrow if she's not 100%. Her health comes waayyyy before these tests.

And DON'T let the school bully you into bringing her in, don't answer the phone if neccesary. The general rule is 48 hours after last being sick. Same rules apply, tests or no tests. Think of it as doing all the other dc a favour, not infecting them with the bug.

piratecat Mon 13-May-13 10:33:42

yes deffo. It would have been annoying had dd been ill today but not the end of the world.

There was no way my dd could have sat any bloody sats, she was in and out the bathroom being sick.

Hopefully your dd will recover soon. Dd couldn't keep down water either, but i just kept telling her to take little sips for hydration.
She was really hungry on friday, and tried some dry cereal, but twice was sick.
By the evening she had some more and kept it down.x

ShadeofViolet Mon 13-May-13 11:16:55

We had this last year and I am so glad I wont have to do it again for a few years.

ShadeofViolet Mon 13-May-13 11:17:23

posted too soon.

Was going to say I feel for you all and your DC's.

Dd spent all Sunday lying on the sofa with a temperature and a headache, looking horribly yellow (I kept checking the whites of her eyes, was freaking a bit!). This morning, bright and breezy, bounded off to school saying "we get to play rounders after the test". Leaving me dealing with the barrage of texts from concerned rellies wanting to know if she made it to school ok grin.

Iljkk I think they are allowed to take each test up to 5 days after the original day. You and the teachers are supposed to make sure she doesn't get a chance to ask those who sat the test, what was in it (as if they'd remember much!). And if she doesn't get to sit the test ... it doesn't really matter. Better to miss it, than to sit it when she isn't 100%, do worse than she could have and feel bad about it.

CouthyMow Mon 13-May-13 11:35:51

Well, I will eat my own words about DS1 being cool about his SATS. They haven't seemingly bothered him all weekend, but this morning he had a massive meltdown over what needed to go into his see-through pencil case!!

Bloody SATS indeed!!

Tingalingle Mon 13-May-13 11:37:04

lljk your poor DD!

Be warned that the school might indeed want her to do the SATS from her sick bed.That's how DS did his, 6 years ago.

The really embarrassing bit was that they sent someone round to 'check that we didn't still have any educational posters on display in his bedroom'.

Erm, no, we didn't.

Tingalingle Mon 13-May-13 11:38:18

Oh, and I would have told them to stuff it, but DS has autism and was definitely not going to deal well with 'Not Doing SATs' after being told for weeks that this was the week to do them.

Your DS sounds very like mine Couthy. Quite cool over the weekend, but it all hit him a bit this morning. But I guess Monday morning is often a pressure point for everyone isn't it ? Hopefully they'll be back to cool again by tomorrow smile

grants1000 Mon 13-May-13 12:05:20

Who can tell me which sats are on which days? Reading today?

DS so laid back, due to excellent teacher minimising stress & worry about it all.

DS just requested a Kit Kat Chunky after school for doing his SATS today and he will tell me every morning what he would like as a treat!

grants1000 Mon 13-May-13 12:05:57

He as nervous and just wanted to get into school early and get going, I think the will all feel a lot better after the first one is out the way.

melika Mon 13-May-13 12:07:24

My DC didn't even know it was SATs week when they did them, they just told the kids it was over a few weeks in May. Don't remember any stress at all!! Pencil case contents must have been provided.

Iamnotminterested Mon 13-May-13 12:07:55

Reading comprehension today.

Nice paper.

grants1000 Mon 13-May-13 12:08:59

Fab thanks, and what for the rest of the week? (if you don't mind)

RustyBear Mon 13-May-13 12:11:01

Today is reading (comprehension), tomorrow is the spelling, punctuation and grammar and the two Maths ones are on Wednesday and Thursday, plus mental maths on Wednesday.

Iamnotminterested Mon 13-May-13 12:11:11

SPG tomorrow.

boxershorts Mon 13-May-13 12:46:26

Some of the SATS and HOMEWORK statemenst here are horrendous and need widder publication.

FRI TV Any of you see the Hong kong exam hot house exams (Which Master Gove approves of) ?

chicaguapa Mon 13-May-13 12:51:15

I know this is controversial, but I don't mind the SATS at the end of KS2 tbh. I think DC should get used to doing tests and the general jumping through of hoops required of them all through life. Tests are as much a part of school as everything else and I think it should be seen as a practice for the pressures they'll be put under at secondary school and in time, their GCSEs.

It's all well and good saying they're only 11, but most of them are gaining independence by now, have mobile phones, are out with their friends on their own at weekends, some have boyfriends etc and are more than ready for secondary school. I know this doesn't apply to all those in y6 (DD included) but my point is that they are growing up and I'm sure they can cope with tests in y6 with a focus on how well they've done at primary school.

DD hasn't brought any papers home to do, other than ones she did in class. She had a little wobble last night, but we just said that it's her chance to do her best and show what she can do. We are focussing less on the level she achieves and more on the attitude that she should be approaching the tests with. She's doing all the level 6 papers too but she knows that there's no difference between level 5 & level 6 at secondary school.

Parents do put a lot of emphasis on league tables and the pay-off for that is pressure on the y6 to do well in their SATS and produce the results that parents value so highly. Equally parents want to ensure that their DC has access to the best teaching at primary school and again, how else can you ensure that unless you measure schools and teachers on progress and acheivement?

boxershorts Mon 13-May-13 12:54:08

Its a matter of degree, CHICA. Are you not impressed by some of the worrying statements on here about SATS and HOMEWORK EXCESS?

chicaguapa Mon 13-May-13 13:00:19

Yes, I agree that too much stress is a bad thing.

As a parent, I would probably decide how much I felt was appropriate. eg. If DD didn't want to do the level 6 papers and the school was putting her under pressure to do them, I would have to look at it differently and ask the school not to enter her for them. DD has had some mind map homework to revise for the SPaG paper, but I said she didn't have to do it as she only got 1 wrong in the level 6 practice paper and I thought the time was better spent for her to relax instead.

Every DC is different but in principle, I don't think the SATS are a bad thing, but not for the schools to escalate them out of all proportion maybe. confused

boxershorts Mon 13-May-13 13:02:01

Chica thanks for the response I learn a lot from reading sites like this

PastSellByDate Mon 13-May-13 13:07:36

Hi there:

DDs are in Y5 and Y3 so have this all to look forward (?) to but just wanted to wish everyone good luck.

By the way was I the only one to read from mrz

In past years we have opened the pool before school for a swim or splash around...

Can I just ask - Is this an ordinary state school mrz? I'm suddenly feeling a lot better about the fact that a lot of what you say happens at your school isn't at our ordinary, run of the mill, inner city state school.

Agree with chicaguapa. Completely. I do think some people get a bit excited about testing like it is a new thing and all the fault of the evil league tables but I was tested at 11 35 years ago so there have always been tests.

But I also have to say not all school pile on the pressure. They don't at my boys' school. They are realistic about it. I don't have a child doing them this year but a friend wants to take her yr 6 DS to a footie match (last match of the season, premier league, season ticket holders) and the school have said he should go and not worry about the maths SATs the next day as he is more than capable of doing it. That sort of relaxed attitude won't make them a nightmare for the children.

It does horrify me the lengths some schools go to though. I wouldn't mind betting that the ones who are piling on the pressure aren't the ones rated outstanding or good though. They clearly have something to prove. Maybe they should have worked harder at making sure children have worked hard for all 4 yrs in the Juniors rather than having to cram it all in during yr 6. If the children had been making steady progress there would have been no need for last minute panics.

I also think some parents make it a nightmare for their children by asking them if they are worried, buying extra workbooks and all that. You just don't have to do that. My attitude was to keep a watchful eye bu I would rather my elder DS did as well as he could without cramming and get put in a realistic set at secondary school than to have him cram and fret, do exceptionally well by his standards and then put a set that was too high and where he could struggle and fail.

Ledkr Mon 13-May-13 13:24:43

Dd wasn't nervous but seemed over excited and was loud and bounding about like a Labrador on speed.
She was excited at the prospect of doing fun stuff after sats.
Might have a ceremonial burning of the papers and books at the weekend grin
Load of old bollox really.

Ledkr Mon 13-May-13 13:26:16

past dd has a lovely pool at her ordinary state primary.

AhBut Mon 13-May-13 13:40:44

3-5 paper was about Jungle Book and wolves apparently. Right up my mini- Attenborough's street.

Dancergirl Mon 13-May-13 13:53:10

Should we be discussing content when some children might be taking them later?

Sparklingbrook Mon 13-May-13 13:54:32

Aren't they all taken at exactly the same time?

LackaDAISYcal Mon 13-May-13 13:55:31

I've just had to go and pick DS up from school as he "is ill". I spoke to him on the phone and the first thing I said was..."is your exam over?" After spending yesterday telling him that it wasn't a big deal and they were more for the school than the pupil. He ws like hmm

Now worrying about tomorrow and what to do with him if he is indeed still poorly; though apart from a bit of a sniffle, he seems OK. I think it was probably a combination of a bit of a cold and comedown after all the stress of the build up. He said the paper was OK; it was about wolves and there was a bit of Jungle Book in there, so he felt confident as he devours nature programmes and felt quite knowledgeable. Though he didn't attempt a couple of questions as he didn't understand what they were asking.

So, if he is ill tomorrow, do I send him, or not?

LackaDAISYcal Mon 13-May-13 13:56:50

They are all taken at the same time dancergirl. Otherwise the DC would have all had to sign a gagging order!

Ledkr Mon 13-May-13 13:58:20

No you certainly do not. If he's ill he needs to be at home.

Dancergirl Mon 13-May-13 13:59:03

Didn't someone say unthread that there is a 5 day window for ill dc to sit them?

Ledkr Mon 13-May-13 13:59:40

Dd will have a migraine later. I'm half expecting it but am at work so waiting have to call in emergency people.

Dancergirl Mon 13-May-13 14:01:28

No of course not lack You don't pick and choose what to go into school for! If they're well they go to school, if they're ill they don't!

Feenie Mon 13-May-13 14:01:57

Yes, there is a five day period for the first time this year in case of illness.

GaryBarlowsPants Mon 13-May-13 14:06:31

DD has been incredibly quiet and moody over the weekend, despite us reassuring her that the sats are more about testing the school than her, as such. I will be glad when this week is over! Does anyone know when we get the results? I'm assuming they will be included in their end if year report but I'm not sure.

Hope DS is better tomorrow lack.

mumofthemonsters808 Mon 13-May-13 14:06:42

Lacka I would see how he feels tomorrow sometimes a good rest can work wonders. Our school is adamant that however poorly your child is they must attend, whatever illness they have can apparently be accommodated. A teacher will come and collect the child and return them to their sickbed once the test is over. I'm sorry but if my DD had a vomiting bug there is no way I would send her in. How can anyone be expected to do a test paper in between throwing up and being drained by the heaving and dehydration ?

AhBut Mon 13-May-13 14:20:44

5 day window or not, you won't be able to stop the kids talking! I know the even 6 one too, but not telling now smile

AhBut Mon 13-May-13 14:21:02

Level!

Wishihadabs Mon 13-May-13 14:32:12

we've not got SATs for 2 years. TBH I am depressed by the minimum standards set for nc children and even more so by the schools freaking out over the dcs achieving when all's said and done very average measures of progress (like cm Ds was level 3 at the end of year 2 , now (yr 4) levels 4a/5c and I thought he had stalled a bit in year 3. Two levels over 4 years really should be a minimum surely. (Not talking about sn btw).

Dancergirl Mon 13-May-13 14:39:58

That's madness mumofthemonsters why don't parents at your school protest by withdrawing your dc as a group from sitting them??

In fact I'm amazed how some people are just sitting back and taking this rubbish from the school.

ReculverTowers Mon 13-May-13 14:44:18

our school even had the cheek to say parents should take in children who are usually on transport shock it's not their bloody gcses

Sparklingbrook Mon 13-May-13 14:46:50

I might say DS1 is ill tomorrow if it gets him a lift in. wink

LackaDAISYcal Mon 13-May-13 14:48:08

He seems much recovered, but is a bit snotty. An early night will do wonders I'm sure; he was up quite late last night fretting about today!

Ruprekt Mon 13-May-13 14:50:48

Message deleted by Mumsnet for giving too much info about the content of SATS papers

Ledkr Mon 13-May-13 14:52:22

This is ridiculous isn't it. If be pissed off if my dd had to sit next to a child with a bug then got it herself gave it to the baby or me and dh who would then need sick time grrrrrr
It's bloody madness

Sparklingbrook Mon 13-May-13 14:52:27

What's the plan for the morning Ruprekt? I hope DS enjoyed the paper too. I will find out in about half an hour. smile Then we will be doing SPAG revision. sad

crazeelaydee Mon 13-May-13 14:53:45

SATS were a nightmare for Ds in year 2 it was relentless!, In fact anyone would of thought I was the one sitting them from how much jeffing grief I had about them...think I was averaging 3 times a week that "SATS" was mentioned to me by the frantic teacher. To this day I still do not see how they benefit a child in any way, when teachers are constantly assessing the Dc to be sure they are progressing.

During a recent meeting at Ds's school the HT muttered the "key stage 2 SATS" (DS is only in yr 3!) to me and I may of just flashed him an icy glance across the room, should of asked him in what way they would effect my Ds's education???? never thought of that. Well this time I will not be getting as stressed about the bloody SATS and I certainly won't be adding any additional pressure on my Ds because of them.

LackaDAISYcal Mon 13-May-13 14:58:26

No revision needed here, according to the school. Which is good as I've never been an advocate of last minute cramming even though it got me through my uni finals

Hmm, they don't sound like they were too bad today, though thinking R&R a little high-brow ? Not sure DS will have heard of them but I know that shouldn't matter too much.

Rockinhippy Mon 13-May-13 15:20:55

My own DD isn't even doing these yet - but seems is STILL feeling the pressure of watching her friends in the year above feeling SATS stress sad that & having her teacher tell the class how important it is they get top marks as it affects where they are in HS, DD was under the impression that meant if they don't do well, they don't get into the better schools sad -

It seemed so wrong to have to put her straight & tell her who of our friends did well for themselves - DESPITE failing in school & how it's not the end of the world - if you are clever & work hard, it will shine through anyway

My DD has health problems affected by stress & is a perfectionist, so I am dreading SATS, she's hyped up enough about upcoming tests as it is, though she did seem more relaxed after my undermining everything her teacher had said telling her its not so important so long as she just does her best

kjrv81 Mon 13-May-13 15:48:14

Well first day of sats here for us. DD1 coped well, she said it was ok. She likes animals so glad it was about the jungle.

Can't wait for this week to be over.

crunchbag Mon 13-May-13 15:55:50

First test over, DS enjoyed his afternoon doing PE and DT

Can't believe people actually sent their children in when they are ill.

DS is happy enough and says he finished this morning's paper.

Ruprekt Mon 13-May-13 16:19:01

Crunchbag......we had to send them in!! angry

No option.

School were great though. The school receptionist went up to give ds some ibuprofen at 10am, he had a rest in the office at break along with a bottle lucozade and a packet of crisps which then got him through the short writing task.

He came home at 12.

Plan for tomorrow is the same.

Dosing him up with calpol and ibuprofen every 2 hours.

grants1000 Mon 13-May-13 16:27:35

DS is on a high, said it was easy, he has dyslexia and had help and extra time - so I am pleased he is pleased.

He's got no chance with the spelling tomorrow, but we know that as it is where he really stresses and struggles. But hey he can nearly touch type and knows what he wants to say and can say it how he needs.

He says he is doing a science one also? I did not think there was a science one? I've not asked him more as he said I was 'being moring with the questions'

Ruprekt Mon 13-May-13 16:34:38

grants.....ours did the 2 science papers last week.

Not statutory tests.....ds did one from 2009.

morethanpotatoprints Mon 13-May-13 16:36:04

OMG.

There's no way I would send my dc in if they were ill. Tell them to shove it, they're not God.
Ruprekt
I'm not blaming you, i just can't believe the bloody cheek. If they are no better tomorrow I'd keep them off. grin

Ruprekt Mon 13-May-13 16:40:59

But ds INSISTED on going in.

He has always had 100% attendance apart from earlier this year when he had a viral infection again! He does respond well to calpol and ibuprofen and he is glad he went in to do Sats.

He did not want to be on his own doing the tests.

His teacher was really proud of him. smilesmile

OhLori Mon 13-May-13 16:45:32

I couldn't give a stuff about SATS. If my son's school pulled this SATS hysteria stunt, I would threaten to pull him out of the exams, and if necessary the school.

Parents are way too craven to schools, IMO, and we seem to have lost all sense of proportion if this is what is going on in schools.

Originally, weren't teachers meant to keep quiet about SATS? They were just meant to be normal tests that children undertook, barely realising what they were doing?

morethanpotatoprints Mon 13-May-13 16:47:47

Ruprekt

I think your ds is marvellous and any other children who have battled through illness. I just think its wrong of schools and hypocritical to insist they attend if ill.
How can they say 48 hours compulsory absence if you have a bug? Oh, but wait, its SATS well they can come in a throw up over everyone.
My 2 ds didn't even know they had done theirs, no pressure from school and parents weren't informed when they were. Oh the good old days grin I think it has gone mad now and we will be celebrating the week when dds friends have to do theirs grin

Message deleted by Mumsnet for giving too much info about the content of SATS papers

LackaDAISYcal Mon 13-May-13 17:00:38

My DS left a couple out in the Jungle Book section Ellen as he wasn't sure what they were asking.

I was disappointed he didn't get to bring the paper home with him, like you do for your high school and uni exams! I'd like to have an ogle smile

Theas18 Mon 13-May-13 17:04:26

Best of luck to all the DCs this week.

I definitely go with all the " it's for testing the school". It's easy ish with very bright kids because doing tests is a way of life for them, they seem to roll from one test/exam to the next. Easy to for get that each hurdle is the " biggest ever" though (OK apart from 11+ was before SATS).

Fortunately my youngest is 14 (almost) and they all remember SATS week as the week breakfast club did bacon butties rather than the tests themselves! Shame it's not like that now.

Mind you even 9yrs ago when my nearly 20yr old did them the whole of year 6 was a wash out as it was ALL SATS and very little happened for the kids starting year 6 on a 5a, the higher level papers had been abolished then and now are back! at least that gives he brightest something to aim for.

Deeply disagree with after school and saturday cramming clases though!

Schools use the past papers as practice papers, so I guess that's why they don't let them out. And DC like lljkk's DD are doing it tomorrow.

catinhat Mon 13-May-13 17:12:22

We all create this culture.

Parents pick schools because of their league table position and Ofsted reports. (Not all, but many. In our area, the number of people who apply to schools is definitely in proportion to their league table position)

Therefore, schools obsess about sats and Ofsted.

Therefore year 6 children in some (or most) schools are pushed horribly.

Why don't people withdraw people from sats? Secondary schools don't use them for setting; they do their own assessments or testing.

crunchbag Mon 13-May-13 17:29:11

Ruprekt how can it be not an option to keep him home? What is the school going to do?

I understand your DS wanting to go but really he should be at home no matter how well he reacts to calpol. He shouldn't feel like it is his 'duty' to go in. It is madness.

girliefriend Mon 13-May-13 17:35:27

My dd is in year 2 and I haven't heard anything about her doing her SATs. Infact I have just asked her if she has had to do a test or heard anything about her SATs and she shrugged her shoulders grin

No SATs madness here then!!

I don't agree with SATs and would not pander to all this extra stress and work tbh. I think its wrong.

Ruprekt Mon 13-May-13 17:51:13

It never crossed my mind to keep him home once he said he was going in!

mrz Mon 13-May-13 18:04:45

He obviously felt up to going in Ruprekt

Ruprekt Mon 13-May-13 18:23:38

Exactly mrz.

If he had been as ill as he was a few months ago, there was no way he could have gone in as he was vomiting and dizzy.

I would have phoned the school to ask what needed to be done.

Sparklingbrook Mon 13-May-13 18:31:03

Well DS2 survived the day. Level 5 paper in the morning, Level 6 one last lesson. He says it was 'ok'.

ChildrensStoriesNet Mon 13-May-13 18:40:10

From my own school and college experience "pressure" didn't help at all, my best work was always when I was relaxed and free to think about what I was doing.

There are those who say they thrive on pressure, perhaps it's a question of how much, we are all different and that's precisely why good teachers need the freedom to do what they know is best.

When working as a specialist teacher, individually adjusting the approach to each individual gave a 70% success rate, when the tick boxes arrived this dropped to 43%.

signet Mon 13-May-13 18:44:08

DS1 loved the SATS reading comprehension today. He is a mad keen Jungle Book fan and has read it so many times so it really boosted his confidence to have it in the test today.

All in all it was an interesting paper for him and he thinks he has done really well. Mostly he was just happy because the year 6 kids are allowed to take chocolate in to school for break time this week!

Sparklingbrook Mon 13-May-13 18:45:10

I wish it had been about Minecraft/FIFA13/Top Gear. grin

signet Mon 13-May-13 18:47:02

haha yes they would have all loved that. At least it was vaguely interesting for them though. I've heard some years have been dreadfully boring.

Ledkr Mon 13-May-13 18:53:56

I just wowed dd with my magic powers of knowing what the paper was about. She was shocked for all of ten seconds then glanced at my I phone and said "mumsnet" and rolled her eyes.

Sparklingbrook Mon 13-May-13 18:54:58

I did that too Ledkr. grin he was all 'how did you know?'

Ruprekt Mon 13-May-13 18:57:34

gringringrin

EleanorFarjeon Mon 13-May-13 19:33:55

The verdict in this house was that the L5 paper (wolves, Jungle Book) was 'easy' and the L6 (sporting endeavors from what I could gather) was 'really hard' with no multiple choice answers.

DS3 found the level 6 paper really hard as well. TBH, I only found out last Friday he was doing it. Bit of a surprise as while he is good at maths, I didn't think his English was up there. After doing this paper I guess I was right! grin

LackaDAISYcal Mon 13-May-13 19:48:05

Last years L5 paper was extremely hard, to the point that DS's teacher said he was convinced it should have been a L6 paper! I'm glad they got an easier ride of it this year!

DS is still sneezing and groaning, but wants to be there earlier tomorrow so he's first in the queue for breakfast grin

Sparklingbrook Mon 13-May-13 19:50:04

DS2 says the 'Going the Distance' Level 6 paper was ok, but the very first question was a 3 point one. i don't know why this bothered him but he seems very obsessed with how many points a question carries. confused

EleanorFarjeon Mon 13-May-13 19:53:14

Same here Ellen. I knew ages ago ds was doing maths L6, but the teacher decided to put him in for everything recently.

He's good at maths, but the rest? Distinctly average imo!

I feel a bit sorry for him sitting both papers all week.

snozzlemaid Mon 13-May-13 19:57:22

My dd is glad today is over. It was the test she likes least. She thought the level 5 this morning was fine but the level 6 this afternoon was difficult, as others have said.

BTW according to my DS's timetable the morning paper was a level 3/4/5 paper and not just a 5 ! The so called "expected" level is still a 4.
I think it's a bit daft to have an "expected" level though. Clearly some children will get a 3 and some a 5 and for many either of those will be good for them - representing their own best work and effort.
Just like they don't come with a manual they don't come in a standard format either smile
Pet hate is when the politicians say "every child should pass ...."
Oh really, and what about the many with special needs and individual differences ?

D1 said he preferred the topic on the Level 3-5 reading, but that the L6 reading was OK too - he said it was more straightforward than some of the practice papers they have been doing.

He isn't looking forward to tomorrows though. Thankfully he is not doing the L6 GAPS.

midas Mon 13-May-13 20:10:52

Question please for teachers/TA. Do you check the papers while you are helping with invigilating.
Reason being my dd was told off by the Ht for not finishing her test. She didn't give her the opportunity to say a word. Came home in tears.

Yes, level 4 used to be the average. To turn an average into a target seems a bit, hmm, ignorant? My DS3 could teach them a thing or two about statistics! wink

Ledkr Mon 13-May-13 20:38:16

Midas poor dd how dare the ht do that. Dd missed out four questions she not I could care less she just wants her hair on bendy rollers grin

Feenie Mon 13-May-13 20:38:22

We're not allowed to check them - but you couldn't help but notice a child not finishing. Not much point telling them off though, unless they were sat doing nothing?

chickensaladagain Mon 13-May-13 20:45:38

Dd thought this morning's paper was confusing as it jumped around and was asking about the pictures when it's supposed to be reading

She thought this afternoon was easy

She often does this and thinks the harder papers are easier -strange child

MiaowTheCat Mon 13-May-13 20:46:36

Loads of kids don't finish all the questions on an average year. I always feel sorry for the kids who really are below the tests and shouldn't have been put in for them - when they write things like "I dont no!" in the question spaces and you just want to go pick 'em up and give 'em a hug.

Think the only checking that goes on generally is clarifying names etc before they go off to the markers - schools tend to go through and change nicknames to proper names, put the surname kids are down on the records as onto papers where they've surname changed and put dates of birth on any ambiguous ones so it's clear which child things relate to.

midas Mon 13-May-13 20:47:11

Was told by TA to leave 3 marks questions and didn't get the chance to finish. Left about 8 marks undone.

DS2 had a mini-wobble just before bed last night, because reading comprehension is his weakest subject. He has very little confidence in his ability to infer things (reading 'between the lines') in reading comprehension, due to his ASD. What he infers is not always what the author was trying to imply! smile

He felt the reading went OK though. He is hoping for a strong level 5.

Tomorrow (SPAG) is a long day for him as he has three papers. I have tried to give him a pep talk about keeping his handwriting legible.

To be honest, he was more thrown about having to have a bottle of water and a mid-morning snack (both outside his usual routine) than anything else.

Sparklingbrook Mon 13-May-13 20:52:17

We are still wading our way through SPAG homework here. He's done the Maths past paper and now we are on 'superlatives'. Bedtime looms....

muddysamazingyoni Mon 13-May-13 20:56:12

DD came home with a big smile on her face. -- i was expecting to deal with the fallout from this morning--

DD said she enjoyed the tests and only found one question hard.

She told me tomorrow is the SPAG test. DD called it the spagbol test. smile

I'm so relieved DD is more positive.

pointythings Mon 13-May-13 20:58:23

SPAG homework the night before the SPAG test? Really? Does your DS want to do this or are the school insane enough to make him?

DD2 tells me the Yr6 are not stressed out at all, seems like her school is keeping it low key. I hope it's the same next year when she's in Yr6. She had a go at the L3 to L5 sample SPAG paper online (I couldn't stop her!) and really enjoyed it, strange girl that she is.

Sparklingbrook Mon 13-May-13 21:00:29

he says it's due in tomorrow pointy. confused

androbbob Mon 13-May-13 21:07:48

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

pointythings Mon 13-May-13 21:09:40

But he's doing the SPAG test tomorrow! I mean, what's the point? I don't blame you for being confused, if he hasn't misunderstood then his school is really losing it!

DD2 already knows I will shield her from this kind of nonsense if her school are mad enough to try it, but then I am an obstreperous and contrary so and so strong-willed.

pointythings Mon 13-May-13 21:11:35

androbbob I doubt there's that much difference between the top of the middle set and the bottom of the top set. DD1 is in Yr7 and the range in her top maths set is mid-level 5 to high level 6/borderline 7. The teachers know how to differentiate even in that group.

CouthyMow Mon 13-May-13 21:33:25

DS1 said the lvl 3-5 paper was easy, but there was one really hard question in the lvl 6 paper that he's unsure if he got right or not.

He's obviously had to use his brain today - he took himself off to bed at 7pm, which is unheard of - his usual bedtime is 9.30 on a school night, and he doesn't usually fall asleep until gone 11pm!

grin

I can't wait for Friday!

piratecat Mon 13-May-13 21:46:42

dd said it was about wolves, was quite good as she likes wolves, but would have preferred something about Take That. Then she came in, ate a double decker and played sonic on the Wii.

that's my girl!!

lucjam Mon 13-May-13 22:00:59

DD said that the level 3-5 was easy but found the 6 quite hard, as aparently did the others doing the level 6 paper, which was about swimming apparently.

So SPAG tomorrow, will be glad to get that one over with. The onto maths and she's only doing level 3-5 so no worries about level 6.

Roll on Thursday 3pm!

AChickenCalledKorma Mon 13-May-13 22:33:50

According to DD1, in the level 6 paper, the passage was easier than usual but the questions were much harder and her brain froze. So that's encouraging hmm!

mumof2beautifulgirls84 Tue 14-May-13 09:14:04

Completely off topic here but I'm new and was wondering if someone could tell me how to post my own post please?.

piratecat Tue 14-May-13 09:34:25

go to the topic you want, and you will see top left, 'start a new thread in this topic'

hope that helps.

welcome!

LackaDAISYcal Tue 14-May-13 09:40:54

Aw, my poor DS. He has gone in coughing and sneezing, loaded with tissues and cough sweets and dosed up on paracetomol sad. He wouldn't hear of not going in though; too indoctrinated over the last few months about how Very Very Important SATs are hmm

We sent a note asking that he is allowed home after the exam. He isn't doing level 6 thankfully. If he was I would still have wanted him home after the morning paper.

Sparklingbrook Tue 14-May-13 09:47:57

Aww Lack poor soul. He'll be back soon. x

So, is it spagbol for tea tonight then ? smile

Sparklingbrook Tue 14-May-13 09:52:40

SPAG bol all round. or will it be GASP as it was reeaaallyy hard? sad

So long as there are no GAPS in their knowledge. Boom boom!

piratecat Tue 14-May-13 10:00:14

grin

LackaDAISYcal Tue 14-May-13 10:09:20

grin

Sparklingbrook Tue 14-May-13 10:16:30

This thread has just appeared. It's not right is it? sad

cherrycarpet Tue 14-May-13 10:28:50

Day 2. DS1 doing level 5 & 6 SPAG today and was VERY grumpy as we walked to school this morning. Sounded like he missed out about 3 or 4 questions yesterday as 'the page was stuck together'... Oh dear. Never mind - roll on end of Thursday.

MadeOfStarDust Tue 14-May-13 10:32:59

My dd came home really happy - she sat the 3-5 paper and was pleased she got to the end of it and only left out one question. She said it wasn't the easiest paper she'd done (4 or 5 practise papers at school) but it wasn't the hardest either...

Why all the "level 6 was hard though" stuff - of course it was! It's supposed to be....

MadeOfStarDust Tue 14-May-13 10:34:33

Oh and dd went skipping off to school today - SPAG is her "favourite" test - strange girl!! grin

Sparklingbrook Tue 14-May-13 10:36:16

DS1 (13) was 'SPAG? What on earth is that?!' when DS2 told him what the test was.

mam29 Tue 14-May-13 10:42:43

dd1 year 2came home yesterday. says her teacher been out again at meetings.

shes in mixed year 1class but phonics test not until june.
she passed phonics test last year.

doesnt appear shes had any tests.

however she was talking to a year 5 about sats.
I said oh really what is a sat shes like mum its an exam and test that year 6 take.

Why do they take it? its to help determine what group they in for senior school.

Are you sure? did the year 5 or year 6 kids tell you this?
no the year 5 teacher when I asked her

so would school perpetuate that myth that it determines sets in year 7 to try get them work harder?

Then my weird child says I cant wait to do my sats.

maybe in 4years things will change.

im assuming year 2sats possibly next week as teacher said few weeks ago they not happened yet and happen in may.

MadeOfStarDust Tue 14-May-13 10:54:14

Y2 sats are usually subsumed into classroom work so they don't even know they are being tested.. Ours are happening here over the next 2 weeks...

LackaDAISYcal Tue 14-May-13 11:16:18

DS is home. Teachers told him to go even though he wanted to stay. I think they were worried about him spreading his germs around too generously grin

He said the papers were fine, pretty easy. He generally does well with spelling and grammar though.

He better not get used to these half days though!!

Sparklingbrook Tue 14-May-13 11:17:24

That's great Lack. Phew. smile

nipersvest Tue 14-May-13 11:36:10

just reading some of the comments, funnily enough, dd has said the same, yesterdays paper wasn't the easiest they had done during practices, but wasn't the hardest. and of the level 6, she said it was a nice passage to read, but the questions were hard.

mumofthemonsters808 Tue 14-May-13 12:17:41

DD said yesterday's level 5 paper was ok but she found the level 6 paper very difficult.I did not even know she was doing the higher level paper and she was surprised also.

Lack- Glad your son got to sit today's paper, it's not easy having to do a test when you do not feel too good so I'd be very proud of him regardless of the result.

ProudAS Tue 14-May-13 12:43:45

I work in education and will try to clarify a few points.

SATs in year 2 and the phonics check can be pretty low key depending on how the school handles them and children may well not realise that they have been tested. The year 2 tests inform teacher assessment and are normally administered round about now but there is no set time.

If your dcs are in year 6 reassure them that they won't lose their (already offered) place at high school if they don't do as well as they hoped and that the results do not map out their entire future. They may initially be placed in sets at high school depending on the SAT results but this should be reviewed later and teaching staff know that one test result does not tell the entire story of a child's ability.

I am not aware of any proven link between test preparation (extra homework versus relaxing weekend) and performance in the SATs but would be interested to know whether it has been investigated.

Ruprekt Tue 14-May-13 13:37:03

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

lljkk Tue 14-May-13 14:01:17

Ooh, ooh, let me in, budge up. Saw DD at noon & she is manically happy doing exams (weirdo) so I have green light to rejoin the thread.

DD's teacher wasn't planning to enter anyone for L6 SATs until end of March when I told him when the L6 tests were. I cannot say there's been any pushiness either.

ClaraOswinOswald Tue 14-May-13 14:57:54

Is there a separate level 5 paper or do people mean the 3/4/5 paper? I know there is a level 6 but it's all getting a bit confusing.

Glad the SPAG seemed ok.

KateSMumsnet (MNHQ) Tue 14-May-13 15:33:45

Hello all,

Just a quick note to say please be circumspect with how much info you give about your DCs exams, as some won't have taken certain papers yet.

So it's fine to say "DD found the English exam a breeze", but not "DD found the English exam a breeze, she's been able to spell quixotic since she was 3". We will withdraw post that give away too much info.

KateSMumsnet (MNHQ) Tue 14-May-13 15:34:23

Oh and good luck to all involved!

Sparklingbrook Tue 14-May-13 15:35:53

DS2 had to go for a poo in the middle of his test. grin

lljkk Tue 14-May-13 15:45:56

yes, there was some rather specific info on here! I don't blame anyone, but glad I restrained from even reading the thread until now.

Clara there is a usual test to discriminate from level 3c-5a and another test for those thought able to obtain 6c-6a marks. A small minority are being offered the L6 and of these the vast majority will not pass (probably).

Sparklingbrook*: at least he wasn't being marked on that! smile

bold type fail!

Sparklingbrook Tue 14-May-13 16:30:23

He may have been Three. I would give him a Level 6 if he flushed and put the lid down. grin

How horrible to have to put your hand up though. sad he said one child's constant coughing was a bit of a distraction.

CatelynStark Tue 14-May-13 16:47:23

My girl was poorly last Thursday and Friday so I kept her off school. She had panic attacks on Saturday and Sunday night sad so I was expecting a bit of drama.

I told her that if she was still ill on Monday, then I'd keep her off. She told me that the school had said if anyone was absent, they would deliver the papers to the house so the child could do them at home???

My first thought was 'Shit! I'll have to Hoover!' grin

Yet she's been fine - coming out of school very tired though. I think I'll be happier on Thursday afternoon than she will!

Apparently the school have organised a surprise for them - it had better be at least a trip to the bowling alley as that's what my two older ones had smile

lljkk Tue 14-May-13 17:04:03

4.5 hours of tests for DD, today. Missing a day is definitely not advised. smile

grants1000 Tue 14-May-13 17:31:57

My DS has just developed a hideous cough and asthma wheeze, all kicked off by frigging hayfever in the space of 24 hours, he took his SATS today, then school called me at lunchtime saying they were concerned, but now feels terrible, looks grey, can't stop coughing, Ventolined up to the eyeballs, got an emergency docs appt at 6pm after earlier phone appt, I am praying they give him some prednislosone (sp?) I have been giving him hayfever meds for the past 8 weeks in preparation for this f'ing SATS week. We are both utterly pissed off.

lljkk Tue 14-May-13 17:40:24

the can be rescheduled, Grants100, but will mean social and Internet isolation until he's done them, which could be into next week (or so I've heard).

lljkk Tue 14-May-13 17:40:35

THEY even

Had a look at the 3-5 SPAG test, first one I've seen so no idea if it was particularly easy or difficult. It was easier than I expected, though. I could answer all the questions, which, considering I was brought up in the 70s with very little formal grammar teaching, was amazing! I shan't give away any details... blush

Myliferocks Tue 14-May-13 18:30:08

DD3 came home yesterday and today saying that both the level 5 and level 6 papers were easy.
I did nicely point out that that doesn't necessarily mean that she answered them correctly. grin
Hopefully she'll still feel the same come the end of the wee.
DS1 is in year 5 and has been doing internal sats all week and he reckons the ones he has done have been hard.

spanieleyes Tue 14-May-13 18:42:32

The Year 5 optional papers are harder than the 3-5 Year 6 papers for some strange reason!

Myliferocks Tue 14-May-13 19:19:05

Aaaaaahhhh! Just noticed!

the end of the week blush

yaki Tue 14-May-13 19:35:08

My children were in at the start of all this, I would never have guessed it would be turning children into nervous wrecks at 11 .

Indeed schools are judged by results, and some schools are poor. But it is your child and their happiness and well being are your main concern.

I was in a school recently and when a new class of Yr 7 were asked about the poems they liked one child piped up 'genre'. Tal about brain washing.

lljkk Tue 14-May-13 20:12:50

DD says she feels quite relaxed about them, a bit meh even. Thing I realise now, they build up to this from yr2 (the exam format and whole assessment weeks, I mean). So there's nothing too different, except a feeling that the staff themselves is excited about it and some other special rules apply. Not that different otherwise.

forehead Tue 14-May-13 20:50:05

When my dd tells me that she has found a test 'easy,' i am always concerned. It usually means that she has not answered the question .

hugoagogo Tue 14-May-13 22:45:49

poor dd did 5 tests today, It is ridiculous.

Sparklingbrook Wed 15-May-13 06:56:56

Day 3. We are getting there slowly.......

Maths today for DS2. It's one of his favourite subjects (or at least it was before SATs sucked much of the joy out of it).

mrz Wed 15-May-13 07:06:34

They aren't meant to do 5 tests a day shock hugoagogo! There are only 5 tests (plus 4 level 6) to be taken over 4 days

seeker Wed 15-May-13 07:08:29

Why on earth did she do 5?

Sparklingbrook Wed 15-May-13 07:19:37

DS2 has announced this morning he isn't very good at maths. Nothing like thinking positive eh? hmm

RustyBear Wed 15-May-13 07:27:01

The spelling and grammar were on two different papers, so if she was doing level 6 as well, she might have counted them as '4 tests’. Not sure where number 5 came from, unless she was sick on Monday and did the reading paper yesterday.

CouthyMow Wed 15-May-13 07:30:11

DS1 said that the Spelling was easy, as was the punctuation and Grammar papers, but that the lvl 6 extended writing task was really hard.

He's looking forward to the Maths papers today though, veritably bouncing around eager to get to do them.

My DS1 loves Maths tests though! (Strange creature!!)

CouthyMow Wed 15-May-13 07:30:41

The 5th paper would have been the lvl 6 extended writing paper.

seeker Wed 15-May-13 07:33:47

And how long per paper

Poor DS1, its his birthday today, and more tests.

At least its all Maths today for him, he loves Maths.

Poor DS1, its his birthday today, and more tests.

At least its all Maths today for him, he loves Maths.

lljkk Wed 15-May-13 08:07:15

SPAG is 2 different (fairly short) tests & then if you do L6 there are 2 more. Plus extended writing, so adds up to 5 tests in yesterday's schedule.

DD says the maths today is 4 different tests (in total with L6 papers). But I think only 2 hours in total, so a doddle after the marathon she had yesterday.

Sounds like the Reading test is the one they all dread.

DD & mate are laughing over silly spelling mistakes they made, not stressed.

Wow - I've read this thread and I am so glad DD's school doesn't do SATS (but still managed to get the highest exam results in the area last year).

Yellowtip Wed 15-May-13 09:17:15

mrz (or anyone) so if a child is sitting L6 in everything, how many papers in all - presumably 9?

nipersvest Wed 15-May-13 09:18:27

hugo, my dd also said she did 5 tests yesterday, i took it to have been, spelling, punctuation and grammar in the morning, then 2 level 6 papers in the afternoon.

Sparklingbrook Wed 15-May-13 09:22:48

DS2 only did Level 6 on Monday not in SPAG yesterday. What is the point of that?

MadeOfStarDust Wed 15-May-13 09:29:25

worldgonecrazy - not every school goes nuts on SATs - ours gives a few practise papers in class in the month before and provides help where needed... they also ask the kids and parents of those who are capable IF they want to do level 6 papers. Some do - some don't..

My DS3 also did the level 6 reading but not the level 6 SPAG, sparkling. He didn't do well enough on the practice SPAGs to warrant wasting his time on the level 6, but he's borderline level 6 for reading. They do report the results separately for Englsh, don't they?

Practice SPAG, practise SPAG? Is it a noun or a verb? Or an adjective, describing the SPAG test? I give up...

Sparklingbrook Wed 15-May-13 09:53:21

Yes, i think you are right Ellen. Bit of a mixed message though. It's like being told their reading is good-everything else not so much.

Such is life, though, sparkling... grin

Sparklingbrook Wed 15-May-13 09:56:30

True Ellen. And that's just my take on it DS2 doesn't give a monkeys and just does the Paper he gets. grin

Good luck with the maths today, sparkling's DS, my DS and everyone else.

My DS also sat the L6 reading, but not the L6 SPAG, only one child in their year sat that.

He really isn't bothered about the Maths ones - he seems far more relaxed than i expected!

My DS also only did part of the level 6 English - though he did the SPAG and not the reading paper. He was so pleased to finish the level 3-5 reading comprehension that I'm quite pleased he didn't try for the level 6 which he probably would have found difficult to finish. He said he's never finished a comprehension paper before bless him !
(Possibly him telling his teacher that he had finished the paper at break, and him being so pleased about it, might have influenced her decision - she's very nice like that !)
Extended writing was on a good topic for him, am I allowed to say he got to write about one of his hobbies ?!
I'm no good at secrets sorry blush - and others have given away far more and posts still standing !

lljkk Wed 15-May-13 11:26:00

I suspect writing is the hardest to cheat on; what are they going to do, compose an essay at home, memorise it word for word & regurgitate? Neah.

Spelling cheats, on other hand...

SPAG: The types of things DD was learning about grammar the week before were what I was first learned in an advanced English class at age 14. EG: To understand her homework, We had to look up difference between complex and compound sentences, or the difference when same word is used as an adverb or as a preposition (don't think those are spoilers because I have no idea if they were on the test, I just know they were in DD's homework). It was very tricky stuff. And she doesn't at all need to know it yet (or maybe never).

Tingalingle Wed 15-May-13 11:40:58

I'd reckon 'never', as I have bugger all idea about the difference between those things and I'm an editor...

Abuelita Wed 15-May-13 11:42:11

English pupils are the most examined in the developed world. An ex-Chief Inspector of Schools has warned that recent Ofsted changes mean that schools are likely to use "all means possible" to raise results. I've posted about this on the Local Schools Network (link below).

The pressure on schools to increase SAT results (and therefore avoid speedy Ofsted inspections and possible enforced academy conversion) leads to Year 6 hell. A friend of mine removed her 3 children from a local primary because her Year 6 daughter was coming home every day in tears and didn't want to go to school because they were forever revising SAT papers (they'd even started in Year 5).

But this isn't education - it's teaching to the test. And it's about time parents shouted, "Enough!"

www.localschoolsnetwork.org.uk/2013/05/recent-ofsted-changes-likely-to-increase-pressure-on-schools-to-raise-exam-results-by-all-means-possible-says-ex-chief-inspector/

gazzalw Wed 15-May-13 11:56:31

It might just be useful then for parents to be told 'expected' GCSE grades of DCs when they leave primary school - just so one has an idea for future reference.....Also are those predictions made solely on the basis of the KS2 Year 6 SATS or other markers too - I ask because although DS got high Level 5s in Year 6 he was ill for his SATS so could have done better....

chicaguapa Wed 15-May-13 12:54:13

AFAIK level 5 SATS will give a target GSCE grade of A/A* anyway.

I think SATS inform the official target GCSE grades but the school should internally monitor those anyway if a DC turns out to be more capable than his SATS suggested.

HTH.

chicaguapa Wed 15-May-13 13:03:29

DD told me this morning that they have sex education to look forward to after the SATS have finished. She thinks it's too much too soon and that sex education is ruining their young innocence. grin Not sure what she's expecting to learn.

I'm proud of how she has taken it all in her stride this week though. She'll have done 9 tests over the 4 days but has been relaxed and just trying her best. She says she hopes she got level 6 but she'll be happy with 5 as that's still a good level. I think it's all about attitude, and this is where it starts. <starts hummimg the theme tune to Fame>

boxershorts Wed 15-May-13 13:11:41

Yes the theme song of FAME is bril (they had a suicide in the last rather poor Fame fiml I saw. )

FAME pressure cooker methods work for some. But should not even be tried on some kidsIts horses for courses. (Unless your Mr Gove and he leans towards Hong Kong school extremes.

I like parodying good pop songs. I did fame

" Dont wanna live for ever, I wanna learn how to die. Dont wanna live for ever.......I,m gonna make you girls cry." Cha, cha, chaaaaa

Cheers chica

piratecat Wed 15-May-13 15:45:15

dd's teacher told her yesterday she had got all the spellings right confused

farce

Ledkr Wed 15-May-13 16:17:20

Ok then. Dd told me her teacher tapped her on the head when she made a spelling mistake shock unbelievable.

Ledkr Wed 15-May-13 16:19:02

I was planning on doin my own sex ed before I realised that dd is mortified by any mention of sex or body parts hmm good luck to the teachers I say. All that cringing and giggling.

kjrv81 Wed 15-May-13 16:22:26

Well day 3 here and have an unhappy DD1 tonight, she excels in English but really struggles with her maths bless her. Last day tomorrow - hooray!! I have promised her a KFC on the way home.

They are getting Sex Ed after sats too.

Classic quote from cool DS when I asked him how they went, and was he tired out ? ....

"I don't know why everyone thinks they're tiring. They're not" smile

They went swimming this afternoon (as usual on Wednesdays) which was a nice idea I thought.

Feenie Wed 15-May-13 16:33:25

Ok then. Dd told me her teacher tapped her on the head when she made a spelling mistake shock unbelievable.

It is truly unbelievable and needs reporting.

If I knew which school it was, I would do it myself. Cheating really pisses me off.

hugoagogo Wed 15-May-13 16:57:44

Yep I think some of the tests must have been different parts of the same thing.
She is doing the silly level 6 papers as well as the 3-5, such a lot of work for the poor thing, but she did get an extra biscuit. hmm

Anyone get a feel for the maths papers? What are your DC saying, were they OK?

Sparklingbrook Wed 15-May-13 17:41:53

DS2 said it was 'fine' but no further info Ellen.

Ledkr Wed 15-May-13 17:54:53

feenie dh and I are still considering what to do.
It's going to be denied no matter what isn't it?
I'm still shocked.

Sparklingbrook Wed 15-May-13 17:57:26

It is shocking Ledkr, but the repercussions of saying anything are huge (unfortunately). I wouldn't know what to do. Can open, worms everywhere IYKWIM. sad

chickensaladagain Wed 15-May-13 17:59:57

Dd came home today confident that she had done well so we are all chilled tonight

Just got DS3 home from his friend's house. He was quite happy, said he had time to check his answers on the non calculator paper and the mental maths was ok.

Feenie Wed 15-May-13 18:08:43

www.education.gov.uk/schools/teachingandlearning/assessment/keystage2/a00197262/ks2-maladministration

The LEA has to investigate all complaints seriously.

I have no sympathy for the teacher - she knows she is cheating.

Sparklingbrook Wed 15-May-13 18:11:26

That's true Feenie. I am really shocked TBH, no idea what I would do.

spanieleyes Wed 15-May-13 18:14:19

Three of mine finished the maths paper after about 20 minutes and one promptly fell asleep confused

Ledkr Wed 15-May-13 18:52:31

Bad for the children too as dd can't see it was wrong which isn't great.
It's one of those sought after schools too. Makes you sick doesn't it m?

forehead Wed 15-May-13 19:09:08

Feenie, can you tell me if the students get a separate levels for Reading,
Spag and the spelling , or are all the marks combined?

clam Wed 15-May-13 19:17:33

Spag results are being published in their own right, I believe, as no one can work out how to incorporate them into the overall English level for this year!

forehead Wed 15-May-13 19:25:16

What about the spelling Clam?

clam Wed 15-May-13 19:41:27

That's always been amalgamated into the overall score. Unless it's changed recently, which is unlikely. I moved out of Year 6 thank God a few years ago.

Feenie Wed 15-May-13 20:07:08

There's not even going to be an English level, after last year's debacle, clam! So just Reading and separate SPAG result, and a writing teacher assessment this year.

MiaowTheCat Wed 15-May-13 20:33:22

DD told me this morning that they have sex education to look forward to after the SATS have finished. She thinks it's too much too soon and that sex education is ruining their young innocence. Not sure what she's expecting to learn.

We had a somewhat "lively" young character at the last school I worked at, and it was nearing the "sex ed" time of year (well puberty and that stuff). Somehow he let on his expectations of these lessons to the colleague who taught him - basically he assumed the teacher would walk into the room wearing a dressing gown and armed with a pad of post-its, drop the dressing gown and use the post-its to name and label all relevant parts of the body.

Cue the teacher in question being given knowing looks every time anyone had post-it notes out in the staffroom for months!

The child in question went into these lessons to have his expectations shattered - not a post-it in sight!

(Sorry - totally unrelated to the SATs part of the discussion)

prettydaisies Wed 15-May-13 20:50:58

Spelling is part of 'spag' - spelling, punctuation and grammar, so the spelling mark is part of the spag mark.

clam Wed 15-May-13 21:09:50

Shows how out-of-touch I am then. Can't tell you how glad I am to be away from Year 6. Had 10 years of it...

mumsneedwine Wed 15-May-13 21:33:54

Bit late for my year 6 - 'puberty' hit last year and she started her period this month smack bang in the middle of reading SAT on Monday. Cue a v coded discussion with male teacher about needing the loo (is it urgent? Oh yes ! Can it wait ? No sir, I need to go NOW !!!). Poor love has been on Nurofen all week, with a heat pad on her tummy. She is a trooper and has sat every blimmin exam going, although I have been told that her newspaper article yesterday was a bit contreversional - she ranted about SATS apparently and how they have made some of her year cry cos they are scary. She somehow got this in to the topic !!! She is either a trade union leader or prime minister in waiting

piratecat Wed 15-May-13 21:58:34

lol. same here. dd started hers in yr 5.

not been easy at all.

mumsneedwine Wed 15-May-13 22:20:28

Oh and this is my 5th doing SATS and I've never had any of them sit so many stupid tests. Asked at senior schools today and teacher assessed marks are already at some secondary schools. No one is going to look at SPAG (Bol) results - ever !!! It amazing that my other kids have managed without ever knowing what the article in a sentence is.

christinarossetti Wed 15-May-13 22:44:57

Oh god, don't start me on the cheating. I know several parents from one particular local 'outstanding' school whose children have had TAs sitting next to them telling them the answers in KS2 SATS.

This was a few years ago - my friend's dd is now 17 and she witnessed it during her SATS tests - so no idea whether it's still going on.

chickensaladagain Thu 16-May-13 06:43:54

Last day of sats -thank god!

Sparklingbrook Thu 16-May-13 06:56:03

Yay!! Ignores Science tomorrow the end is in sight. grin

chickensaladagain Thu 16-May-13 07:02:24

Our school isn't doing science -tomorrow is own clothes day and charity sports event

Sticklebug Thu 16-May-13 07:07:20

Last ones here too, although I don't quite understand why DD did 1 maths paper yesterday and has 3 today! Surely would have made more sense to do 2 on each day.

Last day of tests today for all our Y6 kids - they are not doing science either.

DS is looking forward to today, more maths!

lljkk Thu 16-May-13 08:02:30

Sticklebug DD says it's because they have to finish L3-5 papers first before they can take the L6 for maths. But that's not how the various literacy papers were run, so don't ask me why the inconsistency.

They did maths A and mental maths yesterday, maths B today which is 45 mins and the 2 level 6 papers, which are 30 mins each. So not too bad.

I think DS2 has some KS2 and KS3 Science papers today (teacher assessment rather than externally marked SATs) and a level 6 Maths paper. This makes it his 'best day ever'.

He has been remarkably calm throughout. DD and DS3 have also had internal assessments this week and have been fine.

DS1 (Y8) has had one internally marked KS3 Maths paper and has been a total stress muffin. He didn't even realise he was sitting it until 2 days before. I have asked him to find out what tests he has next week.

chickensaladagain Thu 16-May-13 08:50:51

Omg, just overheard the deputy head telling the yr 6 to stop running around incase they hurt themselves before sats -really???

seeker Thu 16-May-13 08:51:34

Probably a joke. Calm down, people!

DS thought that too Sticklebug

Guess he figured 4 divided by 2 = 2 grin

But seems the adults aren't that logical.

Meant they all got to go swimming yesterday afternoon though
(Maybe that was the idea - to have a bit of a mid-week break ?)

mrz Thu 16-May-13 11:39:13

Went into school this morning to be faced with a burst water main and school closed ... nightmare!

Our school do optional sats each year. Dd has just finished sats and is now doing cats!?! No idea what they are.

I think they're "cognitive ability tests" Damn - and usually done in Y7 by the secondary schools. But I've only just found out about them too, here on Mumsnet. I don't remember DD or her school mentioning them when she was in Y7 a couple of years ago ? Apparently used for setting and streaming more than the SATS, or so I heard.

lljkk Thu 16-May-13 14:53:30

What are they doing about y6 SATs, mrz?

Noon update from DD was gleeful report that her team won the school Netball tournament. SATs pressure? What SATs pressure?

MadeOfStarDust Thu 16-May-13 16:29:22

Mine - only doing level5 papers said that this year they were a lot easier than the previous years papers... ho hum...

Sparklingbrook Thu 16-May-13 16:31:52

Yay. It's over! I will never have to see another SATS paper in my life. Unless the grandchildren are still doing them. grin

mrz Thu 16-May-13 16:35:15

We sent everyone home except Y6 and they did both the level 5 & 6 tests without a break before going home ...

Ruprekt Thu 16-May-13 16:45:23

Mrz....what a pain but a nice short day!

Ds had a viral rash all over his body.....not contagious....sat the paper and is pleased with what he did.

Took more piriton and calpol this morning....but it has flared up again now. confusedconfused

CatelynStark Thu 16-May-13 17:58:50

My girl arrived home so shattered that she could hardly speak! She did manage to mutter that the Level 6 Maths was horrendous though sad

Ah well, that's the stress over until ruddy year 9!

Picturesinthefirelight Thu 16-May-13 18:18:05

Why? What happens in Year 9. I guess they choose their options and are put into sets for them?

Dd has had quite a nice week. Internal tests in the morning then things like house music, leavers play rehearsals etc in the afternoons.

However we found out yesterday she has an important audition next week which could mean a change of senior school choice.

Sparklingbrook Thu 16-May-13 18:22:51

DS1 (13) is Year 9. He has just chosen his options, ready to start in Year 10. Hard to keep up any enthusiasm for dropped subjects for the rest of this term.

Picturesinthefirelight Thu 16-May-13 18:29:12

I feel like we're in limbo to be honest. Hopefully bybthecend if next week we will know exactly which school dd is going to.

CatelynStark Thu 16-May-13 18:39:04

Yes, my middle girl is in Year 9 and has been constantly stressed with endless exams and assessments since September!

She starts year 10 after this half term (which I still can't get my head around) and we still don't know if she's been given all of her options sad

BackforGood Thu 16-May-13 20:38:31

really ?
My dd is in Yr9 and thinks it's a 'chilling year' before starting her GCSEs next year.

Sparklingbrook Thu 16-May-13 20:40:10

I know DS1 has exams coming up but Year 10 doesn't start til September. I think he is in for a huge shock TBH. He has requested to do Triple Science for some unknown reason.

float62 Thu 16-May-13 20:43:22

Yahay, they're done and I couldn't give a twotafwaddle about the results but my ds has done them. I s'pose I should post this in special needs given ds (ASD yeah, yeah, blah,blah,etc,etc) was screwed around with no or little school for 4 years but shan't. He did it. He can do the jump through hoop thing that we all have to do. Gosh I can even post here as a proud mummy. Many thanks to his school and his very special teacher.

seeker Thu 16-May-13 21:10:29

Some schools start GCSEs in year 9. Bonkers in my opinion.

Picturesinthefirelight Thu 16-May-13 21:11:21

Agree. Bonkers.

BooksandaCuppa Thu 16-May-13 21:18:20

Well done to float's ds and teacher smile