My feed
Premium

Please
or
to access all these features

Join our Primary Education forum to discuss starting school and helping your child get the most out of it.

Primary education

DS is hitting other children (is possible Aspergers).

12 replies

JollyPirate · 24/03/2010 19:44

I am putting this here and not in special needs education because I really want to reach as wide an audience as possible.

DS has had problems right through from nursery and is now in Yr 2 (was 7 end December 09). He is due for a first appointment at the social communication clinic tomorrow and it could be that he has ADHD or Aspergers or autistic traits. (who knows I am snowed under with it all and can no longer see the wood for the trees).

Currently he has 15 hrs of one to one time per week which I am told is to help him access the curriculum. His behaviour in the classroom is inconsistant as he has some sensory difficulties which are mainly around lots of noise. There are some activities which staff know that DS just will not cope with so they arrange other activites for these times. DS also has sensory seeking probs and the OT has said this is due to difficulty DS has in knowing where his body is in space - hence he needs to keep moving. Mainly this excess activity manifests itself in fidgeting and wriggling around lots. His DT (dear teacher) has given up trying to get him to sit on the carpet at story time so DS now sits on a chair.

My concern is that over the past three months his behaviour seems to have deteriorated and there have been three incidents with other children over recent weeks. The first incident involved another child who would not let DS join in a game with Lego - DS spat in his face in temper. This was dealt with in school in that he was told that you do NOT do that and Lego was withdrawn for the rest of that day. Another child used to spit at DS when he was cross so am sure DS picked that up from there.

Then last week DS hit a little girl in the class. The little girl's Mum who is a TA in the classroom witnessed this and says it wasn't a hard hit and was due to an disagreement between the two if them. The school told me at the end of the school day and DS was nowhere to be seen. He was in fact hidden behind the book corner where there are some storage shelves. DS had tucked himself in on the bottom shelf and refused to come out. I mean..,. why hide away from me? I am not a horrible Mummy who hits and shouts. I just want to understand why he behaved in the way he did. I asked him about the incident and got a very confused story - in short I couldn't work out the whys and wherefores so made an appointment with the school.
On the way home I noted that DS looked extremely tired and suggested that he did not use the Wii that evening (he is usually allowed 30 mins before tea) and he went into an utter meltdown - screaming and raging and telling me he hated me etc etc. He was in the front of the car and was kicking the dashboard, then he took a shoe off and held it to my face shouting "do you want a piece of me" (a line from Toy Story). I pulled the car over, got hold of him and made eye contact before telling him firmly to STOP his behaviour NOW. And he did - this eye contact and firm handling often works. We got home and no more mention was made of the Wii - he didn't even attempt to put it on - there was no fight - he just accepted that I had said No and that was that.
I had a meeting with the school yesterday and told them all the above. They said firstly that he had never displayed those kinds of rages in school and that secondly although DS had hit another child this was not usual for him (something I already knew). They also said that social skills in most children aged 6-7 could still be erratic and that had this not been part of a bigger problem with social communication that they would not have told me. (Not sure I wouldn't want them to tell me tbh). Anyhow - I came away feeling more positive and ready for the social communication clinic (first appointment tomorrow).

Today I collected DS to be told that he had hit another little girl. In fact he had really hit her hard around the head according to the TA and I am just mortified by this as he could have really hurt her. Apparently they were listening to some music and DS wanted to listen to one thing while the little girl wanted to hear something else - cue an argument and DS (or not so DS )lashing out.
I am just so upset and worried as prior to January there were no incidents like this. I am racking my brains but cannot think of any reason for his behaviour to have changed like this. DS has never been a hitter and was always the child at nursery who got bitten (there was an incident last year where he bit another child but it appears that they were both mucking about and getting too physical according to the school).

So - bg question. Do I apologise to this little girl's Mum as I want to do? I feel so bad as her DD needs to feel safe in school and I can't help thinking that DS could have really hurt this little girl. It's not a nice thought to know that your child has done something horrible.

I asked DS if he had apologised and he said no because the teacher would not let him. My feeling is that she was upset and that they thought DS might make things worse. I have suggested to DS that he apologises tomorrow and he agreed he would. I asked him about the incident and he says that he "didn't mean to hit her". My reply of course is that his hand did not hit her by mistake and that he has ultimate control about what his hands do. So of course you meant to hit her. I asked him what he could have done instead of hitting and tbh he seemed clueless. I suggested that he could have walked away, listened to her choice of music, or gone to speak to an adult about feeling angry. His reply was that he wasn't angry. I asked him why he hit this little girl if he wasn't angry and he couldn't answer.

I am so worried about all this. At the moment I can control him and use stickers etc to reward good behaviour - as he gets older this will be less effective (tell me if that is wrong).

Is this my fault? I had PND after DS was born and have had depression on and off ever since.

If you've read this far thank you - realise I am rambling but just need to write all this down.

OP posts:
Report
deaddei · 24/03/2010 20:05

So sorry you are having to deal with this- and no, it is not your fault.
I have no real advice, but my ds was bitten very badly on the neck once by a little boy with Aspergers. I didn't know what was wrong with him, thought he was just being out of control and was very cross when the teacher told me- if the mum had come up and explained about her son, and said sorry- that would have helped me understand.
So I personally think a quiet word with mum would help.
Hope you get some help.

Report
Mallenstreak · 24/03/2010 20:34

I think it depends on how you think the mum might react. We are regularly having incidents with our DS (like yours waiting to go to clinic to start assessment- poss.Aspergers/adhd)but he doesn't bite just pushes and shoves when children are upsetting him. Parents have complained to the school about him and I leave it to the Head etc to speak to them. We have also had incidents such as a mother verbally abusing ds and another one coming round our house bashing on the front door wanting a fight with DH! I can really sympathise but please don't feel it's your fault.

Report
JollyPirate · 24/03/2010 20:55

Thank you. My sister (also a TA) thinks that if the class teacher was considering not actally telling me that DS might not have actually hit this little girl as hard as the TA (who is new) suggested. That for me is academic - the fact is that he hit her.

I am seeing the SENCO tomorrow again (second time this week)to update her on how DS got on at clinic and also to discuss today's incident. I think the other Mum will be okay as she is very nice (all the other Mums are nice). I just feel bad that this has happened.

OP posts:
Report
3cutedarlings · 24/03/2010 22:20

Dont Feel bad JollyPirate non of this is your fault, it is nothing to do with upbringing or PND or anything else that you have done for that matter.

From what you have said its the social side of things that are causing your DS to lash out, he probably doesn't have the communication skill to reason with his peers and put his point across. It sounds to me like the school need some advice/support on methods of how best to support him tbh, things like the teacher giving up and not getting him to sit on the carpet like the other children is not helpful IMO.

For children with an ASD (my DD1 has AS btw and is also 7) giving reasons as to why they did what they did is very difficult, my DD finds who, when, why, what sort of questions for example almost impossible answer although i find if i break it down i can usually get some sort of reasoning out of her .

Personally i think i would speak to the other childs mother and explain that your son is finding things difficult at the moment.

And can i also suggest that you post this on the special need board too

Report
claig · 25/03/2010 01:41

I think I would speak to the mother and apologise, but I would ask your DS to apologise to the girl in front of you and the mother. That way he will feel a bit ashamed and hopefully that will teach him not to do a similar thing again.

I think he hid from you because he knew that he had done wrong and would be told off and asked to explain himself and didn't want to discuss it because he didn't have any good excuses. The worry about getting his story straight for you probably stressed and tired him out which is why he had a meltdown, with a minor issue setting him off.

Report
madwomanintheattic · 25/03/2010 03:09

hope the appointment goes well - but, can i ask, where was the 1-1? i appreciate that she is mainly there to help him access the curriculum, but was she not present?

if he has 15 hours, the 1-1 needs to start looking for and recognising triggers.

it might be that increased tension in the classroom (oh, yes, sats coming up, so all else gone to pot lol) means that he is having a little more trouble than usual staying within his normal boundaries as the routine is changing. is it an infant school? sometime the change to juniors can start to cause some tension at this point too, esp with more sensitive children.

tbh i wouldn't worry too much about his outburst in the car. it's not uncommon for a child who might be experiencing some difficulty holding it together at school to lash out when they are in a safe environment (esp if you take away the promise of the wii lol). it does sound as though he is finding y2 more difficult than usual to deal with, which might be for any of the reasons above/ asd/ general immaturity/ whatever.

on slightly different notes - has the ot provided a fidget box of stuff for him to use? has he got any of the numerous wobble type cushions to help him stay put?

i would hold off the apology tbh - but it depends how well you know the parent. there are parents who would be understanding and sympathetic, but there are parents who would not.

really hope your appointment goes well. x

Report
colabottles · 25/03/2010 13:20

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn

JollyPirate · 25/03/2010 21:28

Thank you all - we have had a diagnosis of ASD and ADHD today which has been both a shock but a relief IYSWIM.

The local support services are definitely going to contact me and offer support. Thank you for the tip colabottles as all is helpful and I will look into that. My sister thinks DS will qualify for fulltime 1.1 now we have the diagnosis.

OP posts:
Report
want2sleep · 25/03/2010 21:39

seen your post also on other page...take time to get your head around it all your in shock....no mum can ever be totally prepared!

Give yourself time...I think I'm only just beginning to accept dx after 3 yrs! I'm very stubborn possible AS traits lol!

So sending you lots of (((((hugs)))) have a glass of wine ... take one day at a time and defo get your head/emotions around it before you try and help your ds cope...your ds is still your same ds as yesturday ...I must say the dx is a life line to getting the support ds will need in school and thats what counts.

Report
JollyPirate · 26/03/2010 06:10

Thank you want2sleep the "one day at a time" advice sounds good.

OP posts:
Report
Stuntnun · 06/05/2010 15:16

Good luck JollyPirate. It's an uphill battle with ADHD but there's tons of help out there: on the Internet, from the paediatrician, some schools can access support services etc. I used The Incredible Years programme (there's a book) by Webster-Stratton which will really help with the behavioural problems.

Report
TheArsenicCupCake · 06/05/2010 15:34

JP.. So glad you got your dx.
I can't help with the ADHD but IMO it's all about stratagies with as/ asd ( ds2 is in the spectrum).

My advice and it's only from my personal experience would be routine, calm space and recognising fight and flight.. And getting in before it hits the fan. It might be that you ds is hitting out as he is overloaded at that time and it's coming out in fight. He may have a tendency for only seeing his part of the world.. So time to calm down and then reflect when he canmanage to.

Can his school provide him with a calm down area? Do all of the staff including lunch supervisors know his signs of distress?

Look at how you deal with this naturally and write it down for the school. Simple thing can really help.

I'd also have a look at the anger volcano. It may really help.

Your ds might be hiding in corners away fro
you as he needs his space.. Rather than being frightened of you.. So take heart.

If you email me on blackcoffeenosugar @ hotmail dot co dot uk I'm happy to pass on a rather long list of things we do with ds2 some of which might help.

Report
Please create an account

To comment on this thread you need to create a Mumsnet account.